Guild Wars 2

Evilek.5690:

Sicarius.4639:

https://youtu.be/eA126dULIr0

After today bug fix is staff AA dps stronger than Dagger Gl with your Staff 11111 run !! =)

I think they should move some of the damage to CnD, Backstab, and Weakening Charge, but not really nerf the overall DPS. We really should have top tier DPS, but it’s understandable why people QQ if a big chunk of it comes from autos. I still don’t feel like it’s a PvP problem, given that most Thieves do not run full damage builds.

Edit:

Zodryn.4216
I have no problem with the size of dps, main problem is when AA chanin make more DPS than other skills.

Agreed.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

He made that ridiculous thread.

Didn’t notice that lol. To be fair to him, I only said the numbers he got were ridiculous. The concept of the thread itself is fine, and if there really was a 100% discrepancy between the DPS of two weapons on full DPS specs, it’s certainly an eyebrow raiser.

As it stands, it would seem Staff is of more concern than Dagger, but neither are that crazy compared with other options. If a Thief specs for 6k AA damage (Zerk, Scholar, DA, CS, DD etc.) I recommend sneezing in their general direction. It should take care of the problem.

Evilek.5690:

https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/218201/Bez_n_zvu.png

Berserker/Scholar/air/fire.

177 736 totall DMG / 29 sec is 6128 DPS.

This 4k DPS is really funny.

SuinegTsol.1729 Staff has right now best DPS after this hot fix

Keep in mind, I’m not using Scholar, Air or Fire. I could use Scholar I suppose, but I wanted more consistency from my sigils (if you screen cap right after the sigils proc, your DPS will get a small spike). Either way, the point of my calculations was not to find maximum DPS, but to compare each option for Thief. I threw in Revenant because of the ridiculous numbers in another thread (6k Dagger vs 3k Revenant…I don’t believe it).

SuinegTsol.1729:

did yet someone test the dps from staff compared to dd raid-wise? Current values may lead to dd backstabbing still better than staff…

Edited the OP with some sustained numbers. It would seem that Staff is superior thanks to the Vulnerability stacking when it reaches equilibrium. In a Raid group, though, if Vulnerability is already accounted for, Dagger may be better. I feel like Vault and Backstab are close enough, but I may do some testing to find out for sure.

Thanks to the fantastical “6k dagger auto!!” post, I thought I’d do a bit of testing on my own to compare the DPS between Thief Dagger, Sword, Staff, and Revenant Sword. Kill DPS is more accurate for trash mobs or squishy players, while Sustained DPS is more accurate for tougher mobs (raids, fractals) and players with high sustain. Sustained is usually higher because it is calculated with AA conditions like vulnerability at their equilibrium state. Here are the initial results (I’ll do more complete testing at a later date):

Test 1 – Kill DPS
No traits, utilities, or sigils
Marauder amulet, Pack runes
Dagger – 2.1k
Staff – 2.1k
Sword – 1.92k
Rev – 1.7k

Test 2 – Kill DPS
All damage boosting traits, passive utilities, accuracy and force sigils
Marauder amulet, Pack runes
Dagger – 4k
Staff – 4k
Sword – 3.7k
Rev – 3.4k

Edit:

Test 3 – Sustained DPS
All damage boosting traits, passive utilities, accuracy and force sigils
Marauder amulet, Pack runes
Dagger – 4.5k
Staff – 5.2k
Sword – 4k
Rev – 3.8k

Note: Impossible Odds was not used, because it can’t be active 100% of the time. Testing with Impossible Odds pushes Revenant Kill DPS past all Thief options, and brings Sustained DPS slightly above Thief Sword DPS.

Edit 2:
Test 4 – Sustained DPS
All damage boosting traits, passive utilities, accuracy and force sigils
Zerk amulet, Scholar runes
Dagger – 5.2k
Staff – 6.5k
Sword – 4.9k
Rev – 4.5k

Test 5 – Sustained DPS
All damage boosting traits, passive utilities, bursting and force sigils
Viper amulet, Zerk runes
Dagger – 4.1k
Staff – 3.4k
Sword – 2.8k
Rev – 3.3k
Pistol – 1.7k (yeah, it sucks that bad)

MyPuppy.8970:

SlayerSixx.5763:

MyPuppy.8970:

Shirlias.8104:

To me reading the small map is a bit hard ( class icons are way to large tbh ).

Not indicating mesmer clones would be a HUGE qol improvement. If we know there’s a mesmer, we know there are clones, no need to cluster the minimap anymore.

To add to that, not indicating which is the real mesmer when they use their downed stealth would be an even better QoL fix for mesmer. As it is (and has been), there’s really no point producing a clone since there’s still a big red arrow over the real one.

I agree.

Doesn’t actually matter. The real one always appears second. I didn’t even notice the arrow for the longest time. They’d need to remove the arrow and make the clone appear at the same time as the Mesmer.

We’ll be getting a way to deal with block (besides tripwire which nobody takes), and the bunkering should take a significant hit, which means we may actually be able to kill people.

It really isn’t even cheesy if you spam it to try and kill someone from 100-0. Why? Because it deals poor damage until 25% and is very telegraphed. If someone actually dies to Heartseeker spam, it’s nobody’s fault but their own.

Lol at the fact that the two posters (not counting OP) after mine have names related to things I referenced in my suggestions.

Here are a few ideas:

Destroyer of Worlds
Eater of Cereal
The Most Excellent
Oakenshield
The Defiler
The Celestial
The Pyromaniac
The Not-Quite-So-Brave-As-Sir-Lancelot
The Morning Person
The Ember

Or if you just can’t pick:

The Indecisive

Firebird.8324:

I find the trait to be more passive garbage that will likely cause thieves to be very OP in the upcoming meta. They can already dodge more than a rev (which is really saying something) so do they really need more evade frames?? Bunker teef inc.

Dash doesn’t give more evade frames. And Thieves should be able to dodge more than Rev, it’s kind of always been their thing (see: old Acrobatics). Why is that a qualifier for nerfing a GM trait?

Hmm…I just beat Zhaitan for the first time before HoT launched, and beat Mordremoth yesterday. Everything about the expansion felt superior to the core game. Better map design, better story pacing (though it could use one extra story step where you learn how to beat Mordy), more interesting characters, challenging enemies, amazing final boss (seriously, go beat Zhaitan and tell me HoT is disappointing).

The core game is bigger, but how much time do you spend in each map? I’d wager most people only visit SW, major cities, and the WPs closest to world bosses. The only issues I have with HoT are the PvP balance problems and guild costs, but those could have been problems even if they launched separately from an expansion.

Edit: and armor. They really should have added more armor sets.

+1

Please make this happen Anet.

Krysard.1364:

Zodryn.4216:

Krysard.1364:

Zodryn.4216:

I would like to point out that you are asking for a survivability nerf to the easiest class to kill in the game.

U for real?

It sure as heck isn’t Mesmer or Ele. Who are the other candidates?

Well, its the easiest class to kill if he afks on point, but has by far the best disengage ingame, so its not easy to kill at all.

We do have great disengage, but note that I said easiest to kill not easy to kill. Also, being somewhat hard to kill because you can run away well isn’t usually a good measure of survivability.

Krysard.1364:

Zodryn.4216:

I would like to point out that you are asking for a survivability nerf to the easiest class to kill in the game.

U for real?

It sure as heck isn’t Mesmer or Ele. Who are the other candidates?

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Grandmaster Yo.4327:

that they really needed huge buffs in the first place is kind of vain.

what are you talking about? What huge buffs?

Apparently Basilisk Venom is now the most insanely OP elite ever (meanwhile Deflecting Shot + Heavy Light), and we will be hearing “10k auto OP pls nerf!” on top of “Omg 50k Backstab OP pls nerf!”

I would like to point out that you are asking for a survivability nerf to the easiest class to kill in the game. Soft CC removal and swiftness is hardly “ridiculous.” If you need to lock down a Thief with Dash, just use hard CC. I expect that fear spam Necro will become more viable with the reduction of bunker ridiculousness, there’s also stun lock Mesmer, and other options. Thief isn’t “untouchable,” it’s appropriately slippery with plenty of counterplay options.

QQing.3089:

Never before have I ever wanted something so badly in this game.

We partially already had it, but you had to trait for it. June patch last year, Hidden Thief activated BP on Steal. It still had the regular BP cooldown though so it didn’t always activate. Rather than fixing that, they changed it back to plain old stealth. I would like a guaranteed stealth skill on F3…but we’ll see if that ever happens.

The Shattnerer dramatically pauses in approval.

lighter.2708:

softwizard.9208:

lighter.2708:

stealth was never special to thief, it’s initiative..

^ by this logic:
Eles, why are you special? A: we have 4 stances with 4 spells each all ready to destroy you.
Rangers, what about you? A: RATATATATATAT
oh, and thiefs you look cool, whats special about you. A: basically …a mana bar that stops us from using more then 3 spells in a quick succession hur dur

ele’s about attunement..and ranger’s about pet..just like thief’s about initiative…warrior’s about adrenaline and necro’s about DS…these are class specialties…

You’re talking about class mechanics. A Necro’s mechanic is Deathshroud, but they “specialize” in boon corruption, minions, lifesteal, and chill among other things. Certain specializations are more important than others (i.e. many Necros don’t care about or need minions, almost every Thief needs stealth), and usually other classes will have some of the same abilities, though usually less pronounced (good example being Rangers have a small amount of stealth).

Stealth and evading account for the entirety of a Thief’s defense, and the official website even calls Thieves “Experts at stealth and surprise…” We have a whole traitline devoted to stealth and one of our unique class mechanics (stealth attacks, the others being stolen items and initiative) is dependent on stealth to work.

There is nothing wrong with other classes having stealth, but there should be a limit.

Shaogin.2679:

Oh no, other people have stealth. The world is ending……

I don’t care that engi has a crazy smoke field combo to get 16s of stealth (equivalent to the best thief stealth skill on a lower cooldown), because at least it’s difficult to pull off and not always practical. The problem is, they also have extremely easy, near permanent group stealth on top of several reveals. That makes no sense. Thief is the master of stealth, but Sneak Gyro is far better than SR in many situations (especially PvE where the gyro is ignored by AI). Mesmer is at least somewhat more reasonable after the PU nerf, and I can accept that the class should have decent stealth access thematically.

What sets the thief apart? I’d say it should be stealth, mobility, and evading. Other classes can stealth at least as well as thief, some are nearly as mobile, and a few far outclass base thief evading, while coming close to daredevil.

It’s been like that since the June Prismatic Understanding change. It was then nerfed, but Chrono and especially Scrapper have crazy stealth access considering neither technically specialize in it. Meanwhile thief stealth is the easiest to counterplay. I blame three years of complaining from people who didn’t understand thief and got themselves repeatedly stomped for their l2p issues.

runeblade.7514:

After patch, thieves will be godlike because everyone else is squishy.

We’ll see. Thief wasn’t godlike even when everyone ran zerk. They were great, but you still only wanted one, and still relegated to decap/+1. After patch, many classes will run 4 stat ammulets with vitality, toughness, or both. Boons will also still be rampant (unless Necros push out boon meta). I think most people will still have plenty of options vs thieves.

lloydst.6985:

There are also people posting on their phones

I post almost exclusively on my (four year old) phone. I rarely abbreviate, except for common in-game abbreviations like D/P for dagger/pistol. I even format with bold, bullets, and so on. I don’t consider typing on your phone an excuse for lazy writing.

1. Get full zerk. The extra defense you have may be ok in PvP, but in PvE you need to kill fast. Use blind, evade, stealth to survive, not stats.

2. S/D isn’t great in PvE. Try S/P for better damage along with a great evade on 3 and blind field on 5. S/P 3 with Signet of Malice and Invigorating Precision can heal you to full in a mob.

3. Don’t waste initiative on Death Blossom when running power gear. It deals pitiful DPS and robs you of the init for stealth.

4. With full zerk, feel free to take Shadow Arts. Shadows Rejuvenation should help you tremendously. Mug or Invigorating Precision can also help you survive.

5. Play the AI. They lose you when you stealth, so wait to backstab if you need to regen a bit. Learn to time interrupts, blind, etc. to avoid damage.

Ithilwen.1529:

You think I can dodge 5 attacks? Every one of which will either kill me outright or kill me by poison ticks? ANET kittened all over Mesmer and replaced it with thief. If having a short invulnerability that prevents point capture is so bad..

Then why is a god mode single hit kill that can’t be stopped ok?

No need to dodge 5 times. If 5 people get Basilisk and all attack you, one dodge will invalidate most if not all of the stacks. And backstab is very easy to both predict and to stop. Honestly, sword 2 will probably be enough to let you ignore BV, not to mention other distortion, blind, etc.

Mirror of anguish.

Also dodge, blind, etc.

yolo swaggins.2570:

Someone died to a deathblossom build ebola.

Someone ran zerk in the bunker meta and got eaten by a starving thief.

You know, I agree. It’s not like thief has been in a rough spot since June last year, getting even worse after HoT to the point where others assume they will lose with a thief on their team. Beyond broken indeed.

Link

30% faster sword autos sounds wonderful! Basilisk is no longer the breakbar king (edit: nvm, still turns to stone and unblockable), but should be really interesting in PvP. I wish we got a few cooldowns reduced, but overall it looks good.

The AA damage might help a bit. I’d like to see Choking Gas and Dancing Dagger get some good poison, and most condi utilities could use lower cooldowns.

Wings that require one or two players with very high mobility, possibly to the point where vertical ports are necessary to deactivate some device or something would give us a spot. Also, sections that require on demand or prolonged stealth would give us a spot IF Sneak Gyro would get killed in those sections.

Gibimo.2193:

Acrobatics

Adept
New trait : Empowered Evasion : Replace Fleet Shadow
gain might whenever you evade an attack
duration : 4s
Recharge : 1s

I hope not. Power of Inertia used to be 15s of might on every dodge. This would only give 4 stacks max IF you evade an attack every single second. Realistically you’d probably get half that.

Thief notes:

Sword auto needs love compared with dagger and staff. I’d welcome faster auto attacks on both sword and pistol. Looking forward to whatever you have cooked up for Acro. Some other things could use addressing as well.

• General survivability on base thief needs a boost. Higher base HP, blind on CnD, and evade on P/P are some options.

• Some cooldowns are kind of high. Haste, Roll for Initiative, Smoke Screen in particular. Shadow Refuge, Blinding Powder, Shadowstep, and Venoms could use a small reduction too.

• Dancing Dagger, Body Shot, and Short Bow 2, 3 and 4 need help.

• (Edit) Also, Preparedness baseline, Reveal normalized, and Destroy Shadow Trap should behave like Portal with no pathing check.

Thanks!

Apolo.5942:

I find hilarious that the one weapon that is all about movement, has THE self rooting skill.

Thief sword? :P

If we get core Tyria gliding, we need Labyrinthine Cliffs back in the game! I don’t care how you do it (well, ideally a historical map with playable season 1 update), but I will be very sad if I never get to glide there.

I’m choosing to remain cautiously optimistic. At least they didn’t mention anything that needs to be “toned down” for us. Karl, I believe in you!

luzt.7692:

Zodryn.4216:

What other boon or condi is only accessible by one class? I’d say their unique mechanic is being able to reset any and all skills on their bar as well as health and endurance. Alacrity just supplements the time theme. My point was just that thief has little to no access to the “do stuff quickly” boons, which seems weird.

He’s probably referring to stuff as Banners, Empowered Allies and Assassins presence.
Alacrity pretty much falls in the same category, right now.

I could argue that stealth should be unique to thief, or at least that it should have the most access to it. Then we have mesmer and scrapper…

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Zodryn.4216:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Zodryn.4216:

Also, why does the quick mobile class have no superspeed, quickness, or alacrity? Why does the master of stealth have the easiest stealth to deny and the jack-of-all-trades class (Engi/Scrapper) gets near perma group stealth in one skill?

You realize that Alacrity does almost nothing for Thieves correct?

Group alacrity would make us more desirable in raids (why not on thrill of the crime) and even solo it benefits our utilities, which usually make a big difference in our survival (shadowstep, signet of agility) or damage (venoms). 66% faster regen is extremely good even if it doesn’t benefit our weapon skills.

Yeah those can be decent, but I guess I am of the mind set certain classes should have there niche mechanics, say keep Chrono as the only class with Alacrity and so on it would provide more distinction and allow for more diversity now it would be great if Thief was given more group Utility maybe by redesigning Venoms or some thing else.
And FYI they are nerfing alacrity so it may not even be 66% come tomorrow

What other boon or condi is only accessible by one class? I’d say their unique mechanic is being able to reset any and all skills on their bar as well as health and endurance. Alacrity just supplements the time theme. My point was just that thief has little to no access to the “do stuff quickly” boons, which seems weird.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Zodryn.4216:

Also, why does the quick mobile class have no superspeed, quickness, or alacrity? Why does the master of stealth have the easiest stealth to deny and the jack-of-all-trades class (Engi/Scrapper) gets near perma group stealth in one skill?

You realize that Alacrity does almost nothing for Thieves correct?

Group alacrity would make us more desirable in raids (why not on thrill of the crime) and even solo it benefits our utilities, which usually make a big difference in our survival (shadowstep, signet of agility) or damage (venoms). 66% faster regen is extremely good even if it doesn’t benefit our weapon skills.

I hope Acro gets what it needs to make it useful and set it apart. Maybe some boons and team support along with more mobility. I won’t complain about an AA buff, but I hope that the skills that spend initiative get a look. Does anyone even use Dancing Dagger or Body Shot ever?

Also, why does the quick mobile class have no superspeed, quickness, or alacrity? Why does the master of stealth have the easiest stealth to deny and the jack-of-all-trades class (Engi/Scrapper) gets near perma group stealth in one skill?

Destroy shadow trap needs to be made a port with no pathing checks. There is no reason to keep it a shadowstep.

Also, here’s something every class can do to counter thief stealth: stand in black powder (little red circle). If he tries to combo in it to gain stealth, he reveals himself. BP is expensive too, deny him twice and he can’t attempt the combo again.

Also if you’re in WvW just carry a stealth trap with you. One minute of reveal if he even gets close to you. That’s about as hard a counter as you can get, and anyone can use it.

A lot of Tyria is already quite vertical, and gliding in certain areas is going to be a blast. Sure, it will add a few JP skips and some map breaks, but why is that a problem when there are already ways you can do that? I do want gliding in central Tyria.

How about this:

You can earn 1g per day running a dungeon you’ve never run before. You only get the 1g if you rate the dungeon at the end. Player made dungeons do not have any rewards when they are created.

Periodically, Anet will review some of the top rated dungeons, and give them completion rewards based on the time and difficulty.

You cannot release a dungeon you have not completed, so no impossible dungeons.

Rising Dusk.2408:

Zodryn, I noticed in you’re spreadsheet you’re using Brawler’s Tenacity coupled with Impairing Daggers. This also benefits the heal skill, which is nice, but I’m not sure if it’s higher DPS than using Needle Trap with Deadly Trapper or not. 3 stacks of poison is nice, it’s true, but Havoc Master giving 7% damage all of the time is pretty good considering the high Power stat.

In testing it’s hard for me to know which is better for that third utility, so if you could shed some light on why you picked ID that’d be great. With your build you’re low on bleed duration, so I’m not surprised it’s better for you… But I think with full viper’s you can get bleed duration up to 66% which makes Needle Trap pretty great.

I tried various builds and so far I find full viper with sinister rings and earrings provides the best DPS (spreadsheet doesn’t reflect that build). You get around 67% bleed duration with that, but it’s still a toss up between needle trap and impairing daggers.

They have different uses. I will say ID actually does good direct damage while Needle doesn’t. I’ve swapped havoc master in, but I still like ID. If you have multiple targets, or you aren’t getting might from your party, trap is better. Single target with plentiful might I’d bet on ID.

Ooh thanks for pointing out the might issue. I’ll fix that. I’m working on a more detailed spreadsheet with more options, but feel free to copy that one and paste your stats into it and whatever mods you expect (like might stacks). It autoupdates most everything.

Thaddeus.4891:

Did you two guys just stopped at this sentence and didn’t continue to read? I talked about that more later and I still don’t see how you can do 15k dps without direct damage. If i include 4 other players getting the venom I reach near 8k, not 15k.

Look at the spreadsheet I linked. You are comparing optimal DPS of a condi engi or zerk DH vs some numbers you pulled from one video. I’ve hit 19k on a poison tic with no food or multiple other bonuses. I’ve seen pics of 30k poison tics from VS thieves.

Rising Dusk.2408:

Thaddeus.4891:

Wait a sec. Venomshare don’t help his dps. He give more dps to the other. I hope you don’t count the dps of other getting his venom as his dps right?

That’s the coolest part about VenomShare—It is your DPS because the game counts it as you applying the conditions from the venoms. So when an ally with a venom strikes the VG, it’s the Thief applying the condition, gaining the benefits from traits / condition duration, etc.

Correct. And even if it counted as allied DPS and not yours it’s still damage the thief is adding to the group so I don’t see what difference it makes. In a five man sharing scenario, you can easily hit around 15k not including direct damage.

Edit: as for your warrior comparison, there’s a big difference. You dont count banners because you don’t know how it affects the DPS of others completely. With venoms it’s well defined. 30 stacks of poison with the thief’s condi damage and duration. I can give you the exact amount of damage every stack will do, and that damage is entirely because the thief used a skill and runs with certain stats, so it is counted as his DPS (ignoring the fact that the game actually does count it as the thief’s stacks).

Also, a chrono may have low DPS, but you want them because of the ~20% DPS boost they bring to everyone with alacrity. You can’t quantify with a DPS number, but you quantify it as a percent and count it as a benefit of chrono. So you can’t just ignore 80% of the venom effectiveness because other people are needed.

Thaddeus.4891:

Ok here my approch. I looked at your video during the Red Guardian phase because that’s where you concentrate the most on dps. You never heal and dps as much as you can.

The fight start a 6:05 and finish at 5:36. It’s hard to seel with the low quality so feel free to tell me if I make a mistake. So the total fight last 41 seconds.

You did 1 Steal, but you could have done 2 so I’ll give you 2 steal. So here the list of attacks during that 41 seconds fight.

- 2 Steal, 2 Trap, 2 of each venom, 8 Lotus and 8 Dodge and 4 full auto-attack sequence. Again feel free to step in if I made a mistake. If anything I think that I gave you too much attacks, but it’s ok.

That give in total 294 hits (because several attack have 3 hits) so on average you should trigger Dagger training 98 times during that fight.

Total of 704 seconds of poison, 609 second of bleed and 146 second of Torment. In reality you have a lot of condition left on the bar when the guy is dead so not all those condition are actually part of your dps, some are wasted. But for simplicity stake let’s include all of that in your dps. Let’s not forget the 33% power to poison and a constant 10% to all condition damage because of your trait. Let’s also not forget the +5% condition damage from rune of Berserker because it doesn’t increase you condi dmg stat, but do increase your damage number. I’ll also take into account that the guardian move always so the torment do more damage. I also took into consideration +170 and +750 condi damage stats from banner and might.

That give us a total number of 195323 damage divided by 41 seconds for 4763 dps of condi. Tbh the swap sigil was useless there so you number could have been higher. But that’s pretty low don’t you think? I don’t really know what’s the engineer dps now, but from what I remember pre-hot it was around 21k with the perfect rotation. Now with viper but the nerf to food, it’s higher than that. But lets say that to be competitive it need to at least reach 18k dps like the Guardian can in theory. And let say that you could reach 5k condition damage with the right sigil. Do you think that your condi thief can do 13k of direct dps? And if he can, what does it say on condi thief if 75% of their damage come from direct damage?

I know that that kind of math can be wrong and feel free to tear that apart if you can. I would love to have 9 condi build that are around the 18-20k dps mark, one for each profession. But I doubt that it’s the case, at least for the thief it doesn’t seem so.

I didn’t do the math on direct damage, but it seem that a condi thief can do between 10 and 15k dps, which is very low for raid. It’s the same dps I have on my engineer when I tank in half rabid with no flamethrower or when I do the circle on my engineer at VG and can’t dps properly for 80% of the fight.

Huge problem. Red only has three people, so he loses 40% of his venom dps since he isn’t sharing with five. Also, I don’t know where you got your numbers, but I count closer to 1000 effective seconds of poison (4 per dagger training, 216 per spider, 40 per steal, 12 per auto chain, and 20 per trap), didn’t look at the others. Given that I can reach 15k DPS in highly suboptimal conditions, I’d say your math is off somewhere.

Rising Dusk.2408:

Video
Build

The most important thing to remember is the +33% damage to poison trait, which makes poison application incredibly strong for the Thief. Otherwise check it out! I promise it’s really good!

I made a spreadsheet specifically for maxing venomshare DPS, and it seems pretty solid. I even measured 15k DPS in a fractal recently with low might stacks, dire armor, and no sigil bonuses (didn’t swap for doom proc and had no corruption stacks).

Spreadsheet