Guild Wars 2

Take a breath and re-read Sitkaz’ post, specifically sentence two.

Yeah yeah, I see it. =P

Somewhere in the OK’s I got lost.

and if you think that liadri does not require you to have the favor of the RNG gods then you just simply got lucky and don’t know it.

So those of us can that consistently beat it now, we’re….magically delicious or something?

1. Just because a woman thinks something isn’t sexist, doesn’t mean it isn’t sexist. If your wife/gf/friend/mom/whoever says, “I don’t have a problem with high heels on a robot,” that doesn’t make it A-OK anymore than a woman saying it isn’t OK makes it automatically not OK. This argument comes up a lot in feminist-related things, and it’s really not an argument. It’s just opinion: a girl thinks it’s ok. Maybe even an unofficial poll of all the girls you know says it’s ok. That’s great, but so what.

2. Just because something’s done a lot already doesn’t make it OK either. People keep saying, All MMOs have stuff like this. Greek art has stuff like this. Etc. Well it’s not like the people who are against it don’t know that. It still doesn’t make it OK and it still isn’t an argument, it’s just a situation.

The opposite is true too, though. Just because a woman (or a man deciding he needs to defend women) is offended, it doesn’t make it “sexism”.

Sadly, that seems to be the criteria nowadays. If a woman is displeased by something I say or do – for any reason – then it’s “sexism” because she says so.

You missed my point. When things start having areolas, nipples and [ since the word is filtered, I will deem it the hole between the legs ], it starts at least to me, expressing sexual things.

Not to be snarky, but if you look at Watchknights and see “Sexual things” then…well…ok, I don’t really know what to say.

It’ll suffice to say that no one – male or female – that I know thought “Sex” when seeing the big clockwork battle robots.

Well you can’t use direct ranged attacks, but you can plant ranged attacks…in my case (Guardian), I can plant scepter 2 or staff 3 on it to kill orbs. Staff 1 also never misses. I never try an melee them.

Also, any ranged attack that doesn’t rely on a projectile (Necro Scepter 1) will kill them.

It’s really just projectiles, which have ALWAYS had issues in this game. =/

They still don’t need areolas.

They don’t need heads, or arms, or legs, or eyes, or feet, or anything else for that matter.

They could just be spheres that roll around and have retractable blades for rolling into people.

I still believe that cosmic orb spawn location is randomized (unlike rifts). Will test this tomorrow on single arena to get conclusive data.

Even if Orbs are random (which I doubt, but possible) it’s barely even a factor. Worst case scenario is that an orb will pull you into Shadowfall, and even then you can rally off the orb.

(Yes, sometimes the orb is bugged, but that’s not RNG in the fight mechanics itself.)

Care to elaborate rather than implying that I am mentally handicapped? If was able to beat her thanks to luck, why loosing becouse of bad luck is impossible?

Because it’s not luck. Once you have the pattern down, you can beat her every single time. If I had the time and inclination, I could probably go in with my Necro and win 100% of the time just because the pattern for completing the encounter is the same each time.

The only thing that’s “luck” about what you did is that you probably just stumbled into “doing it right” one time without knowing it.

“will my pet magically dodge the AoEs in P1 and live longer than one auto in P2?”

Forget the pet. The pet is dead. It’s just how it is. You can still DPS her down without it in the given time. (Though I do agree it’s a little unfair to Rangers here)

“will the vision kill me for no reason as its in the middle of the vortex? Or will it become a crystal like its supposed to?”

Why are you standing IN the vortex? Don’t do that.

And yes. It was based on luck. I won becouse I had luck and in previous tries I had not. Therefore I conclude that this encounter is luck based to some extent

No.

The only mistake is the stacking of one shot mechanics into one fight. If the AoE 25% of your HP and the exploding dark things took 50% of your HP, I’d be more inclined to call it a fair challenge but this fight is just cheap as all hell.

How would that even be a fight then, though? Shadowfall only doing 25% of your HP?

What would even be the point of the fight if you can avoid every Shadowfall AND it only does 25% of your HP in damage? At that point there wouldn’t even be a failure condition, you’d just be able to stand there and auto attack her down like every other zerg mob in the game.

I feel I should point out that in the eyes of the media these days, those statues would in fact be labeled as “fat” unfortunately.

True….and it’s confusing, too. I dunno who’s driving that, because neither I nor any men I know happen to like this, “70-pound, skeleton totally visible, no actual apparent feminine parts” image that’s been portrayed in recent years as “sexy”.

Do 8 orbs achievement with a ranger or necromancer. No thief, no guardian, no warrior.

I’ve beaten her with Ranger and Necro so far, and plan on doing 8-orb with my Necro tonight. (I’m wondering if a “Hit her with 2 orbs, gather a bunch of shadows, get them all to walk into a pool at once and spawn multiple orbs in Phase 1” strategy would work at all. Supposedly there’s only 4 shadows up at a time, but even that would mean only doing 2 orbs in Phase 2. Hm)

The “lack of vigor” is greatly overstated as a disadvantage. I didn’t even use dodge when beating her normally on my Necro. If you’re doing it right you shouldn’t even be dodging that much in the first place.

Yeah, looks like it’s gone.

But there are many men who aren’t conventionally attractive, who not only rarely see themselves in the media they consume, but are insulted and disregarded by the women (and sometimes men!) who believe the only attractive men are the ones they see in media.

Fixed for completions’ sake.

Yes, it works that way, too.

This is a problem that people predicted the moment we heard about the Dodge system in the game.

If you give players a ton of ways to completely avoid damage (Dodge, blocks, invulnerability, etc) and make those abilities extremely “cheap” (Low cooldown, low or no resource cost, etc) then eventually the only way to really kill the players is to make it so that they die in one hit if an attack does manage to get through.

Actually, the other extreme is to have enemies that attack so absurdly fast that you can’t dodge/block them all, and that happens in GW2 as well sometimes.

It’s actually similar to the old “Sunwell Radiance” issue back in WoW…if you give players too many ways to simply avoid damage, then the damage has to be ridiculously high when it does land.

(power fantasy vs. sexualization)

See, this is what bothers me about it.

When an unrealistically perfect female with some cleavage showing is presented, it’s a sexualized image created to appeal to men, and thus an example of men’s sexism against females, it’s damaging to women’s self-esteem and body image, a visual form of misogyny, reducing femininity only to it’s physical parts, so on and so forth.

When an unrealistically perfect male with their entire chest, abdomen, and god knows what other crazily developed muscle groups showing is presented, it’s not a sexualized image, and it’s supposedly not appealing to women at all. Somehow this ALSO gets blamed on men and their sexism, because it’s some kind of “Power Fantasy”. It’s not at all harmful to male self-esteem or body image, it’s not an example of misandry, it’s not reducing masculinity only to it’s physical parts, etc.

It’s frustrating for several reasons.

1) It’s a clear double standard, but generally men aren’t allowed to talk about it. If a male said, “That image of a hyper-built, physically perfect, air brushed model makes me feel insecure.” he’d just get laughed at.

2) It doesn’t help with actual womens’ issues. There are a lot of them, too. Real issues in the real world that demand attention. Instead we get a lot of – quite frankly – lazy “feminists” who want to feel like they’re morally superior crusaders, but only want to pick the low hanging fruit that is the “omg boobs” topic.

3) It only further stigmatizes the female form. I actually wonder if women in the real world with large busts feel self-conscious because the rest of their gender seems to be so disgusted with any depiction – real or created – of breasts larger than a B cup. (Even fully clothed ones.)

(especially as of late because of Anita Sarkeesian’s controversial behaviour)

And yeah, Sarkeesian is an example of a “feminist” who doesn’t seem to want to actually take up any meaningful battles and would instead rather invent completely absurd issues to turn into faux-outrage. (And then she gets completely trolled hardcore by the internet and thinks that it proves her point or something, while totally unaware that she’s being trolled something fierce)

Oh hey, this isn’t the same rehashed stuff at all.

Ok.

No, it’s not an assault on women appearing in media, it’s an assault on pointlessly hyper-sexualised and unrealistic depictions of women in media.

It’s a standard of video games, comics, etc. Most characters end up depicted in completely unrealistic and/or perfect physical forms. (It’s why Professor X has muscular legs, and Reed Richards is built like Superman)

The problem is that no one ever attacks the male side, only the female side. And you THINK you’re doing some kind of noble service, when really you’re just stigmatizing the female form.

but the designers decided to make them SexBots.

The only people that see them as “SexBots” are the ones looking for something to be outraged about. And again, you think you’re being all noble about it, when you’re really just exacerbating the problem that you think you’re fighting against. (That being, “Oh, a female. Clearly this is just a sex object because it has breasts. Lets focus on that instead of any other value this might have.”)

This fight is almost totally about luck

There is zero luck involved. The entire fight follows a pattern.

Every time you guys do this, you just keep building on the problem that you seem to think you’re fighting against.

This constant assault on anything in any media that has females in it only serves to create a taboo around the female form and ultimately make it so that any female figure must – by definition – be reduced to only her physical parts.

There is a difference between inflation and an increase in price due to demand.

And that’s exactly what happened.

Higher demand led to higher prices.

Ta-da! Right here.

Notice how the +endurance regen food went up in price? Wonder why.

(Even though you don’t even need to dodge to do Liadri)

Not really. To be honest, CoF1 farming gave out way more gold than anything going on right now. Plus it was raw coin being injected into the economy, whereas a lot of the money being made off of the current content is really just from getting skins/items and selling them to other players.

All in all, this might actually be better for inflation than CoF1 farming.

Too many players in this game feel that x time spent should = x award

Not just in this game. In every game. And in real life as well.

It’s a topic that I’ve ranted about a lot…this attitude that “time spent” is somehow a meaningful metric for anything.

Colin Johanson.

Er, I mean, Trahearne. Yeah, that guy. =D

I do agree that the Asura technology is a little out of place.

Charr stuff is at least acceptable to a point. That sort of unpolished, early industrial stuff makes sense.

But Asura tech, that’s just crazy. Especially since you take the primary antagonist of the entire story thus far (Zhaitan) and literally just blast him in half with a laser mounted on a flying ship. It’s hard to take anything else in the world seriously from a lore standpoint when there are Death Stars flying around the world.

Hah, I went away for a while and come back and people are still filling out the form.

Unfortunately, the form will only be around for two weeks. Fill it out while you can!

Having RNG based pulls,

Nothing in the fight is RNG. When people start realizing that, they beat it pretty fast.

having bugged Orbs

They are annoying, but every class has a way of dealing with them.

previous spawns on the map

I never had that happen even one time, and even if it did it’s just a bug, not something wrong with the fight design.

a camera you spend time fighting

Yeah, the camera blows. Wish they would learn to stop making the camera the biggest enemy. =/

The rude waiter would definitely have ruined the evening’s experience though;

Right, and I agree that all the issues with the Gauntlet do lessen the experience. ANet really needs to seriously think about their testing methods before putting out content, this is a recurring theme with them.

I’m just saying that it’s unfair to say that the Liadri fight is to blame. The fight itself is great, there’s just too many external issues that didn’t get tested sufficiently that make the overall experience frustrating.

Interesting that as time goes by, there’s fewer and fewer “omg Liadri is impossible” posts. =D

It’s really not THAT bad. Everyone can do it.

Do not want. I’m already tired of activities and 1-shot challenges. I have no time to just enjoy game. Instead I am compelled to do LS achievements in time limits.

Why do people keep saying this? It’s the stupidest logic you could possibly come up with.

And that’s why it was not fun nor challenging!

Yes, but from a design perspective it’s unfair to blame the Liadri fight for all the other things that went on in the area. We have to look at them separately.

It’s like having a great meal at a restaurant, but then saying the food sucked because your waiter was rude.

I ran the loot train for 2 hours this morning when it first came out, and another hour this evening. Mostly with huge zergs farming Queensdale continuously. Probably killed 80-90 champions all told.

Result: about 4g (total, from every source)
0 lodestones
0 cores
0 exotics
2 rares — total
I did get some amount of T6 mats
All the rest was blue/green/trash, lower-level mats, and coin bags

WTF is my roi so frikkin’ horrible compared to everyone else? Does Anet hate me, or am I just the unluckiest mother in the history of the universe?

Honestly, most of the “OMG I GOT SO MUCH GOLD” stories you hear are from people that just got really lucky with a drop or something. Not an actual representation of what you’ll consistently get in an area.

People were claiming to get 200g/hour by farming Orr champions too, and what they really meant was, “I got a skin/precursor/whatever in my first hour.” not that you actually get 200g/hour on average.

Was it fun or challenging? No.

To be fair…all the bad things about the fight really had nothing to do with the fight itself being fun or challenging. They’re all external factors that should have been weeded out in testing – something that ANet has a serious issue with.

I don’t have a Rabid set, always hated full condi.
I’ve got Zerker/Knights mix, Soldiers set and Hybrid with Carrion+Rampager mixed.

Me neither, I just bought a bunch of Rabid greens from the TP. You do sooo much damage to her that it doesn’t matter what level of gear you use.

I tend to die at phase 1 half the time and when I do make it to phase 2 (and the game decides to pick an easy pattern for the red circles) I’m usually already at low health.

The phases always follow the same pattern. Just learning it is the key.

Think of the floor as a pie cut into perfect quarters. In Phase 2, Shadowfall hits two of those pieces, always opposite one another. (So north and south, then east and west, then repeat)

Naturally, that means that running as close to the center as you feel comfortable doing in Phase 2, as that will let you run as short a distance to safety as possible. (If you REALLY hug the center, you can make every Shadowfall safe spot, even if perma-crippled.)

Also, don’t over think it. Scepter auto attack alone will destroy her in Phase 2 very quickly. Keep your focus on just avoiding all the one-shot attacks and burn her down, don’t try doing some fancy max DPS rotation or something if you’re having focus issues.

As a Necro player with 2k hours in I’ve tried Liadri 160 times.
I came close to beating her a few times, but yeah it sure is difficult since Necros have no blocks, no invul and no vigor.

Then again there are a few Necros who got it in 5 or 6 tries on the Necro forums, so it’s clearly not impossible at all.

Go full single target condition damage. She absolutely melts in Phase 2 like nothing, even with green gear. I actually did it on my first try with my necro (After doing it on my ranger, so I knew the pattern already.)

It’s really not as bad as people are making it out to be. It’s only been a few days, so people haven’t learned the fight yet. Once you learn it, it’s pretty simple. (Went back and one-shot it on my necro after beating it on my ranger.)

I bet there are a ton of Mini’s in Lion’s Arch by the end of the event. Just keep at it.

So after doing it on my Ranger I decided to give a Necro a shot just because I’ve seen a lot of “omg Impossible on Necro” posts for some reason.

30/30/0/10/0

Scepter/Dagger, no secondary weapon. Full Rabid gear, a mixture of greens and yellows. (No exotics)

Blood is Power/Signet of the Locust – third utility and elite never got used.

Did it in one attempt. Phase two barely lasted any time at all, I think the might from Blood is Power was still on me when it ended. In comparison my Ranger was struggling to meet the time requirement. Just goes to show how insane condition damage can be when it’s not being smothered by the stack limits in a zerg.

Honestly I think that once people get the hang of this fight, it won’t be nearly as bad as people on the boards are currently making it out to be. I expect a ton of mini Liadri’s in Lion’s Arch by the end of the event.

Ranger
30/25/10/5

Greatsword/Short Bow
Signet of Stone/Signet of the Wild/Quickening Zephyr
Rampage as One

The fight itself is great. I still maintain that a combination of bugs, camera issues, and red-visibility make it more frustrating than it needs to be. But it’s awesome otherwise.

One of the commanders even said the other day, I don’t care about the score, I am here for the fights. Enjoy your fights in T2 .

Ooo, maybe SoR’s plan is to drop in ranks until they can pair up with Maguuma and have a giant GvG fest together and have a first ever double-zero WvW score!

There’s a clear order of magnitude of difference between Liadri and the others with gambits.

That was kinda the point. There’s 11 bosses that get a little harder and harder and then one that’s really hard at the end. That’s the design. Not really sure what about this is posing such a challenge of comprehension.

Are you seriously saying that the imagination of the developers is so poor that they were unable to come up with anything harder than the other bosses with gambits and Liadri?

That’s a pile of words that barely makes sense in the context. The gauntlet scaling difficulty is exactly as the developers intended.

Like I said above, it’s not a choice between no poss and childishly easy.

Just gonna keep repeating that and pretending the other 11 bosses and the gambits don’t exist at all, aren’t you?

Worst update ever. All in my guilds are saying a normal player cannot do this, and I agree. Fortunatly Anet stated GW2 was for casual players….woooooot!?!?!?

Never fear, 99.999% of the game will still let you just AFK with autoattack on and “win”.

It’s not a false dichotomy between impossible and lol faceroll!

And again you repeat something that’s already been addressed as if it’s an amazing revelation that no one could come up with an answer to.

Strangely everyone here seems to think that there are only two options – insanely difficult and impossible to beat for most people….or faceroll. Why have so many completely ignored the middle ground? Requires skilled play…but no such skilled play that most people simply can’t do it regardless of how hard they try to improve?

There are 11 other bosses in the gauntlet that fill those criteria. They’re all fairly forgiving if you pay attention to the mechanics, but still a challenge for many people.

It’s also possible that they made a philosophical mistake with this design. By drawing their attention to it, I’m giving them the chance to correct it.

The mistake they made was letting the same technical issues that have lingered since beta to creep into this content. (As it has with almost every bit of content since beta.) Someone needs to look at their QA/Testing team and really start asking what they’re doing.

Aside from that, it’s a challenging boss. That was the point of it.

They’re free to ignore it if they want. So are you. What are you getting so worked up about?

Is that an alternate version of, “u mad bro”? =D

Then let Anet openly come out and say it. Say “This reward is only for an elite few. It doesn’t matter how patient you are or how hard you work”. At least then I’ll know where I stand.

Really? Do they really need to come out and personally put a label on every single thing that gets produced? You’re a human being, you don’t need to be told things that are self-evident, like a boss being difficult.

“WARNING: Fire may be hot”

My question again – who do you design your content for?

I answered that already. Is 99.99% of the content not enough for you, you have to try to paint the entire game design in a negative light simply because there’s one thing you can’t do?

It’s a question of whose aptitude? Do you design content so that the majority of players find it really hard or so that only a few can complete it? Who are you designing for? Not passing judgement. Just want to know.

99.99% of GW2 is designed such that you can literally just turn on auto attack, get up, go make a sandwich, check your e-mail, feed the cat, come back, and collect a gold medal and treasure chest. There is absolutely no doubt that the game is designed almost entirely with absolutely no significant level of aptitude required whatsoever.

So to point at this one boss and claim that it’s somehow indicative of an unfair or exclusionary attitude in the game as a whole is clearly folly.

A legendary is also supposed to be a rare item. But I can get it if I put in insane amounts of hard work.

You mean insane amounts of farming. Not “hard work”. Again, we’re back to this idea that “time spent” is somehow analogous to something other than simply time spent.