Yes there are people who play WvW for WvW but look how small that community is now.
The community is only small now because that is the result of three years of neglect in regard to the real issues that WvW has, when the game launched there were a whole bunch of guilds with 500+, some a 1000+ players who came specifically to play WvW, they left long ago, because it was clear WvW had fundamental issues and that Anet were not going to address those issues, lack of rewards has very little to do with it.
Saying that, GW2 doesn’t look very healthy fullstop, I saw a post by someone who is in multiple big PvE guilds claiming far fewer people are logging in, PvP forum has continual complaints about matchmaking caused in part by the small playerbase.
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You sound like a typical PvE Skinner Box addict, rewards or lack thereof, are the least of the issues with WvW, and have nothing to do with why most WvW players & guilds have left the game.
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The whole point of WvW is to not have fair fights….
Fair fights and poor class balance are two different things.
The stuns and shatters are avoidable. IT JUST REQUIRES A BIT OF GAME SKILL It’s time to learn to play.
If you had “learnt to play”, then it would be obvious that an instant 1200 range stun that can be applied from stealth, multiple times per minute is not avoidable in any meaningful sense.
This sort of design would be less obnoxious (though still pretty cheesy) in a game with healers, but with the limited support classes give in GW2 it simply doesn’t work, it is just one more example of why PvP in this game is such a massive success.
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lol just no. Not only did mesmer get more things put into baseline (a GM trait became free) but they also benefit more by literally combing multiple old builds into one (PU + shatter now.)
Eles ALWAYS went into 3 trait lines before spec patch. We run practically same build before and after. We aren’t suddenly running two builds like mesmer. Always water/arcane. The fire (or air) line is nice, but about on par for the rest of what everyone else got. Especially when you consider the nerfs in arcane and air.
Try learning to read, going into three traitlines is not the same as “three full trait lines”, the clue is in the ‘full’, ele has a lot of really strong traits, so for example being able to now go fully down fire to in addition to water, arcana and be able to get blinding ashes, plus increased fire damage, more burning, reduced cooldowns, more condi cleanse etc. made dagger eles, an already strong build, even stronger. (add in how strong burnig is now, and well…)
Now compare that to say engy, now even if incendiary powder was put back in the explosives line, cele engy would not have the power creep dagger ele has had from having access to three full trait lines, the synergy is just not as strong, nor on the whole are there as many strong traits on an individual level.
As for mesmer, doesn’t change what I said, mesmer is the other class had big power creep from the changes, but much of that came from buffs to the mesmer like making IP baseline, the 1200 range on blink baseline, mantra changes, the ridiculous blind trait, etc, having access to 3 full trait lines helped, but not as much as it helped dagger ele.
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As far as I know, D/D eles didn’t get buffed much more than other classes; in other words, other classes benefited from the power creep about as much as D/D eles.
Ele had big power creep, not because of buffs to the ele class, but because ele benefited more than anyone else from having access to three full trait lines.
I watched quite a lot of Wimbledon a few weeks ago, I didn’t see Roger Federer and co hurling abuse at each other over the net, and that is something that actually takes skill, and has millions in prize money / sponsorships on the line, unlike GW2 which is a joke in terms of skill, as a competitive playerbase and has nothing but pocket money on the line.
The words that sum it up are immature, juvenile and pathetic, but I guess as a generalisation those apply to many “gamers”.
I’ve try pvp in other games and that’s the best and more balanced pvp I’ve ever try.
Try it on the old games like lineage 2, aion or wow, or in the new ones like archage, FFXIV and more.
There’s a large amount of broken classes that simply you can’t defeat and classes that simply you have to not use in pvp because they’re so bad in pvp that is a waste of time try to use them.
Last two MMO’s I’ve played every class was wanted in PvP.
For example the last MMO I played was Rift, from about 5 months in for around15 months, when I played every class had options, there were weak trees, but that was about it, every class had options, warrior could go anti-caster with voidknight or with a decent healer behind them were really strong going DPS, cleric was best PvP healer in the game, also at times had other options like nice AOE build for larger group PvP, Mage could go full damage or have maybe the most influential build in the game if played well (chlorodom) and rogue could go tanky melee, assassin for picking off individuals, ranged specs or even support as a bard in larger PvP formats.
The problem with balance in GW2 is that it does not have hard roles (though I guess thief is sort of close to having one), in a typical MMO, if they overnerf the single target healer spec, it doesn’t matter, you still need the healer, if they overnerf the support class, doesn;t matter you still want it for larger scale PvP maps and so on. The class gets protected by having a hard role, in GW2 if something gets nerfed then there are multiple classes ready to replace that class (thief aside to an extent).
The other problem with GW2 PvP is it is only 5v5 and only one format (I barely count teh joke that is courtyard), there is no variety, in other games, specs that are not great for 3v3/5v5, etc often still have a place in PvP because there are 10vs10, 15vs15, 20vs20, etc, or something that may be weak in deathmatch, is strong in capture the flag, etc, so even if our favourite class becomes unfavoured in one format, it is still wanted in other formats.
And that is just PvP, when it comes to PvE & WvW, this is a game where balance is so bad the same classes have been ‘unwanted’ in those modes for three years.
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Reading all the negatives about ranger, if anet would just buff ranger I would feel so op. It’s possible that you guys never played against solid ranger with proper build. As for me, I think ranger is in very solid place atm.
A – mes, ele, ranger
B+ – guard, necro, thief
B- – engi, warps: if u want to see what I can with my ranger, poke me anytime for duel
What a class/build can do in a duel is nearly irrelevant to how strong it is or how much use it is in PvP, there is a reason there was not a single ranger in the ESL EU tournament a couple of days ago…
Yeah let’s face it, WvW is a niche. People who play only WvW is a lot lot fewer. It kinda makes sense that a company like Anet will tend to look over a small percentage of people.
Most players are a “niche”, PvP players are a niche, those than speed run dungeons and want decent PvE are a niche, RP players are a niche, etc, you know one of the reasons WoW actually grew its playerbase for years, it catered far better to the different “niches” of players who played the game, than the vast majority of other MMOs, who tend to short-sightedly concentrate on their biggest niche at the expense of everything else and which all suffer from a playerbase in continual decline bar the odd bump for an expansion or going F2P (including this game) rather than actually growing it, which in real industry would be considered a failure.
If you think ignoring swathes of customers is how successful businesses work and basically not having the level of resources to provide a fit for purpose product, then I suggest you look outside the amateurish, tinpot little industry that is gaming.
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Why the whining about eles, in ESl EU tourney yesterday, there was only one match where five of the ten classes were ele, most matches only had 3 or 4 eles, this is clearly not enough, ele needs more buffs so every match has 50% of the players on ele.
Now people may say, but there was not a single ranger or necro in that ESL tourney yesterday, surely they need buffs and ele need nerfs, you silly people, ranger / necro do not count they have been removed from game, this how we achieve balance, it is much easier to balance when we have fewer classes.
Mesmers also need a buff, there are still small windows between the dodges, stealths, teleport, distortion, diversion, knockback, blurred frenzy (or staff 2 pseudo stun break), being moa’d, being blinded, being LOS by clones/phantasms and being stunlocked that you can still hit a mesmer, this is clearly unacceptable and ideally for the sake of balance it would be better to further buff mesmer to remove another class, I suggest they up the mesmer mobilty by massively lowering the cooldown on blink, this way not only will those small windows be removed, but we may be also in a position to eliminate thieves from the game, again making it easier to balance, so we will head further toward the dream balance of ele/mes teams, with maybe a token rampage warrior for fun.
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As they actually totally disgusted true WvW players for trying to do something this week, they should at least try to minimize damages done and freeze server ranking.
WvW rankings are a joke every week, when really all that matters is the difference between coverage of the servers and how many mindless PvDoor zombies each server has, if three years into the game you still haven’t worked out that as a competitive format WvW is a total joke, well…
This event is so fun that I’m downloading ESO…
Two of most things will kill you, though I guess thieves are worse than some other classes as most classes / builds will not be able to disengage from them, but heh that is what happens when you make a game where it is skilless faceroll to focus a target down because support is limited when you have no healers and there is no DR or immunity on CC. (especially focusing certain classes)
Everybody calm down. Anet is doing the smart thing by (slowly) correcting bugs.
Really? Part of the reason GW2 PvP has the “massive” playerbase it does is because they take so long to fix bugs / make balance changes, it is also part of the reason why people get worked up, because it means they have to put up with (or simply leave the game / leave PvP as most have done) some obnoxious OP crap for 6-12 months or they fret about Anet “balancing” some OP thing on their class and nerfing it into oblivion for 6-12 months.
If Anet actually did regular balancing, most people would be a lot more chilled out about these things.
Really i thought gw2 problem was because it had few game modes. Then I heard it was because of the lack of rewards, for some odd reason it keeps changing.
Which is why I said ‘part of the reason’, try reading things properly.
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Everybody calm down. Anet is doing the smart thing by (slowly) correcting bugs.
Really? Part of the reason GW2 PvP has the “massive” playerbase it does is because they take so long to fix bugs / make balance changes, it is also part of the reason why people get worked up, because it means they have to put up with (or simply leave the game / leave PvP as most have done) some obnoxious OP crap for 6-12 months or they fret about Anet “balancing” some OP thing on their class and nerfing it into oblivion for 6-12 months.
If Anet actually did regular balancing, most people would be a lot more chilled out about these things.
He’s probably one of the best engies out there, I’m talking about Five Gauge from The Abjured.
Well, I see him do the follow:
Perma swiftness
Stealth
Pull the target
Push the target
Heavy condition damage
Good ranged damage
Insane healing
Perma regen
Perma vigor
Insane kite mechanic
Engi shield has lower cooldown on block than guardian and warrior, unbelievable.
He trasnform people into MOA, really Anet??
He gets WARRIOR’S rampage on a much LOWER cooldown, the damage? Is almost the same.
It’s tanky as hell
He goes twice in less than 20 secs into the mini-form being invunerable to everything…
He cleanses condies very often.So, Engineers can do EVERYTHING and they do everything very very well.
In good hands like Chaith, it shows how broken engies are.Remove the moa, rampage, shield and invulnerable from this class and it may balance things out.
Also engies has zero cooldown on kits, give Eles no cooldown on attunements too.
How exactly does a build using marauders amulet, has limited condies (none of the OP burning, no torment, etc) have “heavy condition damage”?
How does he have perma vigor when the only vigor he gets is 2 secs on a toolbelt skill use (he doesn’t even run the 50% endurance trait)?
How do you think he has insane healing when his only healing is his heal skill and then blasting into into to put it on a 20 sec cooldown and has one leap finisher (he has no blast finishers outside of blowing up the heal turret) in the water field, and again is running marauder amulet with no healing power, how is that insane compared to say a cele D/D ele?
How is elixir X almost the same thing, when 50% of the time you get tornado which according to your hero Chaith is so worthless he immediately cancels it 99% of the time?
And so on…
Chaith seems to have let’s say an optimistic attitude toward engies, but if you actually watched and listened to what he said, even with that attitude you could see the problems, for example:
- He didn’t even bother engaging a d/d ele because they are “indestructible”.
- After doing a stealth Moa / rampage on a mesmer he stated that was pretty much his only chance to beat a mesmer (the mesmer still lived).
- He pointed out that what was engys viable build was dead (cele rifle engi) because they moved incendiary ammo into fire arms, so to get a similar level of performance now you would need to have access to 4 trait lines now.
- That whilst that IA nerf actually made engy balanced, other classes like Mesmer, Ele, etc had huge power creep from the changes.
- That the soldiers engy some people play is worthless, as why play engy when other classes/builds like d/d ele can do that job much better.
And so on… And that is from someone who is “optimistic” in attitude, go watch some other engies who stream / play in teams who basically sum engy up as a piece of kitten in its current situation and are playing classes other than engy due to that.
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There is counterplay and simply spamming interrupts isn’t going to do the job, even if they do stun (remember fighting Hambow Warriors? They had a lot of CC, too and the CC was somewhat manageable as long as you had at least one escape ready because you knew what was coming next).
No the CC of hambow warriors was manageable, because it had counterplay, because it had animations and cast times, so you could react and for example dodge a pin down, where as a 1200 range instant stun (let’s not even go into the stealth thing) is unavoidable unless your idea of “counterplay” is to not to use skills, it is pitifully bad design.
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I’ve notice that people are saying they are being one shotted by mesmers, and this is indicative of OPness, but the full mesmer burst happens between 1-2 seconds, can people not react to this?
What do people react with when being stunned and burst, when they can be stunned for 1.25 seconds, instantly, from 1200 range, even from stealth, any time they use skill with a cast time, multiple times per minute that far exceeds stunbreakers/invurns (and that is in a 1v1, let alone that in a teamfight these stunbreakers will get used up by against other opponents), bad, broken game design is… bad and broken.
I used to have to bait dodges on my mesmer, now I just roll my face across the keyboard.
They get stunned from 1200 range, that means something is about to happen to them, so they should use their stunbreak and probably roll or use a blocking-like ability.
Do you even read what you reply to? You can trigger CS multiple times per minute between MoD & Diversion, far more times than the number of stunbreaks / instant blocks & invurns than most builds have, there is no counterplay, and that is 1v1, add in most fights are not that, and stun breaks and the few instant invurns/blocks get used up far mroe quickly in teamfights, it is even more of a joke, it is skilless and terrible game design.
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I’ve notice that people are saying they are being one shotted by mesmers, and this is indicative of OPness, but the full mesmer burst happens between 1-2 seconds, can people not react to this?
What do people react with when being stunned and burst, when they can be stunned for 1.25 seconds, instantly, from 1200 range, even from stealth, any time they use skill with a cast time, multiple times per minute that far exceeds stunbreakers/invurns (and that is in a 1v1, let alone that in a teamfight these stunbreakers will get used up by against other opponents), bad, broken game design is… bad and broken.
I used to have to bait dodges on my mesmer, now I just roll my face across the keyboard.
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Fact is it doesn’t, a lot of the QQ outside of obvious bugs are all L2P issues.
People that have “L2P” left GW2 PvP long ago (who are not masochists), because to anyone with even the slightest clue as to what constitutes good well designed gameplay, things like instant stuns that can be applied from 1200 range, multiple times a minute, even from stealth, is such monumentality inept broken game design that is pointless playing the PvP.
The game has a lovely fluid combat engine, but that is it, the rest of the combat / mechanics are a poorly designed, low skilled, joke, if you had “L2P” you would realise that.
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http://www.sirlin.net/ptw-book/introducingthe-scrub
In Street Fighter, the scrub labels a wide variety of tactics and situations “cheap.” This “cheapness” is truly the mantra of the scrub. Performing a throw on someone is often called cheap. A throw is a special kind of move that grabs an opponent and damages him, even when the opponent is defending against all other kinds of attacks. The entire purpose of the throw is to be able to damage an opponent who sits and blocks and doesn’t attack. As far as the game is concerned, throwing is an integral part of the design—it’s meant to be there—yet the scrub has constructed his own set of principles in his mind that state he should be totally impervious to all attacks while blocking. The scrub thinks of blocking as a kind of magic shield that will protect him indefinitely. Why? Exploring the reasoning is futile since the notion is ridiculous from the start.
cheese = cheap
That paragraph doesn’t make any sense, unless you are working on the basis that the game is perfectly balanced and everything requires equal amounts of skill, as of yet I have never played an MMO that even comes close to that, so they are indeed many things that are low skilled / poorly balanced / forgiving (cheese/cheap), which is part of the reason video games have such a laughable skill cap compared to things like sport or chess, that take real skill, and have real balance, the author is apparently some sort of scrub not to have worked this out, or maybe he is just thick.
You’re missing the point. Players are incredibly quick to label something as low-skill cheese, but all that does is give them an excuse to lose. What other purpose does it serve? To call something out as imbalanced? In that regard it’s useless, because it provides no description as to why it is unbalanced, nor does it provide any ideas as how to not make it unbalanced.
So at the end of the day, it’s an excuse word designed to make players feel better about losing to something. Sometimes the “cheese” is actually unbalanced and could use a tweak. Sometimes the player just couldn’t be bothered to try to figure out how to beat it, nor could they be bothered to consider that, perhaps that build is designed to beat theirs if played very well.
He doesn’t have a point, for him to have a point the game would have to be perfectly balanced and everything require equal amounts of skill, the vast majority of video games come nowhere near that, and MMORPGs certainly don’t, just because something is in the game does not mean it is well designed, balanced, etc, so I see no problem with players pointing that out.
One of the purposes of the article is to show that truly great players of a game won’t get mired in their emotional muck when playing/learning. The second you label something as “cheesey”, you no longer approach it with the conviction you otherwise might to beat it. You stunt your own growth because you think that you’re doing something more difficult, and therefore you should win. But the other guy wins because he’s using some cheese-easy strat, and it’s suddenly the game’s fault.
There are no truly great players of video games, skill cap is too low, as for stunting your growth nonsense, if you are too weak minded to be able to accurately evaluate things that are poorly balanced without affecting your own performance, that is your failing, not everyone is that limited.
I do find it amusing how you think coordination with a physical ball is “real skill”, but coordination with a mouse and keyboard is… I don’t know what you’d call it. Fake skill.
No I think tennis for example is real skill, because firstly the skill cap is a zillion times higher than a video game, and secondly because it is a mirror matchup, it is all down to the player, rather than the imbalances that are created in most video games by differences in skills/traits, etc.
You know a few weeks ago, the F1 team that have won something like 4 out of the last 5 championships were complaining about the performance of the engine their manufacturer has come up with this season and how a large part of their struggles this season is down to that, but I guess they shouldn’t say that, because some big time winner with a website says so. /sarcasm
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http://www.sirlin.net/ptw-book/introducingthe-scrub
In Street Fighter, the scrub labels a wide variety of tactics and situations “cheap.” This “cheapness” is truly the mantra of the scrub. Performing a throw on someone is often called cheap. A throw is a special kind of move that grabs an opponent and damages him, even when the opponent is defending against all other kinds of attacks. The entire purpose of the throw is to be able to damage an opponent who sits and blocks and doesn’t attack. As far as the game is concerned, throwing is an integral part of the design—it’s meant to be there—yet the scrub has constructed his own set of principles in his mind that state he should be totally impervious to all attacks while blocking. The scrub thinks of blocking as a kind of magic shield that will protect him indefinitely. Why? Exploring the reasoning is futile since the notion is ridiculous from the start.
cheese = cheap
That paragraph doesn’t make any sense, unless you are working on the basis that the game is perfectly balanced and everything requires equal amounts of skill, as of yet I have never played an MMO that even comes close to that, so there are indeed many things that are low skilled / poorly balanced / forgiving (cheese/cheap), which is part of the reason video games have such a laughable skill cap compared to things like sport or chess, that take real skill, and have real balance, the author is apparently some sort of scrub not to have worked this out, or maybe he is just thick.
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Well a few reasons, the map is bad for 5v5, it would be better if it were 2v2/3v3, the game isn’t balanced for it, it is pretty dull / simplistic, after all it is basically just a team fight in a very dull map, it has a lower skill cap (again dull).
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A thief complaining about balance for roaming in WvW whatever next, why do you think over the last three years thief has been by far the most common roaming class in WvW, because it is underpowered and unforgiving?, LOL.
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Everyone is so focused on abusing a bug that they’re missing out on good builds that aren’t dependent on exploiting a bug.
Except it isn’t a good build, it is a build that is vastly inferior to a mesmer or thief doing the same job, it is a build that shows one of the issues with this game, in that having a glassy build with a bit more health, a bit more armour and a bit more healing, a block, etc is worthless in a game with no healers and no DR on CC, so you are ridiculously easy to focus down, unlike mesmer/thief who have the mechanics you need to survive/disengage/drop target on a glassy build.
Look at a popular game like HotS or League of Legends. Someone gets caught out of position, he instantly dies and his team gets punished for it.
Bad comparison, different type of game, MMOs have more skills and generally combat that has more depth, more variety and requires more thought, for that to work you need longer encounters.
Stealth has enough counterplay as it is: if you recall, pre-patch, in tpvp, only one meta build was using stealth. The other stealth professions (mesmer and ranger) were not considered very viable. The problem we face now is the burst. Reduce the stats from the amulets and you won’t have trouble against stealth builds anymore.
Stealth has very little counterplay in this game, in most MMOs damage knocks people out of stealth, the ability to in-combat stealth is very limited, there is normally no way to stealth other players, there are consumables that counter stealth in some way, movement speed is often slower in stealth and so on, stealth in GW2 is easymode.
In conquest stealth is limited to an extent due to not being able to contest / cap points in stealth and the OP cheese of constantly being able to reset fights is limited due to the points ticking away meaning you can’t waste time like that, but in stronghold stealth will be as broken as it is in WvW.
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Why is it Anet always puts in high AI low skill builds into the game?
Erm perhaps because like most MMOs there are people of different levels of ability and you need to have something for everyone, I mean really if you are so bothered about “skill” why are you are even playing GW2, it doesn’t have a high skill cap, you should be playing SC2 or CS, or better yet play something that takes a real level of skill like chess or tennis, GW2 is a joke in comparison.
…it is very much the same ele that was falling out of the meta before patch only with the extra grandmaster everyone received…
That every class gets an extra traitline does not mean every class benefits to the same extent.
I wouldn’t worry about engi, when they fix the nade bug, these nabs will all switch to something else, because engi is now pretty mediocre after the changes, and there are far stronger options. (shows how much of a joke this forum is, with all the whining about engi “buffs” pre-patch from kids that have no clue how things work)
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This strategy was only really viable and common in WvW roaming(which is btw not a gamemode the game is balanced around) and was essentially useless in 2 of the 3 gamemodes(SPvP and PvE).
That the balance in this game as a whole is a joke because Anet really only bothers to balance around tPvP (and even fails at that) is hardly a plus point, besides which they are adding stronghold, in which stealth will be as lame and imbalanced as it is in WvW.
I’ve started using PU in SPvP as sort of an offpoint harasser and sidecapper. I can say from experience that while 100% duration is a lot, I almost never stay in stealth for that long.
Doesn’t matter if you usually come out earlier than the full duration, the issue with having 6 sec /10 sec durations on stealth is it reduces counterplay even further because people have even less idea of when their opponent is going to reappear again / burst them from stealth, it just makes the game even more unskilled than it already is.
Also keep in mind that Anet seems to be moving towards more reveal access for certain classes. Engi’s lock-on, the spoiled guardian trap, ranger shout and WvW’s stealth trap are all good sources of reveal
No they aren’t good sources of reveal, the ranger shout has the same issue the engy toolbelt skill has, which is it doesn’t fit into most builds, stealth traps are a joke and are only really of any use in situations like trying to kill a d/p thief (and now mesmer) that are trying to “permastealth” inside a keep in WvW, lock on is the best of the bunch, but again it is one class, and only certain builds.
I want to hear opinions on Prismatic Understanding on MESMERS, not stealth in general
Tough kitten, it is relevant to why making this trait have 100% extra duration is so lame and how weak your argument is about them adding more reveal sources is. This game has the most forgiving, imbalanced (in terms of risk vs reward especially) stealth system I’ve ever played, in most MMOs damage brings you out of stealth, you are severely limited in your ability to stealth in combat, your movement speed is slower in stealth, there are normally consumables that any class can use to detect stealthed players, you can’t stealth other players and so on, the “counterplay” to stealth in GW2 is a joke.
So adding more stealth with the new PU trait just makes the game even more braindead, even more unskilled, but then I guess that is the target audience.
…till GvG…
… is just one mindless slaughter and ganking again and again.
I dislike this repetiveness…
The irony is strong with this one.
As for 1v1 and “skill”, everything you have to do in 1v1 you also do in tPvP, plus a bunch of other stuff on top of that like map awareness, the added aspects of combat that playing with teammates / fighting multiple opponents entail, learning how to make the best of a real build and fighting far more at a disadvantage, as opposed to a cheese duelling build, and so on.
From my perspective you are saying: “I can’t dodge the opponents abilities, so there should not be abilities I have to dodge.”
It is funny how people bring this sort of thing up, but never look at it from the other perspective, focusing someone down in this game is by far the least skilled in any MMO I’ve played, no healers, no diminishing returns / immunity on CC, the most forgiving / abusable stealth system I’ve ever played, etc make it faceroll, especially against certain classes, it is simply brainless.
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Thoughts?
That a big part of why you are having more fun is that a lot has changed and people are playing a lot of different builds, trying out and fighting against new things is fun, when a meta has been established and you have played against the same builds for 6 months, things will be less fun.
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After the patch hit, WvW roaming has become impossible.
Because roaming was balanced and in a wonderful state pre-patch…
LOL, that is not a telegraph, sure at the start of a 1v1 duel that is the case, in actual game of PvP, with teamfights, people streaming in and out of fights, etc all you know is that any one of the numerous times in at most the next 30 secs that a necro gets 3 or more condies on them, they may be transferred back to you.
The biggest telegraph is the Plague Signet symbol showing you, that condi-bombing this guy might be a bad idea.
The Plague Signet trait has a high 30 second cooldown. That shouldn’t be a problem. And if a necro uses all that transfer stuff, he has no sustain at all and is a perfect prime target.
People just aren’t used to it and cry for nerfs now. L2P!
Try reading things properly, he isn’t talking plague signet, it is about the trait Plague Sending that procs the plague signet active effect when the necro has three condies on it, there is no signet symbol for when it is off-cooldown.
And to be clear I am not “crying for nerfs”, I was just correcting the notion that it has a telegraph, it doesn’t. This game is full of badly designed passive procs, instant skills, etc, so I see no reason to nerf this one for necro when every class has them, rune sets have them, sigils have them, etc, just accept that this game has a great combat engine, but the actual design of many of the skills, traits, mechanics produce brainless gameplay.
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The telegraph is the 3 conditions on the Necromancer, which you know will cause it to proc, don’t be a moron and blow your entire burst when you know its about to reflect at you.
LOL, that is not a telegraph, sure at the start of a 1v1 duel that is the case, in actual game of PvP, with teamfights, people streaming in and out of fights, etc all you know is that any one of the numerous times in at most the next 30 secs that a necro gets 3 or more condies on them, they may be transferred back to you.
But then that makes it no worse than a million other procs, instant skills, etc in this game that all lack real telegraphs.
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This thread is pointless, there is a lot more to balance than DPS, mortar has 1500 range, it also has AOE – chill, heal, blind, posion, plus a waterfield, ice field, poison field, light field, and a blast finsiher.
In WvW, since the patch, the 5 man target cap on most skills that share boons is not working, it seems there is either no cap or it is very high like 25 players or something, so people in zergs are going around with perma 25 stacks of stability, perma 40+ seconds of quickness, etc.
(also lots of lag, maybe due to this?)
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Power shoes is gone, cloaking device is gone. I have go to into the whole tools line just for speedy kits.
The trait the reduced both flamethrower and eg is gone. Alot of the Master traits are better than the grandmaster traits and now you cant take them instead. I could go on on but whatever.Build variety also to a big hit meh..
Not sure why you are complaining about power shoes when it got replaced by a better trait – mecha legs, you get the 25% movement speed and what used to be leg mods in the one trait.
And yes build variety did take a hit, but on the other hand in theory it should be easier to balance.
Because having vastly more thieves roaming about in WvW than every other class will be totally different to usual…
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Ranger did get buffed, but engis got super buffed. Engis were already 1 or 2 per PvP team while rangers were 0 or 0 per team. It makes no sense…
The buffs on engy get overstated, both from the perspective of the actual buffs, but also from the actual position of engy.
Now don’t get me wrong cele rifle build is OP, but that is just one bit of engy, in many areas it needs help, like every class that needed buffs/changes in weak areas, look at the zerker options for example, zerker engy (static discharge) is literally the weakest zerker build in the game, that aspect needs help/buffs. Same thing for kits, most rarely got used because people worked out not to stand in bombs, FT is simply bad, and elxir gun is only good in 1v1 and offers less survivability than elixir S/slick shoes in any other situation.
Also two things on cele rifle, firstly cele is getting nerfed (10% I think was the number given), secondly the metas in the last year have hugely favoured engy, most of the other builds have either had good self condi clear like medi guard, or also had AOE condi clear like d/d ele & shoutbow, so the things that gives engy the biggest problem condi necros, condi rangers, etc have been absent.
They have also had nerfs, but people seem to ignore these, for example the speedy kits thing that got changed to 20 secs by a dev the other day, this “buff” just means engy gets the same uptime on swiftness from that it has now, but that when it gets boon stripped it now will be longer before it can be reapplied, it also in turn nerfs invigorating speed, the idea that this is a buff, is ludicrous.
Similarly people who I assume don’t play engy enough, don’t seem to notice things that have been core to the survivability of many engy builds for three years, got nerfed by their positioning in trait lines, for example if you were up against a burst heavy composition it was not unusual to select both invigorating speed and protection injection, they have been moved to the same trait tier.
Also look at the game as a whole, in PvE engy is a decent option, but that is all, it has never been wanted like ele, guard, warrior, thief, etc, in WvW it is the worst class, in that is has been basically unwanted for zergs/raids for the entire game, even the much maligned ranger has been in a better place since the longbow/signet buffs.
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The only reason why nobody complains more…
Difficult to take any complaints about class balance seriously from the joke that is the WvW player base given how few complained that were basically no rangers (or engies for that matter) in zergs/raids before the read the wind patch, too busy spamming 1 on their guards collecting MOAR lootbags (those that don’t spend most of the time running away) like the incompetent little PvE players most are.
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Or you can just ignore thier, bashing and do as you please. If a zerg comes in and wipes everyone out, it’’s thier right to do so. If you want to interupt duels then go ahead. kill them. it’s not thier place only. you cap lands. that’s what you do. if they wanna duel. then it’s thier risk they are taking. u are not obliged to wait for thier duels to finish. it’s thier job to maintain that area so that they can duel.
Well he could do that, but of course that has repercussions, for example if he interrupts my 1v1, then cries for roamers to help defend his upgraded camp some time later, guess what, he isn’t getting any help, which is my right to do so, same for a blob interrupting a couple of guilds having an open field fight, sure he could do it, but then he might find that when his beloved garrison is attacked that guild decides not to help, which is their right to do so.
Again, I’m sorry to take up for the developers, but there have been many times where people have complained about circumstances, and when a dev pulls up their data, their argument falls a part.
Yeah it is called PR or propaganda, it is there to give a false impression to those gullible enough to fall for it. There are many more times they do not respond, you know why, because when the player gives the screenshot and says we all solo queued they had a 4 man pre-made + 1, the player was right, they only respond when it suits.
I would always try to grab a friend or two to play with me which helped make me a better pvper in general
If you want to get better at PvP then when you are in a pre-made you want to be facing other pre-mades, not players queuing solo, in fact that is the other half of the problem, if people queue up as a team (and they are not terrible) and they don’t end up against another full team, it is often a total washout.
Furthermore most people queue solo sometimes, even people in actual PvP teams, in fact these guys are often hit the worst, because they have ratings and end up against pre-mades more often, so the idea that solo queuing should be deliberately made worse by facing pre-mades, is well…
It is just a dumb system for all involved, but heh don’t worry the PvP playerbase is huge due to great choices like this.
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the beautiful thing about gvg’s is that its meta encompasses so many viable possibilities. ive never seen more build variety anywhere else. until recently, only the engies and rangers have been left out. but we have rangers now, and we’ll have likely have engies in there when the patch hits. in other words, indirectly, they’ve done a great job overall balancing gvg’s. and they did this by staying out of it
What? The balance in “GvG” is a joke, most weapon sets never get a look in as it is the same old ones that get used, condi builds do not exist because the mechanics of the game were made for 5v5 and break when you have a bunch of guards/warriors in a ball who can endlessly AOE heal & AOE condie clear, and as for the class balance, LOL, that can roughly be summed up as 4 classes that have been vastly overrepresentated, the other four vastly underrepresentated to the point two of them have been non-existent for most of the game, one of them still is.
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Meanwhile in Warrior land, no designer ever posted, ever
Meanwhile in warrior land, mending was supposed to be turned into physical skill next patch. Naturally it wont be, spoiled engi kids took all resources leaving war, ranger, guard, necro with bad taste in mouth.
In WvW they are the least wanted class in raids, and have been for three years, and when I say least wanted what I actually mean is unwanted.
In PvE they have been very average, and never highly desired.
And in PvP before celestial builds they were between a nice option and sub-par (though never terrible) and have the weakest zerker build options in the game, since celestial they have been a default pick just like bunker guards were for almost 2 years, thieves have been for the entire game, hambow/shoutbow have been, etc.
Certainly overall they have faired far worse in this game than warriors, guards, thieves & eles, but please don’t let reality get in the way of things.
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I was looking through Streamlined Kits and the effective loss of swiftness uptime there was an unintended consequence of Kit Refinement being packed together with Speedy Kits. I’ve gone ahead and changed the swiftness from Streamlined Kits to a 20s duration.
Why just not buff engineers to 1 shot anything on a sight?
Rip any form of balance.
Yeah because “buffing” a trait to worse than it currently is (more chance to have that swiftness boon ripped, nerfs invigorating speed (again)) is OP, as for “one shotting things”, a rather ironic comment given zerker engy is literally the most useless zerker build in the game (PvP).
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