Guild Wars 2

liadri was hard

then you’d have longer queue times, and people would feel pressured into playing their class a certain way (eg guardian bunker).

people would still just queue up with whatever class they wanted then switch classes during pregame

the problem is
>land all burst on warrior, warrior is at 35%hp from a full glass cannon bursting it
>warrior counterpressures hits 1/4 of his abilities and kills target.

to kill warriors you need to go glass cannon, and once you do that you’re so easily killed by the warrior anyways.

sd thieves kitten all over shatter mesmers

don’t use soloq as a gauge for your personal skill level, use it to improve yourself it’s not worth getting worked up over.

welcome to soloq

Hambow has easy access to cleansing ire, strong aoe damage (conquest gamemode amplifies this), and strong cc. Sustain through adrenal health/healing signet passively too.

glaphen.5230:

Oblivion.8307:

glaphen.5230:

Oblivion.8307:

abusing line of sight, cleansing ire and counter pressure are all great additions to stances, plus lyssa runes too.

Line of sight is situational, Cleansing Ire wont work with anything besides longbow and Lyssa runes are a whole different balance problem.

what weaponset do you have in mind when referring to warrior balance? in most used warriors builds the weaponsets usually have blocks, cc or mobility. You can kite with the mobility, counter pressure with cc or straight up just block I guess.

Greatsword and sword since the rest all rely on one ability hitting and if it doesn’t you’re screwed for the next 7-30 seconds. No good player gets hit by Earthshaker or Eviscerate. Really though are you actually suggesting Warriors kite though? The counter to every Warrior build besides Rifle is kiting them so how is kiting gonna help you unless the enemy is another Warrior or some perma chilled Thief trying to Heartseeker spam you.

If you’re under pressure you can use mobility to your advantage and resustain with adrenal health/healing signet while kiting your opponents.

glaphen.5230:

Oblivion.8307:

abusing line of sight, cleansing ire and counter pressure are all great additions to stances, plus lyssa runes too.

Line of sight is situational, Cleansing Ire wont work with anything besides longbow and Lyssa runes are a whole different balance problem.

what weaponset do you have in mind when referring to warrior balance? in most used warriors builds the weaponsets usually have blocks, cc or mobility. You can kite with the mobility, counter pressure with cc or straight up just block I guess.

abusing line of sight, cleansing ire and counter pressure are all great additions to stances, plus lyssa runes too.

glass cannon ele healing back to full from 10%.. wat

DoYourBestBear.6810:

To Evan Lesh, I’m your biggest fan and I love your work

nope. evan’s mine. i’m his #1 fan.

(disregard warriors from this)if your build isn’t full bunker it requires vigor/invuln/evadespam/blocks. The only class that doesn’t have this is necro that has the deathshroud pool. Using shamans/rabid/clerics/soldiers amulet can help which is why condition builds are generally stronger because toughness scales better against power than vit does against conditions. general meta builds ->
-thief (feline grace/vigor/shadowsteps>high mobility)
-engi (perma vigor/AR/blinds galore/block on pistol5&toolkit)
-mesmer(not really viable, although PU is perma stealth, perma regen/prot with aegis+vigor on crit//shatter has perma vigor+invulns+stealth)
-ele (not really viable, s/f is most ‘meta’ build. 5s invul.. that’s about it really, a couple of blinds and reflect on earth 4 i guess, vigor from phoenix/arcane shield)
-guard (bunker, invul/vigor/energy runes)
-ranger(50% endurance regen baseline/evadespam through s/d&sb/high regen through spirit & healing spring)
-warrior(lol)
-necro(deathshroud, good weakness on dagger#5 and weakening shroud trait)

expect qq about PU mes next patch

Going full bunker isn’t really advised unless you’re going to be at the mid node mainly. People have said the build you linked doesn’t have high mobility but it does, permanent swiftness from the warhorn and sword #2 leap is good mobility. The reason you can’t go full bunker for close node is that you don’t offer enough when you enter a mid fight, the build doesn’t have much 1v1 potential other than outlasting and surviving for prolonged periods of time which is why it’d be most preferred as a mid build. If you look at something like the spirit ranger you can see it offers the spirit buffs, zoning potential from shortbow spam (at range), and AoE rez plus much more as well as okay mobility with the sword leap. Close node builds need to be sustainable, but also offer 1v1/1v2(outlast for prolonged periods, perhaps even killing in the 1v2) potential. Looking over your build I’ll list what you offer to a teamfight when you roam into mid.

- AoE Regen(Banner)
- 170Tou/Vit (Banner)
- Aoe Rez (Banner)
- Safe stomps (stability)
- AoE Condition Clear (WH)
- Single target CC (Mace/Shield)
- Tanky enough to rez under pressure

So basically you’re a defensive support with stun capability. You don’t really offer enough zoning potential due to likeliness of being kited plus you’re only able to lock down a single target. Due to your build supporting it’s more beneficial to have it at the start of a fight (with the exception of rez banner). You can essentially leave a banner in mid and be supporting the fight a lot just due to that. In my personal opinion the most optimal things for you to do would be -

Know how to teamfight, your job should be surviving, supporting condition clear with warhorn and zoning/disrupting enemy team as much as possible. If there’s another bunker on your team it’s your job to chase something such as a necro around, make sure he’s useless in the teamfight(to the best of your ability, it will be hard due to being kited). Similar with other classes. If they’ve got a different comp than this then try to protect your main damage dealers, stun/zone people hitting them etc.

- Look at the enemy team, do they have potential invaders (Mainly thief/warrior/engi)
- Cap close point
- Wait until they’ve capped their close node, if nobody’s invaded yet, head to where they’re most likely to invade (beach on forest, courtyard on kyhlo, near mid area on foefire)
- When you’re certain that you’re not being invaded kitten how mid is going, if you need to go there and offer team support do so. Make sure you’re always watching the minimap.
- On maps such as forest, you can potentially take the enemy close node. If your team loses the fight mid during this time stay at the enemy point, you’ll force enemies there allow your team to regroup and they could potentially assist you from respawning.
- During the teamfight do what I mentioned before with zoning, always make sure your banner is in an optimal position and watch your teams healthbars so you can kitten rezzes you may need to do.
- Keep an eye out for your point, however if the teamfight is in a losing situation don’t leave, if it’s even but you can win if you stay, then stay. The big factor here is it’s only one person decapping your node, if you can win mid point in an efficient amount of time you can send back the people from the mid fight to take back your close node.
- For Kyhlo you being on treb or mid is very useful, your mobility with swiftness and sword leap makes you pretty mobile on this map, if they have no invaders you can drop your banner underneath mid, head to the trebuchet, head into mid, just go where your support is needed.
- Disengage from points when your team starts to win and head back to what you need to defend, there’s no point having 3 people killing one thief at the end of a teamfight, and in your case especially since you’re a bunker you’re not offering too much.
- Never fight 1v1 on an enemy contested point unless you’re sure you can win within a reasonable amount of time, head to where your team mates are contesting and offer support to them, you’re useless in 1v1 encounters(compared to other builds) unless it’s purely a survival situation.
- If you’re with another tanky person on a neutral node trying to kill one person, leave and offer your help elsewhere, nobody’s going to die within a reasonable time on that neutral node and your help is much preferred elsewhere.

sorry if this seems scattered and confusing i’m kind of tired if you need any more advice feel free to ask for specifics, i kind of just thought of stuff and typed it out.

edit: i probably repeated this throughout a lot but your build is pretty support orientated with slight zoning through the mace. you basically either want to be defending a node against players, capping enemy point and defending it or supporting where you can.

If you’re going to allow a trait such as halting strike deal so much damage it’s better placing it in a higher tier of traits. Remember mug damage(prenerf)? Although mug damage still isn’t terrible.

Is this specific to soloq? Or teamq?

Paragon.5479:

says the spirit ranger who wanted to be first so hard that he made new N-A account,ur true skill will show now in time “passive master”

Heh, I don’t play much anymore and when I do I usually play ele since it’s pretty fun. So unfortunately my ‘true skill’ won’t show, or since i have no skill it will! I’m merely giving advice to somebody, getting to high places on the leaderboards isn’t hard if you’re abusing op classes, lol.

Laserbolt.6731:

Oblivion.8307:

i think it’s pretty easy to carry a majority of games with necro/warrior/spirit ranger

I don’t think it’s “pretty easy”. I think it’s nearly impossible.

I have tried. But when your team is kittening around streaming 1 by 1 into the enemy zerg, you cannot be at all three points at once. And wherever you are not, you lose the capture point.

don’t overwhelm yourself with trying to carry each and every individual game, play your best in each game and cater to what your team needs. realize what you do wrong in the games you play and improve upon those aspects of your gameplay.

i think it’s pretty easy to carry a majority of games with necro/warrior/spirit ranger personally, you’re just seeing the start of mmr taking fruition. I remember the start of when soloq was implimented, I went 6-5 in my placement games and ended up with 70%~ win ratio when I was actively playing

or run d/d zerker ele and have fun while not caring about your rank!

soloq really shouldn’t be taken as a skill measurement, lol. if anything it’s something you do to improve your own gameplay. You can’t win every game but if you’re doing the correct things you’re more likely to win than lose games. If you really want to improve your gameplay you can review all of your games to think what you could have done better in regards and how you could have done better in order to carry your team and apply the things you’ve learned to future games. That’s really what soloq is for in my honest opinion. But nevertheless the topic has derailed into stupid leaderboard rank kitten contest.

jmatb.6307:

Edit: Symbolic I disagree on LB because being at the bottom shows you how TERRIBLE most players are. Especially on NA lol. You’ve never been there so you haven’t had the “privilege” of having to stare at your monitor and shake your head at the kind of things lower tier people do.

I’m already there, i think i’m rank 6-700 or something because i only play zerker staff or d/d ele lol. alls I mean is there’s no reason to bring up leaderboard numbers into a discussion as it’s pointless and ends up in a ‘my kitten is bigger than your kitten’.

somehow i feel responsible for nobody getting rewards, heh.

There’s really no reason to divulge into leaderboard numbers when talking about balance, I agree. However I would like to point out that many necromancers would prefer Dhuumfire to be removed from the necromancer, I really hate the trait personally. The ideology behind us not wanting for this trait is to start getting traitlines fixed properly with perhaps a removal of traits such as dhuumfire, empathic bond, incendiary powder and such traits like them, moving the power of these traits into different areas of classes(except dhuumfire, they can just remove that). Adding more to the game isn’t the way to go as you’re just adding more stupidity into what traits already are instead of aiming to fix them even if it does take time to do so.

i just like to see who’s still farming pugs at prime time

Ixl Super Ixl.7258:

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
Poor symbolic he moved his main account to NA to get some nice reward, why did you do that to symbolic grouch

i moved to na cause eu community sucks kitten and to get my main man evan lesh’s name on top yo. i knew there weren’t any rewards.

edit: nice to see u playing with zym recently anyways!

How about Diamond Skin would activate for 2 seconds whenever you switched to Earth, and gave 75-90% condition reduction? It provides active play and doesn’t act as a hard counter to condition builds.

I’d really prefer if lyssa just removed conditions in all honesty. The boons aren’t needed and are way too powerful.

Smiley.5376:

The only class that really needs it is thief. Thief is such in a kittenty state, if you remove this they’ll be even more useless. Warrior won’t be less OP without lyssa. Other classes that lose/use this you don’t even notice it… So it’s not really OP…

What i’m saying is, your making such a thing of it while it completely isn’t. This is the perfect QQ thread example that will get Anet’s attention and they will simply do 1 thing: make the game even worse for thieves.

Please try to view the game in an objective balance instead of only thinking of one class.

Wintel.4873:

Oblivion.8307:

@guyabove 30 arcana is not mandatory. ele is where balance SHOULD be, i wish idiots would stop trying to get eles buffed when its not the answer, classes need to come down not kittening go up holy kitten.

Well good luck going meta-level without Evasive Arcana, the 1 trait which Ele gameplay revolves around. Heal on dodge, AoE damage on dodge, blast finishers, etc. Dodging = everything for Ele, it’s the only way to survive.

Something is wrong with “ele is where balance should be” considering that it’s an outlier class. That’s like an crazy person who insists they are sane and everyone else is crazy instead.

Have you only recently started playing? Elementalist was a strong class even after its healing coefficients were nerfed. Other classes were be buffed in order for it to be redundant in pvp. Plus viable in soloq =/= viable in high level competitive play. You don’t need evasive arcana and it’s not a mandatory trait. Realistically in current meta you’re giving up too much damage to go into arcana/water. The most amount of arcana points I ever really put into my ele builds is 20. Current ele state is kill before it kills you, you can’t outsustain the damage people put out unless you go full bunker and in that case you should be 0/0/20/20/30 or 0/0/10/30/30 anyways.

Marcos.3690:

Erwin.5603:

I want my mesmer vs ele 1v1 matchup back !

good old times :’( mesmer close point, ele far point.

The outcome of an intense duel deciding games

cantrips ele vs mesmer was the most kittened kitten ever, cantrips ele vs anything at the time was stupid as kitten.

@guyabove 30 arcana is not mandatory. ele is where balance SHOULD be, i wish idiots would stop trying to get eles buffed when its not the answer, classes need to come down not kittening go up holy kitten.

then they get themselves into more kitten, it’d be more beneficial for them to fix it slowly. They got themselves into this kitten in the first place by whack a mole balancing to necro.

force the meta into a more kittened state, i like it.

‘are necros op?’ ‘nope, they’re countered by warriors’

i want my op double ravens back.

Zenith.7301:

Oblivion.8307:

Zenith.7301:

cymerdown.4103:

Zenith.7301:

Um……

15000-16000 average health with water traitline.

10% is 1500-1600 damage. Your minions will do that much in less than 2 secs.

It’s a useless trait. No ele will take it. An ele still needs 20 in water and 20 in arcana at the very least, not leaving enough for diamond skin.

First of all, “Your minions”??? What game are you playing where MM Necro is viable?

But anyway, that’s exactly the problem with the trait. Either it won’t be good enough and nobody will take it, or it will be pretty OP and everyone will take it. With complete immunity traits like that, there is not much middle ground (outside of meta shifts, but meta shifts due to a single OP trait are not very natural types of shifts).

Lastly, with the words you just said, I don’t think you’ve really thought carefully about how to min-max the trait. I won’t post the exact builds here, but use that noggin.

because it’d be nice to get something different like glass cannon daggers

glass cannon daggers is actually fun and in my opinion a balanced build. Are you sure you just don’t suck at playing glass cannons or do you want it to be op as kitten?

edit ontopic: fresh air ele with diamond skin is gonna be kittened, same with bunker builds.

You think glass cannon dagger ele without traits in arcana or water is balanced in the current context?

I usually like to run 10 points in arcana, but yea, it’s a fun build. It kills kitten and is prone to die, what a zerker should be.

Zenith.7301:

cymerdown.4103:

Zenith.7301:

Um……

15000-16000 average health with water traitline.

10% is 1500-1600 damage. Your minions will do that much in less than 2 secs.

It’s a useless trait. No ele will take it. An ele still needs 20 in water and 20 in arcana at the very least, not leaving enough for diamond skin.

First of all, “Your minions”??? What game are you playing where MM Necro is viable?

But anyway, that’s exactly the problem with the trait. Either it won’t be good enough and nobody will take it, or it will be pretty OP and everyone will take it. With complete immunity traits like that, there is not much middle ground (outside of meta shifts, but meta shifts due to a single OP trait are not very natural types of shifts).

Lastly, with the words you just said, I don’t think you’ve really thought carefully about how to min-max the trait. I won’t post the exact builds here, but use that noggin.

because it’d be nice to get something different like glass cannon daggers

glass cannon daggers is actually fun and in my opinion a balanced build. Are you sure you just don’t suck at playing glass cannons or do you want it to be op as kitten?

edit ontopic: fresh air ele with diamond skin is gonna be kittened, same with bunker builds.

gs/mace shield is still pretty kittened lol, it’s unforgiving to play against especially with how warrior sustain is. It’s also pretty forgiving to play with disengage with greatsword (5s weaponswaps/rush/whirlwind). The burst skill on mace also has a really short cooldown plus there’s 2 blocks with mace/shield and 3 CCs.

regarding 20k killshots though, i was pulling 18ks on full glass ele using double banner + signet of might with signet of fury active, you’re going to need like a kitten load of might to pull 20k without the banners and signet. Plus traits were like 30/0/0/10/30.

then you meet a thief who uses the warrior steal whirl just as you finish kill shot cast and cry

trust me, it’s not as viable as you think to pull off such huge crits.

people run ogre because it’s the highest damaging runeset in the game as the +dmg stacks insanely well with other +%dmg modifiers in traits (scholar are better for pure damage but 90% health is hard to maintain at all times).

a t s e.9614:

If they nerf Lyssa runes , I want the other classes elite to be nerfed aswell. Because basilik venom is pretty useless …..

Yep, that’s why d/p thieves run basi venom without Lyssa, right.

data.4093:

Oblivion.8307:

data.4093:

Oblivion.8307:

data.4093:

Oblivion.8307:

data.4093:

Yeah, condinuking shouldn’t have any counter. /sarcasm

yeah, stunning someone with basi venom shouldn’t have any counter. /sarcasm

So…I guess…basilisk venom wasn’t patched in october? Wait why are we talking about bask venom…

Thief engages on me from 2k+ range using signet/sword2/steal with basi venom. He has every boon in the game(plus aegis). I’m stunned, how can I retaliate other than try and run away after using a stunbreaker?

Corrupt boon?

So there’s one possible spell that can counter lyssa runes to a certain extent? But wait, I mistimed it and it was dodged due to 3 spam, kitten I suck.

You’re right. Lyssa runes aren’t an issue, thieves are. Better nerf ’em.

Same exact thing applies to warriors with signet of rage, full condition cleanse and every boon in the game on a 48 second cooldown. Except they can’t engage on you from 2000 range. Warriors are kinda regardless stupid though. Necro flesh golem is another one where there’s a low cooldown, offers cc and gives you every boon in the game while removing all of your conditions.

data.4093:

Oblivion.8307:

data.4093:

Oblivion.8307:

data.4093:

Yeah, condinuking shouldn’t have any counter. /sarcasm

yeah, stunning someone with basi venom shouldn’t have any counter. /sarcasm

So…I guess…basilisk venom wasn’t patched in october? Wait why are we talking about bask venom…

Thief engages on me from 2k+ range using signet/sword2/steal with basi venom. He has every boon in the game(plus aegis). I’m stunned, how can I retaliate other than try and run away after using a stunbreaker?

Corrupt boon?

So there’s one possible spell that can counter lyssa runes to a certain extent? But wait, I mistimed it and it was dodged due to 3 spam, kitten I suck.

data.4093:

Oblivion.8307:

data.4093:

Yeah, condinuking shouldn’t have any counter. /sarcasm

yeah, stunning someone with basi venom shouldn’t have any counter. /sarcasm

So…I guess…basilisk venom wasn’t patched in october? Wait why are we talking about bask venom…

Thief engages on me from 2k+ range using signet/sword2/steal with basi venom. He has every boon in the game(plus aegis). I’m stunned, how can I retaliate other than try and run away after using a stunbreaker?

data.4093:

Yeah, condinuking shouldn’t have any counter. /sarcasm

yeah, stunning someone with basi venom shouldn’t have any counter. /sarcasm

zerker staff ele is god.