Guild Wars 2

lordhelmos.7623:

I’ve played alot of MMOs from phantasy star online, to guildwars 1, WoW, Aeon, RIFT, SWTOR, TERA…

This is the first time ever that I got 2 hours into an expac and just turned it off. This was a sad disappointment because I very much like guildwars 2 and invested alot of time and money into the game. But HoT just didn’t do it for me.

This is not really meant to be a bashing thread, but I’m wondering what kind of issues people ran into that caused them to be disinterested in the xpac.

For me:

1.) Lack of solid tutorial for the new content. New maps were sensory overload with a ton of new icons that were not explained. I didn’t play the PvE beta, it took a friend explaining that masteries needed to be grinded up a bar before a point could be used.

2.) Elite specializations tallgated behind massive amounts of hero points. All the new playstyles are not really unlockable until your done with like 75% of the new content. The result is pretty much feeling like your going through just another living story with the same class mechanics that you had pre expansion. Alot of the elite specializations are not even that much better or leagues worse than the core class.

3.) Massive frustration for finally getting to hard to reach hero points and finding out you don’t have the mastery to get it.

4.) Hero point challenges crushing solo players, begging for help from friends when you realize they can’t figure out how to get to you or don’t have the masteries to reach you.

Definitely more frustration than fun. Not saying I will quit gw2, but I will go play other games and maybe give this another shot sometime later. But for now, in this state? No way, there are much funner things to play.

For the people that are enjoying the new content, I’m happy for you. If it floats your boat and your not having the same issues then great.

Add on story gating to that list, and spot on!

Requirements to achieve and create things seem incredibly disproportionate to the new gameplay content available to achieve them with. Especially the central Tyrian masteries. New rewards for things I’ve done so often I don’t particularly want to do them again, that’s not encouraging me. Quite the opposite.

I’ve played alot of MMOs from phantasy star online, to guildwars 1, WoW, Aeon, RIFT, SWTOR, TERA…

This is the first time ever that I got 2 hours into an expac and just turned it off. This was a sad disappointment because I very much like guildwars 2 and invested alot of time and money into the game. But HoT just didn’t do it for me.

This is not really meant to be a bashing thread, but I’m wondering what kind of issues people ran into that caused them to be disinterested in the xpac.

For me:

1.) Lack of solid tutorial for the new content. New maps were sensory overload with a ton of new icons that were not explained. I didn’t play the PvE beta, it took a friend explaining that masteries needed to be grinded up a bar before a point could be used.

2.) Elite specializations tallgated behind massive amounts of hero points. All the new playstyles are not really unlockable until your done with like 75% of the new content. The result is pretty much feeling like your going through just another living story with the same class mechanics that you had pre expansion. Alot of the elite specializations are not even that much better or leagues worse than the core class.

3.) Massive frustration for finally getting to hard to reach hero points and finding out you don’t have the mastery to get it.

4.) Hero point challenges crushing solo players, begging for help from friends when you realize they can’t figure out how to get to you or don’t have the masteries to reach you.

Definitely more frustration than fun. Not saying I will quit gw2, but I will go play other games and maybe give this another shot sometime later. But for now, in this state? No way, there are much funner things to play.

For the people that are enjoying the new content, I’m happy for you. If it floats your boat and your not having the same issues then great.

Omne.4603:

What does MMO mean?

Massively Multiplayer Online game.

The “Massively Multiplayer” simply refers to the sheer number of people able to play the game, simultaneously.

It doesn’t suggest how they should play it.

As opposed to a single-player (or a small group) game only being capable of allowing one player (or a small group of players) to play the same game, at the same time.

It isn’t intended to imply that all, or even some, of those players have to play together, on the same side, as a group.

…and in fact, in older multiplayer games, the two, or four, people who played them together were very often playing against (not with) each other.

Of course, people can play MMOs together, on the same team and that can be great.

However, it shouldn’t be obligatory, just to experience the content and that was never what the term was invented to imply.

If it has become that way, in some games, that is mostly due to logistics and/or player requests.

It is not due to the developers trying to adhere to some made-up definition of “MMO”.

Maybe it shows that other people just need to get good.

Nope, that has nothing to do with anything.

Just hit MR23 been solo the whole time.

That is truly excellent. For you. It has kitten-all to do with anyone else, and is not helpful to the discussion.

Some enemies just seem rather silly. Champions that go invisible and one shot you, snipers that leave fire everywhere, mushrooms that will mob you to death and explode as if it was their purpose in life, etc. I like the content, but solo wise, its overtuned.

A lot of hero points have champions, and those champions either life steal, can one shot, or just have so much health and damage that the time limit is too short… Now don’t get me wrong, I’ve soloed a few… But its clear this was not meant with solo in mind.

Edit: Plus, I should not need a seperate set of gear just for open world map completion, etc. What do you expect me to do, craft a third set of ascended for my main?

I have to say, I have been very frustrated with HoT so far. I go out of my way to reach some really hard to find Hero Challenges, and then find that it spawns Champ mobs with ads, completely impossible for me to solo. Yay. I could wait there hours without anyone coming by to help. I advertise in chat, but nobody even replies. Working as intended, I’m sure.

I like when casual groups form to take on content, but HoT maps have way too much going on all over the place, so the populations get way spread out. It’s like the same problems Silverwastes and Dry Top had, which we told them about, only even worse because the maps are larger and harder to navigate. They require WAY too much player coordination and investment than open world maps EVER should.

Open world maps should be CASUAL, they should be about “bring what you’ve got, and it will work fine.” If you show up alone, then 95% of the content on the map should be soloable. If you show up with 50+ people, then at least 40% of the content should scale up to make that an interesting challenge. Anywhere in between should work fine too.

Now let me be clear, I do not want to solo. I do not drive other players away or run from them. I just don’t want to have to bring people with me as I go, I want the number of players who are there to be enough, whatever that number may be. Ideally there will always be people around who want to do the same activity, but in practical experience this is almost never the case.

I’ve been having some fun with HoT so far, the maps are interesting and beautiful and I’m still entertained with the exploration elements, but I’m consistently frustrated by trying to actually do anything. I’m still only tier 3, even though I have the mastery points to be like tier 10 or so, just because leveling is way too stingy and worthwhile events are way too few and far between.

I agree with the OP here. So far, I’m making some slow progress in the first zone of the expansion. I’m enjoying the game in small bites, but I’m dying A LOT and progress feels slow. The rest of the game from 1-80 didn’t feel like this. Something feels different now. Something feels wrong.

Now, granted, I’m a filthy casual player that’s barely touched group play and only has exotic gear plus a few ascendeds…but that’s how I play. I like solo play. I like exploration. I like collecting. I like a LITTLE grinding, but not a ton.

I think I’d enjoy the expansion more if it were just re-tuned a bit. I don’t play in the open world expecting to need fast reflexes and no mistakes. That’s why I don’t bother with a lot of group play. I like to play it casually. So far, it feels like this expansion doesn’t have a good place for me…and that’s disappointing. If the open-world enemies were re-tuned so that I don’t lose half my health the second I engage an enemy, I think I’d have a lot more fun with the game. =/

Personally, I’m hoping that things just aren’t balanced yet and things aren’t yet working as intended.

I’ll have to join in with you OP, even if it means being called casual or being told to L2P.

The content just seems a bit over tuned to me. I’m trying to do this on my Mesmer who is in the same predicament. Full exotics with a few Ascended pieces, I’m runed up right and everything, yet I am struggling so much in these new maps.

If I get hit by anything, I’m pretty much dead instantly. I mean shoot, one hit from those baby raptors and I lose half my life. And I feel like I am doing less damage now than before, as before I remember hitting mobs for thousands of damage, now I’m only doing hundreds, yet they are hitting me harder than anything else.

I play at night, and there isn’t much players around during my time when I do get to play, so a lot of it is spent doing everything solo. I mean, I have got like maybe 2 or 3 hero challenges, cause I could commune with them. But otherwise, forget getting my elite specialization now. I don’t stand a chance even attempting these new hero challenges.

It just feels like they tuned this content for group/zerg play only. I am struggling to enjoy it, but when you are constantly dying to what should be an easy fight, it is hard to have any fun.

Pretty Pixie.8603:

I have had no problems looking at a map, seeing where a commander tag is and heading there. What stops you from doing so?

What an absurd comment. None of those silly people running around with their comm tag on have any more of a clue than the next guy in this NEW content.

Sylent.3165:

Open world pve in my opinion is supposed to be a fairly easy casual experience. It’s not anymore, it’s become difficult for a regular solo player to hop on and enjoy. People wanted hard content, they have raids, and fractals, but needed more. They kinda took the casual relaxed players out.

But the content isn’t hard. It’s only hard if you play alone. With a big group it’s really easy.

That’s the reason once again why open world can’t be truly challenging. Mostly because the scaling system is not working perfectly. Doing open world content alone vs with 2 players is already a huge change and makes the content much easier.

Currently I would say the new open-world content is balanced around 5-man groups to be still a kittenallenging (for the average player). But zerging is still super powerfull and solo-ing is really bad.

What anet has to do: Either change the scaling system (a lot of work probably) or seperate solo and “group content” a bit more.

IMO a really great design fault we have in the expansions are the Adventures. They are unavailable most of the time and to activate this “SOLO-content” you have to do a series of GROUP-events. I mean think about it! Who had this idea? … Well, I actually like the idea of the Adventures being instanced but why are they “locked” and unplayable most of the time like that?

All together I would say it would have been much better if the maps were generally design for solo play but with some events that are aimed at bigger groups. Make “Solo Adventures” available all the time and add “Group Adventures” that require a event chain first.

Simply: Make the hard content instanced or optional in the open world.

Avlaen.7241:

the problem about finding a group aswell is so much of the maps require masteries to easily navigate, if you dont have the masteries and others do you get left behind in the dirt. Or if you kitten up and miss a jump/glide you get left behind or you get lost and seperated….

Yes, it’s this aspect of HoT that makes it suck, the PvE element of the Xpac is essentially anti-social. To be more accurate, it’s the introduction of this aspect post level 80 that sucks. If for example the aspect had been present say post level 20 then many PvE peeps would have gone, ‘Mmmm, maybe it’s simpler to just play Aion’.

I like GW2 because it’s a casual game that is interesting and varied enough to continue playing. I grind at work, I work very hard at work. I stopped playing Aion because it became work, and I will stop playing GW2 for the same reason.

Omne.4603:

What does MMO mean?

No where in the definition of MMO does it state that that people have to play together. It merely means that alot of people are on at the same time. It is their narrow minded folks that assume that it means ‘must play with other people’.

I may get yelled at as well……

But gw isn’t gw anymore. We have to many people now who are these awesome epic elite people who quit other mmos because of problems, then came here demanding things in this game which were the reasons they quit the other games to begin with.

Open world pve in my opinion is supposed to be a fairly easy casual experience. It’s not anymore, it’s become difficult for a regular solo player to hop on and enjoy. People wanted hard content, they have raids, and fractals, but needed more. They kinda took the casual relaxed players out.

The regular Joe working 40 hours a week, and who does things outside of gw2 took a massive slap in the face with this expansion

Pretty Pixie.8603:

I have had no problems looking at a map, seeing where a commander tag is and heading there. What stops you from doing so?

Not seeing any com tags at all?

the problem about finding a group aswell is so much of the maps require masteries to easily navigate, if you dont have the masteries and others do you get left behind in the dirt. Or if you kitten up and miss a jump/glide you get left behind or you get lost and seperated….

Hey there.
So I know, right off the bat, there are going to be plenty of people out there saying I’m just “complaining” and whatever, so I’ll try to address some of the possible arguments in this post.
As I’m navigating my way through the jungle, trying to grind out those masteries and get my elite spec, I realized that about four hours had past and I just barely got mastery 1, and not even a heal skill for my elite spec.
Soloing this new content has proven very difficult, many deaths have resulted, but that may be because I’ve only been a causal player. On and off. Right now I’m playing with almost full exotic gear, and I think maybe 2 ascended pieces. Which for a new player, returning player, or other casual players should be fine. You could do most of the content before (aside from higher fractals) without ascended gear.
Now there are some tricky mechanics to these new mobs, and I’ll definitely admit I applaud ANET for all they’ve done. But it gets to the point where it’s no longer rewarding. I’m grinding only for the sake of grinding, getting lost in this massive map (which again, good job, honestly. It’s very impressive), and dying a lot. And almost all the hero challenges are impossible to do solo.
Now, I know some obvious complaints about what I just said after picking through some of the forums.
“Things can’t just be handed to you. Play the game like ANET intended”
“Find a group. A lot of the content is duo-able”
“It’s supposed to be challenging. ACCEPT THE CHALLENGE”
Okay, fair points. Here’s my problem with all of that:
For casual/returning players, we don’t know anybody to duo with! That already makes the game a little more intimidating. It’s not easy to find a group, but it definitely is possible.
The content is supposed to be challenging yes, but not every aspect at that difficulty. Maybe once we have our elite specs it’ll be easier to deal with some of this, but the developers make us work extra hard for that. Which I understand that, but then make the first map at least a little easier until we get adjusted! And the Hero points should be challenging, still solo-able, but challenging. And even the events should have their challenging mechanics (based on the # of ppl). But not the normal trash encounters too. With so many things happening at once all the time in the jungle, it’s hard to not get caught and die. And there aren’t many waypoints around to tp back to. Especially without those masteries.

I really want to enjoy the game, and I’m going to keep trying. But ANET, please, could you ease up a little bit on us? 1st zone should give us a bit of a handicap. I’m not sure I know of any great solutions, but I’ve thought of some ideas for what their worth.

Lower mob mechanics (there shouldn’t be trash mobs, like the frogs, with teleport, stealth, poison, etc.) If they’re going to be that tricky, either reduce the # of them, or give me some hero points!

Maybe introduce a group finder for this content? If it really is intended to be this challenging, then it’s designed for group play. Which I guess I’m okay with, but at least make grouping more accessible. This makes it more obvious to those just entering the zone that group-play is highly encouraged.

Change the way elite specs works. Either reduce the # of points we need to unlock each piece, or at least couple the weapon prof with the first trait and give us the heal skill! those are two very important aspects. I mean I can’t really even use my elite spekittenil most of the tree is unlocked because I’d be sacrificing an entire trait line! Without some skills, that’s just not worth it.

Anyways, you can all commence to make fun of me now for complaining about HoT, but I just had to put my opinion out there and see if anyone else cares about the newbies and returning players.

The new maps are among the most beautiful I’ve seen in any game, let alone MMO.

There is a considerable amount of thought that was placed into each Hero point’s location….and for that I highly commend Anet.

However, some of the champions that you need to kill at these Hero points are simply not solo-able (or even doable with a 2-3 man group). Furthermore, it is incredibly difficult to coordinate a larger amount of people to reach certain Hero points in order to complete them.

I’ve spent quite a bit of effort and reached nearly all of the “remote/hidden” Hero points in the first map, but got absolutely demolished once I activated them.

If these points (or at least the hard to access ones) were made more doable for a 1-3 man group, it would make the Elite leveling system go by much smoother.

HardRider.2980:

Considering there is no underwater combat as far as we know that’s not surprising..
But it also means they know about it and when they finally work on underwater the hype would be soo real.

One would think they would have to if/when they introduce the deep sea dragon. I for one would love the Pact to set up pockets of air on the sea floor, maybe some of which have begun to degrade, creating areas where there were aerial rivers that you could fall out of. Imagine the jumping puzzles!

I, for one, enjoy underwater combat tremendously. I’ve made Frenzy and Kamohoali’i Kotaki, and I’m part way done with Kraitkin. Guess what? I don’t care if anybody sees them, because I made them for ME to look at, because I really like the skins and I really like using them. While it might not be enjoyable for some people, some of us really like underwater combat and would love to see it developed further. In the meantime, I’ll be using my underwater legendaries and enjoying them, whether anyone else sees them or not.

…Again…

From today’s news post:

we will be releasing new legendary weapons in small groups at regular intervals until the full set of sixteen has been added to the game.

There are 19 weapon types in the game. Three of them being the aquatic weapons. ArenaNet seems intent on not making new versions of these three weapons, and now we have confirmation that hold no intent to make a second legendary for them.

This is rather disappointing. Rather than having ArenaNet ignore underwater content, I’d rather they put some effort to improving it. And even if that’s a long-term goal, making 3 skins per weapon set they’re doing shouldn’t be that hard (even more so when so many tridents already share skins with staves, and spearguns with rifles).

Terra.8571:

Sondergaard.8469:

I just got done reading about the plans for the new legendaries. Yes I agree they should be difficult to acquire, but one thing that stood out to me was that you are taking away the option of earning a legendary through a variety of paths.

What I read is that if I want one of the new legendaries I have no choice but to participate in content that I don’t enjoy, and have no desire to play. Examples, World vs World and PvP.

I am not a competitive gamer, and I enjoy playing in PvE environments. When I had heard you were reworking the legendary path to put more focus on an epic journey I was initially excited for this.

Now that I’ve read that that epic journey means I have to go through areas that I would otherwise avoid like the plague (and yes I have tried them many times and never enjoyed it any of the times I did) this is just a huge turn off for me.

I want the ability to have a choice in my journey, and how I acquire my weapon. I do not want a requirement to have to spend hours, even months in content grinding away at something I absolutely do not enjoy for a weapon skin that I would really enjoy having.

Please reconsider this decision.

Legendary weapons were always designed to show a mastery of the entire game, not just PvE. After all, they can be used in all 3 formats. Previous legendaries required WvW badges which when legendaries first existed, required a lot of WvWing or doing the EB JP. Even the latter usually required some PvP ing.

These new legendaries already have made a bit easier as you can buy the PvP shards off the TP when it goes live. Even doing WvW, just join an edge of the mist train. It’s not likely you’ll have to do more than a weekend of it.

In contrast, PvP ers have to do map completion, dungeons (although reward tracks help – they’re not as efficient) and crafting. I currently spend 90% of my time in PvE (use to WvW and PvP a lot) but personally, the little bit of work you have to do in PvP is a small price even for PvE lovers.

With regards to AN decision, I don;t think they will/ need to change it.

Mastery my kitten , this post is so full of it.

From the very beginning you’ve been able to outright buy any legendary from the trading post.

You think that will change by making the precursor account bound, but it won’t.

What they replaced with collections, they introduced new tradeable mat grinds.

Which means you can outright buy ALL of the materials, be they PvP or WvW shards/memories, do none of PvP/WvW, and you can buy the new mats for the collections as well.

Essentially, you only need to do the PvE collections with nontradable mats, but you will be able to buy everything else.

They just made it grindier so more people buy gems to convert to gold. Now they’re gonna nerf gold gains from dungeons and are going to concentrate them on raids who have a weekly lockout, and fractals who have a daily lockout.

You mark my words, they’re gonna nerf gold acquisition from playing the game so that the only people making gold are Trading Post barons and those who purchase gems with RL money.

And what this new path does is introduce even more gold sinks, so if you thought lodestones were dropping in price and you wouldn’t have to spend on a precursor, guess what they introduced new goldsinks in their place.

This whole legendary journey is just a scheme to make a grind that encourages people to open their wallets and buy gems to convert to gold.

style.6173:

I hate PvE but enjoy PvP and WvW. What a lot of your PvE folks don’t understand is that you have to spend WAY more time in PvE to learn a legendary than you do in PvP or WvW.

Why should I be forced to map complete in the expansion? The answer is that a legendary should show progress across all game modes. Ascended gear (which has the same stats as legendary) should be available exclusively through your preferred game mode.

This isn’t really counter to my argument. It in fact supports it. My point is that you shouldn’t HAVE to play a game mode you don’t enjoy. There should be multiple paths, not a required ‘mastery of the whole game’ concept. I don’t like that. I don’t enjoy that, and to me it feels like it goes against ArenaNet’s philosophy of no grind, or a grind that at least doesn’t FEEL like a grind. Every moment I have to spend in pvp or wvw is a grind for me.

Likewise, as you pointed out, for non-pve’ers and people who are exclusive to pvp or wvw shouldn’t be forced to play through hundreds of hours of pve just to acquire a legendary weapon. Each game mode should have its own track towards providing progress on the whole legendary, so people have a choice of acquiring some parts, or all of them from their desired mode.

displacedTitan.6897:

So did the OP and other people miss the part where they said that the PvP and WvW portion could be purchased on the TP or did they just instantly kneejerk and post here?

Buying parts is certainly an option but it takes a lot of the fun out of the adventure. If I wanted to just buy the parts, I’d settle for an ascended which is far easier to obtain and the same stats.

I want the adventure and the journey, but I want to be able to seek that in my desired game mode and not be forced to just drop some cash on the TP and cheat half the journey.

from what i just read its to help even out the economy of the game. well i think the economy is pretty even, pvp,wvw, and dungeons get precursors, they sell, crafter/gatherer buys, makes legendary and sells to pvp, wvw, and dungeon players i call that pretty even. i my self get enough pvp action when i go to wvw to get crest. this is a mmo not e-sport. forcing the pve players to do wvw was accepted, but pvp, i will never do it im not that type of player. Anet is beginning to forget about their pve players although were the ones whom truly support their in game economy. we also spend our hard earned cash on the game, expansion, gems, and gold just like the pvp players and wvw players so why are we being hung out to dry all the time by Anet, ive played gw since launch of gw1 and have really enjoyed it, im really upset that my time, money and endorsement of it to other people, whom buy it, is nothing to them. maybe its time for me to suport another company

Well I hate it that they again found another way to chantage ppl to play that hated PVP
So no new legendaries for me then.

I just got done reading about the plans for the new legendaries. Yes I agree they should be difficult to acquire, but one thing that stood out to me was that you are taking away the option of earning a legendary through a variety of paths.

What I read is that if I want one of the new legendaries I have no choice but to participate in content that I don’t enjoy, and have no desire to play. Examples, World vs World and PvP.

I am not a competitive gamer, and I enjoy playing in PvE environments. When I had heard you were reworking the legendary path to put more focus on an epic journey I was initially excited for this.

Now that I’ve read that that epic journey means I have to go through areas that I would otherwise avoid like the plague (and yes I have tried them many times and never enjoyed it any of the times I did) this is just a huge turn off for me.

I want the ability to have a choice in my journey, and how I acquire my weapon. I do not want a requirement to have to spend hours, even months in content grinding away at something I absolutely do not enjoy for a weapon skin that I would really enjoy having.

Please reconsider this decision.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

It would be a pretty big “wtf!?” if the mursaat returned in huge numbers.

Not as much of a “wtf” as there having been a city in the maguuma that no one has seen this entire time. Besides how do you know what the remaining Mursaat could have done in 250 years? Scarlet made an entire army in a few weeks/months. You wouldn’t need huge numbers either, even a few Mursaat could probably wreck kitten, the last Eidolon I saw was a shield and the Seers aren’t anywhere to be seen.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Mursaat have been established as powerful but selfish kittens who are willing to kitten entire worlds and races for their own existence. They’ve done such twice.

Would you really want those kinds of people as your allies

Wouldn’t be the first time we’ve done that.

I wonder how Elona is doing since we released Palawa Joko.

I’d rather it be a new race with new lore than if it had been a city inhabited by the Mursaat, which would have been blatantly lore breaking.

The whole point of the Flameseeker Prophecies was that it was about the doom of the Mursaat. Their species is nearly extinct with only Lazarus the Dire still potentially being alive. If the Mursaat were not only still alive but thriving it’d make a lot of what we did in GW1 meaningless.

That isn’t to say I don’t want to meet Lazarus the Dire one day and have him return as a major antagonist. There just shouldn’t be an entire city with a thriving Mursaat population.

Derigar.7810:

What boggles my mind is why you do not add polls in-game after completing an event, or after a combat encounter. It’s strange why you don’t do this.

Strangely, they did. For once. During first GW2 closed betas… it was simple and helpful.