Guild Wars 2

pullnointer.1476:

UrMom.4205:

i put my 500+ tickets into kiel’s basket, i don’t support rng.

gurugeorge.9857:

I also voted against RNG. If the developers had wanted the cooler content developed, they should have put it on the anti-RNG ticket.

you two realize how insanely fallacious that logic is, right?

If developers were (among other things obviously, including making something cool), testing the waters as to public opinion about RNG by having one ticket’s main discount being pro-RNG, and if they believed the pro-RNG choice would carry the day, then it would be natural for them to attach to that choice the cooler content that they wanted to make. As it turns out, the pro-RNG choice didn’t carry the day, even with the cooler content to sweeten it. They ought to have realized that RNG isn’t as popular as they think, and they ought to have attached the cooler content that they wanted to make, to the anti-RNG choice.

pullnointer.1476:

gurugeorge.9857:

milo.6942:

i’m really surprised so many people support this voting-on-features system. they pick 2 good ideas and then make sure that 1 of them will never come to fruition? that’s a great system… thanks for making the best possible game for your players.

People have been whinging about not being able to “make a difference” in virtual worlds for ages. Now we the players were given a choice with real consequences (choose one thing, forego the other), and you think this is a problem?

is that not what he said?

I thought he was being sarcastic.

swilkers.5938:

I have two things that in my opinion are in great need of attention. One is super easy to address and the other will be scoffed at but it a really big issue.

1. Looting
Can we please get this game into the 90’s and just not have “loot bags”? In WVW I leave so many bags I wish that there was an achievement for how many times that I have been screwed out of opening them since I died before opening them. This is just asinine. Auto loot should be truly AUTOLOOT. No buttons pressed.

2. Warrior Banners
In groups in PVE and WVW these things are easily the most annoying things to pick up since everyone is SO AFRAID of missing the tiny loot bags (see item 1) that they spam F in hopes that they do not miss a loot bag. Unfortunately, Warriors don’t really care where they leave their garbage for others to pick up. Make these things “ALT F” or something to pick up please.

As to 2) , area loot is now in the game – check options, key commands, assign area loot to whatever key you want, problem solved.

This reminds me of the complaint you sometimes see in EVE Online. In that game, because progression can be done offline, some people get it into their heads that they’re entitled to be able to progress their alts at the same time as they’re progressing their main. An analogous entitlement illusion seems to be at play here.

But no MMO has ever done that kind of thing. You progress only the character you play, in every MMO.

milo.6942:

i’m really surprised so many people support this voting-on-features system. they pick 2 good ideas and then make sure that 1 of them will never come to fruition? that’s a great system… thanks for making the best possible game for your players.

People have been whinging about not being able to “make a difference” in virtual worlds for ages. Now we the players were given a choice with real consequences (choose one thing, forego the other), and you think this is a problem?

Fiontar.4695:

Some people must have some serious blinders on not to see how “insulting” this kind of content is to players, the game, the five years of pre-launch development and the Manifesto.

I think you are reading way too much into it. This is a celebration event, it’s meant to be a bit of fun (and for me it certaintly is – and tbqh, rather than taking me away from the open world, it’s sparked up my interest in seeing the whole world, because in order to do the Balloon Tourist, I’m exploring some areas I haven’t been before, and not only that, I’m participating in some of the normal zone events along the way).

Now having said that, I definitely agree that they need to start working on the promised gradual change of the open world itself – they need to start shifting and varying DEs, etc., as was promised. That larger change needs to happen. But jeez, come on, you can’t expect that to happen overnight. What they are doing now is learning how to make those changes.

You will notice that one of the choices in the election was to further develop some LW events that have already happened – that’s more like what you’re wanting, surely?

If you’re bored, leave it for a while and come back (I’ve done that 3 times, and each time I love the game more). This isn’t like other MMOs where coming back is a chore to pick up where you left off. It’s actually very easy to pick up where you left off, and in fact the changes in the world and variation make it quite exciting to come back after a break. The world feels alive in a way few other MMO virtual worlds do.

Be patient for the deeper promised ongoing changes, they’re still learning how to do what is an incredibly complex thing that few developers have really tackled before (except, notably, the original EQ – something like LW content was the whole point of the title “Everquest”, but they couldn’t sustain it at that time, mostly for technological reasons, which Anet now think they are beating).

If everyone’s wearing the same type of gear in dungeons it’s a sure sign something is broken in the design, and it’s quite possible that it’s the content not being difficult enough.

Attacking people who exploit this is stupid. People go for the the quickest, easiest way to do things, naturally.

There are good reasons to go all the way in the Illusions line for a shatter build, but I doubt going to 20 is worth it just for the extra bounce, the extra bounce is just an extra treat that’s possible for shatter builds.

Power/prec/crit doesn’t affect condition damage, except indirectly if you have Sharper Images (your prec copies to your illusions, so they have more chance of landing bleeds) for that you need Condition damage gear (Ravager, Rabid, Carrion, Apothecary). To make fullest use of iWarlock, you don’t necessarily need extra condition damage, but rather condition duration, which you can get from runes or sigils I think (as iWarlock maximises on the number of unique conditions up on the target, not their strength), however obviously more condition damage is good too if it’s affordable.

Generally, speccing for Staff is different from speccing for GS, since Staff is more defensive, and more oriented around condition damage and Toughness (although iWarlock obviously would benefit from Power and Prec, but iWarlock is more like the damage dealing side of a mainly defensive weapon), and not so much Power, so with Bifrost you’d be better off with a 0/20/20/0/30 (shattercat) or a 20/20/30/0/0 (blackwater) type of build, but then you’d be losing out on the phantasm orientation and Focus thing, so I dunno, it’s a bit of a conundrum.

You might be better off sticking to your playstyle and aiming for the GS legendary instead! Otherwise, if you’re determined to go for Bifrost, you might have to change your playstyle around. You should try Staff play with an Exotic and see how it suits you, you might find you even prefer it to GS!

LOL, this is so my favourite update yet, this is the first one I’ve felt like being completionist about.

I do agree though, that we want to see more gradual and permanent change in the open world, as promised.

Auesis.7301:

gurugeorge.9857:

I also voted against RNG. If the developers had wanted the cooler content developed, they should have put it on the anti-RNG ticket.

No, you didn’t. If you legitimately think your vote against Evon made any difference on the RNG front, you are seriously over-inflating the value of your decision and the impact it will have.

I think you’re being a bit naive. RNG boxes are a big thing in f2p MMOs, and some developers rely on them a lot. It seems to me that (apart from the many other reasons for having the event, most of them cool) there was a bit of a trial balloon being floated by the devs. They wanted to gauge the playerbase’s interest in the lockboxes, and thereby to see whether going further in the RNG direction would be acceptable to the players. The playerbase has sent a resounding NO WE ARE NOT ALL THAT INTERESTED IN LOCKBOXES message.

Even when the deal was sweetened by what would have been, lore-wise, a much more interesting Fractal, still the answer was NO.

Hopefully the message is clear and Anet wont flirt any more with RNG than they are doing already. It’s ok that lockboxes are in the game, some people like to gamble and that’s fine; but if they were to have more of a presence than they do (like for instance they do in the Cryptic f2p games), it would degrade the GW2 experience.

If Anet did Raiding with rl cash prizes, that ought to shut the whiners up for a while and keep ’em busy.

ME WANTS HORSE MONSTERS!!!!!!!

Pfft. I think the election was partly Anet throwing up a trial balloon to see how important RNG lockboxes are to the players.

The vote is a warning shot across Anet’s bows. Most players either don’t like RNG boxes or don’t care about them. It’s ok that they’re there, some people like gambling, but the vote for Kiel was mainly a vote against making RNG any bigger than it is already in the game.

i.e. even when sweetened with what would have been more interesting content lore-wise, the players voted against.

That should tell Anet something.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

gurugeorge.9857:

I voted for Kiel because I hate RNG boxes with a passionate loathing and I didn’t want to encourage the developers to think the majority of players have much interest in them.

Evidently they don’t. Hurrah!

I pray to the Six that you will forever have bad RNG.

Well I don’t gamble (unless a key drops ) so I don’t care.

PookieDaWombat.6209:

gurugeorge.9857:

I voted for Kiel because I hate RNG boxes with a passionate loathing and I didn’t want to encourage the developers to think the majority of players have much interest in them.

Evidently they don’t. Hurrah!

This 100 times!!! This is my main reason for voting Kiel, with my second reason being that character wise she is “good” for LA. She is good PR and yes, a strong female character which is rare in games, period. Evon had some pluses in his favor (and about 40% of my votes went to him), but I just liked her better for the post, so she got most of my votes.

As I’ve just said on another thread, I wholeheartedly agree that I’d have rather seen the Abaddon content than the Thaumanova content. I’m sure most players feel the same way. But I think it was more important to take a stand against RNG, so important that even spicing that choice up with more attractive content didn’t turn me, and I suspect a fair number of people felt the same way.

I find water combat great, and super-easy once you get the hang of what precisely your weapons do and the right swapping and combos for them. Water combat for me is part of the icing on the cake of a superb game overall.

Most fun for me, Mesmer and Guardian, followed by Warrior, then Ranger, then Thief, then Engineer, then Elementalist, and waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay down below all them …. Necro.

For some reason I just can’t sync up with the Necro playstyle.

I also voted against RNG. If the developers had wanted the cooler content developed, they should have put it on the anti-RNG ticket.

If the devs preferred the Abaddon Fractal, they shouldn’t have put the Abaddon Fractal with the choice that signals “we like RNG boxes”.

I voted for Kiel because I hate RNG boxes with a passionate loathing and I didn’t want to encourage the developers to think the majority of players have much interest in them.

Evidently they don’t. Hurrah!

I dunno, it seemed obvious to me that apart from other reasons (just the coolness of having an election in a game to decide content, for one), a subtle reason they put the choices as they were was to see how concerned players are with RNG boxes.

Obviously not much.

Good.

I was in the Bazaar today dropping in my last votes for Ellen (yay Ellen, boo to RNG), when I suddenly felt a bittersweet feeling that this beautiful place, with its beautiful music, fairytale atmosphere, fun things to do, and cute conversations, would be gone soon.

I then realized that I was feeling exactly the same way as I used to feel as a kid when the circus was in town, and then it was gone.

That, to me, is a type of immersion I’ve never felt in an MMORPG before. It feels a bit like a … well, like a living world.

More please!

Zietlogik.6208:

I think I was way too hyped over this game…mainly from the 8 years I played GW1….but nearly every single developement choice they have making has been turning this game into a blob of un-interesting, bland, here today – gone tomorrow, massive mess of “content” and it is truly disappointing.

See, I tried GW1 and while I recognized it was a great game, it didn’t grab me. GW2, on the other hand, really grabs me because it actually feels like a living virtual world, which GW1 didn’t (to me). I suspect the playerbase of GW2 probably intersects with the natural playerbase of GW1 a bit, but GW2 is attracting a whole different type of player who wants something that GW1 couldn’t offer. After all, GW1 is still out there.

Devs generally don’t listen to forums unless there’s a real uproar that betokens players in-game feeling the same way. Nothing that goes on in these forums represents that level of concern from the majority of players who play the game, it’s just griping from the usual suspects.

TwoBit.5903:

That doesn’t, however, mean that the game isn’t without faults that are discussing. If the developers happen to be listening, all the better.

The question is whether they are faults or just different gameplay design. Should the design have been the same as GW1? I can understand GW1 fans wanting it to be so, but that doesn’t mean GW1 objectively had better gameplay. Better in some respects, worse in others.

Primernova.5791:

Fluid class roles, is what GW2 needs.

Your post reminded me of Champions Online. That game has a system where the class roles are fluid. i.e. every toon has the same ability to be hybrid and support and be tough themselves, but they can also (with a reasonable CD) go into roles, which up their stats and automatically tweak their build in certain ways.

It actually works quite well, except that it still doesn’t seem to avoid the zergfest mentality. But that’s mainly due to mob AI being simplistic enough that all-damage is still usually the way to go.

I have a suspicion that to have a clkitten or fluid class system work well, you have to compensate by having mob AI be much more sophisticated. And maybe the problem with that is it’s a much harder task to solve for programming.

Gehenna.3625:

Sadly any depth the combat system might have is not required for most content where auto attack and dodge will suffice.

I usually stand still, not even dodging circles anymore with auto attack on when leveling in the zones. It takes a little bit longer but it works. The fact that I don’t die when I just hit auto attack and let go of the keyboard and mouse entirely with most mobs in leveling zones is a clear indicator that there is a problem with the combat system.

I’m not sure that’s a problem. It’s just a reflection of the combat system being forgiving enough for beginners to get along blindly mashing buttons, even if, as you say, it’s slower. But if you want to kill mobs faster, you have some headroom to get skilled.

Of course if a player is used to being forced to up their skills in MMOs because a combat system is unforgiving, then they might feel something is missing in this system.

But what a system like this does is leave it totally up to the player how much they want to concentrate, how skilled they want to get, etc.

Given that you’re relatively low on Power, wouldn’t you be better off using Staff instead of Sword? On the other hand, if you want to use Sword, wouldn’t it be better to go for more damage from it via Rampager stats and be more Glass-Cannoney?

Also, with lower Power, aren’t Shatters weaker?

Not challenging you, I’m still learning, but this has tweaked my curiosity.

Answering my own question, I’m guessing you’d say the Toughness is necessary for a PvP context. I’m thinking though that for PvE, the changes I’m thinking of might work (switching to Rampagers’s)?

This is an interesting build, I’m trying it out at the moment.

It’s particularly interesting in that it’s pretty close to the 20/20/30/0/0 condition build that’s popular at the moment, but you’ve deliberately given up on the Duelling line (and Precision altogether) and gone Inspiration instead. That’s a pretty bold move.

I miss the clone spamming from the 20/20/30 build, but I do like the extra health and the faster CDs on the Scepter (and of course the extra condi can’t hurt) that come from Inspiration. I have a feeling that you might be right that the extra buffer, near-continuous regen and better spike healing is relatively more useful for a Condition-based build than the ability to spam clones and the illusions bleeding on crits, especially given that Necros are big atm.

Still, got to play around with it more (I’m using it in PvE as well, it’s quite good for PvE too).

For me, it’s “living” in the virtual world as a lvl 80. I just do whatever takes my fancy, and I can do it all, there’s an absolute ton of stuff to do. Currently I’m invested in getting a set of Rabid armor.

But then, I am a casual player (maybe an hour or two an evening, a bit more on weekends).

Atherakhia.4086:

Rangers are so strong they’re the second least useful class in WvW.
Rangers are so strong they’re not welcome in PvE groups.
Rangers are so strong they’re blowing up the sPvP charts.

But that could precisely be the “problem of perception” that the devs are talking about. Games have FOTMs all the time, and classes that are not FOTM are not wanted, even though they’d be perfectly fine.

Also, with games like these, you get a situation where some buzz concepts take hold of the community, and people just repeat them in order to look cool.

Kurakura.7281:

gurugeorge.9857:

But the combat system has a lot of headroom to get more and more skillful with.

hahaha…. No… The so called headroom in this game is microscopic compared to other action mmorpgs.

What “other action MMORPGs” are you thinking of?

It’s hilarious really. I remember when the game first came out, there were complaints about the boringness of the gameplay on the Mesmer forums, then someone discovered a few of the Mesmer’s neat tricks, and everyone was like “oh wow, I didn’t realize you could do that”.

The combat is as deep or as shallow as you make it, it really has that headroom.

On the other hand, some of the enemy AI is a bit placeholderey. Mobs, especially bosses, could behave a bit more intelligently for groups whose level of gameplay is more sophisticated than the average troll’s.

Swagger.1459:

it’s unfortunate that you don’t understand my original post. if you plan on commenting again then I strongly suggest you reread my posts and give yourself time to think and absorb what i have written. also, if you consider combo effects and undocumented “neat tricks” as deep profession designs and gameplay, then we are on much different levels of experience and expectation.

Oh, so you know they exist – then why the 1,1,1,1,1,1 crap?

I probably pay about roughly the equivalent of a monthly sub fee. The nice thing is that what I pay and when I pay it is totally in my choice.

It feels like a virtual world, and it feels like it’s living and evolving. This makes it a great place to wander around in and goof off for an hour or two. It’s also filled with “things to do” – one can follow stories, achievements, etc., whatever takes one’s fancy. There is such an abundance of ambient detail in the game, it always amazes me whenever I play it. Not to mention, it’s absolutely gorgeous, and utterly charming in the way that a “light”, family-friendly fantasy game should be.

The TP system is superb. It allows you to either wander the land at will, immersed, or jump out of immersion immediately and get to a place to do something specific that you want to do.

The combat system is amazing: it’s forgiving enough so that a beginner can get along ok with blind button-mashing, but it’s deep enough so there’s a high skill ceiling if you want it (you can do things better and more efficiently if you want to).

The build system is deep and addictive. Even within professions, there’s a huge variety of possible builds, all viable. Even the min-max best builds aren’t that far ahead of any themed build you could fancy.

The class balance is amazing, possibly the best I’ve ever experienced in any MMO. In PvP, one never feels that another class has any unfair advantages, and one wins and loses in a fair way. If one loses, it’s because one isn’t playing one’s best, or the other player is better, not because the other class has an IWIN button.

On the social side, the game rewards co-operation like no other game. The normal human instinct to help out is rewarded in this game, unlike any other MMO, where it’s punished. This often leads to conversations, which can lead to friendships, etc.

Have we established that the OP needs to l2p?

The secret of Guild Wars combat is that the abilities you use most aren’t actually named. They’re “neat tricks”, combos that you have to figure out for yourself by combining the named abilities, swapping weapons, exploiting your own or others’ fields, etc.

For example, as a Mesmer, I often use a “thing” that isn’t found anywhere in the manual: I press one key which forms a combo field, then I press another key which creates an illusion at the target’s location and grabs its attention, then I press another key to leap through the combo field, immobilize my target, and lay down some serious hurt with a powerful attack which requires another key. But that combo field can also be used for other purposes, like controlling mob positioning.

Likewise, with every profession, there are loads of “things” like this that you can discover for yourself. Even the Warrior, the paradigm of “dumb” combat has a lot of “neat tricks” of its own, which, again, are not documented anywhere. You have to discover them.

That’s the interesting thing about GW2 combat, the actual real thing isn’t documented. Sure, you can spam a few buttons robotically and do ok – the game is designed to be forgiving. But the combat system has a lot of headroom to get more and more skillful with.

I use Ravaging with Rabid trinkets.

The key to the Staff’s damage is to get iWarlock out when the mob has lots of conditions on them – so that’s usually after Chaos Storm.

If you have the boost to Condition damage from stats, then iWarlock’s damage is better the more condis there are on the mobs.

I like to think I put a bit of effort into upping my skill level, both for PvE and for PvP, and to understand better and better what I can do, and when to do it. I’m not that competitive with others, though I enjoy it sometimes; I’m more interested in the feeling of mastery of a skill, the little victories. I don’t really have enough time to go into things hardcore, but the time I do play, I like to concentrate and learn.

I dunno, I feel like a hero with the single-player story, and I feel pretty heroic when I’m wandering around saving villagers, etc. I also feel heroic when I play well and beat someone in PvP, or a difficult mob in PvE.

The weapons look pretty cool, and you’ve got to respect the effort the player has put into getting them. Not that big a deal in the larger scheme of things, though.

Generally if someone’s downed in a big brawl, it makes more sense to help them by targeting the lowest-health mob, given that that’s who they’re probably targeting, and given the risks to oneself of rezzing in a big brawl (unless one is specced for it). Usually you can see who they’re flinging mud/sticks/etc. at anyway.

In the open world, if I see someone downed on the map, I’ll usually go out of my way to rez them if possible. It’s nice to be nice.

It has for me a bit. Recently I had a go with Neverwinter. Now, all in all, Neverwinter’s not a bad f2p MMO, the combat is fun and the Foundry is excellent, but it really just felt “last gen” to me – and I couldn’t stand the heavily instanced nature of it. I loves me the free-roaming open world feeling I get with GW2.

Interesting to read the thread though, in view of where the game is now. Was it made or broken by the Jan/Feb patches? Or were people just pontificating with a lot of hot air?

The term “cast” itself suggests something that takes time – involving gestures, incantation, etc. And that is a standard trope for magic users in books and games. I know what the OP means – something is gained by the action combat, but also something is lost.

One of my favourite “magic user” animations of all time was one of the Loremaster spells in LOTRO (forget which one), it just screamed “magic user” – the animation was you whipped out a book, and waved your wand about in the air for a few seconds while reading it. i.e. your eyes were actually on the book, you were READING a spell, and WAVING your magic wand – and then you THRUST the wand in the direction of your opponent, and BOOM (I think the spell was “Cracked Earth”).

Perfect! I never felt more like a “magic user” than when playing the Loremaster

Mesmer is quite “magic user” feeling, but more because of the tinkly, moaney, purple butterfly-ey graphics fx and sound fx.

The concept “stance” does seem to suggest “toggle”.

I dunno, just today I was reminded of how much fun the game is when there are people around to do DEs (a run of a few DEs in Fields of Ruin), and how dull it is when there aren’t any people around.

It’s the same with any MMO really, but because of DEs, there’s an extra fun factor when there are lots of people.

I still say server merge, or early zone merge, or something like that. Surely it ought to be possible for the game to dynamically adjust to the numbers of players playing in zones?

It always amazes me why developers don’t prioritize this sort of thing more. There’s nothing that kills the atmosphere of an MMO more than it feeling “dead”. That was one of the big problems with SWTOR – it was apparent early on that there were too many servers, and that some were ghost towns. Early merging might have been a loss of face, but it probably would have saved the game, simply because MMOs are most fun when there are lots of people around – even if you’re soloing, having players around makes it feel alive.

Now GW2 isn’t nearly in the same sort of trouble as SWTOR, but surely it must have had some reduction in numbers from the early days when lots of people tried it, even if it wasn’t a precipitous decline, there would still have been some decline.

I don’t watch other players much, I am too enamoured of my own awesomeness

Of characters I like the look of while playing, it has to be Mesmer, it just seems so “magical”.

Vayne.8563:

Tons of people never played it in the first place, because it didn’t have jumping.

raises hand Me. It was one of the reasons I never played GW (the others being I didn’t like the instancing and just didn’t like the art style or lore very much).

Coming off the back of City of Heroes, where you could fricken’ fly and fight at the same time, I found the vertically challenged nature of GW to be almost a joke.

Not that I enjoy jumping puzzles all that much myself, but I know lots of people who do.

Dare I say it – server merge?

Hmm, just to report that the Bazaar update seems to have cured this, for me. Whether deliberate or accidental or whatever, it’s great that I can play with my normal connection now.

Devata.6589:

The sort of temporary content the people who do not like the temporary part will still be in there. So it’s not good at all.

But how many people actually don’t like the temporary content? Do you know? Or is it only your personal dislike, shared by some people you know? Is a bit of rabble on the forums representative of the majority of players?

Speaking for myself, I’ve never felt any great urge to complete any of the temp content. I dip into it here and there as the mood takes me. If I get a reward, great, if not, no problem. Does that attitude define a lot of players or just a minority? I don’t know – but Anet probably knows.

I can appreciate that temporary content might be annoying for a completionist player or a hardcore Achiever, but MMORPGs no longer need be defined by playstyles that attract primarily that type of player. However, I do I hope Anet do introduce enough things to keep such players happy too.