Showing Posts For tkalamba.2541:

4th Jan: BG/SoR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Awesome 45 min fight tonight at SOR garrison, valorous resistance to the secret alliance between TC and BG :p

Looking at EB I almost feel like this alliance actually exists lol

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

4th Jan: BG/SoR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

SoR and TC might have a better chance in facing SBI than BG in the current situation… But if you guys just let BG go that wouldn’t be cool…

I honestly would hate to let you guys go without a fight.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

4th Jan: BG/SoR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Yes, but you can still achieve that by hitting 1st place, their points are just as good as 2nds.

We’re aware of that, but we’re not going to keep smashing our faces into a wall before we realise we need to take a different approach and change tactics. We’ve worked our way up to T2 and seen what happens when our opponents decide to cut out 2nd place and solidly hit 1st place (us) and just fall back on points even more because of pure stubborness. We try to not only learn from our mistakes but those of others where we can.

We don’t like to back away from fights, nor do we like ignoring one side in favour of the other, but when the same plan isn’t working for 2 weeks, we need to modify our objectives in order to be contenders (at least for second place). If we focus on one side, we’re not about to turn a blind eye to the other.

Good to hear, keeps things interesting.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

4th Jan: BG/SoR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

No I think there’s some valid points being made …. And some nuances …. TC has to be second before it can shoot for first.

You may well take second this week, we (SoR) seem to have low participation this weekend for whatever reason. But as long as BG is in this tier you cannot and will not take 1st, their population and coverage has become far to large for the other T2 servers to overcome.

The only thing you would be doing is working FOR BG by focusing on SoR, I’m not suggesting focusing BG or SoR for that matter, only that you are helping to secure first and a big point spread for BG, allowing them to move to T1, which due to their current surge and recruitment is where they belong. Like I said you playing for the pied piper by doing what they want you to do, even if you do not think you are doing it.

What would be really nice is a balanced T2, instead of servers who wish to jump into T1, by stacking. I’m not saying that is a bad thing, or that people who wish for T1 should not do that, it would just be a lot more enjoyable for the 3 servers in T2 to be on equal footing for better fights.

So you’re saying we can never beat BG because of their coverage …. Seems to me that’s a strong argument for TC to try for second… If only to gain rating.

And yes, would be nice if things were balanced …. Makes for enjoyable gameplay all round … But given the often unpredictable nature of gamers, it’d be hard to regulate that. Even with a fee to transfer, there would still be server jumpers…. Although I suspect that would become more marginalized.

You could gain rating, and cause BG to lose rating technically if their lead wasnt so big at the end of the week.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

4th Jan: BG/SoR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

No I think there’s some valid points being made …. And some nuances …. TC has to be second before it can shoot for first.

Yes, but you can still achieve that by hitting 1st place, their points are just as good as 2nds.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

(edited by tkalamba.2541)

4th Jan: BG/SoR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

I really hope TC/SoR focus more on each other and fight for second this time around rather than putting so much focus on BG. You guys won’t win that way. :<

Technically wont win focusing on each other anyways. The idea of focusing on the leader is to deprive them of getting the potential points they need. If we ignored you and went after each other, it more or less means you can do what you want. It makes no sense to focus on each other.

Doesn’t make sense for SoR because you are already in 2nd and want to keep it that way. BUT it does make sense for TC if they actually want to progress and move into 2nd place. Afterall, you have to be 2nd before you can become 1st. TC ignoring SoR only helps SoR hold 2nd place while it guarantees that TC will stay in third.

What ends up happening is 2nd and 3rd fight amongst themselves, allowing 1st to steamroll in potential points. Fighting for 2nd doesn’t work in anyones favour except for 1st place. If both 2nd and 3rd set their sights for 1st, they serve a dual purpose, they not only work on getting themselves potential points, but they deprive 1st from theirs preventing a massive point lead. The 2nd and 3rd place would be smarter to focus on 1st to actually have a chance in a match. It also keeps things much more interesting and competitive.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

4th Jan: BG/SoR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

I really hope TC/SoR focus more on each other and fight for second this time around rather than putting so much focus on BG. You guys won’t win that way. :<

Technically wont win focusing on each other anyways. The idea of focusing on the leader is to deprive them of getting the potential points they need. If we ignored you and went after each other, it more or less means you can do what you want. It makes no sense to focus on each other.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

Wasn't WvW supposed to reset?

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Just reset now, we got in

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

4th Jan: BG/SoR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Lets see how interesting this week gets

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

12/28/2012 BG/SOR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Is it just me or half the time people post these smoking gun hacking shots I can’t even tell whats going on lol. I just stare at them trying to figure out who’s cheating.

The screenshots never actually tell the story. They just show a guy somewhere where he apparently shouldn’t be. I never trust a quick screenshot, video would be infinitely better, so no you are not alone.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

12/28/2012 BG/SOR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Spoiler:
They don’t exist.

More like:

Spoiler:
It’s against the forum’s rules.

What? Since when? I sure don’t see it in the Code of Conduct… :/

It’s one of the main reasons why these threads get closed so often

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

[Choo] SoR Guild - WvW Focused

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

The above issue has been taken care of, the form should not present any issues.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

12/28/2012 BG/SOR/TC

in WvW

Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Guys drop it. I’ve spoken to Maelwaedd.
They went about it a fine way on the forums.

May I suggest we have all the posts about this particular case self-deleted before a mod decides to close this thread for us?

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

[Choo] SoR Guild - WvW Focused

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Guys something is wrong with your site. When I go under recruitment it says “You can’t submit the form”. I even tried multiple browsers and registering with a different email address. Still get that error. Can you please advise how I can join as I’d love to be a part of your team.

I’ll take a look into it and pass the info along.

Thanks for the heads up

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

Sanctum of Rall needs you!

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Most of our guilds are recruiting all zones, so yes NA is still good to go.

We’re pushing mostly for Oceanic solely because we lack some presence there, but I’m sure no one will turn you down.

You can check out paintrainchoo.com to apply to Choo, a primarily WvW guild, that is considering doing a dungeon run event everyonce in awhile to get gear. (We have members who already do it, but we plan on possibly making it some sort of weekly guild thing)

Or you can check out the many other guilds that represent on SoR. Here are some of the ones who posted in the guilds forum that I’ve seen, and there are many more that roam WvW that are usually looking.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/BAR-Recruiting-on-Sanctum-of-Rall

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Heroes-for-Hire-SoR-PvE-WvW-needs-you

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Sanctum-of-Rall-Coerce-1

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Iconic-Guild-icon-Sanctum-of-Rall

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Potluck-Massacre-PLUM-is-recruiting

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Dead-By-Dawn-recruiting-PvE-sPvP-WvW-on-SoR/first#post1162320

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Caedas-CDS-Hardcore-WvW-PvE-International/page/2#post1103704

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/US-Sanctum-of-Rall-PvP-18-SPQR-THE-REPUBLIC/page/2#post1180936

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Sanctum-of-Rall-guild-Lords-Of-Krampus-LOK/first#post1189478

Edit: Added PLUM’s post to the list
Edited again : Added Dead by Dawn
Another Edit: Caedas added
And another: Added SPQR’s thread
And antoher new edit: Lords of Krampus added, a newer SoR guild.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

(edited by tkalamba.2541)

Sanctum of Rall needs you!

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Sanctum of Rall could use any guilds looking to transfer, especially during the Oceanic primetime.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

12/28/2012 BG/SOR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Anyone with a score update?

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

[Choo] SoR Guild - WvW Focused

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Bumpity bump bump bumpity bump bump!

Teamspeak comms last night:

Commander: “Watch out BG is trying to run through us, hold the line.”

Person 1: “NOBODY PASSES THROUGH THE PAIN TRAIN.”

Person 2: “Thats what they get for running around on the railroad tracks.”

Thats right.. Nobody gets past us. All we leave behind in battle is the bodies of our enemies each and every night. Join the Pain Train today and join us on our daily WvW massacres!

Haha I remember hearing this. Join us today to get in on the shenanigans.

Especially if you’re from an Oceanic or Asian timezone. Alpalca Owl could use some more able players.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

(edited by tkalamba.2541)

12/28/2012 BG/SOR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

I’ve seen plenty of upleveled players on SoR and BG, silly people…..

I was one of them :p

I just leveled my alt Necro exclusively in WvW over the past couple of weeks, currenty sitting at level 77

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

12/28/2012 BG/SOR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Just have to say to Choo, man y’all were on your game last night. You were finding our weakness pretty quickly and ruining my footage darn you! ;D Anyways, you guys were good sportmen so major props to all of your team and to your Commander.

As for the three Choo camping my body at DB (I was the mesmer on the hill), I was actually laughing the whole time. Not at the way you guys were staying to watch over me like a hawk (which was a smart thing! We had 2 more rogue inside!) but it gave me a break to go eat some ice cream and watch some Boy Meets World. Was really funny but smart move on your part. Tried to invite you to a group but y’all were already full. ;D

Ah HA. I was the Human Elementalist that was sitting up there for like 30-45 minutes if I remember correctly. I figured you still have rogues lurking around in the water so we decided to stay guard and make sure you didn’t get that much needed rez! Last night was truly a blast though. Thanks for the great fights in BG BL last night!

This must have been shortly after I got off to go to sleep (ugh I hate work)

Last night was insanely fun, regardless If I could see what was going on. Just kept spamming my marks and Epidemic with my Necro the entire time I was in the chaos.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

looking for east coast usa guild

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

I’d give you one of those standard guild responses… but I think if you jump onto Sanctum of Rall, and jump into the Blackgate Borderland, you will witness the work of (Choo) better than if I were to put it into words.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

Highly active servers?

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

I’m in Borlis Pass and I encounter players pretty frequently.

Sanctum of Rall is fairly active in PvE from what I can tell, but we’re really competitive and active in WvW.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

end game?

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

this doesnt seem very good then, looks like i wasted £50

Why not try playing it? It has no Sub, you will likely get alot of enjoyment in the journey to Level 80. Also, WvW is some of the most fun PVP i’ve ever played.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

Thief/Warrior LFG on Very High Pop Server

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Come join us at Sanctum of Rall. It’s a Tier 2 NA server.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Choo-SoR-Guild-recruiting-for-WvW/first#post1128563

Check the above link out. We’re very organized, and have a high pop in WvW and PVE during NA primetime. I’d recommend coming here.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

Do you WvW? If not, what's stopping you?

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Yes I WvW, often actually. I even leveled my second character exclusively in WvW.

We’ve been up against Blackgate for 7 weeks now, with an eight week still coming. Still doesn’t stop me. I have fun, even with the supposed OP thieves (I play Necro and Engi)

I look forward to upcoming changes to WvW as any other player, but I’m still having loads of fun.

I also can’t say I encounter the same issues as many other players seem to (FPS drops, lag etc.) They do happen occasionally, but that can be attributed very easily to my Internet, and happens rarely.

Maybe its because I just play for fun, and winning doesn’t matter all too much. We haven’t won for 7 weeks, and we keep going. I don’t care about the rewards (really, if you actually contribute, repairing shouldn’t make you go broke) and I can still roam, and do well. (Killing Yaks awards points, and deprives the enemy of supply don’t forget) I just find it really fun.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

12/28/2012 BG/SOR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

But should BG outnumber their opponent…oh boy, you better build some additional Pylons because those Overlords are at max capacity.

Haha, I love this reference. To stay on topic, yes, every server zergs. It is a strategy in itself, you send in the cannon fodder to soak up damage and tire the enemy out, then you strike in force. It’s basically the sole purpose of the zergling.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

Creating a non-official WvW only forum

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

It’s pretty active right now in T1 NA with JQ getting a huge influx of eu/daytime players. It also motivates casual JQ players to join up.

Plenty in T2 NA aswell. SoR, even when losing we still comes out full force during NA prime time.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

12/28/2012 BG/SOR/TC

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Score update:

BG: 190,333 (665)
SoR: 117,091 (
20)
TC: 106,820 (+15)

These aren’t numbers befitting of “tier 2”…these are numbers when many players start to not show up, at least during this oceanic window/NA early morning timing.

It seems like a tier shake-up is in the making…a couple weeks back matches were fairly balanced across most tiers other than the bottom few, this week it seems nearly every single bracket is turning into a blowout, but the servers aren’t moving due to how the ratings work.

Edit: Correction. The blowout brackets this week are tiers 2, 5, 6, 7, 8. In particular, Blackgate, Dragonbrand, Devona’s Rest and Kaineng seem to be servers that need to move up, and all of them are in fact doing so other than Blackgate which might need another week or two. I’m no expert on the glicko system but tier 2 atm is fairly stale, with Blackgate clearly much stronger than the other 2 servers. Not too sure on how the T1 servers are doing, but perhaps we are having the old problem of having 4 “tier-1 ready” servers but only 3 slots in tier 1? Maybe we’ll go back to the old days where tier 2 is the place for whoever fell out of tier 1 to have a week of faceroll, and then the top 4 servers sort of take turns dropping down for freewin vacation weeks while the other 2 tier 2 servers just take the beating from different servers week after week. That would be amusing, but in a sad way for us

Holidays ended for some of us already, I’m already back at work so I can’t help fill the gaps left by our lack of Oceanic coverage in the morning. Could help explain some of the numbers difference, as I don’t recall Blackgate having this much of a lead at this point of the week in previous match ups.

You are right, it may be another week or two before BG moves up, unless something changes next week. I’d be interested to see how things go before the February update to WvW.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

Precursors and WvW

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

I can confirm as well, I’ve seen guildies score some precursors.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

Sanctum of Rall needs you!

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

We have a pretty strong NA presence, just need to build up our coverage gaps.

This server provides some of the most fun you could have in WvW.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

New Year, New Server

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

You should check out Sanctum of Rall

We’re insanely competitive, and are looking to grow our WvW player base quite a bit.

We have several guilds, of different sizes, that work together, and use a server wide TS channel. There’s quite a bit of organization, and I feel you would likely enjoy it here. We haven’t been able to beat Blackgate for 7 weeks now, but we still haven’t stopped enjoying WvW enmasse.

We also probably have the largest matchup thread going right now with our discussions between us, BG and TC.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

2 Experienced PvP/WvW Players LF Guild

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

You had me all the way up to the ques. It is the reason I have been hanging out in the lower tiers just to avoid those. One off the main things we are looking for together when we transfer is a server which is low to non existent ques on and off weekends. Yes weekends they are bound to happen but keeping those at or under ten minutes is what we prefer.

They aren’t as bad as he made them sound. I’ve jumped in on Fridays and Saturdays and gotten in within 10 minutes. Usually, our home borderland has a longer queue, but most don’t. This is also strictly at reset, most other times queues are practically non-existant.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

52 Thief LFG

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

LF Good Guild - PvE/SPvP/WvW Willing to X-fer

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Hey there! Since you are looking for above average in all three categories, I highly recommend joining Sanctum of Rall.

#1. We are the unofficial PvE server of GW2 arguably.

#2. We are a T2 server with the strongest NA presence. Along with an amazing community.

#3. Sanctum of Rall is not just a server name. SOR has a history and we are building it to be the best server and community out there.

If you are also looking to join a guild I would recommend you check out this thread:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Choo-SoR-Guild-recruiting-for-WvW/first#post1116984

For more information regarding WvW/The Server:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Sanctum-of-Rall-needs-you/first#post1115912

To add to this, check out this post

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Choo-SoR-Guild-recruiting-for-WvW/first#post1116984

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

[LF] WvW Guild

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

looking for a guild....

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Willing to transfer servers? We’re looking for more players on Sanctum of Rall (NA)

Check this post
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Choo-SoR-Guild-recruiting-for-WvW/first#post1116984

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

Isle of Janthir- looking for a PvE/WvW guild.

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Hey Latromi,

check this post out.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Choo-SoR-Guild-recruiting-for-WvW/first#post1116984

We are very active, very communicative and host a number of events. We have a high ratio of participating players so you should feel at home and actually get a good chance to play with a solid group of players.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

(edited by tkalamba.2541)

[EU] Experienced Thief looking for a new home

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

We’re actively looking for international players, and i think we fit your needs. Also, to answer your above question, we have several players from Australia, UK, Singapore and Taiwan and they have no issues with lag.

Check out this post

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Choo-SoR-Guild-recruiting-for-WvW/first#post1114310

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

Lookin' for a perfect guild for me

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Hey,

Check out this post.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Choo-SoR-Guild-recruiting-for-WvW/first#post1114310

We’re an NA guild, all english speaking looking for more international players

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

SoS lonewolf looking for a guild!

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

Sanctum of Rall

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Hey,

Check out this post

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Choo-SoR-Guild-recruiting-for-WvW/first#post1114310

We’re actively searching for players to fill out our roster.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

Looking For Guild...

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

We’re recruiting for Choo at Sanctum of Rall. We’re primarily a WvW guild, but do host some dungeon and PVE events for the guild.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Choo-SoR-Guild-recruiting-for-WvW/first#post1114310

Feel free to ask me any questions,we’re looking for active players.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

LFGuild - Henge of Denravi - Australian plays

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Interested in changing servers?

We’re actively recruiting for Sanctum of Rall

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Choo-SoR-Guild-recruiting-for-WvW/first#post1114310

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

80 Necro LF Serious PvE/WvW Guild

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Hey,

check us out at the following post.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/guilds/guilds/Choo-SoR-Guild-recruiting-for-WvW/first#post1114310

We’re actively looking for any players for SoR.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

[Choo] SoR Guild - WvW Focused

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

We’re still looking, go to the above link to apply.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

12/28/2012 BG/SOR/TC

in WvW

Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

score update plz

BG: 75,662 +245
TC: 43,507 +210
SoR: 41,835 +240

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

[Choo] SoR Guild - WvW Focused

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Bumping again. Come join us in SoR

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

Sanctum of Rall needs you!

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

As a representative of Choo, I fully support this initiative.

We need guys to help keep what we take during our NA primetime.

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

[Choo] SoR Guild - WvW Focused

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Another Daily Bump. Sign up today!

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]

[Choo] SoR Guild - WvW Focused

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Posted by: tkalamba.2541

tkalamba.2541

Another daily bump. Come help us make our push to T1

Lord Lefteris – Engineer [Sanctum of Rall]