Guild Wars 2

Fortuna.7259:

Vayne.8563:

Now you get to the nitty gritty of the problem.

There are a whole lot of people who really believe that they can take a single line out of the manifesto and turn that line to mean what they want it to mean, without taking the rest of the words around it into account, and all the stuff said about it afterwards.

The line “we don’t want people to grind in Guild Wars 2” is followed by “no one likes it, no one finds it fun, we want to change the way people view COMBAT”.

The paragraph starts with the line, “In other games there’s this boring grind to get to the fun stuff…”

What is Colin talking about…boring grind to get to the fun stuff. Not gear grind. Gear isn’t mentioned anywhere in the manifesto. Even the article referring to the manifesto written after doesn’t use the word gear, though it does use the words “fun reward”. Can you maybe perhaps interpret that as meaning gear. Maybe. But it’s not a sure thing. At the very least it would be something you’d have to think about. What did Colin mean when he said grind.

If you take the words out of context, the manifesto was betrayed. If you look at the context, backed up by months of commentary after the fact, then the manifesto wasn’t betrayed.

Whether you like the game or not, whether you like what was done or not, the manifesto itself didn’t change. The intentions of the devs didn’t change.

The one thing that DID change, was the slight vertical progression added to the game, which wasn’t mentioned at all in the manifesto.

In other words… it depends on what the definition of the word “is” is.

I am not interested in your legalese. The manifesto says nobody finds grinding fun. I don’t expect to find the resulting game centered on grinding. I don’t care why or how it devolves to grinding. It isn’t fun.

If anyone is taking a few words out of the manifesto and overly emphasizing them, it is you. Imagine describing the system for getting laurels in the manifesto. Does it seem just a little out of place? Does it make you feel like a hero in a dynamic world where what you do matters? Is it “the fun stuff”? Maybe its running CoF1 1000 times. The spirit of the manifesto is not alive and well in the game, and it shows.

The only grind is for cosmetics, hence it isn’t required to experience any content in the game, hence you don’t have to do it to “get to the fun stuff.” Oh look, that’s a line from the manifesto. You don’t need laurels to get to the fun. You don’t need to farm CoF to get to the fun.

I don’t think Anet were really taking the title of their video that seriously. I mean a manifesto is more along the lines of a long document someone writes down on paper to describe whatever crazy things they are thinking. Typically we hear of crazed serial killers or suicidal people writing manifestos. When I think “manifesto” I think Mein Kampf not youtube… Realistically, I think Anet’s choice of video title was just an attention-grabber, nothing more. Yes they wanted to talk about their vision, but if they were making a true manifesto, it would be posted on the official wiki as an itemized list of objectives with philosophical commentary on design.

Primernova.5791:

The roles don’t need to be dedicated but the roles do need to exist, just in a more fluid way, with specs and weapon swaps. A 1.2 second knockdown is not CC. A 3000+- heal over 7 seconds, for characters that have 15K+ health is not a heal. Having decent armor/toughness and vitality, but no threat/agro is not mob/boss control in PvE.

That’s all mostly to do with the pvp side of the game. 1 second knockdowns chained together in a team fight is some pretty insane pvp CC. All those small heals add up over the course of a fight to make a big difference in deciding the winner. What they need to do for PvE is change how Defiant works so that coordinated groups can effectively mitigate damage using control instead of dodge spam. This would negate the need for a threat mechanic as well.

No RPG before or since GW2, has tried to completely destroy trinity, think about that (aint broke, don’t fix it). GW2 imo, is the best MMO out atm, yet it lags behind what I consider to be one of the worst MMOs atm by a significant margin. If GW2 can’t squash the husk that WoW has become, it will have a lot of issues going forward.

I think you mean no MMO has. Plenty of RPGs have no trinity. Diablo 2, 3, Torchlight, Fallout, The Elder Scrolls, off the top of my head. I think people’s preconception of what they think the term “MMO” is supposed to mean stops them from realizing you can have the same class freedom and action of those games, coupled with the massively multiplayer experience. There doesn’t have to be a wall arbitrarily placed between those two worlds. Anyway, putting the trinity in GW2 won’t do anything to help it defeat WoW. The very idea that it has to defeat WoW is the real problem.

Fortuna.7259:

Xenon.4537:

The way I see it, people who dislike GW2 just see if from a bad angle, and the problem with those people is when they refuse to adjust their angle. So then it comes to either adjust your angle, or go find something that looks good from your angle. But don’t blame the scenery for your bad camerawork. And to push this analogy even further, I think some people just have broken/smudged lenses…

Some people have a wide, roaming lenses. They can focus on the those things that display quality and integrity. Others have narrow lenses that cannot be moved. They have no choice but to watch what is in their field of view.

Furthermore, I think people have a hard time figuring out which lenses they have because they are like… Superglued to the face or something… They might think they have a million dollar IMAX camera, but what they really have is the cardboard tube from a roll of toilet paper… And the cardboard is soggy and misshapen.

Vayne.8563:

Xenon.4537:

Vayne.8563:

Oh, I’m well aware people are “winding me up” as we say downunder.

Vayne are… Are you Australian, after all this time?

I’m a transplanted American. I moved here about ten years ago, but yes, I’m a citizen of Australia now.

Ah, well I’ve already started reading your posts in an Australian accent, there’s no turning back. <3

Vayne.8563:

Oh, I’m well aware people are “winding me up” as we say downunder.

Vayne are… Are you Australian, after all this time?

I run glass staff/scepter on my ele. GS/axe on warrior, or Ham/sword.

Vayne.8563:

That’s why I always say that when someone says a game sucks, they’re really talking about an incompatibilty between what they want/expect from a game and what the game delivers.

QFT. They don’t realize that when we talk about a subject, we are discussing 3 different entities. There is the subject that exists in my mind, the subject that exists in your mind, and the subject that exists in reality. Since we aren’t omniscient, we can’t truly know the one that exists in reality. We are trapped by our own limited perceptions. Everyone has different perceptions, thus everyone has different opinions. No one thinks about this, though. Each individual just spews bullkittens and assumes their opinion is the right one.

The way I see it, people who dislike GW2 just see if from a bad angle, and the problem with those people is when they refuse to adjust their angle. So then it comes to either adjust your angle, or go find something that looks good from your angle. But don’t blame the scenery for your bad camerawork. And to push this analogy even further, I think some people just have broken/smudged lenses…

I think the one thing we can count on is Warriors will continue being OP in PvE and lame in sPvP. Lol.

Wasn’t sure where to put this thread. I was wondering if anyone had heard if Anet plans to have more novels written? I’ve finished the 3 current ones and loved each of them. Also, what did you guys think of the books? What would you like to read about if they did more books?

I would love to read a story about the fall of Orr from the perspective of someone who was there. Or maybe something to do with the bloodstones. I understand 2 of the 5 pieces are unaccounted for; perhaps an enterprising crew of adventurers set out in search of them.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Nurvus.2891:

In Guild Wars 2, however, you have things such as 2-6% procs, you can have 20% chance to crit for 250% damage, and all other kinds of situations that make it so that whether or not you win a fight has little or nothing to do with your skill, but with how lucky you got.

I think that’s a slight bit of hyperbole. Though luck to not be the only one facing four enemies in a PvP or WvW setting, all at the same time and flat-footed, certainly would count on whether you win or take a waypoint trip.

Yeah, this is really all the luck factor I’ve experienced. The “2-6% proc” I’m assuming he’s referring to certain runesets that offer 5% chance to apply protection or the engineer trait 8% chance to convert incoming conditions. Its important to keep in mine that those effects have a tiny % chance because they receive a huge volume of “dice rolls” in combat. My guardian has 6/6 Rune of the Pack and I often find it proccing on cooldown (5% chance, 10s icd) in WvW because of the sheer number of attacks being applied to me. I’m not an expert on probability, but 5% chance for something to happen, applied 20 times over 10 seconds, starts to become highly improbable for it not to proc.

In addition to all the things they talked about in the blog, I hope they work on some form of raiding. And before someone attacks this post, keep in mind that raiding doesn’t mean gear treadmill.

I feel like Anet lied to us the same way McDonalds lies to us.

Duke Blackrose.4981:

League of Legends – THE most popular game in existence.

Actually I think Tetris is technically the most popular.

LordByron.8369:

Xenon.4537:

mesme.5028:

I know i have been annoyed with a-net over a few things.

I feel this is not the game the devs in the manifesto doing the sales pitch talked about,
but i guess that is all it was a sales pitch, i try to think atm, well done them they got peeps to buy it.

I guess the devs are told what to do by investor’s and shareholder’s, but idk for sure who tells them what to do, they must look back at what they told us and think i hatted having to lie to peeps to get sales but guess their jobs would be on the line if they didn’t.

So im thinking now its not really their fault, as for 1 mill likes on facebook, i think there is far better mini games there than in gw2, so perhaps they shouldn’t have done it there, again maybe they well told too idk.

While i do like gw2 ( mini games and jumping excluded) i don’t think i could give the game a thumbs up as i like many others feel cheated in the game we got, perhaps if they had been honest from the outset and said gw2 will be a 3d plaform type mmo with mini games content then peeps would vote.

I dunno what you watched, but it wasn’t the same manifesto I watched.

Using sarcasm to pretend that you are not in denial of obvious things doesn t help much.

11.000 posts thread.
Same posts opened after months is having answers

And if its not enough most public press already gave the same opinion than MOST player that expressed themselves on the argument

So if with any wordplay or inricate logic someone tried to find that the manifesto was not broken doesn t change a simple fact.

Manifesto gave CLEAR expectations.
If you ask a player who never seen GW2 what can understand from that manifesto and then shows him GW" he will say it have been broken in its core points.

Pure speculation and heresay. As I said before, everyone is interpreting the manifesto differently. This is what happens to every game. The devs say some things, the community fantasizes endlessly about it for months or years prior to release, and by the time the real game comes, it can’t possibly live up to the fantasy that exists in each and every individuals mind.

When you and I talk about GW2, we are actually talking about 3 different entities.

1. The Guild Wars 2 that exists in your mind.
2. The Guild Wars 2 that exists in my mind.
3. The Guild Wars 2 that exists in reality.

I cannot truly know the GW2 that exists in your mind, just as you cannot truly know the GW2 that exists in mine. The best we can do is try to focus on the one that exists in reality. If you would like to actually point out exactly how you think they strayed from the manifesto, I’ll be more than happy to discuss it. In my opinion, they did not stray from it.

mesme.5028:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Xenon.4537:

Erasculio.2914:

I think everyone who has read your posts realizes you have a very strong agenda of trying to make up as many excuses to defend ArenaNet as possible (with the little token criticism here and there to save face). That’s probably why so many ignore the way you try to defend the Manifesto – your arguments are biased due to your own agenda.

How is his argument biased or based on an agenda? He’s stating his opinions same as you. It’s unfortunate that people feel the need to gang up on him due to his frequent posting. I’ve read nothing but calm, collected, thoughtful posts from him, and all I see him get is bile in return. Turning the discussion from it’s topic to an attack on his credibility is a sign of a weak argument.

I think this thread should be closed because it doesn’t seem to be about discussing how to interpret the manifesto anymore, so much as attacking people who don’t share a preconceived interpretation.

I suggest you read his post history a bit better. Far too many gems of

I know more than you
I’m better educated than you
I comprehend more than you
I understand more than you
I know what the devs meant, more than you
I have a better understanding of MMOs than you

On and on. He claims to take that tone because of frustration about being “attacked” but, doing what he does just generates more aggro. He is indeed taking heat, like a tank doing taunts.

Its pretty much I’m right, you are wrong, and here is why [ insert commentary on education, comprehension, knowledge, etc]

And its funny you mentioned credibility attacks.. its a staple in his posts.

I actually feel sorry for him, i don’t think anyone likes him and that’s a shame, i know he brings a lot on himself, but maybe it’s a defense thing or something, nobody is perfect:).

I like him. Again with the whole interpretation thing, I don’t read the adversarial tone in his posts that everyone else seems to read. I think the reason he gets a lot of flack is because he posts so much. His posts are like so many data points on a graph unto which a certain threshold has been reached where he got himself too much attention from the wrong people. And now its a bandwagon thing to jump down his throat or treat him like a token fanboy.

mesme.5028:

They took everything we liked about gw1 and put it in gw2, /looks for her rit and monk.

Rit: see Engineer
Monk: see guardian

I just stumbled upon this on youtube. Lol. I wish DB had energy like that.

They pretty much already outlined what they will be working on for the rest of 2013. So anything not mentioned will probably not be seen before 2014.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/looking-ahead-guild-wars-2-in-2013/

I have a feeling laurels will be involved somehow in the new ascended gear. Possibly requiring X amount of content tokens + Y amount of laurels + Z amount of gold.

Vol.5241:

Xenon.4537:

Resetting the story might be complicated under the hood, but it’s not impossible. Implications include:

- Getting the loot rewards again, which is a non-issue imo because the loot is junk overall and isn’t worth any more or less (for the time investment) than any other loot in the game.

- Getting the exp all over again, which is also a non-issue imo because people can already craft their way to 80, not to mention the race change option would probably cost around $25-30 worth of gems.

So really, the only issue is the programming Anet would have to do to implement it, which is simply a matter of whether they feel like the time and resources put into implementing it would turn a profit in gems sales. That said, they do already have plenty of issues on their plate, and this is far from a priority.

That may be suitable for me or you, but poor old Joe over there does not want to have to start al lover with leveling, and he doesn’t have the money to craft up. Anet needs to consider all affected players, not the select few.

What do you mean start leveling again? My post meant to imply that it would be no big deal if, for example, you leveled to 10 doing your personal story, used a race change, and then did those 1-10 personal story quests again (and got the exp from them). Whether you spend gold to craft-level, or spend $30 on a race change at 50 and cash in on 1-50 personal stories exp, it’s all the same in my eyes. I’m just saying the possible “exploitative” implications aren’t really an exploit, at least not an adverse one.

Erasculio.2914:

I think everyone who has read your posts realizes you have a very strong agenda of trying to make up as many excuses to defend ArenaNet as possible (with the little token criticism here and there to save face). That’s probably why so many ignore the way you try to defend the Manifesto – your arguments are biased due to your own agenda.

How is his argument biased or based on an agenda? He’s stating his opinions same as you. It’s unfortunate that people feel the need to gang up on him due to his frequent posting. I’ve read nothing but calm, collected, thoughtful posts from him, and all I see him get is bile in return. Turning the discussion from it’s topic to an attack on his credibility is a sign of a weak argument.

I think this thread should be closed because it doesn’t seem to be about discussing how to interpret the manifesto anymore, so much as attacking people who don’t share a preconceived interpretation.

I think what’s going on here is people making a bunch of different interpretations of the manifesto. Sort of the same way people make different interpretations of the Bible.

What I hate is that the color “yellow” in my loot used to mean “YAY ECTOS!” but now it’s just a huge disappointment.

You know this is the first I’ve thought about this. I think hearts would be a good idea for new maps. I think Orr and Southsun feel sort of “incomplete” because of their lack of hearts. Dynamic events should be a huge deal, but hearts would simply fill out the zone and give more substance to it. They could offer zone-specific unique rewards from the vendors too. I can’t think of a good reason why hearts would hurt a zone.

Smith.1826:

If they’re worried about how the race change will affect the personal story, couldn’t they just have that be a prerequisite? “Change your race – provided you finished the whole PS”?

Aside from that it’s probably just a lot of work at the moment, what with the personal story, cultural armor transfers, and not messing with the Emperor title. I wouldn’t be too surprised if we saw it at some point in the future, what with all the craziness the Consortium’s capable of.

This is a good idea for a simple solution, however I think Anet would dislike this approach because it would limit their possible customers to a smaller demographic of PvE completionists. Not everyone completes their personal story. Heck I’ve been playing since pre-launch and I haven’t done mine 100% yet. Their gem store philosophy tends to be items that literally anyone can use at any time regardless of how much content they have completed.

Happyfool.8951:

Xenon.4537:

Excursion.9752:

I would like to see it happen. I agree the story should reset and as for the armor well it seems like to much work for them to make a convenience to us. So I would say all cultural stuff would be at a loss. Because if you look at it from a new characters point of view it would be at a loss if you decided to make a new character with the race of choice.

Why would it be a loss? Every race has X, Y, and Z armor pieces that are equivalent. If I changed my Charr to an Asura, My Charr T3 helm would become an Asura T3 helm. It’s logically simple, the only issue is the code behind the scenes.

and what of the personal story? just convert too? you make it sound so easy.

See my other post.

Excursion.9752:

I would like to see it happen. I agree the story should reset and as for the armor well it seems like to much work for them to make a convenience to us. So I would say all cultural stuff would be at a loss. Because if you look at it from a new characters point of view it would be at a loss if you decided to make a new character with the race of choice.

Why would it be a loss? Every race has X, Y, and Z armor pieces that are equivalent. If I changed my Charr to an Asura, My Charr T3 helm would become an Asura T3 helm. It’s logically simple, the only issue is the code behind the scenes.

Resetting the story might be complicated under the hood, but it’s not impossible. Implications include:

- Getting the loot rewards again, which is a non-issue imo because the loot is junk overall and isn’t worth any more or less (for the time investment) than any other loot in the game.

- Getting the exp all over again, which is also a non-issue imo because people can already craft their way to 80, not to mention the race change option would probably cost around $25-30 worth of gems.

So really, the only issue is the programming Anet would have to do to implement it, which is simply a matter of whether they feel like the time and resources put into implementing it would turn a profit in gems sales. That said, they do already have plenty of issues on their plate, and this is far from a priority.

There are some excellent DB commanders, and there are some not-so-excellent ones. The best ones are likely on TS and have a large guild following them. Ask in map chat for the info. IMO everyone should use TS even if they don’t have a mic. It’s free, it’s easy, and it forms closer relationships between players. Organizing a zerg is millions of times easier when they can give verbal commands instead of stopping to type, especially in combat.

Vayne.8563:

You know I just looked up Rift. It has 350,000 likes…and it’s been around a whole lot longer then Guild Wars 2. It was even a pay to play game. I don’t really think the whole Facebook like thing is indicative of anything.

This.

mesme.5028:

I know i have been annoyed with a-net over a few things.

I feel this is not the game the devs in the manifesto doing the sales pitch talked about,
but i guess that is all it was a sales pitch, i try to think atm, well done them they got peeps to buy it.

I guess the devs are told what to do by investor’s and shareholder’s, but idk for sure who tells them what to do, they must look back at what they told us and think i hatted having to lie to peeps to get sales but guess their jobs would be on the line if they didn’t.

So im thinking now its not really their fault, as for 1 mill likes on facebook, i think there is far better mini games there than in gw2, so perhaps they shouldn’t have done it there, again maybe they well told too idk.

While i do like gw2 ( mini games and jumping excluded) i don’t think i could give the game a thumbs up as i like many others feel cheated in the game we got, perhaps if they had been honest from the outset and said gw2 will be a 3d plaform type mmo with mini games content then peeps would vote.

I dunno what you watched, but it wasn’t the same manifesto I watched.

Ghosn.3219:

The amount of hours played seems extremely low for the amount of active players they’re talking about. It’s a bit outdated, but in 2010, NPD stated that the average American gamer played around 13 hours per week. I’ve known some people who played GW2 for 20 hours per week.

Also, while it’s not an MMO, Diablo 3 might be a decent comparison for numbers. It sold 12 million copies, and in May there was an infographic release. People played a total of 8 million hours per day in that game while the game averaged 2.1 million players per day. The numbers for Guild Wars 2 just don’t seem to make much sense.

But… Diablo 3 is terrible.

I miss D2…

It’s sort of like Necro minions, except worse because they have a finite duration, even traited. And you need a lot more traits to make spirit weapons effective than a Necro needs for minions. Anet should probably add a PvE buff to summoned minions that reduces AoE damage they take by a lot. It might also help if they could be scripted to move out of AoE.

Isciira.2958:

The only thing that will fix this problem in to reduce the amount of exp given by crafting, but I don’t really see that happening.

That, and the promise of making champions drop better loot (blog post). But who knows when that will happen.

Personally, I’ve vowed never to craft level again. I didn’t do it on my first toon (didn’t have the money) and I felt a lot more accomplished and attached to that toon. It was more fulfilling to put the work in, get out and see the world.

Seems like every update Anet is testing the waters for different types of RNG box and money making schemes. I really wish they would return to the Wintersday model of selling individual skins for 800 gems WITH a chance to get a ticket from chests. I didn’t hear anyone complaining about that, besides maybe the fact that the skins looked ugly (imo).

Morrigan.2809:

I have been following WildStar since 20011 and it is an interesting, over the top idea- a bit traditional in game aspects for my liking but it has some very interesting concepts- I fail to see what it has to do with GW2 though (except for sharing a publisher)

I was going to somehow turn my response back to OT but there really is no point.
OP does not like the LS- it is the way GW2 is going forward…

I’ll attempt to tie it back in.

One might consider that since NC$oft is the publisher of both Wildstar and Guild Wars 2, then the two games are indirectly affected by each other. Remember the publisher is the company that sits on a mountain of cash and pays studios (like Anet, and Carbine) to make games for them to profit from. NC$oft has a finite supply of cash to hand out, and if they feel like Wildstar is more important, they may not give Anet as much money, which impacts the development of GW2.

Theoretically Anet may be forced to develop “cotton candy carnival” content and gem store RNG scam boxes in order to stay afloat in the absence of NC$oft’s cash infusion. I try to remain hopefully optimistic, though. I think Anet has some fun plans in store. It’s just a matter of time.

Jemmi.6058:

Xenon.4537:

I’m of the philosophy that if you can do something in a game without actually altering the game’s code, then you shouldn’t be punished for it. It’s the developer’s fault if a flaw exists, and it’s their responsibility to correct the flaw. They should be thankful when people uncover the flaws so that they can be identified and fixed.

I agree to an extent. I disagree when this action negatively impacts other players experiences. For example, there have been many exploits which resulted in a massive influx of ecto’s or gold into the economy. This lowers the price of ectos or decreases the value of gold, and consequently, negatively impacts players who gain these items by legit means.

I do not mean negatively impacts in the case of the original poster, who was kicked for not following the strategy of the party. In this case, we are missing too many details to know exactly what happened/why he was kicked. If they simply kicked him, because he did not know the strategy, without saying anything, than that is more of a problem with the players than the code and strategy.

I was referring to more victimless crimes such as when people were jumping over the wall in CoF p2. Banning for that is just unfair.

In the case of an exploit affecting the economy, I think it would be better to fix the exploit than to worry about banning the exploiters. If they can’t exploit in the first place, then there’s no need to ban them.

Sure ban people for hacking, but if you think of the game’s code as a set of laws, and you are doing something within that set of laws that wasn’t intended, I don’t see it as breaking the laws at all. You are simply interpreting the laws differently.

I’m of the philosophy that if you can do something in a game without actually altering the game’s code, then you shouldn’t be punished for it. It’s the developer’s fault if a flaw exists, and it’s their responsibility to correct the flaw. They should be thankful when people uncover the flaws so that they can be identified and fixed.

TheDaiBish.9735:

Xenon.4537:

TheDaiBish.9735:

Ghettoblade.7962:

They are just biding their time until the other game they are developing comes together.

…what?

---

Molten Weapon Facility and Aetherblade Retreat is returning, while these mini-games will be cycled. Also, a while back, a dev said they are coming up with some form of raiding.

I believe he may be referring to Wowstar. It’s a new MMO being published by NC$oft (Anet is not involved) and it looks like… bad… to me anyway. It has all the same core elements as WoW (similar questing system, rested exp, class/race restrictions, traditional raids which means gear treadmill most likely, etc), but tries to have mobile/dodge combat like GW2, except every single thing in the game is telegraphed with an obnoxious red or blue aoe mark. Also it looks like clown barf with all the colors and cartoon style, and it tries to present itself like Team Fortress 2.

Ahhh. Was wondering what he / she were talking about.

Eh, Wildstar aesthetics don’t look that bad IMO. Aside from the different paths of levelling and bunny girls I don’t know much about it.

I probably won’t get it, but I’m not going to hate on it. Each to their own and all that.

I’m mostly spiteful toward it because a bunch of my friends refused to play my favorite game (gw2) and instead constantly talk about Wildstar like it’s going to be the second coming of Christ.

I need new friends…

TheDaiBish.9735:

Ghettoblade.7962:

They are just biding their time until the other game they are developing comes together.

…what?

---

Molten Weapon Facility and Aetherblade Retreat is returning, while these mini-games will be cycled. Also, a while back, a dev said they are coming up with some form of raiding.

I believe he may be referring to Wowstar. It’s a new MMO being published by NC$oft (Anet is not involved) and it looks like… bad… to me anyway. It has all the same core elements as WoW (similar questing system, rested exp, class/race restrictions, traditional raids which means gear treadmill most likely, etc), but tries to have mobile/dodge combat like GW2, except every single thing in the game is telegraphed with an obnoxious red or blue aoe mark. Also it looks like clown barf with all the colors and cartoon style, and it tries to present itself like Team Fortress 2.

VOLKON.1290:

Xenon’s list also doesn’t include skills that have aftercast skills, such as mesmer focus 4.

Yeah, but I figured people would want to lump skills like that into a single skill.

cesmode.4257:

Xenon.4537:

Kain Francois.4328:

It sounds like to me the team wanted to do a specific strategy, and you refused or didn’t listen.

Either they wanted to skip the first two switches, or they stood on the wooden structure during the boss fight. Either way, if they kicked you on level 3 FoTM, chances are they simply found you obnoxious.

Why are the carebears in this thread calling his group elitist, when they darn well don’t know what happened? You really have to try hard to get kicked from level 3 FoTM.

A realist! I like you.

OP take this as a wake up call. Learn how to do things the fast/easy/efficient way, or find a more casual group to run with. The world doesn’t change to suit individuals. You need to adapt. Also, the group shouldn’t be forced to be stuck with someone they don’t like just to protect that person’s feelings from being kicked.

What crap. For fractals, most groups dont say “we are skipping and glitching and exploiting everything we can”. If the group kicked him for a few mistakes made, that is just BS on their part. Its not like the OP knew exactly how the group wanted to run all three fractals.

First of all, most groups do give some sort of communicative indication as to their intentions. Even if they assumed he knew they were glitching, when they saw him not keeping up they likely said something in chat. Secondly it is absolutely not BS to kick someone if they make mistakes. If the group wants to be strict, that’s their choice. They shouldn’t be forced to be stuck with someone they don’t like. They obviously didn’t have the time or patience to hold his hand and teach him their ways. I don’t blame them at all. I’ve been in both the “all 3 AC paths in 15 minutes” groups and I’ve been in the “Three-and-a-falf-hours-and-only-halfway-through AC p2” groups. Some people don’t like spending extra time doing things if they don’t have to, and putting up with bad pugs is simply masochistic in some cases. Again, if OP doesn’t want to do what they do, then he needs to find other people to play with instead of feeling hurt that he got rejected.

I don’t think the word “gimmick” need be thrown around with mechanics so much. The way Imbued Shaman works, for example, is a great step in the right direction. You need some sort control/support abilities to reflect, block, or otherwise mitigate the adds projectiles. There should be more encounters where certain types of non-dps skills are important. But I don’t think it should be called a gimmick. It’s just a part of the encounter you have to contend with which breaks up the monotony of tank/spank.

Math time. Adding up total equipable skills at a single time.

Warrior:
10 weapon skills with swap, also option to have fast swapping
2 potentially burst skills
3 utilities
1 heal
1 elite, with one potentially adding 5 skills
17-22 total skills.

Guardian:
10 weapon skills with swap
3 virtues
3 utilities
1 heal
1 elite, with 2 potentially adding 5 skills each
18-23 total skills

Mesmer:
10 weapon skills with swap
4 shatters
3 utilities
1 heal
1 elite
19 total skills

Necromancer:
10 weapon skills with swap
5 skills from death shroud
3 utilities
1 heal
1 elite, 1 of them adding 5, 1 adding 3
20-25 total skills

Thief:
10 weapon skills with swap
1 steal skill that gives a wide variety of possible skills, lets say 8 in pvp
3 utilities
1 heal
1 elite
24 total skills

Engineer:
5 weapon skills because they have no swap
4 toolbelt skills, of which turrets provide 2 in each slot
3 utilities, 5 of which provide 5 weapon skills each
1 heal, 1 of which provides 3 skills (1 of them 3 times)
1 elite, 2 of which provide up to 5 skills
14-33 skills
(my math may be a little wonky here due to the way the skills are organized)

Elementalist:
20 weapon skills due to attunement swapping
3 utilities, 4 of which provide 5 weapon skills
1 heal
1 elite, 1 of which adds 3 skills and 1 which adds 5 weapon skills
25-41 skills

Ranger I’m not totally familiar with. They have the standard 10 from weapons, 3 from utilities, but they also have pets… Someone else can do the math.

I don’t see any classes with only 10 skills. And let’s keep in mind that cooldowns greatly affect the flow and usage of all skills, for example the Thief minus the 8 steal skills has arguably the lowest number of skills in combat (next to a kit-less engineer), but has initiative instead of cooldown timers, allowing all 10 weapon skills to be used freely.

Kain Francois.4328:

It sounds like to me the team wanted to do a specific strategy, and you refused or didn’t listen.

Either they wanted to skip the first two switches, or they stood on the wooden structure during the boss fight. Either way, if they kicked you on level 3 FoTM, chances are they simply found you obnoxious.

Why are the carebears in this thread calling his group elitist, when they darn well don’t know what happened? You really have to try hard to get kicked from level 3 FoTM.

A realist! I like you.

OP take this as a wake up call. Learn how to do things the fast/easy/efficient way, or find a more casual group to run with. The world doesn’t change to suit individuals. You need to adapt. Also, the group shouldn’t be forced to be stuck with someone they don’t like just to protect that person’s feelings from being kicked.

Aenaos.8160:

-Player behaviour.The amount of crap that
goes on in the PvP chat is unbelievable.
From the “yar all f€&@@ nubs” to the “ez meat baites”
to the “stfups”,it just seems that the worst of the worst
are playing this game mode.

This goes on in every pvp format game ever. It’s called trash talking and it’s built in to the human race. Best you can do is turn off your chat. There is no shortage of scum bags with dirty mouths playing video games.

-DPS.Tones of it.It is becoming this games monomania.
It takes the life out of everything,it makes encounters
only a few seconds long,and it negates the necesity
for any kind of tactical thinking.
Just go in,mash your buttons,do more dps than
your oponent,and win.

This is true for PvE where the problem is really about the lack of encounter mechanics and too many tank/spank bosses. However, there’s a reason people run bunker builds in PvP.

-Gimmicks.Being. transformed into a moa and losing
all of your class functionality.Now…that is some
good esports stuff.Of course I could go and
ltp MOA.This seems to be the fastest way to rage quit.

Are there no hard CC elite skills in other games?

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

The overall problem of PvP is that GW2 intentionally was created as a PvE-Game. Then they added some sort of PvP to sell it under purposes of E-Sports in mind and as an AAA-PVP title game. See the problem?

Lol. Yet another one of these cookie cutter posts.

“GW2 was made as a [choose pvp or pve here] game and so [opposite of first choice box] suffers because the devs only care about [first choice box].”

It’s all bull**** folks, and it’s bad for ya. – George Carlin

Everyone runs zerker in dungeons because it’s the fastest and most efficient if the players are skilled enough to stay alive. It’s not so much a problem with the gear being OP. It’s more a problem of the content being 95% tank/spank. They need to add more fight mechanics a la Lupicus, Imbued Shaman, Dredge Powersuit, etc. The Aetherblade dungeon was a step in the right direction (although it wasn’t perfect, imo).

Randulf.7614:

No, not ever.

Why not?