Guild Wars 2

Dempsey.8760:

DeathPanel.8362:

Isslair.4908:

Wha?

The defending of Magg is such a faceroll now.

Done it with a pug party with 2 rangers, rifle warrior and some ele. Had no difficulties whatsoever and completed it in one try. I imagine with good team it’s just facerolling while mobs die.

It could even use some more upscaling.

Well thats at least 3 aoe type chars 2 of which cripple on their aoes.

Try it with a melee heavy team, and you will fail every time.

how? most melees have the capacity to keep stability on themselves when needed, I know i can, and i know that every warrior has the same skills availible to them. Also both melee classes have MANY stun breaks, a few of them are on pretty short cds too.
2 warrs, 2 guards, 1 mes, did it just fine.

@the gates assassin, running full dps warrior myself. Axe/shield however, i found no problem with this. I suppose the real skill is to be able to run full dps and still succeed.

Pretty much. Ask anyone complaining about their glass cannon dying if they look at skill animations or what the mob is targeting. Glass cannon is for people who can handle it. My engineer still takes tool kit and elixir S a lot of the time just in case. I could probably sub them out for Elixir B and Rifle Turret, but I prefer the utility.

This game is about more than just damage

holloweaver.7460:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

I’m glad I’m not the only one who thinks challenge is a good thing in a game.

Fast-clicking on a mouse is not exactly what I can a challenge.

Thanks Anet to remind me that there are better games around.

…What does that even mean? Is that a serious post? That’s such a hyperbole that I can’t believe I’m responding to it.

Scoundrel.2139:

I think the only real problem is that Devs here have decided everyone is a patient and understanding adult. They forget a lot of people who play are childish (not young, just childish) idiots who are happy to say: LoL! the nub died!

… just before kicking the person who died. Not everyone is happy to take on new players for dungeon run. I was lucky when I was learning as it wasn’t as it now is. New players will find it rather difficult.

So don’t game with them. If I don’t know a run, I always say “This is my first time on this one, is that alright with everyone?” If I get any pushback, I just leave. Why game with people who suck?

DeathPanel.8362:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Path 1 was the same for me.

Path 2 was a big challenge. We tried multiple different approaches and it took a while, but it was definitely worth it. It’s more about team coordination than specific professions and armor.

You need:

1) Snares
2) Support
3) Damage/AoE
4) Target Calling

If you can handle that, you can beat it. We had some of the “Worst” classes in the game and we were able to do it when we figured it out. Engineer, 2 Necros, Ranger and an Ele.

If we can do it, anyone can. It’s not your profession. It’s not your armor. It’s your skill.

I’m really glad that’s how it is.

Wrong, IT IS about your profession.

You said it yourself in your post you need snares/support/aoes.

Not every profession have those things. Just because you happened to have the right classes/builds in your team doesn’t mean anything.

It doesn’t matter how “skilled” you are, if you don’t have those types of professions with those abilities you outlined yourself you will fail.

Every single class has either crippled chilled or immobilized just in their utility slots. Every single class as at least one of those in their weapon abilities.

So no. It doesn’t matter what profession you bring. If you bring warriors, you may have to focus more on spiking them out with damage, but you still have things like throw bolas for snare. Did I mention your damage is insane?

And, no every profession does have those things. Thieves have multiple things that either stealth, regenerate, heal or allow for more damage (Venoms). So even they can support. Warriors can murder face and they do actually have snares. Even warriors can support with banners.

Rackhir Tanelorn.9123:

laokoko.7403:

ya I mean “Engineer, 2 Necros, Ranger and an Ele” That is how you get through cof path 2.

If you have cough cough warrior it’ll be harder. Most warrior use hundred blade for aoe. But now they can’t tank 100 mob and have knockdown on them.

No if you have Stability/Control/Tanking/Support Warriors you are fine… if you have 100 Blades all Zerker Signet/MF Warriors you will die miserably…

As you should

THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS!!!! Could not agree more.

You cannot just jump into a high level dungeon and expect 5 glass cannons to succeed anymore! As it should be! Sure, it might be possible, but you have to adapt if it doesn’t. Aka, skill.

Indica.1380:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

If you are dead dead, it’s probably not always the best idea to res someone anyways. If they are just downed, I’ve never seen someone not go for you. Honestly, with the fact that you can lose progress through a wipe now I find that players are more willing to do daring feats to res me and others. I sure as hell do.

we can lose progress with a wipe? i didnt read anything about that.
i find it much better to go on with 4man than ressing someone unless i role a guardian or the player doesnt have any mobs aggro on him. but then again even if he/she doesnt he can ress himself too.

If you are fighting a boss and you wipe, he regains all of his health. In certain section, if you die, certain events will reset.

Exactly. If you build your build a certain way, you can’t get mad when you can’t do certain things. If I build to be a full supporter, I can’t complain if my damage is kitten. If I go full berserkers, I can’t complain if I die really fast. You have to build yourself to do both. Balance is key.

Indica.1380:

well most dungeons are there for the exotic gears which alternatively you can craft or buy (excluding fractals). now post-update, its become even more pointless unless you are after a specific gear skin.

i like what you pro-update guys say, if we dont like it then dont play it. then i question what is the use of this debate? what is the use of Anet opening a feedback section? so if we dont like it we automatically become whiners?

anyways back to the subject. if i see a player in down-state now, being a glassy mesmer i will not ress them. plenty of times i tried to ress someone ive died myself, thankfully there were this “waypoint” that i could rely on. but now ressing is not an option for glassy players like me. why would i risk losing more man power by ressing? makes no sense.

Being a full glass cannon in PvE is generally not a good idea. Even the devs themselves have said this. Survivability > Cannon for the most part.

Second, the pros heavily outweigh that small dilemma. The dungeons are more challenging and require thought, instead of armor repairs.

You cannot buy the armors for dungeons, so what do you mean it’s useless to do them?

Us “Pro-Update” guys aren’t saying that. I can only speak for myself in this, but I’m saying what I like about this update. It’s clear to me that there was a LOT of work put into not only this patch, but this game. I’m not saying “If you don’t like it, just quit”. I’m saying, if you see an issue, express it in a non “Oh god everything is terrible and bad and I hate it” way. It’s not constructive and it gets old fast. Maybe you’ll see that this update isn’t bad. Maybe you’ll see what they’re really trying to do by enforcing the WP stuff.

Just say what you mean without the hyperboles and whinny language. That’s all. It’s fine if you don’t like the update, but I think it’s impossible to say this update was 100% kitten.

If you are dead dead, it’s probably not always the best idea to res someone anyways. If they are just downed, I’ve never seen someone not go for you. Honestly, with the fact that you can lose progress through a wipe now I find that players are more willing to do daring feats to res me and others. I sure as hell do.

Silk Greywin.2453:

That’s just silly Mkalafut. Of course its the opposite of hardcore. Putting 5 people together in a new environment doesn’t make a team. I believe this change will see a lot of people lying on dungeon floors because it is too risking to rez them ….. it happens now. It will get worse. I am glad you are happy with the changes and would appreciate you not disrespecting my choice to be unhappy with them. I think the less able players will be even more discouraged from attempting the dungeons. An acquaintance ingame ventured into fractals with a team of strangers and was admittedly a newby and unwittingly ill prepared. He was so badly treated by the group, that chose not to help him get better but to denigrate him, that he will not go near dungeons or fractals again. Although many many people in GW2 are good souls, not all are. I have a number of issues with Anet, this just being the small straw that is really pushing on the camels back.

What purpose does that story serve? The problem with that dungeon run wasn’t the content, it was the players he was with. Fractals is beautifully designed. You can’t blame Anet for crappy people. It just happens. If that person was with me, they probably would have had a much better time, as I generally am very nice to people just starting out. Same dungeon. Different players. Different experience.

If you want easy dungeons, go to one of the lower level ones. CoF is level 78 iirc. That shouldn’t be easy. Not to mention path 1 is a really easy starting point. There’s plenty of content for casual players, including the personal story and random events. Keep in mind, they’re designed to be more challenging content. It should NOT be easy.

I think you unfairly demonize Anet. They worked for months on this build and I for one think it turned out great.

If that is aimed at me Essence, I dont care for the rewards… I play to have fun and enjoy the company of my friends worldwide. I make new friends and explore new places. Don’t feel the need to enter a kitten competition via armour or levels or rewards. Anet have just modified a great game into a less enjoyable place. I don’t think it is a level playing field as Anet hoped, as I have members in my guild who are young and can’t ‘buy’ or ‘play’ their way in a kitten contest because believe it or not, some of us have real life commitments and can’t spend 24/7 in GW2. Seems the content is being funnelled into a WoW tasting game. I have put real money into game to support Anet, but no more. Anet have made one too many modification for me. I find the Black Lion gouging dishonest, and am generally disillusioned at Anet’s integrity. Glad you haven’t had substantial Gold disappear from trading post like one of my members and have anet flick them off… another has had items disappear of characters and Anet don’t care…
I don’t clamour for harder content, just clamour for fun content. Would like the choice. But saying that I know that I have only to leave the game… this is a choice I have.

You’re being really melodramatic for no reason. It was really boring to have to just kite enemies. This is the system from GW1 and that worked great! It made it so you actually had to plan out what you were going to do before rushing it. A game without challenge is pointless. How much challenge depends on the player, but there has to be PvE dungeons that are good for hardcore players. CoF should be that, as it is one of the highest level dungeons. So yeah, if you don’t like a challenge, don’t jump into the Citadel of Flames just yet. Get good at the more basic stuff (personal story, events, lower level dungeons) and work your way up. There’s no need to complain because higher level content is being made actually difficult.

It’s like complaining that DoA in GW1 was too difficult. Well yeah. It’s suppose to be.

Path 1 was the same for me.

Path 2 was a big challenge. We tried multiple different approaches and it took a while, but it was definitely worth it. It’s more about team coordination than specific professions and armor.

You need:

1) Snares
2) Support
3) Damage/AoE
4) Target Calling

If you can handle that, you can beat it. We had some of the “Worst” classes in the game and we were able to do it when we figured it out. Engineer, 2 Necros, Ranger and an Ele.

If we can do it, anyone can. It’s not your profession. It’s not your armor. It’s your skill.

I’m really glad that’s how it is.

I’m glad I’m not the only one who thinks challenge is a good thing in a game.

If you’re happy and you know it…get off the forums and play the game!

Speaking of which.

Amen.

I’m beginning to notice how much people complain about a game that’s actually really fantastic. The forums really taint it. I think I’m going to post here less, or at least take people less to heart. This game really is fantastic and no matter what some forum posters say, Anet really does care about all aspects of the game.

Tera GX.8149:

I have to point out, as a player who doesn’t do dungeons (well, Fractals I did a fair bit more, but still isn’t my focus) that this news is rather attractive to me. I didn’t find dungeons to be too hard, just too centered on high numbers and consequently mundane. Hearing that the challenge will be increased makes it sound more interesting, starting with increased value for one’s life. But until they address the balance of boss mechanics and HP, I’m not exactly expecting a thrill.

The CoF Path 2 thing was on the same level of Fractals IMO. It’s worth the attempt.

Uhhhh, stop theory crafting and play the class. I was rocking in dungeons today. Way more damage than usual with 100nades bar.

Players looking for a challenge – “CoF Path 2 was awesome!”

Players looking for money/items – “CoF Path 2 was too hard!”

Players who don’t do dungeons – “Jesus. I guess I’ll never beat a dungeon then.”

For the record, I’m totally okay with this.

This was addressed by the devs in a previous post. They intend to add more waypoints to compensate. The small amount of waypoints was to counteract res rushing, which is no longer an issue. Idk when they plan to implement it, but I know they do.

Here’s what you need to be able to do it:

1) Snares
2) Calling targets
3) Party Support
4) Damage, preferably AoE.

We did this with no guardians or warriors. Instead we had A necro, ele, ranger, engineer and another necro. Hardly what most would consider an ideal party. It took some time to figure out the right strategy, but boy was it worth it.

God forbid a dungeon take some thought, time and skill to complete xD

Grenade Kit is epic damage now. That is all.

Now THAT was a kittenin’ dungeon. Whoever designed that, good on you. Tough and it actually took some thought. fist bumps. I hope to see more stuff like that.

Relax guys. They said they’re going to update AoE Right? Well none of those updates do that, so there must be more to this update.

It’s coming. Breathe.

Definitely not. That’d be a huge nerf to the class. The power of Engineers is kit swapping. This would make engineers completely uninteresting.

I attached a bunch of pictures of cool places you can get to with your engineer via jump shot. It really helps you start battles with the upper hand if you combine this with grenades. Some of these are purely escapes.

For the first one, you can jump shot to the small bit of rock next to the bridge. From there, you can jump up and escape other players attacking you.

For the Battle of Kylho one, it does work on both trebs.

Engineer Trick 7 is using jump shot to get back up to the white area.

I have played the engineer for a good 4 months now in sPvP, tPvP, WvW and PvE. I’ve done every single dungeon besides Arah Explorable and I’m currently doing Fractals 8. My engineer is, of course, level 80.

1. Are Engineer class good at PVE ?

I use a variation of the 100nades build for PvE. Because I have kit refinement, I can switch between great support through Elixir Gun and huge damage/conditions with grenade kit. All I have to do is switch my armor out for healing armor or berserkers. They’re heavily underrated. Elixir R is the greatest thing a terrible group could ever come across.

2. Can they tackle 3-5 mobs at lvl 65+ zones ? (having warrior, never died in PVE, almost soloed most of the zones, except for Group events – he is a beast )

Easily. Ball them up, throw down the 100nades combo and roll out. Continue to blast them with grenades, pistol blinds and whatever else you have equipped.

For melee mobs, throw down a freeze grenade and nuke. Then take out your pistol and throw down glue shot. If you have bomb kit out, drop a glue bomb. They’ll NEVER hit you once.

As for ranged, take them out quickly with a rifle spike with 100nades. Engineers do SHOCKING amounts of damage in their spikes. Seriously. 14k easily in less than a second.

For mixed groups, snare the melee, spike the ranged and then go back to the melee. Med kit is usually enough to keep you alive.

3. I play WvW , Looking at the comments , i can see that Engineers have good place in WvW.

Definitely. Grenade kit is great for taking out siege and keeping enemies off of walls. Tool kit can yank people really nicely from walls and once they decide to buff mortar, we can be walking sieges.

4. I never do PVP. (So i do not have to worry about)

100nades is great in PvP, and there are a few good bunker builds out there.

Side note

You’ll hear a lot that grenade kit was nerfed. This, while true, really doesn’t matter. They only nerfed the auto attack. Shrapnel Grenade and Freeze Grenade still do crap tons of damage and the 100nades spike DEFINITELY does plenty of damage. Anyone who stays on grenade kit and nukes with the auto attack isn’t doing it right anyways. Engineers are about kit swapping, utility and conditions. In fact, most of our pressure is from the wide array of conditions we can inflict.

Supply Crate Good as it is.

Mortar Increase range to 1,800. Increase recharge of Rocket skill to 60. Make the rocket skill fire one large bomb, instead of five small ones. Have it knockback foes. Remove line of sight requirement. Increase recharge to 180 seconds.

Elixir X Change functionality to: Gain 10 stacks of malice and might for 20 seconds. Lower Recharge to 90

Add new Elite Gadget:

Thrusters Recharge 90 seconds. Activation 0. For 10 seconds, you move twice as fast and ignore all slowing effects. Gain stability for 10 seconds. Breaks Stun.

Add new Elite Kit:

Create Rocket Kit Allows you to switch in and out rocket kit for 25 seconds. 180 recharge.

RPG 500 damage. Causes burning (200).

Rocket Jump Launch yourself into the air. 1,500 range. (Like Jump Shot, only it allows you to go up). Recharge 20.

Multi-Shot Fire five rockets at your foe. (damage(x5) 2,000)

Explosion Fire a rocket at your foe that knocks them back.

Napalm Shot Fire a rocket that burns foes at target location for 5 seconds (damage on impact: 500) (damage on tick from burning: 500). Duration 10 seconds. Creates a fire field.

Blast Fire an explosive shot at target location. (Blast Finisher). 20 second recharge.

RPG kit won’t happen, but I can dream.

ShaunZ.1098:

That and we’d need a turret for the elite slot (I suppose the supply crate, but I’m so tired of supply crates!). I’m all about making turrets viable, so let’s hope.

Reread the description of Mortar. It’s technically a turret.

Well, is the problem that warriors are too good at killing or that mobs are to bad at staying alive?

Ejiofor.4801:

Great build! Trying it out now. Good stuff

In regards to Kit Refinement and Tool Kit, however, I noticed that I am not dropping an ‘extra’ Box of Nails. Anyone else having issues like this?

There’s no animation for it. Look closely when you switch to it. You’ll see the nails there.

GlacianNex.1520:

Interesting – so is having points in vitality and healing is not beneficial at all for support?

Vitality keeps you alive.

Healing makes your healing skills more effective. So no, healing is definitely useful for support.

I thought up a bunker build that uses the push back turrets trait, but the issue is that turrets currently:

1) Kill utility
2) Exploding turrets makes it so you waste that turret

Essentially, a turret is only one skill, disguised as two.

Until that’s fixed, they’re really not worth it.

If that’s your build, it’s no wonder you’re not doing a lot of damage.

Don’t build engineers like you build your warrior. It’s not meant for that. You can build high damage, but you have to think of your utility too. That’s what makes the engineer great. Great damage with a lot of utility available. If you go through a dungeon without swapping skills at least once, you’re either doing it wrong or the dungeon is just stupidly easy. In Fractals, I switch my weapon, armor and utilities all the time to fit the situation I’ll be going into. There’s a reason you’re allowed to change your skill outside of towns.

Thomassassinate.9370:

Whats more annoying imo is dudes who dont accept guardians.

You want me to make a warrior and make him lvl 80? Aint nobody got time for that…well i don’t at least.

I play hypocrite though and make 3 warriors and 1 mes join me instead. Some immediatly leave if im a guardian but usually they dont.

kitten please. You’ve got nothing to complain about. If you want a misunderstood profession, go make an engineer.

Xolo.3580:

Kardiamond.6952:

Each time I try another build, I feel gimped. What If I can do low damage with more survivality, when I can one shot people.

TL;DR : Buff our weak build, and balance our 100 nades build.

What’s your opinion about it?

You pretty much gave the definition of what “overpowered” means right there. It’s not good if something is a way better choice than all the other potential options, and it’s bad for the game if it has to do with oneshotting. I’m always confused when I see -insert oneshot build user- argue that these builds are balanced and of course it’s always a L2p issue… dodging that 20k instant dmg. This game is an MMORPG, not a FPS…

In gw1, you’d be right, but now we’re equipped to handle things like that.

We have dodging, blocking, invulnerability, protection, blind and aegis to make it so the entire thing does nothing to us.

Also, where is this “Only damage and nothing else” coming from? Elixir S = you can stomp things super easy. Tool kit = Pulling, snaring and defense. Grenade Kit = AoE damage from REALLY far away. Rifle = Bunkering and snare. Medkit = prepping points with a ton of bandages, speed buffs and condition removal.

All of this with a really good AoE spike. How is this not a dream build?

Wasdclick.1764:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Why would you want the other blast finishers? The blast finisher for light fields is retaliation. Pretty sweet.

Water fields grants AoE healing. Fire grants 3 stacks of AoE might. Dark inflicts blind. And smoke grants AoE stealth.

There’s plenty of reason to want another field. Light is one of the better fields, but others are good too. Especially water for all the healing output, and Fire, for might stacking builds that rely on a fire field for a quick buildup of might.

Yes, but with no investment in any power or w/e, you can deal damage and heal your party. I’ll take that over the rest of em in the middle of a battle.

Can a mod sticky this? This is really really useful. It has all of my favorite builds and it would be really helpful for any new Engineers.

I’m not looking for the function of running, just the gameplay. I just did Metrica Province’s Jumping Puzzle and I’m trying to work on speed running it. Windy Puzzle is friggin hard to speed run.

Also, that naked run sounds like the greatest thing I’ve ever heard. Ever. I’ll have to ask my guild leader xD

Is there anything like this in the game that I don’t know about? I mean, sure, there’s some minor running in dungeons to skip mobs and I generally speed through jumping puzzles (Haven’t done all of them yet), but is there anything sort of like running Droks? Anytime I was kind or bored/down I’d just go for a really long run from Ascalon all the way to Grotto. Kinda miss that.

Sure, I can just run from one end of the map to the other, but it’s different now. There’s waypoints that make it much easier and for the most part, mobs aren’t placed in a way that makes the run challenging.

Kardiamond.6952:

Well you need some drawback.

It doesn’t make one shotting people anymore fair

Tell that to the thief and warrior. Besides, skilled players still absolutely destroy me in fights. If you die to this, it’s because you stood still and let me in. It’s no doubt a great spike and build, but I really don’t see it as OP.

I don’t really see a way to fix it. Might be a good idea to focus on this post on trying to solve this rather than just mention the issue.

Mif.3471:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Mif.3471:

Engineers need balanced builds that reward intelligent play, not one trick pony (like 100 grenades) or gimmick builds.

How is it a one trick pony?

It’s designed around killing people with kit refinement cooldowns.

So? The Warrior is designed around killing people with a great sword attack. The Thief is built around going stealth and stabbing people. You just described the build.

This build can do a lot. Look past the basics.

Magnetron.5823:

Well yes, you can do a 16-20k damage combo ( if your opponent isnt any good ) but you cannot miss! or be blocked or what that new elementalist does vanish in thin air etc.. then your screwed

Also vs thiefs.. you miss everything, best defence if hes vanished is to take out the wrench and start hitting around you and use the gear shield if he appears next to you.. but that really takes good timing.. And i have since a few week more and more skill lag with bigger groups, so timing isnt working for me

Thieves are the easiest class to kill with Engineers. By far. When they go invisible near you, you KNOW they are next to you, so throw down your 100 nades and they die. Pretty much every time.

Anyone who says that Engineers can’t be good hasn’t played them enough or at least hasn’t tried to make working builds. I discovered 100 nades myself through a lot of testing of traits and skills. It’s not like the other professions where skill comes from hitting 2. That’s what’s so great about it.

Mif.3471:

Engineers need balanced builds that reward intelligent play, not one trick pony (like 100 grenades) or gimmick builds.

How is it a one trick pony? You have a spike, you have yanks, mobility, condition support/damage and you have medkit which can make holding points a lot easier for others (Lay down a bunch of those bandages before you leave).

It’s not gimmicky at all. If this is gimmicky, what isn’t?

I think what makes this kind of a gray issue is that we don’t really know where the line is in this game. What build is totally fair? Where is the build that is in a perfect place? Useful to new players, extremely powerful to great players.

If I was to give everyone in PvP a title from this list:

Terrible (Can’t kill anyone and bad tactics)
Decent (Sometimes gets kills, but generally dies quickly)
Good (Gets kills often, occasionally kills high ranked players, but most often just loses to anyone who’s great)
Great (Great tactics, gets lots of kills, hard to kill even with glass cannons)

I’d say I’m Good. To me, a good build should allow a Good player to at least stand a chance against a Great one, and should just about own everyone below them

That’s how this build feels to me. Really powerful, but great players are still going to be a challenge. If you stand still in PvP, that’s your fault.

Sitael.4680:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Fair way to think about it, but think of it like this too:

[…]The difference with P2W is that they purposely put obstacles in that can be remedied either by them fixing something they purposely put in or you paying money. It’s purposely bad game design to get more money. If the things you buy are simply more content or purely cosmetic, no one has an issue, but as soon as you can buy power, it becomes kind of wrong. It becomes schemey.

You right in one side, but on the other side, LWs are only cosmetic Weapons and somtime not even really that. They don’t have (yet) better stats then exotics. So why we are talking about P2W? There is no reason for. They gives no one more power or whatever kind of stats to be better than others. If someone buy a legendary, it is nothing more than buying a weaponskin.

The question is, why people are willing to grind or pay for a skin and why there is so much dispute about nothing else than cosmetics?

Because paying money will HEAVILY lighten the load of grinding you have to do if you want to get one. Imagine this was a dungeon and you could pay to skip one of the more tedious sections. It’s not physical power, it’s progress. Money, in a way, is power. If you just start this game and buy yourself 20g, I think you have a bit of an advantage over others, especially since one of the best ways to overcome the level requirements of Story is to do crafting, which requires a crap ton of materials.

Why would you want the other blast finishers? The blast finisher for light fields is retaliation. Pretty sweet.

I don’t get why people think the heal is bad. Take kit refinement and put some healing power in and you have an AoE heal for about 7k in 10 seconds. Not to mention it removes conditions from anyone it hits on impact. It’s pretty nice.

ENGINEER
—Solo PvE—
DPS: 8 / 10
Survivability: 9 / 10
Support/Utility: 7 / 10
Difficulty: 5 / 10
Fun: 9 / 10

Tossing grenades only gets old if the boss itself gets old. Otherwise, love the utility it brings.

—Group PvE— (Dungeons, Dynamic Events, etc.)
DPS: 9 / 10
Survivability: 6 / 10
Support/Utility: 6 / 10
Difficulty: 8/ 10
Fun: 8 / 10

It’s on you to stay alive, but 100 nades is a great damage bar. You can easily throw in Elixir Gun and have some decent AoE condition removal and healing. The 1,500 range grenades are EXTREMELY useful.

—sPvP—
DPS: 9 / 10
Survivability: 5 / 10
Support/Utility: 7 / 10
Difficulty: 9 / 10
Fun: 9 / 10

Loving 100nades. It’s hard to stay alive, but instant killing stupid thieves is just too great to pass up. Elixir S is an amazing utility in sPvP and tPvP. Never worry about stomping again.

—WvW—
DPS: 8 / 10
Survivability: 5 / 10
Support/Utility: 6 / 10
Difficulty: 9 / 10
Fun: 9 / 10

100nades can easily spike down some siege at the cost of your life. Throwing down two Super Elixirs while specced for healing will keep those flame ram guys up pretty easily. Not to mention we’re probably the best class for keeping people off the walls and we even have a skill that can yank them right off (in tool kit)

Sitael.4680:

eisberg.2379:

If Arenanet can actually get people to buy $2000-$4000 in Gems to convert to gold to buy a Legendary, then good for them.

Do not think in a term of one big amount of money. Take it like it would be a monthly fee for the game (e.g. $20 / month) and as the game would be a hobby. There are lots of hobbies where people pay more than $20/month for it.

Fair way to think about it, but think of it like this too:

In other games, you play and it’s either fun or not. If it’s fun, you just pay once and maybe more for some more content that comes out later on. In the end, once you pay, it’s fun. The difference with P2W is that they purposely put obstacles in that can be remedied either by them fixing something they purposely put in or you paying money. It’s purposely bad game design to get more money. If the things you buy are simply more content or purely cosmetic, no one has an issue, but as soon as you can buy power, it becomes kind of wrong. It becomes schemey.

Because ANet is known for taking risks. They did an amazing job with GW1! And that is when they were just starting out. They are FAR from what they are company wise. They have the power to make a game with no grinding, but they have changed their fundamental game design philosophy. It’s so clear in many aspects of the game. I feel stupid doing so many things. It makes me feel like I’m playing into their trap so much. GW1 NEVER felt like that. I did things because I wanted to and the was no requirement to do otherwise. Gameplay came first, not money.

Also, define success. If you mean pushing the bounds of the genre, I say yes, but they taint it with so much BS. They have something great, but it could be even better.

You seem to treat games like their things to be marketed. Something to make money off of. It’s people like that that ruin games and weaken the entire medium. You aren’t a true artist if you make game design decisions in the name of money instead of the players.

Regardless, the point of this post is asking what other ways we can make it so getting a legendary is more about skill rather than grinding.

SneakyLemon.8461:

i skimmed that article so maybe i missed it but, i saw nothing talking about the social aspect of these games. Not many people get ‘addicted’ to single player rpgs that have a similar form of character progression that keeps you playing. I think the social aspect of MMOs is one of the main things that keeps players logging on excessively.

I think that article is kind of a cop-out. People need to realize it’s about self control. Maybe the developers ARE putting in things for the sole purpose of keeping players coming back but come on guys, it’s a video game, go outside and talk to girls.

Definitely. We aren’t robots. We have the choice to not play. This does however work towards humanities weaknesses. This stuff will most likely make your body want it, even if you mind is saying this sucks.

But you’re right. The choice eventually lies on us. I stopped playing any grinding a week ago and the game is much better for it. I also decided not to play every day and I’m way more productive in life.

As much as you want to repeat it, it won’t make it sound any different.
You introduce something that requires skill, it’ll eventually be accomplished. And quickly. So instead of a six month game, you have a two-week game. MMO directors always say they hate grind and that game X isn’t grindy (and Colin said they didn’t want GW2 to be grindy). But honestly it is. But I don’t care. That’s the genre. It’s like asking RTS games to not be so complicated. Well, that’s the genre!
Your statement is as riduclous as those folk who think the only reason why they introduce a feature is to drive gem sales. This game isn’t stale, there’s a lot to do in this game if you choose to do it. Maybe the reason why you think the legendary process is too stale is because you’re too focused on it when there are other things to do.

You’re giving up on the game. MMOs don’t need to be grindy. People just think that’s the case. They really don’t have to, it’s just designers are afraid to do it because MMOs are so expensive to make. YOU are backing that fear up.

No genre should be defined by grinding. That’s not a game. That’s a part time job.