Definitely have engie envy going on. For some reason they are really pushing to make people play engies by giving them buffs across the board.
They haven’t received buffs across the board, this “buff” is just giving them the same swiftness they’ve always had, on a class that outside of that swiftness generally has limited mobility, it has also nerfed invigorating speed by increasing the cooldown on getting swiftness to 20 secs. And if you’ve played this game long enough and don’t have a selective memory, then you will remember engy swiftness got indirectly nerfed long ago, when they buffed all the movement speed traits (like the warrior melee one)/signets that were 10% movement speed to 25%.
As for peopel playing engies, it is only really PvP they are overly represented in, and that it is only since celestial (and horrible turret builds for a while), in PvE they are not well represented, they are I guess ‘okay’ in PvE would describe them, and in WvW they are fine for roaming, but absolutely the least desired class for raids/zergs, to the point many guilds do not even recruit them.
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The justification is you live by the glass, you die by the glass.
Full zerk comes with drawbacks equal to the benefits. That called balance.
Except that it isn’t called ‘balance’, in the bit of the game that they actually balance on tPvP it is balanced for several reasons you have a lot of places to LOS, due to the nature of tPvP you are not going to get insta focused by 5 rangers, etc, in WvW it is anything but balanced, but then very little is.
Abjured won the last ESL monthly without a thief… against a team that used a thief. But here you are saying that thief is a must have in every team comp… hmm…
For three years, there has been a thief on nearly every team, with the odd rare exception like TP, until eventually even they switched to thief, Pax final, WTS finals, etc, thief on each team, EU qualifiers TCG – thief, Orange Logo- thief, MC – thief, etc, that the odd team runs no thief occasionally, changes nothing, the class is and has been vastly overrepresentated for the entire game, for a very simple reason it is too strong at what it does.
P.S – I am pretty sure Abjured could win NA with all sorts of comps, given the general lack of competition.
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I don’t agree with this since if Thief is really that imbalance, then why aren’t the teams consists of 5 Thieves then?
There are 8 classes 5 slots, when 1 class nearly permanently gets a slot that is imbalanced.
Why do you think a Thief is the best counter to another Thief? It is because one of the reason is because Thief can interrupt the enemy Thief.
LOL, so the answer to counter broken is counter with the same broken class, nor is just the low cast time skills, it is the “punishment” other classes skills go on a cooldown, in fact I seem to remember, though it has been a long time since I checked that you didn’t even lose the initiative cost, depending on the skill and where in the animation you were interrupted or have they fixed it now. (talking weapon skills obviously, though BS like withdraw is also silly)
Are you talking about the Warrior or the Guardian? Perhaps Engineer?
Erm no, neither warrior nor engy have been permanent must have picks for 3 years, warrior was not on many teams for a long time, engy was ok for a long time, but it is only since cele it has been on nearly every team like a thief has for three years. Bunker guard was on nearly every team for a very long time, and now you have lots of medi guards, but really it isn’t the same thing.
Now things like cele engy, shoutbow, medi guard, etc may be OP, however these are balanceable, thief is not.
Thief has had plenty of nerfs and it has not solved the real issues, even after all these nerfs there is still a thief on nearly every team, it is still far too good as a roamer and plus 1, to the point no other class can compete, most can’t even compete simply as a glass cannon, even without taking the roaming/+1 ability of thief into account, the basic design of thief is broken OP, and the only way to balance it is to rework some core aspects, it is as simple as that.
Though feel free to explain why it is balanced that one class should almost have a guaranteed spot regardless of meta, regardless of balance changes, when there are 5 slots to share between 8 classes.
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It’s not funny at all. That’s the main reason they keep nerfing the Thief, they don’t play the profession thus they think it is OP.
They keep nerfing thief, because they have a habit of not addressing the real issues in the game, so instead paper over the cracks with easy “fixes” that normally don’t work, the easy “fix” for thief is to nerf it, and as usual that did not work, so they kept nerfing it, and it still has not worked.
Thief is still imbalanced, which is why it has had a slot in nearly every team for the entirety of the game, and still does, despite the nerfs, thief can not be balanced by nerfs, its core design is too strong, giving a class best mobility, best engage, best disengage, high burst that is less telegraphed than anything except silly fresh air burst, a lot of low cast time skills, spammable skills, huge access to maybe the most powerful mechanic in the game (stealth), etc is just a broken design that they will never be able to balance by nerfs, it will either be OP so a must have on a team or nerfed into the ground to the point of uselessness.
Some of the core design of thief is mindblowingly bad, for instance skilled play like interrupts should be rewarded, yet we have a class that interrupts are borderline useless against, it is pathetic.
So when people say thief should not be nerfed anymore, I agree, it should have certain mechanics / core aspects reworked, when there are 8 classes (soon to be 9) and 5 slots in a team, and one class has pretty much had a guaranteed slot for 3 years regardless of the meta, objectively that is very imbalanced.
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For a little perspective, my main is a shatter mesmer, the class that thieves compete w/ for team space and role the most…
There is no competition, you either have a mesmer paired with a thief or you use a thief because it is better, which is why for 3 years thief has had a slot in nearly every team regardless of the meta, 5 slots 8 classes, only one always has a place, objectively the class is imbalanced in tPvP.
The problem with condi builds in PvP isn’t that conditions need more damage, it’s that shoutbow and d/d ele can put out a lot of AOE cleanse.
Except that isn’t the problem, condi builds have pretty much always been underrepresentated, the vast majority of meta builds in this game have been power based, really the only classes that have been reasonably well represented in the meta for long periods as actual condi builds were engi and ranger, and even then condi engi was never a default pick like bunker guard, thief, hambow/shoutbow and so on, until celestial engi which is more power than condi, actual condi builds have been a rarity in this game.
Shelter is not passive play, it’s completely reactive.
You can only interrupt it with skills that go through the block, which many builds lack, it has limited counterplay and is far more forgiving compared to things like consume conditions, ether feast, etc, where it is far more important to cover the heal in some way (in this respect it is also passive), that you can use the block wisely (or not) does not alter that.
We don’t have the passive heals that other classes possess.
I agree to an extent (go see how much passive healing you get on mesmer), but my point about the passive heal is some try to brush it off as okay to have another lame passive skill because it is “weak”, when it is only 30hp less than what is considered a good master trait on engy (and also has an emergency heal on top of that).
Furthermore medi guard more than makes up in instant heals which are just as obnoxious & also lacking in counterplay.
All of which have high CD’s. Any experienced player knows how to outplay a Guardian by exausting our long cd abilities and out sustain him. It’s so apparent that we’ve even asked for some quality of life changes.
Any experienced player knows they are a team fighting build and how broken, how forgiving medi guard is, which is why you have people that have spent 2+ years on ele, playing medi guard instead and going to Germany in August.
Talking of experienced players a few weeks ago ROM was streaming, he was “marvelling” at how much punishment this medi guard, a supposed glass cannon could take with three of them focusing it, the word he summed it up with was “cheese”, he was spot on.
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That is some nice empty rhetoric you got there, try again when you have an actual response.
That’s all that I need to say. You have to figure things out for yourself; I’m not going to just give it all away.
That is some nice empty rhetoric you got there, try again when you have an actual response.
Your big wall post is literally all QQ and zero attempt to learn counterplay. If this is really all you have as a response, then I guess you’re beyond help.
That is some nice empty rhetoric you got there, try again when you have an actual response.
That is some nice empty rhetoric you got there, try again when you have an actual response.
That’s all that I need to say. You have to figure things out for yourself; I’m not going to just give it all away.
That is some nice empty rhetoric you got there, try again when you have an actual response.
Shelter’s heal is OK at best. If people wanted the heal for straight up healing, our signet does around 8k. Guards take shelter for the block and blowing a block at any time is dumb. If you’re struggling against people blowing shelter for the heal, I’ve got news you won’t particularly enjoy.
That the heal does less than healing signet is irrelevant to the point, it is a dumb skilless heal that you don’t have to position for or cover, because it lacks counterplay, which pretty much describes the healing in this build fullstop, passive healing, a heal that blocks, heals on instant cast meditations, even the active heal on the virtue is yet another instant skill.
If the passive aegis every forty seconds, which can be burnt by an auto attack, is giving you trouble, that news of mine is only going to sound worse.
Nothing to do with “giving me trouble”, it is simply more passive kitten, nor if you engaged your brain is it simply a case of removing the aegis, there is no indication of when the virtue is going to come off cooldown after being activated, when it does come back it applies aegis instantly, on occasion this has saved me on my guard, where assuming the opponent checked for aegis, it popped as they were using their skill, which is just more passive RNG with no counterplay.
100 HPS passive is OP? Well then.
As you conveniently ignored, the master level trait backpack regenerator on engy is a considered a good trait, it heals for 30 HP more, people trying to pass off the virtue’s passive healing (+the emergency heal) as near worthless are either dishonest or clueless, especially in a build that already has a ridiculous amount of healing, it is just more passive skills BS that make builds like medi guard faceroll.
Whacking away with the hammer as in what exactly? The auto? You’re getting hit by auto? Every attack on hammer is terribly telegraphed. Seriously, are you lagging?
Me? When I bothered to play this game, sometimes I would get immobilized, knocked down, etc by other players (this is not a duelling game) or sometimes I am already fighting so am low on cooldown /dodges, sometimes I simply make mistakes, so yes sometimes I do get hit by hammer skills, just as players who are going to WTS get hit by them, obviously you never get cc’d, have perfect positioning 100% of the time, etc and are off to Germany in August to win WTS 500-0, with your exceptional skills.
So back to reality, even the best players get hit by hammer auto sometimes, Glacial Heart is just another braindead passive proc on crit skill that makes builds like medi guard so noob friendly / braindead.
A passive 300 more burn damage every five hits. I suppose your perma poison on auto is OK though, right?
My perma posion? I responded in reference to a CI mesmer.
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Nothing to see here, folks. Just another person who wants easy mode kills with no effort.
When I want easy mode kills with no effort I log out my shatter mes and go on my faceroll medi guard…
That’s funny, because I often swap to my CI interrupt mesmer and eat medi guards for breakfast.
Not really, as your CI mesmer is still vastly more unforgiving than the faceroll that is medi guard.
Where you can for example facetank a full condi bomb and clear it, assuming you get hit in the first place and aren’t saved by passive aegis BS, any damage you take from facetanking that condi burst, can then be healed up by BS passive healing that heals for 30 less than a master trait considered good on engi (and also has a 1.6k emergency heal, + 800 hp in regen + retal + removes three condies, instant of course, because you can never have enough skilless i-win buttons on a guard that do way too much for the input or thought required), plus the BS 2k uninterruptable heals on instant medi skills (apparently counterplay for your opponent or having to think on medi guard are not design considerations).
Then if that isn’t enough you can then use the brainless heal that is only susceptible to the few skills that can ignore a block, apparently positioning or covering your heal are only for classes like necro, mesmer, etc.
After that just instant teleport, start whacking away with the hammer, oh look your opponent is chilled from a passive proc that has no counterplay as it occurs on crit (also unblockable, so even someone having the “good fortune” to block when it procs does not stop this passive BS), goes well with the passive burning procs with no counterplay.
Medi guard has ridiculous sustain, ridiculous survivability, passive procs/healing and a kittenton of instant skills with no real counterplay, it is a fine example of everything that is wrong with this game, where skilless faceroll builds with minimal risk and lots of reward like medi guard, shoutbow, turret engi (they at least nerfed that crap), etc are the standard.
There’s plenty of counterplay. You just obviously haven’t found it, and decided to kitten about your failure here instead of looking into some pretty glaring flaws of the build.
That is some nice empty rhetoric you got there, try again when you have an actual response.
Nothing to see here, folks. Just another person who wants easy mode kills with no effort.
When I want easy mode kills with no effort I log out my shatter mes and go on my faceroll medi guard…
That’s funny, because I often swap to my CI interrupt mesmer and eat medi guards for breakfast.
Not really, as your CI mesmer is still vastly more unforgiving than the faceroll that is medi guard.
Where you can for example facetank a full condi bomb and clear it, assuming you get hit in the first place and aren’t saved by passive aegis BS, any damage you take from facetanking that condi burst, can then be healed up by BS passive healing that heals for 30 less than a master trait considered good on engi (and also has a 1.6k emergency heal, + 800 hp in regen + retal + removes three condies, instant of course, because you can never have enough skilless i-win buttons on a guard that do way too much for the input or thought required), plus the BS 2k uninterruptable heals on instant medi skills (apparently counterplay for your opponent or having to think on medi guard are not design considerations).
Then if that isn’t enough you can then use the brainless heal that is only susceptible to the few skills that can ignore a block, apparently positioning or covering your heal are only for classes like necro, mesmer, etc.
After that just instant teleport, start whacking away with the hammer, oh look your opponent is chilled from a passive proc that has no counterplay as it occurs on crit (also unblockable, so even someone having the “good fortune” to block when it procs does not stop this passive BS), goes well with the passive burning procs with no counterplay.
Medi guard has ridiculous sustain, ridiculous survivability, passive procs/healing and a kittenton of instant skills with no real counterplay, it is a fine example of everything that is wrong with this game, where skilless faceroll builds with minimal risk and lots of reward like medi guard, shoutbow, turret engi (they at least nerfed that crap), etc are the standard.
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Nothing to see here, folks. Just another person who wants easy mode kills with no effort.
When I want easy mode kills with no effort I log out my shatter mes and go on my faceroll medi guard…
You can’t fix thieves by nerfing them, Anet tried that it failed, thieves are broken OP because of their core design and mechanics, thief has already had more nerfs than most classes and the result of that is… in a game with 5 slots and 8 classes thief has had a permanent slot on nearly every team for the entirety of the game, and still does & thief is still a big problem for most other classes when it comes to zerker builds, the nerfs changed neither of these things.
Giving a class the best engage, best disengage, best mobiity, a lot of skills with low cast times (or none), skills that are spammable with no cooldown that do one of the most idiotic things I have seen in a game that is render skilled play (interrupts) as borderline useless, high burst, that other than the lame fresh air ele, is far less telegraphed than most other classes (e.g compare to mesmer shatter, static discharge, etc), huge access to the most powerful mechanic in a game (stealth), etc, is just a monumentally bad design.
Continuing to nerf thieves until they are useless is not the answer, the only way to fix thieves is to redesign some core aspects of the class, but don’t hold your breath actual problems in this game don’t get fixed they get papered over, which is just one of the reasons why PvP has such a huge playerbase, so when there are 9 classes available, still expect there to be a thief taking one of the five slots on every team and learn that is what is known as “balanced” in this game.
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- Teleports not working because of a leaf on the ground
This is a problem for every class and many skills, you get ‘obstructed’ on ranged attacks because of some pebble or leaf, leaps fail because they hit some pebble or plant, pulls like magnet pull fail, etc.
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http://www.sirlin.net/ptw-book/introducingthe-scrub
“In reality, the “scrub” has many more mental obstacles to overcome than anything actually going on during the game. The scrub has lost the game even before it starts. He’s lost the game even before deciding which game to play. His problem? He does not play to win.
The scrub would take great issue with this statement for he usually believes that he is playing to win, but he is bound up by an intricate construct of fictitious rules that prevents him from ever truly competing. These made-up rules vary from game to game, of course, but their character remains constant."
worth a read. might open your mind.
Not really, playing to win DOTA 2 at Dreamhack, fair enough, playing to win regardless of fun in a broken a format that is an uncompetitive joke like WvW, is irrelevant and best left to noobs who have just started the game and don’t know any better yet.
They’re not invulnerable while stealth you know…
I didn’t see anyone state it did, the simple fact is the stealth mechanic in this game lacks counters, compare it to stealth in a lot of MMOs:
- If you have a DOT on you, you can’t stealth (using your normal stealth skill)
- If you take damage whilst in stealth you are knocked out of stealth
- If you attack from stealth and miss / are dodged/ blocked etc, you come out of stealth.
- Your movement in stealth is often at a reduced rate
- Your ability to stealth in combat is severely limited, where you have to normally trait into a certain line of a skill tree and then get an in combat stealth skill on a long cooldown (often 60seconds-3m).
- In some games if you get too close to your opponent in full frontal view you get knocked out of stealth, I know shocking that you have to think about positioning.
- Other games have consumables where for instance they will show up stealthed players on the mini map.
- In most other games, you cannot stealth other players.
- Other games have better anti-stealth skills both in the sense of practical use – AOE skills that knock people out of stealth, but also in many games you are not restricted by the number of skills on the skill bar, where as in GW2 a ranger has to kitten their build to fit sic em on, and the engy skill doesn’t fit any build except maybe static discharge, which no one uses in tPvP.
The stealth mechanic in this game is way too forgiving, brainless, basically easymode, the lack of counters to what is maybe the most powerful mechanic in a game, is laughable, just one more of the reasons why despite having maybe the best most fluid combat system in an MMO, that the PvP has basically failed.
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What is the point of having a tournament in a game mode that as a competition is a complete joke?
Nonsense, multiple classes are supposed to fill the role of roamer, just like over the course of this game multiple classes have fulfilled other roles, the simple truth is thief is poorly designed because it is far too good at that role and it has far too much going for it in regard to glassy builds, the only “spin” I see here is from you.
Yes, the meta is OP. Meta-team composition is OP.
Poor class design is OP.
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Similarly for GW2, the thief is is on nearly every team. It fills the niche/role of being a roamer, back-capper, and someone that makes fights unfair (turning that 1v1 into a 2v1, a 3v3 into a 4v3 (picking off easy targets(people with low health/ones that do more damage)))….
If thief was truely OP, you would see teams composed of more than just 1 thief, since, being OP, it can/should handle more than what I’ve listed above….
…well, for starters, what you were trying to do with saying the thief is OP because it’s in every team, is a team/role-composition issue as opposed to an issue pretaining specifically to a class/character.
Nice try spinning something off of it.
Nonsense, multiple classes are supposed to fill the role of roamer, just like over the course of this game multiple classes have fulfilled other roles, the simple truth is thief is poorly designed because it is far too good at that role and it has far too much going for it in regard to glassy builds, the only “spin” I see here is from you.
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For what is OP simply look at how a class is represented.
To take the only area they seem to balance the game on – tPvP, there are 5 slots in a team between 8 classes, for the entirety of the game thief has been an automatic choice for one of those slots for nearly every decent team, objectively it is OP in tPvP.
But having 2 thieves in team is far worse than 2 warris, 2 engis, 2 eles, 2 guards. So by your philosophy they are OP…
And? When it was not uncommon to see 2 hambows for example, yes they were OP, eventually they got nerfed and that stopped, obviously 5 slots, 8 classes if one build is taking two spots then that is OP, two ‘wrongs’ don’t make a ‘right’.
Difference is, that sort of thing is temporary, due to balance changes / meta changes, thief having a permanent slot is not, does not matter what the meta is or how much they nerf thief, it is still a default pick, which is objectively OP.
The problem with thief is aspects of the core design / mechanics are OP/broken, so is essentially unbalanceable, the class has had plenty of nerfs, more nerfs than most, which in part have just made it weaker in situations it did not need to be weaker in, and failed to change the basic issues of it being too strong at roaming/+1 to be left out and preventing most other classes from going glassy power builds.
But in typical Anet style, they try and paper over the cracks by endless nerfs, that don’t solve the issue at all, rather than address the core problems and redesigning certain things.
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For what is OP simply look at how a class is represented.
To take the only area they seem to balance the game on – tPvP, there are 5 slots in a team between 8 classes, for the entirety of the game thief has been an automatic choice for one of those slots for nearly every decent team, objectively it is OP in tPvP.
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If you cant defeat them , join them
I think you will find most have taken the better option of simply playing something else.
Ever read the comments on virtually any internet forum/comment section?
Honestly, I sometimes wonder how you people get through life in your sensitive little bubble.
And i’ll also quote the standard “Welcome to the Internet”.
I’d suggest it is you that live in a bubble, “the Internet” is not like gaming sites, youtube comments, etc, I guess if you only inhabit areas of the internet where the demographics are heavily skewed toward kids and for want of a better phrase manboys, then you might think that, but I can assure you forums for science, wildlife, astronomy, programming, etc are considerably less immature.
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All they need to do (and they DO need to do) is add like a minior 100 damage to the laying of the caltrops so you can’t spam it in stealth.
Lol and here comes the thieves defending stealth caltrops. Classic.
Or people just think things through, the reason they don’t put damage to add a reveal on caltrops is it would be unusable because thieves at times have to dodge whilst in stealth, e.g – if a thief uses shadow refuge is low on health they will need to dodge to survive until shadow refuge finishes, so if caltrops had a damage component that revealed them the opponent(s) would just trigger the caltrops and reveal the thief.
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Why do you, more than less, go together against the Spanish server, doing 2 vs 1 most of the time?
The irony…
But beyond that too much PvD / nightcapping, too much running from fights, even when your zerg outnumbers the opponents (with the exception of maybe one BB commander), too much ninja capping whilst other servers are fighting, not very interesting roamers (too many thieves) and hackers.
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Its what anet said around the time GW2 was released not my own definition.
It wasn’t a definition fullstop, they’ve also mentioned small scale at various times, they specifically introduced bloodlust/ruins to encourage small scale for example.
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Video overall is decent, but the build is too op, anyone dueling with that build shouldn’t be too proud of winning 1v1s…
Just think! Soon we can run the same build + panic strike + executioner!
And roaming in WvW will become even more dead than it already is…
I rather nobody hardcounters nobody and everyone has a fair chance to win based on skill/build, and not have an advantage based on certain class mechanics.
1. Everyone has a chance to win based on skill/build
2. Game where no one counters anyone is a straight way to completely destroying the game balance
Not really, a good game has soft counters, a bad one has hard counters, this game has several hard counters to the point for the countered build to win there either has to be a huge difference in skill level or someone basically needs to be asleep to lose.
As for balance, LOL, hardcounters are one of the problems with balance in this game, look at how many classes cannot play zerker specs, because zerker thief eats them alive (and then does the whole roaming & +1, thing better than them on top of that).
Why Necromancer don’t hardcounter anyone? XD
Oh…yeah… we’re bad in spvp…
So you’ve never played a condi necro and rolled your face across the keyboard when faced with a condi engi?
Because it is pretty much broken in every aspect, as a points scoring competition and “winning” it is worthless, and equivalent to say a football match (yes the one where you actually use your feet most of the time), where for one team only 3 players come out for the start of the second half, and the other team still has 11.
Class balance is non-existent, for zergs/raids for most of the game it can be pretty much be summed up as four classes making up the vast majority of the numbers, the other four as relegated to bit parts and barely represented, with the extreme being engy as basically not required/wanted at all.
Class balance is also pitiful on a smaller scale, the difference in risk vs reward is ridiculous, hence why there have always been a billion nabs on thieves, or as someone mentioned above you now have longbow rangers also rolling face, as what is reasonably balanced in tPvP where there is a lot of LOS, is faceroll time in the very open areas you often get in WvW.
Which of course is down to the balance philosophy of this game, which is basically balance for tPvP at the expense of everything else, which of course has resulted in tremendous “e-sports” success, with the thing last night drawing huge viewing figures of about 850, so less than some kid streaming Runescape from their bedroom…
The playerbase, literally the worst I have ever encountered, I guess because this is not a PvP MMO nor does it have PvP servers, never played a game with so many PvE nabs (and this incldues many WvW players/guilds) who run from or avoid even fights.
Oh and then there is the hackers.
All of which is why WvW is in such a great state, with a huge healthy playerbase, and a new PvE map will solve everything. /sarcasm
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Again Zinkz, not saying Celestial didn’t push them over just the main problem was the skills/traits involved with the top 3.
There is no problem, your assertion does not match the reality of what has happened over three years, if these professions and their amazing traits/skills were so strong, then they would of been strong regardless, yet for long periods they have been between mediocre and weak, to the point of being virtually non-existent for months in the case of eles pre-cele patch, whilst bunker guard was in every single team for virtually 2 years and now we have medi guards, thief has been in nearly every decent team for the entire game, etc.
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Disagree, Cele accentuates the problem but isn’t the main issue at hand. It’s the professions who can use them efficiently.
Not really, those professions at different times in this game have struggled, for the months before cele / might runes patch for example ele was the least played class in teams, for much of the time before hambow there were long periods when warrior was poorly represented in teams, for most of the game engy has been between a nice option and below average, cele patch is the first time it has been a default pick in the way many other builds like spirit ranger, bunker guard, hambow warrior, thief (d/p, s/d) , etc have been for long periods throughout the game.
That certain classes can use cele more efficiently is no different to other classes & amulets, zerker for instance, for most of the game, thief/mes have been able to use it far more efficiently than other classes (now medi guard also), compare to say engy, where zerker may as well not exist for engies for all the use a static discharge engy is.
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Unfortunately, 3 weeks into WvW, I’ve concluded that, at least on my server, no one really cares about WvW….no one actually cares if our borderlands is completely taken by another server, because it doesn’t effect them in any way.
Most people do not care to any real extent, because for the vast majority of matchups “winning” is pretty meaningless, and not because of insufficient rewards or incentive, but because “winning” in most matchups boils down to differences in off-peak coverage and mindless PvDoor, there may be a scoreboard and a “winner”, but as a competitive event it is just a worthless joke.
Not exactly sure yet why this should be ‘improvement’, I feel it’s again catering the beginners and taking away sense of progress and achievement.
What is this ‘achievement’ you speak of, you really regard playing a video game for X number of hours as an ‘achievement’?
i’m saying that anet has balanced WvW around having stacks.
You think Anet balances for WvW?
Seems you just have the typical myopic view and can’t see the wood for the trees, you talk about balance and an 8-10% DPS loss on ele, when for most of the game you have had four classes vastly overrepresented in WvW (raids/zergs), and four very under-represented to the point one of them, engy has been pretty much unwanted for the entirety of the game, balance, LOL.
Good I won’t have to faff about getting guard stacks.
Conquest forces builds that just aren’t fun to play or play against. Bunkers.
Conquest doesn’t “force” builds any more than other PvP modes, and as for what is ‘fun’, that is subjective. You say you don’t play WvW, but if you did, you would find that it is not uncommon for small roaming groups (which is just basically killing each other, no objectives) to contain bunkers to act as bait, to res, to disrupt, support, etc.
firmly believe that for MMO PvP, arenas is the way to go. Arenas are 2v2 or 3v3 fights on a tiny map. If you die, you are out. This type of PvP is extremely popular in any and every MMO that has it. Blizzard and World of Warcraft have put up many tournaments with many thousands of dollars on the line.
Erm WoW arenas flopped as an “e-sport”, despite having a playerbase larger than anything except LoL, and a huge gaming company behind it, go play WIldstar and see how popular arenas are…
Arena objectives are simple. You kill your opponents. No trebuchets to fire, no nodes to stand on, no NPCs to kill. It’s a brawl, and it’s exciting. It’s fun and easy to watch.
Or it’s dull, simplistic, low skill capped, that isn’t fun to watch, they’ve streamed GW2 2v2/3v3 before, guess what not many people watched them, even for GW2.
I guarantee that MMO fans who have never played this game will love the combat and get hooked!
I also think the best thing abut GW2 is the excellent combat, however there are literally hundreds of thousands of people who have tried GW2 and left who did not like the combat system.
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It isn’t unfair that ward/engi/ele have move speed and sustain. What’s unfair is the kitten ed celestial amulet only catering to them. This jack of all trades business needs to go.
Which is no different to other commonly used amulets, take zerker for example, for most of the game it has basically “catered” to thief/mes, since they buffed medi guards to faceroll levels they also use it, but for other classes, engy for example zerker may as well not exist.
This only applies to bad pvpers though. If a skilled team or a skilled mesmer morphs you, they can easily down you and prevent you from being able to escape with use of gap closers.
That applies to the entire game, no diminishing returns / immunity on CC + no healers means focusing someone down who you can perma immobilize/stun/daze/chill etc in this game, especially certain classes, does not take much skill. Which I guess is one of the reasons they seem so adverse to making modes higher than 5v5 and where players aren’t split into smaller fights to some degree through objectives.
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I have offered my argument for why rapid fire or any other channeled skills shouldn’t follow in stealth. You however, have responded with nothing but ad hominem and equivocation.
You have offered nothing but equivocation and whining due to your inability to play.
I meant that rapid fire requires a target in order to work. When an ability requires a target in order to work, then surely it would make sense that the entire ability should require a target to work right? I never claimed to be an anet developer and was merely providing a paradox of the skill requiring a target only partway through it’s use.
No it does not make sense that an ability would require the target the entire time, not sure why you find it so hard to grasp, game mechanics are not “logical” or consistent in that way, if they were then I would either need to aim my arrows like grenades, or grenades would automatically be targeted like arrows.
It is called balance, a concept you don’t seem to understand, a skill that deals its damage over x amount of time, is both easy to interrupt and easy to avoid part of the damage, it gives even the slowest of players time to dodge roll, block, blink, invurn, reflect, etc out of at least some of the damage, classes that can stealth a lot would virtually never be hit by a full channelled skill if a target was required for the whole channel, it would be hugely imbalanced, channelled skills also offer one of the few counters to stealth in this game, again balance.
And again there is no paradox, different skills work in different ways, I have no cooldown on my thief skills, that is not a paradox that is how it was designed, I have to aim my grenades on engy, again not a paradox just the way the skills are designed and balanced, just as channelled skills only require an initial target and then are locked to that target – design and balance, there is no paradox, game mechanics do not follow some strict “logical” code, which is why your entire argument is simply fallacious.
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What’s the problem with having a thief in every team? People pick thieves because they are insanely mobile, and you need mobility for fast decaps and +1ing fights. The only real issue is how strong thieves are against mesmers: if the match-up was somewhat balanced, you could pick a mesmer over a thief. But as long as this mobile roamer role exists, thief has a place in the meta, and I think it’s fine.
By the way, guardians are in the meta since the beginning of the game, and so are warriors. They just fit some roles better. I just think rangers and necros should change a bit to be viable in a certain type of team composition, but claiming that thieves should be nerfed because they are meta is a misunderstanding of how conquest works.
Erm it is called balance, there are 8 soon to be 9 classes, that one is a default pick is hugely imbalanced, and you obviously missed my point, nerfing thief is not the answer, that is Anet’s answer and all it has done is make thief weak in other ways without actually addressing the core issues, I said some things need to be redesigned, the basic design of thief is unbalanceable.
I really didn’t mean that. If anything you’re being a little rude for refusing to admit that you misinterpreted my argument. I mean seriously. Do you honestly think I would’ve tried to give an argument based on lore? I’m assuming that you have a hard time understanding idioms as well? Now unless you can contribute to this discussion instead of giving ad hominem then please just go away because you’re aren’t adding anything to this discussion by insulting me.
I understand idioms fine thanks, as for contributions to the “debate”, I could say the same about you, you’ve offered absolutely zero of substance, and as for what I honestly think I’ve already stated it.
Again, i meant mechanics logic. As in: this skill was designed with this in mind.
Rapid fire was meant to have a target in order for it to properly work. When a thief stealths, rapid fire still continues to fire. This creates a paradox where the action contradicts the intent.
Oh so you are a developer for Anet now, so you know how channelled skills were intended to work, oh wait you aren’t, and again are just confusing your unsubstantiated opinion, with fact.
There is no paradox or contradiction, game mechanics don’t follow “logic”, we’ve already established that, that channelled skills tracking the target make no sense to you is irrelevant.
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Now next please read between the lines and realize that I did not mean fantasy logic when i said logic.
‘Read between the lines’, LOL reading between the lines all I see is you came out with a nonsense argument trying to justify why rapid fire shouldn’t follow in stealth because it isn’t “logical” and now you are backtracking because you didn’t think it through properly and consider that virtually nothing about the combat is “logical”, so it was a dumb argument to make.
I agree that the logic of a fantasy game has nothing to do with with combat mechanics or balance of the game. I never said that it did.
Not to mention straight up lying through your teeth, I quote “Logically, it makes no sense why am a ability based on aiming should be able to pinpoint track someone while their target is invisible. Because this is illogical, the burden of proof as to why channeled skills should follow in stealth falls to you.”, really pretty pathetic.
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I don’t need to justify anything, I’m not the one trying to justify one skill on “logic” or “lore” you are, logic or lore have absolutely nothing to do with it, as shown by the examples I gave that you conveniently ignored as they show how ludicrous your argument is, we’ve had people who can’t play whine about channeled skills before, guess what, nothing changed, it is a counter to stealth that provides some balance, in a game where stealth has very few, learn to play.
What examples are you talking about? You never countered anything I said.
The examples I provided in my post that demonstrate how “logic” has nothing to do with game mechanics, such as it is not logical that thief, ranger, etc can carry around an infinite supply of arrows in their quiver, it is not logical that when you are slashed by a sword you stop bleeding after a few seconds, it is not logical that when you are killed you come back to life seconds later and so on.
The “logic” of your silly roleplaying fantasies have nothing to do with combat mechanics or the balance of the game.
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People complain that d/p thiefs are to good… I seen Cry babys asking for nerfs, what if, instead of nerfing one of the few viable builds for thiefs, we buff pistol/pistol for power builds.
Thief is a fine example of the real problem and how nerfs (or buffs) don’t solve the real issues, thief has had a lot of nerfs, yet for three years thief has been in pretty much every top team, and yet again at the last WTS there was a thief on each team, the reality is the core design of thief is too good at what it does, even repeated nerfs don’t stop it being from being basically untouchable in its role and a default pick on a team, the truth is the class needs certain things redesigned, same goes for a lot of other things AI for example one of the issues that two of the classes (mesmer/ranger) that struggle most of the time face is having to rely on AI that doesn’t work properly/reliably.
But it seems actually fixing fundamental problems in the game like these (LOL 1 year mid air immob bug) is not the policy, the policy is paper over the cracks.
Logically, it makes no sense why am a ability based on aiming should be able to pinpoint track someone while their target is invisible. Because this is illogical, the burden of proof as to why channeled skills should follow in stealth falls to you.
Also, stealth in this game is completely different to stealth from other games. You’re comparing apples to oranges.
LOL, because being able to “stealth” in full sight of someone, in broad daylight in an open space with no cover is perfectly logical…
Stop equivocating. That’s not what I meant. Stealth was clearly designed to be able to be used in broad daylight; it makes sense that it works that way. and FYI, lore-wise, stealth is magic, so it can be logically justified in an in game way also.
As for channeled skills, there is no clear reason why they can track in stealth: it’s not logical.
LOL, ‘lore-wise’, just pretend the same magic fairies that make stealth into invisibility give rangers magic powers when they fire their bow that lets them track “stealthy” foes.
Do you think it is logical that when someone is slashed by a sword they only bleed for a few seconds? Or that when your character dies they don’t actually die? Or that rangers/thieves never run out of arrows? Those are rhetorical by the way, as the answer is obviously they are not logical, but that is because game mechanics and balance, and your sort of “logic” do not mix.
Learn to dodge, interrupt, etc and stop making weak excuses for your failings with nonsense about “lore”.
Wow, what a strawman. The lore thing was not my argument, it was some extra information included at the end. My argument was that stealth was clearly designed to be used in broad daylight and it would be dumb if it couldn’t be. It makes sense that it works this way.
Channeled skills however, have no clear indication of why they should follow in stealth. They were clearly designed to be aimed at someone and require a target to be aimed at. Continuing to follow after the target disappeared creates a illogical paradox. Now it is up to you to justify why this strange paradox should exist.
I don’t need to justify anything, I’m not the one trying to justify one skill on “logic” or “lore” you are, logic or lore have absolutely nothing to do with it, as shown by the examples I gave that you conveniently ignored as they show how ludicrous your argument is, we’ve had people who can’t play whine about channelled skills before, guess what, nothing changed, it is a counter to stealth that provides some balance, in a game where stealth has very few, learn to play.
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I meant in terms of it’s cd. It’s like when Engineer’s complain about not having condi-clear when it’s right there. I still find it to be superior since it’s on such a low cd but that’s just me. The only reason why you believe the opposite is because there’s no other option for the Guard to take and yet here’s an option for an Engineer to take…
Edit: Again, cherry picking at its finest.
LOL, talk about hypocrisy, “I meant in terms of it’s cd” that is “cherry picking at its finest”, just ignore the stunbreak, but then your whole argument is hypocritical cherry picking.
And no the reason I believe CoP>elixir C is as I stated and you conveniently ignored, is that elixir C has no stunbreak, which not only makes it inferior, but would also make viable engy builds which require two kits suicidal, which is why no one uses it, despite your delusions over how good it is, where as Contemplation of the Purity does have a stunbreak, and fits in a viable build where it also gives obnoxious uninterpretable healing and only has an 8 sec higher cooldown.
As for engies and condi-clear, the reason engies complain, is because they can do maths, apparently you can’t, Anet even stated weak condi cleanse is part of the design for engies, they aren’t lying. Engies also understand the quirks of their skills unlike a lot of other players (as conveniently demonstrated by the post below this from someone giving opinions when they do not even know how transmute works), take transmute for example it doesn’t remove a condi, it removes a stack, so if it hits a stack of 12 bleeds, it only reduces that stack to 11, WOW!
The reality is the lack of condi builds and the amount of condi clear on shoutbow & ele in the meta, help engy, if they made balance changes to make condi more viable and condi builds entered the meta, engy would be more effected than other meta builds including your passive, instant skills faceroll medi guard.
There is a reason engies are one of the first classes that get focused by teams, defensively they have big weaknesses, weak condi cleanse, only ever one stunbreak, no real stability and no teleports, it is also partly why engy has no viable or even close to viable zerker build.
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