Guild Wars 2

Astral Projections.7320:

I recommend you get another dog. ^^There are large numbers of dogs in the pound looking for a home. Most of the dogs I’ve gotten were pound dogs and were wonderful pets. As a plus, you’re saving their lives as well as giving them a wonderful home. Yes, it’s sad to lose them but there is the joy from living with them to balance it out.

I have a 2 year old German Shepherd/Doberman cross called Apollo (From the pound) who is gorgeous and who we call son of Abel sometimes because they lived together and he shares much of his character. He is super protective of Alice our 2 year old daughter and that is just sooo cute. So at the moment I am thinking we should just concentrate on him. That said we are still very upset and thus my emotions are no doubt clouding the judgement of everything i am thinking about at the moment.

Should have all of the qualifiers rewards ready for distribution this week.

Thanks!

Keysha.2815:

What about a zone just for guild halls? Then it can have the open world feel, but not be all over the map. I just think guild halls all over would be intrusive. Especially for those who don’t do much with them. Experience says that if you open the world to building, people will drop buildings right where they start. Or in the most intrusive places possible.

And I do not like the idea of airships. I’d rather have buildings, where we can have a large room to see everyone at once.

Yep I think this is a must. Like Devata says it is super important to remain true to the pillars of the game and whilst having large maps doesn’t meet his/her goals it does align with the pillar.

Just want to note again this is a brain storm and not indicative of anything we may or may not be working.

These are my opinions mainly as a player but also as a developer and as always a CDI that the team is reading.

Chris

Tryxtr.6295:

Way too many ideas in here to comment on all of them, but here’s my thoughts on a few.

Instanced versus Open World
Instanced makes perfect sense because it will take way less effort to implement, avoids a lot of the player cap issues and completely avoids the problem of the open world becoming cluttered. Open world guild halls could be amazing in certain scenarios, but realistically I think it would be too much work to implement them.
note: I will admit that walking through Lornar’s Pass, for example, and seeing this huge towering structure built into the mountains would be a very impressive sight

Alliance Guild Halls
I think that having an actual hall for guild alliances would be a mistake, for all the same reasons as everybody else has already mentioned. It would make for a messy divorce. However, I think that building a “bridge” between guild halls that would allow guilds that have an alliance to visit each others Halls, or a large area that specifically exists so the 2 guilds can mingle, would be an excellent compromise and would present no issues whatsoever. If the alliance ever fell apart the “bridge” or auditorium-style room would simply disappear.

Minimum Size of guilds
People are suggesting that a 1 or 2 person guild should have access to a guild hall as well, but my question is “why would they need a guild hall?” They won’t have anybody to talk to, it wouldn’t increase a sense of community, they can’t really GvG (1v1 I guess, but they can do that in PvP or WvW), and the other “stuff” (ie crafting stations, etc) can be found in the open world.

Suggestion to Devs
I think it would be extremely helpful if the devs could constrain our brainstorming a little bit by making a decision on a few key areas, such as instanced -vs- open world and minimum size. That would help streamline the conversation a little. I would also suggest starting an entirely new thread once a couple concrete decisions are made.

Lots of amazing ideas so far and there’s a lot of potential here.

I was just thinking about this and then i read your post. This might not be a popular driving function (and I apologize Devata this is nothing personal and I really appreciate your input in the CDI’s) but I would like us (for the sake of focusing the discussion) to move away from Open World Guild Hall discussion.

Put simply I am removing the proposal of open world Guild Halls specifically from our brain storm.

I do however want us to continue to talk about some of the benefits open world brings. For example how could we still keep some of the cool Guild ‘Beacon’ mechanics etc (And by Beacon I mean ways for the guild to express their personality and progression)

Chris

Arewn.2368:

Devata.6589:

And yes I am aware I said instance. This is purely because I am a fan of instance over open world (-:

But why?

That is a much more important question. It’s Anet who talks about a living and breeding world. Open world guild-halls (and housing) that people can build them-self will be able to do that. Even more so then dynamic events and the living world.

An instance makes is less interesting and more put away, in addition it’s out of the game in a way, or better said it’s out of the game-world.

I very strongly urge you to actually go try Archeage, which has open world housing as a primary feature.
tldr; it can be an absolute nightmare, and in practice the only real benefit is “oh look, I can see some random guy’s house/some random guy can see my house”, and “haha I ganked you on your farm” (in Archeage’s case, it’s an open world pvp game).
Unless Anet can guarantee a plot per player, it’s going to cause some pretty ugly situations and some very jaded players. And they’d likely have to do so without introducing vast expanses of open space, or cluttering the normal maps’ skies with airships that people have to render, if they want it to look any kind of reasonable.
When you’ve spent a week looking for a plot, any plot, to build on to no avail, or when your beautiful house gets neighbors that block out your nice view or build something that aesthetically looks like trash to you and clashes with your house, you get a lot less enthusiastic about the “open world” part of housing.

Instanced housing/guild halls that can have some sort of interaction with outside forces (gvg being a popular one, but it could include other things like the ability to make the hall open to the public and having events within) would, I feel, be far more conductive to community interaction while circumventing the real estate issues entirely.

I’ll say it again for anyone on the side of “open world housing”. Go try Archeage and see what Open World Housing is actually like in practice. I’m not saying it’s entirely bad, but a reality check on what it actually entails in practice is always a good thing.

I agree and have been looking at Archeage to. It is always important to look at other games relevant games and feature in the same field when designing.

Chris

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Donari.5237:

I think Lanfear’s question is what happens if the guild you are repping swaps alliances and no longer is in the alliance that made the hall — how do you handle man-hour investment in an alliance hall if for reasons fair or foul you need to go separate ways?

Yes, this is precisely what I was asking. I know in GW1, my guild was in several different alliances over the multitude of years that I played. Sometimes alliances just don’t work out for a variety of reasons and guilds go their separate ways.

What happens in such a case, when the guilds split, to all the effort that was put into these ‘shared’ halls. The man hours, the funds, etc. When they join another alliance that has it’s own shared hall already, do they now have their hall, the old shared hall, and then the shared hall for the new alliance as well? This could get cumbersome. Do they lose the old shared hall instead and thus all the effort put into it? That could really tick some people off. Or do shared halls simply no longer exist if the alliance does not exist? Could this not be a double edged sword – ie, as much deterant as incentive to build such an item?

Yeah this is a real problem. This could completely preclude Alliance functionality on our Guild Halls discussion. Can we have some ideas to beat this problem please and see if we can solve it?

Chris

Nighthawk.6453:

About Open world vs. Instanced GH: what if we sort of combine both? Guild claims some structure in the open world, unused by events, PS and NPCs and it becomes entry point for instanced Guild Hall. Non-guild players can see some basic decorations, like tag and icon, and props tied to upgrades.
Players of the guild that owns the building can enter it’s instanced version. Instanced version is “bigger on the inside” and has interior tied to location, i.e. asura lab or sylvari leaf house for building in Maguuman, human tavern or house for building in Kryta, etc.
Pros:

• GH has Open World noticeable representation.
• GH are spread around the world.

Cons:

• Limited amount of buildings in each area (can be solved by adding more houses, or zone part specifically for houses) .
• Guild members can’t see the exterior without leaving GH.

This is a really good idea.

Chris

DragonWhimsy.6489:

On the matter of Guild Alliance Halls, I have nothing against those necessarily, but they are absolutely not a replacement for small guilds having their own guild hall.

From a RP’ers perspective though, that could be a really awesome way to have a fully RP’ed town or other shared experience. I think the RP community would really enjoy that.

I don’t disagree. The discussion around alliances and small guild access to Guild Halls are not mutually exclusive.

Chris

Rambodacious.7495:

Adventuring – Specializing in this category provides:

Responding to Chris Whiteside

I love the idea of the alliances you posted, but I think each guild should have to build/improve their own structures. If you represent a given guild within the alliance then you can take advantage of their buffs. This would allow guilds of varying specializations from above to band together and give all of their players access to all aspects of the game without having to grind out their own upgrades. Also, with this change, small guilds could then benefit with little to worry about.

Allowing a special channel for Alliance Chat would be great too.

Honestly, smaller guilds could just ally with the larger ones and get all the bells and whistles. Bigger guilds would want it, because it’s a few more people repping the guild here and there throwing coppers into the Guild Vaults per above. Everyone wins.

As far as how to go about actually unlocking the tiers/upgrades etc from above? I’ll get to that tomorrow.

Hi Rambo,

I totally agree with:

Allowing a special channel for Alliance Chat would be great too.

As a player I hope GW2 gets more custom chat channels full stop.

I love the idea of the alliances you posted, but I think each guild should have to build/improve their own structures.

This is an interesting an complex idea. The idea of guilds in this scenario of having building specialties is just awesome. i going to have think about this some more.

It would be totally cool to have guild outside of your alliance that you could reward or pay to come into your guild area and guild from a set of custom creations. Note i am brain storming here, this is a very complex but cool idea.

Chris

Baltzenger.2467:

I don’t think it does any good to start repeating suggestions to not have them “buried” in the thread, because by doing so, the thread is getting very messy and hard to read. I do not know if the purpose of this is that “we” get to a consensus, because how will we? It’s better to just post your suggestions/ideas (once!), answer to the questions proposed, and move on.
I’m sure the team will read the whole thread and not just the last pages, also, if something needs to be further discussed, we will be asked to expand on that, like we have been doing to this point.

I mean, it shouldn’t be that an idea gets more attention because it is posted more times on the same thread…

Exactly. If someone posts then it is read, considered and added to knowledge base of many of the CDI collaborators. That post then informs discussion and problem solving, thus there is no need to repost. If there hasn’t been a direct answer or question by anyone it doesn’t mean that it hasn’t been useful to the conversation. As we continue to move forward with the discussion we will drill down further and things will be more focused. This particular CDI has been excellent and we are definitely not out of the discussion phase so hang tight and lets carry on having a great discussion.

For those that are interested I did a talk at VFS Game Design Expo a few years ago that goes through the different roles of a game designer during development. Watching the pertinent parts (Mainly the Concept and Dev section) maybe useful if you all if you have the time to watch it. Please note these are my personal experiences and opinions and the talk is not designed to be put forward as fact or the opinion of Arena.

Chris

I’m definitely pushing to have us work on some detailed brainstorming of the guild upgrade system. Here is a very short summary of discussion thus far:

• Someone suggested that the upgrades be tied to buildings which I think has some very clear potential.
• People have suggested a few ways to break those upgrades down but none too specific.
• We need to discuss how the building system would incorporate old upgrades but also provide new ones.
• What kind of new upgrades would be possible because of the system turning into buildings?
• What changes to influence and guild progression should happen to make it more intuitive if we went with buildings?
• How do we build customization into this upgrade system where there currently is none? Someone suggested this and there were some talk of separating clear core functionality from the unique customized features, but that is sort of where we stopped.

I’d love to see people just blue sky take a crack and fleshing out some of these ideas and then I would be happy to summarize which ones I think gel well together and try to combine them into a more cohesive design that we could then begin discussing the pros and cons of.

Jon

munkiman.3068:

Tryxtr.6295:

Way too many ideas in here to comment on all of them, but here’s my thoughts on a few.

Suggestion to Devs
I think it would be extremely helpful if the devs could constrain our brainstorming a little bit by making a decision on a few key areas, such as instanced -vs- open world and minimum size. That would help streamline the conversation a little. I would also suggest starting an entirely new thread once a couple concrete decisions are made.

Lots of amazing ideas so far and there’s a lot of potential here.

I agree, however i do wonder if it’s just that further internal discussion would need to take place before they could narrow things down. I like that they are putting in little guided points to discuss, but not totally locking us into a key concept. Both Jon and Chris have stated they prefer instances (vs open world design) as well, but it’s good that they are willing to listen to reasons behind the idea and various suggestions to fix the issues, instead of just entirely dismissing it. Still at some point someone has to call it, just for the sake of progress or not beating a dead “mount”

To be fair I prefer open world design, but think its very hard to overcome many decisions that have already been made in the game.

Devata.6589:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

All good points and this one is very valid:

‘I think, for smaller guilds, the basic bonuses should be obtainable easily. Examples like a guild armorer merchant or something. But the bigger, longer, and higher stuff should stay the bigger and longer. Yes, big guilds will reach it faster than smaller guilds, but that’s the nature of the beast. Bigger guilds are going to get to the bigger and better stuff sooner.’

This is also a very acute point:

‘As for guild alliance halls. They could work, and would be neat. The only issue would be, what happens if the alliance breaks apart? who gets the hall?’

Initial thoughts are that members of the Alliance would each get an instance of the shared guild hall. And yes I am aware I said instance. This is purely because I am a fan of instance over open world (-:

Chris

And yes I am aware I said instance. This is purely because I am a fan of instance over open world (-:

But why?

That is a much more important question. It’s Anet who talks about a living and breeding world. Open world guild-halls (and housing) that people can build them-self will be able to do that. Even more so then dynamic events and the living world.

An instance makes is less interesting and more put away, in addition it’s out of the game in a way, or better said it’s out of the game-world.

Hi Dev,

For all the reasons and more stated by many in the thread about the pros and cons of open world vs instance. Also it is very acheivable to have a living and breathing world within an instanced map (I do however understand your point).

Chris

Donari.5237:

For those suggesting “defend the guild hall events,” what happens if the guild fails the event? What rewards come from succeeding and how are those balanced against other game play modes? How is it kept from being a mob-wave farm fest while still feeling rewarding to use? What makes it special to guilds as opposed to just finding events in the world to do? Would the guild have the choice to just never trigger such a thing?

I’m not dissing the idea, as it certainly could be fun to have an option for action and adventure surrounding the hall, just wondering about these factors.

My assumption is from reading the related threads that you would lose some of your progression in the guild hall and would have to build it back up.

Chris

Gulesave.5073:

With all this talk of how to build and manage the halls, and where to put them, and who can see them and go in them, I’m not seeing any mention of what you would want to do once you’re in there.

The desired functions of the hall and its constituent upgrades should be considered from as early a point as possible, to inform the design from the legs up.

Preferably, I think, it should be a place to do things we can’t do anywhere else. Otherwise why build it? Unless you really just want your guild hall to be nothing but an elaborate meeting hall with a few crafting tables…

Hi Gulesave,

There has been a ton of discussion and brainstorming on Guild Hall Content in the thread. Maybe once Jon gets some time he an summarize some of it.

Chris

Donari.5237:

I think Lanfear’s question is what happens if the guild you are repping swaps alliances and no longer is in the alliance that made the hall — how do you handle man-hour investment in an alliance hall if for reasons fair or foul you need to go separate ways?

That is an interesting issue. Alliances in this context are pretty complex because of this one point.

Chris

Clerigo.9475:

Sad to hear Chris.

Heres my buddy. Name was Boris. Was with us for almost 15 years. Gone this past February.

One of the longest nights of my life. Me and my brother up all night until vet arrives to put him down in the morning. Closed his eyes, and no more.

Miss him alot. Still find myself looking for him when i get home.

Never will have another pet again.

I am so sorry. I don’t think we will get another dog )-:

Chris

Glad to have been of help! =)

SpudBob.9036:

My work gives recognition rewards in the form of gift-cards, and I used to always use them on amazon to buy gem-cards.

However, my last order on amazon.com last month said that they were out of stock, and they still haven’t received any.

Since this is the only way I justify buying gems and I wanted to get some before the next living story content comes out, can someone please look into why amazon.com no longer has the gem-cards available?

I will see if I can find out anything about this. It could be simply that Amazon needs to order more cards to sell, but I’ll check.

Thanks to those of you who are staying on topic and attempting to give John and his team valuable feedback.

Feel free to post your thoughts, but please stay on topic and make positive, meaningful suggestions.

Thanks for the feedback, Moa. I’ve incorporated some of your suggestions for future rules.

Elric Of Melnibone.4781:

I just had to put down my best friend of 16 and a half years this Saturday and for those who are not pet owner’s you cannot imagine how big a hole they leave behind when they go. I think a general pet memorial someplace out of the way in the game would be wonderful.

.. )-:

Chris

Gaile Gray.6029:

Oh, dear, I didn’t know. I’m so sorry, Chris, and yes, I’m sitting here at work crying my eyes out.

My heart is with you and your family. <3 to you all.

Hugs Gaile.

Chris

FYI i will be reading the discussion tonight and jumping back int tomorrow!

Chris

Marcus Greythorne.6843:

JonPeters.5630:

My box is guild upgrades. I want us to brainstorm how we could revamp the upgrade system given the introduction of a feature such as guild halls.

1.) Something that comes to my mind would be a system where you have a specific number of free slots and you have to choose which things you’d put into them – just like the skill-system (3 utility slots but many choices to put into those). This would make guilds relatively unique vs. others.

The bigger the guild – the more variety is available for them via more slots. Small guilds may have only 2 slots (e.g. they specialize on dungeons and sPvP) but it’s not too hard for them to reach the higher tiers in these categories, since their chosen slot-options are designed for small groups.

2.) What if each player could choose 1-2 occupations in the guild hall? He would gain personal reputation and would unlock stuff only specialists on that area could get. This way the huge guild-group would be split into multiple sub-groups which work together for their sub-goals. (e.g. the dungeon-specialists would unlock dungeon portals for their guild, but only on higher level tiers in their sub-paths. Players who play a lot of GvG could unlock new GvG-maps for their guild. They also unlock personal prestige rewards (like costumes) but also stuff for everyone in the guild. etc.)

Not everyone can unlock everything, which would make smaller groups within the guild more meaningful. You would have to specialize, which would be important so that more people are involved in the upgrade-process instead of only a few hardcore players who unlock everything and make the others feel redundant.

(something like TF2’s classes – the more you play with one, the more you can customize your character and the more you can help your team in a variety of ways).

This could go even further: The dungeon team could also have multiple sub-categories, where players can and should specialize. Players who play very supporty (revive a lot, heal a lot) could unlock exotic gear with support-stats for everyone to purchase, while they unlock personal things as well (skins which show off the support-role).

The TLDR here would be: give every player something to specialize in so that this player would feel special in a guild while he unlocks stuff for himself (prestige-items) as well as for the whole group (useful items).

I like this, but would want to make sure we don’t deny access to core features. Someone suggested guild hall upgrade trees as guild hall structures. I think you could make an argument for structure types. Ones that contain core features vs more unique specialized structures that guilds must choose some number of to build.

Please submit a ticket for assistance with this case. You can do so using the link I have provided below. Please select “Account Issue” from the drop-down menu on the page for this particular situation. Be sure to fill out the form to the best of your ability to help expedite the process.

https://help.guildwars2.com/anonymous_requests/new

Oh, dear, I didn’t know. I’m so sorry, Chris, and yes, I’m sitting here at work crying my eyes out.

My heart is with you and your family. <3 to you all.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

‘As for guild alliance halls. They could work, and would be neat. The only issue would be, what happens if the alliance breaks apart? who gets the hall?’

Initial thoughts are that members of the Alliance would each get an instance of the shared guild hall. And yes I am aware I said instance. This is purely because I am a fan of instance over open world (-:

Chris

Personally I think I’d prefer instanced Guild Halls over open world ones anyway, since I wouldn’t necessarily want people wandering into my hall uninvited. Would be like someone simply wandering into my home without knocking. But, that’s just my take on it.

Now, with each guild getting their own instanced of the previously built “shared” hall, if the guild entered into a new/different alliance would they then lose that, since this different alliance would potentially have their own shared hall? Could they potentially lose all the effort they put into the previously shared hall, or would that effort then translate into the new alliance? (which opens up a whole different selection of issues and potential exploits)

I way I see it is that you have access to any guild you are repping.

Chris

FYI I am AFK currently.

Hi All,

Sorry I was afk. Again thanks for all your kinds words and also my sympathies for all of those that are and have been here.

Chris

munkiman.3068:

Thorfinnr Sleggja.1209:

Devata.6589:

Thorfinnr Sleggja.1209:

Devata.6589:

Did you read the thread and know what the air-ship suggestions where about?
Basically the idea whas you could build your own airships and for idea’s of what would be possible see the Wizard’s Tower http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Wizard's_Tower and the Zephyr Sanctum http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Zephyr_Sanctum

In short, yes, I have read the thread…and many ideas that have been listed are fine and actually quite cool…but in perspective…may take a long time in development to get them into the game. Which is why I suggest start small, get the GHs in, get some quick wins with the community, and keep a group(obviously not their only thing) working on new additions to go into GHs say every 2-3 months(some go in automatically, some may need a Guild to “work” toward adding them to their GH). Each small addition could build on the background supporting system development to work up to the big adds that many are suggesting here and get them into the game.

I would expect them keeping adding new stuff to it. But you first do the bulk of work and then start adding stuff, not the other way around.

OK…apparently this is now Devata’s Thread, and I do not fit in with his expectations of contribution.

Chris and Jon, this was a good thread with many good point-counter-point ideas and discussions, but since 1 person has now decided to deride any suggestions, not only mine, that are not in line with what they think should be done, I will no longer add input to this thread.

Good Luck, and I hope more constructive things like this can take place.

I’m waiting on Jon to come back with “a box” list so we can really brainstorm further on potentially good ideas. I’m also waiting on Chris for question 2

I think the idea of open world guild halls is sound, for another game, like Archage

My box is guild upgrades. I want us to brainstorm how we could revamp the upgrade system given the introduction of a feature such as guild halls.

munkiman.3068:

Devata.6589:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Devata.6589:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

‘As for guild alliance halls. They could work, and would be neat. The only issue would be, what happens if the alliance breaks apart? who gets the hall?’

Initial thoughts are that members of the Alliance would each get an instance of the shared guild hall. And yes I am aware I said instance. This is purely because I am a fan of instance over open world (-:

Chris

Personally I think I’d prefer instanced Guild Halls over open world ones anyway, since I wouldn’t necessarily want people wandering into my hall uninvited. Would be like someone simply wandering into my home without knocking. But, that’s just my take on it.

Now, with each guild getting their own instanced of the previously built “shared” hall, if the guild entered into a new/different alliance would they then lose that, since this different alliance would potentially have their own shared hall? Could they potentially lose all the effort they put into the previously shared hall, or would that effort then translate into the new alliance? (which opens up a whole different selection of issues and potential exploits)

“I wouldn’t necessarily want people wandering into my hall uninvited.”
And why would that be possible in open-world guild-halls?

Especially with doors like in WvW where the guild can set a door only allow guild-members or allow everybody in, or other rules. Whatever they want.

Or guild-hall airships. Maybe you allow gong on to other airships but maybe not. (if the gap between two airships is to big)

That has been given as a solution in this thread.

The common theme with open world is the ability to go anywhere as you please. Thus the keyword “open.” It’s all one big instance without restrictions. To lock non guild members out makes it not ‘open world’ anymore, as the hall becomes its own instance. It’s own map. Similar to crossing from Queensdale to Kessex, for example. Open world guild halls (at least to me) would be much closer to how the lodges function in Hoelbrak.

I’m not sure on the airship proposal. I’m not keen on air ships to be honest. But, that’s just my perspective on it.

Open world means your guild hall is in the open world. That does not mean that there are no restrictions and it does also not mean everybody can get inside it. But everybody could walk or fly past in.

You know just like in real life your house is in the open world but you can’t build everywhere you like and the door prevents unwanted people from getting in.

Basically, my vote is a no. There is an expectation to guild halls IMO, that it’s a private place for Guilds to gather, especially on top of it issues with megaservers and population. As discussed already, what is the population cap of a guild hall? 150-200-400? Right now open world won’t hold much more than 150 people in most cases and we are talking about server plots on maps that are capable of holding something like 1000 players or more?

I’d also like to see Guild halls mapped out like they were in GW, where you had 2 sides (2 structures) that supported GvG, which isn’t possible in an open world scenario. I’m of the mind that you solve every issue discussed by just making them an instance, besides boring and showing off.

Devata,

I don’t want to call you out, but because you are such a strong proponent for open world, what kind of systems, tied to guild halls would you like to see to help gain some of the benefits that you feel make open world so compelling.

P.S. I agree that open world is super compelling, but also feel like in an already live game you can see both the resistance you are going to get from existing players and the difficulties you will have to overcome of decisions made in the past.

Jon

DiogoSilva.7089:

JonPeters.5630:

Conski Deshan.2057:

I find the current upgrade system quite stagnant and boring, you get your influence passively, click a button then wait a week.
(no offense intended to the creator of the system)
Maybe have the initial guild hall unlock under architecture say level 2/3 but past that an active system is needed.

On Categories for upgrades ,I’d see it breaking down something like this: (I may have what you meant by this wrong?)
Structures:
-Towers -halls -corridors -entry halls -Misc rooms
Defenses: (could be just graphical)
-Trebs -Cannons -Hot oil -Misc
Interior:
-Seating -Tables/cabinets -Rugs/banners/flags -Wallpapers/wall -statues/monuments -Misc
Exterior (wouldn’t actually limit it to placement outside as I’d like water features in the command room)
-Fountains -Trees -plants -training grounds -Livestock -Misc
NPCS
-Functional -Decorative -Alts
Glory or Rare category (this section would have limited placement (i.e once per guild hall or 10 per guild hall) basically the more prestige and high end stuff.
Limited Section for limited items i.e reward from once off events or competitions like a new Christmas tree each year.

This is a great break down, but I was speaking more about categorizing guild upgrades. Let me give an example to help get things started:

• WvW
• PvP
• Guild Missions
• Dungeons

This would tie the upgrades more to game mode than to the current arbitrary categories.

Before making a breakdown, I would like to think a little about Conski Deshan’s point regarding how “passive” influence is. I mean, I pretty much forget that it even exists, most of the time.

So, I am thinking, assuming the simplest case scenario: no customisable halls (excluding a visual representation of the guild upgrades), what could be a good reason to add guild-driven dynamic events/ quests/ hunts all around the world, if there’s no furniture to hunt down? Well, to make influence more actively obtainable!

Anyways, back to the breakdown, I think your example is effective and simple to understand. But I propose the following:

• Architecture (the guild halls itself)
  Unlocks guild halls, determines their size/ scope, unlocks general merchants and functionalities (bank, etc) within the guild halls, in addition to the current effects;
• Guild Identity / Representation (marketing the guild or having a presence)
  Unlocks and/ or expands upon guild armors, emblems, advertising boards, flag buffs, etc;
• Competition
  WvW buffs, GvG privileges, access to and maintainment of a guild-bound custom arena (as an alternative to the current means), ability to set up tournaments, unlocking access to pvp training area (with dummies) in the guild hall, etc. Also includes unlocking the respective merchants.
• World Presence (player-driven or player-created events)
  Guild missions, guild-related hunts or dynamic events for privilege/ furniture/ whatever, ability to organized guild events in towns, ability to set up duels, etc. Maybe the flag buffs can be here. Maybe this category can be fused with Guild Identity;
• General PvE Experience/ Organization
  For dungeons, fractals, raids, open world events and buffs.

Good categories. I agree influence is not a good system and we should think about how we would change how you obtain upgrades once we have talked through the specifics of what kind of upgrades a new system has and how it incorporates the existing upgrades.

I have noted your ticket for further review. You should receive a reply shortly.

The department that handles this type of situation is a bit backed up at the moment, hence the lack of reply up to this point on this ticket. Apologies for the wait. Please rest assured that the ticket has not been forgotten.

The serial code that he purchased has not been registered yet. He needs to go to https://register.guildwars2.com , click the “Link Account” link beneath the “Create New Account” button, enter the information for his trial account there along with the new serial code, then hit “Next” to continue the registration process. Just to clarify, the account that is receiving that error in the screenshot is not a trial account.

Khisanth.2948:

Serophous.9085:

As for minimum size, I would say 25 members must be in the guild to start. That seems like an easily achievable number, especially with people able to join up to 4 guilds at a time.

What would be the benefit of this arbitrary limit? How does it improve the content?

Being able to join up to 4 guilds at a time is irrelevant. Having to grab extra filler members just so you can build a guild hall would be silly. If someone leaves the guild and you are now at 24 members does the guild hall go poof? If not what was the point of the limit? If yes … expect a lot of complaints from all over the place.

FYI I would not put a hard gate on number of guildees required for Guild Hall creation. That is my personal opinion.

Chris

Note Jon and I are asking separate questions about different areas of the feature. Hopefully this isn’t to confusing. Feel free to engage both of us in tandem.

Chris

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Serophous.9085:

Edgar Doiron.2804:

Serophous.9085:

As for guild alliance halls. They could work, and would be neat. The only issue would be, what happens if the alliance breaks apart? who gets the hall? Does it go away if the alliance fails and a new one has to be started all over? If anything, that could be a completely new and different CDI if (or after ) guild halls are implemented.

That sounds as complicated as a divorce :P

and chances are, it would be!

All the more reason to keep things separate imo. Fewer peeved people in the long run.

Note we have come up with two valid options that can also be part of the design.

1: Small Guilds aren’t Excluded.
2: Alliances can create a shared Guild Hall.

Chris

Edgar Doiron.2804:

munkiman.3068:

JonPeters.5630:

This is a great break down, but I was speaking more about categorizing guild upgrades. Let me give an example to help get things started:

• WvW
• PvP
• Guild Missions
• Dungeons

This would tie the upgrades more to game mode than to the current arbitrary categories.

So. This is about changing the categories to be more inline with game modes and it looks like you’re adding a few as dungeons and PvP only oriented categories don’t exist currently. Since politics and economy work globally across game modes (in general), where would they fall in this new category structure?

I’m at the point of trying to see what this has to do with the halls themselves though. Or are we just speaking about what parts of these new categories would be displayed in a hall? I like the idea of having an extra Asura Contractor show up and start building stuff in a workshop (which could currently sit in the architecture area “Build a physical workshop in your guild hall”). They could be crafting things like banners banquets and the like. While it’s a fun idea, it really doesn’t add much functionality to the upgrade system, but it does integrate the idea of halls more closely to the process.

Yep i’m trying to grasp what Jon wants here.

Does he just want us to redistribute the current upgrades under new names? or what?

If Guild Halls become the upgrade system it is an opportunity to look at the upgrade distribution and make it more meaningful and more sensible. This is an opportunity for you to do that. I just gave an example so that you could make your own suggestions within that understanding.

All good points and this one is very valid:

‘I think, for smaller guilds, the basic bonuses should be obtainable easily. Examples like a guild armorer merchant or something. But the bigger, longer, and higher stuff should stay the bigger and longer. Yes, big guilds will reach it faster than smaller guilds, but that’s the nature of the beast. Bigger guilds are going to get to the bigger and better stuff sooner.’

This is also a very acute point:

‘As for guild alliance halls. They could work, and would be neat. The only issue would be, what happens if the alliance breaks apart? who gets the hall?’

Initial thoughts are that members of the Alliance would each get an instance of the shared guild hall. And yes I am aware I said instance. This is purely because I am a fan of instance over open world (-:

Chris

munkiman.3068:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Hi Munki,

We are just brain storming and thus throwing the idea of Alliances up. it was the top voted QOL proposal by the CDI group and something that I think would be really good for many aspects of the game.

It is important to try to not think of me as a dev in the discussion. I am just helping you guys to design and problem solving and you guys are helping me with your design ideas and community persona.

Chris

Fair enough, although i think of you and Jon as the ones that drive these conversations, more in the sense that we at least have a tighter structure so we can all sort specific ideas out. I mentioned some of this in a previous post.

I agree Alliances should be a thing, for sure. I also think you should be able to visit each guild in an alliance hall and guest to that guild for things like GvG and missions. A couple features that should come along with the Alliance idea. But, then again, we still need to work out the issue with a map cap even moreso then.

Yeah we are happy to drive and thanks for letting us do so. What i mean is just because we all talk about something it doesn’t mean it is a ‘thing’.

Chris

Devata.6589:

JonPeters.5630:

HHR LostProphet.4801:

HHR LostProphet.4801:

JonPeters.5630:

[…]

Saved for later when we get a dungeon or raid CDI: I like the direction in which this suggestion is going but I would suggest another implementation.

Back to Guild Halls
One question I would like to have answered:
Guilds can hold up to 500 players. Normal maps can hold up to 100 – 150 (?) players.
How do you want to ensure that players don’t feel separated from each other, can you raise the player-cap for Guild Halls?
Do you have any other idea how to get around this issue?

As Chris would put it: Le Bump.
I would like to know how you want to get around the player cap.

I’ll chime in a bit here. It is a good question. I think there would be some conflict here but that there would also be some technical wiggle room. I think we can safely assume that 500 players from a guild being logged in is not the common case. What is a “reasonable” maximum # of members in the guild hall to you? 150? 200? 400?

But if we have maps with multiple guild-halls?

So the question then is, why is the number of players limited. Or does it only have to be limited within an area around players? So as long as we prevent more then x players to come to close to each other it should be fine.

Usually you would think there should not really be a max to the number of players in a map but there would be a max to the numbers of players close to each other.

And I think 250 would be the max even for a HC 500 man guild. But I’m not in a HC 500 man guild so would not know.

I would think you guys have the numbers for that. For us it would be guessing.

Lets assume for brainstorming reasons we have 1 large map.

Chris

I will wait a bit longer for other thoughts before asking my next question.

Chris

Edgar Doiron.2804:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Morning All,

Due to recent events I must confess that I am only properly knowledgeable up to roughly page 12 but I want to jump in and start discussing things with you. I hope that is ok.

I want to emphasize that my questions, thoughts, and brain storming are theoretical and should not be taken as a given. With that said I want to start at the foundation.

Ok lets assume that in the world of the CDI Guild Halls have a lot of horizontal progression such as the ability to create buildings, upgrade them and customize the whole experience. What is the smallest guild size that this would be suitable for. Even more specifically is it ok to have a ton of progression in this Guild Hall example and have small guilds work through it.

An idea I wanted to throw into the mix would be could small guilds have a shared Guild Hall with an Alliance?

Chris

I think there’s no real minimum behind guild halls, unless you hide it behind merits, which is a bit harder to come by in a small-ish guild.

I worked on getting my guild upgrades done, the guild was created at pre-launch of the game, and my active players ranged from 3-4 to around 20 at peak time during those past 2 years+

We recently finish upgrading everything this summer. Yes, it took a while, and what we did in-between, we played guild missions with an allied guild, while we would get enough influence to upgrade everything we needed.

I think being a smaller guild, working towards these objectives that seems so far away, brings us closer together, working towards a common objective. Now we run our own missions every week, and when we’re recruiting we can say we have everything unlocked.

So nothing is really unreachable, if you don’t mind putting the time in it.

Ok great.

Chris

stale.9785:

For those who don’t know – the rainbow bridge:

Just this side of heaven is a place called Rainbow Bridge.

When an animal dies that has been especially close to someone here, that pet goes to Rainbow Bridge. There are meadows and hills for all of our special friends so they can run and play together. There is plenty of food, water and sunshine, and our friends are warm and comfortable.

All the animals who had been ill and old are restored to health and vigor; those who were hurt or maimed are made whole and strong again, just as we remember them in our dreams of days and times gone by.

The animals are happy and content, except for one small thing; they each miss someone very special to them, who had to be left behind.

They all run and play together, but the day comes when one suddenly stops and looks into the distance. His bright eyes are intent; His eager body quivers. Suddenly he begins to run from the group, flying over the green grass, his legs carrying him faster and faster.

You have been spotted, and when you and your special friend finally meet, you cling together in joyous reunion, never to be parted again. The happy kisses rain upon your face; your hands again caress the beloved head, and you look once more into the trusting eyes of your pet, so long gone from your life but never absent from your heart.

Then you cross Rainbow Bridge together….

Author unknown…

(I’m of no particular faith, with absolutely no certainty of heaven. Still, more than any reward for US, I do hope there’s a place like the bridge for our companions.)

Yeah the last thing i said was be a good boy and I will see you soon.

Chris

munkiman.3068:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Morning All,

Due to recent events I must confess that I am only properly knowledgeable up to roughly page 12 but I want to jump in and start discussing things with you. I hope that is ok.

I want to emphasize that my questions, thoughts, and brain storming are theoretical and should not be taken as a given. With that said I want to start at the foundation.

Ok lets assume that in the world of the CDI Guild Halls have a lot of horizontal progression such as the ability to create buildings, upgrade them and customize the whole experience. What is the smallest guild size that this would be suitable for. Even more specifically is it ok to have a ton of progression in this Guild Hall example and have small guilds work through it.

An idea I wanted to throw into the mix would be could small guilds have a shared Guild Hall with an Alliance?

Chris

Hi Chris,

I’m kind of at a loss with this, it seems like we are all sort of going off in different directions? Are alliances a thing?

Anywho, some stuff is sort of floating around the virtual yard so far:

Increasing horizontal progression when is comes to halls
1. Visual upgrades (wall of achievements, representing upgrades)
2. Re-Categorizing current upgrades to reflect more with halls
3. Adding specialized structures (workshops, kitchens, personal spaces, etc. )

Guild hall limitations
1. Member caps
2. Ability to customize the structure (more sandboxy)

Open world halls versus instanced

Costs
1. Up-front fee
2. Maintenance costs (more in line with open world)
3. Equal footing costs for small and large guilds

I’m not looking to drive the conversation, but there is a lot floating around.

Hi Munki,

We are just brain storming and thus throwing the idea of Alliances up. it was the top voted QOL proposal by the CDI group and something that I think would be really good for many aspects of the game.

It is important to try to not think of me as a dev in the discussion. I am just helping you guys to design and problem solving and you guys are helping me with your design ideas and community persona.

Chris

Serophous.9085:

Guys, while the whole design aspect is sounding fun for a guild hall, I think we are forgetting one thing:

In GW1, the guild halls were relatively the same design for GvG. So while developing and building a guild to look how you want, how would this effect the GvG aspect, where there could be some annoyance in trying to find a guild lord to kill?

Hi,

GvG will be discussed after we discuss raiding.

Thanks,

Chris

Grebcol.5984:

My cat died today….i feel with u chris!

Aww Greb I am so sorry.

My heart goes out to you.

Chris

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Morning All,

Due to recent events I must confess that I am only properly knowledgeable up to roughly page 12 but I want to jump in and start discussing things with you. I hope that is ok.

I want to emphasize that my questions, thoughts, and brain storming are theoretical and should not be taken as a given. With that said I want to start at the foundation.

Ok lets assume that in the world of the CDI Guild Halls have a lot of horizontal progression such as the ability to create buildings, upgrade them and customize the whole experience. What is the smallest guild size that this would be suitable for. Even more specifically is it ok to have a ton of progression in this Guild Hall example and have small guilds work through it.

An idea I wanted to throw into the mix would be could small guilds have a shared Guild Hall with an Alliance?

Chris

Even the smallest guilds could own and upgrade their halls in GW1 if they were willing to work towards it. I feel that it should be the same here. It may take more time, but there is no reason a husband and wife guild (for example) should be excluded just because they don’t have ‘x’ number of people. Guilds are not about numbers, they are about companionship and cooperative play, and sometimes 2 is enough for some people.

Thanks Lanfear. To be clear I am definitely not suggesting exclusion.

Your answer makes absolute sense.

Not once we have discussed this question we ill move onto the next.

Chris