Guild Wars 2

Jibber Crabst, this community needs something new to do :-/

They won’t even see this thread, as devs don’t read this forum (no one at ArenaNet is working on dungeons, so no one needs to stay up-to-date about them).

You should post this in the Bugs subforum so it can be ignored instead of not-seen (again, the “no one at ArenaNet is working on dungeons” thing).

I hope so. I always thought Centaur Runes existed solely for the healing mantra :P

Srs — mesmers have poor swiftness uptime (Temporal curtain is useless if its not the first application of swiftness), and here come these runes that provide AoE swiftness everytime you heal…and mesmers have a heal that can be popped 3-4 times very quickly….

Too perfect not to be intended

Requires effort + involves dungeons = no can do

Love the idea, though.

Oooh, they’re gonna get leaderboards for the Adventures, too!

That sounds familiar….

“At Lupi, need guardian who can wallsploit” when there are already two guards in the party…SMH.

Was AFKing in Rata Sum the other day and overheard a conversation in /say in which someone was bragging about fighting Lupi in a party without abusing wall-on-wall. People were actually impressed.

WTF happened to you, Arah Q_Q

Rymer.4017:

1. Remove the repair anvil in the dungeon this way if you die and respawn you have to live with the broken armor.

They tried this in fractals — people just log out/log in/repair/re-enter instance. It’s been broken like that for 3 years, I wouldn’t expect ArenaNet to fix it, and we’d just see the same thing in dungeons.

Also, this would just make it harder on newer players. Those who are complaining about stale, easy content never touch the repair anvil, except maybe at the beginning of the dungeon. Wipes are rare these days in experienced groups, and having enough wipes to break armor completely is almost unheard of.

2. You do not get the out of combat hp regin this would then require more support healers and a more defensive type of play to it.

Nope, it would require people to leave combat, wait for their self heal to come off cooldown (if needed) and heal. This just adds wait times after a fight, it doesn’t make healers necessary.

Heh, and like Nike said — full DPS spec’d classes can do a ton of AoE healing, too. “Requiring a healer” in this game just means “require a water field and blast finisher” :-)

3. If you die you do not recover from resurrection sickness till you finish the dungeon. This way there is more risk to dying if you do not have the support to keep you from death.

Again, experienced groups looking for “the next level” of challenge wouldn’t be affected by this. That said, having some consequences/possibility-of-failure in the dungeons would be a nice addition, though folks would still find a way around it, like the FotM relog-to-repair trick.

Just my 2c — remember that the people who are bored aren’t dying, or really taking that much damage during the fights. We need new content to challenge us — not gimmicks added to make the stale, old content more frustrating and slow.

Purple Miku.7032:

dlonie.6547:

bladex.9502:

Anet should remove the option to see the amount of achievement points someone has accumulated, since it has nothing to do with dungeons themselves.
But somehow most people still think it’s a relevant scale for someone’s skill….

AP is totally a great indicator of dungeon skill — I mean, look at this scrub. Prolly wears a shield on his head. Certainly couldn’t handle Arah or FotM 50 without a hard carry.

Who wouldn’t kick?

<3

You’re just jealous because my warrior has full yellow clerics with dwayna runes and yours doesn’t!

Nah bruh, Golemancer Runes OP

I’m honestly just amazed that you’ve managed to keep it so low. I’m at 6.5k without even trying :P

bladex.9502:

Anet should remove the option to see the amount of achievement points someone has accumulated, since it has nothing to do with dungeons themselves.
But somehow most people still think it’s a relevant scale for someone’s skill….

AP is totally a great indicator of dungeon skill — I mean, look at this scrub. Prolly wears a shield on his head. Certainly couldn’t handle Arah or FotM 50 without a hard carry.

Who wouldn’t kick?

<3

Eirdyne.9843:

- remove achievement points from being visible in dungeons or in party.

- remove the linking of armor stats within dungeons to allow for players to play support roles, condition roles, and etc.

- disallow use of damage meters

- Create a Terms of Service agreement that bars players from being able to do all of the above.

- armor linking cannot occur before one hour and ten minutes after finishing a dungeon.

Thing is, they aren’t trolls. Those are just regular PUGs. There was nothing unusual about your experience in this game.

These dungeons are legacy farming content. No one runs dungeons for fun anymore — with one minor exception, there have been no new themed dungeons added since launch.

The way dungeons are run today are to skip all mobs/bosses possible and DPS bosses down as quickly as possible, and people expect things to go quickly. If they don’t, they’ll start kicking you.

This used to just be confined to speedclear groups (which is fine, if you join a speedclear group and can’t keep up, you should be kicked, lol), but it’s disheartening to hear that this is happening in “full clear” advertised groups. Sorry you had that experience, but I do have a couple recommendation — maybe try to get a full group of friends together or join a laid-back guild that runs dungeons.

Other than that, this isn’t join to change. The PUG environment in this game is a cesspool more often than not. You can find gems in the rough, but there’s a lot of crap to sift through.

I like your suggestion for a separate LFG section for speed groups. We’ve asked for a hard-mode / normal-mode system to help keep these player groups separated, but one of the few replies we’ve gotten from ArenaNet concerning dungeons is that hard-mode will never happen. I can dig up the link if you’re interested — they also said they don’t plan to make more. Quite an informative thread….

rotten.9753:

Wethospu.6437:

I have enough challenge with opening my daily login rewards.

Then don’t open them. You can only hold 4 unopened chests at the same time, after that, content of your old chests is automatically put into your inventory.

^Truth.

The struggle is real. Every day, log in, log out. Don’t even bother clicking them anymore. There’d be more but I got bored and cleared them out a while back.

#HardcorePvAFK

applauds

That was masterful. Nice choice.

There are worse food-measurement systems, I suppose

I like that your unit of measurement for mayonnaise is “finger”.

That does sound good…almost time for lunch…hurry up noon…

Shortening with obscene amounts sugar creamed in (like when making cookies) is probably the most delicious and satisfying thing to eat ever.

I’m not proud about knowing that, but it is what it is :P

Well, that one idea for a better experience indicator than AP.

Sits back and waits for the LFG screenshots and Gen Disc QQ

Oh man, is guardian sword really that dead now? It’s not even included in the tests?

I’d love to see that, Nike. Especially the “90s to kill with full DPS” bit.

I ran AC a few months ago with someone who hadn’t played since pre-ferocity. They laughed till they cried when the boss went down in 4 seconds during a 3-man run :-P

I brought it up as an exception to the “first generation dungeons” bit. It was very gimmicky in places, but they were at least trying something new. The community pretty consistently said “this isn’t a change for the better”, but instead of trying to iterate more, they just stopped.

Puzzles and gimmicks aside, some of the boss mechanics aren’t horrible, in my opinion. I’d take Slick and Sparki or Foreman Spur over Howling King or Rumbly any day, for instance. There was a step up in mechanics there, IMO.

Of course, that’s also looking at the neutered version of the AC bosses post NPE/Ferocity….they were a lot more fun before that, lol

Still, the main point was that if they’d continued iterating and investing in producing dungeons, there would be much more interesting encounters, and that the likely reason the ones we have feel so boring is because they are first generation, and created before the combat system was known.

I don’t really know what happened with Aetherpath. They weren’t really iterating at that point, because they just shoved it out, watched it flopped, and never even attempted to address any of the issues with it. I guess that’s what happens when there is no dedicated dungeon team…

Simple AI and lack of consequences for failure are good points too. Both could have been addressed in later generations, if they’d have cared to.

deSade.9437:

I don’t feel like gw2’s dungeons are so much more exciting than gw1’s. Playing trinity, despite the shortcomings, didn’t feel boring at all, at least there; it felt good to have a.. place in the world. Dungeons were fun, and unlike in gw2, you actually risked wipes and failure was a little more punishing.

How much of that was from just having something new to do from time to time?

Aside from Aetherpath, the GW2 dungeons were more or less created blind. They had an idea of what the classes would do, but the combat system was more or less a giant unknown — they were first generation content created before the combat in the game started to gel and before the players (and devs) really knew what the limits of the system were.

Aetherpath, for all of its warts, is a step up in terms of mechanics. Some are gimmicky, some aren’t great, but even then — they’re something new, they’re experiments. They are second generation mechanics — better, but still with some room to improve.

If there were still a dungeon team to create content and work with the players to push the systems and push PvE beyond those early iterations, I doubt we’d be saying that GW2 dungeons are boring.

Alas…que sera, sera…

One of my favorite mods for WildStar is AuraMastery: http://www.curse.com/ws-addons/wildstar/220014-aura-mastery

It had a steep learning curve, but was worth it. You could add custom UI to popup a message/icon/etc when skills were on/off cooldown and could use all sorts of triggers to determine when to show/hide/grey out/etc the indicators. You could even have progressbar-like indicators for things like cooldowns and resources.

It was amazing. It’d be like having an icon flash up when you could CnD without losing the 6(?)-initiative DPS boost while showing a visual indicator of how much initiative you’re waiting to regenerate. Then have it swap to a different indicator for heartseeker once the enemy’s health dropped below a certain threshold.

Lotsa fun to play around with. Too bad we can’t have mods here :-(

They do. I just watched a video on youtube to confirm….guess I’m rustier than I thought.

I was just about to edit that out and save myself the embarrassment, but now you’ve quoted me, preserving my brainfart for eons to come.

Thanks Jerus. :P

Sublimatio.6981:

deSade.9437:

Is this “renevant” thing a side-joke I don’t understand…?

irrevelant

FTFY.

BTW, couldn’t help but remember this wonderful thread when I saw that xD

NikeEU.7690:

One issue I had with energy was that it wasn’t clear from looking at my tool bar how much energy I would need to use to cast a skill just by looking at it. And it wasn’t super clear how long I needed to regen energy for before my elite skill could turn on again.

Asking as someone with no experience on one — but was it different from, say, initiative on a thief? There’s not a clear indicator (other than stopping to read a tooltip) of when a thief has enough initiative to use weapon skills 2-5. Maybe it’s something they just expect you to memorize like the other classes?

Or was there really just no mention of resource requirements on the skills?

Edit I’m a kitten er. They do grey out on thief.

fishball.7204:

dlonie.6547:

Am I missing something, or does anyone else smell a flop? :-/

The beta was only a super small subset of players. Combining EU and NA total, still less than 500 people (more like ~300?), it shouldn’t be too surprising there isn’t many post on there. It was nothing at all like the Revenent beta weekend.

We also gave feedback to the devs and map designers directly when they joined us on teamspeak so not really a lot needs to be posted on the forums.

I am missing something then Good. If there was really that little interest during a large scale test, it’d be a really bad sign. But for that small of a tester pool, it’s not so bad.

“omg this is too hard” has my vote. Followed quickly by the new “nerf defensive combos!” cries once they see coordinated full zerk/sinister teams clearing it faster than they can.

Just noticed this: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuvtest

There are a total of 20 threads in that forum, including the one that’s locked and the “Welcome to the subforum!” threads. Am I missing something, or does anyone else smell a flop? :-/

Of course I have a kittenty ISP. Aren’t they all?

TWC all day, like a boss. My router is also about 6 years old and was a cheapo I bought from Comcast way back when…so I’m probably long overdue for an upgrade…

But yeah, I can count on roughly two DC’s for every 4 hours played on a good day. Makes doing anything solo obscenely frustrating.

Mechanics that require teamwork and coordination go against their “put 5 random ubercasual snowflakes together and win” philosophy, though.

Remember: first and foremost, every encounter must be accessible to all and not make anyone feel frustrated or like they should improve their personal skill level. That’s not what GW2 is about. It’s about fashion and copious rewards for trivial “achievements” (Hey! You logged in! Here’s a chest with some shinies! GJ!!!!!!11!!!).

If people have to work together, communicate, or meet some skill threshold to complete content, it’s not appropriate for this game.

The team that made the original dungeons (and LS S1 dungeons) has been disbanded, and ArenaNet laid-off the team lead years ago.

So while they definitely used to know how to make these instances and had a team that showed a lot of promise for iterating them into something godkitten ed amazing, I’m not sure that possibility is still on the table.

Dismantling the dungeon team and getting rid of their lead was a conscious decision by the game designers and management, as has been the absolute neglect of dungeons since. It’s hard to believe that HoT will deliver anything for dungeon lovers — when you look at where we’ve been, it’s plain to see where we’re going.

I really don’t like being the negative raincloud, but I’ve held out hope that something good would happen for this community for far too long, and don’t want to see anyone else wasting their time waiting for something that’s not even a possibility. ArenaNet will never publicly announce that they’ve abandoned this area of their game, but the neglect and silence on the subject certainly aren’t giving us any reasons to hope for improvements.

In fact, in the lead up to HoT, they seem to be deliberately avoiding generating any instanced-PvE hype. If they have anything planned, it’s a tentative plan at best and will be the first deliverable to get cut when time starts running short — hence why they don’t want to say anything about it. They want the option to say “See? Clearing guild halls! Challenging group content!” when they run out of time to put in an actual team-based, replayable instanced challenge.

Perhaps internally, but if so, they’ve been hiding any kittens they give towards instanced PvE very well :-P

Here’s all we know:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Very-disappointing-news-for-you-guys

So no. Dungeons and fractals are a ‘possible but not likely’ area for ArenaNet to develop. They don’t want to put developer time towards making new ones (“Aetherpath was too much work”), and they’ll only step in to change something when there’s a game-breaking exploit.

Not only do they say “no big changes to current dungeons”, but also “no plans to make more at this point.” Granted, this was a while ago, but they certainly don’t seem to even be concerned with maintaining or supporting the content or the community when it comes to current dungeon issues either.

Once they announce what the “Challenging Group Content” for HoT is, we’ll have a stronger idea of where they intend to go with this. But looking at the last 2+ years of neglect and stagnation for instanced PvE in this game, those of us who have been paying attention don’t have a lot of hope, so I wouldn’t expect much.

Only if allies can pop the bubbles for cleansing.

GET IT? HA!

Cool, so long as the information is there, I’m happy

I added my RFC here: https://github.com/arenanet/api-cdi/pull/60.

RFC is up. Feel free to make suggestions: https://github.com/arenanet/api-cdi/pull/60

I agree with the checkbox. Two columns of check marks, one for all time and one for daily, would be a nice touch.

I’m not sure about the strikethrough idea. Is the plan to change the main page to have these elements on them? That might be unclear why certain paths are crossed out. The only path that should be crossed out is TAFU :P

A page with a more compact representation of this (e.g. all paths are visible at once) would be nice for determining what paths are left “at a glance.”

I’ll put an RFC for that API in this morning. It’ll be great if this can happen. Imagine, a world where someone asks “how do I know what paths I’ve done for DM?” and we can answer with more then “uuuummm….do you remember doing X? How about Y? Did you fight a Z?” xD

Jahroots.6791:

Of course it’s not okay, but the point I’m making is that an LFG description isn’t ironclad and doesn’t necessarily represent the views of the entire group. Sometimes people change their minds, or the party gets hijacked, anything can happen between the posting and starting the path… PUGs are volatile.

People saying one thing and doing another has always been a major IRL problem, and it’s completely unrealistic to expect MMOs to be exempt. It sucks but there is a very simple solution: Don’t PUG until you can handle it.

Sorry for the confusion, that was directed at Flaw, not you. You’re not the one who was railing against someone who joined an ‘all lvl, all welcome’ group at-level, calling it “toxic” and “bad behavior” :P I shoulda quoted.

You are correct — the description may not agree with what all of the players want. In a perfect world, players who disagree with the stated description would discuss changing it or leave the group instead of enforcing restrictions that contradict the description, but yeah. Not everyone seems to think things through.

That’s why the phrase “exp only” exists. If you don’t want to run with inexp players, don’t use “all welcome”. Pretty simple stuff.

If you honestly believe that advertising a group “all welcome” and then kicking players for being inexperienced is ok, or that an inexperienced player joining an “all welcome” LFG to learn the path and become experienced is being toxic, then I really don’t know what else to say.

Nevets Crimsonwing.5271:

If Mr. Hrouda or anyone else on the dungeon team could take a look, it would be much appreciated. Thanks!

15/10.

FlawlezZ.3178:

Anyway I was just saying that he’s toxic himself too and I would also kick him if he joins a group and comes with his low level character instead of his main character. Even if it says all levels welcome etc. It’s just bad behaviour and I don’t want to be in a group with someone like that, especially when he fails really hard and I need to carry him (I’d rather carry someone who is actually new to the game).

…

Playing a dungeon at-level in a group that’s advertised ‘all welcome’ is bad behavior and toxic. Wow.

You can go to any dungeon with any level.

Not using the LFG tool. It won’t let you even see LFGs for dungeons that you aren’t at level for. It could have been an explorable AC, but that’s an assumption on your part and even if true, it’s not a justification for calling the player toxic. Inexperienced with the dungeon system, sure, but to assume that they were trying to maliciously drag down the party…it’s a pretty twisted worldview for that to be the first thing that pops into one’s mind.

Evapor.6849:

Pretty sure we don’t need OP’s opinion at all, dungeons breed a toxic environment and you have a lot of wannabes that no nothing about the game yet they are running a meta copy pasta, have no idea how their class works or any mechanics and just flame everyone in the dungeon because somehow people think running a meta build means that nothing is your fault and your better than the other players in your party.

I run meta builds on all of my classes and use a sinister build on my engi I join just about every group, Sometimes if im in the mood i’ll carry noobies in all welcome groups and if they ask me for advice i’ll help them out. But the groups that form like ‘Zerk full run 5kap+’ immediately screams to me that everyone in that group is completely clueless and is bad at the game, the same thing happens when you join pugs that gearcheck you and then want to bug mossman, oneshot lupi or something it’s like those groups should just explicitly state that they are looking for someone to carry them instead of going through loops to end up flaming each other when they find out they are all terrible.

There are just a lot of bad players in this game that are making it to level 80 and can’t seem to handle the fact they know nothing.

This is true.

Watched Miku’s Arah bomb video again, got the itch to do some goating. First time in at least 4 months.

Spend about 15 minutes exploring, and … DC.

Alt+F4.

Now I remember why I stopped. I miss instance ownership :-(

FlawlezZ.3178:

dlonie.6547:

Measuring dungeon skill by AP…this just keeps getting better.

Please explain how having 7k AP implies dungeon experience. Genuinely curious what your logic is here.

Where did I say anything about dungeon skill? Assuming from his AP count he has thrown a lot of hours into GW2 and has leveled a character up to 80. How is he a new player? He deliberately worsens the group experience, because even though he could switch to a level 80 char, he doesn’t. If he’s not experienced with dungeons, why doesn’t he switch to his Lvl 80 character, where he’s allowed to do more mistakes?

Read more carefully:

viziel.4507:

Note: I ONLY joined groups that advertised (all lvls, all welcome) kinds of groups NO Zerg 80s groups!

If someone kicks a player (even a lowbie) from a group with that description, they’re a bit of a kitty, yeah?

He also mentions joining a group on the LFG at level 30 — there’s only one dungeon he could possibly be running in that case, and if lowbies are getting kicked from ‘all welcome’ parties for freakin’ AC story, then I agree — there’s a tryhard/toxicity problem in this game.

That’s not news — I mean, there always have been a lot of tryhards, but this level of kittenery is just getting obnoxious.

BTW, if you’re joining a lot of parties and getting kicked for being low level, try making your own group and put that you’re low level / learning in the description. You’re more likely to find a patient teaching group that way — or better yet, another group of players just learning fractals to figure everything out with :-)

Measuring dungeon skill by AP…this just keeps getting better.

Please explain how having 7k AP implies dungeon experience. Genuinely curious what your logic is here.

Update:

This issue is still affecting the live game.

FlawlezZ.3178:

viziel.4507:

Note: I ONLY joined groups that advertised (all lvls, all welcome) kinds of groups NO Zerg 80s groups!

I would kick you too. If you go to a dungeon with a low level character on purpose and you even mess up, your kick is well deserved.

WTF is wrong with you? You’re toxic, srsly

NovaanVerdiano.6174:

velmeister.4187:

Since ANET can’t prevent people from selling FoTM last boss via LFG because of numerous valid reasons, this is a request to the community to take action for healthy Pugging.

There are multiple instances where several folks kick a person out of the group and promptly sell it for 15-20g. It is stupid to buy into FoTM as the reward is not a guarantee but, the real problem is that there is no way to prevent a team from kicking someone and selling for profit.

When anyone sees an advertisement to sell last boss of FoTM, please join this group and keep abandoning them till they give up and try to recruit a proper team member to complete the instance or 4 man it themselves.

Enjoy your ban for griefing people.

Eh, they’re dungeon people, though. kitten ’em.

Lendruil.9061:

This should become a sticky.

Great list, dunno how I missed it until now. It’s good to have a reference for known bugs, preventative measures, and possible fixes.

If these aren’t going to get fixed, it be nice to at least make this information more visible.

This should become a sticky.

This should become a sticky.

This should become a sticky.

This should become a sticky.

IrisTheCasual.3742:

- “Alright, I’m sorry for healing you. Next time you walk back.”

And I held true to my words for the whole fractals.

claps

TheFamster.7806:

Go on strike and stop buying gems…? Idk i think that’s the only way to get ane’ts attention these days

lol, I stopped buying gems years ago when they broke Alphard.

Not going to give support to a company that can’t even answer “Did you mean to do this, or is it a bug?”

And here we are with Lupi. Go ANet, keep up the great work!

But yeah, there are enough people buying gems for shineys every patch that they really dgaf about us not buying them. They’d probably love it if all of us disappeared and no one touched any of the dungeons again.