Thief also does higher dps with fgs and stacks vuln. More stealth. Faster stealth. Perma blinds. Spammable blasts. Faster at skipping. Is that not enough to convince you?
Engie is:
- More DPS than thief outside of FGS.
- Better cleave for trash clears.
- Way better vuln stacking outside of FGS, and slightly better vuln stacking with
- Blasts are simultaneously and faster.
- Can blind without sacrificing DPS
It is true that thief has better stealth and better modifiers for FGS, and can permablind at the cost of something like half their potenital DPS, but if those are the only reasons you’re taking a thief and think engie is never viable, you’re just intentionally being close-minded. You wouldn’t take a full cleric hammer/staff guard if a DPS greatsword guard with Wall of Reflection is good enough for the content you’re running, and you don’t need to take a stealth-and-blind-spamming thief when an engie provides enough for your purposes and gives you better DPS.
I just watched through our run. I was NEVER able to maintain 25 vuln on bosses, not even on belka. It usually reached 25 peaks while dropping to 14-15 on average. And this is including other people’s vuln stacks. I was even using Koi Cake and the vuln on crit trait. Been doing your rotation, with little interrupts, as bosses don’t just facetank you infinitely.
Even on bosses, the engie should be maintaining 10-15 of those stacks you’re seeing, so that alone is a pretty big DPS boost. If they could maintain 25 stacks permanently solo on a boss with Defiant, that’d be pretty much the end of the story, they’d be 100% absolutely worth taking.
Nice of you to ignore “Faster at skipping”. Which is probably the most important point i made. Along with more stealth.
Id be interested to see your recommended group composition for TA Forward.
Condition damage is independant of power and precision. Power builds synergise which is why knights would do more. Doesnt change that dire is too strong and the risk for rabid is non existant. Theres imbalances all over many of the gearsets. Any defensive gear makes the game completely faceroll. What i dislike is the reversed risk vs reward when dealing with condi damage. But it wouldnt bother me if there was actually a proper glass condi set which actually out damaged the others while having no passive defence.
TL;DR
I dont mind defensive gear being op for damage as long as i can go full glass in condi or power and out damage them. But thats not possible with condi atm.
Yeah I know that. I still think rabid and carrion do way too much for the amount of defence they have. People would agree with this statement when talking about Dire, so why not rabid/carrion?
Because Rabid/Carrion are two offensive stats, one defensive? I would hope they have decent damage output, and it’s still lower than most power builds.
Also, since when were bomb engineers ranged? Since when were Sword/Sword warriors ranged?
Im not saying nerf condi damage. Im just saying the whole condi damage build system is borked. You barely lose any pressure for going more defensive (dire) and going full glass (rampager) does less damage. Also undead runes further encourage this warped risk vs reward. Can you not see the problem with that?
I said almost all. Not all. Maybe i over exaggerated a bit.
Pretty sure condi engis use nades? And yeah warrior is one of the exceptions, but it also uses a longbow which is ranged.
Yeah I know that. I still think rabid and carrion do way too much for the amount of defence they have. People would agree with this statement when talking about Dire, so why not rabid/carrion?
Not to mention almost all condi builds are ranged. Which reduces the risk even further. Its the main reason i hate it so much. Its not challenging at all to play yet it achieves such strong results in so many situations.
Thief also does higher dps with fgs and stacks vuln. More stealth. Faster stealth. Perma blinds. Spammable blasts. Faster at skipping. Is that not enough to convince you?
Can be put into perspective quite easily with the necro. Necro lupi solo takes around 8 minutes with berserker. When using rabid it can easily go under 7 minutes. Which doesnt make sense because rabid is a hell of a lot less risky then berserker. Condi gear stats have way too much pressure for the lack of risk they have.
Umm, what? The first Rabid necro Lupicus solo took about 22 minutes. Even with more refined tactics (the tactics used were pretty refined just to accomplish it in the first place), that wouldn’t get cut by over half.
Current all time record for condi necro solo (before patch). Its possible to beat this, and I will be doing so once i have enough cm tokens for runes. http://youtu.be/fryNu0KS8iQ
Time is 7 minutes and 28 seconds.
Current all time record for berserker necro solo (before patch). Will also be redoing this and it will be tough to get a similar time with nerfed crit damage. http://youtu.be/Nk2NNMxp3t4
Time is 8 minutes and 34 seconds.
You cant rate first solos. The first mesmer and guard solos were like 30 minutes simply because of poor weapons/builds and ranging. The same goes for the first necro solo (he used a staff and 3 defensive utilities).
the only thing about your solo lupi argument is most of the time you run dungeons with a group.
if you had 5 condi necro’s on lupi you would still get around the same time due to 25 stack limit.
if you had 5 zerk necro’s on lupe you would get a much much better time because physical damage is not capped to stacks.
Yeah that wasnt my point though. My point was condi shouldnt be highest damage for no risk. Id be ok with it if the best condi set was pure glass, but it simply isnt.
Can be put into perspective quite easily with the necro. Necro lupi solo takes around 8 minutes with berserker. When using rabid it can easily go under 7 minutes. Which doesnt make sense because rabid is a hell of a lot less risky then berserker. Condi gear stats have way too much pressure for the lack of risk they have.
Umm, what? The first Rabid necro Lupicus solo took about 22 minutes. Even with more refined tactics (the tactics used were pretty refined just to accomplish it in the first place), that wouldn’t get cut by over half.
Current all time record for condi necro solo (before patch). Its possible to beat this, and I will be doing so once i have enough cm tokens for runes. http://youtu.be/fryNu0KS8iQ
Time is 7 minutes and 28 seconds.
Current all time record for berserker necro solo (before patch). Will also be redoing this and it will be tough to get a similar time with nerfed crit damage. http://youtu.be/Nk2NNMxp3t4
Time is 8 minutes and 34 seconds.
You cant rate first solos. The first mesmer and guard solos were like 30 minutes simply because of poor weapons/builds and ranging. The same goes for the first necro solo (he used a staff and 3 defensive utilities).
Can be put into perspective quite easily with the necro. Necro lupi solo takes around 8 minutes with berserker. When using rabid it can easily go under 7 minutes. Which doesnt make sense because rabid is a hell of a lot less risky then berserker. Condi gear stats have way too much pressure for the lack of risk they have.
Yeah it is but honestly props to anyone that can keep their mental health while trying to sell dungeon paths on a regular basis. I gave up on it because i didnt like waiting around and having so many idiots who cant read just put me right off selling any path.
:>
I dont think you qualify for retaining your mental health Sam.
The most common tactics were condi necro or axe berserker necro with lich form. This allowed you to dps while kiting and in the case of lich form you never got pulled by the orbs. Also well of darkness is helpful to prevent those adds from killing you.
The fight is more about being situationally aware than anything else.
Yeah it is but honestly props to anyone that can keep their mental health while trying to sell dungeon paths on a regular basis. I gave up on it because i didnt like waiting around and having so many idiots who cant read just put me right off selling any path.
Why do people do cof p2 instead of p3? P3 is faster. Also paths like CoE are kind of only worth it if you’ve done all the shorter paths + arah already and still have time.
Anyway im just a casual as i only do arah, ac, ta and se on a regular basis.
Runes like undead dont help this. Getting more damage from stacking toughness. What kind of logic is this? Turning reduced risk into increased reward.
Power does better better in increasing defensive stats for offense or vice versa.
Turning reduced risk into increased reward:
- deadly strength: 10% toughness to power (necromancer)
- retrebutive armor: 7% toughness to precision (Guardian)
- performance enhancement: 10% healing power to power (Engineer)
- energized armor: 7% toughness to power (Engineer)
- strength of spirit: 7% vitality to power(Ranger)
- armored attack: 10% toughness to power (Warrior)
- rune of the worm: 7% vitality to ferocity (rune)
- rune of exuberance: 7% vitality to power(rune)
- rune of exuberance: 5% vitality to precision(rune)
Then you have the once that turn high reward into low risk for power:
- practiced tolerance: 7% precision to vitality (thief)
- soothing winds: 7% precision to healing power (elementalist)
- death into life: 7% power to healing power (necromancer)
- great fortitude: 7% power to vitality (warrior)
Compared to:
Turning reduced risk into increased reward:
- rune of the undead: 7% toughness to condition damage (rune)
- strength of stone: 10% toughness to condition damage (elementalist)
- chaotic transference: 10% toughness to condition damage (mesmer)
- rune of exuberance: 5% vitality to precision(rune)
Then you have the once that turn high reward into low risk for condition:
- practiced tolerance: 7% precision to vitality (thief)
- soothing winds: 7% precision to healing power (elementalist)
Edit: added rune of the worm/exuberance
Exactly. I dont like any rune which does this especially runesets which are already good dps. Condi damage requires little investment so its a bit much in this case. Whereas traits like that arent much of a problem because they are so far in defensive lines the potential damage is already lost and wont be completely made up for by those traits. The runes are silly though. Even exuberenace and worm. Condi runes its a bit more so.
The hood, the dye job, the clashing with the sword. The armour combo isnt toooooo bad, but theres no effort to make it fit together with the dyes and weapons. So its a pretty serious fashion crime.
I have however seen far worse crimes, especially during Tequatl events.
Maybe its because when you reflect with feedback it just uses the mesmers personal modifiers and stats. But when its reflected with wardens it uses the clones, which includes empowering illusions and phantasmal str, and then makes the bomb yours so it also uses your personal mods aswell. So you get it increased twice. Thats the only reason i can think of.
Im guessing empowering illusions and/or phantasmal strength have a big impact. Mesmer doesnt have many personal modifiers. But even so the difference seems a bit too large.
If he didnt die before he could leap, I’d help you test this.
Gl killing him before he could leap if his first attack is such.
Fear Me! to the ice-wall slightly behind him and to his left. You can CC him with that before he leaps, or even aggros, and still get him to that wall before the fear runs out. 4x Fiery Rush, dead. 100% success rate in preventing him leaping at all, assuming the war doesn’t screw up the Fear.
This is exactly why people complain about “zergburgers” bypassing boss mechanics. You really do set a great example for the rest of us! The best advice is to teach someone how to deal with the situation when things go wrong or you dont have a perfect group. That means dodge.
Anyway to answer the op. It probably is to do with terrain clipping. I witness it almost every day on abom in arah p2. Probably because he clips the rock when doing the leap. I always assumed it was lag or just an animation bug though. x)
Dark fields are fine. We just need other combos (mainly finishers) and this will allow us to actually use our dark fields properly. Lightning fields already give vuln on whirl and projectile so i dont think its realistic to ask for vuln on dark fields.
Smoke fields already cause blind on projectile and whirl, so I don’t think its realistic to ask for blinds on dark fields. Dark fields are something that is nearly exclusive to the necromancer, and making dark fields useful will greatly improve the combo field play for necromancers. If you really don’t like vulnerability, you can always goo with something else on leap and blast.
Hmm forgot about that. Vuln on leap and blast would be nice I admit. But blind is also quite nice. Only problem is it can be done very easily without combos. So i guess vuln would make dark fields more favourable.
Yeah no idea why people advocate traveler runes, givers weapons etc. Engi is still a decent vuln bot with scholar + full berserker. But its not a speedrun class.
Dark fields are fine. We just need other combos (mainly finishers) and this will allow us to actually use our dark fields properly. Lightning fields already give vuln on whirl and projectile so i dont think its realistic to ask for vuln on dark fields.
Id really like to see enfeeble become a blast so we can actually have some nice synergy in pve team comps (DS flash blasts with staff ele lava font). Also just giving us blasts on axe 3, offhand dagger and warhorn would help with prebuffing in all gametypes. Also feel like spectral grasp and reapers touch should both be 100% projectile finishers by default.
Force and accuracy is fine. Force + strength sigil is also good. Battle can work but doing a proper rotation means you stay on focus for longer than warhorn. This means strength would be better than battle.
Force/Night/Slaying sigils are your best sigils but if you dont want to carry 3 different daggers you can try something else. If you prefer just having one setup then just going force + accuracy/strength is probably the best choice.
Thats what my necros for. That and the dark fields. x)
Never even thought about LH on them because they are so easy. Thought it was gonna be some revolutionary tactic involving static field or something. :<
Did you actually read any of the reasons why we said your comp was bad. It was nothing to do with dps. Although your group does lack a few pure damage dealers.
Thats why I enjoyed doing TA Fw records. There was only 1 fight we used fgs on. Anyway even without fgs we would still stack eles. Engi only does vuln at the cost of dps. That vuln can be incorporated into a more high dps composition without an engi. Ranger definately has a place but only in paths where there isnt much fgs action and there isnt a lot of other utility needed.
I would of considered ranger for our ta runs if it werent for spotter being wasted on the tree and icebow and other ele aoe being so key to killing the tree and wurm fast. It would definately be possible to get a similar time with a ranger. But we felt the extra icebows would help more than frost spirit.
Oh and another reason why guangs comp doesnt make sense. Hes essentially got 3 supportive group buffing classes, which dont have as much individual dps (warrior, engi and ranger). One utility class which doesnt even get to use its utility in that path(mesmer) and only one pure dps role (ele). Thats almost like running 1 dps, 1 tank and 3 healers.
Important distinction – it blocks ranged projectiles, not ranged AoEs/ground targetted abilities. I.e. arrows, Kill Shots, etc.
I understand and agree that it only blocks ranged projectiles like arrows etc. but it doesn’t even consider blocked projectiles as a block since it doesn’t trigger traits.
Its just poor wording. Projectile blocking has always just been absorption. Anything that actually blocks, blocks all types of attacks. Zealots defence doesnt block, it absorbs.
Actually my build is designed to be flexible. So you can take extra chill/weakness/blind/condi cleanse or a stunbreak if you need it.
Traits often have the biggest impact on damage. Simply because of the damage modifiers and also because all gear has atleast 1 offensive stat type. Theres nothing wrong with your build. You lack damage modifiers but minions will make up some of the loss.
Personally if I wanted a more supporty build with higher defence/sustain I would use something like this.
I guess hendo’s scared, I put up the build and now he’s saying he won’t run it.
So there’s that. Anyone else wants to take a shot at it, feel free.
Why dont you come up with a composition that actually makes sense first. How about TA Forward? That should be easier to work out. Or TA Up. Take your pick.
Heres a few reasons why your path 2 comp doesnt make sense. Theres no place to use a portal so mesmer is a complete deadweight. Guardian would make more sense. Engi doesnt have enough stealth for the skips, people would be put in combat half way through a lot of the time, resulting in getting slowed down. You have a single ele with staff (staff ele is always the second ele, scepter LH takes priority if you can only have 1). Your might stacking is going to be slow simply because most of your blasts will be from the engi. The mesmer has no real mobility and with only one ele you dont have many fgs’s to give out for mobility. Ranger could work, but an extra ele could do just about the same. Ranger has the potential to screw up a run a lot more due to rng.
They actually dont even cap vuln on bosses. Its like 15 sustained vuln. The rest has to be done by the rest of the group. Although this is assuming dps runes and sigils. Because it makes even less sense to sacrifice even more of the engis dmg just for a few extra wasted vuln which your teammates can help with.
