Guild Wars 2

Urrid.4593:

It just blows my mind that this isn’t already a thing. Sure they might be “working on something” more elegant than this, but I don’t see how implementing a system so simple would hurt in the mean time.

Especially when the feedback since the BW1 strongly suggested the C&S system was completely inadequate. How long is a reasonable about of time to make these changes…. we are coming up to a year soon.

I’d like to say we have basic group commands in WvW… but we don’t even have that. How can this have gone on as long with no UI functionality for groups in WvW.

Just give us the same WORKING options in WvW that we have in ANY PvE zone.

People are running private squads already in the game WITHOUT any in game tools. It’s clunky and not nearly as effective as when we use the commander system….. but they will continue to run them.

They simply need to use a setup like Dawdler posted to take the frustration out of running multiple groups or guild groups together. Let the PLAYERS form groups and squads the way the works best for US!

How about a grouping system that lets us form squads the WAY we enjoy??!

They need a private or guild only squad system to form forces under the 25 person limit.

eldavo.6054:

In GW2 higher pop matchups, groups of all sizes play important roles.

Exactly… yet GW2 gives us TWO choices to group in game for WvW. 5-man group or a massive zerg where you can’t control the numbers to stay under the 25 person limit for stealth capping.

We NEED a private or guild only squad system that allows players or guilds to group the way they enjoy instead of being forced into a system they don’t enjoy.

The basic ability to GROUP in WvW the way you enjoy should be at the top of the list for changes. Single group, Guild only or Private squads and public zergs should have been in the game at release.

Have ALL grouping system types and let the players and guilds choose the one that works best for them. Most guilds are using a “private” setup anyways, but it’s a jumbled ad-hock system of running separate groups together, marking a driver and having to use 3rd party voice program for dedicated communications.

Horrible, Horrible and Horrible for a modern day MMO that requires social grouping and communication for WvW.

WvW content and bug fixes seem to be last on the list. Grouping and managing groups in WvW is abysmal. Still only have either a 5 man group or a zerg, no sign of private squad systems yet.

We don’t have the ability to kick, invite or manage groups through the guild UI in WvW. We’re not even asking for new coding here…. just give us the same group options in WvW that they currently have in PvE. Very sad….

Another good suggestion but I’d add one more thing. Creating a guild only squad should also be able to include people NOT in the guild. A private grouping system should be inclusive to all people regardless if they are in a guild or not.

Just as anyone can join a public commander pin then non-guild members should be allowed to be invited to a guild squad. Give us the tools and flexibility to create any type of grouping system and let the players or guilds choose what works best for them.

DanyK.3842:

This has actually been mentioned in beta3 if I’m not mistaken. Just take a deep breath and accept the fact that Arenanet will never consider implementing such system. A year has passed since they aknowledged this is a demand and a year without them doing anything. You won’t be positively surprised. Btw prepare to have this post moved to ‘Suggestions’ aka ‘We do not care’ section.

I sure hope they realize how bad their social grouping system is. With all the feedback they have to be aware of it. A decent grouping system needs to be flexible for all play styles and let the players or guilds form the way that works best for them. We simply need a guild or private grouping system that allows multiple groups to coordinate better in the game.

kelman.9451:

Wrong, all this means is now large guild zergs will rule and that is it period. The commander tag gives a PUG and smaller guilds a chance to do something.

Get over it, this game is about army size nothing will change that but to limit the amount of people per man per server.

We need the current commander system AND a private grouping system for guilds or medium forces. There is room in the game for both.

AndrewSX.3794:

Why do WvW updates always encourage blobbing?

One out of two:
-they want to cater casuals cause they’ve finally decided to downgrade WvW to PvP for bored Pvers to cater them to the “pro Esport” Spvp, so they actually want zerging and skillless playing.
-they have no clue about WvW.

Unfortunately the casual PvP player gets more priority over the guilds that enjoy running together but don’t have a decent IN-GAME grouping system to play together. If you don’t want to zerg, but have more than 5 people you have to use an inefficient system of running multiple groups together and using 3rd party programs.

How about a guild or private squad system so we can… you know.. actually group together without attracting every single player in the zone to our guild event?

From the shear amount of posts I’ve made on the current inadequate grouping system in GW2…. I don’t know how they could have missed them.

The basic ability to group with the amount of people we want and the WAY we want should be a fundamental feature of GW2. This should be a top priority for WvW IMO.

We NEED a flexible grouping system for all players and guilds…. instead of being forced to zerg or run a single group. Any other attempts to run separate multiple groups together will never be as effective as an IN-GAME grouping system.

New maps are great.. but we still don’t have a DECENT grouping system to use. With only TWO possible ways to group up in GW2 is a joke IMO. You need a proper system for private squads and guilds to run multiple groups. A 5-man group or zerg are horrible options.

Running separate multiple groups beside each other, marking a “driver” and forced to use a 3rd party voice program for dedicated communications is a horrible grouping system for a modern day MMO. But that’s the most effective way currently to run multiple groups together in GW2.

So we get new maps that we STILL can’t group up in the way we like…. they need guild only or private squads in the game.

BlazeQ.1095:

Many WvW Commanders just lead their own guilds. Id rather just see the ability to have separate commander tag colors. But this topic has been beaten to death….. I hope the devs are working on something to make as many people happy as possible.

That makes two of us. This is a modern day MMO… we need a modern day grouping system that meets the needs of ALL player grouping styles and enjoyment. Only have two way to group properly in WvW is silly.

Give us more in game grouping tools than just a 5 man group or a massive zerg.

Aberrant.6749:

I prefer to run with a guild leader tagless… everyone just calls target on him instead. That way we don’t have to deal with bad/not in mumble/squishy pugs rallying the opposing forces.

Yah Aberrant that is currently the ONLY way in the game to run multiple groups together in a private force…. and that’s sad. It’s clunky, annoying and frustrating at times. Having that visual commander pin for all the groups to see is so much more efficient, but you become an instant zerg and that’s not what many guilds want.

Let’s get a way for guilds and players to form private squads if that’s what they enjoy doing. Using the ad hoc system multiple groups are forced to use if they want to run together is horrible.

Or show all the commander tags, both public and private. Private or guild only commander’s could show as a different color than a public one. Be nice to have a tool tip when you hover over a pin showing: public/private, number of players currently in the squad and perhaps a short 20 character description of what the squad is doing.

description IE: “guild only”; “Havoc force”; “Taking towers”; etc.

I don’t think we need to “eliminate” public zergs as there is a place and need for them at times. We simply need to have viable alternatives to group up which will help reduce the size of the zergs and spread the fighting over the map more. Private squads would help do this.

Dawdler.8521:

Clockradio.3257:

Real guilds only use commander tags when they want pugs… Running tagless and with everyone in a party solves all the problems in this thread…

That may be true, but have you ever run in a 30+ man guilds vs just as many enemies? Just try to follow the commander in combat. It aint easy. Not impossible sure, but its so easy to loose him even when marked as a target because the red circle sort of drowns in the sea of red tags. The commander tag helps ALOT in this situation… Unfortunetly the average PUG does not as the enemy res on that level 20 berserker ranger that thought he was all cool trying to run with the big boys. I’m not really for guilds “hiding” themselves, but I do see a need for it.

So to recap the menu, rather than just having a “Create Squad” button, should have:
- A text box where you can type in a short description (maybe 20 letter)
- “Public” tickbox (default ticked), where public shows to all on the server and unchecked it shows only to the current group the Commander is in and Guild
- Dropdown menu with primary/secondary colors (red, yellow, blue, green, orange, violet)
- (OPTIONAL EXTRAVAGANCA) Dropdown menu with a choice of shapes (dorito, upside down dorito, whatever, maybe 5 of them)

And that would suddenly make those 100g alot more worth it for everyone.

Ok this Dawdler guy gets it. I’d be quite happy with those changes. There NEEDS to be some kind of private or guild grouping system to coordinate better without expected to lead a zerg. Can you run multiple group forces together without putting the commander pin up…. yes,but it feels clunky and inadequate.

Add this

Trying to keep multiple guild groups together without using the commander system is possible but feels clunky and inadequate compared to the commander with a visible pin.

Major update needed for coordinating in WvW.

Keep the current system for public zergs. Just add the option for commanders to “flag private” the squad so only those currently in the squad can see the icon.

I guarantee that you will have a more dynamic battlefield with medium sized private/guild forces while still having a public zerg for solo and random people to join. Have tools for ALL squad sizes and types and let the players choose what works best for them.

selan.8354:

i would love to have different colors for commander tags. and making them private for guild only for example, people would have a harder time to spy by having a character sitting at spawn.
please anet adress this.

still waiting!

If we actually had a way for guilds and smaller groups to group and organize, perhaps we’d have less zergs. Having NO other way in the game for more than 5 people to group that is a zerg commander pin is part of the problem.

Give us a way to form private or guild only squads and we’d have less zerging and more medium sized forces all over the map.

Gudradain.3892:

+1

but good luck getting it…

All we can do is continue to express our desire for a commander and squad system that PLAYERS would like. This is all stuff we’ve asked for since BW1 and hopefully the devs will understand the frustration we’re feeling.

Gudradain.3892:

Still not moved to suggestion forum!

Still no separate WvW suggestions subforum either. This simple thing could help the WvW devs actually facilitate WvW feedback easier.

All this stuff, including private squads and colored commander tags for guild squads were suggested and asked for back in the beta weekend events.

ANYTHING would be an improvement at this time.

gennyt.3428:

I don’t think this is something to be afraid of, there will always, always be pugs and pug commanders. But why punish people who want to move as a guild with clumsy grouping? As is it now, its either disjointed 5 man teams or massive, ambiguous blobs. And if your argument is “but guilds already move around tagless”, then why would it hurt to have a guild tag, what would that take from you(the person who can’t see them on the map anyway)?

Completely agree. Every MMO we’ve played that had a public and private grouping system ALWAYS had some kind of public raid/squad running for random and solo players to join. Communities will always make sure everyone is included for server success.

Guilds and players will run private forces whether we actually have in game tools to support it. So instead of running separate multiple groups using a clunky, frustrating and inadequate way we’d do the same thing with a modified C&S system that we can make private.

The difference is it will be easier to coordinate which will make the game more enjoyable.

Naughty Goddess.3018:

PLEASE make the Commander pin…..account wide! I play a lot of WvW on my whole account 6 players at the moment.

WvW Wish: Player rank account wide like in sPvP.

Really curious if they are actually listening to WvW feedback from players… serious WvW and commander changes needed.

renmei.3102:

Or please make different tags for WvW and pve and have them obtainable in different ways. Commander tags are very useful for large guilds when doing guild missions and events.

I remember getting the commander tag and thinking now our guild can coordinate and run together for guild events and guild WvW. Trying to create fast moving havoc forces became extremely difficult when everyone in the zone flocked to the pin and became “back seat” commander or complained because we weren’t leading the zerg. Our intention was never to lead the zerg, simply to coordinate our multiple guild groups.

We almost never flag the pin now, simply not worth the trouble. We prefer havoc forces and are forced to run separate groups, using 3rd party voice instead of the more effective C&S system because you can’t make private grouping over 5 people in GW2.

Arenanet, let’s have a flexible grouping system that allows ALL players and guilds to group the way we enjoy. We need some type of closed or private grouping system if we choose to play the way.

PetricaKerempuh.7958:

but particles on new armor skins not matching old armor skins is way more important than skill lag and unbalanced wvw matches…

Make it so #1!!

iNaddict.8021:

If you are a commander.. the map should zoom out and you have a birds eye view of everything.. ALA star craft 2… what would be lol..

then you can give commands that way.

Be nice to have a Zone commander leading, and sub-commander / guild commanders that he can issue orders too. This way guilds can flag private and form squads the way they want and the zone commander can see where they are, how many people in each squad and issue orders.

Lots of stuff they could do.. but first they need to allow private commander forces for guilds.

Herr der Friedhoefe.2490:

We’ve been asking for this pretty much since day one. Zero result so far.

As they are working on changes to the C&S system I feel there is some relevant feedback in this thread that should be on the first page!

:)

Urrid.4593:

Anet – please give us the ability to choose the color of our commander tag and the ability to make these tags public or private!

Anet, if you do this, you will see a massive renaissance in how WvW is played that de-emphasizes massive zergs and encourages new, exciting, play.

Good to see other people suggesting this. I’ve been a strong advocate of private grouping systems and allowing guilds and players to group the way we enjoy.

Currently the best way to form a private force in GW2 is by running multiple groups together, forcing everyone to use a 3rd party voice program (no dedicated chat channel for multiple groups) and marking a “driver” with a bulls-eye to follow. This may be the best way to do it… but it’s clunky and frustrating compared to running under a commander and squad system.

Whatever changes they make to the C&S system they NEED to have options to create private forces or allow multiple groups to run together better than we can atm. The lack of flexible grouping systems is one of the biggest disappointments and frustrations in WvW for our guild.

Entire C&S system needs a major update. They have said they are going to upgrade it, but no time line and no idea exactly “how” they plan to upgrade it.

DevonCarver.5370:

Upgrading the commander system and UI is on our goal list. It’s a complicated task, requiring lots of resources however, which means it isn’t going to happen overnight. Believe me though, I find our commander system almost entirely lacking in useful functionality.

Here is the post: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/Commander-squad-not-working/page/2#post2350808

I hope they really make changes that players want….. some kind of private commander system for guild events is a big one for me.

Clockradio.3257

You can effectively move your entire squad around without using a commander tag. It just takes practice and voice comms really help. I know this because my guild does this nearly every single night. The only time someone tags up is when there is no other commander on the map, and usually then we just have one person tag up to lead whoever wants to follow (most of the pugs), while we run a separate group around the map without a tag.

As far as the chat thing, if you really need to type something out, use guild chat.

I guess we disagree on the term “effective”, but hey that’s ok. Many in our guild have run small groups/forces since DAOC. The MOST effective way of running multiple groups is using 3rd party voice programs and marking a “driver” and using points of interest to rally if we get split up. That is currently the best in game option to create a private force consisting of multiple groups.

Running multiple groups described above is NOT as effective as running the same groups within a commander and squad system. Sometimes not everyone are able to get into 3rd party voice, or not everyone in guild chat are doing WvW…. this is where a C&S system is more handy.

If they allowed commanders to hide the pin to everyone who’s not currently in the squad, IMO it would be easier and more effective than running the way we currently do. There will always be a public commander up, but for those guilds that prefer private smaller multiple group forces…. using a modified C&S system would be easier and less frustrating for guild events.

Talmor.9048:

Nope, do not want Guild Tags. One of the parts that initially drew me to WvWvW is that as a non-guild member, I could easily identify the action and get there by looking at the tag.

It segregates and alienates PUGs from Guilds too much. I for one hope that they do not have guild tags and keep the system intact as it is. But that is my opinion.

Clockradio.3257:

Real guilds only use commander tags when they want pugs… Running tagless and with everyone in a party solves all the problems in this thread…

I think the point here is guilds can’t effectively group and do the things that that enjoy, and the way they enjoy. Running seperate multiple groups together, with no dedicated channel and targeting a “driver” is NOT an effective system for private grouping. Having a visual pin like the commander and squad system is simply more effective for organizing and coordinating guild groups.

Clockradio.3257:

One pug who doesn’t know what’s going on can rally an entire enemy force and wipe the guild group they’re following.

This exactly. We tried running with multiple guild groups and used the commander pin to organize better. Even though we announced in /team and /map that the pin was for guild havoc groups, random people joined us. Our attempts at speed and ambushing were destroyed with random people tagging every guard and yak we passed. There will always be public commanders for random people to join, but the lack of a system for guilds to group privately is ridiculous.

For a modern day MMO, we certainly don’t have a modern day grouping system. Give us the tools to form forces the way we ENJOY instead of clunky workarounds.

Dawdler.8521:

Dont forget that color and description should be customizable as well. Then it become possible to organize while having visible tags. Like a red tag that says “WoW Guild Raid” or one thats blue and says “Here be PUGs”, etc.

You dont have to hardcode invisible guild tags – make it a social part of the WvW overhead map instead.

It should be a simple matter for ANET considering everything they have added to WvW since release, but no. They completely ignore it.

Having a tool tip when you hover over a commander tag would be great. Something showing the current player amounts in the squad and perhaps a short 15-20 character description of what the squad is focusing on.

Give us a decent commander/squad grouping system that actually allows players and guilds to group the way they WANT. Private or guild only grouping system for more than 5 people are needed badly.

Luthan.5236:

Yes. We need different suggestion forums. Also for sPvP.

Agree, both WvW and sPvP are such different aspects of the game from PvE they should each have a seperate suggestion forum. Having WvW and sPvP buried in the massive PvE suggestions just makes no sense.

SoPP.7034:

Ahmrill.7512:

Please allow the tools for players to coordinate in the way that works best for them. Some type of private grouping system is desperately needed.

Absolutely and desperately are key words here.

And in part this is the reason why huge zerg blobs have become the meta. In short, it’s easier and more effective.

How many of us have tried to organise small havoc groups?

If you pin up your accused of breaking up the zerg and not doing what the “map” wants.

Don’t pin up and you will be asked repeatedly “where are you again?” You are then stopping at easily located places for members to catch up and regularly as members get lost or new members join.

sigh

There is a significant niche element here that has been neglected for too long.

Sounds like you’ve experienced the same frustrations our guild has. The lack of FLEXIBLE ways to group hinders our gaming experience and our fun in general. Give us the tools to group whatever way we want and each guild or player will choose the way that works best for them.

SoPP.7034

I’ve seen a few Nord posts on this and I am in 100% agreement.

What I find amusing is that if ANet is serious about breaking down the zerg this should have been a given. It takes a lot of unnecessary work to coordinate a skirmish/havoc group.

“It takes a lot of unnecessary work to coordinate a skirmish/havoc group.”

That line you posted Sopp says it all. It should NOT be this difficult to group and form squads they way you want, and play the way you want. Two choices in game – either run a 5 man group or zerg. Any other way players try to coordinate is clunky, frustrating and usually requires 3rd party programs to communicate. There is no dedicated in-game chat channel for anything above 5 players that is not a public zerg.

Give us PROPER tools to group and organize. With only a 5 man or zerg as options, it becomes frustrating for guilds and players who enjoy medium size forces of 15-20 players. You either run as 3-4 seperate groups or put up the pin and people expect you to lead…. neither are great options when you just want to run with your guild.

SoPP.7034:

Lets hope they pull their finger out. People talk about how War Hammer Online had a better system, and war hammer online suxx -.-

For all the shortcomings warhammer may have had, their grouping system was one of the best. I don’t even care if we have a system just like warhammer had. I just want to see a system that’s flexible enough to meet all guild and player uses and preferences.

One of those preferences is to have some kind of “private” option so we can create a custom squad for our guild without having every single player in the zone flock to the commander pin.

Straegen.2938:

Guild tags top want the list of many guilds. Adding them would make the game less zergy since players could more easily be forked off from the main zergs and managed.

This exactly. If we actually had a way to make private custom forces larger than 5 people then zergs wouldn’t be so dominate. More medium forces taking multiple objectives can cause more damage than one zerg. A zerg can only be in one place at a time.

Tons of great changes that have not been acknowleged in any way. This was also asked / suggested way back in the BW1 forums. They said changes to the C&S system are coming, let’s just hope it’s changes the players ACTUALLY want.

Allowing commanders/squads to flag private for guild events is a big one for me.

Xsorus.2507:

GW2 is anti small man, pro zerg..

Anet talks about how they wanted to emulate DAOC, but it becomes pretty obvious when playing that they have ZERO idea how DAOC really was…and I question that any of them ever played the game to begin with.

It’s actually anti-anything but a zerg. I still can’t believe we don’t have some kind of private or guild only grouping system for private forces over 5 people. Something like allowing commanders to hide the pin AND still retain all the functions of a squad, only those people currently in the squad could see the private commander pin.

You have 15 people who want to run privately together. Our only options are to create three seperate groups, and use a 3rd party voice program for communication as there is no dedicated chat channel. Horrible option.

100% agree they need some kind of private grouping system for guilds or creating specific sized forces. The easiest way would be allowing commanders to “hide” the pin publicly while still retaining all the functions of a squad. This would now allow commanders to create a private squad for either guild members or players and only those people currently in the squad would see the pin.

This seems the easiest way without adding a completely new grouping system. Arenanet, yet ANOTHER person asking for some way to create a private grouping system for more than 5 people…..

DevonCarver.5370:

Upgrading the commander system and UI is on our goal list. It’s a complicated task, requiring lots of resources however, which means it isn’t going to happen overnight. Believe me though, I find our commander system almost entirely lacking in useful functionality.

Just curious if you can give us a sniff of what might be in the works?!

:)

People complained that the same WvW matches were stagnant and boring. Now people are complaining that mixing up the matches slightly are too hard. You can’t have it both ways, at some point you need to give it your best effort or work on gaining some quality WvW guilds to your server.

They could lower the random variation formula slightly, but you are still going to get oddball matchups at times. There is no perfect solution that is going to make everyone happy…. there is ALWAYS going to be a server mismatched for some weeks.

Better grouping system. Ability to make squads of any size and flag them “Private” for guild events and prevent every single player on the map flocking to the pin when you are only trying to make multi-group havoc forces.

3 server system is the only way to go. Having only 2 servers fighting would result in BIGGER blowouts and BIGGER imbalances. Using a 3 server system, double teaming at times allows weaker servers to take out bigger servers.

It allows for corrections in population and off-peak populations.

If they do a proper update to the commander and squad system it would be as popular to our guild as the culling fix. IMO the grouping and command structure for leaders, players and guilds in WvW are severly lacking. Foremost they need grouping systems to be flexible for whatever guilds and players like doing.

There is no reason we shouldn’t have a grouping system that gives us some control over the size of the force and for guild only events. Having either a 5 person group or a massive zerg are terrible options, it should be much more flexible.