Guild Wars 2

Curiously, I took notice of this GW2 concept art from Kekai Kotaki, which seems to depict the Riven Earth Falls. Comparing maps places the falls at Jetz falls or just south of there. Of course, I went and checked, peering from as many angles as I could find, but saw no stone heads. So, either the artwork was never used and the stone heads were scrapped from the location, or those are not the same falls, and the stone heads can be found if Anet opens the zone below.

Also, the Ebonhawke weapons are quite common on npcs, for example, human renegades use them, and IIRC Faolain uses the scepter as well.

I find the sylvari to have certain uncanny, creepy features to them. For one, they always have this air of righteousnesses around them. While that might seem like a positive trait, it applies to the NC as well, the sylvari never doubt their cause, even though they can doubt their ability. If they believe something is evil or against them, they will destroy it without doubt. Another related thing is that they never experienced growing up and most are very young, so they, at least most of them, can’t understand childhood. Their world view is very different from that of humans, their perception of life and death, family, history and purpose radically different.

From that short story, I got the idea that perhaps it was an actual future she saw, her being a tool used by the Nightmare Court to take control of the Pale Tree, but she rejected that future after seeing it, as well as the tree when it tried to dissuade her from looking, not content with how insignificant she saw the other sylvari being. She rejects her sylvari origin and takes a new name, and kills her mentor, decided to carve out a path of her own, not controlled by anyone.

However, where the short story ends doesn’t match what we see in the game – something more happened between. Thorn vines are gone, and her attacks are anywhere but near the Grove and Rata Sum. “There’s something you must understand, your world is built on fog and sand”, as her poem went. The short story gives us no backstory on that line, which I find to be the most curious one.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Tuomir.1830:

1. The point? It could have been under Abaddon’s guidance that The Fury performed the rituals. Afterall, there are no traces of Titans in Underworld.
2. It still is close to the environment, but not made from the environment.
3. “Titans, ancient creatures dating back nearly as far as my own kind…” -Forgotten Warden
   “I wish to see this to its end. Over the eons, much has changed in Tyria. But not these Titans.” -Ancient Seer
   The forgotten were present in the dragon rise after which the gods settled to Arah. Unless the gods were very good at hiding from the dragons, the Titans were on Tyria before them.
4. I wrote that, yes, but would you have preferred “made what would later be known as the Foundry of Failed Creations”?

Something made Titans before the gods arrived in Tyria, and later this method was used to create an army for Abaddon. The Titans had access to magic with strong connections to the elder dragons, specifically Kralkatorrik.

1. My point is that NOTHING points to the Titans being creations of Abaddon. The fact that they’re eons old, as old as the forgotten, means that they predate Abaddon’s fall. Abaddon before his fall is described as a just and noble god. A noble god would not go about tormenting souls to make sick creations. But Dhuum? Dhuum would.
2. If you want to get technical, all titans made their bodies in the Ring of Fire after passing through the Door of Komalie. This means that either they removed their body to make new ones, or their body changed to the environment. One could just say “ArenaNet’s laziness on assets” or it could be that the environments between Ascalon (burned down, barren, sky full of ash, tar lakes, and lava coming through some cracks in select locations) and the Ring of Fire (ash-full air, burned down, barren, lava “lakes”) were close enough that the Titans didn’t need to change their bodies for xyz reason. Still, this is not the same as the Elder Dragons which cannot – not even Subject Alpha – change their body’s element.
3. However, there is still nothing to dismiss the claim that Forgotten were brought by the Six Gods (or rather, sent ahead of all six). Why could it not be possible that both Forgotten and Titans were sent by the gods (or in the later case, by Dhuum)? An alternate explanation would be that the seers saw the titans after the gods arrived and that, in the Mists, the Forgotten and Titans were created around the same time.
4. Actually, yes, because clearly your original wording caused confusion.

Nothing tells us that “something made the Titans before the gods arrived in Tyria,” – as said, the Forgotten’s origins still lie in the Mists to all of our knowledge. And so do the Six Gods’ – we cannot say which is older between the two groups (Gods or Titans/Forgotten), we can only say which arrived on the world of Tyria first – the Six Gods or Forgotten (though even that is subject to debate). The seers could have easily first saw the titans well after the Elder Dragons went to sleep and the Six Gods arrived on the world.

Just because the Titans had access to the Cauldron of Cataclysm, does not mean that they had access to Kralkatorrik’s magic. After all, it is 1) not proven (even though I think it is) that it was powered by Kralkatorrik’s magic; and 2) not proven that it was powered by said magic when the Titans gave it to the charr.

1. I never claimed he started making Titans before his fall – I was implying he had found out the method of creating them before his fall, and later had The Fury carry out this ritual to make him an army of Titans.
2. Just because Inquest hasn’t progressed as far in their studies on the dragons, doesn’t mean that whatever created the titans in the first place hadn’t. Fact is, all of the Titan types match the elder dragons.
3. That’s an interesting idea. But, again, there’s nothing that suggests Dhuum made them either, and tormenting souls to bind them into Titans is kind of like necromancy, and doesn’t fit his MO. I find it much more likely that the god of secrets would know an ancient ritual to do so.
4. Well, I suppose my original wording was confusing. Shall we now drop point 4?

Humans say the forgotten were placed on Tyria in 1769 be, but as they were present in the latest dragon rise, that seems rather impossible. They were there prior to the gods, and they say Titans are nearly as old. I find that quite clear.

“Titans had access to artifacts capable of harnessing dragon energies”, that better? The connection remains.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Tuomir.1830:

Something made Titans before the gods arrived in Tyria,

No that would be too much of an assumption. You can say that titans had existed before they were created by The Fury. But not that something made them. For all we know, they could have made themselves.

They are artificial beings, never seen formed naturally. Even if they performed the ritual themselves, something created them the ritual in the first place. And based on the dialogue of the Forgotten Warden and the Ancient Seer, that was before the gods arrived in Tyria.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Tuomir.1830:

The Titans had access to magic with strong connections to the elder dragons, specifically Kralkatorrik.

For what reason do you draw this conclusion?

This has been covered in this thread enough already. The Titans gave the searing cauldrons to the Flame Legion, so they must have had access to them.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

1. And? It’s still The Fury and not Abaddon who was making Titans.
2. No, but as I said it is ashen. And actually there are parts of it that are a bit volcanic – go to the northeast corner of the Eastern Frontier, which isn’t too far from where the Armageddon Lords appear.
3. I know what you meant but that remains unchanging the notion that nothing even implies that the Titans predate the gods in existence – let alone are tied in any way shape or form to the Elder Dragons, especially given how there isn’t a single Elder Dragon minion that even remotely resembles titans in either form or function. The line from the seer only makes mention that they are eons old – eons merely means “really old” unless used in the astrology tense (which I doubt it would be) which would be billions of years old (which not even the seers would be).
4. Then comment on something you did write: “Taking these cauldrons and magic from the dragons into his realm, he made the Foundry of Failed Creations, where he started doing what Inquest is doing now – experimenting with the dragon energy.”

1. The point? It could have been under Abaddon’s guidance that The Fury performed the rituals. Afterall, there are no traces of Titans in Underworld.
2. It still is close to the environment, but not made from the environment.
3. “Titans, ancient creatures dating back nearly as far as my own kind…” -Forgotten Warden
   “I wish to see this to its end. Over the eons, much has changed in Tyria. But not these Titans.” -Ancient Seer
   The forgotten were present in the dragon rise after which the gods settled to Arah. Unless the gods were very good at hiding from the dragons, the Titans were on Tyria before them.
4. I wrote that, yes, but would you have preferred “made what would later be known as the Foundry of Failed Creations”?

Something made Titans before the gods arrived in Tyria, and later this method was used to create an army for Abaddon. The Titans had access to magic with strong connections to the elder dragons, specifically Kralkatorrik.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

It’s actually said Malyck doesn’t have a dream when you read inbetween the lines. If you go with Caithe’s path, you find out he never forgot anything, there was just nothing to remember in the first place.

The Soundless separate themselves from the dream, partially by living away from it. Although theirs is a willing separation, Malyck could have disconnected from the dream of his tree before his awakening, as he drifted away from it in his pod.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

As to the DoD being inherent to the Pale Tree sylvari – I think it is. Otherwise, the Pale Tree would cut off the Nightmare Courtiers from the Dream of Dreams in order to slow/prevent/stop the spread of the Nightmare. The fact she doesn’t shows that she may not have that capability. Furthermore, we not once see a sylvari soul, meaning that unlike a norn there’d be no aethereal tie for a sylvari – only physical ties. Meaning that the body would retain that tie, since there’s nothing departing it (a soul) upon death. Though that’s still conjecture, there’s still no evidence to support sylvari have souls – even they themselves don’t know what happens to them upon death, in a non-physical manner.

“I do not control the Dream. I am simply its caretaker.” – Avatar of the Tree

The tree acts as a medium between it’s Dream and it’s children, the sylvari. However, that doesn’t mean it can sever the link between itself and the Nightmare Courtiers at will. But, I’m fairly sure dead sylvari don’t contribute to the Dream (the Pale Tree didn’t know about what happened to Riannoc, for example). That would suggest that the link between the sylvari and the dream breaks on death.

Besides, not having a spirit leave the body would suggest that they don’t have a connection to the mists, as other beings travel through the mists after their death, whereas sylvari may not even have a spirit or soul, and their whole essence is in their body. They could even be just extensions of the Tree, like cells in our body. That in itself could be enough to prevent them from being corrupted, not this proposed connection to the mists.

1. And so was working for Abaddon when performing the ritual for making Titans.
2. Titans appearing in Ascalon are of the fire variety, even though Ascalon isn’t volcanic. Shouldn’t they be more like Cracked Mesa are were their form made directly from the landscape?
3. Ah, thank you, that one I missed while looking into it. What I meant was “something older than the human gods on Tyria”, which, if the gods arrived after the dragon rise where the forgotten were present and the Titans date back to be as old the forgotten, makes perfect sense. If there were Titans on Tyria before the gods were present, Titans are created and are not known to occur naturally, and later they are being created in Realm of Torment, then Abaddon or Dhuum most likely learned the method of creating them from something that created them before.
4. No, I wasn’t actually thinking along those lines at all. The Foundry is where the Titans are created, using ancient dark rituals. That much is known. Regarding the Foundry, I had no intent to imply anything I didn’t write.

And believe me, I dug through those dialogues when re-evaluating my theory, I just missed the last one you linked.

The connection between a havroun and the mists may or may not sever on death, but the same applies to sylvari as well. Their connection to the Dream is not inherent, it comes from the Pale Tree, and may or may not be severed on death. And again, there is no proof that the dream holds relation besides similarity to the mists – and take into consideration that each pale tree seems to hold a dream of it’s own (“It means my fears are well founded. You were not born of the Pale Tree, Malyck. We cannot see your Dream; you cannot see ours.” -Trahearne).

Is there a reason to believe a dead sylvari would be a different case in that regard?

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Tuomir.1830:

My theory is that when the six gods lived in Arah, Abaddon was studying the elder dragons. He may have found the cauldrons, and tapped in to the power of the dragons. Taking these cauldrons and magic from the dragons into his realm, he made the Foundry of Failed Creations, where he started doing what Inquest is doing now – experimenting with the dragon energy. Somewhere between that and the events of the Guild Wars, he succeeded in creating his own minions through that study – the titans. When you look at the different kinds of titans he had, they were made of fire and stone, of ice, of flesh… now does that not seem familiar?

There’s a couple problems with your theory:

1. Indications point to the Titans being creations of Dhuum. The Fury is the one in charge of making the titans, and it is a general of Dhuum.
2. Titans are created by twisting souls. The appearance they take is based on their environment.
3. Titans are said to have existed eons ago in Tyria and are as old as the Forgotten race. This would mean that they’re older than your theory would credit them to be.
4. The Foundry of Failed Creations is called such not because of the titans, as many believe, but because it was sundered by the Fury when it broke free, twisting it into mimicries of reality but failed to make proper mimicries.

1. The Fury is in charge of creating the Titans, but it served Abaddon, and did so in Abaddon’s realm.
2. Broken spirits are a part of the ritual for making the Titans, however, we don’t know what the rest of the ritual holds. The appearance they take is based on their environment, but how are they so adaptable? Perhaps they were infused with the power of multiple elder dragons, similar to Subject Alpha.
3. I couldn’t find a mention of the age of the Titans being compared to the forgotten, the only thing was a seer telling how the Titans are the same as they were eons ago. It isn’t very specific, and Abaddon (or Dhuum, as it may be) could have learned the way of creating them from something even older. Still counts.
4. I never made an argument based on the name of the area – despite the fact that it was shaped by The Fury after it broke free, it still is where the Titans are made.

Yet Havroun Grechen was turned Risen, despite having arguably much stronger connection to the mists than a generic billy-bob-briar sylvari. Connection to the mists does not give immunity to corruption.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Tuomir.1830:

There is no indication that the Dream would be the reason the sylvari are immune to the corruption.

Actually there is. Three points:

1. Only the things tied to the Dream of Dreams (aka sylvari) have shown to be immune to corruption physically. The question really depends on if the White Stag is also immune, and if Malyck’s brethren are not.
2. The Dream of Dreams functions very much like the Mists, even the portal to the DoD in A Light in the Darkness is the same kind as the ones going into the Mists.
3. The Forgotten, which hold ties to the Mists, have magic that’s immune to corruption.

Connect the three dots and you have “things tied to the Mists may be resistant/immune to the twisting effect of draconic energies; and this includes things tied to the Dream of Dreams.”

There’s any number of dots that could be connected there. When the only example of a being incorruptible we have is the sylvari, we could take any attribute unique to them and say that’s the relevant difference. You say the Dream of Dreams functions very similarly to the mists, but it could just as well be the actual mists that you step into through that portal, and enter a reflection of the dream materialized in there, or it could be just Anet reusing assets. I find no evidence of any special relation to the mists the sylvari would have. Therefore, the only relation between the forgotten and the sylvari would be that the sylvari can’t be corrupted, and that the forgotten have magic that can’t be corrupted. And two points don’t make a trend.

BrunoBRS.5178:

Tuomir.1830:

BrunoBRS.5178:

Tuomir.1830:

BrunoBRS.5178:

none of the branded creatures, as far as i know, has the power to turn anything into other branded creatures, and the brand itself is not expanding, implying kralk is the only one that can brand stuff and burn land causing crystallic formations.

BrunoBRS.5178:

and there’s the fact that searing magic didn’t turn anyone into branded creatures either. if it was kralk’s magic that was being used, then we’d have had ascalonian branded walking around for much longer. “it wasn’t kralk himself that used his branding powers” doesn’t stick either, because as we know, none of the other dragons need to personally be the agent of corruption, as long as it’s done with their magic (with varying degrees of effort involved, but i’d imagine the power to brand the land would be more than enough)

See what I see?

first quote states that the branded creatures cannot brand the land.

you people are comparing searing cauldrons with the magic that caused the brand.

second quote addresses that by saying that if searing magic = branding magic, then there would be branded creatures.

there is no contradiction.

But it is a blatant contradiction. First you say that the branded creatures that use magic originating from the dragon do not spread corruption, and then proceed to say that using magic originating from the dragon would be impossible without causing corruption.

you’re misinterpreting me. i said:

1- the dragon does not have to be present, or an active force, for the corruption to happen, as seen with other dragons;

2- the corruption process has varying degrees of difficulty (zhaitan’s minions just need to kill someone to corrupt them, jormag needs them alive and force them through a long ritual, and the corruption takes time to happen fully). creating branded creatures is obviously something mere minions can’t do, but if someone were to replicate (or tap into) the same magic kralkatorrik used to create the brand, then the corruption would’ve been visible.

and last but not least,

3- branding magic is the only way to create branded creatures, and if the searing did not create branded creatures, then it is not branding magic. the searing and the branding have different methods and different outcomes, they just both share the theme of crystals and burning.

like i said, the brand’s process is “melt everything with magic, crystals come out of it”, while the searing’s process is “rain crystals everywhere, burn things with said crystals”. the outcome and the cause are reversed in the searing’s case. even if you believe i’m wrong regarding the corruption process and its challenges, the argument remains that the branding and the searing are two different processes, no more similar than an elementalist’s magic and primordus’ corruption.

You differ the magic used by the branded from the magic used to make the branded, but then refuse to compare the magic used by the branded to the searing magic. The branded attack by summoning crystals that explode to purple flames. The searing cauldrons summoned crystals from the sky that exploded into flames. Just because the branding and the searing are two different processes, doesn’t mean that they are the only two processes.

Besides, you are wrong about how the dragons corrupt their minions. If it was enough that the victim was just killed by risen to become risen, why would Zhaitan’s army ship dead bodies from the mainland to be made into risen? Jormag can corrupt dead as well (from one of the novels), and Uldek the Fierce, the chieftain of Agrak Kraal, was turned branded when he attempted to tame branded beasts.

BrunoBRS.5178:

Tuomir.1830:

BrunoBRS.5178:

none of the branded creatures, as far as i know, has the power to turn anything into other branded creatures, and the brand itself is not expanding, implying kralk is the only one that can brand stuff and burn land causing crystallic formations.

BrunoBRS.5178:

and there’s the fact that searing magic didn’t turn anyone into branded creatures either. if it was kralk’s magic that was being used, then we’d have had ascalonian branded walking around for much longer. “it wasn’t kralk himself that used his branding powers” doesn’t stick either, because as we know, none of the other dragons need to personally be the agent of corruption, as long as it’s done with their magic (with varying degrees of effort involved, but i’d imagine the power to brand the land would be more than enough)

See what I see?

first quote states that the branded creatures cannot brand the land.

you people are comparing searing cauldrons with the magic that caused the brand.

second quote addresses that by saying that if searing magic = branding magic, then there would be branded creatures.

there is no contradiction.

But it is a blatant contradiction. First you say that the branded creatures that use magic originating from the dragon do not spread corruption, and then proceed to say that using magic originating from the dragon would be impossible without causing corruption.

BrunoBRS.5178:

none of the branded creatures, as far as i know, has the power to turn anything into other branded creatures, and the brand itself is not expanding, implying kralk is the only one that can brand stuff and burn land causing crystallic formations.

BrunoBRS.5178:

and there’s the fact that searing magic didn’t turn anyone into branded creatures either. if it was kralk’s magic that was being used, then we’d have had ascalonian branded walking around for much longer. “it wasn’t kralk himself that used his branding powers” doesn’t stick either, because as we know, none of the other dragons need to personally be the agent of corruption, as long as it’s done with their magic (with varying degrees of effort involved, but i’d imagine the power to brand the land would be more than enough)

See what I see?

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Tuomir.1830:

When you look at the different kinds of titans he had, they were made of fire and stone, of ice, of flesh… now does that not seem familiar?

How does that make them different from elementals? Surely all those elementalists aren’t studying dragon magic to make their creations.

No, Titans are demons that form from what ever material is available. That is why the titans that emerged in Kryta were made of plants, and the titans in the foundry were made of flesh.

But that is not the carrying argument. The carrying argument is that “it is said the Cauldron’s magic was older than the Charr, older even than recorded history, and forged by ancient entities fallen into sleep and quiescence”. The Titans themselves do not fit the description comfortably (how would they even forge such things?), yet they gave the cauldrons to the Burnt warband, who used them to rain magic that was a combination of crystals and flames, and now we have flame legion using the same kind of stone shaping in their fortresses that is found all over the Dragon Brand. Add in the points Konig covered, and it all starts looking quite cohesive.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Tuomir.1830:

However, presumably no sylvari had seen Zhaitan at that point (and I don’t see how Anet could have had fitted him in there), so the fear other sylvari held, especially fear towards the dragon, manifested in a twisted dream, the nightmare hounds in the dream formed in a similar manner, though not from such specific fears.

Caithe had seen him. She was in fact the only being who saw him and lived until the Pact’s actions.

Ah, that I had missed. Still, the dream of an individual sylvari is a seemingly random collection of memories and experiences, so the chances of that one particular memory popping up are quite minimal.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Tuomir.1830:

And regarding the hounds, they too are made by the Pale Tree, it would stand to reason that they too are immune to dragon corruption in the same way. The nightmare court turns them to nightmare by putting them through pain and suffering until they embrace it, just like they do with captured sylvari.

However there’s a lot of differences between the sylvan hounds and the sylvari – sylvan hounds don’t seem to learn anything from the Dream of Dreams and may not even be tied to it (which is, IMO, why the sylvari are immune – their tie to the DoD – which means that Malyck is not immune), and they form as pups rather than full grown adults.

There is no indication that the Dream would be the reason the sylvari are immune to the corruption. But, you raise a good point about them being born as pups. For the sylvari, a childhood wasn’t necessary from the Pale Tree’s viewpoint. Why do the hounds have it? Maybe they indeed don’t learn from the Dream of Dreams, and so have to learn through growing up. Regardless, we’ve never seen sylvan hounds corrupted by the dragons, and the Nightmare Court uses the same methods of converting them than they use for converting captured sylvari.

Thalador.4218:

After witnessing the active replica of the Cauldron of Searing in the Crown Pavilion, and seeing how it emits a cone of blue light skywards (and after checking the cinematic where Burntfur activates it – a globe of blue light shoots into the sky), I’ve become more convinced of my current theory about the Cauldrons’ origins: the Giganticus Lupicus.

The Molten Berserker in Molten Facility was equipped with peculiar technology. Aside from the dredge boxing gauntlets, he looked fairly cyborgish and infused with blue light (eyes, veins, etc.) – which is strange, since Flame Legion is all about red, gold, and black (the Godforged have flaming eyes). The Risen Lupicus in Arah seems to have been a cyborg before his death and reanimation (left steel hand is grafted into flesh, and there are those metal rings strapped onto his chest and arms emitting green light/gas). Both the Berserker and the Lupicus use shadowstepping. I’m inclined to believe that the Lupicus preferred the use of cybernetic augmentation, and the color of their signature magic was blue.

And before they were wiped out, they’d forged WMDs capable of being powered up by the magic of dragons (the fact that we only see what is suspected to be Kralkatorrik’s energies could be connected to the fact that the shamans only harnessed him to charge the cauldrons up). They might’ve believed what some humans believe: that nuke works fine against any enemy, including the incomprehensibly powerful that’s threatening to eradicate your race without breaking sweat. The dragons might’ve only greatly thinned their numbers before going back to sleep, but what if it was the Lupicus’ careless use of dragon-enchanted WMDs that pushed them into extinction – corrupting and ravaging more arable, habitable land than the dragons would’ve.

That’s an interesting theory – and it actually kind of fits in with the theory of mine about the connection.

My theory is that when the six gods lived in Arah, Abaddon was studying the elder dragons. He may have found the cauldrons, and tapped in to the power of the dragons. Taking these cauldrons and magic from the dragons into his realm, he made the Foundry of Failed Creations, where he started doing what Inquest is doing now – experimenting with the dragon energy. Somewhere between that and the events of the Guild Wars, he succeeded in creating his own minions through that study – the titans. When you look at the different kinds of titans he had, they were made of fire and stone, of ice, of flesh… now does that not seem familiar?

Given that they’ve been on the ground for a few hundred years gathering dust and dirt, and that their source, if related, was likely altered from the original magic of Kralkatorrik, I don’t find them too different.
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/1/1b/Tail_of_the_Star_God.jpg

Also, I find it noteworthy that all the Flame Legion structures are practically identical to the spiked ground of the Dragon Brand, only differing in color.

BrunoBRS.5178:

Tuomir.1830:

If the searing magic is related to Kralkatorrik, that’d make a connection between the titans and the elder dragons… which would mean that the god of secrets would have had at least some level of knowledge about the elder dragons, which actually seems pretty reasonable. That could also potentially make titans relevant to the current story, meaning we might not have seen the last of them.

…However, that only works if searing magic is related to Kralkatorrik (or any other elder dragon, for that matter) at all.

i think people cling too much to the fact that both kralk and the titans (or rather, the searing cauldrons) burn stuff up with crystals. that’s like saying eles tap into primordus’ power when they use lava font, or that necros are disciples of zhaitan.

I’m not saying they are necessarily related, but it’s a possibility. It’s not just the crystals, either.

“When the Charr next struck against Ascalon, it was with all the fury of destiny denied. With a magic item known as the Cauldron of Cataclysm, the Shamans called forth the magic of the Titans and performed the Ritual of the Searing. It is said the Cauldron’s magic was older than the Charr, older even than recorded history, and forged by ancient entities fallen into sleep and quiescence.”

-The Ecology of the Charr

If the searing magic is related to Kralkatorrik, that’d make a connection between the titans and the elder dragons… which would mean that the god of secrets would have had at least some level of knowledge about the elder dragons, which actually seems pretty reasonable. That could also potentially make titans relevant to the current story, meaning we might not have seen the last of them.

…However, that only works if searing magic is related to Kralkatorrik (or any other elder dragon, for that matter) at all.

Just because it happened in Orr doesn’t mean it had to have something to do with Zhaitan, much less make Faolain risen. Nightmare court are quite visibly not risen, not in body nor mind.

And about the dragon in the dream, the dream is a collection of the memories and experiences of other sylvari, that’s why there were those risen and such present. However, presumably no sylvari had seen Zhaitan at that point (and I don’t see how Anet could have had fitted him in there), so the fear other sylvari held, especially fear towards the dragon, manifested in a twisted dream, the nightmare hounds in the dream formed in a similar manner, though not from such specific fears.

And regarding the hounds, they too are made by the Pale Tree, it would stand to reason that they too are immune to dragon corruption in the same way. The nightmare court turns them to nightmare by putting them through pain and suffering until they embrace it, just like they do with captured sylvari.

Andele.1306:

Kirschwasser.3972:

That’s actually fascinating information. Aren’t there instances where there’s water in a map at a certain level, but also open spaces at that level?

In general any of the human/krytan zones you get multiple water bodies, all on the same level no matter how far away from eachother.
The three real exceptions to the “all water at the same level” is in the sylvari starting zone (the JP with the orb), the unfinished JP and the Chaos Crystal Caverns (all of them that could technically be a zone under the actual zone/fake instance because of the mechanic how you get in).

The unfinished JP is actually just above the water level, the ground above it is quite high, and to reach Spelunker’s Delve, you swim through an underwater tunnel to an area under a border mountain. Both use the same water level.

I find the fact that pretty much everyone holds the greatsword behind their torso ridiculous. But, I guess someone at Anet thinks it looks cool…

DarcShriek.5829:

Tuomir.1830:

Not all non-nightmare sylvari are goody good two shoes, just look at Canach. The dream doesn’t control the sylvari, so nothing stops one from going power mad, crazy or Disney villain.

But there are reasons behind his actions. He’s sort of an unwitting villian. Scarlet, on the other had, seems to have an all out crush against Jenna and Divinity’s reach. She’s also had time to organize and gather resources. That’s an awful lot to accomplish even for a first born.

Also, Sylvari seem rather aloof to the affairs of others. Not really goody two shoes, for the most part they just don’t care if it doesn’t threaten them. Dragon’s threaten them, so they care.

My point was that it isn’t so strange for the mysterious stranger to be a sylvari, when some were ready to question if she even was a sylvari…

Not all non-nightmare sylvari are goody good two shoes, just look at Canach. The dream doesn’t control the sylvari, so nothing stops one from going power mad, crazy or Disney villain.

When you are in combat, you can’t just run silly. You have to pay attention to your posture and balance, even when moving. You can’t really keep up a full-speed sprint while fighting.

The mysterious stranger, who I assume to be Scarlet, had a perfect opportunity to assassinate Jennah and get away, but she didn’t. So, we can assume that’s not her plan – at least not yet.

Meta events are nice. They tell a story, chain together events and usually lead to grand battles. However, I find them to be rather linear in most cases. Usually, it’s either just a linear, one direction chain of events, or a tug of war. What I’m suggesting is adding side events that alter the main events in the chain. Let’s take “Assault on Ascalon Settlement” for an example. It’s a rather interesting event chain, but most events are rather irrelevant. So, what would I do to it?

Let’s say Nebo Terrace is safe and centaurs are rebuilding their forces. Now, two side events spawn in the area – one, an architect has been captured by the centaurs, and must be freed and escorted to Nebo Terrace, and two, a supply caravan must be escorted to Nebo Terrace. These side events wouldn’t show on the meta event header, but if both would be completed, another event would begin, where the players would use the supplies to build defenses in the town.These defenses would last, and would make defending the town easier.

And to take it further, add additional goals to the events that change the outcome of the event. For example, when the centaurs attack Nebo Terrace, a chieftain is with them. If the chieftain is killed before the centaurs retreat, this starts another event where the Seraph take the chance to go on an offensive against the centaurs.

Still want to take it up a notch? Long lasting results. Let’s actually have events change the zone for a long time. If the players successfully push out the centaurs and take the Blood Hills Camps, they stay out for several days. During this time, the meta event is replaced by one that focuses on rebuilding the area and keeping it safe. Once the “Safe time” is over, centaurs start attacking again, and if events are failed in succession, they can take the area back.

Still want more? If the centaurs are possessing both Nebo Terrace and Ascalon Settlement, why should they just stand there, complacent in their victory? They should continue, send forces against the Lionguard fort, burn down Cornucopian Fields, and attack the Almuten Estates.

Of course, doing all this is a lot of work, considering the amount of meta events around. However, it would make the world feel more alive, and deliver some of the promises we were given.

TA armor should also glow when worn by sylvari – I mean, it already takes color from sylvari skin, why doesn’t it glow?

I suppose you are right. It’s just that this is a theory pops up every now and then, with nothing new to it. Still, I apologize for my harsh tone.

There will be pretty trees, too. Trahearne likes pretty trees.

I’d like it quite a bit, if it wasn’t for the wings. They kinda ruin the flamboyant pretty boy look. 6/10.

And here’s my ranger.

Sylv.5324:

25 years ago, not 225.

Reading comprehension, is it that hard? The seed for the pale tree was planted about 250 years ago, and the sylvari firstborn awakened about 25 years ago. 250 – 25 is 225.

Other trees – Malyck

Not corruptible – dragon minions can be corrupted, see Kudu’s Monster, [url=http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Subject_Alpha[/url].

The human gods have no known relation to the elder dragons, that’s all conjecture based on speculation and doesn’t hold up.

The Tablet of Ventari has no relation to the elder dragons, either, it is a stone tablet that an old centaur outcast carved his philosophy on. What makes you think it would have the power to remove elder dragon corruption? Again, nothing backs that up, it’s more fanfic than theory.

The sylvari awoke some 225 years after the seed for the Pale Seed was planted. It doesn’t match the first dragon awakening, nor the latest. If Mordremoth matches the awakening rhythm of the other dragons, that won’t be in give or take 50 years. We know that there are other trees, we have no idea if the awakening of their firstborn matches any dragon awakening.

This theory has nothing in it, and I hope this is the last thread made about it.

I find the stance where the character holds a greatsword behind his or her body ridiculous and unbelievable, and after asking around, I’m not alone with this opinion. At least change that to a more reasonable stance, where the weapon is held at the very least between the wielder and the target!

Zayd Akira.1942:

Tuomir.1830:

But there’s absolutely nothing to back that theory. It’s just baseless speculation.

Mordremoth is pretty proven, there’s lots of evidence that shows that he exists.

Everything else fits so perfectly in the gaping hole that is the sylvari origin, there’s nothing that shows it could be real but there’s nothing that shows it isn’t either., hence why its a theory :P

I’m not doubting the existence of Mordremoth. I’m just saying that the theory that links him to sylvari is bogus.

Zayd Akira.1942:

Tuomir.1830:

Zayd Akira.1942:

VitalSuit.1980:

The thing about Glint is that the Forgotten used a special ritual to cleanse her corruption (which is proven in Arah path 3 when you cleanse an undead chicken’s corruption from Zhaitan and it becomes friendly). Ventari’s tablet was just sitting there. It’s not like the Sylvari woke up, read it and said “wow I’m not working for Modremoth anymore”. There would have to be a hell of a lore more than that to break a dragon’s corruption.

I’d say, think of it much in the way animals can be raised. On one hand you have the dog that gets plopped down in a great home with loving owners that treat it kindly, and are kindly to each other. That dog has better chances of also being a kindly dog, where as a different dog that was left all alone while it was growing up would be more wary of people, more feral, and possibly dangerous.

The pale tree able to sit and watch humans and centaurs getting along with each other and was shown that peace between long fought enemies could exist may have been enough to turn the pale tree from Mordremoth’s side. Glynt was branded, thus could have been directly controlled or influenced by Kralkatorrik, while the pale tree was just a mere creation, and might have a bit more free will, but that might not be the case, seeing as primordius’s creations all seem one-track-minded on destruction so you do have a point but that’s just one unanswerable question in a bundle of dots that all seem to connect without any counter-issues what-so-ever.

The Sylvari like to believe that the pale tree was created by Tyria (the planet) its self as a defense mechanism against the dragons, but i feel like this is kind of a crappy explanation for the appearance of an entire race of peoples, and them having come from the nature-themed elder dragon makes a ton more sense than the planet itself creating its own races.

It just doesn’t work like that. The Great Destroyer was hell bent on clearing out everything under Tyria’s surface in preparation for Primordus to wake, and Svanir went feral the moment he was corrupted.

Tai Kratos.3247:

Another interesting thing to note is that the other trees that Modremoth creates might give birth to minions that are nothing like the Sylvari, seeing as the Sylvari were shaped by the mind of the Pale Tree to appear like humans, both male and female. So chances are, other minions of Modremoth will not be humanoid.

See Malyck.

Ventari’s Tablet itself could be the source of the Pale Trees cleansing and what frees it from Mordremoths control/corruption, much in the fashion of the ritual that was done to free glynt from Kralkkie. It kinda does just work like that. We already know that the true belief and goal of the Nightmare Court is to remove/destroy the tablet, believing that suddenly this will make the pale tree start doing more nightmare court approved activities.

Also, Malyk doesn’t know where he came from, And as he said before, he doesn’t remember being birthed from a pod, he simply remembers waking up under a bridge by a river bank. It’s proven he doesn’t come from the pale tree, but that’s about it. He could still have been from a mordremoth influenced tree and just fell and hit his head which gave him amnesia. This is what trahearne first thought had happened to Malyk in the first place!

Oh please. You think growing next to the philosophical scriptures of an old centaur outcast equals an ancient cleansing ritual by the forgotten?

And did you even read what I was answering to with Malyck? Tai Kratos was suggesting that other pale trees would make minions that wouldn’t be humanoid, because the Pale Tree shaped sylvari after humans. The existence of Malyck disproves this outright. Also, the Pale Tree also makes the fern hounds, further invalidating that theory.

A theory with nothing to back is not a theory. It’s the same as if you seriously presented a theory that there is a kitten base on the dark side of the moon.

Wealth Concentration can cause price rise for high end rare items with higher demand than supply. If the market for such items becomes accessible only for the rich part of the playerbase, then the prices will follow the paying capacity of those with enough wealth to take part in that market. However, preventing resale of goods is not the way to combat this issue.

Cloud.7613:

Tuomir.1830:

And I’m saying it bothers me to see tasteless things in a game I enjoy the style of.

I’ll usually be with you when it comes to this, but in this case I will not. You act like GW2 doesn’t already have side cleavage and It even has under boob, what is more tasteless then that? In all my time of playing Aion I have never seen THAT.

There are some controversial sets, though I find them still for the most parts to be more tactful. The thing that bothers me the most about those sets is actually that the male version is very much lacking by comparison.

The underboob is a bit over the line, I agree.

nica.5829:

Tuomir.1830:

nica.5829:

TheKillerAngel.3596:

My sense is that you’re looking for armor sets that look like this:

http://na.aiononline.com/media/uploads/images/wallpaper/full-size/Elyos-Gladiator-1024x768.jpg
http://www.daevasreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/3-5_concept_armor01.jpg (Also from Aion)
http://www.daevasreport.com/images/multimedia/wallpapers/2-7_wallpaper_templar.jpg

If that’s the case, ArenaNet could consider dragging more of NCSoft’s Korean artists stateside. As a general difference between the aesthetics of Western vs. Eastern MMOs, Asian artists often go for a more refined look for armors and emphasize style over function.

This post has examples of armour that represent the look I am after. I especially love the 3rd one, it’s fully covering plate but really gorgeous and elegant. I think this style would not look out of place in gw2.

To me, all but the armor in the third image look tacky and tasteless. See, opinions can differ. Can you say that yours is objectively better than mine?

Yes but there is already armour to your taste in the game, there really isn’t much choice for people like me. THAT is the point of this thread. I am not arguing that everyone should like what I like. I just want choices of armour for people with similar tastes to mine to use. If they added 1 pair of heavy boots with a slight heel and elegant looking, I bet you would start to see 50% of the playerbase using them, at the very least. But at the moment we do not have that choice.

And I’m saying it bothers me to see tasteless things in a game I enjoy the style of.

nica.5829:

TheKillerAngel.3596:

My sense is that you’re looking for armor sets that look like this:

http://na.aiononline.com/media/uploads/images/wallpaper/full-size/Elyos-Gladiator-1024x768.jpg
http://www.daevasreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/3-5_concept_armor01.jpg (Also from Aion)
http://www.daevasreport.com/images/multimedia/wallpapers/2-7_wallpaper_templar.jpg

If that’s the case, ArenaNet could consider dragging more of NCSoft’s Korean artists stateside. As a general difference between the aesthetics of Western vs. Eastern MMOs, Asian artists often go for a more refined look for armors and emphasize style over function.

This post has examples of armour that represent the look I am after. I especially love the 3rd one, it’s fully covering plate but really gorgeous and elegant. I think this style would not look out of place in gw2.

To me, all but the armor in the third image look tacky and tasteless. See, opinions can differ. Can you say that yours is objectively better than mine?

But there’s absolutely nothing to back that theory. It’s just baseless speculation.

You can make soulbound items account bound with transmutation stones.

I like the old school rogue look you’ve got there, but the wings kinda ruin it. 5/10.

And here’s my engineer.

smeen.4237:

Maybe when the Sylvari ‘mature’ they turn into trees themselves and spawn their own children. (Speculation, don’t take this seriously please.)

Nope. The Pale Tree grew from a seed Ronan found in a cave. Unless, of course, you are suggesting Sylvari become seeds as they mature.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

The idea of new dragons forming upon the death of another does present something interesting. Remember Arah jotun path? At the end you see the formation of a new star and it’s said it signals the awakening of a dragon – odd that one would awaken after Zhaitan’s death even though 50-ish years haven’t passed since Kralkatorrik’s awakening. What if instead it signaled the birth of a new Elder Dragon? One to replace Zhaitan.

Interesting thought, but Priory researchers looking into Jotun stelae speak of 6 against 5. Also, Primordus stirred about 50 years prior to it’s awakening, it could be a common thing for them to take more or less 50 years to wake up.

Zayd Akira.1942:

VitalSuit.1980:

The thing about Glint is that the Forgotten used a special ritual to cleanse her corruption (which is proven in Arah path 3 when you cleanse an undead chicken’s corruption from Zhaitan and it becomes friendly). Ventari’s tablet was just sitting there. It’s not like the Sylvari woke up, read it and said “wow I’m not working for Modremoth anymore”. There would have to be a hell of a lore more than that to break a dragon’s corruption.

I’d say, think of it much in the way animals can be raised. On one hand you have the dog that gets plopped down in a great home with loving owners that treat it kindly, and are kindly to each other. That dog has better chances of also being a kindly dog, where as a different dog that was left all alone while it was growing up would be more wary of people, more feral, and possibly dangerous.

The pale tree able to sit and watch humans and centaurs getting along with each other and was shown that peace between long fought enemies could exist may have been enough to turn the pale tree from Mordremoth’s side. Glynt was branded, thus could have been directly controlled or influenced by Kralkatorrik, while the pale tree was just a mere creation, and might have a bit more free will, but that might not be the case, seeing as primordius’s creations all seem one-track-minded on destruction so you do have a point but that’s just one unanswerable question in a bundle of dots that all seem to connect without any counter-issues what-so-ever.

The Sylvari like to believe that the pale tree was created by Tyria (the planet) its self as a defense mechanism against the dragons, but i feel like this is kind of a crappy explanation for the appearance of an entire race of peoples, and them having come from the nature-themed elder dragon makes a ton more sense than the planet itself creating its own races.

It just doesn’t work like that. The Great Destroyer was hell bent on clearing out everything under Tyria’s surface in preparation for Primordus to wake, and Svanir went feral the moment he was corrupted.

Tai Kratos.3247:

Another interesting thing to note is that the other trees that Modremoth creates might give birth to minions that are nothing like the Sylvari, seeing as the Sylvari were shaped by the mind of the Pale Tree to appear like humans, both male and female. So chances are, other minions of Modremoth will not be humanoid.

See Malyck.