Cleansing Ire fell out of the meta, because the specialization update wrecked Shoutbow and Hambow builds, and longbow is really the only reliable way to trigger Cleansing Ire.
The melee bursts are so fickle with the mass amounts of dodges, blinds, and blocks flying around, that you might as well just take Last Stand, because you can’t rely on Cleansing Ire to proc when you need it. We have to take triple stances to survive in PvP anyway.
Solution: make the more important part of Cleansing Ire (Embrace the Pain, old trait merged into Cleansing Ire) a separate trait again, preferably replacing Thick Skin).
The primal bursts are mediocre, but the Rage skills are especially disappointing. ANet might as well have made them all Physical skills; at least then they would have gotten a bonus from Peak Performance.
Headbutt and Outrage have some useful applications, but those are about it.
I like your proposal, Smoosh. Anything would be better than the one-trick pony we have now.
It seems like the big problem is that only two classes can use the rifle, making it a weapon with a very small audience. ANet doesn’t seem to care, when they have so many classes that use greatsword, longbow, etc.
At this point, a signet build takes more thought to use than a stance build. Stance play is just a mind-numbing game of cooldown rotation.
I understand. I was pretty underwhelmed as well with power/support with the berzerk spec as well. I honestly could only come up with decent condi based builds. lol Confusion/burns-bleed. I had a hard time convincing myself to take the spec otherwise for my GS/Hammer and M/S. Mayhaps something will come up. But it does look like the ol’ hammer/GS Rampaging stances will still be a thing.
Maybe if they juice up a couple of the primal bursts… hammer, axe, and longbow primal bursts could use some serious help.
However valid not necessarily true for everyone. I enjoy having 27k health pool 2k armor and kittenting 4kburns/bleeds before anyone can even bat an eye at me.
Warriors are already balls deep profession no reason to add the same mechanic. I guess the whole of elite specs was to bring roundness for all professions. So, a War could go condi, or an engi could go stealth trickster burst, or a guard could go trappy. Keeping professions in one little niche is counter to what ANet is trying to do whether it pleases everyone idk. But I like being able to play different flavors of my favorite profession.
Like I said not trying to invalidate opinions, but just pointing out some other.
I see your point, and I see the need for experimentation and build diversity. It just frustrates me that Berserker doesn’t bring much to the table for power builds. In fact, it just hurts power builds because you have to replace something more important to take Berserker. Plus most of the primal bursts are mediocre or sidegrade at best.
It’s like they’re penalizing Warrior’s bread-and-butter with the elite, and you might as well forget this elite and wait for the next expansion pack if you want a true “Smash Brawler” specialization.
Thanks for the feedback, I didn’t mean to disrespect people that want to play condi builds on Warrior, I just wish Berserker had brought something powerful and game-changing to the table like the other elites (Reaper, Chrono).
Note: Zerker was actually intended to be pure condi when they designed it, but changed it last minute. In one of the POIs.
No wonder Berserker is so mediocre. They give us an elite that is essentially a kitten burn Guardian or a poor man’s Ele/Engineer.
We play Warrior to smash, bash, and crash around the battlefield, not kittenfoot around with other classes’ cast-offs. I would rather do one thing right (smash stuff) than a couple things kitten (hybrid, condi).
extremely good feedback
I agree with everything BurrTheKing said, plus I add my own opinion:
The adrenaline nerf needs to get reverted – it hamstrings Warrior and Berserker unnecessarily, and the reasons for it have vanished.
Having your adrenaline decay immediately and rapidly after battle now is just insane. To begin with, if you want to open a fight with a burst/primal burst, you have to blow your cooldowns (Signet of Fury/or multiple Rage skills) just to start using your class mechanic. Then, as soon as you disengage, you have to do to it all over again, because you will have zero adrenaline to start the next fight with.
The reasons that Warrior suffered the adrenaline nerf are long gone. The old traits (old Berserker’s Power, Berserker’s Might, Embrace the Pain) that let you build adrenaline more quickly and gain buffs for storing it up got eliminated. ANet transformed Warrior from a sustained fighter to a pure burst class like all the others. If we can’t open a fight with our class mechanic, we are basically crippled.
Yeah, some of the other classes have to “build up” their mechanic (Druid, Necro/Reaper), but they can carry that over from fight to fight. At least give Warriors a grace period before you sap all the adrenaline out of them.
Gunflame is only overpowered because it is bugged right now. I submit that it will end up forgotten, along with the rest of the rifle, after the pre-launch wave of nerfs.
Gunflame: the hero that Warriors deserve, but not the one that they need right now.
Sorry, no. We ALL know greatsword is Batman…..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xx11JqpM2DE(lol, jk. well played)
Ah the Batman Halloween greatsword! Good point. Maybe Arc Divider will become the hero that Warriors deserve (but not the one that they need right now).
Gunflame: the hero that Warriors deserve, but not the one that they need right now.
Against an Ele that uses Earth Attunement properly, you are pretty much screwed… if you can’t crit them, your damage gets reduced to nothing, and the Ele can just swap to Water and sustain easily.
Warrior bursts are just way too predictable for an Ele that pays proper attention to fall victim to.
Please let us know if you have success with any build in sPvP not using Discipline. I wonder how well we can do without Fast Hands.
Welcome to the game.
Right now, Warrior build diversity is pretty bad. Almost all decent PvP builds must take Strength + Defense + Discipline to survive and have a chance of defeating enemies 1v1. The reasons being:
(a) that Warriors rely on a quick weapon swap (Fast Hands) for almost every vital combo, so you have to take Discipline,
(b) some classes burst so hard that you need Defy Pain and Endure Pain to survive, so Defense is critical; and,
© greatsword is pretty much essential for damage, so Strength is mandatory.
D/D Eles are difficult for any class to defeat, no matter your build. Don’t feel bad about rotating off a point occupied by a D/D Ele, because fighting them is either futile or turns into a stalemate and a waste of time.
There seems to be no consensus on Berserker yet, but many think that even though it is fun, it is not worth sacrificing one of your three key trait-lines (Strength, Defense, and Discipline), because those are so vital.
In conclusion on PvP, Warrior can be effective in PvP, but only if you use one of the current meta-builds that offer some variation of greatsword + x (couple choices for mainhand swap) + shield, and (of course) the three essential trait-lines.
So if you’re looking for creativity or experimentation, unfortunately Warrior is not your bet right now. Engineer, Mesmer, or Necro offer some more options.
In WvW, you can get a bit more creative for Warrior, because you can rely on zergs for strength in numbers.
PvE, I think someone else can give a more informed opinion than I, but as far as I know, there is an optimized metabuild if you run dungeons.
OP learn to play. I main thief (and I know mesmer is your main), so quit your crying.
I main memser? Wrong(i have only ever mained warrior, and that was when it was my only character, i play all classes), i’ve never lost to a thief as warrior, and crying ? Again, wrong. merely wanting to see where others are standing in regards to the buffs to somthing that didnt need itmin my eyes.
Post your useless ‘learn to play’ garbage elsewhere.
Anyone can post a video of big damage Eviscerate hits, but they never post a video of the countless times Eviscerate gets blocked, blinded, or dodged. Same goes for Killshot, Earthshaker, Skull Crack, etc.
The shield buffs were absolutely necessary just for Warrior to survive. Every class has gravitated to a strong burst meta since the core specialization patch, and if you can’t survive bursts, you are screwed.
Ask yourself why every Warrior build since the June patch runs double endure pain, triple stances, and shield.
I will agree that the Warrior didn’t need the shield cooldown buffs, but are Warriors OP? No. Are they dangerous and can they wreck face? Yes. A berserker warrior can be beat by alot of different builds.
Cele Eles, D/P thief builds, most mesmer builds, condi engis, a few ranger builds, etc.
Warrior absolutely needed the shield buffs. Warrior sustain was marginal before the adrenaline nerfs, turned to crap after the adrenaline nerfs, and really turned to crap after the shout nerfs.
If you go full zerker, god help you if you don’t take double endure pain, triple stances, and shield. Without those, anyone can burst a Warrior down like nothing.
All Nine Elites: Ranked into Tiers for sPvP
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Thuggernaut.1250
Let me give my rationale for each choice:
1. Chronomancer - Alacrity and Continuum split. ’Nuff said.
2. Reaper - Reaper Shroud is bomb, and Robert Gee has significantly improved the greatsword skills.
3. Herald - Boon sharing makes this one a good team fighter.
4. Scrapper - We haven’t gotten a chance to test it, but the function gyro could be a game-changer.
5. Druid - Depending on how powerful the heals are, this could be promising. Some of the glyphs seem decent.
6. Daredevil - You can’t go wrong with an extra dodge and a 10-second block, but otherwise, this one doesn’t bring much to the table offensively.
7. Berserker - The primal bursts are mediocre and Warrior build diversity is so bad that taking Berserker means giving up a more valuable traitline.
8. Tempest - Underwhelming Overload mechanic doesn’t do anything Elementalist can’t already do, and better.
9. Dragonhunter - Traps are a non-starter in sPvP, and the longbow skills are disappointing.
All Nine Elites: Ranked into Tiers for sPvP
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Thuggernaut.1250
From what we know so far, here’s how I see it playing out for sPvP. I also rank them within each tier, from best to worst:
Top Tier:
1. Chronomancer
2. Reaper
Decent Tier:
3. Herald
4. Scrapper
5. Druid
Crap Tier:
6. Daredevil
7. Berserker
8. Tempest
9. Dragonhunter
Rifle is still a beter ranged option than LB, if you play non condi builds … Power LB i don’t do any dmg. I’m forced to take Rifle over LB for WvW, if i need a ranged weapon.
Even forgetting damage completely, with longbow you get (1) a blind, (2) a blast finisher, (3) an immobilize, and (4) a fire-field. None of which you get with rifle.
The utility on longbow is just too good to ignore. Even if the thing did zero damage, it would still be better than rifle in 99% of situations.
Some of the burst skills are really PvP only. Earthshaker (hammer) and Skull Crack (mace) are underwhelming in PvE, but jaw-dropping when you manage to land them in PvP against human opponents, because of the long stuns they inflict.
Others, like Combustive Shot (longbow) and Flurry (sword) aren’t visually impressive, but have excellent utility.
You will appreciate bursts more after you get used to them and learn to use them to maximum effect. Most of them are specialized; the only one-size-fits-all burst is really Combustive shot.
I don’t like how adrenal health works passively. I would much rather have it be like you said, where on burst skill landing regenerate health for say 5 seconds in a fashion similar to rangers troll urgent skill. Or my favorite idea would be heal whenever you gain some adrenaline (each point gained heals a small amount, 100 healing base per point). not gaining adrenaline no bonus healing. i dunno sounds kinda strong but its an idea!
This makes sense under the current system, and would definitely work a lot better than Adrenal Health does now.
I remember that under the old trait system way back, Warrior had some traits that encouraged you to hold on to adrenaline (old Berserker’s Power, Adrenal Health, old Arms traitline) by giving you bonuses for not spending it.
Now, we get all the bonuses from using the burst, and adrenaline decays so rapidly out of combat, that if they want us to “burst, burst burst” as soon as our adrenaline bar fills up, Adrenal Health is pretty much useless. Might as well make it work like Rousing Resilience: one flat heal at the time of the burst, or start a strong regeneration like Troll Unguent like you suggested.
This would work even better with the Berserker specialization.
A couple gimmick builds exist that use offhand axe in sPvP/WvW, you might want to check this one out:
http://intothemists.com/guides/5777-the_finisher
But in general, you can do far better with any other offhand.
Fast hands is important to warriors because without it, the warrior mechanism (finishing attacks) just doesn’t work well. We have some amazing talents that trigger off of finishers ( +20% damage, clear 3 conditions ), and the finishers themselves are very powerful. Being able to swap just for the finisher makes the warrior a ton better. Without fast hands, you basically can’t use addren fast enough.
In one sense, this is why Berserker is so poor. We already can swap weapons and land a finisher every ~7 seconds and trigger some amazing side-effects. Being able to trigger a lesser effect every 5 seconds without the supporting effects from talents is just… ‘meh’.
This, so hard. You hit the nail right on the head; weapon swap is critical to everything that the Warrior does. Being able to choose and use the right burst at the right time is absolutely necessary, in WvW and especially sPvP.
Warrior needs baseline Fast Hands, or we will forever be chained to Discipline.
I got something even more fun in mind.
Decapitate becomes a sort of reverse Arcing Strike and deals more damage the higher their health is. Once they’re low it deals very little damage. However, if you use it to knock someone’s health to 0, they just die. No downed state, just the sweet embrace of
Grenth.It would rarely happen, but when it does you will feel like the most powerful person alive.
Btw, idc if it’s “OP” it sounds stupidly fun in my head.
I like it. It gives you an incentive to Decapitate; roll the dice and see if you score a brutal kill. This would make an axe Warrior the ultimate gambler in combat, and it fits in with the Berserker theme: a kill-crazy wild man whose rage strikes fear into the hearts of his enemies.
The payout on Mystic Toilet recipes is so bad that it would make Las Vegas casinos blush. Don’t feel bad about getting crappy returns from the Toilet, because the odds of getting anything decent really are that low.
This isn’t the realm of stronk. This is the realm of stupidly OP.
It doesn’t seem stupidly OP when compared with the Engi elite spec, that can finish downed and revive downed remotely:
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/meet-the-scrapper-engineers-elite-specialization/
It’s true that the primal bursts have a fast cooldown, and this would make Decapitate “stronk.” But, Berserker needs something “stronk,” because at the moment, it only gives mediocre sidegrade potential. In fact, Berserker hurts Warrior build diversity, because of the necessity of Discipline in all builds, especially in Berserker.
Take a look at the properly functioning elite specializations – Reaper and Chronomancer. Both of these sacrifice a trait line, but in return give a new mechanic that is “stronk” – Reaper Shroud and Continuum Split. Those are game-changers. Right now, Berserk is not a game changer, because most of the primal bursts are mediocre at best, and the decent one (Gunflame) is already set to receive a significant nerf.
Think about it – mainhand axe is the redheaded stepchild of PvP for Warriors, and Berserker makes it even more dubious. The Decapitate burst needs something really awe-inspiring to tempt Warriors into using it.
Solution: Decapitate downed-finisher. A nice Decapitate on a downed foe in the middle of a rez would make all those hotshot Mesmers and Guardians take notice: Don’t kitten with the Berserker.
So far, Decapitate doesn’t bring much to the table beyond Eviscerate. Sure, it has an AoE, but that alone isn’t worth much in PvP, and it does less initial damage to boot. Plus, it’s as difficult to land as a standard Eviscerate. How does this encourage us to go Berserk when the regular burst skill is arguably better than the primal burst?
Proposal: make Decapitate a downed finisher, like the Daredevil elite combo Impact Strike.
Why? The skill is called Decapitate; it only makes sense that it serves as a killing burst. Decapitate has an AoE, so it that would make it a nice punisher to use on enemies that attempt to revive their downed teammates in combat.
Please give us a reason (1) to even go Berserk in the first place, and (2) to use mainhand axe in PvP. This improvement to Decapitate could finally make axe competitive.
The greatsword primal burst change sounds pretty good. I also like the changes to the axe and hammer primal bursts. Good to see some power-based options that make Berserker worth taking on a non-condi warrior.
A shame about the Gunflame nerf, but then again, it’s nice that it doesn’t root during cast anymore.
Sweet, Robert Gee delivered. At least we have someone in our corner.
Anet pls.
Gun Flame is completely broken in pretty much any situation with more than 2 targets (that are close together).
Gunflame is no more powerful than a traited Orbital Strike.
Theres little incentive
ahahah “little incentive”, lol.
That skill is completely broken and OP.
Must be immediately fixed with a max 5 targets and -50% dmg
Might as well just use traited Killshot then.
Berserker is already mediocre enough to begin with, and now you cretins want to nerf its only semi-useful burst into the ground before it even launches.
We need the same treatment that Reaper got… after the first beta, Robert Gee went into the Necro forum and broke down his observations on Reaper performance and his planned modifications.
Obviously we all want Axe 5 to reflect projectiles, but the chances of getting that are slim.
Awhile back someone suggested adding cripple to Axe 5, which might help keep enemies within range for the full channel. But that doesn’t solve the underlying problems of Axe 5, which include the long channel and garbage DPS.
Also the fact that you can’t dodge during Axe 5 anymore… which means that casting Axe 5 basically begs your opponent to daze, stun, or otherwise unleash a massive burst on you.
I really can’t think of a good use for Axe 5 in PvP other than activating whirl finishers, which are weak anyway.
Agree, we got straight-up banged on the healing skill front. Defiant stance for sure, and also Mending, which never got adjusted during the specialization patch.
Healing Signet or bust. I guess you could use “To the Limit” if you still run pure shoutbow.
I think Warrior heals need strong buffs, rather than Revenant heals needing nerfs.
Every skill looks good fired into stationary, defenseless golems.
Let’s see how well it performs in WvW with aegis getting spammed everywhere.
Topics like this are why I stay away from dungeons and anything associated with them.
Want your beloved game to thrive? Have to remove the paywall. You have any idea how many “low budget” free to play gamers are out there looking for a good pvp game who are willing to spend $50 but not much more? You realize a lot of free to play games make it a wallet fight and people who spend a few hundred get stomped on by the people spending thousands on the game….
I must call bull on this assertion. World of Warcraft still thrives, even though it continues behind a subscription. After almost 11 years, it awaits its sixth expansion pack.
EverQuest still survives, and it only offered a crippled F2P option a couple years back… after 13 years of pure subscription service.
Subscription games can and do survive and thrive, because the successful ones invest in the retention of current players and long-term customer satisfaction. These F2P business models, like GW2 has just converted into, always degenerate into troll-infested cash-grabs with B2W (buy-to-win) gameplay mechanics that encourage impulse purchases for in-game advantage.
I’m really glad I held off on pre-purchasing this expansion pack. Let’s see what happens to the game in the next few weeks when the F2P players make it to Lion’s Arch, PvP, and WvW.
What do I need to catch up on?
Surprisingly little. Although Silverwastes is fun, you didn’t miss much else.
That would be nice, especially if they up the party limit for Stronghold, which sucks as a 5v5 gametype.
You can’t give up Discipline because of Fast Hands. You can’t give up Strength because of Berserker’s Power.
I don’t see much use for Berserker in PvE, but in PvP, it might be worth swapping in. Let’s see how the next beta weekend goes.
I agree that the rifle auto-attack and weapon skills in general need a buff… better velocity, better utility, something.
The Killshot gimmick has always held rifle back, because anyone can point to that and say “look at that damage!” Despite the fact that pulling off a Killshot in real PvP too risky to have any value, and it really doesn’t add much to PvE when pulling greatsword and spamming 100b does better DPS.
Going from buy-to-play to straight free-to-play will cause some irrevocable damage… you attract a much different audience when the audience has no money invested in the game. Even a token $20 entry fee stops a lot of garbage from flowing in.
I fear for the economy if this turns out true… free core accounts will turn into horrifying inflation of basic commodities on the BLTC.
The entire game economy contains thinly veiled gambling mechanisms… most of them with horrible payouts. If not the Mystic Toilet (probably the worst, imo), you can gamble on Black Lion Chests, karma bags, and ecto vendors, and maybe more that others can think of.
Champ bags are another way to inject RNG into loot drops, and those drop exotics so rarely it’s barely worth the carpal tunnel syndrome to click through them.
If the poor payouts and tightwad RNG don’t discourage you from gambling in this game, I don’t know if anything will. I don’t buy from the BLTC because the drop rates on the RNG items are so bad that dumping the money into a slot machine would feel more productive. At least a slot machine doesn’t insult you by handing out worthless boosts all the time.
Maybe they planned a new Guild Wars 2/Taco Bell cross-promotion:
http://www.tacobell.com/static_files/TacoBell/DD/dare-devil-loaded-grillers.html
True it’s similar but since you can get controllable quickness without having to take Frenzy and as I said you got the AoE aspect which is hopefully useful in every part of the game.
Imagine using Wild Blow on a group of enemies that are reviving someone! You send them flying, then you shoot a Gun Flame into them. I really hope they don’t nerf the explosion effect too much. While it looked strong on a group of stationary golems it’ll be pretty hard to do that kind of damage against actual players.
It would actually be kind of cool to see Rifle Berserkers that can break up the current Zerg WvW mentality. When grouping up means you might be blown up it can force different tactics.
Wild Blow has some interesting implications for WvW… combined with a Gun Flame and Crack Shot piercing, you get some solid anti-zerg AoE potential.
The Dead or Alive trait looks amusing, especially when combined with Defy Pain and Endure Pain.
In theory you could max out your adrenaline, use Wild Blow, then swap and instantly use Gun Flame. if you used it on a group of enemies, the explosions will hurt them as well.
It’ll still be very gimmicky, but hopefully a bit more useable now.
That might help, although it sounds similar to the old Rifle Butt + Frenzy + Killshot combo… sounds good in theory, but difficult to actually pull off on a moving target. Wild Blow looks like it might work a bit better than Rifle Butt.