Guild Wars 2

Abimes.9726:

I realy like the idea .

1° It will help people watching streams to understand the dangerosity of some conditions.
2° it will help players who currently spam they’r condition removal to get rid of 3 bleed stacks that they are better to wait to have more condition presure on them before removing the DOT.
3° It will help condition classes to see if they have to presure more or if they can change their targets wile the dot is doing his damage.
4° It will help support classes to know when they have to remove conditions on their team mates.

Problem how do you make that work for tourment and confusion (Just grey the base degen ?)

+1, the best part about this is that it makes the stream a lot more understandable, and thus increase viewership.

#allisvain

The score should be hidden lol. It’s just decorations right now and should not be used for any meaningful comparisons.

They should force everyone to use a Human instead of Asura.

Lordryux.9785:

hmm my team actually won xD

Do you know why? Because the other team have 2 eles xD

Glenstorm.4059:

Maybe they’re wary of instant-cast AoE CCs?

I do agree that being able to cast “Flash-Freeze!” and “Aftershock!” while Overloading (or Fire Grab, or Churning Earth, etc. etc.) would be amazing. But I can also see an argument for why counterplay is needed.

There can be delayed effect, but it doesn’t need a cast time. Make it instant cast, and freeze after 3/4s.

Cele Ele gets one shot by Mesmer too. I’m not complaining, just stating the fact. Ele has good sustain, but a coordinated burst from stealth of 2 Mesmers can drop any class.

ThatShortGuy.4672:

+1 to this tread and answers. I’ve been having trouble with d/d eles with my d/p thief. Haven’t never really played an ele, I forgot about waiting out water attun.

Any more tips on d/d ele would be awesome!

Steal their boons right after their might combo from Fire -> Earth. Then you will get 25 stacks of might and crit them for 14k backstab.

Always use your teleport right after an Updraft knock back (and see that they switch to fire). If you dodge that big burst, the Ele will have to go to defensive mode while you burst them down.

Tbh, Ele is one of the easiest class to beat when you understand their mechanics and limitations. It’s pretty hard for them to workaround their limitations, and you will have the upperhand. The key thing is to steal their boons in Earth, and burst when they have just used their heal in water, or switched out of Water. Dodge the burst in Fire, and range it when they are in Air (so you can watch the RTL and dodge it). Most Ele has a set of rotation between attunement, and you can easily predict which attunement they are going next

Normally Air → Fire → Earth → Water → repeat.

AcidicVision.5498:

Vash Past.4385:

“A thief caught out of stealth is a dead thief” – you mean like how an ele caught out of stealth(all the time, since we don’t stealth) is a dead ele? Aaaand because you’re sooo squishy, stuff your Medium armor class? You literally have it so easy you don’t even realize what squishy means. Lol

This is entirely off topic, and I’m not sure you want to get into all of the ele defensive weapon and utility skills, heals, immunities and cleanses.

Tell me all the great ele defensive weapon/utility skills/heals/immunities/cleanses they have when they go full glass cannon. Thief has way more innate advantage with stealth/teleport and medium armor. On top of that, they have access to the most toxic play style, insta-gib from stealth.

Yah, we gotta unnerf the true shot damage. I can’t reflect and instantly kill a guard anymore.

Complaining about Ele burning on a Diamond Skin build only shows that you’re outplayed. The biggest burning from Ele is from Ring of Fire, which does 3 stacks on burning when you walk in and out of it.

The important part? It applies zero/no burning stack on cast! In order to get burned, you must walk in and out of it. I have seen people stayed on it for full duration, died, and whispered complain about OP burning Ele. It’s like a player keep running into guardians Ring, got knocked down 3 times, died, and QQ complain.

A Diamond Skin Ele has no trait for burning. If people keep walk in and out of the Ring of Fire, they deserve to be defeated. As Grouch said: don’t do it.

You can complain about Diamond Skin; however, don’t QQ about burning in the same sentence. It only shows that you’re outplayed.

I don’t think it’s a good idea either. People will look at other people’s build and just start insulting their teammates when they see an unusual build.

Once in a teamq match (yes, it’s teamq), my teammates kept asking me why I played a signet Ele. They didn’t believe that signet Ele is viable. He stopped asking after the first minute after we crushed the other team in mid fight.

We don’t need more unnecessary drama and a toxic environment where people examine other people’s builds and AFK/quit when they see something strange. You play your build, I play mine. You don’t get to dictate which build I run, unless we’re competing for the first spot in a big tournament.

I hate it when people say ele has 8s attunement. That’s hyperbole, and not good for the class. It’s 8.7s, and even longer if you actually play the game.

Since you can’t swap out of an attunement as soon as you enter it, the overall cooldown is more. You have to wait at least 1s between attunement because we have a 1s cool down when ypu swap into an attunement too! Go from air to water, wait 1s, then water to earth, wait another 1s. Because of that, even if you try to swap all the attunements as fast as possible, it takes you at least 11.7s, or 12s accounting for human error (people can’t press as fast as that). If we want to talk about ele swap time, use the 12s figure, not 8s. That’s disingenuous, and actively harm the class.

Furthermore, if you rotate so that you can use burning speed once per fire attunement, then it’s a 15s rotation. Faster attunement cd just means more flexibility. If you want to switch attunement as soon as possible, then you have to skip burning speed/fire 4 at every other fire attunement. Since you will have to spend at least 1s in earth and 1s in water, and 1s in air, the overall combo will be one burning speed every 26s. That applies to a host of other skills too, like water 3. The trade off will be: more attunement, lower damage, or time the attunement to get more skills activation, less attunement swap per minute.

Conclusion: Saying ele has a 8s swap time is very misleading. Be fair and say that it has a minimum 12s (or if you really want, 11.7s) swap time for a rotation.

P.S: with chill, that will be a 20s attunement time. To save you a calculation. Also, that requires 6 points in Arcana.

rhycochet.5268:

i’m a thief player. but i basically predicted this was going to happen. if you’ve been around long enough you’ll know that anet has a history and habit of overbuffing whatever is weakest to the point of ridiculous OPness, and then nerfing whatever was perceived to be OP to the point of being borderline unplayable. as much as thieves needed a boost, this is not what should have happened.

Agree.

The DS nerf and Cele removal for Ele is over the top too.

nearlight.3064:

This reminds me of when you all cried about tempest being trash when it was revealed. I was legit the only one defending it those days.

People disliked it because it offered the same Ele, not like a new Chronomancer. It’s an Ele++. Then they disliked more because everyone was expecting a DPS spec, with massive damage (it’s a freaking Tempest!), and it turned out to be a heal bot.

You may not realize it, but many Ele players are bored of being a healbot. In fact, right now Ele has no other build in PvP except being a heal bot. That’s why people complain again.

It’s a guaranteed victory if you get auto-balanced. Always click on the volunteer button, unless you have other reasons.

The ANet devs don’t realize the most important thing:

• For PvP, balance is everything

How the kitten that the PvP team doesn’t own the balance team? Why the kitten that we let the PvE team dictate the balance when PvE is mostly about playing with AI? Like, WTF?

TL;DR: so far, the pro-ban side argued justice should be served properly, or else it’s a joke. The pro-violators side argued the ends justify the means. And since ignoring this makes more money for ANet, it’s fine.

oRNG lost to the Abjured both mechanically and rotation-wise.

Also, now people in EU can shut up saying “NA has no competitive scene and that’s why the Abjured keeps winning”

The fact is they are strong, and that’s why they win.

Also, the the complaint about Ele is getting old. Phantaram had been playing Ele when it was the bottom tier (and still won). They are just good players. oRNG played like pugs on front of the Abjured.

2 hambow with AoE cc really help in team fight. Even with just spam cc (you don’t need to chain it correctly), you forced the other team to stay in defensive mode. It’s very effective.

Xanario.5718:

Hello all, what would be the best weapon to use as elementalist ? best dps output ?

There is no “best” weapon. It depends on what you want to do. D/D is widely regarded as a very versatile weapon, but Staff is pretty good too.

Best dps output is no doubt glass staff. Best burst output is no doubt glass S/D. If the fight last more than 10s, glass staff > glass s/d.

BTW, that’s for end game contents. I’m not sure if you’re new or not. If you’re looking for a leveling weapon, then pick either staff or d/d.

Zewad.6138:

Really dont understand all the “totally possible” and “just carry your matches”.

Most of the time i get teams that play like total pvp newbies. Pve builds and 0 map awareness.
Not to mention the amount of useless teefs and warrs that are either trolls(diamond trolls) or players that dont care about the meta.

I cant “carry” a match by myself. You know, teamplay and stuff.

It’s about matching your teammates style.

I think most people who think they get “bad teammates” is because they don’t know how to match their playstyle to their teammates playstyle. In short, it’s all about being adaptable.

Seeing your teammates like to +1 fights and left home being decapped a few times? Instead of insulting then, you can start watching home and intercept any opponent who wants to decap it.

Seeing your teammates dieing too much in team fights? It probably means they are using DPS builds. Heal them, or jumping into a fight first to consume the opponents big cooldown so your teammates can burst the opponents.

By adapting to your teammates, you increase your win rate a lot. I occasionally get matched with MMR tankers, but it’s fine because there is nothing I could do about that. However, if your teammates intend to win, you usually can adapt to their playstyle and allow them to maximize the potential of their builds/playstyle.

Markin.9167:

Rune of Mitigation
(1) +25 Healing Power
(2) +10% Protection Duration
(3) +50 Healing Power
(4) 50% chance to apply weakness for 5 seconds when struck while you have an aura (10 sec cooldown)
(5) +100 Healing Power
(6) Gain a random aura every 35 seconds while in combat

what you guys think?

Very interesting, not too strong, but not too weak. I think #2 should be 10% boons duration though.

I totally disagree. In fact, the tactics for GW2 is pretty simple. What made GW2 fail at esport was because of the bad balance, and the 6 months per patch balancing approach.

Shockwave.1230:

• Guild Wars 2 has a lot of systems players need to understand in order to create an effective attribute setup.

LoL has a lot of systems players need to understand: multiple modes, multiple traits, builds, strategies. I’m just pulling up a random page for a random hero below. In short, it’s even more complicated (and people love it).
http://www.mobafire.com/league-of-legends/build/taric-support-why-gems-are-truly-outrageous-march-update-243829

Shockwave.1230:

• While you’re crafting your attribute setup you must also consider what weapons play to those strengths.

In LoL, while you’re picking a champion, you also must consider which masteries to use, which runes table to use, which summoners skills to pick. Then in game, you must consider which items to buy, etc… Picking a weapon in gw2 locks in the spells, which you can think of is just similar to picking a different champion in LoL. And LoL has way more champions than gw2 has with the weapons per class.

Shockwave.1230:

• Additionally you need to consider what 5 slot skills play to the strengths of your attribute setup.

Considering how many skills/items combo you need to learn for LoL, you’re not making a good case that gw2 is more complex. In fact, most of the slot skills people use are pretty standard, and unchanged for a while. Think about a warrior without Berserker Stance? Even a newbie knows that. It’s more of a false choice rather than complexity. Want to be OP? There is only one or two choices. Don’t want to be OP? Then you should know what you are doing already.

Moreover, you don’t have to level up skill in gw2 pvp. In LoL, you even have to plan which skill to level up first depends on the situation.

Shockwave.1230:

• You also need to figure out what traits make the most sense in your build. You must also consider the impact trait lines have on attributes.

The masteries table and runes table in LoL is pretty complex too. Guess what, that’s esport! Why? because they only allow masteries/runes to change your power by around 15% of the original one. That maintains good balance while allowing hardcore people to tinker and find their best builds. A complex trait systems is what we want. What we don’t want is to get killed in 2 hits, or to attack a bunker for 5 minutes and they don’t die. Both of that are too extreme.

Shockwave.1230:

• Finally you have to figure out what runes and sigils make the most sense to run.

Tbh, I love the runes and sigils system in gw2. Sure, there are certainly some OP ones that I don’t like; however, it’s a pretty good system. The stats points given are low enough that it doesn’t significantly change the build, while offering a lot more customization options. In the next patch, they removes part of the customization already, so you can just put on one rune.

Shockwave.1230:

Is Guild Wars 2 PvP too complicated to be consumable by the the mass esport audience?

A strong no. Worst case, just google a guide and copy it. How is it more complicated than LoL, which is one of the most successful esport game?

Exedore.6320:

Sunshine.5014:

they don’t ask players what the players want; they assume they know what the players want. When they started asking, it was late, and they wasted a year of development.

Except that players usually don’t know what they want either. Players often think they want something, but when it comes along, it turns out they didn’t want it. They just thought they did. Or maybe only a vocal minority wanted it. You can’t just take player feedback at face value; developers have to think on their own too.

You just said it. Since even the players don’t know what they want either, the developers should give them the new version to test! If the majority of the players complain loudly about something, then give out a number tweak patch, and let the players see if that’s really what they want. If they don’t want it, they can complain, and the developers can change the patch back. That leaves a paper trail that later the developers can use to say “here, we did that, and that didn’t work.” or “yah, we did that, and it seems that you guys love it, so we keep it there”

Right now, with the long iteration, the developers can only get the blame.

About the “we must give the players time to adjust to the new meta.” The sad truth is it was a lie. Players are pretty smart. Let’s talk about the recent addition of healing skills. People had predicted rightly that the Mesmer’s signet would get a lot of use, even before the patch was live. They could just look at the number from the leaked notes on Reddit and figured out. If ANet could balance it to the point that it takes the players a long while to figure out what is OP, then ANet could be considered succeeded in balancing the game. Right now, immediately after each patch is a serie of same complains. It doesn’t take people long to see that Warriors are still OP, or Spirit Rangers’ ultimate is still too strong. Saying that “the players need time to adjust” is just an excuse. It is the reason why GW2 PvP is in this sorry state.

I’m a full glass Ele and I have no issues with smokescale/raptor or whatever you think should be nerfed. Please don’t drag down the game. We need fun challenges. Even with 12k HP, one dodge can save your life from a smokescale, and one lavafont is enough to kill it.

I main an Ele, and I’m between rank 50-100 on soloq, ~200 on teamq, just in case people ask.

I’ve been playing Ele since the start of the game, during the time that Ele was god tier, and when it was kitten tier. I was pretty happy with the adjustments ANet made for Ele in the recent feature pack. I’ve been playing my Ele with Rune of Strength for about a month now, and it’s simply just too strong. I tried Rune of Strength with other classes, like Warrior, Mesmer, Engi, Thief, and come to the conclusion that it’s broken. Let me tell you why:

Without Rune of Strength, and Ele has on average 12 stacks of might if combo properly. With Rune of Strength, I can keep 25 stacks of might permanently during fights. Not only Rune of Strength provides 45% more Might duration, it also give you a 18s stack of might every 5 seconds. That’s a permanent 200 more offensive stats in combat, just from the 4 pieces bonus, without counting any other benefits it gives.

25 stacks of might gives a big stats boost to any class/build. That’s 875 power and 875 condition damage at the same time. No rune should allow people to get that much benefit by just equipping a rune set.

By comparison, going from a Cleric amulet (largely defensive) to a Berserker amulet (largely offensive) only gives you 279 more power. Now, by just equipping a different set of runes, you can get a lot more offensive power, not even counting the 7% damage boost, which is permanent if you have a Sigil of Battle.

Rune of Strength should be shaved. As an Ele, this is a hard opinion for me to voice; however, I think it’s best for the game that we admit Rune of Strength is overpowered, and in need of an adjustment.

Discuss?

Celtus.8456:

Sunshine.5014:

Celtus.8456:

Still not fixing the ele. We’ll just see less ridiculous burns and random blinds now, which was an emergency fix, I guess.

Also, nice Smiter’s Boon on Icebow 4.

How is it not fixed Ele?

• Sustain? Double the CD on Vigor on crit
• Might? No more might Cantrips (9 stacks)
• Burning? Huge nerf from 3 stacks 5s to 1 stack 2s

D/D Ele gonna hit like a wet noodle again. if you to a D/D Ele after patch, its purely gameplay issue. Haters gonna hate though.

Still boring, uninspired design and mostly locked into the water/arcana choice for all eternity. That is what I mean by not fixed.

Instead of creating new builds, the devs have just had a fixation on buffing/nerfing the same build forever.

But as I said, all Sustain/Might/Burning are nerfed. Ele will be out of meta already. Just move on, haters don’t have to keep beating the dead horse, especially when it’s no longer a dead horse but a skeleton corpse.

Obviously double Rev.

Most people gloss over the 20% Aura nerf too. It’s pretty significant.

Unholy Pillager.3791:

Supreme.3164:

Unholy Pillager.3791:

Mizu.4508:

Diamond Skin isn’t OP, its completely useless against power builds but it walls off condition builds pretty well. The only reason we can even fight necromancers is because of Diamond Skin. Once its removed, load on the conditions and its game over.

FALSE. Reaper power builds are slow, melee range bruisers that are forced to rely on slowing down their enemies with chill or locking them down with fear in order to deal their damage. Druids also tend to be heavily reliant on immobilize. All of these are negated by diamond skin. Even if we accept the incredibly poor design decision of passive, complete condition immunity, it still counters some power builds pretty well. And yes, especially if (as you pointed out) the tempest also has permanent 40% damage reduction, high reflect uptime, and auras that chill or stun attackers.

Well..good thing eles have something to punish people that attack him..maybe one day we’ll have something that prevent us from being hit in the first place

Reflect, mistform, high mobility and near-permanent vigor aren’t enough? That’s a hell of a lot more then necromancers get.

Mistform is useless in high level PvP since you lose the capture point. It’s also on a 75s cooldown, not like Mesmer’s block. Meta Tempest has very poor mobility compare to Mesmer/Rev. And what’s the perma Vigor for if you spend the majority of your time channeling kitten cast skills?

The only thing I agree with you is reflection, but most of the DPS comes in melee range anyway.

Runewolf.8456:

someone.7485:

Cause the pvp community in guild wars is sooo nice atm……

it’s much nicer then most f2p games like LoL or DotA.

Totally agree.

People tend to under appreciate those things. They always think the grass is greener on the otherside.

Pops Arcane Shield and laugh at your opponents wasting their CCs for a second? Why not pop an Armor of Earth and laugh at them wasting their CC for 8 seconds and get a bunch of boons in the process?

Arcane Shield needs a 40s cool down.

Yes, default. It’s baseline.

kuritsutian.2987:

Don’t underestimate the Ele, it’s been on top before without the need of Diamond skill, celestial amulet can be replaced by the new ones without the overexagerated loss that it’s been trying to be portraited in the forus.

Yeah, because it had:

1. Cele Amulet
2. Energy sigil
3. 3 mights on Cantrips
4. Battle sigil 3 stack of mights
5. 5 seconds CD blind
6. Stackable Frost Aura

Now with all the above gone, it’s gonna face more nerfs:

1. Aura nerfed 20%
2. DS can’t protect you with condi bomb anymore. Armor of Earth gonna be a liability because Reaper will corrupt it to both Fear and Chill.

I’ll wait and see the full patch notes, but I don’t have confidence in Karl.