Guild Wars 2

JaironKalach.4938:

Um… This is a great concept but it has a siginificant potential for fraud. All it takes is one person deciding to keep both money and mini.

I would assume requiring people to hand over the current buy order amount when receiving the minis would negate this. As keeping the minis would just mean the victim could just buy a new one.

Is there still a potential for fraud using that system?

I often have to go through many screens to check on my achievements.

Adding something right under the story quest panel would really help when trying to keep track of how far along your achievements are.

Currently if I’m aiming for an achievement I need to hit ‘H’, click the achievement menu button, select the achievement catagory (often the catagory is reset even if looking at it 5 minutes ago), then scroll down to the achievement.

This is frustrating.

Why not add a checkbox next to each achievement, and once selected that achievement will appear in the same panel as the story progress as a bar that fills as you achieve more of the achievement.

This would give people who care about achievements more ready feedback on thier progress and may make those who currently don’t pay attention to achievements, become a bit more interested.

Getting all 54 Miniatures at once unlocks the achievement, but you can then trade/send the miniatures and keep the title.

The title currently costs around 570g if you kept the minis.

Is there any interest in people pooling their money and swapping minis? I was thinking I’d just buy them all, people could send me the buy order minimum, I’d send the minis, then once the achievement is unlocked we’d exchange both back. (Avoids the 15% loss per transfer if everyone just TPed them.)

570g is a fair bit for most people, so friends could pool money. I’d say a lot of groups have that much money between them.

Ursan.7846:

So no, it really isn’t a problem. An item that rare will get sold, despite the 1c undercutters.

The problem isn’t related to whether an item will get sold or not, it’s the time it will take to get sold.

The only purpose of 1c undercutters is to get their item sold quicker, the amount of time between when the under item sells and when the original item sells is liquidity taken from the original seller.

Normally undercutters have to pay something (less profit) to get this advantage. It’s what we call competition.

As the system currently stands the undercutter can gain an advantage without spending anything remotely noticeable (1c).

That’s the issue.

whiran.1473:

OP, is there competition in Guild Wars 2’s economy?

Please give me a more appropriate title and I’ll edit my original post. (I of course expect an insulting interpretation since it takes a certain character to critique a sentence literally, without regarding context.)

Disclaimer: I’ve completed the Halloween JP around 200 times, loved it. Completed Snowglobe 20 times, hardly any fails. My problem with the JP is not because I can’t complete it, but simply that I feel it’s so badly designed that I have no wish to grind it like I did the Clock Tower.
First section: Snowflakes. Same model used over and over for different sized platforms. All floating mid air.
Means there is no sense of perspective, hard to actually know what size the platforms are before jumping. Repetitive platforms makes the puzzle stale and grindy.
Candy cane suffer from same problems as all ledge jumps, ledges feel unresponsive, and seem to cheat to grab on to player, characters will often jump further or shorter than commanded making the ledges feel both cheaty and unfair at the same time. (Of course this is solved by side jumping, but I’d imagine most don’t do that.)
Second section: Mints. Same model used over and over for different sized platforms. All floating mid air.
Same problems as first section, but worse. Mints give even less perspective as they are whole models with no shadows and the inability to see through them for even minimal perspective.
Third section: Presents. Boxes seemingly disappear randomly, gives the feeling of luck instead of skill. The jumping pattern required is very unsatifying, back and forth over and over (assuming no presents missing), no aiming, no complex decision making.
Forth section: Candy cane. Wind creates a timed barrier, after racing to that point. Breaks pacing.
Fifth section: Snowballs. Skrit throwing things never actually threaten the player. Instead just create an annoying atmosphere where new players feel they could be thrown off at any moment. At the double mint off shoot, wall can throw you in to the ground if you hit the snow bank at the slightly wrong angle.
Sixth section: Presents. Jumping on blue presents requires no aiming. Simple and boring jump forward. No skill involved, makes no use of what could be a good final run up.
Summary: The Clock Tower (gold standard JP at this point) was hard, but even the cheap part felt like a failure of skill. There was no random component. Snowglobe seems filled with random, platforms are unreadable ahead of time, skrit snowballs (even though they don’t actually do something) make the player feel they are facing random elements, the presents are very random, the platforms feel random due to their complete flatness and weird angles (which is they obeyed normal game physics and wern’t sticky would not be able to be jumped on).
Summary summary: Snowglobe is too easy, and too cheap/random.

Mandar.9813:

An undercut is a form of insurance.

Sure, the problem is that that insurance is currently effectively free for items worth over 1g. And as with everything which has no cost, it is currently overconsumed. And rightfully so- why not take advantage of something free which provides you benefit. I certainty do.

Mandar.9813:

sellers will be substantially deterred from trying to compete to win a sale.

I don’t disagree. I can’t speak for others, but I doubt people will be deterred, and that is certainly not my intention. What I’m asking for is simply that they have to pay something for the right to push the first comer back in the selling queue.

As you’ve said, undercutting has the purpose of increasing your liquidity, at the expense of whoever else had the lowest selling order. When the undercutter pays something for that it’s called competition. Under the current system there is effectively no cost to 1c undercutting- and that’s the problem.

Mandar.9813:

you’ll just see a devaluing of goods.

Good, if sellers are willing to sell at lower levels then the goods arn’t actually worth as much as the currently distroted market is showing.

Mandar.9813:

by just 1c, can drastically change profit.

I’m not sure where you’re getting this from. I never said 1c is a drastic change in profit. In fact since my proposed change is percentage based, this can never be the case. Only items with a large sale value would be effected, where 1c is not at all a drastic proportion of the sale price.

Mandar.9813:

I’m not sure which “market” you are worried about ruining,

There is not multiple markets for a single good. Once sell amount meet buy amounts a sale occurs. Buy and sell markets are unavoidably connected. Anyway, 1c undercutting doesn’t destroy a market, and I never claimed it did- it simply makes some players benefit at the expense of other players without offering anything of value, or apply any degree of skill or effort.

Mandar.9813:

because you are upset about constantly being undercut

You keep implying I’m whining because of selfish reasons. I’m a massive 1c undercutter. I profit tons from employing the stratagy, and I avoid high value items like the plague. If the change I proposed was put in I’d lose money, not gain it. Buyers would be the most benifitted as they’d now face sell orders that actually represented sellers willingness to sell, instead of the 1c undercut wars which do hardly anything to effect prices.

Mandar.9813:

Being undercut by one Copper is hardly a risk,

And yet you wrote an entire paragraph about liquidity, and how undercutting was an insurance against it. So tell me- why do people 1c undercut if, apparently, there is no reason to do so. You say being undercut is fine, because eventually your item will sell, and yet the people undercutting you are still undercutting you. Please explain that one.

Mandar.9813:

Basically what you are suggesting is for the average seller to just “agree” on a market cost,…

It’s a good thing I’m not asking for undercutting to be removed from the game, as otherwise what you just said would be relevent. What about costless undercutting? Do you think that the extra control, and the benifit of not being lumped after people who got to the market first, should cost sellers something? More than 0.000001% for Dawn for instance?

Or are second arrivers entitled to free control/liquidity at the expense of first arrivers?

Mandar.9813:

I guess the question really is: which instinct will win?

And that would be fine if both instincts were actual choices. But currently there is only downside to matching the current sell price, and only upside to 1c undercutting the current sell price. In a healthy market, to gain an advantage, you need to either take home less or act is a smarter manner. 1c undercutting does neither.

Mandar.9813:

You’d be asking people to trust the market to stay steady, and therein lies the problem.

Here again you highlight the problem, the thing you’ve previously said “isn’t a risk”. First movers take a risk, that the market will not move downwards and that their item will be sold. 1c undercutters increase this risk by getting the same reward, but getting their item sold faster. They pay nothing for this, they screw the person before them at no cost.

Disclaimer: I’ve completed the Halloween JP around 200 times, loved it. Completed Snowglobe 20 times, hardly any fails. My problem with the JP is not because I can’t complete it, but simply that I feel it’s so badly designed that I have no wish to grind it like I did the Clock Tower.

First section: Snowflakes. Same model used over and over for different sized platforms. All floating mid air.

Means there is no sense of perspective, hard to actually know what size the platforms are before jumping. Repetitive platforms makes the puzzle stale and grindy.

Candy cane suffer from same problems as all ledge jumps, ledges feel unresponsive, and seem to cheat to grab on to player, characters will often jump further or shorter than commanded making the ledges feel both cheaty and unfair at the same time. (Of course this is solved by side jumping, but I’d imagine most don’t do that.)

Second section: Mints. Same model used over and over for different sized platforms. All floating mid air.

Same problems as first section, but worse. Mints give even less perspective as they are whole models with no shadows and the inability to see through them for even minimal perspective.

Third section: Presents. Boxes seemingly disappear randomly, gives the feeling of luck instead of skill. The jumping pattern required is very unsatifying, back and forth over and over (assuming no presents missing), no aiming, no complex decision making.

Forth section: Candy cane. Wind creates a timed barrier, after racing to that point. Breaks pacing.

Fifth section: Snowballs. Skrit throwing things never actually threaten the player. Instead just create an annoying atmosphere where new players feel they could be thrown off at any moment. At the double mint off shoot, wall can throw you in to the ground if you hit the snow bank at the slightly wrong angle.

Sixth section: Presents. Jumping on blue presents requires no aiming. Simple and boring jump forward. No skill involved, makes no use of what could be a good final run up.

Summary: The Clock Tower (gold standard JP at this point) was hard, but even the cheap part felt like a failure of skill. There was no random component. Snowglobe seems filled with random, platforms are unreadable ahead of time, skrit snowballs (even though they don’t actually do something) make the player feel they are facing random elements, the presents are very random, the platforms feel random due to their complete flatness and weird angles (which is they obeyed normal game physics and wern’t sticky would not be able to be jumped on).

Summary summary: Snowglobe is too easy, and too cheap/random.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

All the other Sell Orders don’t matter to me either. This is a competition (of sorts) to sell our items. There is no rule or law that dictates what I can or cannot sell for, and there shouldn’t be. So if I place my item for 1 copper less, that means I’m making less money than if the other guy sells his for 1 copper more. If it make him feel better, he can say he made more of a profit than me.

Again, when you say “there is no rule of law”- that’s correct. What I’m asking for is to implement a law.

Look at what you’re saying- you know that 1c undercutting isn’t true competition. “If it makes him feel better”- you know that the original seller isn’t truly getting more profit- they’re getting 1c more. And waiting longer. Because I, and you, have cheated him of his place.

If the person could relist their item for 1c less than us, at least that would be bordering on fair. But they can’t- they lose 5% if they do, and another person will just come along and 1c undercut their new price. If there was no 5% fee, then that would at least be fair- but it would encourage an endless micromanaging of sale orders the same way buy orders are currently micromanaged- giving the advantage to those who devote the most time rather than those willing to offer more for the item.

I know others sell orders don’t matter to you- but take yourself out of your selfish position for one moment. I benefit greatly from 1c undercutting, but we should all be willing to put aside personal gain and correct injustices for the good of the market.

MisterEction.9382:

…
The fact that you’ve written several pages of text just indicates there is some advantage for you personally…

I benefit greatly from 1c undercutting, as do most power traders. I’m here because 1c undercutting is unfair, and rewards those who prey on good faith traders. A healthy market benefits all over the long run, I’m willing to give up the advantage so that others have faith in the system.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Remember that 1 Gold less and 1 Copper less is still less. So the lower price does indeed deserve to go first.

Justify that. I’ve written several pages of text arguing why that isn’t the case. Your response is that the current system is correct because it is correct.

1c is 0.33% of the cost level 80s pay to move to a new area, 0.9% of the cost people pay to move within an area. 1.25% a single piece of cotton.

You’re arguing semantics: 1c less is obviously technically less. But you’re ignoring the reality of the situation. 1c either way is not actually an amount worthy of being paid attention to by every player.

Starting gear costs 1c, and you get 5 of those items just for creating a character. And I’d imagine most don’t bother vendoring that gear before deleting the character.

If you want to play word games then we don’t really have anything to talk about. I admit that 1c less is less, what I disagree with is that 1c less is functionally less to the point where it deserves to jump infront of other people. What constitutes an appropriate amount that represents a true undercut? I don’t know- I’ve floated 5% as an idea. What percentage do you think is reasonable? So far it seems 0.000001% is perfectly reasonable to you. Is this the case?

Leablo.2651:

And if it was a 1g undercut…? You’re having an emotional reaction to something that makes no material difference to you.

I’m having a purely practical reaction to queue jumping.

Competition is wonderful, no one is a communist here. No one is trying to fix prices- we’re in fact trying to do the complete opposite.

The question here is: how much should people have to pay in order to sell their item faster?

The current system, on a Dusk, determines that you have to pay 0.00000025% of the sale price in order to jump in front of someone. I simply believe that that is completely unreasonable.

Why percentage do you believe is completely unreasonable? Just off the top of your head. I guarantee you that it is higher than what the system currently allows.

As to ‘no material difference’, that’s silly. Yes under 1c undercutting and 1g undercutting there is still an item placed in front of me- but the person infront of me had to make a sacrifice to do it. They had to give something up, this allowed me to better choose a price point that I believed was low enough already that people wouldn’t choose to further undercut me. As it stands- there is no price point low enough as you can always just take a 1c cut and end up at effectively the same profit margin that I chose.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

No, then I just undercut the under-cutters with more stuff at a lower rate. It’s a vicious cycle, but one I refuse to lose at.

The only time I don’t bother with undercutting by 1cp is at the end of the nite, when I log out. At that time, I’ll most likely up the amount I undercut by a 50 cp to 1 silver.

Mate. You’re stealing someone’s spot in the queue.

I’m not sure where you’re getting this ‘everyone wins’ nonsense from. You are selling your item instead of the person who listed their item, in good faith, first.

Yes the system allows you to do it- but come on. You’re not being a crafty entrepreneur, doing something that all the stupid people haven’t worked out- you’re exploiting a poorly designed system to jump in front of other people- and then saying that you deserved to sell the item first because of how competitive you are.

No offense, but you- personally- are the problem.

(To be fair: I, personally, am also the problem. As I 1c undercut (possibly) more than anyone. I just seem to actually recognise that what I’m doing it exploitative and based on a faulty system, whereas you seem to of mistake this advantage as some kind of personal achievement.)

Zid.4196:

Here’s some good advice how to deal with 1c undercutting from the guy who hit WoW gold cap and had three titans of worth just 9 months into EVE http://greedygoblin.blogspot.com/search?q=0.01+ISK

From the very article you listed:

Before you’d ask why the hate against the 0.01 punk: I’m a preacher of capitalism and a strong believer that it’s good for the World. The station trader is providing a useful service for both parties. The impatient seller can sell instantly to his buy order, the buyer will find the item on the station, he doesn’t have to go there the previous day to set up a buy order. The competing station traders decrease the margin between the buy and sell prices, providing income to both parties. The 0.01 punk not only doesn’t provide such service but discourage sellers to set up sell orders (as it won’t sell as he undercuts them) and discourage buyers to set up buy orders, so he moves the market away from equilibrium, enforcing the belief that the market is something evil that doesn’t serve the people. I’m also annoyed by his existence as it’s pretty easy to get rid of him so his pure existence proves that most people has the trading knowledge of a toad.

Which is exactly the problem I’m talking about and the exact reasons that it is a problem.

Want to know what else is different between EvE and GW2? The 5% listing fee, which prevents you from simply relisting the item again and again until the 1c undercutters go away. Which negates the entirely of the advice given in the article (although well written for EvE).

majorkong.9073:

So what’s the harm?

Good question. The buyers still get the item. An item is still sold. Who is actually harmed by the current system?

Buyers: Instead of benefiting from actual competition you have 1c undercutters jumping ahead of other sellers without taking a true hit (more than 0.000001%) to their price. As such prices remain higher than they would under true competition and buyers pay more.

Sellers: When listing an item, sellers take a risk. That risk is that their item will take a long time to sell and that they’ll need to relist their item at the cost of 5% of the selling price. Sellers always risk being undercut, that’s the nature of markets, but under a fair market the competition has to at least take a hit to their profit- currently the risk of being undercut is almost 100% and the time taken to sell the item will always be double that of what it would be if everyone was forced to either offer buyers a better deal or wait in line.

Buyers: With the constant fear of being undercut sellers are more likely not to enter the market at all, leading to a lower supply and less competition.

Sellers: Since the same thing happens with buy orders, sellers are not allowed to sell in to a fair representation of what people would pay. Instead they face the same 1c overcut war between orderers, where sellers gain 15c from fierce overcut wars- instead of the 5-30% that true competition would bring.

Summary: Sellers factor undercut risk in to the prices they choose, meaning buyers have to pay higher prices to buy out a sell order.

Buyers have to waste time micromanaging their buy orders to avoid being 1c overcut (sellers don’t get this luxary, as the 5% listing fee discourages relisting).

Buyers have to pay higher prices as undercutters are able to gain the full advantage of first sale without giving up any true price decrease (0.000001% off is not a true discount).

Sellers have to wait (potentially forever) for their items to be converted in to cash, despite the same items being sold for 1-4c less, a sum they’d gladly give up if the system allowed them to: but no matter what they listed it at originally the people who sell after them will just undercut by 1c.

Bluesavanah.8562:

I’ve seen a lot of markets crash recently, adding this would simply make that problem worse, as now people are undercutting by 5% constantly instead of by 1c gradually.

Edit: Spoke with Bluesavanah ingame, got a bit more information on what was being said.

I simply disagree that this will be the case. Yes- each undercut would be far more significant, but as undercuts actually cost something to sellers- they’ll also be far less frequent.

Sacrificing 0.000001% of the price is automatic, it’s instinctual. You check the buy spread for false orders and then you undercut. And why wouldn’t you? You get the money faster and there’s far less undercut risk.

But 5%? That’s a real decision. You’re sacrificing profit for time (risk for reward) or visa versa.

Markets will still move, that’s a given. But now people will be making profit decisions rather than jumping infront of the poor sap who got there first. For a market to crash there’d need to be a removal of demand, and a willingness of supply to take far lower prices. The undercut fee wouldn’t in itself cause a crash.

Aoreias.6384:

There’s an implementation problem here

This is why I love human systems. So easy to overlook methods of exploitation. You’re right that’s a tough one.

I suppose what you said is the best solution. The price must be 95% or less than the next highest listed price to avoid the fee. It does make the system a tad complicated for the average joe, which turns it from a feature I have a hope of seeing put in to a theoretical argument.

A bold claim, but hear me out.

Supply vs demand; Isn’t undercutting just competion?

Absolutely not. Competition requires one of two things- product differentiation where quality can influence purchasing decisions or price differentials where consumers simply purchase the cheapest available option of the same product.

1c undercutting is price differentiation, isn’t it?

Only in the most technical sense, and in reality- not unless the item is worth more than 1 silver.

Why? Because price differentiation is based on consumer value. To the consumer a Dawn selling for 400g 20s 1c is practically the same as one selling for 400g 20s 2c. Yes, the 1c undercut one is cheaper, and the buyer will always choose the cheaper one, but the buyer is not sufficiently better off after the transaction to be noticeable.

Then how should it work?

Currently in the market for Dawns you have 4 different types of buyers and sellers. One seller gets to the market first and chooses a sale price, and one seller gets to the market second and chooses either:

• the minimum they would take for the item (assuming that minimum is above the current lowest sale price, or significantly below the current sale price if the seller believes that price unreasonable)
• 1c below the current sale price

the system, as it is, rewards the second comer simply for coming to the market later by allowing them to list the item at the 1c undercut and get their item sold before the first seller.

Why couldn’t the first seller just list their item 2c lower to begin with?

The 1c undercutting isn’t random. Regardless of what the first seller lists the item the second person always has the option of listing 1c lower and 1c is 0.00001% of the sale price.

Why can’t the first person just relist the item 2c lower once they see the undercutting?

The listing fee of 5%. But let’s assume there is no listing fee, is there still a problem? Once relisted the first seller only has until the undercutter sees the relisting and undercuts again. Leading to an endless war that results in no real gain to buyers (who only gain 30c on a 400g purchase) and ends up rewarding those who are lucky, or who play the most instead of a true profit cutter.

So what’s the solution?

Competition is supposed to be about lowering prices and increasing supply.

So the only real solution is to charge a 5% fee to anyone attempting to list an item for sale at less than a 5% discount to the current lowest sale price. (eg. selling an item for 950g when the next lowest is 1000g is uneffected, selling at item for 999g99s99c is charged an additional 50g listing fee). This number is in no way necessary, make it 2%, 1%, 10%. Just make it more than the 0.000001% that is currently in place.

This would lead sellers to make an important decision when listing at item: Do I want to sell my item faster for less profit, or wait a bit more for more profit. As opposed to now where that question is not truly being asked and undercutters are simply jumping the queue.

This idea is not revolutionary, or even unheard of.

Go to any stock exchange and ask to bid $200.01 on a $201 stock and they’ll laugh at you. As stocks rise so to do the allowed bidding units. Penny stocks (0.01-0.10) allow half cent bids, while dollar stocks allow 1c bids. $50 stocks allow 5c bids and so on- and so on.

Because stocks exchanges realised, long ago, that efficient systems require limits that don’t encourage destructive behavior.

Turial.1293:

Then while I am out there I get distracted by events, etc.

Exactly. If you’re sitting there for 5 weeks straight killing 5 million ogres you’re doing it wrong. But having feedback for killing ogres moves people out in to the world, while killing ogres you can run in to other people and start doing ogre killing DEs, you can deeply explore caves filled with ogres, you can find packs of ogres gaurding chests, and run dungeons filled with ogres, you can test out new weapons, and chat with others who are also killing ogres.

The achievement board is simply there to help you start an adventure, so that the entire game isn’t just spamming LFG in LA for 2 hours before going off in to an instance yet again.

If the feature helps a single person have a fun experience because they decided to do something other than LFG spam then that’s a worthwhile addition. And it doesn’t require endless upgrading like new scripted content does.

What does pointless mean?

Pointless to you? We’re playing a game. We’re not curing cancer. There is no reward possible in the game that has any amount of meaning other than what players give to it.

I just want, at the end of killing 5000 Jotunns, for the game to recognise that you did do it. That to me makes the game feel responsive. Clearly it doesn’t for you- you need your feet to sparkle, or your autoattack to do extra animations.

And there is already plenty of content in the game that satisfies that desire- but your ‘meaning’ requires constant developer time and will need constant updating. My suggestion gives a large swath of people equal meaning and requires no developer time beyond the first update. That is it’s advantage.

Lack of upkeep.

Thanks to everyone who replied, but I’ve been shown a method to obtain both PoIs and have handed over the cash.

Shamrocky.5036:

Woah, 17k achievement points? I find that hard to believe. I think a screenshot is in order here

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/15k-Achievement-Points/first#post890926

All they need to do is undo whatever they changed in the last patch. Not like it’s either ‘major content patch’ or ‘fix keg brawl achievements’.

It’d take a couple of minutes.

@Illconceived Was Na.9781

You can still do the basic achievement and get 100% of the points. The leaderboards will simply be for people who want to have a friendly competition against the entire playerbase.

@Zorby.8236

The points motivate people to play. They give guidance. Instead of standing around in LA waiting for a fractal group it can move people out in to the world, doing things. This comes at the cost of minimal dev time, unlike scripted content which quickly becomes stale, player driven content is constant and unending.

Why would you kill more than 5k sparks other than money? More than 5k bunnies? Why is a person whose made 10k longbow kills counted the same as someone whose made 200k longbow kills? Wouldn’t have information be interesting to know?

Currently achievements are done and then forgotten. Their entire usefulness has already been used up by the majority of the playerbase. Adding more achievements will do nothing to address this problem- the only solution for stale content is to make content playerdriven.

Bartho.7896:

Eh why do you want those PoIs so bad o.O, they dont count into any achievement whatsoever

I have 17k achievement points, getting 2 achievement points for unlocking POIs isn’t a motivation.

What I do want is to not have to look at empty POIs when I run CoE (which I do fairly often).

Most people consider them bugged, 20g seemed the minimum motivation to get people out of the wookwork.

I’ll be grouping with Braxxis.7062 when he’s on. If anyone provides a detailed explanation prior to that then they’ll get the money instead.

Wethospu.6437:

Submarine:
Central POI:

Submarine: I’ve done this on multiple runs and simply end up inside the submarine, unable to jump any further in to the wall. How does one not end up inside the submarine and able to get the PoI?

Central POI: I’ve already faceleaped in to the stairs past the lasers but have not been able to get over the barrier. Is there a specific place that you can jump over?

To add some longevity to endgame (without hardly any effort on the devs part) achievement leaderboards should be added to individual achievements.

All achievements would have to be expanded to track beyond their current maximums and instead replaced with repeatables that have no maximum.

Clicking a button next to individual achievements would then open a leaderboard, giving you the top 20 for that particular achievement, and your current ranking.

This would motivate people automatically to compete for nothing more than bragging rights, and would allow individuals to pick unpopular achievements where the competition may not be as fierce and carve out a top spot.

Edit:

“I don’t want to have to grind achievements forever”: Normal achievements will remain. After an achievement is capped a new achievement will unlock where you can gain progress forever. Once the normal achievement is capped you can stop, no points will be rewarded, the higher unlocks wont effect your completion. The unlimited achievements will only be for people who choose to have a friendly competition with the playerbase.

I want to get 5 people together, join a dungeon and costume brawl grind up to the 500 champs needed.

Anyone interested?

Thanks to everyone who replied, but I’ve been shown a method to obtain both PoIs and have handed over the cash.

Checked most public sources and found no way to get them.

If anyone out there knows how to discover these PoIs (assuming they aren’t completely bugged) I’ll pay them 20g.

You can reply to this thread or pm me ingame.

First to get the information to me will get the money after completion.

Please please please add easy modes to JPs. Just to shut the whiners up.

Make the easy modes you jump up one step and then you win. Just so we don’t have to listen to how their grandmother can’t be left alone for more than 20 second intervals, how they’re a nearsighted war vet, or how their hand eye coordination was destroyed saving kittens from a burning tree. Wah wah wah wah wah wah wah and another million excuses.

Let them have their meaningless victory that 100% of babies can also achieve and then make the real game where people who want a challenge can get things done.

This is the world they want to live in, where they can complete everything- just like they deserve- without actually putting any effort in to it. And it’d be better for everyone if you just gave it to them.

Otherwise they’re going to threaten to quit again and create 50 page whine threads instead of actually learning how to play- and no one wants that.

Unfortunately ANet will of inevtiably given in to the whiners, well represented in this thread, and will of turned this JP in to a baby mode challenge.

Because everyone deserves to complete all ‘challenges’ otherwise they’re unfair and mean.

God forbid people actually need to anything other than spend time in order to complete something.

Keg brawl has been ignored for so long, and the only change has been to break the achievements.

So weird.

I’ve also experienced this issue. Would love it resolved, maybe add a minor amount of glory or xp as well.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Risingashes.8694:

encourages a constant 1c war between sellers.

I’m sorry you’re mad that we sellers are willing to undercut our profits by 1 cp in order to sell faster. If you refresh the TP, and see my listings as cheaper, by all means feel free to post lower. Just don’t be surprised if the price drops by another 1cp on your next refresh.

That’s my entire point. The 5% is charged upon listing and it can be undercut by 1c every time.

I could take the 5% hit and relist, but then another person would just undercut by 1c.

That system doesn’t encourage equilibrium, or that people list items for what they truly value them at. It’s simply a 1c undercut war, where luck determines who actually sells the item.

If buyers were benefiting then that’d be fair game- but they aren’t. They’re getting (at best) 3-4c off the purchase price of items which can be 1g-100g in price. If undercuts required a 1% decrease then buyers would truly be getting value from competition and sellers would need to ask real questions about how much their items are really worth.

But instead continue demonizing me for being greedy because I don’t want to ‘compete’ or some other such nonsense. Because 1c undercutting is ‘true competition’ rather than exploiting a poorly implemented system that rewards luck over the willingness to accept lower prices.

Zen.2450: Sorry about these guys. They seem to think that GW2 is real life, and that the BLT is manned by people who need to feed their family.

You’re suggestion is completely valid. As the fee structure is currently setup it fails to encourage fluid exchange of goods and instead encourages a constant 1c war between sellers.

I seriously love these suggestions: it just shows why regulations in the real world are able to be so screwed up without the public going in the a frenzy.

I’m sure to OP is off posting another ridiculous theory elsewhere, but just in case I’ll attempt to educate you in high school economics.

What you’re suggesting would mean that a person who buys up a significant amount just below the average price would then see prices rise due to an automatic decreased in supply. Once prices rise supply automatically increases meaning that prices drop but only drop down to the average price. The investor can now simply wait out any spikes for the price to go back to the average price and then sell at a guaranteed profit.

However since supply to inverse to price, all investors know that prices are essentially fixed, and therefore will act accordingly. This will mean investors will get rich without risk, and the ‘market’ will essentially be a vendor that charges retail purchasers a fee which is distributed to rich investors.

You’ve managed to help the very people you believe are evil at the expense of the ‘little guy’.

Congratulations.

Halagaz.6085:

i mean a guild is nothing else than a special chat channel.

It just feels like ANet never actually sat down and thought about how multiple guilds would actually work. A competent QA team should have dealt with a lot of these issues prior to release, especially since most of them are likely not hard to implement.

(Not that I’m blaming the QA team, they might have had their hands tied by management for all I know.)

RNG should only be implemented as follows:

ANet sit around a table and ask “What is the most absurdly high amount of times that someone can be expected to <do thing> before it becomes ridiculous that they haven’t gotten <thing> yet?”

For example: “The chance of getting a Permanent TP from BL Chest is 0.001% therefore it takes 10000 chests on average to get one. So if someone hasn’t gotten one after 20000 chests that person is having a really bad day. So for every chest opened the person gets 1 token and the Permanent TP will cost 20000 tokens.”

This should be in place for every single RNG event, you have a chance of getting everything and also a definite token which can be used to purchase all random items at the cost of double the average drop rate.

• This would keep things rare.
• Give people who don’t like gambling a definite cost of items, avoid situations where someone gets 6 rare items which they don’t want but never the 1 rare item that they actually want, and 6 people never get the 6 rare items the first person has multiple copies of.
• Make RNG annoying but not soul destroying.
• People are still capable of being surprised by being lucky.

Most people are fine with rarity, they’re fine with randomness, they’re fine with ‘putting the hours in’.

But what, I believe, most people hate (!, hate hate hate hate) is that feeling that no matter how many ToT bags you open, no matter how much money you spend, that there is no upper limit to unluckiness. And you know that some people open 5 bags and get something they don’t really value that you’ve opened 20000 and have not gotten.

A few volunteers have devoted a lot of their time to managing a LFG guild for Fractals.

Due to the lack of nonrepped chat the only really workable way for it to work was to use ranks to denote levels.

Due to absurdly low rank limits we had to create multiple guilds (1-9,10-19,20-29).

Due to the absurdly low max guild limit (5) we had to have admins spread throughout all the guilds.

But we struggled through- doing something ANet should have done themselves, without a modicum of support from the poorly implemented multi-guild system, jumping over a pile of needless restrictions that serve no functional benifit.

However with the recent patch self demotion has been disabled, meaning that members can now no longer update their level- rendering the major benefit of the guild defunct.

Admins cannot possibly be expected to field the amount of work needed to individually update each members level as each tier has close to 400 members, and the work of kicking and inviting members to the next tier is already hugely time consuming.

The guild will still be around, but this post is just to share the needless frustration that ANet continues to heap upon people who are just trying to help the community.

The most frustrating thing is that I have so many low cost orders open at the moment that I have no way of really telling how much I’ve lost.

The only reason I noticed it was I made a very specific order for Ruby Shards but only received half of them (with no buy order remaining).

I’ve lost all confidence in the TP system, but don’t really have any alternative. What good is spending so much time calculating profit percentages and irking out gains if half your items are just never going to arrive, and the only way to know about it is to keep an external log of all orders compared to all receipts?

Has anyone had such an issue resolved? Has anyone found a way to at least work out how much has been lost?

Levistis.8356:

Just started today for some achievement points, but found out I was getting none. Great minigame though, very addicting and fun.

Don’t let this discourage you. The more you play and the more your opponents play the funner it gets.

There is a huge amount of strategic gameplay that doesn’t get thought of until everyone starts using all the skills. Effective sides will start playing like soccer rather than just zerging the keg- gets really intense.

Hey: 15k Achievement ‘enemy of humanity’ here.

I would love an achievement point rework. I’ve actually made a post about it in the suggestions forum long ago: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Achievements-should-be-expanded-on/754937

But why are you suggesting taking away achievement points from people? I got those points in good faith, not by exploiting or cheating. Instead why not expand achievement points so that all playstyles are awarded?

In the linked thread you’ll see that there are fairly minor changes that could really expand the longevity of achievements, and use them as a platform to encourage positive in-game behaviors.

Hologramx.6402:

They are just like nightmares that actually never exists and you never want to see again.

I never imagined the pain I was causing some of you. Not sure how I’m going to live with myself, as a walking nightmare of the beyond.

Graill.8596:

Remember, bad players are created by bad dev game mechanics.

Exactly this. There is absolutely no reason that a few very specialised things are the only repeatable achievements. Why aren’t heavy crafters rewarded, or heavy mob farmers, or trading post junkies, or dungeon farmers? All these people capped their points in the fortnight of playing and the variety is so basic that creativity or expansion of playstyles isn’t even noticed.

Wabbajack.8520:

It’s an issue that has been around for months now. One of the reasons many people no longer play the mini game.

And it is cheating, a very clear case of exploiting. It involves using an ability in mid air and rotating the camera in a certain way to target much much further than the skill is intended to be used.

No it does not.

Why are you spreading misinformation? The skill has nothing to do with ‘mid-air’. It’s just using one of the skills as intended.

Most people don’t bother to actually learn how the skills work and so they think one of them is broken. No skills in Keg Brawl are broken, and if you think they are then you’re not playing properly.

Of course whenever people don’t know how to play- a subset will (instead of learning how to play) start accusing other people of cheating. Keg Brawl has been modified multiple times since launch, to pretend that a core skill is somehow ‘unintended’ is a joke.

The person was in no way cheating.

He is using an ability available to all players.

It’s not hidden, it’s not an exploit, it’s not using a skill in a sneaky way. It’s straight forward and anyone can do it.

The counter to it is to get infront of the person and to have people in organised positions instead of just running around trying to punch the person with the keg.

You’re playing Keg Brawl like it’s a zerg fest. Keg Brawl is soccer.

Instead of accusing other people of cheating, how about you join in the practice mode and actually test how the skills work and how they’re supposed to be used.

Achievements still frozen.

Keg brawl is neglected enough already, the least we can get are meaningless achievements.

Thanks to all the well wishers. Hope you guys get whatever it is you’re aiming for.

kRiza krimos.1637:

not like its changing the world.

It’s a good thing I never claimed I was a golden God, or that I cured cancer.

Sometimes it feels like you guys think this is a competition. My achieving a meaningless thing isn’t intended to insult you.

Patrikan Habaton.2548:

your far behind me in wvw pvp

I don’t believe I claimed to be the best player, or better than anyone at anything. I do however have 15k achievement points. That’s the only thing I claimed and it’s an indisputable fact.

Are you really so insecure that you need to disparage other’s meaningless achievements?

http://i.imgur.com/WhKBR.jpg

Since my 10k post went well, I thought I’d update you all.

Just hit 15k achievement points.

Keg Master has always been bugged.

But now all Keg Brawl achievements are locked in their current positions (eg. I’ve scored about 30 points today but still at 352/500).

Keg Brawl is already nearly abandoned, this really needs to be fixed.

Vanilla raiding in WoW meant that 5% of players had a chance at getting something they wanted.

Usually 10% of players actually wanted whatever item dropped, but because items where shared people competted against each other and no items were wasted.

Fractals awards higher percentages of loot but members cannot opt-out of receiving them. Meaning that inevitably the same group will have 1 member with 4 rings, 3 with 2 and 1 with zero.

This has turned GW2 from one of the fairest loot systems (tokens) to one of the least fair.

You cannot trade items, cannot sell them, cannot disenchant them. Groups I’ve played with have often lamented that they would love to of passed on a ring that they didn’t need. But the system as it is does not allow anything like this.

The system is broken and unfair. And ANet needs to wake up and go back to their design philosophy.

RNG is not fun.

@Sharpie

Thanks. I just think there is a huge wasted opportunity with achievements.

Often people are under the impression that there is nothing to do in the game. But really the game has tons to offer, people just need a bit of guidance. While leveling the guidance is inbuilt, you simply do what gets you experiance. While searching for 100% world completion you go everywhere the map tells you isn’t done yet, and in that time you run in to cool things.

Once map completion, and leveling is done, there is a lack of guidance and so faced with infinite possibilities people tend to do nothing.

Achievements give people token, meaningless rewards that nonetheless motivate them in to specific action.

Some people think tracking down 10,000 elites is a waste of time. But others would find that fun.

Some people think crafting 100,000 baubles is a waste of time- but for people who are making a few baubles anyway, the time put in may be worth it to them.

Without the achievements no one goes that extra mile because there is no feeling that mass specialisation is actually noticed by the game, and cannot be demonstrated to outsiders.

This is something I’ve wanted since I hit the 250 limit. You apparently have the gem store there to increase convenience, but nothing on there that actually does anything.

+250 to each slot.

Extra tabs for yellows, boosters, dungeon tokens (I have 1.5k of each dungeon taking up more than an entire bank tab.

Halve waypoint fees. Unlimited salvage kit. You can charge $20 worth of gems for those and people will pay it.

Give us items in the gem store that are actually worth paying for but have no impact on the fairness of the game itself.

I just got my second ring after running 10/20 dailies since the dungeon went live.

I don’t appreciate it. All I remember is how horrible and unfair it was up to this point. Anyone who thinks RNG is a worthwhile system is a masochist and a cheat who doesn’t want to work for rewards.

7) Current zones for users on other servers should be shown in the format “Lion’s Arch (Blackgate)” or “Ascalonian Catacombs (Isle of Janthir)”.

This allows members to know whether someone is busy without bugging people who can’t possible attend an event.

@Nox: Unfortunately ANet have publically stated that they have no solution, and are not working on a LFG feature of any kind.

These changes are not just for a Fractals LFG. Any secondary guild is currently unworkable due to the need of representing and the cumbersome nature of inviting members.

The changes are needed if the multiguild system is to have any sort of relevence, something I assume ANet intend- as they put the system in place to begin with (albeit poorly).