Guild Wars 2

BlackBeard.2873:

apharma.3741:

Enjoy your new druid/scrapper/diamond skin ele bunkers.

All of those builds, while strong, fold to focus-fire quite quickly, as their defense is based on healing and soft mitigation (like protection), while chronobunkers had so much hard mitigation (invuln) that they could EASILY 1v2 or 1v3 for a very long time with no counterplay.

Yes, druid/scrapper/tempest need a nerf (like all of the elite specs still), but they aren’t as game-breakingly OP. For the rest of the season, at least there will be more viable builds (even if everything is still heavily bunky).

I don’t agree with you about ele bunker, DF it has more than enough evade frames, shocking aura, condition cleansing, healing for self and allies, stun breaks, stab, stupid high protection and generally should be able to hold a 2v1 almost indefinitely.

Besides, most EU teams were not running double mesmer, this double mesmer was an NA issue not EU where the mesmers were being focused hard and fast.

P.s. I don’t mind the precog blur to distortion, I mind the 0.75s cast which makes it very hard to use, otherwise I think the shaving down is alright. I don’t think more needs doing though but we will see.

The sad thing is you’d think this was 1945 in the PvP forum and VE Day as if some epic fight between good and the evil mesmer had been won. Some are still saying it’s not enough.

Stilgar.6437:

calm down it was the worst build of all time. not only massively OP but so annoying to fight against, it simply made pvp not fun on any level of play. it ruined the pro league and the league system launch. props to devs for hotfixing it. The build is still OP in a way, but at least it has a major downside.

Mesmer is so strong in general due to alacrity, it will still have a place in the meta. But at least this bunker abomination is dead.

So very wrong.

DD ele after spec patch before they nerfed blinding ashes was the worst build of all time. They literally had to change the ESL rules to prevent people bringing 4 and a thief and dominating any team not bringing 4 eles.

Funny how people forget the way teams stacked 2-3 of guards, engies, eles and warriors at various times but suddenly lose their kitten if 2 of necro, ranger, mesmer and probably thief get stacked.

Enjoy your new druid/scrapper/diamond skin ele bunkers.

Good Tofu.9376:

I think people are really failing to see that the dps difference between Assassin’s and Commander’s is so small. Its actually quite imbalanced as to how good Commander’s is in comparison.

I think you’re failing to see that a revenant is such a large boost to the party that there is 0 reasons for a chrono to ever be in a party without one. Which brings us all the way back to you not needing commander gear as you can run boon duration food and leadership runes.

Also I do not have much confidence in your dps calculator that you linked it does not take into account a ton of things like cast times, coefficients of different skills, rotations etc. So I would refrain from using it as any form of benchmark.

Well of precog becoming distortion as a hot fix…oh and it gets a 0.75s cast time but no after cast because having a cast time on a stunbreak makes sense.

For the source check page 5 of the link above or patch notes in a few hours when they hotfix it.

For lulz compare it to EU.

I’d rather they trim the stats on the amulets to adjusting traits too much especially if they maintain the no split between PvE and PvP. Example, reducing the power on zerker amulets, adjusting down the toughness and vitality on tanks amulets till they’re in a position people like.

Raids were designed and tested with things like elite specs being as rediculous as they currently are, nerfing damage will hurt raids in terms of what is viable and what isn’t. I don’t want to be in a situation where 1 team comp is leagues above everything else for 1 boss just because those damage mods aren’t used in PvP so get a free pass. Case in point burn warrior on gorseval.

Edit: Before someone brings it up, I’m not averse to nerfing where necessary to traits and skills just not massive gutting of them like we have seen in the past.

apharma.3741:

Does whining on the forums reddit till ANet replace all weapons with silly string and noodles count as a counter?

Called it.

At least it isn’t as bad as revenants. They’re on the fast track to 2 years of nerfs till they bleed and get wrekt by ambient chickens.

Would be nice if they remade the entire weapon from the ground up starting with solid auto attacks.

At the moment every other class I have that can use a sceptre uses it more than my ele main and she has the legendary one -.-

Good Tofu.9376:

1. If boon duration can exceed 100% , there is no doubt that commander+ leadership is better. This should be tested out.

It shouldn’t exceed 100% unless facet of nature allows you to break it. Unless someone says otherwise 100% is the cap.

There is absolutely 0 reasons for a chronomancer to be there without a herald in any raid at the moment.

If boon duration is capped at 100% then Rev (50%) + leadership runes (30%) +boon duration food (20%) will cap you so you won’t need commanders gear.

You know I once had the idea of getting 10 (2 parties of 5) mesmers running PU with MI and running around WvW with 20 supply each completely invisible. You would be able to get all the way to the furthest away towers and get enough superior Rams up and the gates down quick enough to flip even the most upgraded tower.

Still possible at a 7.5s duration and trained 72s cool down, food for thought maybe to the OMFG WvW =P

Does whining on the forums reddit till ANet replace all weapons with silly string and noodles count as a counter?

Server loyalty mattered to me after the first mass exodus of guilds from WSR…

Server loyalty took a hit when the second mass exodus of guilds took WSR from mid bronze to second to bottom and a barren wasteland…

Server loyalty can go shove itself up [explicative] after the third exodus leaving you nothing to do but solo keeps and flip a border on your own because you are the only one in the entire map.

The WvW system needs a drastic shake up to fix core issues between peak and off peak times, ability to actually play with your friends who may not be on your server and to make it less of a k train. I don’t want an EotM style megaserver but there is merit to the idea of filling up otherwise empty maps or closing empty maps which is what mega server is also about.

Ask a mod to move this to Mesmer forum, they don’t bite…much.

Title of his post a year ago is stealth classes are OP in PvP.

Current most powerful mesmer build has no stealth.

Thanks for the laugh.

Chaith.8256:

• Well of Precognition becoming Distortion instead of Blur. This puts it in the invulnerability category, but reducing some counterplay such as warding effects, shocking auras.
• Temporal Enchanter (resistance and super speed) changed to only affect nearby allies.
• Mender’s Purity – 10 second ICD on Power Cleanse, like other ‘on heal’ minors.

In addition I find Countless’ suggestion on Chaotic Dampening I think is very reasonable.

• Well of precog change would be nice, would help bring some form of counter play to the well as others mentioned.
• Temporal enchanter gives super speed and resistance around the glamour, as far as I can tell it only has relevance with time warp in the bunker mesmer as few to any use the utility null field or feedback. I don’t feel this change is needed.
• Mender’s purity is the only thing keeping mantra of recovery relevant, the bunker Mesmer doesn’t use it and I hardly think healing with CS to trigger this is that game breaking.

Chaotic dampening going down to 2.5s would make it worse than elemental shielding an adept trait for ele. Shaving it down to 4s might be ok but I’d rather see runes of durability losing its boon duration as it is undoubtedly the strongest rune in the game.

I’d like to see the counters of boon corruption, unblockable CC/damage and condi overload become a bit more viable in the face of viper revenant.

Edit: EU bunker Mesmer doesn’t seem to run mantra of recovery.

They’ve been playing with each other for well over a year with a regular and consistent roster. Quite frankly I’m more amazed at them still being individual entities instead of slowly merging into some weird 5 man blob thing.

Oh and they also play things that are very strong so not sure where you get the “they play things deemed UP” aspect.

Most people when they say condi reaper are meaning the popular signets of suffering with double/triple signet and corrupt boon with sceptre-warhorn and staff.

If you’re running dhuumfire too you should be stacking bleed, poison, torment, cripple, burn, chill and fear in decent quantities and pretty often especially if you have the auto proc of focus 5. Put simply you’ll be keeping up high condition pressure and decimating the boons and with many unblockable attacks and how stab corrupts to fear you can essentially make bunker mesmer have a hard time being relevant.

Trigr.6481:

apharma.3741:

With a solid nerf to alacrity you remove mesmer from any and all PvE meta as well as making it almost meaningless.

I think it’s pretty clear this is a “How to delete Mesmer from Most game modes”. Head over to the mesmer forum and there’s already a thread on this exact topic.

Personally I think changing blur on precog to distortion so it doesn’t count to point cap as well as tuning Rev so the DH and reaper counters come into play more will solve the bunker mesmer problem.

Simply nerfing alacrity is removing mesmer from the pve meta? Your statement is over exaggerated. Stacking alacrity the way it is now is childs play, if you believe that mesmers can’t be viable in pve, pvp, or otherwise without perma alacrity then you are doing something wrong my friend.

Countless

Yes it is as mesmer dps while no longer in the “ranger frost spirit is better that a Mesmer” is still pretty poor compared to DH, warrior, Rev, ele, engy. Literally you bring a Mesmer for 2 things atm, alacrity and quickness.

Nerf alacrity as much as you suggest makes group alacrity about 6s which is laughably bad and not worth it. Quickness can be covered by running a couple of DH (usually already 1 or 2) with facet of nature.

Boom no need for mesmer and group DPS is better, enjoy doing something wrong my friend.

With a solid nerf to alacrity you remove mesmer from any and all PvE meta as well as making it almost meaningless.

I think it’s pretty clear this is a “How to delete Mesmer from Most game modes”. Head over to the mesmer forum and there’s already a thread on this exact topic.

Personally I think changing blur on precog to distortion so it doesn’t count to point cap as well as tuning Rev so the DH and reaper counters come into play more will solve the bunker mesmer problem.

Yeah the game was very different 1.5 years ago, remember people calling me mad for running zerker staff ele in WvW, now everyone runs it.

I dunno what is up then with C&D for you. For me it’s always had issues with latency and hitting erratically moving targets and seems prone to disagreements with the server as to where people are.

They did say they were making changes to where objects were being rendered a few months ago but not as early as Feb if I remember correctly. Even then it should have helped you with landing it not messed it up. Hope you get to the bottom of it.

Jana.6831:

My graphics are pretty low and I can hit stationary targets, perfectly.
As soon as the move just one bit I’ll miss.

I noticed this a long time ago, for me C&D isn’t easy to land on unpredictable targets which is why I stopped playing dagger offhand over a year ago outside of PvE. Then again I generally have a ping of 70-150 with varying amounts of packet loss so for me it is most likely a latency issue.

Give in to the pistol offhand!

Megaservers as they are in PvE (which is technically what WvW is lol) is definitely not what I would ever want. It would only hinder playing with people you want to play with as well as messing things up royally.

If there was some kind of multi server system which say correlated coverage and player numbers and would allow a few servers on the same team to fight a super server then I could be game.

Example: vabbi, ruins of surmia and ring of fire vs dzagonur and Miller sound vs angry rock. That I could enjoy if it allows for a varied experience which lets otherwise low population servers have weeks with higher team population and other weeks where it’s the usual 3 server fights.

I’d also like a way to either have a free transfer every few months or something so I can play with all my friends on other servers every now and then. Would also be nice to be able to WvW with my guild on deso for guild missions too.

Personally I like it but it has been toned down too much, it needs to be more distinguishable that you 1. Have an aura and 2. It is in fact chaos armour.

Right now most of the auras look very similar with a small differentiation at the feet which is not easy to see. Yes they needed toning down but this is too much as you can’t reliably see what auras are present.

Yeah that’s my problem CntrlAltDefeat, they will nerf Mesmer so hard it won’t be a viable pick at all anymore and it won’t just slip out of PvP meta but also PvE.

I mean until the spec patch mesmer wasn’t a solid pick for teams due to the dominance of thieves where the tables were evened out. A few small tweaks to the point holding potential of well of precog would solve the problem especially when Rev is nerfed to mordor and back allowing bunker mesmer counters in.

OlrunTheBlade.1486:

I love how people are considering queuing as a team “exploiting” if you’re better than them.

I guess it will come down to just how low the lower MMR player is. I mean if you keep queuing up with someone on a Nooby McDerpson MMR then you’re getting into the manipulation territory. If they’re still in the top 100 players then it’s all good.

Another thing people didn’t point out is that in terms of damaging conditions confusion is probably dead last in PvE. The over time base tick isn’t that great and mobs just don’t activate skills enough to make it worthwhile…not when you compare it to burns, poison, bleeds etc from a lot of other classes. Even torment would be better as you can kite mobs around to get more from it.

Though if you wanna have a ton of fun use shield 5 and mistrust on a Zerg in WvW. You’ll need as much +duration as you can get to mitigate a zergs -duration but if you time it right expect to see large purple numbers =D

I think the best suggestion I saw was to change well of precognition to distortion so it prevents point capture. It’s a slight buff in some cases as it gives true invulnerability to 5 players but we all know something like that won’t happen.

Edit: Below is what will happen not because it makes sense but because that’s how stupid the balance seems to be.

So I think chaotic dampening protection will get a 15s ICD because raisins.
Bountiful disillusionment nerfed to 1 stack of stab because lol.
Illusionary inspiration loses its regen because that really makes any difference.
Medics feedback gets no revive speed increase because a unicorn died.
Restorative illusions has its base healing scaled back by 50% but healing power effect increases by 50% because ha ha.
Well of precog cool down becomes 60s to make sure no-one uses it.
Shield block reduced to 1.5s and cool down increased to 45 seconds because we need less viable off hands.
Blurred frenzy increased to 15s CD because we need to hurt all mesmers and make sure they all spend 2 more years out of sight.

Btw I don’t agree with what is said there just in case you didn’t get the hint at “because a unicorn died”.

Naming and shaming is against the forum policy certainly. I dunno if it’s against the wider terms and conditions though but you should be very careful about saying you’re going to name and shame.

I must say I laughed at this change. Not because of any prejudice to thieves but because of how uncalled for and out of the blue it came.

Who knows, hopefully it’s a bug and someone from ANet can comment on this change, maybe on Reddit?

Candiru.5279:

Cat Has Ducks.1982:

Candiru.5279:

big disadvantage? how is the Balance?

Elites take a huge Mr.Hanky all over the old specs. With exception of berserker because it is awful atm.

You can still make some work, but you will be playing with a limited deck of cards.

What class you play?

oh thats bad thx for the info

engi and ele

I’d say you’ll be fine, they weren’t exactly weak before HoT.

Yeah, yeah, it’s the PvE players that are toxic to PvP not posts like the OPs.

As Deimos said, the PvE players go elsewhere for their PvP dailies. With leagues maybe we will start seeing better matchmaking so whatever the OPs problem that s/he didn’t mention is resolved.

Daniel Handler.4816:

There is a lot bias going on in this conversation against the OP.
Take the french. “I can never hit them”

1337 Mesmorz: Well that sounds like your problem

Actual reason: He has almost perma chaos armor and a third of my attacks are blinded. The other others are either blocked, evaded, or invulned.

Mesmers are behaving like S/D thieves are people are not accustomed to it. Kill it the same way you would kill an S/D thief.

Old SD when it was the mandatory +1 decap 50% evade uptime beast or the less old SD when they changed flanking strikes and a few other things including fire and air?

The bunker Mesmer I don’t agree with comparing to SD simply because SD used the marauder (berserker back then) amulet and had that level of survivability. The current bunker Mesmer has all the things you mentioned but uses celestial amulet so isn’t as much of a threat, sure it survives a long time but put a mallyx revenant or signet necro in there and it’ll die swiftly.

I know some of NA is using the well of precog, shield marauder build but it doesn’t have high chaos armour uptime or protection with it so I don’t think you’re meaning that one.

Needless to say I think a lot of people are eagerly waiting for tonight’s pro league to see how well a lot of these builds perform against who. Reason being EU was essentially the vets vs the new guys last week which wasn’t really fair, we could have seen condiseth come out and still won most likely.

This is the kind of behaviour you can expect from most thief players whether they’re at the bottom of the food chain or the top which is why I have little to no sympathy for the current state they’re in.

As for the topic, try posting your build as said above with the build editor, a few little improvements or changes can really help preserve your style and give you a better chance. At the bottom of the build window is a quick link box, copy it and paste it here please, don’t be shy, some people will help without being horrible about it.

Are you sitting in longbow a lot of the time? Switching to a melee set like great sword or sword and dagger or torch would be better when they close in on you and has good evasion on skills. Longbow does less damage the closer you are to targets.

Condition damage really hurts thieves that don’t have shadow arts and most don’t bother to spec for damaging condition clears so that’s always an option.

What pet are you using, some of them are better than others for dealing with different situations. You could also try asking in the ranger forums.

Finally, you should either make a thief and play around with the skills to see how they work and thier weaknesses. Get a friend and go to an empty server and duel them a bit, practise timing your interrupts on the vault, dodging it, finding how big the AoE is etc.

Finally to those who play thief, yes this is a learn to play issue but you don’t have to be a complete kitten about it. I know there is information “out there” on this but newer players aren’t as savvy with the forum and its many navigational problems.

DeceiverX.8361:

Aw c’mon guys. How do you think we thieves feel about all this stealth nonsense and seeing it even on guardians ._.

I don’t agree with the OP either but it’s mainly because I think stealth in this game is very poorly implemented.

I don’t main mesmer but I’ve always wanted to play it more.

The changes with HoT made Mesmer a lot more user friendly in PvE with phantasms taking 95% less damage unless the target of an attack. They still suffer from the not getting buffs so can’t damage the enemies BS.

I do play mesmer a lot more in PvP and WvW roaming, the ability to use a 7.5s stealth and blink away really helps escape those very angry national servers.

Jana.6831:

Yes, it can be any boon of those listed and it’s always swiftness – I tried it and got aegis ~every third time for 11.5 seconds. And maybe it also affects what boons you already have, so if you’re below 70% and have already regen and protection you rather get a new boon on top of that, which would be retaliaton or aegis likely – Just stand around with your mesmer for a while.

No it doesn’t, it does exactly what it says on the tin, random boon, you can already have that boon and it just extends the duration or adds to the stack in the case of might as normal for boons.

There is no magical way to guarantee you get one you want.

Jana.6831:

Thanks for repeating everything again
I singled it out because you bug me about “mesmers have no protection let alone passively appield” each time you see me mentioning mesmers (and others) invulnerabilities.
I get that no one wants their class to be nerfed but if you read my last post and this one and also remember that mesmers have got passively applied protection/invulnerability/aegis on a very low cooldown, their clones, portals, shadowstep, invisibility, active protection – when should I hit them?

I hope someday you’ll get my point – it’s not against mesmers per se but against all the passively applied invulnerabilities and OP skills that “one shot” with one press of a button.

I didn’t bug you about mesmers, I asked about what “passive Invulnerabilities” you were talking about and asked you to list them. You made it about mesmers, I was meaning the list of classes you mentioned, guards, eles and scrappers you listed with mesmers. I do have to chuckle at you not mentioning one of the kings of auto procs, Warriors, in that list.

Please find me a post where I have ever said mesmers have no access to protection. I have said they have no passive invulnerabilites and it is for the most part true. The only time you can get that is by taking the extremely non meta and bottom of the pile blurred inscriptions trait with illusionary inspiration which still has a cast time of the phantasm, usually 1s.

I think I can safely say I will never get your point because half the stuff you complain about is on the thief class and not exactly on bad trait lines (-25% damage reduction in stealth, lots of teleports, blinds, perma protection, regen, swiftness and good access to aegis if fighting Mesmer, instant cool down recharge randomly) and the other half is a gross exaggeration to put it mildly.

Jana.6831:

Since this thread is still pretty offtopic:
I’m not sure if aegis would be a guardian shield on mesmers, otherwise that really could be the tiny bubble I mean.
I stood around with my mesmer yesterday. She had the signet of inspiration and also the chaos line and would randomly gain aegis for 11,5s – so that really could be what I mean – and whenever she got swiftness and regen she also got protection (3 boons on her: swiftness, regen, protection) – maybe that’s a bit too much tbh. 11,5s aegis possibly every 10 seconds (although it did not renew itself while I watched it = every 20s), -33% of damage possibly every 10-15s at any time with a higher chance when below 75% (signet and minor).
Yes, I should pay more attention to the boons on my target. Anyway, my point still stands; too much passively applied protection since June on a lot of classes.

Aegis looks the same on everyone, it’s the same shield icon on all classes.

Signet of inspiration grants 5s of swiftness and then a random boon every 10s usually for 5s. It can be any boon except swiftness, quickness and resistance as far as I know. It is extremely random though so it’s not like mesmers are running around with aegis, protection and regen up most of the time. It is however used a lot actively in small groups for gives excessive amounts of long duration boons.

Chaos is a popular line for roaming mesmers because of PU. There are 2 minors, one granting 10s of regen when struck below 75% and the other granting 3s of protection when you get regen, both with a 15s ICD.

I just don’t see why you singled out mesmer for passive invulns almost immediately when you have classes (including thief if you pick them) have similar auto procs some of which are much stronger. I know warriors aren’t in a great state but them and engineers are the masters of auto proc save me kitten.

Yeah the chrono bunker and the 1 in 100 Mesmer that is running a non standard shatter (inspiration line) are not as susceptible to conditions.

Boon hate is good against chrono bunker, in particular condition revenants and signet necros. I kinda wish ANet had given a little more boon hate out with spec patch as I think it could have balanced the classes a bit better.

Mesmer is in a much better place in HoT than before HoT so I would recommend it on those terms.

Dungeons however got their gold rewards reduced by 2/3 so they aren’t really worth running anymore. Additionally condi Mesmer is only really strong in PvP/WvW roaming.

Current top picks for condition builds are: Engineer, Ranger, Necro, Warrior (large hit boxes).

Mesmer in raids can give timewarp on about a 70s cool down if using it with the continuum split, gives good quickness and alacrity on wells which boosts party dps and if you have 3 phantasms DPSing the boss you don’t lose too much by having to CC adds or break out of melee etc.

A lot of improvements came with HoT for a lot of classes so I’d say it’s worth getting and also trying new classes.

To add to what Silverkey said, condi usually wrecks Mesmer as most do not have condition clears on the build between running portal, blink and either well of precog or decoy.

I will literally run from any condi fight as a power shatter mesmer if they look like they have enough sense to dodge a mirror blade. It’s a fight I will not win.

Actually I was asking about all the classes Jana mentioned not just mesmers. I mean I get all the blocks and elixer S procs especially with old vamp runes on engineers but eles don’t have a lot of invuln auto procs.

Jana.6831:

At least mesmers, partly guards, eles have got passive invulnerabilities – so it’s not in their hands when to “spam them”. Oh and scrapper – constantly invulnerable.

You’ve said this before. In the interests of staying constructive is there any chance you can list these passive invulnerabilities, especially the ones that are not in their hands?

Ross Biddle.2367:

Pymeowthiest pioneered bunker Mes.

Can also confirm hearing him waffle on about the power of Condi Chrono. Like some old cat and his fishing tales.

Fixed, might as well get some fun out of the thread =P

Oh and OP I’d say Mesmer lays on the confusion and torment a little thicker than revenant if you can get them to hit the counter and with a good shatter rate and alacrity. Thing is rev has better access to burn and poison so I’d say it’s slightly better.

aelfwe.4239:

caerulean.4837:

I’ve heard that mesmer DPS in raids is subpar compared to other professions and that we’re mostly taken for the high alacrity and quickness uptime. I just wanted to know if it’d be worth playing a mesmer in the raids, especially if there’s already a mesmer on the team, or if I’d be better off trying it out on an elementalist?

Mmh,

you can surely complete raid with 2 mesmer (some guild has already done it in that way) but yesterday defeating vale guard with pugs i was the only chrono and quickness\alacrity uptime was more than enough (we had really huge dps and good timer).

So basically you can complete raid with 2 chrono but 1 chrono is more than enough.

Personally i didnt had any issue till now to find a spot like chrono but if you want to be “the class who everyraid is LF” leave mesmer and ele and just go viper engie and gg.

ps.
i dont speak for ele cause i dont play it and i have no personal experience about how much easy or hard is to find a spot with class

Ele can hold its own pretty well in raids but you want to be D/F and tempest. Wash the pain away is a great heal for you and allies and slotting a shout like feel the burn with the healing auras trait helps keep the team and scholar bonuses up. Ele can also make a really good healer/tank allowing the other 9 players to go all in DPS.

As for mesmer, I find the time warps are the most beneficial but you want to make sure you have a revenents facet of nature on you when using well of action and timewarp. 50% boon duration gives 5 people something silly like 25s of quickness, more if you use food and runes of leadership for even more duration.

Making sure you use the time warps at the right time and usually only in continuum split is the key.

Zeghart.9841:

If I’m just interpreting what you’re saying in a bad way then I’m sorry, I’m honestly not doing that on purpose. They’re just the ideas your post seems to imply.

I think the best way to put it is I’m apathetic to the current situation of the classes, hope that clears it up.

Zeghart.9841:

That said we both agree on the fact that they can’t stay in this state for long – but the problem is that HoT has already been out for a month now, and many of these problems were identified in the feedback of the beta, if not even before that. That feedback was ignored, and the devs have been silent. And with proleague shining a bright light on how dire the War/Thief situation is and the state of spvp because of it, an outcry is the least you can expect. This isn’t just a War/Thief problem, but about the credibility of a supposedly competitive tournament as well.

True but then in beta testing people were saying that tempest was absolutely terrible, dragon hunter was poor, chronomancer was going to dominate everyone and everything and it didn’t quite play out like that. I guess I just remain hopeful that the Devs are taking the time to bring proper in depth balance patches in between leagues (so that’s bi monthly) that really will get classes that are underperforming in line and over performing aspects toned down.

Either way I think most people in the thread will also agree classes not being competitive shouldn’t continue past the next big balance patch.

I said it in a thread a long time ago.

Condi Revenant is going to have the same problems as condi Mesmer because it’s mostly torment and confusion based.