Guild Wars 2

docMed.7692:

1. - You’re talking about being elite… in a regards to player vs player ranking… as a negative thing? They have 5v5 hot join for a reason.

1. 2 – No, just no. They should however separate solo q vs team q, which they’ve already addressed they are working on.

1. 3 – That is untrue. Myself, amongst many others, solo q and have climbed into the top 1000 easily from this method.

Being out of the scene for 2 months does not make you an informative expert. In fact, although there is still much to fix, what they’ve implemented in the past 2 months have been a significant benefit to class balanace, development of the current meta, and quality of life improvements.

#1. I am talking about ‘elitism’ not ‘being elite’. Buy a dictionary.
#2. No? So if one decides to try out other classes in tpvp he should have his ranking demolished? Also his buddies should avoid having him in the team because their rank will suffer too?
#3. Wow…top 1000 no less. Let me tell you a secret: Do you know why you are able to reach top 1000 via solo que? Because there are not 1000 players in organized decent teams (i.e. game is dead). If there were, you would be behind them. But, enjoy your top ranking in top 1000 or so.
#4. Yeah, ‘being out for 2 months’ does not make me an expert. However, I never said that such thing does make me an expert.
#5. What they did in the past 2 months made the game much worse place. Now you cannot play duels in hotjoins because ppl will see your build. And you cannot really play tpvp with random buddies who are not so good unless you want to be rank 100+; not that these ranks mean anything anyway.

So another problem with recent design changes:
You cannot prevent other ppl from seeing your complete build.

I hope it is quite obvious why ability of others to see your build decisions should be your personal decision and why you should be able to disable them from doing so.
So this shuts off hotjoins for players who do not want others to see their build….cool.

So, I was out for two months or so and I c things have gotten worse. In general I should not waste time on these forums (or this game either) but still.
Problem #1:
Developers decided to promote elitism. How? Simple, if you play with the team that is not top you are set to lose ranks. It was immediately obvious, if you decide to try 1 or 2 new people for the guild and go into tourneys with them, you can lose 40 ranks with two lost games (my first experience after the ladder came out).
Nice, move. Now people who care about ranks are supposed to only play with the best possible team they can get into (no matter how much slack time that forces)?
Nice design.

Problem #2:
Ranks should have been per (account, class), not per account. (Discourages players from trying different classes).

Problem #3:
You are unable to rank player, you are actually ranking the best team player plays in.

…etc

you want anet to…..do something that…MAKES SENSE????
obviously a noob, haven’t been around for long, have you?

well, better be careful what you wish for….they may accidentally buff AOE, you know how ANET is. They are not quite synced up with their own selves.

Water should just be removed from the game. Like…just dry out the pools/lakes in the current maps.

Makes me laugh.

Teams burn out because the whole system is unstable. You need to really be ‘try-hard’ to play on fixed schedule with fixed 5-men team. And try hards usually burn out because of conflicts with real life. When group of 5 ppl is dependent on none of them burning out then you will not see teams lasting very long.

Process goes approximately like this:
1. Game requires people to over-commit their real-life time if 5v5 is the only choice (people organizing their life around game schedule in order to play in fixed 5-men team on fixed schedule).
2. One guy burns out (for example, student failing his tests in school due to overplaying the game will have to prioritize real life over game after few months, and since he cannot practice on his team schedule he simply completely quits). He is difficult to replace if team synch is too important (is it is in this game due to some bad design aspects).
3. Team tries different people to replace the missing guy, but they go on losing streak, resulting in the team falling apart.

It is fault of the game design and what it does and does not offer.

What the game needs is:
1. 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, 5v5 RANKED matches.
2. 1v1, 2v2 and 3v3 teams will feed 5v5. (I doubt 5v5 will be the most popular still due to the fact it will always be inconvenient to organize 5 player team).
3. Balance the classes so that ranks in each ladder (1v1, 2v2, 3v3 and 5v5) has the same representation of classes at the top (approximately 1/8 of top 100 and top 500 players for each class).

Until they do this, spvp will keep dying.

condiments.8043:

There are a couple of large flaws with your analysis of this “dichotomy” you’ve constructed of how damage dealing methods scenarios should play out.

Using the single target vs. AOE argument fails because of how easy it is to hybridize damage sources through weapon swap. Even the thief can easily sit on his shortbow for 90% of his gametime for providing safe highly sustained AOE damage with trick shot, and absurdly high AOE damage with short range cluster bombs along with choking gas for downed enemies and disabling shot for easy resets with damage avoidance. Saying a thief should win 1v1 encounters solely on the basis that one component of its damage dealing is single target is a mis-representation of the complex interactions between classes in team fights when viewed through the lens of 1v1 battle with no contextual value.

This is perhaps why dueling isn’t representative of game balance whatsoever. I could easily make non-standard thief builds and be one of the deadliest 1v1 classes in the game because of how powerful some of the stealth tools are but you wouldn’t be contributing adequately enough in a team fight. Burst specs, while not great in 1v1 fights, maximize their damage potential for priority and out of position targets.

Again more clueless nonsense. Argument does not fail because class has access to two weapons (one single target dmg and one aoe dmg)

When thief switches to bow, it is considered AOE build, when he switches to d/d it is considered single target build.

DMG on those two weapons should follow the design principle stated above. In other words, you should not have thief with “bow only” destroying thief with “d/d only” in 1v1. (i.e. bow should not be stronger 1v1 weapon than d/d).

Clueless ppl should leave these discussions to people with a clue. Problem is that clueless ppl do not recognize themselves as such I guess, so the point is mute.

I cannot believe this community, such a bunch of clueless people scared to death of ‘nerfs’, and not caring about the game one bit.

jportell, just more clueless drivel from you:
If one or two classes are out of balance you fix them. You do not change 6 other classes (it is much much much more work to do plus introduces new balancing issues).

Nerfing, buffing it does not matter, it is just two directions of job called balancing.

But anyway, ANET is going to do what they are going to do, I do not have much faith in them and I am not gonna waste time on forums.

These two (jportell and Arheundel) are just forum trolls defending their classes in their current obscene state even if it means destruction of the game itself.

I would not pay attention to them.

Guys, please have so much sense to understand that discussing skill coodlowns and other skill characteristics is irrelevant.

That is all encompassed in the following fact:
Shatter mesmer and d/d elementalists are mostly AOE dmg classes that are comparable or stronger than single target dmg classes/builds.

It is irrelevant how classes/builds get to that strength in 1v1, what IS relevant is that they are there.
And then what is further relevant is that they become MUCH stronger than single target dmg class/build in team fights.

That is severely bad design.

I am sorry many people just cannot follow and get lost in the details.

Arheundel.6451:

D/D ELE AND SHATTER MESMERS HAVEN’T GOT A SINGLE TARGET SKILL COMPARABLE TO HEART SEEKERS SPAMMERS, GET YOUR FACT STRAIGHT!

Dude, it is irrelevant. Going into details of what each class has just goes off topic.

The fact is that shatter mesmer and d/d ele and s/d ele are one of the strongest, if not the strongest 1v1 classes. And then their AOE (and team abilities and healing) scales like crazy in team fights.

Do you deny that fact? Or do you think shatter mesmers and d/d eles are much weaker in 1v1 than single target classes/builds?

They patched it up to tone you down in EU environment. Look at it as balancing patch.

Caffynated.5713:

Mufa.1326:

So here is a design principle for MMOs that ANET designers failed hard:
You cannot let AOE class/build to be comparable or stronger than single target class/build in 1v1 and then let AOE dmg scale linearly (5x dmg on 5 targets) for team fights.
AOE class/build needs to be slightly weaker than single target class/build in 1v1 and slightly stronger in team fights (only achievable through diminishing returns on multiple targets of AOE dmg).

/discuss

According to who? Horrible PvP MMOs like WoW?

AoE has drawbacks like delays before activation (compare Dragon’s Tooth to Newb Seeker), aiming (skillshots), longer cooldowns, and they already do less damage than zero skill newb classes like thief.

If anything, AoE is weaker than it should be in GW2 because of the sPvP game design focusing on holding tiny little shoe box sized capture points.

According to who WHAT?

Do you disagree with the principle?
Or do you disagree that d/d elementalists and shatter mesmers violate the principle?

Details you mention comparing skills and stealth etc are irrelevant. All of that is already encompassed into 1v1 strength. Do you think d/d elementalists or shatter mesmers are weak in 1v1 against single target dmg classes?

dreztina.4820:

Everyone here is talking about nerfing ele damage so they aren’t as good 1v1, but ele damage has nothing to do with their 1v1 potential. Ele damage already sucks on a single target. I run just about full glass in wvw and spvp/tpvp, and my entire burst combo combined does about 2/3 the damage of a single hundred blades. You can’t just ignore the benefit of downing someone instantly which other classes are able to do just because eles can spread more damage around over time.

Ele is already getting their survivability nerfed a lot next patch. Wait and see if they’re still problematic after that instead of just knee jerk gutting every aspect of the class at once.

I was talking primarily about their 1v1 strength.

The principle I proposed is that: aoe class/build cannot be stronger or comparable to single-target class/build in 1v1 and then get extra benefit of dmg scaling into 5v5.

How they fix them, through survivability or dmg, I do not care personally.

I also think that d/d elementalists got overemphasized in the discussion. Shatter mesmer is in the similar situation and in general dmg should not scale linearly (aoe hitting 5 ppl should not do total of 5x the dmg).

ppl…pls no more discussion who is better etc. Just stay on the topic…..please let us stop the nonsense. It is irrelevant.

Outreach to who?
They had large population to begin with and chased them away by bad design.
Now you want to reach for them without fixing anything in essence?
Game is dominated by downstate management and aoe spam and people decided to ‘spread out’ (on other games).

Masternewbz.4953:

Mufa.1326:

Masternewbz.4953:

Nothing to see here,

just a spamming stealth newbie thief who thinks hes good.

Cries dying to eles 1v1.

Ellen, we both know where you are compared to me. You got destroyed by me in duels on any class you brought (yes d/d elementalist included).
Now, do not embarrass yourself further, and do not derail the topic with irrelevant nonsense. This topic is not about my or your skill. You are free to go and continue thinking you are a great player, noone cares. Just try to stay on topic.

I lol’d to this.

Idk why you are lying to yourself.

Everyone knows and have seen and will witness over and over again how I am better than you 1v1.

I will even frap it 1 day so I can stop redueling you everytime to prove something that is obvious.

Also this whole post is kind of invalid due to comming from a biased opinion from a person who plays only 1 class, 1 build and will post anything just to favour him on his own spec and playing style, wich is spam stealth with a weak backstab.

Eh?
Look, if it makes it easier to live with yourself when you delude yourself to think you are better, then go ahead by all means.

I always laughed about how pathetic it is that you treasure screenshot of one of the rare times you actually downed me in a duel. If I was saving the screenshots of downing you in duels, my hard drive would run out of space.

Now can you please stop flooding topic with irrelevant nonsense?

Try to discuss the design principle. (you know the topic)

Arheundel.6451:

Mufa.1326:

Arheundel.6451:

Aoe dmg is the only counter to stealth spammers, when Anet will re-desing stealth to work like in other games then we’ll talk about aoes, in other games stealth professions cannot bot stealth every 2s making impossible to target them.
In other games you’re allowed to stealth for a sneak attack and then can only re-stealth outside combat.
In the profession description is clearly stated that stealth professions can be countered..and the OP is a backstab thief( check his previosu posts), he’ just whining about counters to his stealth spamming while calling noobs aoe class users and pro those who play stealth spammers

Sorry but you are going into unnecessary details that obscure the issue.

The crux of the issue is this:
Despite the stealth mechanic, everyone knows d/d elementalist is stronger 1v1 than d/d thief for example (at the same skill level).
Then elementalist’s dmg scales up to 5x in group fights and d/d thief’s does not scale at all.
That is simply ridiculously bad design.

You want to derail discussion into discussion on ‘fairness’ of this or that mechanic, but that is actually irrelevant. If thieves even with stealth still lose to d/d eles in 1v1 at the same skill level, then obviously it is irrelevant to discuss each individual skill and mechanic. Result is what it is, and it is wrong.

You should stay on topic and not try to derail it with irrelevant details. I know you want to protect the insanely bad design of your class, but that is not good for the game.

You should really discuss the principle and if you agree or disagree with it. Everyone knows that shatter mesmers and d/d elementalists violate the principle.

Really?
Shatter mesmer are glass cannon and a d/d ele doing dmg is not a bunker and his HP reach 20% after a single backstab+heart seeker…the bunker d/d deal max 800 dmg with ring of fire and not d/d doesn’t win automatically against thieves…maybe the common BS spammer but that’s hardly the only thief build and it’s not for 1vs1 either, there is the sword/pistol build played by many thieves who got no troubles against d/d ( the hot join ones)

JUst uploaded videos of shortbow thief and pistol thieves along with aoe attack like death blossom, this skill is not aoe am I right? and what about caltrops aren’t those aoe as well?

Again I think you are out of topic.
Also I think you are clueless if you think that death blossom and caltrops compare to d/d ele or shatter mesmer aoe.
You are also clueless if you think that death blossom/caltrops thief can compare to d/d ele or shatter mesmer 1v1.
That thief essentially stacks one/two conditions which are extremely easily removed with very little condition removal so his dmg is very easily completely negated.

Masternewbz.4953:

Nothing to see here,

just a spamming stealth newbie thief who thinks hes good.

Cries dying to eles 1v1.

Ellen, we both know where you are compared to me. You got destroyed by me in duels on any class you brought (yes d/d elementalist included).
Now, do not embarrass yourself further, and do not derail the topic with irrelevant nonsense. This topic is not about my or your skill. You are free to go and continue thinking you are a great player, noone cares. Just try to stay on topic.

Arheundel.6451:

Thieves lacking aoe dmg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlWzXy1ZQVI&list=PLBF2912D72F052EC7&index=39

Thief single target dmg +aoe dmg in a single build
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYZ_fBP8TmI

And all this is nothing much a small fraction of what thief does

Are you serious?
wvw and hotjoin videos. Hotjoin video is from oct15 before thief aoe got 15% nerf. LOL

Arheundel.6451:

Aoe dmg is the only counter to stealth spammers, when Anet will re-desing stealth to work like in other games then we’ll talk about aoes, in other games stealth professions cannot bot stealth every 2s making impossible to target them.
In other games you’re allowed to stealth for a sneak attack and then can only re-stealth outside combat.
In the profession description is clearly stated that stealth professions can be countered..and the OP is a backstab thief( check his previosu posts), he’ just whining about counters to his stealth spamming while calling noobs aoe class users and pro those who play stealth spammers

Sorry but you are going into unnecessary details that obscure the issue.

The crux of the issue is this:
Despite the stealth mechanic, everyone knows d/d elementalist is stronger 1v1 than d/d thief for example (at the same skill level).
Then elementalist’s dmg scales up to 5x in group fights and d/d thief’s does not scale at all.
That is simply ridiculously bad design.

You want to derail discussion into discussion on ‘fairness’ of this or that mechanic, but that is actually irrelevant. If thieves even with stealth still lose to d/d eles in 1v1 at the same skill level, then obviously it is irrelevant to discuss each individual skill and mechanic. Result is what it is, and it is wrong.

You should stay on topic and not try to derail it with irrelevant details. I know you want to protect the insanely bad design of your class, but that is not good for the game.

You should really discuss the principle and if you agree or disagree with it. Everyone knows that shatter mesmers and d/d elementalists violate the principle.

Just a copy of the post from other topic that contributes to this one:

Question from XYZ:

… Tell me what the problem with AoE is? ….

Answer:
Well, there are many problems about scaling of AOE dmg, AOE (and single target) cc, invuls from 1v1 to 5v5. I will write a post about those and link it here.

For now I will just answer your question about AOE dmg. Problem is very simple to see:
It is about scaling from 1v1 to 5v5 and where AOE and single target dmg classes/builds are relative to each other in 1v1 and 5v5.
AOE and single target dmg scale very differently from 1v1 to 5v5. It is obvious, currently aoe class can do up to 5x ‘their dmg on signle target’ in team fights (if they catch 5 guys into their aoe).

<cleanup>, AOE class should be somewhat stronger in team fights and somewhat weaker in 1v1.

However, <cleanup> , here is the issue:
Take for example single target dmg build like d/d thief and AOE dmg build like d/d elementalist.
Let us say, for the sake of argument, that 1v1 those two are balanced (although we all know ele owns thief 1v1 at the same skill lvl).
So how can they be ‘equal’ at 1v1 when in group fights d/d elementalist’s dmg can scale up to 5x while d/d thief’s will stay the same??? Why would anyone pick single target dmg build unless he really likes to play certain class/style (build) and decide to overcome disadvantage though the skill?

So how to fix this?
Assume that they are balanced now 1v1. Then you should (for example, numbers are approximate) nerf AOE class’ dmg about 20% to about 80% where it is now. That way AOE dmg class will be somewhat weaker than single target dmg class in 1v1.

But you still cannot make them do up to 5×0.8=4 times more dmg in 5v5 fight fight. That is way too unbalanced. You also make diminishing returns on their AOE dmg: You half the dmg for each additional target. So if they hit 2 ppl at once, they do 1.2 dmg of d/d thief. If they hit 3 ppl at once they do 1.4 dmg of thief and if they hit 4 and 5 ppl they do 1.5 and 1.55 dmg of thief. That way, in team fights AOE build does, on average, up to 55% more dmg than single target build, i.e they do up to 1.55 dmg of single target build. If they catch only 2 ppl in their AOE they still do 20% more dmg. So 5 single target builds against 5 aoe builds would have significant barrier to overcome when they are forced into big team fights. On other other hand, if they force them to spread and into many 1v1s then they should have advantage.

In 2v2 they should be about equal (aoe build will do 1.2 dmg of single target build if it catches 2 ppl into aoe).
But in 1v1s they do only 0.8 dmg of single target bild, so if they are strategically forced into lots of 1v1s they would be at disadvantage.

They way they made aoe builds now is that they are actually in advantage in both 1v1 and big fights. In big fights they do up to 5x the dmg and in 1v1 they do about the same dmg (actually they are stronger in 1v1 than single target builds but let us say they are balanced).

<cleanup>. Game is actually much more balanced at 1v1 lvl than at 5v5. This is despite their claim that they balance for 5v5 (really??? lol). And even at 1v1 game is quite imbalanced, just imbalanced in the wrong direction (builds bringing ton of aoe being stronger than single target ones).

Keep in mind that AOE has many advantages. Like, let us say 5 single target melee is playing against 5 ranged AOE builds. If they focus on one AOE guy in big team fight, the teammates of AOE guy (together with him) can just spam aoe around their guy being focused. So 5 single target guys either have to eat that 5x dmg each, or they need to back off from AOE spam, which has the same effect as making their dmg zero (i.e. providing invulnerability to their AOE teammate being focused).

This puts single target melee builds (and in general melee builds) at severe disadvantage. They are essentially pigeonholed into gimicky burst builds that allow them to stay as short time as possible next to a target do their dmg and gtfo.

AOE guys do not suffer this disadvantage. They can focus their fire on one single-target guy and not expose the whole team to simultaneous dmg from all 5 enemies.

And there are so many other nuances I can talk about, but I think this is more than enough to explain the basics of the problem.

Kardiamond.6952:

And what about class that have only acces to AoE?

We won’t ever be able to 1vs1 someone because we have lower damage?

First, I said ‘slightly’, so that it can be bridged with decent skill gap.

Second, it is their own claim they are balancing the game for 5v5. So in the context of 5v5, you would be contributing slightly more in team fights and slightly less when forced into 1v1. That is why you should try to find urself more in group fight situations (force them through the strategy).

Third, you have access to both AOE and single target builds/classes, so you should pick whatever you prefer.

What I claim is that it is totally unbalanced to let aoe class/build be stronger than single target class/build and then let AOE scale linearly in team fights (5x dmg on 5 guys). Why would anyone ever bring single target class/build into team at the same skill level.

So here is a design principle for MMOs that ANET designers failed hard:
You cannot let AOE class/build to be comparable or stronger than single target class/build in 1v1 and then let AOE dmg scale linearly (5x dmg on 5 targets) for team fights.
AOE class/build needs to be slightly weaker than single target class/build in 1v1 and slightly stronger in team fights (only achievable through diminishing returns on multiple targets of AOE dmg).

/discuss

MakeitNeil.4561:

Here is the reality about the Asura race. They were made to be small, annoying little beasts that everyone loves. I, personally, love the Asura race. I roll a Thief Asura who uses Black Powder —> Hartseeker --> Backstab. One word to you, chill. I never have a problem using Backstab on Asuras. I am perfectly fine with the race. I am actually happy that they implemented Asuras in the game. If you were a former Guild Wars 1 player, you would be glad that they added this race in the game. Furthermore, making them bigger in sPvP would be pathetic. The Asura race was adored in Guild Wars 1 because they were short, cute, little beasts. To take that away from them just because some people have no fighting skill vs. the particular race would be a pathetic choice. Agan, I’ve killed Asuras many times. The hardest kills are elementalists like Crypticrage or Dante, however, the reason I stalemate with those type of characters isn’t because I can’t hit them in the back with Backstab. It is because they sacrificed all thier damage to heal and tank out a storm. My advice to you my friend is learn to fight the class. Talk to someone like Soko D Mudo. I’ve seen him own Asuras many times. I, myself can easily destroy an Asura with Backstab. Practice makes perfect my friend.

You do realize you told me I lack skill and then told me to go ask myself (see my signature) for advice on how to improve?
Priceless.

I cannot believe this topic goes on and on. I think it reflects on the quality of the community.
What is there to discuss here really?

It is an option dude. I do not give a kitten about the lore (what lore?).
I just want to see the enemy so I can kill him, interrupt him, properly backstab him.

This came out of the discussion on asura models in spvp (someone else’s idea but so good we can start topic on it since the old one got crowded with nonsense):

Give us an option to turn all the enemies into single (average size human) model.
It would be a plus if you made the model (for enemies) customizable.

That way ppl playing asuras can still see themselves as asuras, while the rest of us will see them as average size humans (or whatever we customize if it is customizable).

Please support this ppl.

Just to prevent meaningless QQ in advance: Note that it will be an OPTION. So if you prefer to see your enemies in all their ‘diversity’ you just do not use it.

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Sigh…It’s in no doubt your opinion. I don’t have trouble with it you do, (apparently). But wait there’s more. Now you are going to say you have never had a hard time seeing an Asura animation. Get your story straight.

And please elaborate how they can enlarge models with out cause rendering bugs with models causing more animation issues, and delaying more features. Please TELL ME.

It is not an opinion, everyone knows asura models give advantage. My story is straight and your ‘now you re going to say…’ nonsense is stupid. Do not put words in my mouth then tell me to get my story straight.

I do not care how they solve the problem:
1. if enlarging models is a problem, then let them switch model to human.
2. the best idea so far is just above: give us an option to turn all enemies to human model. Ppl who play asura will still see themselves as asuras, but I will see them as human models…..DONE!

Jonwar.9205:

…. Make an option to display all enemies as human……..

Yup, did not see this before, this is a great idea.

Divus.3175, topic is not about you and what will happen with you.

First mesmer burst is also AOE, so they would also get nerf.

Second, necros are in general weaker class in 1v1 so maybe they would not get any nerf or much weaker nerf for their ‘first target AOE dmg’ than elementalists or mesmers. Of course all AOE builds should get nerf in the sense of diminishing returns on multiple target (in other words their scaling from 1v1 to 5v5 should not be 5x but much weaker).

Third: Yes, if AOE was to get nerfed properly, many current AOE spammers who are pathetic players would stop being ‘viable’ in their teams. But that is due to their lack of skill, not really a balance problem.

I put clear guidelines up there: You cannot make AOE build stronger (or comparable) than single target build in 1v1 and then let AOE build scale for up to 5x dmg while other does not scale at all.
You need to make them weaker in dmg on single target, and then scale them up with diminishing returns. Something like 0.8→1.2→1.4 → 1.5 → 1.55 is much more reasonable. That way AOE builds are not too weak 1v1 but not too strong either in group fights. It is just that team of single target dmg builds has advantage if it spreads the fight into many 1v1s, and has disadvantage if it fights 3v3 or larger. For 2v2s they are balanced.

I believe I clearly explained how current situation makes single target dmg and melee builds at severe disadvantage in the game. And of course you still see them here and there but that is because some players just want to play certain build and overcome the gap with skill, not because game is where it should be.

Existence of the ‘downstate’ is not an issue, but numbers should be significantly tweaked.
It cannot dominate the fight as it currently does. Game is advertised for its ‘upstate’ , and that is where the skills are. Then you negate that completely with 0.5 sec rez that relies on single button click after the teammate going down runs to his team.

And then there is scaling of AOE from 1v1 to 5v5. AOE builds are comparable to single target dmg builds in 1v1 and then they just insanely scale to 5v5 (up to 5x the dmg) while single target dmg builds still do the same dmg whether there is 1 or 5 ppl around the dmg area. Just insanely bad design.

Narcarsis.5739:

Vyndetta.9415:

Attrition thief: N/a(lf the build pst)

Rainbow Unicorn Death Blossom: http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-c33V-BFSwk0-S5FOkd0;9;6TJJ;437A19-26-KZV8-BX4jwmAjwmA2Fe

That is not attrition d/p

Saital.4819:

Mufa.1326:

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Ride the Lightning does not drop the orb. Attempting to stealth or being combo’d into stealth does not drop the orb. The stealth just fails, with IMMUNE text.

So you are telling me, I can perma stealth and carry the orb around while noone can see me? Interesting.
Will I be marked on the mini map or will I truly be invisible?

Ride the Lightning does not drop the orb. Attempting to stealth or being combo’d into stealth does not drop the orb. The stealth just fails, with IMMUNE text.

The stealth just fails, with IMMUNE text.

stealth just fails

fails

yes, that was understood 5 posts above yours, I corrected myself and understood correctly his statement.

Transistor.8746:

I made my asura warrior the smallest size it could be because I liked the way it looked and was integral to my character’s identity. I even have the word “micro” as part of my char name.

Following character creation, I leveled her 1-80 and proceeded to get 100% world completion. It was only after this and getting a good feel for all the different possible weapon sets/utility skills that I felt prepared to enter the competitive environment of sPvP. And now you want to change my char’s identity so that you can feel better about not missing a backstab?

Sorry, no.

Let’s wait for this to become a real e-sport first before we start making excuses for our performance shall we?

Do you think stupid kitten like that is more important than game’s quality?

Just because you decided to call yourself ‘micro’ the rest of the players should not be able to recognize your animation, not able to react to what you do, and not be able to properly hit you from the back even though they lose 75% of dmg because of that????
Just wow….you can follow that ‘identity’ in pve and wvw, but in spvp there is really no place for that stupid stuff.
If ANET does not pay attention to these things, they will keep adding up to the frustration until spvp is dead. Wait…it already is dead….

DieQuex.4096:

Mufa.1326:

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Ride the Lightning does not drop the orb. Attempting to stealth or being combo’d into stealth does not drop the orb. The stealth just fails, with IMMUNE text.

So you are telling me, I can perma stealth and carry the orb around while noone can see me? Interesting.
Will I be marked on the mini map or will I truly be invisible?

Stealth does not work when you attempt to use stealth skills or combo fields. I asked this due to the fact that perma-stealth would be incredibly cheesy with this new game mechanic added on the map.

I c, you will just not be able to stealth but you do not drop the orb.

It is interesting they let ele RTL though….just one big LoL at them.

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Ride the Lightning does not drop the orb. Attempting to stealth or being combo’d into stealth does not drop the orb. The stealth just fails, with IMMUNE text.

So you are telling me, I can perma stealth and carry the orb around while noone can see me? Interesting.
Will I be marked on the mini map or will I truly be invisible?

That is a problem of bad match-making system.

To simplify:
In a proper matchmaking system you should play one game against guy in a group ‘below’ you (random choice from group of about 10 qued teams ranked below you) in order to give them chance to advance in ranking (for example take your spot if they win) and then then play one game against guy in a group ‘above’ you (random choice from the group of about 10 qued teams ranked above you) so that you can get ranked higher.

Of course it does not have to be one up one down, it can be random but on average 50% of ‘up games’ and 50% of ‘down’ games.

Ppl getting stuck playing the same team over and over means either: super low population or badly designed matchmaking.

Given how clueless ANET seems to be about things analytical, I would put my bet on the second case.

Vyndetta.9415:

Attrition thief: N/a(lf the build pst)

I am not a sharing person

suggestion: do not make stupid posts like this
Everyone thinks they are the best players, just as everyone thinks they are smart and beautiful. Reality is quite different though.

dreztina.4820:

I don’t consider this a gamebreaking issue, and certainly won’t play that kitten looking race to take advantage of it, but there is a disparity there. I have yet to see any teams rolling around with five Asura though, so it can’t be THAT big of a deal.

You are right, it is not THAT big of a deal. It is smaller than some other more important issues. It still is an issue. It simply disadvantages certain builds more than others and it is in general unfair advantage. That is all.
Ppl trying to dismiss the issue are just running asuras themselves and arguing for their own interest instead of thinking what is the best thing for the game going forward.

LoL, I do not have problem killing asuras. That is not what topic is about.
Also, I own caed, foo. Cannot take lessons from someone that I consider a joke.
And third caed is completely different build. He is burst and uses basilisk, so of course he does not have a problem hitting stunned target. He does not need to backstab repeatedly moving targets like I do.

Khalifahaze.6045:

Yes I get owned by some nobody on the forums…please continue with the QQ because you can’t kill asuras.

And the “nonsense” you speak of is the waste of space this thread is taking up.

Yes you do own you, and I do it a lot. We can test any time you like so you can realize what a nothing you are. You are quite a crappy player and all that is carrying you in team fights is the fact that, as necro, you can spam AOE.

I can kill asuras, that is not an issue so stop inventing crap. Problem is that asuras get unfair advantage compared to other models. The same player will be significantly more difficult to kill for certain builds/classes when the player is using asura as opposed to other models. That is the crux of the issue.

EoNxBoNx.9213:

It’s not nonsense dude it’s the truth. You want them to increase the size of the Asura model, to maybe about the human model? Right? Okay well the skeletal structure of that model is going to have to completely scrapped and redone. Doing this is going to take months and only get in the way of more important features that are in the pipe,( as Jsharp says).

So, it is completely and utterly pointless to even ask for this. when it won’t come for the next, I don’t know 6 months? Maybe? Not even to mention in tPvP setting, you will have 1v1, and you should see him coming. Let’s be real, if you can’t see a warrior charging you or, a thief casting his signet/Basilisk Venom etc , that’s NMP, or Anet’s.

Just play more idk, be more aware.

I do not need to play more, I do not need to be more aware, I can own you easily 1v1, I do not have problem 1v1-ing anyone in the game, it is not about me. It is simply an issue of nerfing certain classes/builds via model choice.

If they cannot make them large due to technical reasons, very simply just transfer them into other models when they go into spvp. I said I do not care what they do, what I do care is that one can easily tell which way model is facing and that animations be easily recognizable.

Vyndetta’s guide on how to counter vyndetta. Too funny … do i have 15 char?

Who are these people saying they have zero problems backstabbing (properly?) asuras?
Are we talking constantly moving/turning target that is not stunned always repositioning and dodging?
Or are we talking noob level play where people stand for few seconds at the time and cast their stuff while static?
There is no freaking way that you have no problem even in 1v1, and in group fights it is laughable how bad things become.
If ANET wants the game ‘to be based on animations’, then they need to make them reasonably clear, and part of that is having large enough models (not just hitboxes).

Making models large enough so there is no ambiguity about direction they face and animations they do is fine with me. I do not care if someone likes to look like kitten.

jportell.2197:

Mufa.1326:

1. jportell.2197 : I do not understand how can someone only see his own benefit (you run asura) and not that of the game? This is VERY detrimental to the success of the game. If we all start running smallest asuras, that will severely decrease skill relevance in the game since you cannot recognize animations.
2. ppl are talking about ‘banning’ the race. Noone would be banned, I think they should just turn asuras automatically to humans (or race of player’s choice) when they step into spvp. Noone gets banned, you just do not get unfair advantage in spvp.
3. NinjaED: It is not issue with ‘targeting’. You misunderstood my original post. Issue is to know which way they are facing so they can be properly back stabbed (into the back for much higher dmg instead of the front).

It seems like the only profession that really has a problem with it is thieves. And don’t you have basilisk venom that turns your target to stone? Seems pretty easy to just get behind your target after that. If you still refuse to use that then it is an L2P issue. And animation for things like CnD is really obvious no matter the race if a thief is strolling up to you and is VISIBLE then guess what a CnD is coming. And poor thieves have an issue landing a BS because someone is smaller HA. You want to talk about people seeing their own benefit? You are clearly posting with your own interests in mind hence the “I can’t 100% land a backstab because I can’t tell where the front is” statement that you OPENED the post with. My asura is the tallest you can make it and is almost as tall as the shortest human or sylvari.

Some clueless noob trolling on forums all day long telling me L2P. Funny.
Backstab thieves are put at the biggest disadvantage with this nonsense. However, every class will have issues with lack of animation recognition. It is stupid to largely neutralize skill of the enemy by making model so small his animations as well as direction he is facing are not recognizable.
I am posting ‘for my benefit’ and I do not hide it, but also clearly for the benefit of the game.
I think it is nonsensical to put positioning attack into the game but, at the same time, allow models that are so small and look like little balls that you cannot recognize which side is front and which is the back.
And I do not have basilisk and have no problem landing my backstabs on normal models. But with asura I simply cannot tell most of the time which direction they are facing. Other ppl complain they cannot recognize animations. How is that acceptable?

1. jportell.2197 : I do not understand how can someone only see his own benefit (you run asura) and not that of the game? This is VERY detrimental to the success of the game. If we all start running smallest asuras, that will severely decrease skill relevance in the game since you cannot recognize animations.
2. ppl are talking about ‘banning’ the race. Noone would be banned, I think they should just turn asuras automatically to humans (or race of player’s choice) when they step into spvp. Noone gets banned, you just do not get unfair advantage in spvp.
3. NinjaED: It is not issue with ‘targeting’. You misunderstood my original post. Issue is to know which way they are facing so they can be properly back stabbed (into the back for much higher dmg instead of the front).