Guild Wars 2

The problem is with not reading and opening multiple threads with the same theme or related the forum is getting unclear for me as a veteran reader and poster to get infos or anything else.
And nevertheless you could have asked your question about an official dev in the other thread, which I highly doubt you get only by request because I know about this in the past (it’s just by chance if somebody will answer here or not), to fill that thread and bring it to a certain amount of post or at least on top of the forum.

aelfwe.4239:

Official Source pls.
…
In that case they’ll should say “we plan to keep releasing raid but after pof release without a specific eta”, it would be enough for me

Several reddit answers of devs and here in the forum. Look for yourself, I’m not your mommy.

And no, I’ll still answer in post where I want to. I’ve also not acted like a mod, I just gave the advice to use the Code of Conduct and know forum etiquette. You can’t blame me for that.

I’m quite sure you won’t get an official statement. If someone of them feels to tell us something they will but it’s rare.
We know for sure that there will be raids in the future but not with this expansion. They will add them when they are ready that’s what they’ve said in the past.

And in the end you know why I posted that link: There already is a thread asking about that. No need to open another one. Next time look around and bump the ones you think they have need for.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/new-expansion-has-no-raid/

lagrangewei.8516:

Beorn Raukar.4328:

And people are doing 4 man matthias while this guys complains

you confused premade and pug. will you do a 4 man matt with pug?

Doesn’t matter, you need to make the right conclusion out of it:
If 4 players can kill a difficult boss there is very much room for 10 men because you have 2.5 times more players. For example you can choose for a third healer and still should be able to have more dps or the ability to kill it.

Oh hi, bai long, long time no see.

It’s still the issue of your first day:
It’s only you that prevents you from succeeding raids. Interesting that it’s still a thing since months.

Mayn things have already been said in this thread but I’d like to add some more:

1. You can be full nomad in raids but you don’t need 10 players in this gear. It’s the same for other MMOs and don’t lie about it, you don’t have a full team of tanks or healers in WoW or FFXIV!

2. If you are full nomads, you are the tank on certain bosses. That’s ok for sure.

3. You need to find people to play with that will only work in a static because the gear stats nomads itself is not very good. But since players can kill certain bosses solo, 3 man, 4 man and even normal groups can low man (7-9 players) you would be no harm for those.
Pugging won’t work due to the reason above: Nomad gear is more than suboptimal. It’s more like a troll build.

Yeah, you told us of staying alive all the time in instances like fractals or dungeons. But hey, everybody can in nomads. You literally can’t die in such gear – I personally already can’t die in Soldier’s gear!
Jus think about it: If everybody is wearing nomads who will die? Yes, nobody and then content isn’t challenging at all if you know all puzzles.

At last I’ll give you an advice for pugging:
Try to equip a druid with magi gear + add some nomad/ministrel trinkets or just build it around 1.4k toughness with the flexibility of adding more. Ask your chronotank at VG, Gorseval, KC, Xera and Deimos about their toughness and go just a little bit lower than them because these are the bosses where the one with the highest toughness will be the tank. For the other 8(!!!) bosses your toughness is irrelevant as healer and you can push it up like there’s no morning. For pugs it doesn’t matter if you are doing 1k or 3k dps as druid.
If you aren’t willing to do even that, sorry but raids really aren’t for you.
Over the last months I’ve seen many many many players completing their legendary armor collection and hell, there were players that were not good at their classes, just decent. And they’ve all played in meta gear here and there although they didn’t really liked it at first.

So yeah, it’s on you. It’s only your attitude. Change it and you will see that so much more is possible for you.
The druid can be your solution to that. I personally know many of such players and they’re always the last ones dying at an encounter together with the chronotank.

zealex.9410:

I dont believe a boss to boss to boss design should be connected this heavily with raids. Its a diff format from the existing one thats just it. You think anet cant make traditionaly designed fractal a stepping stone to raids?

Don’t know why you – again – quote my post and start to argue about things I haven’t said or intended. It’s better if you don’t quote them in the future until you have understood what I was referring to.

1. In this case the forist wrote it’s a shift into mini raids.
2. I agreed
3. I showed him a quote that Anet has “absolutely space for more traditional fractals in the future.”
4. So, it’s possible that we won’t get a mini raid the next time or later.

I’ll add that the actual Swamp revamp with the final boss fight already is enough to be a stepping stone into raids. Anet was using the term “stepping stone into raids” exactly for this specific revamp.
So yeah, if you can handle bloomhunger you will be able to handle the easier raid encounters like Escort, Mursaat Overseer, Cairn, VG, Trio and Samarog.
Don’t come up that harder ones were needed to be a stepping stone for raids.
And before you don’t understand again: I have nothing against the difficulty of the new fractal or the CM and already did it by myself. I’m just stating that it’s a lie that this fractal is a must to bring people into raids. If you could handle the older ones well you were already able to raid successfully.

According to the wiki you should get them from the recommended dailies but pay attention: NOT from the tier 1-4 daily chests:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fractal_Research_Page

All in all you can get 5 per day:
- 1 from the Daily Recommended Fractals, scales 1-19
- 1 from the Daily Recommended Fractals, scales 21-40.
- 1 from the Daily Recommended Fractals, scales 51-75.
- 1 from Daily completion of Nightmare Fractal Challenge Mote (once per day)
- 1 from Daily completion of Shattered Observatory Challenge Mote (once per day)

They are guaranteed so if you don’t get them on your journey today/tomorrow maybe it’s bugged and you should contact the support.

Silmar Alech.4305:

The problem with the special action (key) is, that when you first encounter a new action, you don’t know what will happen if you use it. You try to find and move the tiny mouse over it, while in fight, and try to read the popup with the description.

Half way through the reading, you die. Then the special action vanished, and you were not able to figure out what it does. Then you retry the fight, and the same thing may happen again before you fully understand what the key will do.

That’s not a good method to teach players new action key actions. It produces frustration, because you die and lose the fight while you simply try to read a description.

It’s the same with all these tiny buff and debuff signs on my and my enemy’s bar, especially with the special buffs that are added just for that special fight you never encountered before. Constantly adding and expiring the signs, never able to hold the mouse over it long enough to fully read the popups.

While I agree to a certain point we have to admit that the special action key in the new fractal is introduced to us before we even meet an encounter. So, the time is there to read the complete description for a proper usage afterwards.

Makai.3429:

Maybe in 2012. Fractals are now mini-raids.

That may be true for 99 & 100 + their respective CMs but overall it’s not yet. Fortunately, Anet stated that they will bring out different fractals in the future and not only boss-to-boss-to-boss ones:

Benjamin Arnold.3457:

There’s absolutely space for more traditional fractals in the future.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Shattered-Observatory-Feedback/first#post6659295

narcx.3570:

Except when you’re doing it on t4, because the platform shrinks, so he’s always teleporting to a spot where he can no longer be melee’d. Even if you’re ranged tho, all of the tile destruction mechanics/lightning strikes now appear in a cone in front of him (since there are no back or sides to attack from), effectively making him unattackable for long periods of time.

He can be melee’d there. I did it yesterday and he wasn’t outside of the platform for us only when tiles disappear for some seconds but afterwards you can go back again and continue to melee.

I still don’t understand the issue at this boss for players.
First rule is: Don’t run around like chicken – Stand still!
If there are blinking tiles, don’t move asap, wait 1-2 seconds and go slowly onto the adjacent tile.
With running around you just make things worse and harder.

So, I don’t see that this teleportation will make the anomaly harder for pugs because they already range it from distance while running around headlessly.

maxwelgm.4315:

The whole kitten game is based on pugging LFG or joining randoms in maps to do events, why the kitten would you break with expectations so abruptly? And then again, the encounters are not hard enough to actually make that claim valid: raids can and I would even say should be pugged by many.

They break up with expectations abruptly because this specific side content or call it niche is not meant for the majority of the playerbase.
It’s design intention was for players wanting the extra challenge. Difficult content that cannot be done pressing 11111 as long as people don’t realize and accept it they are walking the wrong path. 99% of the rest of the game is easy, easy puggable and can be done without effort and organisation. Give the 1% to players who love the challenge, love the team play and love the whole dedication you have to bring to raids.

therapite.3645:

Sure but there’s a difference between ‘use the mechanic you learned’ and ‘try to use the mechanic you learned and have it not work the way it’s intended’ which is what Maethor seems to be saying. Our group tried it and had the spheres in front of us, hit them, and had them literally end up behind us instead, or had 3 spheres attach to one person and be unable to get them off at all.

Your condescending tone isn’t helpful either, js.

I don’t know if it is intentional to get more than one bloom during the phase or not. But nevertheless I haven’t seen them bugged and I’ve played the fractal a lot now since release, especially the last boss.
And I can tell you, whenever this phase failed there were people in my groups (pugs but also know players with me in ts) hitting the bloom like there’s no morning with autoattack right after they spawned (Hello, staff tempests with air attunement!).
The key here is to be patient. Don’t hit the bloom until you are in the corner in front of the generator. It will join your place and you need 1 single autoattack to push it into it for the explosion.
If you have 2 blooms connected, do the thing once while ignoring the other one and afterwards run to the next corner.
It’s the same mechanic for 25, 50, 75, 100 and CM.
As said above for me it’s absolutely a player issue in the first place – not surprising because this is new content, so I won’t blame them – just execute it like I described and you shouldn’t have any problems, especially not at level 25. You don’t wipe there if all blooms will explode and you’ll get another 4 blooms.
Plus: Tell you staff tempests to not use air attunement during this phase. I don’t know if the blooms “soak up” the bounce but if not you can really have a problem because air autoattacks will bounce between targets – often seen by unexperienced players at KC (raid boss) during the orb phase while they push it out of the area failing to close all rifts then.

TexZero.7910:

It’s also like, they dont remember the very same mechanic is learned in the first fight /shrug.

It’s different because you just have to hit the orb away from your group and nothing else. You can still stack together and dps the boss while hit the bloom once in a while to keep it on the edge.
I can understand that people have issues with that even on fractal 25 because they are nervous or panic out due to the floor timer instead of going slowly to the corner first because there is enough time to handle it.

The solar bloom thing on the final boss is very easy:
1. Don’t hit/autoattack them at first
2. Go to the corner next to the generator you want to blow up with your bloom
3. Wait until the bloom has followed to your position as it will move alone without any help or hits at all
4. Take one step back (not a big one, just a little [tap s once or twice]) so that the orb is between you and the generator.
5. Autoattack/Push the orb into/next to the generator
6. Done

Problem most people have: They ignore 1. and hit like stupid as soon as the orbs spawn and then rage/cry about that the orbs are not handling well and everything is bugged. ^^

Zaxares.5419:

Wait, so to get this new cat (where IS he anyway? I didn’t see him at all during my run through Shattered yesterday), you have to feed him all of the above foods AND the Unstable Cosmic Essence? Or have I misunderstood?

As far as I know, yes. A golden fractal relic and the unstable cosmic essence.

Look precisely there are different threads with different opinions already.

But understood, you are such a special one that your opinion is more valuable than of everyone else. ^^

It’s not like there are already some threads about this specific theme.

@Moderators:
Can you merge threads? Ty.

TexZero.7910:

Again i stand by my words.

If people cannot/will not learn mechanics, they should go down a tier. This still applies for T1 as it seems 99% of the problems are people thinking they can just afk and press 1. If that’s what you want to do drop down to open world bosses.

While I agree to to people should learning mechanics it’s just the hp of level 25 that is a bit overtuned compared to the others. The difficulty at every level is ok and the time to react to indicators on level 25 is high enough.
Of course, it doesn’t affect me due to not playing 25 regularly, we just tested this one on release day, but T1 is an introduction to fractals and could possibly scare them off. ^^

CptAurellian.9537:

Also, please keep those “random guy is stupid, group wipes” mechanics out of normal modes. That’s fine for raids and challenge modes, but there are too many stupid people around for normal fractals.

Yeah, that’s the biggest issue I have regarding this fractal. In every other fractal (normal mode) it’s possible to carry bad apples with a little bit of more effort on your own gameplay. For the new fractal such players will easily be able to wipe your group (for example orb phase or skull mechanic) and you can’t do anything besides kicking that I personally don’t like because fractals are a daily routine and every level should be doable with “not so good players”. But time will tell, in an organized group 100 already is a breeze.

Excellent written, Chaos. You nailed it!

zealex.9410:

Was there like a dev interview that stated that boss to boss fractals would not be a thing?

Have I said that devs said there wouldn’t be a boss fractal? Definitely not, again you are coming up with things people haven’t written in the slightest.
Read – Understand – Make a first post – Check reference – Check spelling – Post it (- maybe Edit)

zealex.9410:

Or boss to boss content out side of raids for that matter? Even in raids only 1 wing can be considered a boss to boss type of raid. The vast majortiy of fractals has 1 or 2 bosses and at least 1 event type ecnounter.

And there are others, for example Aetherblades, Cliffside & Thaumanova that are completely different from Nightmare & SO. There is no problem of having 1 or 2 bosses but having boss-to-boss-to-boss fractals only like the dev process has shown us from Chaos to Nightmare to SO now is boring and an evolution that I personally don’t like. You don’t have to have the same opinion and you also don’t have to comment on my personal impressions/feelings because you won’t change them with arguments. It’s like saying that I have to love a skin I don’t like because you find it’s amazing.

zealex.9410:

I dont see how adding new stuff like nightmare and the new fractal will ruin fractals overall just because the aproach is diff. I mean in the en fractals are quite unpredictable with what we will get. And i dont think this means that we are done with the old style of fractals.

Event when reworking old fractals they made sure they retained their original concept ( cliffside, snowblind and thaumanova so far are quite true to what they were)

Who said it will ruin fractals? Please do me a simple favor: Don’t comment or quote my posts if you do not read properly or at least don’t write counter arguments to things I haven’t even mentioned. Thank you.

zealex.9410:

You dont really need shadowstep and prtal these just make it easier. The movements of the orb are set everytime and the special action key resets everytime you get hit by the orb so :/

Yeah, I noticed the mechanic on the 2nd boss and not earlier but it’s still a bit tricky to get the jumps right.

Faaris.8013:

Not sure it’s possible here, just remember that phase where they introduce the ball mechanics and you need people on the cliffs and on the platform to cover all spots.

At least this mechanic can be duoed like we did yesterday. I believe it could be soloed by players with dedication and tricks like portals or shadow steps.

I support you guys. Exactly the same thoughts I have in mind when looking at the new fractal.
As a stand-alone it looks pretty amazing in terms of design & mechanics but sadly it doesn’t really fit into the fractal generation.

Solitude.2097:

The same argument existed in Dungeons + Fractals , where all the LFG lists had the same comment : ‘’only 80 , berseker , 8k achiv , food’’ and on the forums ppl where saying ‘’you know you can make your own casual lfg and take your time ’’
or ‘’the community uses Bersekers , because they want to clear it as fast as pisible , rather than wasting 2 hours’’

But what happend when they reduced the gold from dungeons and made Raids most rewarding content , compared to Fractals ?
In a magical way , without those L33T players the ’’Istanced’’ community became more friendly from the gear you wear , or how many times your head face the ground .
While the Raid community …. well …. lets say its summer atm and we dont know how may are playing it ….

Simply by reducing the gold rewards+Errage from HoT and keeping the same ammount+mechanic for the next expanion Raid , will do the trick .
Casuals will infest the HoT , and its their job to learn the mechanics without to worry is some1 L33T players is trigger happy to /kick them .
Or they reduce their shyness , from joining any Raids in the future expanion (dont believe so – now its 5% :P)

I still haven’t understood your point on the whole thing. Where do you see a problem at the moment?
Too few people playing raids? That’s not the case. Raids are well visited by the target audience. Anet is also very pleased about the current situation and finally with the introduction of legendary armor there was a new huge influx of players that got into raids for the first time. I escorted several of them and they were surprised how easy raiding can be if everybody is working for the team and knows his class and what to do where
Additionally, there are many initiatives beginners can choose to start raiding. Of course, it’s not the easiest thing for people with family duties or people in shift work. But hey, that’s the usual thing because this here is a game and should always be inferior to real life.

No, you’re wrong in so many points.

zealex.9410:

I dont think all the fractals they made so far or reworked could justify as stepping stones.
I the last 2 sure they are a pretty kitten big stepping stone but chaos , snowblind, Arcdivider and thaumanova. I dont believe could prepare you for your first raid run. (prob thaumanova if you diside to dps check the ouze without killing adds). Bot other than that most fractals got mechanics that they lacked in the first place.

The hardest ones are. You would know it if you would have followed their statements, like for example the ones to Swamp revamp.
We don’t speak about the easy ones, please at least start thinking.

zealex.9410:

Im not a native speaker so i might as well not understanding it in the correct way. But i believe the cm’s or at least imo were made to please the demographic that wants 5 man raids. I don believe these will teach you how to raid because they are too hard for that and with the tiered nature of fractals it makes sense they would like to take that to an extreme.

And again, you haven’t either read or understood my comment. I haven’t said anything against the CM. Please read properly and if you don’t get it, read again or look for someone to help you understanding.

zealex.9410:

Now not sure what you are refering when saying old fractals i guess you mean urban? (Since i dont remember the old arcdivider fractal) But id say the new fractal isnt nececeraly a boss to boss to boss type of fractal. You get the interesting isntances with adds and traveling acros from island to island which break the ssomewhat monotonous boss to boss to boss wmindset w4 had.

Not rly, it’s the exact thing you mentioned, a boss to boss instance with 0 to little interlude.

zealex.9410:

As for reminding of dungeons sorry my friend but fractals could never do that dungeons were designed differently and through some mistakes that happened came to be this way fractals had a strong focus on tightness taking away freedom of roaming and doing your thing while ppl would low man the boss.

Again, you haven’t understood/read properly. Look at the old fractals and then look at the new ones. It’s no science to notice that we have “usual” fractals except the older boss fractals like Mai & Molten Boss and with Chaos, Nightmare + the new one boss-to-boss-to-boss-fractals.
While I like Nightmare and I’m ok with Chaos although it’s only decent designed the direction is clear because it’s the same stuff over the last new inventions and that’s a sad and boring thing. Aetherblades and Underground show that it’s possible to make it different + not having heavy mechanic-focussed bossfights.

The usual fractals, at least the harder ones, not all should serve as a “stepping stone” into raids what has been said from Anet!
I think it’s ok to exclude CMs from that, nothing more.

zealex.9410:

Tbh i really dnt know what yu are on about normal mode fractalscan be that but cm are for a diff part of the player base and that part majorly said they like the 5 mnraids feeling these have. And besides ifyou can clear this and have a dcent dps at the end yoou are pretty much golden about getting in raids. I think this is more about ppl feeling bad tha tthe raid team didnt deliver as much and that the fractal team just makes it better and better with each release.

Like so many times you haven’t understood again. It’s the design I’m denouncing.

I agree, although I’m a big fan of raids and clear them every week + having done the CMs with different groups this new fractal is more a “mini raid” than a fractal and it’s very sad to see content turning into the same pattern with boss – boss – boss and focus on the mechanics instead of bringing back a little bit of dungeon or at least old fractal feeling.

Well, you’re just plain wrong. Doesn’t matter, I don’t care.

At first some random 6%, now some magic 15%…
It’s amazing where you get those numbers from, makes really sense.

You can already go into enrage mode on most bosses and kill them with non-dps classes.
Players are just not excited to go into raids with suboptimal gear and hit a boss for 1 hour to succeed while executing (some) mechanics that long.
If you can kill Giganticus Lupicus in Arah with running around like chicken + crying in a certain time you’ll definitely kill some raid bosses after some practice as well.

Solitude.2097:

but why not waste some money , for an extra 6% participation ? :P)

The real question is if raids have been a “waste of money” for Arenanet or not. The latter seems more likely after their latest statements and development process.
The arguments are not on your side.

A boy like that wants one thing only,
And when he’s done, he’ll leave you lonely.
He’ll murder your love;
He murdered mine.
Just wait and see,
Just wait, Maria,
Just wait and see!

FrizzFreston.5290:

In fact I don’t doubt they already explored the idea of an easier raid mode. Just because its not as unreasonable as you think.

Of course they haven’t. But they either have rejected the idea or just not implemented due to reasons.

Jockum.1385:

Content.

As said before other games manage to release way more content than GW2 releases, so it is an Anets decision to release low amounts of content. Be it a direct decision to avoid spreading the playerbase, be it a indirect decision by high standards for bosses, animations, level design, voice acting, etc.

Casuals usually don’t run out of content. That’s more a hardcoreplayers problem.

Simple example:
4 times LS which keeps a player busy for a month: 4 months content.
10 dungeons which get repeated maybe 3 times: 30 weeks = 7,5 months.
So the year would be full. Add some events as wintersday, a break for vacations or whatever, …
In year 2 there are already 20 dungeons ingame. People still sometimes repeat old content. So there is maybe 1 month (or more) worth of old “year 1” content for the next 2-3 years until the content is “completly burned”.
Old content adds up.

For a new game it is difficult to provide enough content. An old game should have lots of content to offer. The majority of content GW2 offers for casual groups is very old, very little content has been added in those years in between. With maybe 5 dungeons each year GW2 would be in a much better shape. Instead players kept playing the same content without variation – and now the content is “burned”.
But I think I already described that some pages ago.

Cool then, but that’s the “Easy mode raids” thread, you better should have posted in one of the dungeon rework threads or open a new one.
Btw. lack of content has always been a thing in this game and I have often critized the company for several conclusions they made.
As a dungeon runner with daily tours before HoT for me the biggest mistake of them was to take Aetherpath as example that the community doesn’t want to have more instanced content although they should have realized that the design of this specific path was awful for being a repeatable enjoyment to casuals.
Later on they had to revamp fractals and fractal rewards so the lack of new content was extended and for me it seems that that they are in line now with releasing fractals regularly and more rare raids.
Can we expect to see new dungeons? – No.
Why? – Because they abandoned them and choose fractals as their 5 man instanced content.
We can agree that this decision wasn’t their best and only hope that the release of new content will be steady now until the game which is 5 years old dies.

Astralporing.1957:

I have seen (guild) groups of people that were perfectly able to do all t4’s easily, and yet giving up on raiding because they couldn’t get past a month of failing.

Yeah, that was true when Wing 1 & 2 were out and meta + guides weren’t that easy to handle like nowadays.
A guild group that isn’t able to succeed Escort in W3 will never be able to get T4s down. That’s a fact. Same goes for Mursaat Overseer, if you fail there, you will fail your T4 dailies every day. Cairn, Samarog, VG and Gorse are not far ahead once you’ve realized how the bosses work.
Of course there are people in fractals that have to be carried every fricking day by pugs but this is the same in raids outside of statics. But when you’re on it, even fractals aren’t the content for such people.

Since I’ve seen the “music guild” (Cmaj) succeeding, MO downed without weapons + other weird stuff and having carried players through raids myself that don’t do T4s or even T1s although I’m not a member of a speed run guild and barely bring super dps numbers on my classes it’s proven for me that the only thing that stops you to not succeed in raids is oneself. If somebody doesn’t want to, it’s fine, he should just let it go. Otherwise try it and maybe you will see raids bring a lot of fun and life in your guild or to you and your (new) friends.

Jockum.1385:

I think we debated that topic in detail several pages ago. Summary: For many players fractals get boring before they reach T4. Those players still have “done” fractals, seen all maps and so on.
It’s comparable to a player which stops playing WvW before reaching max. rank and all achievements. He hasn’t done everything, still got bored.

Well, such a player will play new content several times and then again be bored. So, what’s your plan against that problem?
As a company you have to bring repeatable content otherwise your product will be trash because you are not able to deliver well-developed content in short time spans or people will leave and your company is ruined because you can only develop A+ content once a year.
And yeah, I have a different opinion on the comparison of T1 vs. T4. T1 is a breeze and you definitely don’t have to use certain tactics you have to use on T4. It’s rather that fractals are not your content then. It’s definitely a complete different atmosphere so are raids. If you are not willing to dip into it, also fine, there are enough that are.

Jockum.1385:

In between are dungeons and fractals – which most veterans have done long ago.

If you are able to T4 you will at least get 4-8 raid bosses down easily.

0/10

You can do better!

Yeah, and there are guilds like Cmaj who are focussing on music stuff within GW2 and recently showed their fails but also success in raids.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/6lmmic/a_music_guild_tries_to_raid/
https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/6n2b23/a_music_guild_tries_to_raid_part_2/

Well, maddoctor is right. I started shortly after release way before the introduction of the LFG and it was very difficult to find people via chat or a specific site somebody had implemented to bring dungeon runners together. There were very very very few people that ran dungeons besides speed runners & their guilds.

Miellyn.6847:

He never said that, he said he raided in the beginning.

After this thread we will most likely will never get a compensation for something like this. Endless crying…

He hasn’t ever stepped into raiding during the bug window. That’s all what matters and you definitely understood what I was illustrating!

And yes, I hope we will never get compensations like this again if the implementation is that dilettantish, unfair and ridiculous.
I really don’t care about another asc chest, one bank tab of mine is full with it + I have enough magnetite shards and gold.
There are lots of people that haven’t gotten anything and lots of that don’t even know why they got a chest. It’s all about the principle and the signal to the community being a disaster.

If they are unable or more probably incapable to do such things they should just drop it and excuse bugs in one sentence. That would be fair for everyone.

Hey guys, can you please do your job right?
https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/6nbnpk/anet_just_sent_me_something_nice_i_have_0_idea_why/
It’s inadmissible that people like him get a compensation although never having even stepped into raids and others like me haven’t still gotten anything!

qq

Ye, still missing my compensation. Where is it?

The first problem is you are referring to Illconceived Was Na.9781 numbers where he said “At 10 minutes/dungeon (which has to include travel time), that’s roughly 6-7g in 30 minutes.”
Good groups don’t need that much time per path. For reference: I’m running AC story with 4 beginners in 10 minutes. Plus there are some other stuff you can do. I heard about some weird AC P6 path in which you magically run all three paths at once, all counting for the 5g achievement. I could only imagine but I think there’s more stuff out there waiting for some people to explore. ^^

Your 2nd lack of knowledge is you just look at the flat gold reward at the end of the dungeon. Some of the dungeon mats were rising in price heavily with introduction of HoT and balance changes since then. Back in the days you threw leather away because it was worth nothing and I can tell you, you got stacks out of it and you didn’t know what to do with it. Now it’s very pricey. Same goes for dust, AC is one of the best sources.

So yeah, 40-60g is very much possible for a skilled group.

SkyShroud.2865:

Edit: Incase people forgotten, dungeon was nerfed in favor of raid.

And they reverted it after finding out that dungeons got abandoned from one day to the other although they left legendary collections requiring tokens and people complained about not finding enough players to get them.

Of course the old times are over when people ran AC 1+3 (maybe 2), TA Up + Fwd, CoF 1+2, SE 1+3 and perhaps CM 1 and stopped. But that has never been the complete “dungeon tour” of the better players because you included Arah full as well as CoE + others.

plushiesoda.8150:

whenever I organize pugs on LFG, unless we’re farming. I add the keywords “casual/friendly run” to avoid salty people as even if me and my friends are running meta builds (and trust, me chances are we easily outdps you), though not always. The average so called “elitist METAer” (see what I did there? xP) can be a pain to deal with.

Sometimes things go fast, sometime slow, but hey it is fun, that’s the point of a game, I rather make fun of that ele that forgot to avoid the AOE, instead of blaming him/her and rage-quit(ing) in the middle of a fractal or kicking that necro cuz he/she ain’t running a zerk build (seriously, see what I did there? xP). If your reason for doing dailies is just to get rewards in 20 minutes or less, then clearly YOU should be the one considering getting into a constant party instead :/

that’s my opinion though, everybody has their own way of playing/enjoying the game, however the fact that the salty “elitist” METAer stereotype gives a bad image to (des)organized pugs is a reality that unless arenanet add something like random-LFG-queuing is and will continue to hurt the fractal/dungeon(ing) fan base.

your average new player miss dungeons/fractals because they’re afraid of messing things up, hell even I avoided them for months because of people like that (not like I’m blaming you though, please don’t misunderstand) as it’s happening right now with the raiding-community.

this is a problem that “other games” addressed incorporating “mythic difficulties” aka hardcore mode to almost every dungeon or raid. messing on a hardcore pug? GTFO from my raid noobster!!! … however going full kitten for messing up in a trivial difficulty thing as dailies are? pfff sorry kiddo you’re what we call a “rat kid” over here. (again, i’m not talking about you, it’s just an example, don’t misunderstand)

that’s why I avoid, make fun of and block so many “METAers”

The main issue are not “toxic elitist meta players”, it’s the people who are not able to read and respect LFGs properly.

Too many players want to get the loot piñata and they want to get it as fast as the full meta group can achieve. There would be no complaining, no kicking or toxicity at all if people just go into the groups they fit in or open up their own LFG.

Indeed, the “casual/friendly” run can indeed be a smooth thing, a couple of minutes later but no problems/wipes or anything but it’s a grab bag. I’ve opened it several times when it was corrupted and hell no, that’s no fun at all. There are groups out there that don’t get T4 levels done and then, for me personally, I wasted a ton of my valuable leisure time + lost my nerves because people can’t execute the easiest things although it’s T4 and they should at least have seen the basic levels before! For example, you can’t end dredge fractal even though you are the best solo player in the world if people don’t pull the boss into the right spots + are tanky as hell dealing no damage and don’t die either.

Jockum.1385:

Can you explain what these 4. points have to do with “more players are playing casual teamcontent than hardcore-only teamcontent”.

Why should I? That was not my intention. I just presented facts that apodicticly show you were using data horribly wrong and therefore cannot be used to keep up your argumentation seriously.

Jockum.1385:

1. yes, but most players which will ever get into raids have probably already done so.

You don’t get the difference, do you? That’s sad! T1 people show up in GW2efficiency because they will get it done even after hours but rather very easily in minutes. Raids will end up with disbanding of the group if you have complete beginners. That alone produces a bias in your comparison of the given data because unsuccessful raiders aren’t showing up in your data but people who ran fractals just a single time do so.

Jockum.1385:

4.)so what? players play the content, so it gets played?

You also don’t get this one? Look, for the raid collection you need to play fractals successfully. For none of the fractal collections you have to do raids. So, for the one thing you have to do the other but not the other way round.
—> Bias in your interpretation of data.

Jockum.1385:

I have understood it. But I think i wrote like 200 times that 2 new fractals is not that much content. I wouldn’t be complaining if Anet would release a new fractal every month now.

Ok, then maybe you start to realize that this isn’t possible at all. Everyone with a little bit of knowledge in software programming knows that.

Jockum.1385:

I have asked if it would be ok to delete all raids. You claim fractal development is in a good shape, so all raids could be deleted right? You would happily be playing T4 fractals instead then and drown in content by the glorious fractal development of the past months and years.

Sry, but I don’t get your weird comparisons. I said fractal development is in the best shape than ever before, I haven’t said this is perfect or a reason to celebrate but it’s a huge step into the right direction after years of failing. Ofc everyone would like to see more but I don’t think it is possible unless they lack in quality. You must not forget that they overhauled the whole fractal system for HoT, rebalanced rewards several times, revamped several fractals and brought in 2 new ones, one with a cm. That took a ton of time and ressources.

And don’t think the raiders are pleased:
- bugfixing takes too long or is non-existent
- a whole raid was promised with the release of HoT but they split it up and it took 9 months till the final release
- the next raid wing will most likely be released with the expansion or again one month after release like with HoT. That’s in november/december at the earliest, so again almost one year – and we all don’t know if there is another one already planned

In the end, I’m playing fractals on a daily basis because it’s fun, even the old ones + a good amount of gold while raids are rewarding every 7 days. So yes, it’s fine for me and a big cohort as well according to the lfg for T4 compared to T1-3.

Jockum.1385:

Wasn’t it even you who said GW2 was in a bad shape before raids got released? What has changed since then? 2 new fractals and some reworks? Would this alone keep you playing, without raids?

See above, the whole fractal system got overhauled. And yes, I would have played less and less like I also do now and play other games until the next LS or expansion will be released. The boredom in this MMO led me straight to try raids and I was happy with it.
If that’s nothing for you, your thing. You weren’t standing up and fighting for your content in the past. The small community that wanted a challenge did so after years of asking. I don’t see your people here or elsewhere (reddit and so on).

SkyShroud.2865:

To call something very lucrative, it means you have compared it to something. Also, if you put it into context on my post he replied to, then the point is debatable, such that older players will choose the more rewarding things and dungeons just isn’t as rewarding. Thus, if it isn’t as rewarding, expect lesser people to do it.

He replied with “don’t say dungeons aren’t rewarding” because you said so. It’s a common mistake that people think the dungeon nerf is still existent but with the latest changes to dungeons it got reverted.
Before HoT farming Silverwastes was already more worth it, still people were running their dungeon tour and then turned to SW for a single reason: running dungeons isn’t as boring as doing the same stuff over and over again.
Are you losing a little bit gold due to not doing the most profitable thing for a moment? Yes, definitely.
Are you losing a big amount? Definitely not.

No, you are overestimating those data.
1. Fractals are older than raids therefore it’s obvious that more people have come in touch with fracs than with raids.
2. Fractals have a different target audience.
3. Fractals – for example T1 – are easy to be completed. You can step into them, succeed and never set a foot into it again. I know and guided many of such players, no wonder it’s only 10% of all registered users that haven’t played fracs at least once.
4. Fractals are needed for several collections, for example many legendaries and even the raid armor. So, funny thing here: You have to do fracs successfully if you want to proceed. ^^

In the end, you have to be careful to use GW2efficiency data. Do me a favour and stop it until you’ve found some really good data points for a valid comparison.

Jockum.1385:

Fractals or similar content is also important to keep the casual masses playing.

And again, this is what you still haven’t understood although some posters have already tried to explain to you:
Fractal development is in the best shape since their release in 2013. After “Fractured” there was 0 profound improvement to them. That has changed in the past (with HoT) and they are continuing to develop and release fractals on a regular time schedule now.

SkyShroud.2865:

I don’t know how it is more profitable comparing to fotm 40. Can you explain in terms of math?

He wrote it’s very lucrative and hadn’t compared to fotm 40. And I have to agree, dungeons are very lucrative if you have a proper set up and people knowing mechanics by heart and how to play their classes.
Additionally, it’s less boring to do a dungeon tour with friends than doing one fractal with pugs (because I would expect it’s hard to find 4 friends for this grindy stuff) over and over again.

That’s the point: 90% (insert any high number because we have no data) is playing easy open world content. They have no need for instanced team content that is as easy as there.

Oh god, I hope we won’t get such a content because it would be trash tier and abandoned by the majority of the player base after some weeks already.

Astralporing.1957:

Oh, i agree about that as well, which i’ve said many times already. The rewards for normal mode should most certainly be increased.

Still waiting for your well-defined suggestions.

Astralporing.1957:

People are already farming raids. As long as the weekly lockout remains, the situation is not likely to change all that much – all people able to do normal mode bosses are already trying to do as close to a full clear every week as they can. Can’t really get any further than that.

It’s not farming, it’s killing them once and then you’re done for the week. Farming would be doing it over and over again every day for hours by the ability to get loot for every further kill.
If you don’t allow that people would still not run easy mode – maybe once for the lore – because it’s not worth to do so. Probably, the easy mode reward has to have the reward structure of the actual normal mode for players to play it weekly resulting in a tremendous loot increase for normal mode which would affect the economy too much.
Please tell me values because it’s not acceptable to give 4g for wing 4 easy mode and just 8g for the usual mode. That difference between both would be too small regarding the effort increase from easy to normal.