Ah I see, I normally play about 6-9pm Australian time, might be why my matches are always a blow because if I log on about now (1pm) my matches are far closer and my team mates aren’t worse than me, I become the baddie.
Yeh this system is entirely US-centric. That’s another thing. If you live in another country you can have a 400 ping rate. So there’s a delay between the real time game and what you are seeing on the screen. Then another delay between you pressing a skill and it registering in real time. So trying to counteract a skill that has already occured before you respond to it is very difficult. So for many peole skill in this game is more geography than ability.
If you wait till next season you’ll get it easy and keep 1000g. You could make a full set of ascended armour for that.
Most days it feels like the system is forcing me on 50% win ratio, too many wins result in team mates who afk, too many losses result in wins with the other team having afk’s.. It’s always a blow out win or lose, so would resetting people MMR help fix this?
I think the current matchmaking system requires a large playerbase to prevent excessive match bias. Balanced matchmaking doesn’t require a large playerbase and won’t turn league into a farcical smurf fest.
Current matchmaking functions at its worst outside of primetime ie most of the time. Less people playing causes greater match imbalance. You can’t really rework the algorith to maintain a skill-based league system and also somehow get it to behave as a balanced matchmaking system.
So the choices are a system that functions or a system that doesn’t function.
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Yeh 1 person could carry 1 person that’s believable. A whole team? That would mean the other team sucks. Noob vs Noob. You are the real hero of sheamoor.
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Helseth always thinks he’s carrying. But if you watch his games he’s usually running around all match. He hardly ever kills anything. So his team is fighting 4v5 most of the match and all he does is shout at his team, put ports and yells “free kill” when he uses moa. If anything he is being carried.
“- then the possible drunk person, afk, dc, person not trying at all”
This is more like half the games you are in. The way the matchmaking system is designed it creates this situation.
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After you said you were a new player and could beat everyone in the game. This is basically the mentally of someone who doesn’t get it. You can’t win more than 60% in an even comp. This comp you are winning 95%. Of course that’s nothing to do with team mates and matchmaking. That’s pure skill. Right? So if you are stuck in mmr that’s also nothing to do with matchmaking and all about skill. Anyone is a complete dopey kitten if they don’t get this.
Yeah you and 100 others and the conclusion was to experience mmr hell on a new account you’d need to play to ruby tank your mmr then show how easily you can break out of MMR hell. You can’t do that because of obvious ethical reasons.
You are about 4 weeks behind with this thread.
Anet gave every new account a good mmr. Which is why all season people have been farming with alt accounts.
BTW how is dream land? It must be nice all year round.
Your brain is clearly impervious to information. A new account starts with a mmr bonus. You wouldn’t be getting the same matchups as someone stuck in ruby.
You and many others have misconstrued MMR hell. It is NOT being a bad player or not knowing how to play or blaming your team mates or falsely blaming the system. It is an actual phenomenon. Your MMR is a number that changes very slowly. It takes a long time to fix. If your MMR is average for you pip range you are placed into matches where the opposing team has a higher MMR than your team 50% of the time. This means you are in a grind similar to last season except for a couple of differences. Firstly you don’t advance pips in the same way. You progress very slowly.
So imagine last season except half of your games the other team is by design stronger than your own team. Half the time you will have team mates that are expecting to lose. It’s a real uphill battle. People who have managed to escape it describe it as torture.
This l2p carry stuff is misunderstanding the issue.
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Here we go. Nobody wants esl players in amber. Sorry. I’m sure the feeling is mutual. Anet couldn’t want it. New people certainly don’t. So the obvious solution is to advance them ahead along with other hardcore players. Perhaps a preseason tournament. Once given a leg up they can join teams. Sound familiar. To get an edge on the competition. From there they can grind their way up honestly in a balanced competition to prove they are legendary material. At the upper levels, legendary and perhaps diamond, let people drop divisions. That will slow the scrublords down from getting up there.
Same league for everyone.
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My point was PVE isn’t a skill level so suggesting unranked should be for PVErs is a little misguided. Logic dictates that greater participation in leagues is a good thing. If the system deters people it’s time to rethink the system not send people elsewhere.
What’s the bet you’ve been dropped on your kitten by a PVEr in ranked?
As soon as Anet realise they can’t achieve two diametrically opposed goals (ie using an unbalanced system and still trying to have balanced matches) we will be back to balanced teams.
Played a premade today and one of my team dc’d at the start then came back after midfight saying “loading” held them up. We lost by 50 points. I was suspicious so I asked them if they knew the premade. They didn’t respond then logged out. I was 1 win from going up a tier too.
Not losing Divisions is the primary reason we have this MMR Hell experience. The ladder placement should be fluid, players with artificially high ratings need to lose divisions to correct their ladder placement.
You can accommodate this by removing the division grinding requirements from the Achievements.
Probably it could help but offpeak will still have a wider skill gap matching players almost a full division apart. That is, imbalance would still exist and a higher instance of blowout matches. Depending on the time of day if there are less people below your mmr than there are higher you could drop down or go up a division through sheer chance. That would be annoying.
A balanced system would make games closer regardless of the time of day you logged in.
Your team consists of similar mmr. Your opponents mmr could be much higher or lower than yours. Imbalance is inbuilt into this system. During higher player pool times this imbalance is minimised as much as possible. The winstreaks/losing streaks are a result of this imbalance.
You’ll be waiting a while. I mean think about it. What other possible reason could there be for creating a system that piles the higher MMR players on one side other than to cause them progress faster?
Somewhere about 300 threads back..
That was one of the main reasons for season 2. Pros were playing against pros in emerald and they experienced the same grind as everyone else. They wanted an imbalanced system that allowed the pros to progress ahead of everyone else.
Now I’m arguing both sides of the debate just to keep it interesting.
edit: the scrubs bit was only part of the problem ^.^
Yes I responded. Well played. However the pros were complaining that season 1 was too balanced rendering your argument false. <— little hint on where to go next in your debate
For your argument to make any sense whatsoever that would mean that both a balanced mm and imbalanced mm would create equal or similar imbalance. I’m sorry am I supposed to think this is a rational thought worthy of response?
I agree let’s go back to the system that allows people who don’t know simple game mechanics to advance to legendary also let’s make it so tanking your MMR is a viable strategy to get to legendary these both sound like great ideas to ensure we get enough pve players their wings.
Don’t forget Anet is a business and the idea is to make sound business decisions. This supercedes your concerns over who has wings which Anet told everyone they can get in a year.
Yes. Absolutely MMR hell did not exist. Yes you were thrown into games where ridiculous stuff went on. But you could log in anytime of day and expect short queue times and expect your games to be evenly balanced.
Amber shopping is preventable. People tanking was annoying but didn’t happen nearly as much. You aren’t going to improve the problem by making games imbalanced and giving people more of a reason to afk or feel like the match is over before it starts.
They can’t. You misunderstand. You said no system can create balanced matches in a low player pool. Yet before the introduction of the pip based matchmaking system MMR hell did not exist. Anet didn’t need to expand the pip range to almost an entire division to keep queue times shorter. Queue times were shorter. All the problems you mentioned didn’t exist.
And as far as expanding the current playerbase making the game unplayable 21 hours a day is the last thing you want to do.
Of course they can. That’s the whole point of a balanced matchmaking system. Dota is hugely popular and they promise to keep queue times as short as possible and their matchmaking balances MMR. They couldn’t do this with Anet’s current system.
The main issue to be taken from the OP was that mmr hell exists outside of primetime. So try again.
Basically what you are saying is a system that doesn’t work most of the time it isn’t the systems fault. Wouldn’t the smart thing to do is create a system that does work all the time.
And yes I read your posts but didn’t see any solution to this.
Someone created a statistical analysis of the current system and showed that if you queue outside of primetime you are put into mmr hell. Excedingly unbalanced matches. The devs thanked the original poster and acknowledged this was a problem they plan to fix for next season.
That is not an outside factor. The system cannot function as intended 21 hours a day. That’s broken.
Still the important bit is the part you glossed over. How can you keep a system that creates imbalanced games in a low playerpool with a wide variation in mmr and also create balanced matches at the same time? Did you really think about this?
I see that’s fine. You ignore the issues you don’t have an answer for.
And of course the system is broken. If you can’t play outside of 3 hours a day on the internet that is worldwide and open 24 hours I don’t know how more broken it could be. The devs acknowledge this.
Well it is in a way. Last season people giving up wasn’t nearly as common. Because it created balanced games people didn’t feel like the game was already decided at the start of a match.
I’ve seen people give up upon losing the first team fight. I’ve seen people claim the match is lost after the first team fight and we end up winning. Whether a match is balanced or not doesn’t matter if there are people expecting easy wins.
Ah yeh.. same here. However I’ve never seen someone deliberately afk on a game that could be won 4v5. It’s more like they were feeling unconfident after midfight and kept playing and we won.
But I am suprised by your answer because it’s not really relevant to what we’re talking about.
Well it is in a way. Last season people giving up wasn’t nearly as common. Because it created balanced games people didn’t feel like the game was already decided at the start of a match.
Yes you are right I did. But still how is someone supposed to play under those conditions?
For most matches you will have to put in a little more effort than that.
This comment is just wrong. At times its nearly every second game you have someone afk, or someone running far the whole match and dying every time, or a complete steamroll or something else game changing. Then the other half of the time its the other team having these issues.
You’d have to experience it to understand.
None of this was a problem with balanced matchmaking.
What are you talking about? The way they did it season 1? Yeah no one complained about that at all they just totally revamped it for season 2 on a whim. Plenty of people complained about MMR averaging teams and if they go back to it plenty will be very displeased.
Read the post before my post.
It should be 1v1 if they want matchmaking to be about skill. Then you’re not handicapped with people who camp at home or run lord to die all match or some other ridiculous crap.
None of this was a problem with balanced matchmaking.
My least favourite map. Points are too close together and too far from spawn. Once a team wins mid it’s too much of a struggle to regain control.
To a degree you are right. If the pip system was different it wouldn’t be so bad. In season 1 if you won 5 or 6 out of 10 games you could go up a tier. This season only have 1 or 2 pips to show for it. Even if they fixed it would still be discouraging for people who are on the bottom rung.
And making the game unplayable for 21 hours a day is plain stupidity. With S2 there’s no way the Anet can make offpeak games more balanced without making queue times longer. So the playerpool decreases and to compensate they increase the pip range compounding the problem of snowball matches. Less people play so queue times go up. It’s a vicious cycle. It will never work.
They are for sale in HotM. Anet might as well get in on the action.
They had that. But ESL players teamed up with an amber alt account. Then other people cottoned on to what they were doing.
I wonder if it will be like the Winter’s day wings. They cost about 700g and were in the gem store 2 months later for 500 gems. That would be funny.
Forum anthropologists. Solo queuers win a game and decide to team up organically without your input. They win some lose some. Same as solo q. Then go back to solo q.
^^Working as intended or epic fail?
^This.
It’s a comp that rewards smurfing, that rewards losing, that has seen an increase in hacking, toxic behavior and verified reports of bribing. All of which anet knew would happen at the start of the season because they discussed these things on twitch.
I played nearly everyday last season. This season I’ve gone whole weeks without playing a single game. It’s a suckers game.
I’m sure last season people had fun. But it wouldn’t suprise me if smurfing increased 135% last season. This season it’s probably 300%. Sounds more like a ponzi scheme new membership program. Now PvP is basically torture to play. Pretty not awesome.
It wasn’t meant to be scientific. It’s just to exemplify how ridiculous the concept of carrying is. That should have been pretty clear.
Well that is a seperate point to what I am making. I don’t disagree with that.
Exactly. In an even playing field you can’t carry. You can only carry when the other team is destined to lose and you accuse them of not carrying. You see how ridiculous it is.
“Also can you please stop pulling numbers out of your kitten , thanks.”
Why? Because it upsets your fantasy?
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