Guild Wars 2

The name Viirastra somehow reminds me of Valharantha, the Speaker for the Snow Leopard in Hoelbrak. I feel that they have the same sort of hindu-like vibe to me.

However, I highly doubt Viirastra is a Norn. Perhaps she is a creature form the Mists who somehow saw an Havroun walking into the Mists and reacted to him/her by trying to mimic him. Or she may have a very different origin, the Mists being still quite mysterious, and even more so for the Fractals.

Just a question ; is it necessary to have HoT to play PoF ? Some friends are interested in the latter, but they don’t have the former.

Drop the kittening puzzles. I suck at it. I wanted to play Ep6 a lot. Now, I don’t even want to launch it ever again, because the very first gate is a kittening puzzles, something I can’t pass, no matter how hard I try. Spending 45 minutes on this kitten is not fun. Spending 45 minutes trying to understand a logic which is incredibly different from mine is not fun.

There isn’t any enigma, here, just absolute boredom and joy killer. Please; drop that kitten ANet. i won’t buy an expansion full of this kind of horrors.

Edit : Seriously, have the NPC tell us what to do ! Do we need to snuff out all the lights (did once, nothing happened), make three in a row glow (what I saw on a guide), anything else ?

Something tells me that Balthazar has been ousted by Menzies or another entity who defeated him and claimed the role of God of War, but in a not honourable way, hence precipitating him toward his current actions. At least, it would make sense of his behaviour.

But they did (or does) have towns and bastions outside of the known maps ? If they are New Kryta they have to have some secret bases to raise their army, right ?

Talking about the other place from where Velazquez was born, I begin to wonder if it wasn’t some hidden White Mantle nation, from the north-west of Kryta-North of the Jungle. Those guys have an incredibly high number of soldiers, especially for a faction split down between Caudecus and Lazarus, and I can’t see them all being from Kryta or Ascalon, because the bandits weren’t mostly Mantles and they, like the Separatists, have been trimmed down for years now.

Slowpokeking, I sometimes wonder if you are not trolling. Seriously, how hard is that to grasp what draw and me tried to explain : there is a difference between accepting the possibility to die in battle or to suffer unwanted suffering from the mere presence of your gods in battle. It is another to accept the cold-blooded murder of your friends.

You said it yourself, the Mursaat wanted souls for their batteries keeping the Door of Komalie closed. They killed some of Saul’s soldiers because they knew that those ones weren’t fanatical or stone-hearted enough to sacrifice hundred of their kinsmen and women in return of temporal power. Those who had proven to be able of such cruel behaviour were spared, such as Hablion. Kind of what the Traitor Legions did in the Horus Heresy (on Istvaan IV) if you’re into the Black Library novels of the Horus Heresy (40K lore)

Saul was, however, a very different tool. A broken man, he had been remade as a hero for the purpose of the Mursaats. He would have allowed them ever greater power over the Krytans, but when he saw them for what they were, he backed away. It is probably one of the cases where the Mursaats misjudged humans. They had assumed that Saul was fanatical enough in his worship of them to accept anything, and were wrong.

But they still needed him. No man could replace Saul d’Alessio in their machinations, he was needed, hence why they seized him and spread lies of his death will trying to convert him anew. HaD they succeed, they would basically have had a warrior Jesus returning to his people. no opposition would have managed to snatch away the peoples from Saul and the White Mantle, especially if the Unseen Ones had ordered Hablion and the others to make at least some appearance of penitence for being “too harsh”.

And Saul wasn’t angry, he was broken. He probably thought that the sight of the Mursaat would drive his soldiers insane if they weren’t worthy enough. Perhaps he believed that it would burn their eyes and sear their flesh, kind of like the true bodies of the Olympian Gods and Goddesses did when revealed to mortals. What he did not expect was his gods killing his friends for the sole crime of having seen them. That’s a whole other thing.

Even the Shining Blade though that Saul had died. Him returning, proving himself to be Saul, a man well-loved by the common Krytan (he did save their country when their king and his family had fled and let their kingdom go to hell). Him returning would also have reinvigorated the common rank and file Mantle soldiers : their beloved leader back from the dead, stronger than before (he would have been imbued with more power) would have galvanized them. They wouldn’t have feared death anymore, making them far more dangerous enemies.

It is actually a testament to Saul’s true devotion to his people and Kryta that he endured such a grueling fate for more than 250 years. That man, despite being played by the Mursaat, saved his kingdom twice, first by repelling the Charr, and a second time by resisting the Unseen Ones’ tortures, which indirectly deprived the Mantle of an untarnished leader. What if Hablion and the others had become corrupt ? Saul d’Alessio would have been a living legend at that time, a man so dedicated to his people that even death wouldn’t have managed to come back to fight for Kryta.

Think about it : the common Krytan didn’t know much about the Mantle, the Shining Blade, the Mursaat and all that. But he knew Saul d’Alessio, and he probably knew that the Mantle had said that he was in the most wonderful paradise possible for his devotion. It would have undermined most of the Shining Blade propaganda efforts in favor of Salma.

I hope that we’ll see the memory of Saul being revealed into the larger game and actually be liked. The man was no Deceiver, he was more the Deceived and he paid a terrible price for it.

Ider.1276:

coso.9173:

Braham will probably redeem himself from this, but he feels like he has more substance now, even if he is dead wrong on mostly everything.

No thanks. If his actions will lead to nornocide I personaly don’t want him to be redeemed. Deaths of the thouthands can’t be redeemed by “I’m sorry, boss” or even by “heroic” sacrifice. For me, this is the line. If Verdant Brink 2.0 happens, Braham’s legend should be put near Svanir’s, making his name a curse.

Sadly, this.

If Braham actually had a plan, or even hinted at the beginning of a plan, it wouldn’t be so bad. “I’ll convince the Spirits to join the fight” would have sufficed, because he would have added tremendous power to his “forces” beyond what will probably mostly young and reckless Norns (with the odd old and bitter hunter willing to go and face Jormag no matter what).

But it isn’t what transpired in the cave. What happened was Braham saying “Screw plans and patience, I’m running at Jormag full speed, with as many hunters as I can muster and we’ll kill him”. No true plan, no reflection about how to reach the Dragon or survive lands so cold even a Svanir more than 80% Icebrood need an elixir to endure the cold. No idea where Jormag is in the blizzard, how to ensure that his forces get food and medicine supply lines, or how to approach Dragon unnoticed until the last moments.

Braham’s will lead a lot of Norn to their doom (and it won’t even be the first time Norns endure grievous losses in GW2, most of the named character who died during the Orr Campaign where Norns) and I really don’t see how ANet could redeem him after it. Or, if they make him succeed, it will just feel (to me that is) as a way to hasten the plot of the Elder Dragons demise, so the game could move on to other enemies and regions. And it would be really infuriating to miss the kill of Jormag when he is the dragon I’ve wanted to kill the most for years, now.

What I find sad is that Trahearne died when I felt he was a very compelling and sympathetic character, while Braham is becoming insufferable while I really liked him in the HoT and previous LS. I hope that if ANet truly wants to go down this road, as is its right, they’ll introduce a new iconic Norn character, which should be a lot better thought out than Braham, without being an Eir 2.0.

Yes, there is a Wolf Havroun. Well, the previous one died during the PS of the Norn character and his apprentice was in coma by then, but after the years spent in-game between those events and those of the LS3, I think she should have become a full Havroun.

There should also be a new Havroun for Bear, since the previous one died during the Orr campaign.

What i find a little sad about Braham is, because he is one of the most prominent Norn in-game, people assumes he represents the usual Norn. And yet, ANet has shown us a very different side of them multiple times :

This one is an ambiant dialogue in Bear’s Lodge in Hoelbrak

Shaman Ursel: Why have you come to Bear’s lodge, my friend?
Bann: I need Bear’s counsel, shaman. I face an enemy that I seem unable to defeat.
Shaman Ursel: I see. Will you tell everyone gathered about this enemy?
Bann: Yes, if it is Bear’s will.
Shaman Ursel: All within range, listen, for I suspect this brave hunter has a tale we should all hear.
Shaman Ursel: Tell us about this enemy that has you so defeated.
Bann: (clears throat) I was out in the Borealis Forest, not far from here, and I came across an enraged broodmother.
Bann: I tracked it for a while. I was in a dominant position, until it caught my scent and attacked.
Bann: When the fight was over, the broodmother and its offspring lay dead, scattered in the underbrush.
Shaman Ursel: But… you said that you could not defeat your foe.
Bann: It’s true. My enemy is not the broodmother or her ravenous kits.
Bann: My enemy is the wound I suffered during the fight. It can’t be healed. I can’t hunt. I can’t do anything.
Bann: I’m less than half what I was, and I don’t know how to overcome it.
Shaman Ursel: I understand your challenge, and Bear has a lesson that’ll give you comfort, if you’re ready to learn it.
Bann: I’m ready.
Shaman Ursel: Bear teaches us about the seasons. We have spring, winter, summer, and autumn.
Shaman Ursel: In the spring, the bears awaken, find mates, and form families. In summer, they teach their cubs to survive.
Shaman Ursel: In autumn, they hunt, and the forest belongs to them. In winter, THEY belong to the forest.
Shaman Ursel: In life, we also have seasons that we must respect. Your season has changed, but you’re no less part of the forest.
Bann: I think I understand.
Shaman Ursel: Don’t try to walk autumn’s path in winter. Bear has given you a new mantle to wear and new challenges to overcome.

And those three comes from Raven’s Lodge

Raven Shaman: Why have you come to Raven’s lodge only to lurk in shadow?
Marit Tonleig: I’m unworthy of Raven’s gaze. I passed on false information and, because of it, hunters died for no reason.
Raven Shaman: Did you bring a symbol of your shame?
Marit Tonleig: I brought three stones stained with the blood of those who were killed.
Raven Shaman: Good. Put two of them with Raven’s treasures, and keep the other to remind you always of your mistake.
Raven Shaman: You’re only unworthy in Raven’s eyes if you don’t learn from your missteps. Raven rewards the clever and sincere.

Raven Shaman: Hello. I’ve been waiting for you. Raven informed me you were coming.
Dievi Witmerk: I’m surprised that Raven would consider me worth mentioning.
Raven Shaman: You’re one of his chosen. Surely you know that by now.
Dievi Witmerk: I know I’m stronger of mind than of body and that I’ve been blessed with a seed of Raven’s sight.
Raven Shaman: You know yourself. Now, it’s time for you to know Raven. Your apprenticeship begins immediately.
Raven Shaman: First, entrust your most cherished possession to Raven. Later, you will learn to trust him with your life as well.

Roldar Halvvei: Shaman, I need Raven’s favor. My mother is losing her memories.
Raven Shaman: Raven’s favor must be earned. What deeds have you done recently that would please him?
Roldar Halvvei: I tracked vicious jotun back to their den. They had captured a handful of humans.
Roldar Halvvei: There were too many, so instead of attacking them, I injured several moas and used them as bait.
Roldar Halvvei: When the jotun went to attack the moas, I rescued the prisoners. And I took a horn from the den, for Raven.
Raven Shaman: Put the horn with Raven’s treasures, and I will tell Raven of your mother’s need.
_______________________

I really hope that some of those cultural traits will appear the next time we see Braham and the Norns, it would be great for this race to not be painted as the overgrown and stupid humans they sometimes appear to be…

Per chance, would you remember where Griffon as a Spirit was mentioned ?

Also, I really like your interpretation of Karka. As a Spirit, I think that it would be really hard to contact and convince to grant boons, but the powers It could bestow upon an hunter could be great indeed, especially near the sea. The others spirits you proposed are also quite interesting, i think that they could well represent all thos traits you described.

As for the Saurians, I could see something like this :

For the Bristleback, family, protection and proactive action to defend oneself and his kin. After all, in the jungle, there is many case of an adult Bristleback defending her spawns by attacking the player if he is near by.

For the Smokescale, deception, misdirection and viciousness, since those creatures really like to strike from odd angle while blinding their prey.

All in all, Spirits tied to those creatures would be hard-pressed to answer prayers, either because they never had anyone calling for them, or because they could be even less inclined that other Spirits to help, considering the environment their “species” thrive.

Tropical beasts’ Spirits could well be called by Norns living in Lion Arch or the southern half of Timberline Fall, if they have settled here since a long time. Snow Leopard probably can’t grant much gifts so far in the South of Tyria.

As we know, the Norns believe that there exist Spirits of the Wild everywhere, who can be of animals or things (Mountain is a Spirit just like Bear, at least it was said so in the Norn Week prior to the launch of GW2). And in HoT, they ventured into a far-flung land. Do you think that some may have felt the tinge of some unknown Spirit of the Wild there ?

Ameyalli, the goddess of the Itzel and Nuhocs is a lot like the Spirits of the Wild in that she is the Jungle and its “nature”, like Bear is the spirits of bears and represent there nature. I think it could be possible for some Norns, especially if they are truly devoted/spiritual, to actually adopt Ameyalli in their beliefs. Other creatures may have brought the attention of the Norns, like the Smokescales, Arrowhead, Vampires, Brisleback, etc.

If so, which virtues or knowledge do you think those creatures (and possible the Karka) would come to embody ?

Edit : More generally, a lot of creatures in central Tyria are unaccounted for when it comes to the Spirits of the Wild (at least to my knowledge), such as the griffons or skelk.

I’ve read some interesting point on reddit about Braham’s situation. Basically, after Moredremoth’s demise he was alone for some times and had time to think. It is possible that he came to the conclusion that Eir could have been saved if the Pact Commander hadn’t spent his time talking, and thinking, but instead dove with him and Rytlock deep into the Jungle.

Basically, he is angry at us for having waited and spent time allying with the Itzel in Verdant Brink. And out character isn’t able to react strongly against him because of what happened (the death by hiw own hands of his friend Trahearne, the death of Eir, the whole campaign in the Jungle and its many deaths, etc.). The problem is, if ANet truly wanted to go that way, they should have made it clear, something like that :

Braham : Alone in the Shiverpeaks, I’ve had time to think. About what you did and did not do in the Jungle. My mother died because you wanted to wait, to try to gather useless informations. Who cared about the Hylek ?
Pact Commander : I… I understand why you felt that way, but Moredremoth was too dangerous. We had to had allies, we had to have more intel !
Braham : Your intel got my mother dead.

Rox : I’m sorry about Braham, boss, don’t be too angry with him, please.
Pact Commander : It’s not him I’m angry with, Rox. It’s me.
Rox : You ? Why would you feel that way ?
Pact Commander : Do you know why I chose to leave the Pact ?
Rox: Hrm… no ?
Pact Commander : Because no matter what I decided to do, people died. I had to kill Trahearne, a friend, the one person I could trust to lead us in the fight against the Elder Dragons. I’m… I’m tired Rox. I’m just tired…
Rox: I… I don’t really know what to say, boss. But keep fighting, you’re an inspiration for all who want to stand against the Dragons, you know ? You can’t let go now.
Pact Commander : Thanks you Rox.

This dialogue, instead of some we had would have went a long way to convey Braham’s point in a better way, less obscure way, would have shown why our character was unable to truly react strongly to the harsh words of the Norn (after all, taking down two Dragons, with Scarlet in between is a lot for anyone, especially when you had to confront your force of will with the mind of Mordremoth) and would have made Braham a lot more sympathetic to the player, because he wouldn’t feel so aggressive out of the blue.

Cirian.8917:

Braham will get a lot of hate for being an obnoxious, self-absorbed headstrong idiot but at this point that seems to be his character. As a norn player myself the one redeeming feature Braham managed to show was tracking down the means to make the flaming bow and crack the tooth – and in norn culture, legendary feats like that will smooth over a lot of personality defects.

I agree with your vision, but still, it makes me angry to see his plan described as totally idiotic and my commander being such a spineless idiot when talking to Braham. The Norns have the Spirits of the Wild. Four of them fought Jormag to a standstill, and they weren’t the strongest of the lot, as far as we know. The Pact Commander should be able to rally enough allies to bolster the ranks of the army hunting down Jormag, and convince the Spirits (most of them) to join the fray, which should be more than enough to take down the Dragon. Instead we’ll get more Asura bullkitten to solve the situation, which is really infuriating.

The Norns aren’t dumb brutes, they are supposed to be the most spirituals of the five Races, the ones able to find inspirations in every aspect of the natural world. But beyond the first parts of the PS of a new Norn, you won’t ever see this aspect of their societies, they are always, always, depicted as brute and dumb overgrown humans (and the Icebrood presented as Svanir in this episode were… well, what I expect from Icebrood really, but normal Svanirs aren’t that corrupted usually). And now Braham add insult to injury, because he shatters the myth of the Fang and brazenly goes out of his way to show that doing it the Norn way isn’t the way to do anything. Doing the Asura’s way is always, always, a better option.

My main is a Norn, most of my character are Norns. had I wanted to solve everything like an Asura, I would have made an Asura as a main, but I don’t like those small gremlins, I don’t like their arrogance, and I don’t like their techno-magic bullkitten. I would have been okay with a whole expansion only surrounded by Asuran if it meant hunting down Primordius. But Asurans have been instrumental in Zhaitan’s defeat, in HoT Rata Novus was important (but not essential) and in LS3 they are front and centre even when it comes to Jormag.

This is a very bad message sent by the developers, it is almost as if they are regretting the creation of the Norns (who, as a race, have lost the most named characters since the launch of the game, Orr killed a lot of them, in fact, when there was a character who had to be killed and raised as a Risen, it was almost always a Norn). I don’t like this trend, and no amount of writing by ANet will make me change my stance on it. I don’t want to solve everything with a boring Deus Ex Machina in the form of Asuran tech.

Sometimes, a fight of epic proportion between an Elder Dragon and the Spirits of Wild is the better solution.

I can’t even get explanations for why they worship Jora… supposedly, there is a chieftain who tells it somewhere, but I can’t manage to find him…

Somehow, I feel as if Braham was reenacting the story the Kodan at the foot of the Sanctuary told about the origin of the norns (the one the Kodans believe, that is) : Braham, like the Claw in the story has lost his Voice (Eir) and refuse to wait, to be patient. Now, the question is : will he end like the Kodans think the norn did (i.e. devolving into lesser beings -in Braham’s case, probably an icebrood) or will he “change the story”, so to speak ?

I think that the whole theme of this LS will be to actually forge the new Guild (I don’t remember the english name, in French it’s Gardiens de l’Eternité). So far, Taimi is increasingly arrogant, Braham belligerent and Marjory does as she pleases. Rytlock, Logan and Zojja are currently unavailable, Kasmeer is MIA and Canach still bound by duty to Anise.

I think next LS will deal with Kas, once way or another, and the next two/three episodes (if it is this long) will pave the way for the new expansion, with Braham failing in his endeavor, Marjory being played by Lazarus and Taimi being met with one catastrophic failure in her secret lab, only for the PC to actually bring them all together.

Or at least it is what I see as the only way possible to salvage the new guild. Otherwise it is stillborn.

Weli.4568:

Valmir.4590:

Then HoT killed Eir, the most iconic Norn,

I think it’s fair to say the most iconic Norn title goes to Jora

Not really anymore. Jora* is barely mentioned, even in the Norn areas or stories. Eir was front and center however.

*And ANet truly missed an opportunity to introduce Jora Jorasddotir, there is this Vigil member screaming about her in Hoelbrak since launch and still nothing about this woman. I would have favoured her to break the Fang over Braham.

The problem is that I want to hunt and kill Jormag? I’m mainly a Norn player, every other dragon I would be happy to see be killed by another than the PC. But Jormag, I’ve waited for longer than the game has been released to hunt hims down. letting Braham, a norn who clearly doesn’t want to succeed but to die in a blaze of glory, claim him would be terribly unfulfilling for me.

I’m really sad about the Norns development. they are my favourite race so far, but ANet keep mistreating them. In the PS, they died in droves in the fight against Zhaïtan. Then HoT killed Eir, the most iconic Norn, and now Braham is desacrating the legend about the Fang of the Serpent.

It’s almost as if ANet regretted adding the norns as a playable race, they don’t seem to contribute anything, no ancient magic like the humans, no chivalry drive like the Sylvari did at first (now it’s unclear what they’ll brought), no technology (the charrs) or powerful magic (the asura). Even strength is debatable, the Charrs are also incredibly strong.

I’m a bit bitter, but I really don’t like the way Jormag and the Norn’s story is going.

Yes, but it’s stupid. I don’t like Taimi’s plan. We are overcrowded with Asura, they are everywhere, worst than Sylvari. Jormag is the Norn’s Dragon, my main and most of my characters are Norns. I want to go with Braham, not oppose him. ANet trashed an event I waited for more than four years with the way they broke the Fang, and it’s a shame.

@Shiren : I know it. Still, I want to go with Braham, because it is how Norns should do thing. I don’t want another Asuran cop out to kill Jormag.

Shiren.9532:

Braham was a pita the whole way through and I honestly didn’t think he was worth the effort (I was done with him when he ran off on his own when we first entered Verdant Brink). He resented his mother for his whole life and only recently spent a few days with her and it’kittenting him this hard? Everyone is different but it seems bizarre he’d be this upset over someone he barely knows, even if its his biological mother. As he himself pointed out, plenty of people in Tyria have lost someone to the dragons, he isn’t a special snowflake for losing his mother. I’d be fine to see Jormag turn him at this point.

The biggest disappointment for me by far was the final scene. I love fantasy because of legends like the one about the tooth. I was really looking forward to seeing the norn rally behind someone who damaged the tooth and took us into a dragon campaign for of legendary feats and crazy norn tales. I expressed a while back I hoped Braham would not be the one (it’s bad enough he co-opted Eir’s story, I really didn’t want to him to co-opt the Fang of the Serpent as well) and instead we would see some other norn man or woman rise up and flesh out our roster of legendary heroes, or give more screen time to someone we don’t see enough of.

In itself, Braham didn’t bother me so much. It was more the lack of response from my Commander (who is a battle-hardened norn, who should have put shame on Braham “Perhaps your mother wouldn’t have wanted you either in her guild, knucklehead ?”). Even worse was the fact that when I heard Taimi’s plan I was all “Hell no ! I don’t want Asuran’s silliness on my epic Jormag’s Hunt”.

It’s something I’ve wanted to see since even before the launch of GW2, a mighty hunt of hundreds of norns going to kill Jormag, venturing in the far north, defeating the monster against all hope. And now my character, a norn, will have to oppose it to favour Asuran shenanigans ? Please ANet, don’t go this way, it would kill every interest I have in a fight I wanted to have for years now.

Braham breaking the fang doesn’t bother me, at least it is a Norn who break it. What I can’t understand is how did he learnt of the parchment used by Aesgir and why no other Norn ever tried to get it, to our knowledge ?

I don’t think that Braham will hunt Jormag alone, a lot of Norns will join him in his hunt (hell, my Norn character would do so, in RP, if he wasn’t forced to disagree with Braham in the main story, which was rather raging for me, especially when Braham insulted my character while I wanted to do the exact same thing as he).

So far, I mostly liked everything about this patch… save for the end of the story. Without spoiling to much, my main is a Norn, and I would have favoured to follow Braham option rather than Taimi’s. Sure, Asura magic is great, but I would want more of a brawl with Jormag, Norn-style.

I know that it isn’t possible to cater to every player’s wishes, but I felt that, had I played any other races, nothing would have changed, which is a shame, because I want to hunt down Jormag since even before the launch of the game.

Otherwise, the new zone is simply gorgeous. I’ve always liked the Norn zones, but this one, with the giant trees and hot springs is simply the best.

What would surprise me lore-wise ? That the Kodan’s origins for the Norns would turn out to be true, which would lead to some big revelations about Koda and its place in the Pantheons of Gods in Tyria.

You know what I would like ? Jormag to actually be intelligent. I mean, we know that Elder Dragons can be, and so far Jormag has been portrayed as the cunning one in the lot : it went out of his way to tempt worshippers since centuries to hasten its awakening (meaning that even with sleeping minions and champions, it was able to plot the Nornbear and the precursors of modern day Sons of Svanir), it is the only Elder Dragon actively trying to breach into the Mists (for reason unknowns) and all of this was before the death of two of its brethren/competitors.

So, I hope that Jormag won’t go all Godzilla on us. Primordius, I can see doing such lashing out, after all, even as its name imply, it is the primordial one. But Jormag should try to fool us, or at least the norns. After all, the norns admit the Sons of Svanir and generally consider that peoples should be treated on their own merits, and I’m fairly certain that Jormag knows it. If it was trying to use it -perhaps by sending a champion openly to help the mortal races against Primordius – it would impress me more than him being just a primeval force of ice and death in the North.

Plus, I’m not very fond of an expansion with two dragons dying, because I fear that the affected races (here, the Asuras and Norns) wouldn’t be much fleshed out or that the dragon’s fall would lack an “identity” of a sort. And I don’t see how we could manage a war on two fronts, lore-wise… except if Primordius return to the Northern Shiverpeaks, of course.

I don’t trust Lazarus at all… neither do I trust Mursaat tablets. Heck, even Lazarus pretend that he has “changed” (which imply that he was an kitten before, like other Mursaat but isn’t anymore). I smell something seriously fishy here.

@Lord Trejgon : Elder Dragons usually don’t reach over great distances the instant they awoke, Mordremoth being the exception (either because he had prepared himself for a long time, by using Scarlet and Aerinn or simply because of the amount of leyline energy Scarlet had redirected toward it). And in Primordius’ case, he was contained for a long time by the Dwarves. Him reaching the surface only now may very well be because he finally managed to defeat the dwarves and ended devouring whatever subterranean civilization resided underground.

Caudecus is definitely playing is hand, and Rytlock is remembering Eir.

I don’t find that the Kodan and the Norns are close spiritually or culturally. Quite the contrary in fact. The Kodan are aloof, possessing a sense of superiority (almost a God-Complex, in fact) which makes them think that they have the innate right to judge the whole world and its races. They’re a lot more secretive than the Norns, a lot less open to outsiders (most of the Kodan refugees who can be found in the Norns zones are arrogant, if not downright rude toward the players, if I remember right).

I think that Tengu will be the only playable race from Tyria added in the game, at least as long as we do not move away from Tyria itself to discover new continents.

I think he invested too much of himself in Trahearne, and the later had still a distinct body, and a mind trying to fight the Dragon. It’s probable that the Marshal last act was to actually trap Mordremoth long enough in his body for the Commander to kill it once and for all.

It is quite possible that a powerful Mordrem champion will rise to prominence, like Tequatl did after Zhaïtan death. However, it is also possible that Mordrems who are corrupted Sylvari may regain control of themselves, now that the Dragon is dead (which would make for some really interesting storyline, IMHO).

I would reserve the dwarves for a Primordius expansion… but then again, Tengu would be there as well. I think Far Shiverpeaks masteries should revolve around :

Kodan (semi-aquatic masteries, since there is a lot of seas now in the north)
Ancient Jotun (mystical artefacts, that kind of thing)
Possibly Norns if we need to combat the freezing weather itself

But other masteries would be hard to find. The Modniir who lived there wouldn’t want to teach us anything and they left a long time ago, the lands of the Dwarves from before the Tome of Rubicon are already ingame, disputed between the Norns and Dredges….

Now that I think about it, perhaps that an isolationist group of Dredge could live in the Far Shiverpeaks, but I wonder how ANet would make them interesting.

As for LS3, I hope that the Itzel, Nuhocs and Exalted will still have a role to play. I would hate for them to not be touched upon, especially the later, who are so tied to human history.

I don’t see why a norn Engineer wouldn’t make sense. The Norns respect those who trace new ways to glory or reach new heights of glory. An engineer who’s trying to revolutionize weaponry, one who seeks to destroy the Dragons with such technology or even one who simply wish to become able to repair everything wouldn’t look strange to me.

But I may be biased since my main is an engineer. He went to Lion Arch in his youth and spent more than 15 years there to train under masters (one charr, one asura) before becoming a true engineer, and I think Norns could go directly to the Black Citadel to learn the ways of the charr, perhaps in exchange of serving for a time alongside the Iron Legion.

I love the Shiverpeaks and would like to go to the Far Shiverpeaks… but the masteries there would be hellish to design, at least in my head, because I can’t see allied populations so far in the North. Jormag has ruled there for far too long for any civilization to have remained uncorrupted there. Even norns couldn’t hide among the Icebroods for so long.

I’ve played a lot of time at HoT, and while some events may be difficult to do, even in groups, I’ve largely liked the expansion. Save for one sore spot : Beighart event in Verdant Brink. I’m talking here about his event where we need to bring back pieces of aircrafts.

Since the launch of HoT I’ve tried dozen of times to complete this specific event. It is the last one I have to do in Verdant Brink to finish the daytime successes. And I’ve never the luck to see it completed. I’ve come on maps where it had been completed apparently, but I’ve never, ever, managed to complete it myself, despite my best efforts, and connecting at varying hours in hope of it being feasible.

The only reason I see for this case is that, out of all the HoT I’ve done so far, it is the only one which I can define as both uninteresting, tedious and unrewarding.

It is uninteresting because bringing back some tokens won’t ever be very much interesting anyway.

It is tedious because you have to kill the mobs to make the aircraft(s pieces drop, but I can live with that. Other events in Orr did the same.

It is unrewarding because of the sheer amount of pieces which need to be brought back to Beighart. Even alone, this number must be in the dozens, meaning that no amount of dedication, if you’re unlucky, will reward you with a successful event.

Being a part of a chain event, with interesting rewards, before and after this very specific event, it is quite telling that it usually is the end of said chain event, players leaving the area when Beighart’s event begin. The fact that, at times, Beighart can even be pulled far away from the zones where the aircraft’s pieces drop, if one is unlucky, even add to the problems (I’ve seen him twice being pulled by Hyleks toward the eastern cliff, when the event is at the opposite end, near the western cliff).

And I must say that I’m still surprised by the problems with this specific event, since there appears to be two relatively easy solution to make it perfectly viable. Either reducing (drastically) the number of drops needed to complete the event, or allow players to get the same drop, instead of having a drop available by player and by frog killed.

I understand that fixing this event may not be at the top of ArenaNet agenda, but it is seriously the sole sore point that I truly have with HoT and it makes it all the more infuriating. There is nothing worse than to be prevented to complete successes you want to complete not even by a lack of dedication to it, but by the simple mechanics of an event along the way.

Thanks you for having read me.

I think that Mordremoth was so talkative because he had understood and that this time, the mortal races were more than mere ants and preys. In order :

-Kralkatorrik learnt that despite his might, under the right conditions, a little group of mortals -albeit helped by the greatest mind witnessed so far in GW, Snaff- could have felled him.
-Zhaïtan was slain, something that the other dragons have learnt by now, one way or another (Jormag and Mordremoth probably thanks to their moral servants and minions, the others possibly through some magical knowledge or minions).
-Mordremoth had access to the memories of the Sylvari he corrupted. He knew the face of the Pact Commander, of Trahearne, and Destiny’s Edge. And he knew what happend to Kralkatorrik, if not from another source, probably from Faolain when he corrupted her.

From all this, I can see the Dragons beginning to change their modus operandi. For all we know, for the first time ever two of them have been felled. They aren’t as allmighty as they believed themselves to be, meaning that they may have things to learn from the preys, this time around.

Slowpoke, you have to take into account the fact with all the other threats out there in Tyria, the Risen fleet wasn’t and still isn’t worth the effort to go in the ocean to lure them out. First because they actually rest underwater most of the time, so a fleet seeking to find and destroy them would have a very hard time to do so. Second, because if Zhaïtan wished to have even a somewhat effective navy, he probably made Champions out of every captain. And now that the Elder Dragon is dead, every Risen Captain will have a hard time working with the others, since they are all equals and if Tequatl is what happens to Champions when their Dragon die, then the Captains are probably fighting a war of dominance or going their own way.

We have seen in the Dragonbrand that without champions to direct them, even minions who have a Dragon master wander aimlessly. it is not hard to imagine Risen sea beasts doing the same, which weaken the Risen fleet as a whole. And since no races have any interest in sending resources to fight an army which, still formidable, poses no threat in the near-future, while others make their presence known (Mordremoth attacking everywhere, even Jormag continuing to push toward the South, on meter at a time) launching a full-scale sea war is not a top priority. That and the fact that sea battles can be far more deadlier than land battles, and that if the Risen fleet managed to coordinate against its foes, it could deliver a lot more damages and bolster their ranks quickly.

I know that the core game hasn’t advanced at all on that front since the release, but I would like to talk about the relations between humans and centaurs and how they could evolve in a LS (I don’t see this plotline being able to support an expansion, but it is also too big to be just a subplot in an expansion, if you ask me).

From what I’ve gathered, the situations at the beginning of GW2 has some similarities with the relations of Charrs and humans before Prophecy :

-the centaurs sees the humans has invaders and the humans claim that they have held the lands long enough to be them now, just like the Charrs and humans saw things before the Searing.
-The Centaurs are dominated by one of their clan/tribe (??) just like the Charrs were dominated by one of their Legion.
-the humans are highly divided and unable to mount a coherent defence.

However, there is also one big difference : the two sides in the human-centaur conflict have lost much of their territory. Kryta is the last human kingdom and is effectively land-locked, since the lands south of the Ascalonians settlement seems to be at least partially independent from it. And the centaurs have lost even more lands. They are probably stuck with a tiny bit of the Shiverpeaks and Woodland Cascades as their core territory, and had expanded quite a lot just before the release.

However, the core game experience sees the players repel the Centaur invasion from the gates of Divinity Reach to the northernmost corner of the Harathi Hinterlands. And while it is only my personal belief, I don’t think that they have left most of the centaur ’s forts empty. While the campaign is quite quick in the gaming experience, it is reasonable to suppose that the Krytan forces drive away the Centaurs one region at a time, before they finally gather their forces in the Hinterlands (I know that the Centaurs are still there in the Kessex Hills map after the Tower of Nightmare, but since none of their events has changed, to my knowledge, I must assume that it is just a design choice, not a lore one).

Therefore, it is believable that the Centaurs, having lost their leader (Ulgoth) and most of the territory they claimed (thanks to the work of Caudecus and his bandits/White Mantle cronies) they must be quite in disarray. But as I’ve said before, the centaurs are in a situation where fighting the humans is probably the only way to prevent a total collapse of their population. They are probably far too numerous and crowded to survive for long in a relatively small corner of Tyria by themselves. We have seen that, at the very least, their armies don’t care about the damages done to the land since their bastions are usually surrounded by barren lands, even when the rest of the region is verdant.

So, I assume that being in this state, attacking them in the Woodland Cascades would drive them ever deeper into despair and they could go ever fiercer as the players and the npcs would advance into their territory. Obviously, the humans are probably able now the crush the centaurs, with only a little help, and claiming the Woodland Cascades and every land surrounding Lake Viathan, if they haven’t done that yet, would bolster Kryta, by offering new lands to all the poor people gathering at Divinity reach and turning to banditry to survive, with the right course of laws from the Queen’s faction in the Ministry. It would also greatly secure the position of Jennah.

But is it the only course of action ? We have seen that there exist some centaurs who are friendly toward other species. Couldn’t they help the humans to broke a peace with the Centaurs ? I mean a peace or even the truce like they did with the Charr is probably out of the possibility (because of the lack of territories from both side, contrary to the Charr’s huge swath of lands and Kryta being far more wide than Ebonhawke), but couldn’t there be some way to end this war ? Perhaps a system like the Austrian-Hungarian throne back in the XVIII-th-XIXth centuries ?

What do you believe is feasible ?

There is plenty of ways to make the other Elder Dragons as terrific as Mordremoth without being so “epic”.

For instance, they could make Jormag creepy, for instance. If Mordremoth was the brutally “In your face and mind” type, ANet should have Jormag has a more “You know, all I want is make you stronger right ?”. The more the player goes North, the less he can trust his/her friends… and himself. Braham as been down ever since Eir died… and now he seems somewhat happier ? That’s probably nothing but… What if Jormag his corrupting him ? Can I trust him ? Should I trust him at all ?

That sort of thing would go a great way to clearly distinguish between Jormag and Mordremoth, and every other Dragons can be impressive.

Primordius is not huge, but having the player literally going full Divine Comedy, descending into several layers from the near-surface to a place full of lava and monstrosities which never saw the light of the sun and moons could go a great way to makes Primordius an awesome encounter. And many other possibilities exist.

I would like some political plots. Sure, the Egg must be important, but I would also like to know how the world is reacting to the revelations about the Sylvari, what happened in the Jungle, the appearance of the Exalted… and the death of Trahearne ! For all the hate he got, he was the Marshal of the Pact, his death must have impact !

Honestly, Anet shouldn’t try to topple en Elder Dragon in a LS. Have us deal with the aftermath, with even a minimum of fights, if possible ! Honestly, the LS is the perfect way to expand the world, instead of adding more and more bosses and all.

Now that Moredremoth is dead, will the different races try to deal with their more down to earth problems (the Centaurs and White Mantle for the Humans, the tensions between the Charr Legions, the Inquest, etc.) ? Bonus point if we have in LS3 at some point purely political missions, I would love that.

Hello everyone.

I’m a French player and as you probably know now, France has been attacked by terrorists. It has been the worst attack ever suffered in our country. But in the same time, I don’t forget all those other peoples, everywhere in the world, who have lost their lives to those cowardly fanatics. It is all those people I would like to honour.

Therefore, since we know have in Lion Arch a monument for the dead, I would have liked to propose a gathering at 8pm (French Time) around it, both to remember our losses and take some sort of hope there, in the site of a city which was destroyed and born again, stronger than ever, so it example may show us the way.

I know that North-American and Europeans players won’t be able to play together because of the servers being different, but still, I would like it to know that people gathered there nonetheless.

I’ll be at the monument, with my main character, Valmir Haakonsson from Mer de Jade.

Thanks you all for having read me.

PS : If you know any way to spread this message to other players, please do so, you would have my utmost gratitude.

The problem is that having tanks and healer will be mandatory in HoT. Even in the open world. And that’s not something I want. I’m a casual player, who don’t do farming, dungeons crawling or any kind of PvP, because all those activities bore me to death. Exploring the world of Tyria, facing challenges during even solo events, that’s what interest me in the game.

Now, it appears that it won’t be possible anymore. If I’ll try to go to someplace, it will be gated behind an event where at least on healer will be necessary to clear, or perhaps a tank to control the mobs. That’s not what brought me to GW2, not what made me stay. Again, there is plenty of games out there with a Trinity which are ftp and works just fine. GW2 is (was?) different, and homogenization isn’t a good thing. Ever.

Still, I’ll play HoT, because I want to experience it, to see how the game has and will evolve. But I sure do hope that if I want to play without any healer nor tank, I’ll be able to clear all the casual pve content.

I’m a little disappointed with the full coming of the trinity. Even if the Scrapper is interesting, he doesn’t strike me as a pure tank. However, the druid seems to be a full-time healer, and there isn’t many a reason for me to play GW2, which wasn’t tuned toward it for years, instead of another game which had.

Lytro.9305:

I was thinking about making a norn thief, however I’m not sure if they fit within the lore. I know the connection with the snow leopard spirit might make some consider it, but is there anything else that could support it? Also, is there any norn thieves in the world that you can talk to or maybe they can explain why they became a thief?

Rp wise, the father of my main is a Norn Thief. He doesn’t enter someone’s lodge to steal thing, but hunt Sons of Svanirs and other threats by using ruses, poisons and deadly ambushes. Basically, he is somewhere between a ranger and a thief but leaning a lot more toward the second with his discretion.

We have to keep in mind that the Norns are great hunters, meaning that they have to be at least somewhat discreet when hunting. I don’t think that the majority of the Shiverpeaks’ animals charge right to you when you scream in their direction, even if some probably do so (hello minotaurs !).

I still don’t see how Trahearne stole the spotlight from my character. Thanks to him, I was a glorified Monster Hunter who could give orders to a whole lot of soldiers without ever having to bother myself with logistic, diplomacy or even research of new technologies or ancient lore. All I had to do was to go on a rampage in Orr and kill Zhaïtan.

I hope that Trahearne will survive HoT. In fact, I hope we will be able to purify him if he is corrupted, if only because he is probably one of the sole minds able to clearly tell us what it was to be a Dragon Minion (something which could turn to be crucial when dealing with the other dragon’s minions) and some part of Mordremoth plans/functions.

That’s doesn’t mean that other characters shouldn’t die, but their death shouldn’t come as a “reward” for a great part of the playerbase. I would prefer the murder of Kasmeer by some corrupted sylvarie over Trahearne’s being killed by the player, because it would be a shock, and would drive the player and the story in a more personal way. Kind of like when Belinda was killed. Even if I barely knew her (a shame ANet should have waited to kill her), it made the thing personal, because I love Kasmeer, Marjory and the others.

Mireles Lore.5942:

They are very well capable of having a mechanic that “turns” players.

Those that were around for the end of the first beta weekend will tell you so.

The branded zombie apocalypse in Plains of Ashford was the most epic event GW2 ever had. Branded invaded the area. If you were killed by branded you re-spawned as a branded and attacked other players and turned them too.

And as a Branded you were traumatized by destiny’s Edge. I remember you and your arrows Eir…

Still sad to this day that a lot of non-branded abused the defenses of some fort at the end of the event instead of forming a full-branded family ;(