Guild Wars 2

JonathanSharp.7094:

Some great ideas in here. We’ve talked about moving Dhuumfire up to Grandmaster in the Curses line, and moving Terror as well.

We also like the idea of making Terror scale with # of conditions on your target, so there’s more “play” to trying to load your target up with a lot of condies before you hit them with Fear. Your opponent can try to keep condies low, so that Terror won’t hurt as much.

Dhuumfire moving would also open up a gap for a new GM trait in Spite, so we’d need to figure that out as well.

Great suggestions!

This would be amazing

Btw thanks for all the red posts today!

Working as intended

What about changing it to a 2 part necro themed gap closer?

Taste of blood: when you cast taste of blood, chill your target for x seconds and gain 100% movement speed for x seconds

-> Sanguine Stab: while you are under the effect of taste of blood, deal x damage to target and siphon x health

Just a quick, poorly thought out idea but a gap closer on our melee weapon would be great, especially if the implementation is different than other classes.

Haha, don’t worry guys – I am not trying to showcase skill. This video shows none. And to be honest, I have little. It’s for pure humor / stupidity on their part

And, as anyone who plays wvw regularly will tell you, we’ve all been there

Hey all! In the process of getting some footage for a WvW video so have been recording more often and every once in a while I pick up a gem.

There are a lot of ideas going around in the necromancer community about survivability, especially against warriors who are able to CC lock.

With no further ado, I present you
How to survive a 3 v 1 as a zerker necro

Hey Bhawb, as far as a defense mechanic in DS, what do you think about a trait like:

Delayed manifestation: become mist for 1 s when entering deathshroud.

This would be a way to avoid giving us defensive boons but allow us to use our DS mechanic strategically to avoid large bursts. This would be perfect for one hit mechanics in PvE and allow us to avoid one big burst in PvP and WvW.

The downside would be that it does little for our long term sustain. It may also be overpowered if someone is flashing DS q7 seconds so would likely need an ICD

Haha, the condition burst is over the top. I am working on a berserker build video now and watching your video just drives home the fact that the condi burst is it is now is as fast/faster than the berserker build.

I can tell that you will find the humor in that

But Bhawb, wasn’t he using the combo of chillblains/putrid mark for the AOE weakness?

That is skill

Full clerics healing build especially with all the strong buffs to siphoning

It depends on your playstyle. Are you looking for a build for PvE, PvP, WvW or a combination?

Do you like sticking back and dealing damage from range or do you like to be on the frontline in the heat of the battle?

Are you someone who runs and dodges around like a maniac or do you operate at a slow pace?

Conditions and Berserker builds are both fun and viable in different situations. Really depends on your playstyle. I would reccomend playing with different weapon sets while you are leveling. Try out a build using scepter/dagger and staff, then try out one using dagger/warhorn and axe/focus. If you like the former, plan to go conditions. If you like the later, plan to go berserker. There are also other builds (hybrid, minion master, pure power, clerics) that are less popular but can be fun depending on what you like.

Play a necromancer if it is something you are interested in. See how you like playing it then decide if you like the playstyle or not

I highly recommend the class despite some shortcomings. All classes have shortcomings. Except warrior right now

Hey all – just a little update video. I threw spectral walk/recall into the dark path/pact/well combo for easy escape. I still havent actually tried it in a real situation so not sure how it will work but just trying to throw out more ideas

Cheers!

Draehl.2681:

I liked that last bit… that’s very much along the lines of what I’d like to see as a Spite grandmaster. Withering Precision (not exactly, but something similar) fits so perfectly in the Spite line, while Dhuumfire clearly belongs in Curses.

Im glad someone agrees

I have always (as I am sure others have) split conditions into two main categories: damage dealing conditions and support conditions.

Damage dealing conditions include burning, bleeding, torment, confusion, poison and fear (with torment).

Support conditions include blind, chilled, crippled, immobilize, vulnerability and weakness.

Since curses is the condition damage line, it should include the best access to the damage dealing conditions. Spite has condition duration as a secondary attribute so it makes sense that some traits that deal with support conditions are included there. I think it is kind of funny that right now we have “condition necros” and “power necros” (as well as other builds). All necros should be “condition necros”, but not all necros should use damage dealing conditions as their primary damage source.

I play a berserker necro so I will probably never get rid of Close to Death. That being said, having good access to “lockdown” conditions in the power line (spite) would allow direct damage necros to more easily “lock down” a target. Having a grandmaster with weakness/chilled that actually allows you to lock the target down would be a great option for direct damage necros who do not spec a lot into precision or crit damage. This may allow for a more “tanky”, attrition build that utilizes direct damage, support conditions and toughness… or siphons… (build diversity)

Hey Jon, thanks for posting!

I know me talking about this idea is broken recordish and comes from another necro (Nemesis), but has any thought been given to moving Dhuumfire to grandmaster in curses and moving terror to grandmaster in curses (and perhaps reverting the change to terror damage)? That way, condi necros will not have to invest into spite if they do not want to, the “condi burst” of dhuumfire+terror would be stopped and build diversity would be opened up.

Clearly another trait would need to be put into spite master. Maybe a modification of withering precision that includes chill as well as weakness?

Hey guys. I am sure someone has figured this out already but wasnt able to find the answer so figured I would ask here. I recently switched from using ruby orbs on my power necro to using Superior Runes of the Scholar. As many of you know, the 6 piece bonus for these runes is:

+10% damage while health is above 90%

My question has to do what the calculation of health while in death shroud. While in death shroud, does the rune use your life force pool to determine whether “health” is above 90% or does it use your actual health.

I know this sounds like a stupid question (“while health is above 90%, idiot”), but sometimes our DS has strange little quirks so just wanted to check.

Thanks all ahead of time

Hey Jon, just wanted to echo everyone who has already said thank you for the preview and for explaining the reasoning behind some of the changes. Is much appreciated by many of us and a great step towards collaboration

So it looks like this thread turned into a life-siphon thread

I have a few views about this and just wanted to see if I am completely off base with those views.

1. Current system of multiple small siphons – I do not think that this is necessarily a bad thing, as long as they will eventually introduce a weapon with melee cleave. This will do two things for the necromancer. In a 1v1 situation (in PvE/WvW/PvP) it will only allow for a modest sustain. There is a risk v. reward involved where the more the necro puts him/herself into the heat of the battle, the more life siphoned. A focused necro will die. We see that every day right now. Having a melee cleave weapon will increase survivability with multiple enemies targeting the necro but will allow those enemies to ultimately damage through the siphoning, especially after the heals from well/locust swarm are up.

2. The idea of the unkillable tank necro – this is not a bad idea. Obviously, the necro should be killable, but the idea of having a necro that can sustain itself is great – as long as something is sacrificed for this survivability. A necro who runs full clerics and traits into death, blood and soul reaping should be able to survive for a long time and should also hit like a wet mop. A necro who traits some into power and some into sustain should have some balance of damage and survivability. A necro who puts minimal traits/gear into healing should get only minor results. The idea of a super tanky necro is awesome, as long as that is the build’s primary ability. It seems like the best way to do this is to have the heals with siphon scale significantly with healing power.

The other point I would make about this is that necros still tend to be very vulnerable to CC. Granted, you can take foot in the grave to help with this but if you do, you are sacrificing some points in blood or death. If the necro is vulnerable to CC and sustain siphoning requires active hits, after passive damage skills are spent (wells, locust swarm), the theoretical very tanky necro could be CCed and would no longer have that sustain, unlike a warrior with healing signet.

I guess I only had two points but let me know if they are off base. I tend to think those two changes, a melee cleave weapon and low base heal with much better scaling with healing power would make a world of difference.

8/10
I like the clean look you went for. I am not used to seeing that mask on an asura but I think it works well. Also looks good with the kind of matching staff. Nice.

My necro is not a necro-y looking necro but I still like his new look with the gem store chest released today.

Myrmidian Eudoros.4671:

Afya.5842:

Looking at the guardian hammer and ele’s LH. Their auto attack function in quite similar ways. Maybe we can have one that do a 1.5s chill at the end of the chain.

Or you could have it do something remotely as good as Symbol of Protection & the AoE burst + blast finisher on Lightning Hammer. A chill at the end of the chain is pretty pedestrian by comparison. I could go for a Whirl hitting a 180 radius and applying the chill to all struck. That would be somewhat close to the value of the other 2 chains, but still not as valuable (IMO).

I was thinking the third attack in the auto attack chain could be an aoe chill that damages (much like the sigil of hydromancy). A blast finisher somewhere on the weapon set would be amazing

Bhawb.7408:

Hammer would be AoE control.

And how sweet would it be if a good portion of its control was through chills and blinds.

Myrmidian Eudoros.4671:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

A Greatsword on a necro would have to be a control/sustain weapon rather than damage. That way, we still have the damage route in dagger/warhorn. Necro Greatsword, ideally, would be more of a tanking weapon. You do some damage, but if you really cared about damage output primarily, you would choose something else (that we already have).

I think Hammer is a better fit for Necro because of this reason. I can envision an AoE pull with PBAoE cleave (perhaps a direct damage mark) producing interesting results on a Necro. A decent chaining AA with a boon eater on either #1 or 2 with a mark, a pull and a burst or strong defensive utility (perhaps a LF generating 2s block?) on 3,4,5.

I think it would be great if they coexisted. A greatsword for a life siphoning weapon and a hammer as a tanky control oriented pbaoe weapon

Lily.1935:

But perhaps you could explain it to me. Why do you want a Greatsword? Why do you demand a greatsword over a Scythe or just a normal sword as a cleaving weapon?

I could be wrong, but I think that they have said that classes will get access to existing weapons first. That’s why people are asking for greatsword over scythe. We only have access to one two handed weapon on land. That’s why people want greatsword as a melee cleave weapon. A one hand sword would just give 3 new skills where a greatsword would give 5. Granted they could add another offhand but we already have a decent number of offhands

Tobbygnome.6793:

I in no way mean to undermine your opinion or offend, this is just how i feel about even more homogenization in GW2 and why i think things like this shouldn’t happen.

Haha, thank you! Not offended at all but I appreciate the thought and appreciate the fact that we have a community who can have discussions like this. Clearly everyone here cares about the class and it is great when we can have a conversation back and forth.

I can see the point about homogenization and agree that we do not want our class to lose its identity. On the other side, though, it is a warhorn and when I think of warhorn, I think of someone blowing it and signaling allies to get ready for battle (with swiftness). Maybe I should think about it more as someone blowing it and signaling enemies to get un-ready for battle.

Thanks for all the feedback guys!

Bhawb, I definitely get your point and had a feeling that would be brought up when I initially posted.

I guess my response would be this:
About whether warhorn should actually be buffed, others may not agree and think that warhorn is already powerful enough as is, but I think a small buff to something that it is already able to do would not put it over the top. Using the aforementioned examples, a wider AOE of the locust swarm, more damage from locust swarm or increased cripple duration or AOE swiftness.

About what that buff should actually be, I dont necessarily think that adding a new functionality to it would be necessary. It is what it is – warhorn gives AOE damage and cripple and provides swiftness.

Now, out of those 4 potential buffs I would be in favor of AOE swiftness for a few reasons. (1) as others have pointed it is not a huge buff. Warhorn 5 does not need a huge buff, just a little added functionality. (2) I definitely get that there are many AOE speed buffs on other classes in WvW already but if you are running with a small group, some people may not have those skills equipped and if running with a large group there are AOE caps and extra AOE swiftness always helps.

I guess my point is that we already have swiftness on the weapon set, the weapon is already pretty good and adding a small buff by making that swiftness AOE would not be OP but would be beneficial to your group.

Andele.1306:

a) our core design is very selfish, no point changing it
b) HOW THE FUDGE CAKE IS A AOE DAZE NOT SUPPORTIVE (so the team help skill on 4 instead of 5).
c) It 5 used to siphon hp
d) HOW BY GRENTHS BURNED WINTERSDAY BICUITS IS A AOE DAZE NOT SUPPORTIVE?

I agree that an aoe daze is supportive. It just does not make sense to me that there are 3 classes that have a warhorn skill that provides swiftness and we are the only one that does not apply that swiftness AOE

Hey guys. Maybe I am missing something and someone can guide me in the right direction but does it seem that necro warhorn 5 is a little lacking in the group utility category?

There are 3 classes that use warhorn. Warrior, Ranger and Necro. Out of these, necro is the only one that does not apply buffs to allies as well when the warhorn is blown. Right now, I am thinking that it should apply swiftness to allies as well as yourself.

Two arguments against this would be:
1. Deathly swarm cripples so you are passively buffing your allies by slowing down enemies
2. Deathly swarm damages and cripples so it would be OP if allies got swiftness as well

What do you guys think. Would warhorn be OP if swiftness were applied to allies as well? The main reason I would like a change like this is for WvW. I always feel kind of selfish/useless when running with a group and I blow my warhorn 5 and I am sure others have felt the same

I agree that it is a great weapon for a power build but adding group utility would not make it any more powerful for the necro himself

So based on those answers, I would check out this build first:

This is a build by an established necromancer (Nemesis) and I think it will be a good introduction build for you.

Over time, you can check out other builds as well. We do have several different types of builds (burst condi, sustained condi, glass canon, tanky healer, hybrid, minionmancer) which have different amounts of effectiveness but all have their merits.

Congrats on 80. Lets start off with a basic idea of what type of build you want to play.

Do you primarily play PvP, PvE or WvW?

Do you like playing ranged and kiting your opponent?

Do you like getting up and in the middle of a fight and surviving for a while?

Do you like getting in and trying to burst your opponent down?

Are you someone who likes playing with conditions or someone who likes to see big numbers from direct damage?

Answer those and we can start from there

Hey all. For brevity sake I am just going to focus on the traits that really pop out at me as good or bad

What traits do you really like?
1. Close to death – a trait in the power line that is very useful for power based builds
2. Weakening Shroud – I like the fact that this gives DS more utility as both an offensive and defensive strategy
3. Last Gasp – amazing trait, especially for a minor

What traits do you like conceptually, but feel fall short of what they could be?
1. Siphoned Power – as a concept, this is kind of cool. Become more powerful the closer you are to dying. In practice, it doesnt work. Perhaps the solution is to give x stacks of might when your health falls below 25%. That way you have to make a decision. Do you heal to keep your HP pool up or do you let that one extra hit in to get the x stacks of might before using your heal?

2. Dhuumfire – I put this here only because I do not think it should be in the power line. In the past, I think Nemesis has had the idea that dhuumfire should be in curses as a grandmaster and terror should be moved to grandmaster as well. That way, people have to chose between two of the more “bursty” conditions. Additionally, it sets things up so that people don’t “have” to go into spite for a condi build.

3. Furious Demise – I actually really like this trait but think that it would be great if it applied fury to allies as well in order to increase the necro’s group utility. I do not know if this would be too powerful, however

4. Target the weak – this is a great trait but I wonder why it is in the curses tree. Might make more sense to be in spite. I could be missing something here though

5. Ritual of protection – good concept, protection should probably be longer duration

6. Shrouded Removal – what if it removed a condition from you AND from allies in a limited radius. More group utility

7. Vampiric / Vampiric Precision / Bloodthirst – awesome concepts but I dont think anyone has found a way to make them really worth taking yet. I think a weapon with melee cleave would make them more desirable

8. Deathly Invigoration – havent used this since there were changes to it but last time I did use it (full clerics), the heal was somewhat lackluster

9. Speed of Shadows – like the concept but might have more utility if it provided swiftness for x seconds on entering death shroud

10. Foot in the grave – I know this is asking for too much and is probably overpowered but I wish there was some way to integrate a stun break into this

What traits do you just plain dislike?
1. Withering Precision – please see other post for details about why this trait just isnt good

2. Reanimator/Protection of the Horde – its sad to think that reanimator was actually worse at launch. We need new minors. These traits should be combined into one, made more powerful and put in the master level. For example, summon a jagged horror on critical hit. This effect can only trigger once every x seconds. If this were to happen, the decay of the jagged horrors would probably need to be increased.

3. Death Shiver – there are much better ways for necros to apply vulnerability

Awesome guys, keep em coming! Anyone want to go over the condibomb combo?

Bhawb.7408:

Marking this so I remember (hopefully) to come back and list my MM combos.

Awesome – that is one build I have very little experience playing so I would like to see what kind of combos you come up with.

As a side note, it would be great if we can get some video footage of these. I will try to get some footage in WvW tonight

Hey guys. I thought this would be a fun topic to start. Basically, this thread is meant to start a list of effective combos and rotations that you can use with the Necromancer. Right now, all classes are being accused of “spamming” as a playstyle which I know many people do, but this is meant to take the necromancer playstyle beyond that and come up with some effective rotations.

I was thinking that we could use the following format

Build: What type of build are you using? Conditions? Hybrid? Berserker?

Situation: PvP, PvE, WvW? When are you using it in particular?

Rotation: What is the acutal rotation?

Desired effect: How does it work?

I will start This is a dumb one that I think a dev mentioned but I still have fun using it

Build: Berserker Necromancer, 30,10,0,0,30
Situation: Usually in WvW, either to initiate a fight or when someone is starting to run away
Rotation: Warhorn 5, Jump into DS, DS2, Jump out of DS, start casting dagger 3, well of corrpution, well of suffering, dagger auto
Desired effect: When this combo hits, it is the closest thing to a power burst I have found with necro. By casting dark pact while dark path is traveling, it catches your target off guard with a rapid chill/bleed/immobilize/cripple (from the locust swarm you already cast). The goal is to time it so that dark pact’s cast ends right after dark path hits. The fact that there are several conditions that effect movement skills increase the chance that you will keep the target in the well if the target only has modest condi removal. The double wells along with dagger auto and locust swarm do great damage while the other player is trying to get their bearings.

What effective combos/rotations do you guys use?

EDIT: Updated with video. In the video, I say I am going to show the combo with a real person in WvW but kept getting jumped by 3 or more people so gave up on it, plus I didnt feel like editing clips together

Step 1: Create a time machine
Step 2: Go back to 10/15/13
Step 3: Get a small group of mesmers
Step 4: Trait for Descent into Madness
Step 5: Jump off something high onto blob at the same time
Step 6: One shot blob

I am still hoping for a weapon with melee cleave. Hitting multiple targets at a time will add all those little heals up, especially if you throw down a locust swarm and a couple wells first.

I think this idea is awesome and the fact that you guys are making use of public testing is amazing as well. Thank you!

Hey Allie. I am a visitor to the PvP forums and PvP gameplay so that would put me in the 90%

I’m sorry if it has already been asked but has there been any discussion/any plan to create a public test server that is solely used to look at PvP balance changes?

Several assumptions are that
(1) we know that GW2 has some of the quickest updates and that there will still be a push to get the living story updates out
(2) balance changes take a good time of actual gameplay to be able to fully evaluate them
(3) when balance changes that are perfectly reasonable on paper do not work in practice, the game as a whole can suffer

One idea would be to have a public test server with only PvP available on it as a way to test out proposed balance changes. This would mean that balance patches would roll out to all servers and tournament play less frequently but that there would be a period of time for both the 90% and 10% to give feedback to the devs prior to those patches. It would also give both the devs and players the chance to see how ideas on paper actually play out in practice

I understand that time/money for a server/ 100000 things I have not thought of migh prevent this from happening but it is a consideration

There should continue to be one commander tag that costs 100g and that you have to buy. Perhaps there can be an alternate way to buy it that costs 90g and a lot of BoH.

That one commander tag should have several options
1. Party commander – only appears to members of your party
2. Guild commander – only appears to members of your guild
3. Squad commander – only appears to members of your squad
4. Map commander – appears to all players on your map

Every time you put up your commander tag, you pick which one you want. Each type appears as a different color. This creates a situation where people can:
1. Easily keep track of a “leader” of their party (done now primarily by targeting)
2. Allow for large guild groups or allow guild members to see their guild leader easily during PvE events (e.g. finding a guild bounty on the map)
3. Allow for a beginning commander to have a group of people follow him/her and practice without having everyone on the map follow them/extect that they know exactly what they are doing
4. Allow more experienced commanders to take responsibility for leading the majority of the map

Obviously if someone with no experience wants to throw up the map commander tag they will be able to but as others have said, eventually people will stop following them. For those who want to work their way up to map commander, they are able to.

1. Commander Options
2. Discouraging blobs
3. Parties > 5 people

Bhawb.7408:

Engineers also have Dhuumfire, and no one bats an eye. I’m suggesting that a flat healing buff to an already strong healing ability isn’t going to happen. Well of Blood already exists and works fine on its own; you don’t buff things that are already fine. Turning it into a water field would result in a nerf to its overall healing to compensate, and that isn’t worth it unless you’re in WvW and you want to play water-fields with your friends.

One of the questions I would have is whether in fact a nerf to it’s overall healing to compensate actually isnt worth it to get it to become a water field. I dont think that the nerf to overall healing would need to be that severe in order to balance it.

On the one hand, you/teammates/party would lose out on some healing that you would recieve IF you stayed inside the well the entire time and did not use a blast finisher. On the other hand, you could blast finish the well, get a burst heal and then be able to leave the well for some period of time. This could potentially heal as much as an un-nerfed base well and potentially more if you blast it then stay in it.

The benefit is less need to stay inside the well for the entire duration to recieve healing as well as the aforementioned benefit of having a water field in WvW. The tradeoff is having to run with a team that can blast finish the well or making sure to do it yourself which should not be a huge problem if you are running staff or are willing to use a blast-finishing utility.

I’m just not sure if it really wouldnt be worth it but again, theres no way to tell unless it is tested in real situations

This is copied and pasted from the necromancer subforum:

I agree with Bhawb that CC is a very good heal, especially in the current meta, and that it overshadows the other heals. I don’t think that it overshadows the other heals because it is overpowered but more because the others are situational and may need to be brought up.

Blood fiend should be kept as is however he should have an “on death” heal that is higher than his sacrificed heal. This helps in two ways. In PvP it requires thinking from both parties. Does the necro sac his blood fiend when his health starts to drop too low to get it off cooldown more quickly or does he wait and hope it gets killed for a higher heal? Does the opponent target the blood fiend while the necros hp is high on order to mitigate the effects of a larger heal or can he just get the necro down with blood fiend up?

In PvE it also gives some strategy. Do you keep the blood fiend alive for the extra siphon and dodge roll through a big hit so that he is killed and gives you a better heal or do you play it safe and just sac him?

I haven’t thought out Well of Blood as much. While I do think that it should be a water field, I don’t know what other changes would have to be made to it to make it balanced as a water field. The main push behind this is at least for me, wvw. Well of blood is great however if you throw one down on a gate or in open field combat, you are potentially “covering” a water field that your teammates will try to blast finish. Not sure what the right solution is.

I think I have posted about this before, sorry for redundancy

I agree with Bhawb that CC is a very good heal, especially in the current meta, and that it overshadows the other heals. I don’t think that it overshadows the other heals because it is overpowered but more because the others are situational and may need to be brought up.

Blood fiend should be kept as is however he should have an “on death” heal that is higher than his sacrificed heal. This helps in two ways. In PvP it requires thinking from both parties. Does the necro sac his blood fiend when his health starts to drop too low to get it off cooldown more quickly or does he wait and hope it gets killed for a higher heal? Does the opponent target the blood fiend while the necros hp is high on order to mitigate the effects of a larger heal or can he just get the necro down with blood fiend up?

In PvE it also gives some strategy. Do you keep the blood fiend alive for the extra siphon and dodge roll through a big hit so that he is killed and gives you a better heal or do you play it safe and just sac him?

I haven’t thought out Well of Blood as much. While I do think that it should be a water field, I don’t know what other changes would have to be made to it to make it balanced as a water field. The main push behind this is at least for me, wvw. Well of blood is great however if you throw one down on a gate or in open field combat, you are potentially “covering” a water field that your teammates will try to blast finish. Not sure what the right solution is.

Any form of chain CC sucks, whether that be chain fearing by a necro or chain stunning from a warrior

A necro can fear through a spectral wall and then throw down another fear. Chaining them together sucks

Having one or another is a defense mechanism. There should be a “revealed” type addition to all CC so that someone cannot be chain CCed. There are only so many stun breaks someone can carry.

But, that is a different topic. This is about a possible nerf to necro LF pool vs. miscalculation during community necro testing

I am hoping the change has been done with long term goals in mind and that the long term goal is to provide a weapon with melee cleave that is geared towards a tanky life siphon build and can take advantage of vampiric adding up multiple small heals from cleaved targets

Haha, I hope nobody took what I said as being super serious about duels. I actually do not duel that often and rarely pay attention to my LF pool before I do. I do agree with Symbolic as many others here have that many people duel in order to get better and starting with 0% LF can help to accomplish that goal.

Additionally, however, it is somewhat limiting. I am not saying I would use this strategy, but lets say a power necro wants to open by dark path → dagger 3 (start cast while dark path is traveling) → dual wells → dagger auto. How will they know if this is an effective opening strategy if they have to build LF first? I know that there are ways around this (e.g. sac a minon) but that is still time you wasted with your opener.

Another example would be starting the fight off in DS. I can’t say I have ever tried this but let’s say someone wants to try a build where they are using DS as offensively as possible for initial burst and want to get as many attacks off in DS before the LF pool is drained by the opponent’s attacks. Or someone who’s build relies on flashing DS at the start of a fight for fury, retal, weakness and bleed, etc.

So, I definitely agree that you learn certain things about the class and certain techniques when starting with 0% LF but you also limit yourself from others. Whether these others are good or not, how will you know unless you use them? Additionally, in the spirit of duels helping people improve, how will you help the person you are dueling with improve if they do not know how to handle someone who starts a fight with some degree of LF?

Not trying to be argumentative but just thinking of all the options

The Primary.6371:

L2 distinguish the player from the clones. Bring condition removal. Understand the class mechanic rather than being pathetic. You can go a step further and try to understand the builds you are facing.

There is no need to be rude. Your response was just rude. He is not saying that they are overpowered or that he doesn’t know how to face one. He is saying that they are not fun to fight.

Gandarel.5091:

If I leave the Pvp section and listen to other kind of suggestions, I start to totally understand why devs don’t listen to the community.

It’s a question/suggestion thread. Some ideas are more thought out and some ideas are less thought out. The more thought out ideas provide suggestions that may be useful moving forward. The less thought out ones either (1) get people to think outside the box to consider new options or (2) give more credence to the well thought out ones.

Please do not come into our forum and insult us.

Some ideas will be good and some not as good but nobody is demanding these ideas of the devs in this thread.

Also, take into account that this is a general necromancer forum so balancing issues do not only apply to PvP

Banjal.7328:

Day one Necro here and I think 0% LF at the start is fine.

IMO if you need full LF to win a 1v1,you should work on your build.It’s about as bad as a Mesmer popping moa morph right at the start.

I think it is great that you have been playing necro for a while and know the class well enough to do well in duels starting with 0% LF. I also think that you have to take others who play the class into account.

I am not that good, but have been playing necro for a while and can sometimes do okay with 0%. There are other people who are just starting to play necro and will get absolutely crushed. We can argue that over time, they will learn to play better, especially if they start off playing with 0% LF but that is not the point. The point is that having 0% LF at the start of the duel is a handicap for the necro but that having some percentage of LF at the beginning does not give an unfair advantage to the necro.

Also, it is nothing like a mesmer popping Moa Morph at the beginning of a duel. Moa Morph basically makes the opponent a sitting duck for 10 seconds. Having some low percentage of life force might make for mitigation of one attack or a tainted shackles + fear or a couple life blasts.

I did this. When I ascended mine it became account bound. That was 2-3 months ago, so not sure if anything has changed since

Do any people who play necro ever advocate for starting with 0% LF or is it all coming from the opponent? My guess is the latter and my guess is that most necros in these “formal” duels comply because we don’t want someone to minimize our win.

People who play necro know that by starting off with 0% LF you are handicapping yourself. It is bullkitten that other classes can dictate how we as necromancers duel. As multiple people have said, it is our class mechanic and a major part of our defense. Also, DS is not an “I win” button.

If we as a necro community take a hard stand against 0% LF at the start of duels, eventually permastun warriors, AI driven mesmers and unable to target thieves will get over it and duel fairly.

Also, I play a power necro so my view is somewhat skewed by that.

Quick, simple question. I like watching high level PvP play and have enjoyed catching parts of the past two major tourneys. Is there an estimated date for the next one? Would like to be able to get friends together with some beer and food and watch.

Was just on ioj and had the same thing. Dbbl has been okay for me today though