Guild Wars 2

Right now we see a combination of lag + culling, post fix we are gonna see the lag portion clearly (and there is a lot lately esp after patches)

Its one step in a very broken game, but its a good one anyways.

Titus.9705:

Raijinn.9065:

It may be where we want it to be in about a year or so

Unfortunetly by then the already weak sPvP community will be near non-existent.

pvp builds around the world, and the wvw cant build community around fighting no name players, they are trying to turn it into a week long battleground of generic fighting.

Might as well turn it to 2 factions and make it a day long battleground, this is not rvr like we had hoped.

people interested in spvp moved to lol, it has a horrid community, but it has gameplay peopel like

the good thieves laugh at how easy it is, its even funnier to get 2 of them properly geared and speced and insta gib anyone in game before they are ever seen.

Be sure to invis for the stomp and then emote.

Really the only trick is picking your emote for the insta dead player.

stacking, culling, downed state, anonymous enemies need to be addressed.

instead expect a pvp dungeon to be added, but it will not be like darkness falls, it will be a buggy mess like vulture lord.

Everything else will be patches for spvp which miss the mark, and some holiday events.

The lack of direction will prevent more time alone fixing the problem.

They simply can’t build and deliver 4 games, spvp, wvw, low level pve leveling game and some sort of pve end game.

They punted on pve end game, ignored wvw, spent huge amounts of the their game development and artwork on the leveling game, and sit and wonder why spvp is duller than watching paint dry.

I love the artwork and creativity of the leveling game, but then you see the horrid contrast of the totally detached “wvw 1 week battleground instance”, and fighting generic red, blue green armies with no names and you wonder if they simply ran out of time, don’t care or don’t get it.

The characters all feel like they are not fully leveled up with only half their abilities unlocked, culling and stacking dominating game play in many situations, so I guess the “big changes” struck me as funny.

The problem here is trying to make world pvp an instanced battleground and assign a winner for pveing keeps at night.

You add that to a generic blue – green – red fight with no names and free transfers and you get pure garbage out

Its a minor change to spvp, its not “big changes to pvp”.

I laughed after reading this announcement, to see it was only about spvp..

I keep forgetting they think that practice mode crapola is pvp or even part of a game anyone would play.

The reality will hit home for these devs when they try to sell their first xpac.

Get alot of kills with or without downstate. It needs tweaks, its boring crush 20 people and have to stomp/dps them all while they fly around, go invulernable, etc etc.

And having warbands helps guilds grouping vs, giant hordes following the blue dots mindlessly. Its not theory or something new, I know exactly what they provide to a world pvp environment from previous games.

Its ok to be a fan of the game, its not OK to mindless say everything is fine, when tis obviously not to alot of people.

If this is your first wvw rodeo and you are having fun, thats great, but we can still improve it.

Currently WvW is OK for zergs or solo road fighting or zerg surfing. Bring back guilds!

For guilds wanting to form small medium warbands focused on tactical maneuvering to fight zergs (with not much interest in pveing/trading keeps and battle objectives) and really fight there are too many holes still.

Logging on the other day, here is the current list of issues you hit right away (and yes we can play around alot of them, but its making 90% of my guild play other games instead)

In any event, here is the list ArenaNet of stuff that annoys us big and small:

Forming guild groups/warbands
Simple basics
1) Trying to form guild groups and warbands from guild tab, gives you report as an option not invite to group
2) Cant form warbands… group wars?
3) Easier to spot guild members ungrouped, come on support grouping
4) If you are in Lion arch and in queue you cant even see names of world instances and have to remember/guess or zone out

Culling
Still an issue, being able to accurately determine the critical moment to push in on tail end or over extenders is critical to good rvr. I know this one is being worked on still, and am hopeful here.

Downed state
I get Anet is trying to do something new, but the current system rewards bad players too much in pvp:
1) Invulnerability buff when they run out of hps as they enter downed state needs to go (in wvw)
2) super powers need to go, no more flying around, super hp pools with food, rallying off of deer, you are down not getting buffs and more powerful
3) Better balance of classes downed abilities (single vs aoe knockback, silly super powers)
4) Downed state + water… seriously..

Stacking
When abusing mechanics is a key strat…
We could debate using balista and other boring possibilities, but a focus on fun and good game play would be better.

Stuff to do to change it up
Look sometimes world pvp sucks due to normal forces we don’t expect developers to address (normal snowballing of winners, primetime over pop queues/zergs).
Normally we would simply queue up in instances for a bit on a bad night. Please give us instanced pvp we can do with our real toons, and queue up in world not that spvp garbage.

Man I miss scenarios/battlegrounds like Battle for Praag, Serpent’s Crossing, AV, Warsong etc Heck even hutball that we thought was bad at the time is sounding good.

Anonymous Pvp
Not showing player names and rotating world like they were instances has produced a generic instanced feel of a wow battleground vs a warhammer/Daoc world feel.

Its hard to care about fighting in this environment, and if you think world pvp is about the pve score ArenaNet is featuring for trading keeps ant night…

The score is just a hamster wheel for pvers and new rvr players.

As with all other world pvp games as it matures the players will realize its about rolling around with a group taking on other skill teams, and rolling zergs.

The question is if the devs get core design flaws fixed in time.

I play both, warrior is dps gs/hammer rifle swap weapons / tactics as needed between rifle/gs. I run a ton of cc, and play it like you would a pure dps class not a tanky warrior.

Guardian is just a beast, and and can do solid damage and group support. In your face brutalizer.

Warriors ability to group support / tanky type role is too limited currently.

If you are all about dps go rogue or warrior, if you want a tank/support type role go guardian.

Zosk.5609:

5. Maps can be really pretty simple and getting back into fights in a reasonable time makes things more fun.

Small maps with fast travel times does not work well at all. Warhammer proved this beyond a shadow of a doubt.

Oh sure you get back to action fast, but it also prevent atlot of good tactical pvp, and provides lots of huge clumps fighting pvp. zzzzzz

Small teams need to be able to maneuver and strike zergs.

1 and 2, I agree.
3 & 4) Sadly keep traders will always avoid fights. If people need a cookie to pvp they will be going back to WoW shortly no mater what you do, other than do a hard fail and start remaking wow. Basically they are fodder for pvpers to farm

ColinJohanson.2394:

Also I’ll throw out that the work our WvW guys are doing on culling and progression systems are extremely large, these are feature systems unto themselves. For example a lot of the culling work requires re-building almost entirely the way our game compiles, loads, and handles assets in general. For many companies, this task could literally years, we’re trying to pull it off in a matter of months, these guys are rock stars.

Rockstars are declared stars by their fans. This team is not there or even close at this point. Launching with the game in such a broken state that its not playable without a 6 month super hero effort to get it playable is a rough start.

I am very excited at this games potential, and truly hope it gets the basics going. World pvp is never about the pve keep trader score, its all about busting 3 times your numbers with 1-2 groups.

Your guys will be rockstars when we can play this game without invisible, no name armies, that spring back to life if a deer dies. I will be the first to send your guys a beer when you get there, again I truly wish you guys best of luck.

Quentin Fields.1295:

One day people will understand WvW and tPvP are team games and then will see how useless a backstab Thief in a crowd fight and how he dies to 2-3 ticks of aoe damage.

Unless the team of thieves insta gibs all the aoers.

Sorry but the biggest willy always wins, they can and do team up too.

Definitely don’t want welfare spvp gear or pve grinder fractal gear in pvp.

Having spvp be anti-mmo style paper doll is the core problem, it should have rewards for your real toon. The current spvp just does not work, it needs to be split in 2, keep the existing system of generic pvp as “gpvp”, and real instanced pvp with your real toon.

Its too boring to do more than a few times as is. Reminds me of how boring Arena was after a single season… Would love it to be more like warhammer’s scenarios, and fight with your guild/friends vs enemy realms.

ah well, we are stuck with this cruel shadow of what should have been done for now

Kerithlan.1659:

dooger.2640:

Kerithlan.1659:

Didn’t they say that we were getting a full expansion’s worth of free content some time in February/March? Because if so there’s no reason to complain about anything other than the jumping puzzles eating up man power.

huh? the game is not playable other than culling zerg garbage gameplay.

We already did an organized departure, a few of us remain hopeful the game will reach a bare min required for world pvp someday, and will come back.

Lets not pretend the current game state is anything other than unacceptable in quality, and too low on pvp content to retain players interest while waiting to reach minimal quality standards.

You must have played on terrible servers if your experiences limited you to “culling zerg garbage gameplay”.

The fact you don’t grasp the culling problems means you have no idea how to effectively maneuver a small group vs a large zerg.

It also means you don’t grasp culling is a design level defect in gw2, and is not server specific..

I have no doubt the game will retain players that simply pve doors, there are no culling issues with running in a pack to bang on the next door.

Kerithlan.1659:

Didn’t they say that we were getting a full expansion’s worth of free content some time in February/March? Because if so there’s no reason to complain about anything other than the jumping puzzles eating up man power.

huh? the game is not playable other than culling zerg garbage gameplay.

We already did an organized departure, a few of us remain hopeful the game will reach a bare min required for world pvp someday, and will come back.

Lets not pretend the current game state is anything other than unacceptable in quality, and too low on pvp content to retain players interest while waiting to reach minimal quality standards.

That said I really hope the feb patch rocks, I would love this game to be the successor to Daoc/Warhammer. I don’t need fluff, just fix the kitten culling crap so a skill team can effectively engage a zerg like we have been doing in old games for the last 10 years ..

Make the game pvp instead of PvA and you would have players breaking out.

World pvp is the only draw this game has.

You have to roll out incremental fixes and such while working on larger content patches etc.

Holiday events mean nothing when your guild is all off playing other games.

Dead til Feb is not the game I had hoped this would be, but its the lack of support in general that has turned people off.

Just add it to the list of issues. We would need an active development team for posts like this to help sadly.

My guild has moved on, I keep hoping for a minimal pulse from these devs. its time to only check back on 3-4 month periods. Good luck

I have no interest in playing a game that sees pvp as the lowest priority. Really they just kinda copied some daoc ideas and shoved it off to the side not even making it part of the world.

The game play is poor, culling and downed state reward zergs.
We can’t form warbands (hello our guild wants to play together, right now its better to not even group your team as the name colors of guildmates not grouped is much easier to read )

WvW is not even part of the world, its 4 instance game play vs randoms with no names. Endless free server transfers increase lopsided snowballing and firmly root this game in a no-community random/anon hot join feel.

We can’t even do instanced pvp with our real toons, (spvp is a joke).

There is just zero feel of a mmo world we are fighting for, its just so flavorless and bland. Fighting endless no name players that you will likely not see again, or even know if you have fought them before is not pvp.

This can only be described as PvA, player vs anonymous.

Names are a basic requirement for pvp.

Such garbage fighting generic green, red and blue. I swing my sword, I swing my sword again! Die generic blue villain!

Bugs we understand and will wait for fixes, but our teams of hard core rvr players have lost interest due to fundamental design issues such as this.

I am so hoping Arenanet comes around, I really pushed this game hard to my guild, everyone bored within a month, then not logging in after 2 months is underwhelming.

PvPers go to underdog, pver go to winning side to gear up faster.

The Pvers will quit shortly after getting gear, so it will balance out eventually.

The main problem now is pvpers are bored, and they are only catering to pvers and adding more gear for them to grind, so the situation will continue, with more pvpers leaving

Do the same thing we did in DaoC and Warhammer, form a roaming group and move out. Kill fast and don’t stay in an area after being spotted.

Plenty of small scale fighting, the problem is it gets dull super fast fighting nameless players, or if your side crushes the other sides and they don’t come out to fight.

Shaojack.3871:

Someone is sure to point out “GAME IS NEW GIVE IT TIME!”

Time helps only if the team has the right direction and priorities.

Stuff like culling will get fixed eventually, but I am not seeing a plan or any level of understanding on wvw. So no amount of waiting will help, if our issues are not going to be addressed.

- Plans on reducing downed state in wvw?
- Ability to form warbands (we want to group up with our guild)
- Ability to see kill spam / stats
- Ability to see player names

All long time rvr/wvw players know world pvp always snowballs, that is why games have to provide some support to reduce it/keep things fun. So whats anets stance on giving us tools such as:
- instanced pvp for our real toons to do when your team is winning by a huge margin and there is nobody to fight
- Not supporting transfers to increase snowballing
- Hardcore old time rvers fight for infamy, not pve night flipping wvw rankings (lol), what are the plans here, could be as simple as ranks or kill spam.
- a real out manned buff any time soon?

I have never seen a company try so hard to drive players away.

stuff like culling is an accident/defect, but they choose the downed system, water fighting and now this..

Prioritizing spvp/pve over wvw is what is ensuring people lose interest, not alot out right now, but I guess its time to start looking. We have alot of people playing lol (which I cant stand) until something improves, and I hear planetside 2 is not that great, so I guess its more searching.

small guilds have no interest in following a zerg.

They simply need to add the ability to form warbands that have multiple groups in them.

I bought this game for pvp and to pvp with my guild. At this point people are all bored to tears, the game launched with only one month of end game content.

I would start with adding a few instanced scenarios we can play with our real toons, and make them fun, maybe a Battle for Praag(Warhammer sytle), or even a warsong (wow sytle) gulch, Remove/reduce down state in them as a trial, remove water combat everywhere, focus game play on team work vs splitting up solo and bunker guarding.

WvW cash/item rewards are fine as is, it does need to provide some sort of glory, instead of focusing on the lowest form of wvw which is pve flipping of objectives with a zerg (either off hour or prime time).

Anyone who has rvred more than a few years knows the fun is all about taking a skill team out in a lake and out maneuvering / out smarting / outplaying a much larger force. We wanna see those stats zone wide.

Its absolutely critical to small guild recruiting to see who is performing at a high level, so we can then see if they can do so in a team environment.

Tulisin.6945:

The problem with how many view the downed state is that they just compartmentalize it as separate from how the game “should” work. They say the “downed state caused X, which wouldn’t normally happen if GW2 was any other respectable game.”

As soon as you stop viewing GW2 through the mechanics of most other games, GW2’s mechanics are just GW2’s mechanics, not intrusions on how things “should work”.

That makes zero sense. Asserting blind acceptance of a a bad pvp mechanic does not make it good game play.

Tapping packs of animals to become jojo the human yo-yo is dumb. But ya dotting a wolf before going down is elite at this point. going down then rewards you with a brief invulnerability buff, a new hp pool some cc, then rally to help down your foes.

Of course you have to do stuff like this with current game, but that does nto change the fact its garbage game play from a design stand point.

Its funny how easy it is to down some players, then discover they get super powers and do more damage when downed..

downed state dumbs down pvp, and rewards zergs. It rewards tagging everything, esp an npc that can be easily killed in case you get downed so you can easily rally as needed.

Adding some servers without the downed system in wvw would take over in popularity super fast. Imagine getting to pvp without get out of jail free cards for zergs.

We do get to vote with our feet. Good luck to you.

the maps are not really a problem, compared to the mechanics and design issues, as well as near zero communication to community

wvw world is failing to:

Mechanics failures: culling/stacking/water/downed/altf4ing etc
Extreme boredom: due to anonymous pvp, endless transfers, focusing on pve objectives while allowing night capping

Good world pvp is about:
- small scale strategic vs zergs and other factions skill teams
- Larger scale united server teams cooperating for larger goals, such as a city push/ primary objective take

There is no understanding why people like world pvp, just some daoc cut paste with a huge wiff on quality and fun.

Basic fixes to keep organized departures of rvr guilds will take a minimum of addressing anon pvp, culling, downded state and providing some instanced pvp for our real toons (not that garbage spvp garbage) when wvw is full

There are alot of mechanics that I am sure will be eventually cleaned up like, culling stacking, water, down state, alt-f4ing, class balance etc. They are stretched too thin trying to make 3 games, ie spvp, wvw and pve.

But unless the fun aspect is addressed, none of it matters. Leaderboards would help, and anything to break the pva (player vs anonymous) feel.

WvW is not about loot, zergs or battle objectives, and yes I know new players are 100% focused on this and have not found the next stage. Its about epic battles with your team vs larger numbers and dealing with the unexpected in what is essentially a sandbox.

The more flavor it retains vs nameless faces, and endless transfers, and stale play, the more people stop playing. at this point its hard to get people to play more than once or twice a week.

Stuff to break up the monotony would be great too, so scenarios/warzones would be great change ups, esp during peek zerg time/queues.

But most of all communication is needed. I no longer feel the devs are part of the community like they were pre launch. Thats a shame, I thought arena net was going to be different than bioware/Mythic and the way they handled warhammer & swtor. Groundhog day

Hit and run small forces know not to hang out too long, one way or another you need to move out.

The swords help reduce endless wandering around, and benefit small groups to maneuver.

Objectives are fairly well spread out, and decoy teams can effectively flag areas/objectives to reduce clusters, or misdirect them.

If its an organized zerg guild, they often are on vent so removing swords actually hurts only the smaller forces

Its just too boring to play more than a couple times a month..

It just degenerates and becomes too static too fast.

Nothing is ever perfect, if we make progress on the big issues its all good.

I am hoping we get some instanced pvp for our real characters to break up wvw some.

Class balance stuff will go on to end of time, so i am not gonna freak out here. I would like to see some good steps to balance and making it fun.

I think the game is teetering way to close to “I swing my sword, I swing my sword again!”, but I have faith the devs will spice it up.

Tzash.5748:

WvWvW is about large scale clashes ie: armies vs armies. Individuals are merely cogs in the machine so a player’s name is irrelevant. An individual player’s skill level is also somewhat irrelevant, group coordination is far more vital than single players running around looking for 1v1s. The most common type of engagement in WvW is “zerg vs zerg” and it is next to impossible to identify individual enemy players when you are fighting a horde.

Its been said before but is worth repeating – if you are looking for an environment where individual skill matters then sPvP/tPvP is for you. If you don’t like the way they currently work then you are better of suggesting improvements to that style of PvP rather than trying to change WvW.

100% false. If you are zerging and playing in a manner where individual skill matters not you have missed the fun in wvw completely.

Instead of zerging try assembling a small force and do coordinated attacks on 2 to 3 times your numbers. Its a blast, dealing with all the endless unknowns and larger numbers is what makes wvw fun. The stale boring nature of spvp is 100% not what I am looking for.

Being on the battlefield and finding ways to out smart and out play the zerg is alot of fun. Over time the natural progression of wvw games goes from: uncoordinated zergs => realm pride and large guilds coordinating => more and more smaller 1-2 group teams fighting zergs and looking for other skill teams.

There are always bad apples, but there is no reason to enforce PvA in game play where people are clearly looking for pvp.

I would love to hear from the devs to hear if their intention is the keep the game focused on PvA or if it was really an over sight and changes will be coming.

Obviously people will compare your title to previous ones, the steel fist is a bit much

Sky.9347:

dooger.2640:

Sky.9347:

To the enemy, you are just one of many opponents.
To your allies, your name and reputation is yours to mold.

If you want the trash talking elitist chest thumping bravado nonsense, go to sPvP and earn your stripes.

WvW is about communities waging war, not rambo winning battles.

Whooooosh.

I am talking teams being able to play against other good players and be able to recruit other good players.

PvA players will not play for much past getting leveled and geared up.

NFL is about teams, but its great performances by great players that are fun to watch.

What you want already exists. It’s called Tournament PvP. You can even build a whole guild around it.

WvW is designed to keep the focus on the Server, and beneath that the Guild (via guild tags). Individual recognition serves no purpose in WvW, and the inclusion of names would make nothing better.

Without going off topic tpvp is not worth playing in its current state.

back to world v world, every has an opinion, and names had a solid place in all previous rvr titles, and it does here too.

Sky.9347:

To the enemy, you are just one of many opponents.
To your allies, your name and reputation is yours to mold.

If you want the trash talking elitist chest thumping bravado nonsense, go to sPvP and earn your stripes.

WvW is about communities waging war, not rambo winning battles.

Whooooosh.

I am talking teams being able to play against other good players and be able to recruit other good players.

PvA players will not play for much past getting leveled and geared up.

NFL is about teams, but its great performances by great players that are fun to watch.

The corner cases of someone sending tells you dont want are easily stopped with block.

I have people in my guild that came from the opposite faction in previous games as we had fun fighting each other.

Players are the content in a sandbox, playing vs great players and those rematches are why people like pvp.

This game is a pale sad shadow of what it has the potential to be, it is too bad really.

With no subs our ability to vote is very limited, but if they want to sell xpacks to more than just people playing it as a single player pve game, they need to address names.

Sterile sandboxes get old fast, at this point guilds are going to start needing to hear some etas on basics.

If you think its good to continue on with no name pvp, endless xfers and a sterile sandbox let us know as well. I am willing to hang on for balance patches and all that normal stuff, but I really dont care about any of that in this format.

Its weird, this is a great frame work for pvp, but its missed so badly on all fronts…

the reality on warrior is greatsword or reroll. Hammer, rifle x + shield are ok as secondary weapons, but overall lackluster. weapon sets, trait trees feel half done

Playing greatsword well takes coordination and timing to kill and get out.

We are playing a game with 5 buttons per weapon set, people cry about what ever hits hard.

Warhammer made the mistake of making the maps too small, I do agree the run back death sucks but its the correct and only successful design choice.

borils pass getting farmed hardcore, you guys dont even come out or compete at any level.

I wish you guys played as good as your talk, now that would be fun. Look up more its likely a bored player downing you, roflmao

Friday night is fun still, I do like the rush of fighting. Looks like my server is going to crush this week, :/ I like being the under dog more

First Game Ever I have not enjoyed instanced pvp.. Which is weird as I I have enjoyed instanced pvp running in structured teams alot over the last 10 or so years.

we used to even set up team competitions in warhammer, and i held most wins on my server for like a year and a half until I stopped playing.. WoW arena got boring fast after a season (but I still enjoyed the battlegrounds), chasing a druid around a pillar for an hour.. no thanks.

Its not hard, Balance is always on going, as are bug fixes.

It just feels I am playing someone else’s character, I mostly do it to test watered down builds for wvw.

Water combat and downed kinda blow, but its not that, it just get so kitten boring so fast. It jsut does not feel strategic, it feels more pveish, and tracking timers or some gimmick.

I cant totally put my finger on it, anyone else feel same way?

I do wish we could have some additional scenarios we could play our real characters in, to take a break when wvw is slow..