No Wulfrim was correct. The only real use of crafting is to make legendary weapons -OR- use crafting exp to level your character quicker. There are some proffesions that you can use some of the stuff from ( like jewelry and such). But for the most part it is useless. You can go to the TP and buy upgrade gear for cheaper than you can make it. I have gotten 400 crafting in everything besides armor crafting. I did it mainly because going from 1-400 in a craft nets you about 10 levels.
Where are you guys using this build?? No matter what you do because the minion AI is completely off whack right now ANY minion build will be sub-par.
Are you guys winning in Spvp?
If so I highley doubt your wins are attributed to the spec of one player ( yourself) on your team.
Are you playing Tpvp?
Then I can slightly see how you may contribute to a team win by point holding, and that is about it.
Are you playing WvWvW?
Then I would argue your pets are getting demolished in the aoe zerg.
Like stated earlier. Until minion AI is fixed MM builds are always going to be behind other builds. It might be really really fun to play yes, but ultimately not the best choice right now =(
Once, I was going up to the jumping puzzle in borderlands. Was making my way up to jump down through the waterfall and soon as I come to the top ledge I see several unfinished siege weapons all tossed up like some sort of wall. I walk through the mass of wood and timber constructs only to find around 7-8 people sitting casually on the other side in city clothes and basic underwear. Some were dancing and some were setting off fireworks or something.
Was the most awesome / disturbing / w.t.f moment scene I’ve seen in the game yet.
I am no longer going for a legendary. Maybe sometime down the road , but not right now, and especially not since the legendaries all look…ridiculous for necros.
Instead I think I might just get a lidless eye ( unique scepter) and a ( i dunno) for staff.
Shrug.
I’d love to have this sticky’d. However I also would love to not have a bunch of different stickies at the top of the forums for every little thing. My proposition? Consolidate the Necromancer tutorials video into this thread and have this thread replace it.
Edit: just wrote to a dev/mod to see if they can consolidate the tutorials thread into this one and sticky this one instead. Thanks for grabbing all these vids into one place Equate.
So, I’m working on my second necro. I am plowing through most of the levels using crafting and WvWvW but in between that fun I do actually have to do some pve. Just wondering from everyone else what playstyle they thought worked easiest in leveling pve?
Power? MM ? Or Conditions? and Why?
Mostly I think making money from crafting is about watching for trends. For instance right now a lot of people ( chefs) are complaining about vanilla beans being unavailable or hard to get or w/e. I had a bunch of them so I sold them for a larger profit now then I probably will be able to in a week. Shrug.
I hope they do not do this at all. If we put in 1v1 dueling then more people will complain about X class being stronger than Y class. They already said ( if I’m not mistaken) they do not want to balance this game around 1v1 at all.
What are you ranting about? I’d love to comment on War of the Roses mechanics versus GW2 mechanics but you did not list exactly what you are referring to. Can you give some examples? Link to some articles? Something?
BlueprintLFE.2358
I’m not sure how long you have been cruising these necro forums, but I am very sure we have been asking for communication between us and the devs since day 1 of the forums opening. At first we did politely ask to be updated or told what they had in store. No response. In fact I myself made several threads very politely asking about some sort of communication. those threads were deleted for calling out anet staff.
Anet does not have to tell us anything. I’ve said it a bunch of times now. They do not owe us anything in the form of communication.
But it would be really nice if they did.
Like DrWhy explained a little communication with us here would stop a lot of the complaining. When they do not communicate with us, and then suddenly change abilities or traits that are not even on the bug list, it worries people.
Do not alienate the Dev that represents our class because of some past quite that people completely spinned out of context. There is no way a Dev would honestly bash there players come on now.
While I am all for the defense of Anet, I don’t think anyone is alienating Jon Peters. He is not the necro class representative. Haven’t seen any official posts stating he was or ever will be. He is a lead developer. He does not spend every night or everyday that he comes to work looking at what makes necros tick. In that regard the necro community forums hold him responsible for a little more than he is worth.
It is quite alright for the community to point out flaws in recorded gameplay. Anytime anyone has posted videos that is exactly what any forum community does. We critique and point out flaws or commend where commending is due. Just because in this particular clip of gameplay there was little to nothing to commend him on does not mean we are alienating him. He’s a big boy , I’m sure if he feels like he needs to defend his gameplay, he will.
On the subject of a developer bashing their players, I think that is exactly how most necros feel about a certain statement he made a while back. While I’m sure he did not mean it to insult us , as a community or whole, it did certainly sting quite a few.
Kayotik
I’m pretty sure Dibrom is right as , there are arena net logos next to the names in the video as far as I can tell. I have devs on my friends list in game, and anytime I see them in-game that is exactly how their names show up.
Looks like it might of been axe? Can’t really tell because it didn’t seem like he ever used his mainhand abilities. I guess nice use of the warhorn stun then the ethereal wall? I dunno what to say here.
Never expected him to be a stellar player….but wow.
I have a deep love / hate relationship with my Necros ( yes i have multiple ). I played a warrior all through the bwe’s then for some reason necro just looked awesome on the 2nd day of release. Haven’t looked back since.
While necro does have a long laundry list of bugs/ things that need to be worked on, I still find it a fun class to play everyday.
Dethroat,
What is this video trying to convey to its audience? Are you just trying to show us how you play as a necromancer or some neat trick included ? I just don’t understand the reasoning behind this video since it is just you versus game AI. Also is there a build associated with it you are showing off ?
Enerjak
I was understanding from previous posts by other necros that anything really above 1600 condition damage was really irrelevant. Sadly I took someones word and ran with it . However in your post you are outlining that 2100+ is what you run with. Can you list what gear you are using and food sigil some of that etc stuff out. I’m sure others would love to copy that template of gear for themselves. Also what damage numbers are you seeing in the 2100+ condition damage area. Like how much does each tick for?
Sorry for the barrage of questions on a Monday =(
Cultural armor isn’t really meant to be bought for the stats but rather the look of the gear. This gear was ( in my opinion ) put in as one of the many gold sinks in the game. If you want it, start saving then throw a bunch of money at it. The gear is not going to make or break your game play so , shrug.
While I would still argue that we need some form of burstiness ( which the change to BiP was a ..weird step in the right direction to me ) I see exactly what you mean by our survival is what holds our class back from being able to do what we are supposed to do. I actually don’t think necros do bad damage at all. I just wish we had a way to frontload that damage into a skill or burst. I can see though how me wanting that burst is probably a direct effect of the fact that , as you said, I cannot survive another players burst at all. So I am wanting us to have burst to make up for that fact.
But the questions still remain on how do we increase necro sustain and survival generally and without making all the other classes cry about us becoming unkillable monsters ?
Whoa whoa whoa calm down guys. this is a pretty good discussion thread, really don’t want it to be closed and never looked at =)
That being said Angry Flying,( hmm referenced post removed or something ) I know you have pretty much always had the stance that necros don’t really need more condition damage/ or burst condition damage. I understand and respect that, however from my opinion and playing the game I personally feel we do need it. I’m pretty sure you can look through my posting history that on at least 2 separate occasions and many other posts I have mentioned changing some of our scepter/traits/utility skills to include some sort of burst conditions mechanic. While I don’t think it will fix all the fundamental problems associated with our class in general it will of course gives necros that little bit of edge that just about ever class has: Someway to burst a single target down or give a little more pressure to their hp bar. Can this be done in other ways ? Hell yes. But i Think adding in some sort of burst to conditions would be the easiest was to supplement necros in this area.
Corrupted (2-3 second cast after infected?) aoe, adds a condition which cannot be removed for its duration (10 sec?). This condition explodes an aoe damage explosion when that player walks into a mark. <—- ??
Or
Doomed (4 second cast after infected, can remove it within those 4 seconds) single target, adds a condition that soaks up incoming damage until full then unleashes it on to the player and surrounding players x2? (Maybe too strong?)
Or
Corrosive (2-3 second cast single target), adds special vulnerability that damages the targets armor (temporarily? or maybe even not really damaging your armor) Once armor is burned through: double any incoming bleed effect damage from the originating necro that cast corrosive on you?
I like all three of these ideas, I also am in love with the idea of epidemic doing a small burst of damage. Perhaps even based on how many conditions it is aoe applying. Yum.
Yeah Yuki I wish we had burning also. Moreso I wish they just got rid of bleeding for necros and reworked us to have disease or something unique to our class. Yes deathshroud is unique but it is quite frankly lacking for most necros. It takes a very niche understanding of how it plays along with other skills to be used effectively. As it is most necros who do not understand it use it as a last resort ‘oh crap’ button they activate when all hope is going down the drain. If this is what most necros do , just default then it tells us that deathshroud in and of itself is not alluring, potent, or user friendly enough for players to grasp the idea of what it is supposed to be used for. If that is happening as often as it seems then the skill is flawed/ looks ugly/ is the kid in the corner no one wants to play with.
This brings up the idea that most of our skills do not interact well with our other skills and traits. If they did us necros would have more viable and productive builds than “conditions” and “power build”. Sure there are other builds, but most people don’t use them for long or at all. =(
I understand Anet has /had a certain outlook for necros that they were following through with, and for the most part it is a GOOD DESIGN. If it wasn’t a good basic design we wouldn’t all be here loving our necros or discussing changing things. However it really is time to pull whatever team works on balance and necros off whatever bench they are on and get them working things out. The 5-10 new posts per day cluttering these forums about the same old things day in and day out, are not only frustrating to see and read, but must be a big deterrent to people wanting to come play as a necro.
I’m ranting all over the place so w/e
I’ll be on my red-headed step child necro all weekend
Madame Moorshade Teknomancer.
I would toss my vote in for 300 range as well. Like Yuki has stated it is still well within melee range but gives just a slight room for movement that I think daggers deserves.
^ Yeah, start hitting up the Karma guys in Orr and make a plan on what stats / pieces you want. Start looking into either a named exotic weapon or how to make some mystic weapons possibly. Look for good deals for exotic jewelry or craft your own. Or start working for and collecting mats for a legendary weapon if that sounds interesting to you.
Btw grats on hitting 80 =)
Madame Morrshade Teknomancer
Actually I rather like this ability. Its cast time is , as most people would say, really really slow. Also the sound associated with it is by far one of the most annoying ability sounds in game for me.
I would looooooove to see this ability changed so that the hit area was a little larger. Possibly change the animation to something like a shadow wave projectile along the ground or something.
Oh, I see. You might get better bang for your buck going with Condition/power/vitality gear. the Carrion sets. I know it is not really optimal but this way you will get 2 out of 3 of the stats you are looking for. Sorry I do not know where to find any Vit/tough/condition gear. =(
You can obtain prec/tough/condition in pve through the karma vendors in Orr and mix and matching dungeon token reward armor. As far as jewelry for it goes, I have no idea. I have not seen any exotic jewelry with those specific stats at all. Someone a long while ago suggested getting the exotic carrion jewelry and putting in the ‘rabid’ gem things into it. =(
While that may be their reasoning for doing so, every other class in the game has the capacity of some hefty condition stacking, not just Necromancers. That said, they get the best of both worlds… conditions AND burst… and survivability… and utility…
This is so very true Enerjak. I have had this conversation so many times over with my engineer and warrior buddies that it at this point is like beating a dead horse with them. It is hard to explain to other classes that our class does not have the same burst or conditions available to us. Most of the time they will laugh and say things like " Well you can survive like 3 or 4 people whacking on you for X amount of time, whereas I would be dead" .
The direction that I believe Anet wanted to take this class, was a great idea. Our implementation however, is just plain horrible.
I still love my necro though, don’t know why.
Enerjak
I didn’t say it was a good idea of balance or that it was 100% the reason they did it . It’s just my opinion of how condition damage got balanced the way it is. Also further in my post I also address that this particular type of balancing ( if it is how and why they did it) is not working with pretty much the same example you give.
So while no one LIKES how we work out currently, I am offering what I think is the explanation as to how our class ended up like it did.
The one thing I don’t get is how a single skill from other classes can do more damage than our DOTS do over 5, 10 or 30 seconds? If anything we should be doing SO MUCH more damage over time than anyone. Isn’t that what balance is all about?
If someone else can do 3k in 1 INSTANT hit, our dot should be doing at least double that total if it takes, say, 5 seconds. Right? Then add in how dots can be easily purged and something is completely out of whack.
The reason our abilites work like this is they are balanced around the fact we are not mitigated by toughness or armor with condition damage. So if you do 115 dot damage to one guy , you will do the same damage to the guy next to him. In theory this makes us relatively powerful. It should make us perfect opposites to warriors and such who have high armor + toughness builds. However in practice it really does not seem like it stacks up. Especially when , as you say, we can be bursted down in in a matter of seconds yet it takes our ‘unmitigated’ conditions twice if not three times as long to kill an opponent.
I really wish that if Anet wants to balance our condition damage ( and subsequently our HP/toughness builds) around something like this they would make sure our damage was at least moderate or higher than it was now.
Arianna ,
I do believe Power/Toughness/Vitality is the same stats as the pvp armor you can get with badges. Which moreso makes it just a time grind in WvWvW to get appropriate gear, not really all that hard. I think its much tougher to get the prized rabid type gear. I myself tried this type of build out for a good week. I found it to be very fun, but ultimately lacking in WvWvW and in Pve also. Reason being, that pet AI , like you said, is not up to par. Pets also when they do decide to attack your target take aggro often enough or get hit by aoe often enough that they were dead most of the time for me. Just very sad really.
Xavori, the reason a build like this won’t work is not your fault at all really. In theory it is quite a solid build you have thought of. You have toughness , vitality and you would be taking talents to ‘vamp’ the life of others thus keeping you as close to tankiness as possible. With having multiple pets up through minion master traits you could also put out a decent amount of dps ( in pve… because pets die very fast in pvp ).
However…
The vampiric traits as far as I remember ar not working quite well, are bugged, and do not give life back to you in amounts even close to being substantial. Also the pets that you would be relying on for dps can and usually will die very quickly either on bosses or veteran mobs + in pve or in the zerg in pvp. Altogether it is a great build idea that is not quite possible at this time with the way necro talents and abilities are.
There is a sticky up at the top of these forums that is meant to be used for posting and discussing different builds for necros. You might want to repost this information there. =)
If you are playing in Spvp there are a lot of different factors that will let you know when to blow your epidemic or not. Are you alone or are there other people from your team around? If there are others you may want to pop it early because more than likely if you are bursting down the same target it’ll be dead before you get the cast off. In smaller situations where you are controlling most of the action I would suggest allowing some bleeds to tick a bit then going into deathshroud to juke them into cleansing then coming out of deathshroud and appyling as many conditions as possible then epidemic. Yes this method will take a little longer but you dont really want to place all your skills on cooldown then have them wipe it all off in one fell swoop. So juke them into wiping early, utilize deathshroud to minimize damage done to you, and come out swinging.
Hope any of that helps,
Madame Moorshade Teknomancer
Someone already has Meteorlogicus?? OP has seen it in action? I have not heard anything about this. If someone has a link to a video or something I would love to see it.
So back to the argument at hand. Is the lifeforce loss to power builds worth the slight if not needed and appreciated buff to condition builds. Seems like devs are not quite sure where to change our class for the better. Take away from one build to give to another all the while making MM necros sit in the corner by themselves.
Really wish we could have anyone from Anet just go over a slight plan for necro development. Even if it is just a casual outline of what they would like to test / go over. that way the necro community can dig our hands in and help somewhat.
Bottom line: Those people who used it as a huge life force filler will call it a nurf despite the huge damage increase it provides. Condition Necromancers do have a hard time building life force yes but you shouldn’t be relying on one skill to build it all the time anyway.
Its a buff and quite a big one in my opinion, why?
well… with 106% critical damage…
How is it a “huge damage increase”? You guys keep saying this and have nothing to back it up. While i Give you the exact amount of damage it increases for a condition damage.
I think it is perceived as any damage boost is a huge damage boost for us. =(
Or that since the damage boost comes in terms of might, it can be used however we want and is thus, a damage boost to every single damage skill we have, right?
Dagger either needs to cleave or it needs 300 MH range so you can damage with it while out of strict melee range like an elementalist can. Having neither makes it of very limited usefulness.
Yes please, while dagger does not need the 600 range that axes has, it does deserve a little more than it currently has.
Why do we get 5-10 different posts like this per day? OP I’m sorry but you aren’t stating anything the rest of the community doesn’t already know. You aren’t providing any opinions or feedback on how you propose to change us for the better.
Most people here play their necros because despite the flaws we enjoy the class. I am sorry you are having a hard time with waiting to see how Anet wants to fix/balance/change this class. Perhaps you might want to play an alt while you wait to see how the class will turn out?
Because many people are unhappy with the development of the class… They come to the boards thinking that this is a place to express their opinions, but really it is not… only positive opinions are allowed.
This whole notion of, “If yer don’t like it, GITOUT!” is absurd… People want to express their negative opinions because they enjoy the class but hate that it is borked.
Just because some people are happy with the current state of Necro class, or have HOPE that fixes are coming, doesn’t mean that everyone is or has to be… just saying.
I was not trying to tell the OP that he should ‘git out’ or that he needed to move on completely. Just offering a healthy and fun temporary solution of playing an alt while waiting for fixes or changes to be made. And you are right these boards get modded to death yet we still only get very few and faint posts from devs, but that is not really the heart of this discussion anyhow.
I just think that since there are numerous posts here everyday ( thus showing how neglected and angry we are as a community) that people should really continue on those posts instead of making whole new ones.
Why do we get 5-10 different posts like this per day? OP I’m sorry but you aren’t stating anything the rest of the community doesn’t already know. You aren’t providing any opinions or feedback on how you propose to change us for the better.
Most people here play their necros because despite the flaws we enjoy the class. I am sorry you are having a hard time with waiting to see how Anet wants to fix/balance/change this class. Perhaps you might want to play an alt while you wait to see how the class will turn out?
@ Riot Inducer, while I think giving necros a free 100% lifeforce bar is a bit on the overwhelming side. I do agree with you that perhaps making signet of undeath passively work outside of combat a great idea.
As poster above me stated 1% per 3( or even 5 secs) outside of combat and then 1% ever 1( or 2 seconds) inside combat seems pretty good to me.
