@TheFug – Please show us this proof about which servers you have faced that make yours better than ours. If I look at the ranking, you know the numbers, they show us at 7th over time, and your server at 9th, with your server a good deal behind. Overall. I think our servers are a lot closer than some of the other brackets right now but clearly you underestimate us.
I think the whole world lives in a state of denial these days, but some people worse than others.
@TheFug – We have fought nearly the same opponents as you, and actually had to face the might of servers getting transfers from tier 1 (who will be in tier 1 next week or already in tier 1 now – Blackgate anyone?).
You aren’t making any point except coming here to talk smack. I read through this thread and I see some great chats between servers. I see people having fun. Its too bad you get one poor sport who decides to come on here and disturb a good thing.
I’ll tell you what. When your server rallies and defeats us, maybe even next week, then I’ll be the first person to congratulate you folks on a good win. Until you do, I have nothing else to say. You can take as many digs on TC as you like. It won’t change anything. This is our week, that’s all.
@TheFug – unless you can be in all places at once you have no idea what the rest of our forces are doing. Many of our commanders are preparing for next week already. Many of our players are leveling alts. Ask yourself where all your players from Friday went. To suggest we actively avoid you just sounds like you are a sore loser.
If we did push you back into your spawn, my guess is that you would be the first person complaining about that too. Don’t worry though, like I said before, most of us are completely against that type of domination. Who knows, maybe you are right and you folks wouldn’t let us do it. There is no sense debating it with you. If you folks do get better and go up a tier, you better expect a lot worse. SoR will backhand you like no tomorrow if you even suggest anything like this silliness. Oh and they will camp your spawn like you have never been camped and expect you to come out with a smile on your face for another dirtnap the next day.
Well, we could just do what SoR did to us last week and park sieges outside your gates and kill anything that moves. Most of us (not all obviously) don’t go for that at all.
This is all kind of silly. We will attack when we attack. You will defend when we attack. Territory will flip. We have more people and therefor can do it in more places. Do you think you are the only players this week who can’t find any combat? Perhaps you should go into your server maps and start asking all those folks who gave up to show up. It isn’t our fault they aren’t playing.
That makes absolutely no sense. Are you actually reading my posts? Also, have you ever played at a time outside of prime time. It sounds like none of you have actually seen what goes on outside of primetime, yet are willing to call trolls to those of us who are actually defending our borderlands for more than 2 hours at a time.
What about a few weeks ago when your server crushed us? It was superior tactics? Your server had more people? A combination of both? No server can deny having zerg troops. Most of us frown against it. Unfortunately for you, we have a lot of people playing here now. Still, we have earned every bloody step into the tier we are in right now. There are times when our armies are zergish (so are yours for that matter), and there are times with a high amount of organization. We wouldn’t be in this tier if we just zerged around in one group all the time expecting a win.
I’m really sorry that you folks are being outnumbered. All of us on TC have a very fair sense of play. We want a good game and a challenge. We only learn to get better when we are being driven into the dirt. Trust me, we ate a LOT of dirt last week.
I think you should withhold your opinions on this matter further as you are not looking good to us or your own server mates.
Maybe I’m just doing it wrong. It seems as soon as I hit our great DS mechanic, everyone keys in on me in PVP/WVW and I’m #1 target for Knockdown, Knockback, Stun, Immobilize, Fear, and Root. By the time I recover from this, or even hit a button to break one of the above CC, I’m out of DS lifeforce and just a sitting duck. I mean, if I’m supposed to be that guy you don’t want to engage with, why can just about everyone counter my ability with CC right off the bat?
Most of them are extremely cool, especially Jadon. There is one in particular who is just plain mean spirited. Experienced it first-hand and was surprised by it. You shouldn’t treat your own server-mates this way when they are working their butt off to help.
I think you folks will be fine. You are a good server and honestly agree with the post above that some bad apples transferred there but the vast majority of BG folks are good people.
@Dwok – thanks for the positive words. We will do our best. Good luck to you folks next week too. Your team really has great tactics. It isn’t just the numbers you have, as I’ve fought small battles all week as well. Your commanders and players deserve credit where it is due.
I think the orbs are fun as well, but I don’t agree that buffs of that magnitude are necessary and are counter to a fair match.
Some advantage of some significant magnitude is necessary for orbs to be orbs, and stat buffs provide the largest fun. TBH it would probably better to provide a DPS buff but 0 defensive buff (e.g. +50/100/150 power and condition damage, but 0 to other stats). This way the total effect would be less, but people would still get a stiffy off their big numbers and still key in on the orb as a significant non-PPT objective in WvW.
Sidenote: This is how it was in DAOC, *cough*DAOC mention strikes again.
That is ALL I want out of my gaming. A fair match. Win or lose, I don’t care.
Then play sPvP, because WvW is inherently not “fair” for about a thousand reasons.
The buffs are gone and you are arguing for no reason.
Then you are an idiot because we (I) are not discussing the orbs-that-were, we are talking about the return-of-the-orbs-to-be-when-ANet-mitigates-cheating.
Welcome to an infraction. Like I said about harsh words… ANet said themselves the buffs were part of the problem. Good companies fix problems. End of topic for me. Good luck, hopefully this is your only infraction.
I faced you folks in a pretty harsh match that you stomped us in. I think part of it was the attitude of the players on your server coming to this forum in the match’s thread. They were complaining of being bored, insulting to our server straight out sometimes, and showed a real lack of sportsmanship.
The usual response to this is the same as any other issue that arises. You can’t blame one server for a few bad apples. Unfortunately, since this is a community, that is exactly what can happen if it gets out of control. This is why as a server you folks need to rein these bad folks in and try to bring them into the fold of being proud of their server without being jerks. Learn to win with some grace.
Another thing you guys can do is stop asking for more people to join your server and live with what you have, like most of the servers do. Winning isn’t everything when you sacrifice your soul for it.
I hated you guys a few days after the match, but have since gotten over it. I wish you the best of luck. Honestly, and I think eventually this stuff will blow over and Beastgate will be one of the best servers out there.
You somehow think you are some great mastermind and yet you keep repeating the same silly information.
I’m not some great mastermind. I simply play the WvW game and pay attention to what causes winning or losing.
No matter how many posts you quote or how think -think- you are some Sun Tzu, the fact is you are no different than anyone else – except you want those buffs back.
Sure, I want orbs back because they were fun. Strategies circle around orb movement or orb plays. It adds a new layer to WvW strategy.
The simple reality, as you put it, is that orb buffs are the least stack factor for a winning team.
P.S. I am also a better player than most but I don’t need to prove it with forum posts. Harsh words are for fools and cowards.
I never attempted to prove it with forum posts. I only confirmed what you accused me of. It seems you try to start a lot of kitten but you can’t really finish it when you have no leg to stand on.
Like I said above your first two replies were insulting to skill, be it server or individually. You shouldn’t need to insult me if you have a good debate. You have excellent writing skills but your delivery needs work. I think the orbs are fun as well, but I don’t agree that buffs of that magnitude are necessary and are counter to a fair match. That is ALL I want out of my gaming. A fair match. Win or lose, I don’t care. I’ve already finished this by explaining to you that your information isn’t even important anymore. The buffs are gone and you are arguing for no reason.
@EasymodeX – I don’t need to try. You are making my point for me. You somehow think you are some great mastermind and yet you keep repeating the same silly information. You are basically just playing a virtual game of “I know you are but what am I.” The orb buff is gone. Let reality set in. No matter how many posts you quote or how think -think- you are some Sun Tzu, the fact is you are no different than anyone else – except you want those buffs back. Admit it. Move on.
P.S. I am also a better player than most but I don’t need to prove it with forum posts. Harsh words are for fools and cowards. Your first two replies to my post were simply thinly veiled insults, one of which was edited by a moderator.
I don’t understand why the orbs gone means there’s nothing to fight for in WvW. What about the score? What about moving your server up in the ranks? There’s plenty to fight for.
There is, I agree. I’m sure you will see large numbers of players in WvW tonight after the reset.
I think the idea he had was to give some type of reward as well as the points. I don’t see a problem with that. I don’t care for stat buffs though. Still, in this case, I didn’t think his example was overboard.
Why would we find another reason to bring back buffs for one side? Let’s call them rewards instead and focus on a carrot for you folks that need something more to fight for than server pride. :P
@EasymodeX – what is your point? I’ve been there too. The game has been out how long? Also, which server are you vacating this week?
The buffs are too big of an advantage for an already dominating team. I don’t see how that is so hard for you to comprehend. I could understand all of your arguments for the orbs if you didn’t keep whining about the buffs. Because of this, it looks to me like you depend on them to have an advantage. I would love to have the orbs still, but the exploits would have to be fixed first, and of course the buffs are not needed. There could be any number of rewards for a team having the orbs, and yet you keep whining for the buffs. I wonder why?
They very obviously do affect server balance. I’m sure ANet has the statistics to prove it. Server transfers are worse.
How was I supposed to interpret your posts? You come off haughty and act like you are a better player than everyone else. Yet you transfer servers all the time and are here telling us you think the orb buffs were fine. Sorry man, but you just don’t have me convinced.
I think you should read what I said. All of this preaching as if you understand the game mechanics better than I do is a waste of your time. Now that the orb buffs are gone, it will be on you to prove they didn’t make a difference. I never said once in my posts, which you completely ignore or make some silly assumption about, that the orbs were the difference in winning or losing a match. I did say the buffs were a silly advantage that were not needed for a winning team. It seems to me that your goal is to prove to everyone else that the buffs were not needed to win a match. Quit trying to do that with me. Anyone that knows the server I come from knows we don’t care if we win or lose as long as we have a good fight. We don’t do too bad either. We also don’t hop servers.
In fact, as long as you jump around servers the way you do, whatever your excuses are, I won’t respect your opinions much. Sorry.
The only thing you know is you want the buffs. The only thing I know for sure is that they are no longer there. Now we have reality.
I also know that losers will still lose, and winners will still win.
I also know that the servers in 3rd place will not be able to make comebacks due to the supply mechanics.
I also know that I’ve played with 0 orbs against 3 plenty of times to know exactly how much difference it does (or does not) make.
Really? Do tell. How many moves have you made? I know that losers transfer to better situations. Winners are people who don’t give up. Winners understand sometimes you lose. Winners understand that in order for a win to mean anything at all the game has to be fair. You make a lot of assumptions. You assume just because servers are in a top tier they are there because of skill. While it is the case that there are very good guilds and players on these servers, the bandwagon situation has completely invalidated the results. Come back to me in a few months when the servers even out and then brag about your so-called experience. The top tier servers have only proven to fall apart at this point.
I’ll tell you what, next time we play a match with your server, whatever it is, I’ll meet you out in the open field, just me and you, and we will see who walks away alive. You blow out a lot of hot air. Face the fact, the buffs are gone and there really is no argument here. Be mad about it but it won’t change anything.
You don’t know me from Adam, so you don’t know what I want. I speak for the majority when I say this was a needed change.
I know what you want with the same certainty that you know what the majority wants (or needs).
15% health/150 stats = over powered characters. Some people like to PvP in WvW and even capping camps is a struggle with the orbs, sorry, over, powered.
I cap camps solo with no orb buffs. If your entire server has a struggle to cap a single supply camp, the problem is not with orb buffs.
The only thing you know is you want the buffs. The only thing I know for sure is that they are no longer there. Now we have reality.
We’ll see how things turn out tonight, but my suggestion is that if you are a glass cannon thief used to charging in and bombing the enemy, you better consider your traits again. Bad players can’t hide behind buffs anymore.
Really, why? I’ve been playing my glass cannon thief on a seriously losing server for a long time now against those with 3 orb bonuses. I’ve been doing just fine but thanks for your concern
Well I clearly remember yesterday when thieves like you were doing quite well bombing folks. Those same thieves were unable to do the same after the patch. You may be an exception where skill is a measure, but in the long run, these players relying on extra buffs for damage and health were sadly faced with reality last night. Oh and its not concern, its glee.
There are a lot of opinions on both sides of the orb buff discussion. You’re pretty delusional if you think you speak for everyone.
He never said anywhere he only wants to win, he only wants fairness. Winning isn’t a priority to some.
He obviously wants to win, because pre-change was already fair.
It’s the same as all the servers crying about old-HOD 24×7 map presence. If you don’t have the capacity to win, then you lose. Taking and holding orbs is a demonstration of capacity — whether that is sourced from raw skill, tactics, population, motivation. PPT is the exact same. Orbs are a result of server disparities, not a cause of them.
Hence, there is little difference and people will still be crying about domino WvW matchups 7 days from now.
The real change to game flow balance is going to be with supply. Supply is the currency of WvW, and it’s Nth tier scrubs that think that +50 stats makes them lose. Hopefully ANet will tune the flow of supply and toss Orbs back in for fun at the same time.
Denial is strong in this one. No reason to argue, the buffs are gone. You don’t know me from Adam, so you don’t know what I want. I speak for the majority when I say this was a needed change. I’m not going to call you delusional if you think otherwise, I’ll just let the post count and replies from people speak for me. Have a nice time with a fair game tonight!
Tactics are needed again. Fair play is returned. Tonight will be a glorious night indeed!
Tactics … like acquiring Orbs?
If you didn’t have the tactics or capacity to take or hold Orbs before, you will continue to lose after the change.
We had no problem doing so. This is why our server is in a decent tier. Not 1-2 but 3 at least. Someday 2. I’m proud of where we are at. We don’t need bandwagon jumpers to win. Let’s not devolve this conversation into what you -think- makes you a better server when we know for a fact its server transfers that have resulted in the current dominating servers. These aren’t tactics – they are bodies… Moving on, since there is no debate here – the orbs are gone. The buffs won’t be back and the general population thinks that is a good thing.
Anecdotal. Your opponent server probably stopped playing since it’s Thursday and matches reset Friday. This flow of population has been evidenced in almost every tier almost every week almost every match.
Losing servers will still lose without orbs. Orbs or no orbs really won’t make the kind of difference you want.
Sorry, but no. No sense in arguing over something that has been removed anyways. We’ll see how things turn out tonight, but my suggestion is that if you are a glass cannon thief used to charging in and bombing the enemy, you better consider your traits again. Bad players can’t hide behind buffs anymore. A lesser population with better strategy has a chance. On your server, you might want to start recruiting more bodies.
@Cloud – wasn’t it glorious last night melting those OMGWTFBBQSAUCE glass cannon players whose build relied on these orb buffs? I was playing all day before the patch and our enemy was mercilessly charging in swaggering and stomping. After the patch? At first they tried charging in like before, the only problem was their twitching corpse left smoking on the ground. Tactics are needed again. Fair play is returned. Tonight will be a glorious night indeed!
@TheRamosOnline – please continue not bothering with the borderlands. My server will continue to rack up huge points there while your team waits in queue for EB.
@EasymodeX – lol the orb stat bonuses are fine? After the patch last night our server went from being completely dominated in the spawn to holding territory again. Fights were fair. You can’t explain actual results away. AN calculated the results of what the orb buffs were doing, along with the exploit problem, and hence we have no orbs in the game at present. They will bring them back, but you can kiss those buffs goodbye.
I don’t care if they return the orbs as long as those ridiculous buffs don’t come with them. If they bring those back, I’ll be gone the next day. Thankfully, they removed the orbs for this reason (as well as the hackers). Our match tonight also changed quite a bit as a result. We wouldn’t beat this tough server anyway, but at least now we aren’t fodder to them.
Sooo much more fun tonight. It was a great call. I love the idea of the orbs, but the boons/buffs it gave were CLEARLY too powerful. Thanks for making WvW fun again.
Been the most fun I’ve had all week. Team we were fighting this week is used to just bombing us and rushing in with no risk to themselves. They adjusted quickly because they are a tough server, but they still die like the rest of us now. Much more tactics are required on their part and no more rofl easy kills (especially thieves). The game is playing like it should if you ask me. Thank you!!!
Orb removal changed this game tonight. Thank you soooooo much ANet. I’ve been complaining a lot about this game, but after tonight I’m a satisfied customer.
Swapping the buff = bad idea. Outmanned buff was good for gold farms. I’m sure they were hacking orbs to cause the outmanned buff on one side or another on busy days. Gold per hour is all they care about. Have some fun on everyone else’s expense. Steal some poor moron’s account who purchased the gold… Swapping the buffs would only encourage them to do it all the time because the orbs would mean pure money.
It would be no surprise to me that the orb hackers were doing it to cause people to leave WVW and get the outmanned buff – so their bots in wvw could farm more gold. I’m totally serious. They do anything they can to make more gold per hour.
It’s still close, SBI has bad EU presence, BG has amazing EU presence. SBI has amazing asian presence, BG has bad asian presence. As much as people want to just crush BG or crush SBI its just not going to happen. Whoever wins is only going to win by 10k points or less.
I think BG needs to lose. Not because of being beat by them (well maybe partially evil grin) but trust me when I say SoR is better than BG. You guys need to be determined and hungry when you fight them. I honestly don’t know what the result will be, but I look forward to watching that fight almost as much as the next UFC title bout.
I second the notion that all that needed to be done was swap the buffs: Orb for Outmanned and vice verse.
Except they already said its not that easy. Hence, quick and -temporary- removal. Why complain when they say they will bring it back or something better?
Why does everyone need a reward now? WoW totally destroyed gaming. It should be about the competition above all else. Sure, rewards are a nice bit of fluff, but kicking butt and having bragging rights are a helluva lot better than some piece of gear or silly reward. Just my opinion, but I’m sure everyone wanting their carrot will gripe about it.
EDIT: I think showing the person’s name you are fighting in the combat logs would be awesome. Also in emotes.
Beastgate outmanned? Losing? How can it be? They seemed unstoppable when we played them a couple weeks ago. They had tons of players and it was non-stop waves of death.
Then we played SoR this week. Add the above experience with Blackgate with highly advanced tactics. At least against BG we got out of our spawn and put a hurt in our own borderlands and EB. Against SoR this has been next to impossible. I’m thankful for the Orb removal soon and hope it helps against server as advanced as SoR. I hated BG for their treatment of us when we played them. Complaining about being bored and coming to the forums to mouth off. SoR hasn’t done much of that, or even the silly emoting. They have sieged up the starting areas pretty heavy though. Its brutal. We learned a lot fighting BG, and even more fighting SoR.
In the end, my anger at BG is totally gone. I’m not angry with SoR either. I’m just determined to see TC get better and have fun. I hope everyone in this matchup is having more fun than we are this week. Good luck BG.
If you are seriously bellyaching about this temporary fix you either enjoyed the overpowered boons or are one of the people who loves flying around with an orb.
Yes, remove the orbs until they can deal with hackers. If you make it a boon that results in any type of extra money the hackers will be even worse, as they will use it as another means to farm gold and sell it.
If you need more reasons to wvw than what there already are then you are missing the point. This won’t change anything for true players and guilds that want to compete. It will simply fix huge issues with balance and hacking. I love the orb idea, as long as it is working. The boons given for having the orbs were much too strong for an already dominating team. I would support this change even if it was only done to stop the hackers though. Hours of team work wasted to see some kitten fly away with it. That alone makes this change worth it. Good job ANet.
You remove a feature instead of fixing the exploit? Sorry, no comment.
However, the Orb buff was definitely bad gameplay-wise, but what should have happened is keep the exciting Orb mechanics and just make the buff magic-find or something similar.
They stated in the original post that it’s coming back eventually, they just need a solution now as its effect is too grandiose on the matches. Removing them altogether is the best and fastest solution for the now. Give them time.
