Guild Wars 2

Swagger.1459:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Swagger.1459:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

I thought from this thread that it was all just a big joke.

https://np.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/4033fw/gliding_coming_to_central_tyria/

ANet Rubi

XephyrGW2Xephyr

how does it feel to troll more than 2k people? :p

I WAS SO NERVOUS.
But it was gratifying as hell. <3
I’m so, so, so glad y’all liked it.

Guessed you missed the quote from her right under it…

Nope. All it says is that she practiced beforehand. Not that it wasn’t a big joke. Now, I would love to have gliding in Tyria. I’m just saying she admitted on this thread it was a joke and not real.

ANet Rubi

Haha, thanks you guys. <3 So funny behind-the-scenes thing: In the planning and practice of this, my character swooped around, landed, turned to the camera, and then did the point/wink at the viewers. But I wound up overshooting the ledge, Mark saw that it was going to be a potentially ugly landing, so he showed mercy on me by cutting away early.

Oh hey just <3, I just quote and don’t look at names much anymore.

She was practicing for a reason, think about it…

/shrug. I hope y’all are right but her admitting to trolling/teasing and Gaile’s She did what? means I’m going to wait for written confirmation before I start rejoicing,

Good way to advertise HoT for core/free player that do not have it. See other player glide around core map probably make them want HoT more that way.

Pandaman.4758:

Why are so many people assuming suspended accounts won’t get rolled back to the last backup made before Wintersday started? ANet removes gold from accounts that were purchased from gold sellers in addition to the suspension, it’s not going to be any different in this case.

Because he said this

Does this mean that if someone botted they get to keep everything?
Absolutely not, in most cases we are attempting to remove what we can before the player returns. However, there are just going to be some things we can’t remove.

If they rolled the account back they wouldn’t have to attempt to remove what they can and there wouldn’t be some things they can’t remove.

TL:DR – We do not perm ban people any more (copied from wow!) to be able to fight the shrinking population of our players any time now or in future and keep the false impression that our game is alive.

This will bite the revenue of any company in long term because there are people who dislike the fact that there are people who broke the rules in the past and crippled their game experience in some way allowed to play again and didn’t even loose their PAID accounts. (loosing paid account served as punishment for their crimes where 6 months bans serves as vacation for them where they just play f2p account of other games meanwhile)

Example: Next time I see one of those fancy outfits at gemstore a bell will ring somewhere that will remind me that this company allow those people who broke the rules and negatively affected my gameplay in some way to play again without loosing any money for their actions and I will simply not buy any gemstore items till they are properly punished. (TL:DR – maybe devs will pay from their pockets for every player they didn’t properly punish!)

(this applies for every other online game)

Aidenwolf.5964:

Alin.2468:

Aidenwolf.5964:

From the company’s point of view I can certainly see why you wouldn’t perma ban a gold buyer as they’re likely to buy gems legally and sellers perma ban is obvious. I haven’t had to try 6 times to get into a JP since your ban wave so I guess you nabbed a truck load, GG.

I would want to see your face 6 months from now, when you will see that truckload of players coming back and wearing the skin of Wintersday you did not manage to obtain, because of them.

@Chris Cleary: Thank you.

I’m almost done with my 10k drinks I earned from doing the JP. Get on my level.

There is no level to get on, drink prices might fall later on or the very next day and suddenly, it becomes a cheap cheap skin.

Anet is just doing what every mmorpg will do. Banning not only bots but all their related accounts.

Also, there are actual money transaction between her brother’s account, it’ll be hard to plead her case.

Other game company would just automatically close all accounts if they share IP or mac address or credit card.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

At this point it is between her and support. If she is truly innocent she needs to make a ticket and work with ANet about it and make her argument and I doubt ANet will make any more public announcements concerning this.

Yes. If she wants her accout back earlier than in the 6-months (it is not a permanent ban) she should contact A-Net and convince them (not us) that she has nothing to do with this.

If she has already done this, or not, only she knows. But she also said in the video that she will never play GW2 again, even if she gets her account back. Time will tell.

However, the brother transferred 200 (when I remember correctly) gold from his cheating-account to the account of his sister. That is a pattern that is also found by botters/cheaters and that is why (I suppose) A-Net not only bans/suspends the accounts of botters/cheaters but also the accounts that benefits from those by directly receiving gold ec. because they are connected and mostly also in some way involved in the cheating/botting.

Charrbeque.8729:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

@Fox

I think you’re grasping at straws in this whole matter because you want her to be innocent, possibly because you know her personally. However I think it’s most unlikely that ANet did not double check both accounts closely. They had to know who they were as content creators and this means that once it was publicly raised and the two of them both were accusing ANet of falsely suspending them, it’s unlikely they would only double check one account and not the other. Especially in not checking her’s as it was her video and her doing most of the talking. Her brother only came on the video for a short while. If they were only going to double check one, it would have been her, not her brother who was the secondary person on the video.

When her brother came into the video it was pretty obvious he was reading from a script. He didn’t come off as being sincere and seemed more like he didn’t even want to be in the video.

Yah I noticed that and said

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Yeah. That was interesting to listen to. To me, the man’s voice tones in particular sounded like faked outrage rather than sincere upset and them going on about how they’ll never play Guild Wars 2 again when/if their innocent accounts are restored sounded over the top.

His voice was especially flat toned like he was an actor reading a script, badly, that called for a lot of outrage but he was feeling none of it.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

@Fox

I think you’re grasping at straws in this whole matter because you want her to be innocent, possibly because you know her personally. However I think it’s most unlikely that ANet did not double check both accounts closely. They had to know who they were as content creators and this means that once it was publicly raised and the two of them both were accusing ANet of falsely suspending them, it’s unlikely they would only double check one account and not the other. Especially in not checking her’s as it was her video and her doing most of the talking. Her brother only came on the video for a short while. If they were only going to double check one, it would have been her, not her brother who was the secondary person on the video.

When her brother came into the video it was pretty obvious he was reading from a script. He didn’t come off as being sincere and seemed more like he didn’t even want to be in the video.

@Fox

I think you’re grasping at straws in this whole matter because you want her to be innocent, possibly because you know her personally. However I think it’s most unlikely that ANet did not double check both accounts closely. They had to know who they were as content creators and this means that once it was publicly raised and the two of them both were accusing ANet of falsely suspending them, it’s unlikely they would only double check one account and not the other. Especially in not checking her’s as it was her video and her doing most of the talking. Her brother only came on the video for a short while. If they were only going to double check one, it would have been her, not her brother who was the secondary person on the video.

Fox.3469:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Fox.3469:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Fox.3469:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Fox.3469:

I know Stacy, i’ve played with her and helped with some of their videos. Only met her brother at the actual videos. From what i’m getting he did something stupid and she’s being punished for it.

She is one of the most friendly and warm people i know in GW2. Go hate me all you want but i think botters deserve to be banned, and Zack clearly realised he kittened up now. His sister however is guilty by association? I don’t agree with that.

/shrug.

There’s nothing that says friendly, warm people can’t download and use a hack. Someone I know, who is a nice person, knowingly took advantage of an exploit in another game and was banned. People tend to think of cheating in a video game as not real cheating since it’s a game inside a computer and cheating/hacking doesn’t actually hurt anyone else.

She might be innocent or she might not. However Gaile came right out and said that account had done something only possible through a hack, and in a case like this I’m going to believe someone with access to what really happened, and who doesn’t need to save face.

That was about her brother’s account, there are 2 people 2 accounts, both got banned because 1 of them kittened up, i do not agree with this.

Twitter post by Shazbawt (link is on page one of this thread)
Content creators aren’t immune to the rules everyone else has to follow by. Just double-checked, this will stand.

This was posted after the video came out and is about that video. Both were on the video saying they were unfairly banned. Now, you can believe that Shazbawt only bothered to double check one account but not the other but when he says, in reference to that video, that he double checked and this will stand, I think it’s reasonable to think he checked both people’s accounts.

And i’m sorry but gaile gray in this topic only gave the reasons for 1 of them. You would think she would have checked both accounts aswell, but she didn’t, or she held back information. I have no idea why she would do that, so in posting only the info about 1 account, i’m assuming she just checked that account. I want to know why the other was banned.

They may not answer you as you don’t have the right to know. ANet normally doesn’t discuss this sort of thing with people who aren’t directly involved. They have openly commented because the 2 of them were directly and publicly accusing ANet of falsely suspending them, and ANet rebutted the accusation. However this doesn’t mean that they will answer some random forum person who wants to know more.

At this point it is between her and support. If she is truly innocent she needs to make a ticket and work with ANet about it and make her argument and I doubt ANet will make any more public announcements concerning this.

All i want to know, is if they checked both accounts. And if they did, why they went public with only 1. You cannot react like this with only half a statement. Either they both are guilty, or only one of them is, it’s that simple. Zack destroyed his own reputation and he will pay for it, however his sister is still, until proven guilty, someone who has nothing to do with this. But her reputation is destroyed aswell. These are public figures in your community, and i’m all for banning people that actually cheat. But since Stacy is still a fairly well known content creator, if she didn’t do anything, she is being unfairly treated.

You know, she could be innocent of actually doing anything and her account still be guilty. Her brother admitted to as little as he could get away with but its not impossible to think he did use the hack in both accounts and got mastery points/hero points on both accounts. Of course this means she knew of it afterwards at the very least, but it still would show up as her account hacking even if she wasn’t the actual hacker.

Fox.3469:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Fox.3469:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Fox.3469:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Fox.3469:

I know Stacy, i’ve played with her and helped with some of their videos. Only met her brother at the actual videos. From what i’m getting he did something stupid and she’s being punished for it.

She is one of the most friendly and warm people i know in GW2. Go hate me all you want but i think botters deserve to be banned, and Zack clearly realised he kittened up now. His sister however is guilty by association? I don’t agree with that.

/shrug.

There’s nothing that says friendly, warm people can’t download and use a hack. Someone I know, who is a nice person, knowingly took advantage of an exploit in another game and was banned. People tend to think of cheating in a video game as not real cheating since it’s a game inside a computer and cheating/hacking doesn’t actually hurt anyone else.

She might be innocent or she might not. However Gaile came right out and said that account had done something only possible through a hack, and in a case like this I’m going to believe someone with access to what really happened, and who doesn’t need to save face.

That was about her brother’s account, there are 2 people 2 accounts, both got banned because 1 of them kittened up, i do not agree with this.

Twitter post by Shazbawt (link is on page one of this thread)
Content creators aren’t immune to the rules everyone else has to follow by. Just double-checked, this will stand.

This was posted after the video came out and is about that video. Both were on the video saying they were unfairly banned. Now, you can believe that Shazbawt only bothered to double check one account but not the other but when he says, in reference to that video, that he double checked and this will stand, I think it’s reasonable to think he checked both people’s accounts.

And i’m sorry but gaile gray in this topic only gave the reasons for 1 of them. You would think she would have checked both accounts aswell, but she didn’t, or she held back information. I have no idea why she would do that, so in posting only the info about 1 account, i’m assuming she just checked that account. I want to know why the other was banned.

They may not answer you as you don’t have the right to know. ANet normally doesn’t discuss this sort of thing with people who aren’t directly involved. They have openly commented because the 2 of them were directly and publicly accusing ANet of falsely suspending them, and ANet rebutted the accusation. However this doesn’t mean that they will answer some random forum person who wants to know more.

At this point it is between her and support. If she is truly innocent she needs to make a ticket and work with ANet about it and make her argument and I doubt ANet will make any more public announcements concerning this.

All i want to know, is if they checked both accounts. And if they did, why they went public with only 1. You cannot react like this with only half a statement. Either they both are guilty, or only one of them is, it’s that simple. Zack destroyed his own reputation and he will pay for it, however his sister is still, until proven guilty, someone who has nothing to do with this. But her reputation is destroyed aswell. These are public figures in your community, and i’m all for banning people that actually cheat. But since Stacy is still a fairly well known content creator, if she didn’t do anything, she is being unfairly treated.

They will if Zack puts in a ticket. Given Zack’s public admittance to using illegal programs, ANet’s not likely to come out and say if they’ve checked his account or not. Even if Zack puts in a ticket.

The sister likely got checked since it was her account that was referenced in this post.

And what does her being a content creator have anything to do with the situation? It shouldn’t matter if she was a content creator or not. Content creators should not get treated any different than those who just play the game.

Fox.3469:

Gaile Gray.6029:

Customer Support has carefully reviewed the data that resulted in the termination of the game account in question. They verified that this account accessed 29 map points in under 60 seconds. It is not possible to accomplish this without the use of a third-party program, the kind of program that is expressly forbidden by our User Agreement and our Rules of Conduct.

Because of these facts, the account termination will not be reversed.

You are speaking of “this account” while the fact of the matter is you banned 2 people’s accounts here, care to clear that up? Did both cheat or was 1 just found guilty by living in the same house?

What if I tell you I botted on 1 account I don’t care, and sent the money to my main account.

Should my main account get banned?

I’m not saying Suck at Love deserved to be banned, I’m saying it is common practice to ban people sharing ip/mac address/credit card with botters. That’s what every mmorpg company is doing.

Fox.3469:

I know Stacy, i’ve played with her and helped with some of their videos. Only met her brother at the actual videos. From what i’m getting he did something stupid and she’s being punished for it.

She is one of the most friendly and warm people i know in GW2. Go hate me all you want but i think botters deserve to be banned, and Zack clearly realised he kittened up now. His sister however is guilty by association? I don’t agree with that.

/shrug.

There’s nothing that says friendly, warm people can’t download and use a hack. Someone I know, who is a nice person, knowingly took advantage of an exploit in another game and was banned. People tend to think of cheating in a video game as not real cheating since it’s a game inside a computer and cheating/hacking doesn’t actually hurt anyone else.

She might be innocent or she might not. However Gaile came right out and said that account had done something only possible through a hack, and in a case like this I’m going to believe someone with access to what really happened, and who doesn’t need to save face.

Aidenwolf.5964:

May I ask why you sound like a person calling for forgivness of cheating? You’ve called out the GW2 community for being pleased hackers were banned.

Jeez… I never said to simply forgive them. They are wrong a 100%. All I said was they are already punished enough with temporarily loosing their accounts and being shamed here and on reddit. No need for a crowd of forks and burning torches running after them, or is this the proper way to address cheaters?

ShelBlackblood.7826:

@ArenaNet
So the thread is back. May I ask why?

Gaile post in thread as to cheat. So probably main reason. Also probably as warn to player think about cheat, maybe plan cheat, then cheat, then lie about not cheat when caught. Short story, bad to make video blame Anet for ban and say not cheat. Then hide video when Anet prove cheat. Anet prove cheat. Then say how cheat and sorry only after caught.

This thread is good to show player that might consider cheat. Yes time to not flame cheater any more. But keep thread alive as warning to people like the person that cheat might want to try cheat program.

Just show how cheat can affect other and cause big problem. Thread is good to show this. In other word, this thread is advertise how cheat can cause big problem. Advertise how cheat will ruin every thing for player and how person cheat can make problem for other.

Godmoney.2048:

Immortal.3647:

i have the feeling that this community is one of the worst… the suck at love thread on reddit and the one over here are like magnets for toxic ill manered players.

LOL the Gw2 community is the worst because we don’t support piece of filth, disgusting, worthless cheating pieces of human refuse?

That’s rich. Real rich to expect people to support cheating, liars.

I’m just going block you in game since you have sympathies for people like this. The next step is for you to start cheating yourself.

“Piece of filth”
“disgusting”
“worthless pieces of human”

Oh, my. Calm down dude. I’m sure you are not the kind of person who wishes that thiefs and liars get their hands or tongues chopped off the instant they were caught. I’m just telling you this in case you didn’t know: There are living human beings behind those accounts, with, you know, something called feelings. Ever heard of that?

I used to be moderator in a manga forum some years ago and you, my friend, would’ve gotten a big red warning for such a post. And that warning would be visible under your username -forever- so that everyone could see that you behaved like a duck at least once. Ignorant users would block you as soon as they see the red letters under your username because you “were a bad person”.

Maybe that manga community was just too nice since I was never forced to give someone such a warning, but maybe posts like yours are considered normal nowadays…?

@ArenaNet
So the thread is back. May I ask why?

ryandeniszorro.6735:

While i agree on this, i still think community , at least part of it was , at least, mean. there are actual ppl behind there, with feelings, and i dont see how putting them down helps.
One more thing, i personally have two super clear hack reports from wvw over 3 months old now , with several vids with names, and screenshots, and those two are still logging in and play every day !

Again i am not on S@L side, they did wrong. But i do find quite convenient for Anet to have means to say "look , see, no one is safe from ban ".

Of course there are mean people in this community. There are mean people in every community. And those mean people are often the most visible people. You can’t draw any conclusions out of how the community is by what, a handful of gleeful posts?

The community is fine. It has it’s bad apples all communities do, but this sort of thing does bring those people out of the woodwork.

And many people are just happy that cheaters are being banned because it’s good for the game.

jayson.6512:

A fellow guild mate of mine also ask Anet to double check if there system is 100% accurate because his been accuse of Real money trading but he never sell any in game item for real cash and what shock us is his been in active for almost 1 year and the last time he log in to the game was when HoT are coming out then anet insist that he sold some item with real money which is absurd.

This is a very common story.

10 to 1, your buddy was hacked. Idle accounts seem to attract such attention. He needs to open up a support ticket, clean house on his computer and change his passwords. All of them.

ryandeniszorro.6735:

I wanted to say just few things not about ban but about how we as community went into this. First reddit post with stupid , shameful redditors, who laughed and mocked this two people.
Then GW2 official forums, thriving on this ban.
Is this what GW2 community is now ? Is it best joy for you to see someone sad and upset ?
Sure they made mistake, but is community best response to laugh at that and mock ?

While you are all so happy someone got ban ill leave you this example , how many of you did and do now EXPLOIT fractals mossman to get easy pass ? How many of you were asked in pug group to do mossman exploiting this , and agreed , or got kicked from party if you said “lets do it normal” ? Skipping events Arah for months, remember ? Map breaking for easy JP ? And so on…. Is it really that different ?

And again, as much as it was wrong what they did, i feel that community response on that was far worse.

my 2c

I don’t think people are happy they got banned. I think people are angry that these people tried to deceive them.

If they came out with a video saying we did the wrong thing and we were banned, this level of attention wouldn’t exist. They didn’t. They lied about it in a video, blaming Anet for what happened to them, then pulled the video when Anet responded.

That’s worthy of ridicule if you ask me. And yes, I’m happy people who break the rules get banned, because I don’t break the rules. This is a game. People who don’t follow the rules, should be banned to keep the game fair. I’m happy when that happens.

Hacking isn’t a mistake. Spilling your drink is a mistake. They didn’t accidentally hack. They deliberately violated the rules, for which they were rightfully punished, then tried to use their “fame” to make themselves look better than they were.

This is simply bad behaviour.

aerial.7021:

That really was thought provoking thanks for the effort in adding it here.

Anytime.

It is a game at the end of the day, and anyone telling these 2 people to kill themselves need to get hold of themselves and take a real long look in the mirror. Pixels < Human life.

I don’t want to play with them, hopefully, it’s never an issue, but I’d never wish illness, evil or death on them.

Be mad and frustrated and feel scammed and lied to, you’re justified in that, but asking for their life? C’mon. That’s sick and twisted behavior no one should be subjected to unless they committed a mortal sin against you. Pixel manipulation I’m pretty sure isn’t one of them..

Zok.4956:

I do not hate them and I think some people are over reacting now. And I think after they served their sentence (the ban) they should get a 2nd chance.

I don’t hate them. That’s such a strong word, especially for 2 kids I don’t even know. I simply have no respect for what transpired, and zero sympathy for their plight.

I was just reading that thread over on Reddit, and a post in the ‘Suck At Love’ thread by a user named ‘darthyoshiboy’ really caught my attention. I wanted to come share over here. I hope he doesn’t mind. I thought it something very thought provoking and well written.

Never heard of those kids and personally couldn’t care less about their half-witted attempts to justify cheating.

As far as I can tell, Anet investigated the matter, the players in question were found guilty and got banned accordingly. Only regrets I have over this is that the ban doesn’t appear to be permanent.

Botting or cheating in general has been around since the start of gaming. (I remember back in the 80’s….but that’s another story.)
Generally, most companies, and even private servers with GM’s, act swiftly and ban players after careful investigation. These bans can be temporary (mostly for minor infractions) or permanent.
The fact remains that it gives players an unfair advantage, no matter how long it’s used for, and while it’s very convincing to say ‘oh, but i only used it once’, the intent was there to cheat.

If you sit behind the wheel of your car while you’re drunk, over here you will be arrested and you will lose your drivers licence. You didn’t even drive the car, but you had the intent to do it, putting other people in harms way.
They are oc completely different things, but they follow the same principle : you break the rules, you pay for it.

I find the 10K drink requirement totally rediculous, but i won’t start cheating to get it. I find the endless grind for map farming nodes tedious, but i won’t use a bot to farm it, or to get to JP’s.

So why should someone with the intent to cheat or someone who actually cheated and broke the rules get away scott free ? By farming the wintersday JP over and over, some (most) bots interrupted my gameplay. They prevented me from entering the JP on numerous occasions, they enriched themselves by cheating.
So this guy who cheated by using the bot to get to JP’s or to farm nodes, even for a few minutes or an hour, why should’nt he be banned ?

1. he cheated and lied about it.
2. she, unaware or not, made a video about it, where he actually LIED.
3. Anet investigated and banned their accounts, probably because it cannot be determined on which pc the cheating happened OR because some gold or mats were transferred between acounts, who knows.

Fact is, they got a 6 month ban.
Fact is, it won’t be overturned.
Fact is, he should have been honest from the start instead of getting caught with his pants down.
Now half the community is spitting him/them out and the other half is discussing wether or not she was in on it.

I for one, don’t care if she was in on it or not. HE shouldn’t have lied to her and he shouldn’t have used the bot in the first place.

And if she needs to put the blame somewhere, don’t put it on Anet, blame your brother for the mess.

aerial.7021:

reapex.8546:

Grind Wars is a named deserve by over 90% of MMORPGs imo. It was easy to obtain gold in GW1 just by salvaging for the materials and selling the mats in Kamadan.

It’s much harder in GW2 due to many circumstance, we should also not ignore the elephant in the corner either, that it’s very alluring for a business model to have vested interest in making it harder due to the cash > gems > gold path way they have built into the game, and if you’re the beholder of a cynical attitude you can see that caked over every part of the game as a whole, the most difficult of questions to ask how to fairly balance the issue for both the company and the user of the system so that both are equally rewarded.

GW1 System was far superior when it comes to the economy, if only because you couldn’t buy gold “legally” you had to earn it.

There were more bots in GW1 than in GW2, there was another great purging of bots in GW1 in 2014. Several GW1 players turn to illegal sites, since you could not buy currency legally in GW1 with real money. GW1 is superior in several areas but when it comes to preventing bots GW2 wins, imo.

eduardo.1436:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/3zrbe4/a_response_from_suck_at_love/

Ok, the beans are out. The brother and sister musical duo did teach, at least the brother and I do think it is fair that he gets banned for 6 months. But is there a way to give the sister her account back?

He admitted to lying.

That doesn’t mean that she was telling the truth.

Maybe, just maybe, he did more than he admitted to, and so did she. And just maybe, ANet’s computers caught it where Gaile said her account accessed multiple map points within 60 seconds.

Pandaman.4758:

If you want to stack, run with people who want to stack. If you want to do it normally, run with people who want to do it normally.

As long as you can do more damage within melee range and buffs are limited to melee range, stacking will always be efficient. As long as it remains efficient, people will continue to do it.

Similarly, as long as there are mobs that can be skipped, people will skip them unless people think there’s a ‘reasonable’ reward for slowing down long enough to kill them.

There’s no ‘proper’ way to do content. People will always look for the most fun and/or efficient method that the tools of the game allow.

Tspatula.9086:

I mean to start my task to get my job done on time… I mean to have…..fun? The new maps aren’t really worth entering without doing the main meta events no matter how fun gliding is or how beautiful they are….

You’ve been talking about how unfun this game is and how terrible ANet is for more than a year and yet… Here you are? Interesting.

Almighty Dervisher.6720:

Ah so this is what a HoT player is like.

I’m sorry, do I need to provide my provenance? I played in the GW1 beta, and continued to play GW1 for seven years after its release. I’ve also been playing GW2 since release day (I did play in the beta, but only for an hour or so so I don’t usually bother mentioning it). My experience with HoT has been rocky and though I like certain things it’s added to the game, I also think ANet screwed the pooch on a number of points and I’m not entirely happy with the direction the game has gone.

However, that doesn’t mean that I’m going to agree with every criticism of it. In the case of your criticism, I disagree with such a reductionist approach.

Almighty Dervisher.6720:

You’re ignoring the skills listing, didn’t bother checking the Guild Wars wikis.

I’m not ignoring the skill listings. I’m making the argument that they are inadequate on their own to explain the impact an Elite Specialization has. You are oversimplifying. I didn’t bother to check the wikis because I already know what they contain, and in any case I’m not inclined to do homework before commenting on a post that I don’t think is particularly well thought-out in the first place.

Almighty Dervisher.6720:

I listed the Elite Specializations as part of the “Skill per profession”, because it’s almost the exact same thing. Skills are skills, no matter what fancy wording you use.

Except GW2 professions are more than just their skills. Weapon skills interact with a profession differently from Utility skills, for one thing, both of which interact with it differently from changes to profession mechanics. Furthermore, each Elite Specialization comes with a unique set of traits which alter (sometimes radically) the way the profession is played.

Ayrilana.1396:

thehipone.6812:

maddoctor.2738:

Not this thread again…

I made a more complete comparison in another thread (or rather an actual comparison since yours isn’t comparing anything)

Here:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/hot/HoT-living-world-season-3/first#post5764319

The tl:dr:

Exploration: HoT: 238, EotN: 98
Skills: HoT: 418, EotN: 150
Skins: HoT: 563, EotN: 403

Eotn was less than half of HoT and HoT is just 10$ more.

I like how you count HoT points of interest as exploration “content” but then completely ignore 124 quests and other stuff like Oggy from EotN.

They should have counted the number of events added with HoT and compared them to the 124 quests in EotN. They still can.

Looks like there are 58 events in VB alone…