Guild Wars 2

Pyriall.5027:

Who is going to actually pay for those?

If only other multiplayer games had dedicated servers…we could look at those and see however many hundreds of them there are…the historical precedent would be useful…oh well. /sarcasm

Arrow carts got nerfed way back during the beta weekends because everyone was running around in WvW as level 20 or 30. They took tons of damage from the arrow carts because they had no vitality or toughness and complained. Now that most people are properly leveled and geared, arrow carts barely tickle, so the nerf is getting reverted. I don’t see the problem here.

Daddy.1825:

necros should get a condition thats like bleed but better

TWO BLEEDS

Juan Ignacio.8903:

lettu is not a matter of gold or gems im pretty sure that every1 that bougth guild wars 2 is able to afford a custom arena on their own is about the thing that they are not adding anything new and they are charging you for that.

Yes, they are adding something new, and yes, they are charging for it. They are adding the ability to run your own server, change the map rotation, etc. Since you couldn’t do this before, it is “new” by definition.

Zeke Minus.5720:

All of the things you listed are items of cosmetic or little necessary value. They do not restrict or empower and are purely for convenience.

You’re right. And that’s why it doesn’t cost anything to play on a custom arena. Owning a custom arena and being able to change its settings, on the other hand, IS purely for convenience, does not empower the owner of the arena nor restrict non-owners of arenas, and has little necessary value because – remember this crucial fact – you don’t need it to play PvP!

By your own definition, owning a custom arena is not a feature, it’s a cash shop service.

Parisalchuk.9230:

lettucemode.3789:

Parisalchuk.9230:

My guess is tokens will be 100 gems (he did not say it will be way cheaper, the statement clearly said that prices were not set and could be much higher – for arenas, or lower – for tokens.) In which case 1g a month from 5 friends means you get to duel 1 day a month. Yay!

If time tokens are 100 gems, that’s like 3 gold. 1g a month from 5 friends is 1 and 2/3 months. Where are you getting your math from?

I went to go get lunch so I am behind but I have to respond to this. Tokens add a single DAY, not a month. So 5 guys who give 1 gold a month is 1.66 days, not months.

You are correct, I concede the point.

Juan Ignacio.8903:

This is probably the worst example ever

It goes like this

Here is the TV sir its 600$
ok ty here u go 600$, oh sorry i never had a tv b4 how do i change channel?
Oh u have to press this buttom sir and it will charge u 10$
but i just wana see different stuff

And with the gold thingy yeah you are rigth and all but … there is no gold in pvp !

In your example, the TV is GW2. In my example, the TV is custom arenas.

Zeke Minus.5720:

See, the thing that gets me is this: No other feature of Guild War 2 has a cost restriction other than the actual game itself.

There are plenty of things in GW2 with cost restrictions, take a look at the stuff in the Gem Store. Black lion chests and keys to get unique and rare skins, black lion salvage kits so you’re guaranteed to get your rune back, on and on and on. Owning your own custom arena is like one of these things – a nice side feature, but it doesn’t prevent you from playing the game or give you some kind of advantage.

Once they start charging us $5 to enter the mists, you’ll be right.

bhagwad.4281:

Basically you’re saying that the ability to play PvP depends on the largesse of other players who are paying for it.

No, I didn’t say that.

However, you’re correct in that it could be an issue. But if that’s something that you are concerned about, all you need to do is take a look at any other multiplayer game with dedicated servers. There are hundreds of them and the players or clans are happy to keep them running.

Also, the 5v5 tournaments will still be around for free (from what I hear the 8v8 hotjoins will be replaced by arenas). So I disagree that relying on the kindness of others in this case is a problem.

bhagwad.4281:

Are you high? We’ve been playing for a one time payment all this while (as expected and as we did in GW1). It’s absurd to think that Anet will suddenly reverse its policy and start charging for content that we’ve been enjoying all this while.

They may be a company but what you’re suggesting is called bait and switch.

dreztina.4820:

So where are the fees for playing pve? Where is the dungeon that you have to pay gems to get initial access to and then pay every month to continue going in?

This is just another case of anet treating their pvpers like second class citizens by charging them for basic features while pve’ers actually enjoy their buy to play game. Anet, and other game devs, are going to continue treating pvpers like they are worth less than pve’ers until pvpers like you stop making it easy for them.

You are not paying for PvP content! You are paying for the ability to CREATE the PvP content. Playing on anyone’s arena is still free. Playing tournaments is still free. Where are you guys getting this idea that PvP now costs money?

They added a new feature. This new feature costs money to access, and is a specialty item. Playing the game exactly as you have been playing it up to this point still costs 0 extra dollars. What is the problem here?

Parisalchuk.9230:

My guess is tokens will be 100 gems (he did not say it will be way cheaper, the statement clearly said that prices were not set and could be much higher – for arenas, or lower – for tokens.) In which case 1g a month from 5 friends means you get to duel 1 day a month. Yay!

If time tokens are 100 gems, that’s like 3 gold. 1g a month from 5 friends is 1 and 2/3 months. Where are you getting your math from?

GoldenKnightTim.4390:

I just wanted to duel with my brother and play private games with my friends IRL. It’s looking like Arenanet won’t let me do that without paying extra money. I’m legitimately disappointed.

Arenanet DOES let you do that WITHOUT paying money. You can convert gold into gems. If you don’t have enough gold, as you stated, that is NOT Anet’s fault. That is a cumulative result of the actions you have taken in GW2 so far.

Do you do this in real life too?

“Welcome to Best Buy, can I help you?”
“Yea, I’d like a TV with specifications XYZ that my brother and I can watch things on.”
“Here’s a TV matching your description, that’ll be $600.”
“I don’t have that much money.”
“Well, I can put you on a payment plan, $100 a month for six months.”
“I don’t have $100 a month either.”
“Well then I can’t sell you the TV.”
“OMG I JUST WANT THAT TV TO WATCH THINGS ON WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOUUUUU”

Parisalchuk.9230:

Rising Dusk.2408:

Facts:

• MMOs cost tons of money to upkeep
• Most MMOs ameliorate those costs with subscription fees
• GW2 doesn’t have a subscription fee
• GW2 needs to make money to keep themselves afloat as a company and keep the servers running
• GW2 uses microtransactions to ameliorate those costs

There is nothing greedy here. Custom arenas are not required for you to enjoy the game, and if they are because you can’t live without them for whatever reason, well just join someone else’s! Playing in them is free, it’s hosting your own that costs gems. Seriously, this is a perfectly legitimate setup ANet has going on, and there’s nothing shady or greed-driven about it.

Forcing a player to purchase an item, then in addition having to pay to use it is pretty greed-driven.

As I said earlier a system where you purchase an arena and have full use for a flat fee, or a system where you purely buy time tokens to create an arena is a much better setup that still covers the companies cost to upkeep their servers without double charging the customer. Granted – if the arena cost is exactly equal or cheaper then 1 month of tokens then I am ok with this, but without information on pricing I will remain skeptical that this isnt an attempt to grab as much money as possible.

You get a free month when you buy the arena….and anyone can add time to your server with the tokens. If this guy and his brother get a nice dueling server going I imagine he’d meet lots of nice people who would be glad to contribute to keep it going.

Just join someone else’s dueling server and duel him there. There are going to be like 10 billion duel servers once the general public gets access to custom arenas. It only costs money to own a custom arena, not play in one. What’s the problem?

Bas.7406:

lettucemode.3789:

I think I’ll be using Signet of Spite occasionally now, but it won’t have a permanent spot on my bar.

180 power is pretty dang good, especially in builds that use a lot of Knight’s gear and could use the extra power. 1200 range cripple is great for chasing down those eles and warriors (way more reliable than Spectral Grasp, for sure) and the blind will negate a thief opener. Poison, too, good for lessening heals on demand. And you don’t have to fiddle with targeting!

Cooldown still sucks and long casting time still sucks. But hey, at least now there’s a reason to use it.

Underwhelming patch for us, I guess I was expecting a bit more than what we were already told.

How are you going to interrupt the opening move with signet of spite. That cast time and cd is the issue, and if you are running a build that needs the 180 power, you would lose it all once you activated the signet.

Basillisk Venom has a long casting time too. Many times roaming around in WvW I see a thief, and as we move toward each other he starts casting something, and 100% of the time it’s Basilisk Venom. Since I know this, I can start casting the signet before we get within Steal range of each other. I’ll gladly trade 180 power for not losing half my health or all my life force as the fight starts.

I think I’ll be using Signet of Spite occasionally now, but it won’t have a permanent spot on my bar.

180 power is pretty dang good, especially in builds that use a lot of Knight’s gear and could use the extra power. 1200 range cripple is great for chasing down those eles and warriors (way more reliable than Spectral Grasp, for sure) and the blind will negate a thief opener. Poison, too, good for lessening heals on demand. And you don’t have to fiddle with targeting!

Cooldown still sucks and long casting time still sucks. But hey, at least now there’s a reason to use it.

Underwhelming patch for us, I guess I was expecting a bit more than what we were already told.

Alright, thanks for the additional info all. My understanding was incorrect. I do WvW a lot and have experimented using minions in my utility slots, but I haven’t done a full minion build since I hit 80.

NevirSayDie.6235:

Condition removal is last in, first out.

Really? That’d be cool if it was true, but I’m pretty sure it’s random. Have you tested it out?

This is the first time I’ve ever heard that there’s not enough condition removal in the game. For the past 6 months it’s been like, “all my conditions are instantly cleansed wtf halp” in this forum and on the subreddit, like one thread every couple weeks. Interesting.

Bas and Bhawb figured out how to get the minions to work every time, go listen to the podcast on it. sittingonacouch.com

Sure, the reliability increases the closer you are to the target. But it’s still usable from 900 range and up. I use it a lot to snatch people in WvW, and besides the occasional “obstructed” message on a flat plain I have no complaints with the skill.

I’m expecting good things. Corrupt Boon and Epidemic getting buffed back up a bit is a good thing. Signet of Spite up to 180 power, along with other possible changes, is a great thing. It might make it worth taking in my hybrid. 180 power for free? That’s like four armor pieces! (yes, the cooldown and traits still blow)

Other than that, I’m expecting some bug fixes. Always happy to see those.

I’d like to see some trait consolidation, but I don’t expect we’ll get that quite yet.

Necromancer is pretty much the only class that keeps getting better and better with every patch, so I don’t expect this one to be different.

Cavalier primary attribute is toughness.

OP, I agree with Arkanis, mixing Berserker and Valkyrie would get you what you want. And twice as much critical damage, too!

Thanks for the tips but I knew them already, I know how confusion works and how to avoid it. Also, kite from multiple, ranged phantasms on an open plain? Right.

And it didn’t expire after 3-5 seconds. More like 10. He had the bonus condition duration food (apple icon) on as well.

I think that confusion is fine in theory. But in practice the damage is simply too high (in WvW). In competitive games, if I have a counter (condition transfers and cleanses) to what someone is doing (confusion stacking), they should not be able to counter my counter by doing more of the original, countered thing. It basically makes the original thing the strongest tactic in the game, since you can beat all its counters by just doing more of it.

I would support reducing the nerf to maybe 30% and then take some time to see what state WvW glamour mesmers are in.

So I was one of the people advocating that confusion is fine and that it didn’t need to be changed. Then I started running into a few confusion mesmers in WvW. And while confusion as a condition is fine, I’m not sure how you can justify the damage it did. The nerf was warranted.

Just yesterday I ran into such a mesmer. I’m a condition necromancer, so I have two different condition transfers and a cleanse on my heal. He had 25 stacks of his condition damage sigil and the food (but with the wrench icon) that increases your condition damage. We get to fighting.

A few seconds in, I get 8 stacks of confusion on me. I transfer them to him, but take 6k damage. The hell?

A bit later, 6 more stacks. Transfer again (which he dodged). 4k damage.

Switch to DS to tank a bit. Get loaded up again, go to heal. Take another 4k damage from confusion. -.-

Eventually I lost the fight. I was not spamming spells. I was not frantically clicking and trying to get huge numbers, as a necromancer I don’t have that luxury. I was not ignoring what conditions I had on me, as a condition necro it’s very important that I pay attention to that kind of thing. What I was doing was using my abilities smartly and at the correct times, and I still lost because of the ridiculous confusion damage (also he was a good player).

This is only one example of something that happened several times over.

This change does not break glamour builds – they are still strong in sPvP, and you can already get more condition damage in WvW than you can in sPvP. Just because something has been nerfed from god-tier doesn’t mean it falls down to useless-tier.

infantrydiv.1620:

Because Scepter and Staff vanilla damage are quite weak, and if I want to stack bleeds on something I can do it far more effectively with a condition damage based scepter build than with Barbed Precision and sigil of earth. I find Barbed Precision to be Anet’s only real link between the precision and condition damage on the Curses trait line…

Why can’t you use both? That’s the standard bleed build: scepter, 30 points in Curses, rabid armor (pre/tough/cond), earth sigil. Anyway, crit in this game is useful for way more than just damage with all the on-crit sigils. I think there was a warrior build a long time ago that used no power but tons of precision because he could proc on-crit effects a lot and it greatly improve his survivability that way.

What you see as a negative I see as a positive. I like that Curses gives both crit and condition damage because it means that both condition builds and crit builds have a reason to use those traits. So even though one may use a condition build, with points in curses he can still take advantage of traits like Withering Precision, because even if he doesn’t do lots of damage he’s still proccing the weakness reguarly. Compare that to the condition thief, which has no reason to put points into its crit chance/crit damage line, even if some of the later traits would be useful.

I agree that necromancer is encouraged to play hybrid and that it’s not the best class for focusing all in one thing. But that’s what makes the class unique and fun to me.

digiowl.9620:

There is also a cute little bug where going into DS will trigger any “on health below X%” effects.

Not for at least 3 months. Keep up.

I haven’t played a strict conditionmancer in a while, but as I recall a good combo is something like:

spectral walk and run in → staff 2 → staff 3 → DS 2 → dodge for free mark → swap weapons → scepter 2 → dagger 5 → spectral out → scepter 1 spam.

Rabid armor, undead runes, sigils of earth and corruption.

Nemesis.8593:

[img]http://i.imgur.com/0gWi1T4.jpg[/img]

Remember this Bas ?

I Terror’d a warrior down in sPvP a few months ago, after I saw your video on the build. He flipped his kitten. Whispered me telling me to kill myself, that I was scrubby while he was super skilled, how he was top 100 WoW arena and GW2 is a skill-less game, etc. It was really funny for a while, then the conversation turned toward his upbringing and home life and things got kinda sad. Whoever you were, angry warrior guy, I’ll never forget you. #neverforget

See, without the Terror build I never would have had this human connection! It mustn’t be changed!

You can burst with s/d with the arcane spells and lightning attunement, I saw a streamer do it once. It’s 5-7 spells in a row that have 0 casting time and will all crit guaranteed. Dropped a heavy golem from full to 10% in no time flat.

piffdaddy.8014:

lettucemode.3789:

It doesn’t take it away, 30 in water and arcana would still give cleansing wave and evasive arcana heal. Just instead of Flame Burst, Blinding Flash, and Churning Earth on dodge in the other attunements, you’d get Sunspot (damage at location), Electric Discharge (strike foe with lightning), and Earthen Blast (damage and cripple at location), respectively, instead.

my last post was directed at the op, but honestly your idea is not so bad. I just dont want to lose my elementalists healing because of QQ. The op thinks we should be gutted and forced to use a focus for any survivability.

My apologies then, I thought you were talking to me

Gonna post this idea here for more visibility. I think eles could be brought down a bit by swapping the effects of Evasive Arcana with the 15 point minor traits, or swapping the effects of Elemental Attunement with the 15 point minor traits. Bunker eles (30 in water, 30 in arcane) would still get their heals and most of their boons and condition removal, they just wouldn’t get the benefits of all the other attunements too.

This would also make the the class less forgiving, so this IS related to the OP.

It doesn’t start until 12pm PST, 3pm EST. Still got some time to go. Though I second the motion; if someone could post the VOD link in here once it’s done I’d appreciate it.

It doesn’t take it away, 30 in water and arcana would still give cleansing wave and evasive arcana heal. Just instead of Flame Burst, Blinding Flash, and Churning Earth on dodge in the other attunements, you’d get Sunspot (damage at location), Electric Discharge (strike foe with lightning), and Earthen Blast (damage and cripple at location), respectively, instead.

How about swapping the effects of Evasive Arcana with the 15 point minor traits?

Agree with everyone else in here.Terror builds mess with the way people think necromancers should work, and make them be more careful about when and where to use their stunbreaks and cleanses. But the majority of people don’t want to think, and taking more stunbreaks or cleanses means they miss out on 5% extra damage on shatters, so they complain.

Like nemesis said, there are builds that beat the Terror build, too. It’s not a broken mechanic, some builds just counter others, that’s the nature of the game.

Full Knight’s with some zerker or valk jewels, 30 points in SR, and spectral skills will make you the hard-hitting yet tough necro you’re looking for. Confusion mesmers are a huge pain, but hey, can’t have everything.

Here’s what I run: http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/necromancer/?5.4|7.1n.h15.d.1n.h1|8.1n.h15.d.1n.h1|1n.7f.1n.7f.1n.7f.1n.7f.1n.7f.1n.7f|2v.0.1n.67.1n.67.1n.67.1n.67.1i.67|a5.k4a.a6.0.u46c|0.0|3r.49.47.48.4g|e

There’s room to tinker with the different weapons, too, so use what you like.

As someone who’s played a similar trait setup as this, I say, nice! 10/20/10/0/30 is a really fun build :-D

I went all power with my WvW solo necro with that trait setup (full Knight’s with some beryl jewels), so I can’t comment on how mixing in the condition damage would work. I do have some suggestions though.

Since you’re using staff, change out Shrouded Removal for Greater Marks. It’s really hard to hit with marks in small fights in WvW without it, and you said you wanted to roam solo. Change out Blood Fiend for Consume Conditions so that you have a bit more defense against conditions. In my experience, Putrid Mark or Shrouded Removal by themselves aren’t enough. Other than that I think your traits are fine.

It doesn’t seem to me like you have enough power in your build to justify all the crit damage. Additionally, your weapon choices work against the power you do have – scepter and staff have the worse direct damage multipliers on them, I believe. D/D or A/D along with staff would work better. But I haven’t played it, so if you’re happy with the numbers you’re getting, that’s fine.

If you’re able to record yourself playing, I’d be interested in a short video showing how the build is working.

And check out the Facemelter build in my signature for my take on the power/condition hybrid with Terror. I have a PvE/WvW version too if you’re interested.

You need to have the weapon that has the sigil in it out at the time of the kill.

There are other condition bursts. Engis can load someone up with 6 conditions in no time flat, and Burning hits pretty hard in an HGH build.

Only about 3k of the damage was Axe. 5.5k was Terror ticks, and the rest was bleed ticks from Barbed Precision, Sigil of Earth, and BiP. I count those as part of the combo. Probably shoulda mentioned BiP in my post.

No need to interrupt a heal if you save the combo for when they’re at about 60% health. It downs a lot of builds from that point. Usually you gotta wait for the stunbreak too.

You can negate thief and ele combos with a single dodge too, so not sure what your point is there.

40s or 32s cooldown on a 12k damage combo is fine with me. Steal, B.Venom, and Fire Grab are 45s.

Nice vid! I like power build necros. Looks like 30/0/0/20/20, right? Do you have the gear you use posted somewhere already? If not, could you provide? :-D

Yea, the damage is insane. I was testing the damage from a staff 5 -> DS 3 -> Axe 2 combo with my Facemelter build and consistently got over 12k. Unlike other condition bursts ours is unavoidable without a stunbreak. Really strong stuff. Cheers

Depends on the necro’s build. In my experience power builds have a very tough time against a mesmer, especially the confusion-stacking ones. They have lots of dodges from vigor and can blink around and drop target, so it’s difficult to get near them and lock them down long enough to get your single target damage in.

Condition builds on the other hand counter mesmers pretty well. 2-3 condition transfers and lots of consistent condition stacking means that you’ll soon outpace the mesmer’s limited removal, and since we have lots of AoE condition application there’s an easier time of actually landing things. If you pay attention and avoid the shatters the mesmer will drop in a relatively short amount of time.

So no, I don’t think mesmers are designed to counter necros. I think it’s a battle of the builds.

Used this for months in my spectral power/crit build. Tried to defend it on the forums a few times :P glad to see others using it! It’s really great for both offense and defense.

SA does increase the base time of the protection from Spectral Wall. In my tests it went from 5s to 7s base, even though the tooltip doesn’t update. So one can still only run through the wall twice before it expires. If you were getting 9s with your build, that’s awesome I was getting 7.7s because of only 10 points in Death Magic. 16s of protection on a 32s cooldown is amazing (18s for you), plus Last Gasp means you can have Protection on for over half the fight.

Then I come to the forum and see people complaining that necromancer doesn’t have good access to boons like protection :P

haviz.1340:

Elemental attunement and earth’s embrace are already major traits, unless you mean master. If you move renewing staming to air it should be changed to minor trait like vigorous precision and critical infusion.

Yes, I did mean Master, thanks for asking. Gonna edit.

Another similar idea: swap the effects of the 15-point minor traits and Elemental Attunement. So with 10 points in Arcane you’d get various effects on switching (damage on fire and air, bleed on earth, heal on water), but you’d only get boons for switching if you put 15 points into those lines.

Hey Paul, if you are not too discouraged and are interested in learning more about PvP I am willing to lend a hand and guide you, give you tips and stuff :-) I doubt we’re on the same server but we can do some sPvP, it’s a great place to practice in a controlled environment. Send me a whisper and/or friend request in game, my account name and number are to the left. My Steam account is 2knowindeed, that would probably work better in case I don’t get on GW2 some nights.

I like the PvP in this game much more than WoW, it has lots of depth. However if it’s not the game for you that is understandable :-)

IMO, best way to balance cantrip ele isn’t by nerfing traits, but by moving them into other trait lines. Keep the power of the build, just make them sacrifice to get it, make it so they have tougher decisions to get there. This also helps out other builds that may put points into those lines.

I’m no balance guru, but off the top of my head:
-move Soothing Disruption and Cantrip Master to Earth
-make Elemental Attunement a Master trait
-move Renewing Stamina to Air
-make Earth’s Embrace a Master trait (as suggested in OP)

Thoughts?

Didn’t they talk about this in the last SotG? They tried deathmatch, and it basically went like this:

1) Teams stand around staring at each other for a little while
2) Someone gets impatient and both teams run at each other
3) Everyone uses their elites
4) Huge clusterkitten
5) Elites wear off
6) Whoever happens to have more players left over wins

Doesn’t sound fun to me. I didn’t like WoW areas for similar reasons. Battlegrounds were great.

Basically you gotta pay attention to the phantasms.

-If all of the clones/phantasms start running toward you (and you’re not out of LOS) the mesmer just used a shatter. Dodge through the phantams, not away.

- If only one of the phantasms is running toward you, then the mesmer likely has his sword out and used the 3 skill. How this works is he can use the skill again to swap locations with it and immobilize you. Then he does sword 2 to slash a bunch and turn invulnerable. To avoid this simply dodge toward the phantasm.

-If he stuns you with a pistol shot, stun break it.

That’s really all you need to know. Conditions and AoE work better than single target direct damage because of how slippery they are. I used to have a lot of trouble with them on my power necro, then I switched to conditions and don’t have much trouble anymore.

Also I agree with everything in Rennoko’s last post.

Kardiamond.6952:

Been a long time since I had to arg with ya, I remember the good old them before my engineer when we couldn’t agree if our well healing was worth it.

Good old time! :P

But yeah, about daggering him to death.

I feel it’s pretty random, as any descent thief won’t follow a pattern. Yeah if you hit him, you know because of the chain that you are on him. The issue? They have a many direction they can go.

If you miss the hit, like if you hit in a direction they didn’t go, you just missed them. They will come back with a lot more HP, maybe kite you a bit with short bow. And retry the same thing again.

It’s like a random chance of holding to him each time. Especiall if they have a dodge available.

And if you watch the previous video, once they are stealthed, they can perma stealth over and over if they don’t hit you. And it’s pretty hard to stop them from doing so.

I still feel like that kind of build is directly countering us. Especially with the direct damage they can dish.

Yea, good times. And I did switch from Well of Blood soon after that conversation :-)

I agree, daggering a stealthed thief is not reliable and I made it sound like it was. I think it’s still a valid option against a backstab thief, since you know they are either going to try to backstab or CnD again. Otherwise yea, not worth it, you are correct.

I don’t think it’s difficult to stop a thief from permastealthing in a 1v1 if you know he’s doing it and dodge at the right time, or cripple and run in a straight line. If a thief is terrorizing a group of people then yes, it’s pretty difficult.

I don’t think that any one profession counters another profession or build in this game. I think that certain builds counter certain other builds and that is okay, for example, backstab thieves avoid guardians 1v1 like the plague. I will say that I think this build/counterbuild idea is not as present in the thief/necro matchup, and that a stealth build is the safest, most reliable build against a necromancer, and the safest builds/strats are generally the most popular in any game. But I stop short of calling it a counter to us entirely.

I can’t check the link because I’m at work right now, but this sounds very similar to my Facemelter build, link in sig. Glad to see you are walking a similar path, hybrid terror is a great build :-D