Guild Wars 2

I have reached level 20 spvp and the sad state of spvp is that there is no reason to win the maps. The best way to gain the most amount of glory is to kill NPCs on the map (Svanir and Chieftain and trebs) and to run in a zerg and kill as many people as you can.
Edit – I try to help my team win as much as I can but in the end, I end up getting less points…is this working as intended?

There is no incentive to win. There is not enough points to defend or take points and there is way too many points for killing NPCs(though treb is about right).

Make people want to win the maps, it will make it much more fun. When your team wins you get a massive glory gain, and losers get nothing, or very little.

The point system needs a revamp, because while zerging is fun, it gets mind-numbing at level 20.

And they let you score 30 treb hits…did they not even harass you on the treb??

I was a bit too harsh, for that I apologize, and you are right, the editing is very good.

What people want to see though,instead of high crit highlights and skill spamming is:

1. What do you do when your CDs are down and you get jumped?
2. Show 1v1s vs skilled opponents, not guys running away, and who are noobs
3. It is ok to die, show that too, just make sure you did your best before you died.
4. 1v2? 2v1? Show us how you cheat death every time you PvP…
5. Show us how you cap points when there are four guys standing on it…trebuchet and its user, etc…
6. How did you just humiliate somebody who got the jump on you?
7. Show us how you rallied back to life as you killed somebody who put you in the downed state by throwing your daggers while crying for help.

That kind of kitten sells…

Sorry, but I saw nothing but you chasing down people from behind who had no idea you were hitting them, or were too nooby to realize it, and spamming HS and death blossom. I stopped watching after less than two minutes. This video does not display anything about your skills. Sorry to be so hard, but it is not impressive.
Cheers,
PS

@gwawer – it is not about preparing to defend against a thief, it is about knowing how to counter them. A thief can take a glass cannon build and do ok and get some fast kills, but if he wants to play well he needs practice and knowledge of other classes. The OP has done you all a great favor by posting some valid anti-thief tactics. You would be wise to use them to your advantage.

THIS:

TLDR:
-If you see a thief running toward you with a smug look on his face, get ready for the teleport at or shortly after 900 range.
-Pre dodge FTW. Have your finger hovering over a stun break, immunity, or other defensive cooldown.
-Once you see a thief stealth, dodge and run for 3 seconds, pop a defensive cooldown, or an aoe knockback/stun
-Thieves will stealth every 4-5 seconds if you let them. Anticipate it.
-Backstab is their main source of damage. Don’t let them hit you in the back, make them waste their 3 second stealth, or play defensively when they stealth.
-Stay above 50% HP. Do not go below 25% HP. 100-50%, thieves do reduced damage. 50-25% thieves do high damage. under 25% HP, you’re dead without a cooldown or dodge.
-Stealth lasts 3 seconds. Attacking unstealths. Thieves can’t restealth for ~4 sec. Hitting with cloak and dagger is the only “spammable” way to stealth. You can still hit and damage thieves in stealth. Channeled abilities will continue to hit and face you toward stealthed thieves. There is no perma stealth.
-The thieves that are killing you repeatedly are probably glass cannons. Defensive counter, then burst, defensive counter, burst, defend, damage. It doesn’t take long to do significant damage to a glass cannon thief. Taking advantage of the “safe periods” to do damage then anticipating their burst is the key to success.

How refreshing. First time I have ever gone ten matches without seeing a single memser. Looks like the nerf is working Anet.

@spicy, you have paraphrased what I said.

Reducing haste will solve a lot of the issues.

Agreed on the MOA, so sick of being turned into a chicken that just takes it up the kitten with a weak claw jump attack that does no damage. At least give me the option to fly away!!!

IV Endu, your points for not nerfing retaliation are not related to the reasons they did it in the first place. Having endless retaliation while doing good to great dps is too easy mode.

I play a thief and the only warriors or guardians that I can take down quickly are glass cannons and noobs. They do huge DPS and it depends on who gets the jump on who. It is a trade-off. I think it is justified completely. You can still have it up constantly, it just is more difficult now.

Big lag today…because of the patch??

Not a L2P issue, it is a mechanic that is being exploited in Tournaments (i.e. no one is finishing off, just letting them bleed slowly). Anets kneejerk reaction to that is to make DS more powerful so that people won’t ignore them, but this is not the way to fix it.

I am not asking them to remove it, just reduce it. It is not just my opinion that it is too OP right now. It is not a L2P issue.

I didn’t see that in the patch notes, but that is ridiculous! I

already get peeved when I down someone and I have 6+ health left and they end up killing me because they interrupt me and hit me for massive amounts of rock damage.

Just stupid to buff downed state, what were they thinking?

Hi Anet,

I appreciate you guys trying to balance this game, and all the nerfs are justified and needed, however I think you are missing the big picture.

It is haste that needed an across the board nerf. Make it half what it is today, and removeable as a boon. It is just stupidly OP.

Do that and almost all your issues are solved around PvP.

I don’t see an imminent dagger storm nerf, if anything the retaliation on it will be cut down, but it is not OP IMO. Too easy to counter and the damage isn’t that great (unless you haste with it, and haste needs a big nerf across the board).

I run P/P and D/D and love it. The SB is great for AOE but honestly, the only time I really miss it is in the keep map. It just feels wrong to use a SB.

While I agree with nerfing the thieves (and it is my main, I have 250+ pvp matches with mine) I think they are barking up the wrong tree. it is haste that needed a nerf (across all classes) and not PW itself.

No trolling, the fact is, 100B is easy to counter, and so is Whirlwind, whereas PW is instagib and takes no skill and is nearly impossible to counter when it lands. But like I have said elsewhere, haste is the issue, not PW.

Love backstabbing necros. Just love it.

no surprise here, should have been more IMO. Now you may have to learn to play your thief.

Why is it surprising when you roll an easymode faceroll FOTM class that gets nerfed? It was and is stupidly OP. the good players will adapt. You guys had it coming and it should come as no surprise. Be happy it wasn’t more as it could and should have been…i.e. MOA.

What is confusing about nerfing something that is just stupidly OP and takes absolutely no skill? Now, at least with the retaliation nerf, you actually have to play a Guardian and not just easymode faceroll. Good job Anet, keep them coming.

Gods forbid! a 40 millisecond, which should be .024 of a second slower and not .040 if I am not mistaken. They should have made it more IMO. I play a ranger too and the SB 1 skill is just skilless. This is a minor and needed nerf of the class IMO. No need to whine, just learn to adapt. SB is just easy Iwin…

This is not a how big is your kitten compared to my kitten thread…I am just wondering how much people can put up with the grind to reach good levels of pvp…I am 400 glory shy of level 19 with about 300 matches and honestly, am starting to find it a bit numbing…PVE is not my thing…all my chars are level 2, just after the initial must do pve bit, they are all in the mists…

The skins up to dolyak are just so boring and plain…the medium armor duelist gear looks cool, will go for that but what is there to shoot for after 20? Anyone reached level 80 yet?

Cheers,
PS

You tried pvp for one night and you are saying it is broken?

You mean the only valid one besides the fact that some classes have OP DS and others have rubbish?
And agreed with the OP, not working as intended.

Seriously, first its the damage that is the problem, and now the stealth? Stealth ain’t the issue here, it is that people do not know how to counter it…AOE is your friend.

Agreed on thief/mesmer nerfs, but they should leave stealth like it is and fix it before they decide to do anything else to it.

Nerf the class and be done with it, then I can get on with playing my favorite all time class in all MMOs.

In downed state, definitely possible…I run a backstab build, but have never come close to that even on softies. But good job nonetheless…

I tend to agree, the chests are a joke IMO. And I think you are better off buying the copper chests and salvaging them.

TheGuy.3568:

Pimpslapper.2047:

I think so. I play a thief as my main, and I hate all the hardseekorz spammers and death blossom losers that are besmirching the name and culture of the class that I bought this game to play.

Nerf them both, then I can play my favorite class without all the FOTM rollers ruining it for me and the rest of us who just love the thief in general.

The sooner the better Anet.

Kind of sums up my thoughts but I don’t think some one is “fotm” just because they went with those builds from the start a lot of thieves wanted to be a traditional double dagger players. I cant fault them for that. However for me I play P/D if they nerf stealth they nerf me too and out side of some parts of WvW I cant really touch a D/D. That being said if it would bring it all in line then great. Honestly a cd on Heatseeker would likely be the easy fix but that could ruin D/D.

Some earlier said this was a complaint thread about the classes themselves and what about 100b warriors. Well the thing is this isn’t so much about thief pawning which they tend to do and more about sPvP being flooded with them. I don’t see a point in crying about getting beat considering it happens all the time and I don’t think any of us need a game to stroke our egos. Their will always be some one who is better at it than you thats the way things are. However what happens when it stops being fun? Match in match out thieves doing seeker blossom spams. Among the warriors I have fought I have seen 100b less than 5 times so I cant complain.

So to make a long response more compact its not so much about the fact that we tend to lose to the build but the fact it seems to be the only build that thieves run and that their are so many of them thats it.

Good points. When you join an 8v8 and it is 5 mesmers, 5 thieves, and 3 guardians with a ranger or two, there is something wrong. Though, I am seeing a lot more necros these days, and they are all doing really well point wise.

I happen to play a D/D backstab build, it is what I always play. Heartseeker needs a CD, even 2 or 5 seconds and damage reduced by half, I do not care, because I only use it as it is intended…a finisher (though I have no issues spamming it where appropriate on mesmers and guardians…) But, it should not be spammable by any means.

I honestly think the stealth in this game is fine. The only thing they could and maybe should nerf is shadow refuge, could reduce the time in stealth on that, would probably make sense, but the rest is fine, IMO.

I am only level 18 pvp but have a lot of those games on my ranger as well, and a fair few now on my necro, and tbh, the stealth in this game is quite easy to counter:

1. don’t stand still when you see someone go into stealth (DUH?)
2. Dodge, Evade, roll…
3. AOE…once again, AOE…and lastly, AOE.
4. Be aware of your environment…know where the enemy thieves are and if they are engaged or if they are lurking…if they are lurking watch out. Sounds like dumb advice, but I cannot tell you how many people I come across that just are so focused on Biiiiirrrrrrssttting down one player they do not even notice when I approach, even out of stealth.

Spam your tab button if you are alone 1v1 and you will target him just before he comes out of stealth, you will also see a little wisp of black smoke just before he de-stealths, use this time to get the upper hand…chill, slow, cripple, and dodge if he is a HS spammer noob.

Anyway, as I said before, Anet should probably do something soon about this.

Don’t get me wrong, I am not saying thieves don’t need tweaking, but it is mainly the pistol whippers, HS spammers, and the death blossom abusers who need it. I think once Anet sorts those, the stealth complaints will drop dramatically.

If the one down is a mesmer, or even a thief, you can absolutely forget 1 v 2.

I think so. I play a thief as my main, and I hate all the hardseekorz spammers and death blossom losers that are besmirching the name and culture of the class that I bought this game to play.

Nerf them both, then I can play my favorite class without all the FOTM rollers ruining it for me and the rest of us who just love the thief in general.

The sooner the better Anet.

Thanks for the replies guys!

I play thief as one of my mains and it is a rare necro that beats me (Backstab build), but last night there was one who put me to shame, hats off to him!

Thanks Blueprint and Chidawg for the detailed hints, will definitely help me to learn this class faster.

I have just been messing around with a condition build and it feels pretty good to me for starters.
Cheers,
PS

HI,

most of the links are dead in the build thread, and was wondering if anyone could recommend a build + weapons that is best at countering melee/thieves, etc…can be minions, etc…
Thanks in advance,
PS

Crit all the way…condition is just boring IMO…

I have piercing arrows, yet somebokittenpt hiding behind his illuisons last night and I would get the blocked/los message…bugged?

Anyone else noticed that the illusions are not granting pierce on your arrows?

Why Mug? 5k steals + free and easy poisoning are nice to have I cannot live without it myself…

I use a steal build as well, but is backed by backstabbing…I tried one similar to yours, but found the crit% and damage was too low for my liking. Also, remember to turn off your auto-attack on your 1 button or it will destealth you. What are your overall stats with this build? I assume D/D? Divinity runes?
Have fun!
PS

Try something like this:

Backstabber build that I roll with, I change it frequently, and there are probably better, but it should get you going in the right direction, there is no best build, it is more what you learn to like that fits your playstyle:

http://www.gw2db.com/skills/calc/thief#3|3|2642|8743|3997|4004|4989|30|1738|1143|2356|30|1731|1193|1196|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|10|786|0|0|0|0|2|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|

I use D/D on main, with dual pistols on switch. I keep a Shortbow in my bag for switching out depending on map and professions on opposing team.
use divinity runes in your armour and precision on your daggers and pistols. This should give you good crit percentage and high damage. You are right about the dual pistols, the 3 skill on those does some huge damage on single targets. You may miss the AOE of the shortbow, but not as often as you will miss the burst on a single target IMO (exception is the keep). You could roll with D/P on your main hand but I find CnD more useful than the interrupt and black powder skills for pistol (though vs warrior and guardian, very, very useful…)

Opener is 5 + F1 + 1 that is a steal/CnD combo and backstab at the end to do some serious damage. You can pop haste first too if you really want to end it right then and there as your autoattack finishes him off. If he is still alive, you can restealth with CnD if enough initiative and cd up, or use 7 and re-backstab, finish with heartseekorz if you want and most are dead. Steal and CnD + backstab can do upwards of 15k damage on a ranger/thief/softie. Tanks will be a lot less ofc…

If you steal from a guardian or warrior, you may get 100b or whirling axes, use those after your initial opener and laugh as you kill them with their own /faceroll skill. If you steal against a thief, you will get blinding tuft, which gives you a free stealth/blind ,so you can save your others skills. Necros will give you an AOE fear, which is super. Hunters give you the tree of health, has its uses surely for groups.

Vs ranged, i.e. rangers, use the opener and when they start to open up on you, dagger storm ftw as it has retaliation. a good ranger will stoop firing, the noobs will just keep on blasting away.

I do not like condition builds myself, because it takes too long to kill the enemies IMO. I much prefer burst builds. Anyway, give it a try and let us know what you think, and have fun with the thief…btw, he is not a melee warrior, you have to pick and choose your battles!

Yeah, keep the system like it is but:

1. Don’t show everyone as level 80 in Spvp, show their SPVP Ranks instead!!!
2. Give us some decent skins!! Make the armor for the higher levels really stand out. The higher levels should be feared on the killing grounds, not just based on skill, but on how intimidating they look!

Otherwise, please do not change a thing!

Agreed that :

1. Downed state should be same for all
2. Should be 1 to 1 rally, and not the whole lot.

The way it is now, some classes are just super OP in downed state andothers are just fodder…i.e. Elementalist…and rangers go down hard too.

Be happy your wife even plays it…it is ruining my marriage precisely because she does NOT…

I play mainly thief and ranger, and do well with both. I play a backstab build with my thief and enjoy coming across most rangers. Most do not know how to play and are easy fodder. You need to endure the initial damage (5 seconds as stated and you need toughness), you need to dodge roll as soon as you can, stun him, and kite while healing yourself, use signet of stone if you have to, and wait until he is out of initiative. Be sure to time your rolls and your endurance to miss his big hits, i.e. heartseeker. If you can endure his initial assault the kitten will usually beat cheeks to get out of there because he knows he cannot beat you then.

One thing to remember as a ranger, play with your mouse zoomed all the way out (I assume everyone does this anyway??) and keep an eye out for thieves, constantly look around when you are playing. Poison or bleed them as early as you can and if you see one go to stealth and you are anywhere near him, do not stand still, keep moving, always keep moving, do not ever just stand still and shoot. Sick your pet on them as soon as you can. Most are glass cannon builds and will go down quickly if you get the jump on them. Just do not let them get the jump on you.

I play a dmg/survival build of :

30 (III VIII XI)
0
30 (III IX XII)
5
5
I use divinity runes or ranger, sometimes changing frequently, that gives me about 1950 toughness and 16k life with 40% crit some excellent survival skills from the survival tree.
Axe and warhorn with SB on swap
I use zephyr, signet of stone, (lightning reflexes, sharpening stone, or signet of the hunt, depending on what professions are in the game) and rampage as one. Works great vs all characters IMO.

Good luck, and really the best way is just to play, play, play, you will get better and you will start to woop some kitten with your character once you get to know the ins and outs of the game.

I like the aesthetic only rewards, only way to keep it balanced. But those need a big revamp.

They need to make the aesthetics really stand out for those who have reached good levels in Spvp. The chest rewards are a joke, and often times the armor upgrades from chests on Medium armor don’t change the looks at all from the original skin. Yes you can Mystic Forge new ones, but even those up to Dolyak look just plain stupid (Med armor).

Make it big and shiny, and they will come…and stay, even if the stats remain the same, and they should.

ok thanks for the tips guys, happy ranging

Rage + Zephyr + SB hurts a lot too…

The thieves are fine, no need to have them called by your name. They are super as they are.

I want to be constructive here and not complain, but it is frustrating that in spvp, one of my greatest deathbringers is retaliation.

1v1 this is easy to counter, but what use is a ranger in a big group combat if he cannot even fire arrows without killing himself? Am I meant to melee? I do not think this is a l2p issue, I have over 100 spvp games on this ranger, and do very well with him regardless, but to constantly die by my own sword, as it were…