Guild Wars 2

Seems pretty weak to condis when not in Berserk and spamming F1, the concept is still ok. I run a Bunker Buster setup too but I decided to just go pure damage and stick to avoiding direct fights…although you’d be surprised how many die to this just because of how high the damage is. If I’m gonna fill such a niche role, I’m gonna go full out. That being said I run something more like this when I’m going for damage but don’t wanna die instantly to focus.

Your sustain is still only really coming from those OP runes though, can’t fault someone for using them but take them away and watch how much your sustain drops.

The worst thing about Chrono is the excessive visual spam. I thought base Mes could clutter the screen (I could still easily spot the real one,), but Chrono takes it to another level.

KayCee.4653:

BobbyT.7192:

Am I the only one here that finds the whole node capture game mode boring to watch? Like I have seen a few exciting moments, but those like final style matches.
Anything before that doesn’t really catch my eye and are usually one sided anyways.

No you’re not. Many do.

It’s not the concept of conquest itself that’s the issue, it’s the map design. If the capture points were around 3x their current size (Graveyard), fights wouldn’t look like unicorn vomit(holy crap Chrono). the points also have 0 interesting geographic features, just flat ground.

To compensate for the size, you would have to change how capturing works. One person should only slow the capture of a point, not outright deny it. This encourages the bunker meta even more. Whichever side has more players on point should gain capture progress (a la Battlefield).

This would make things way more comprehensible to spectators and make things more skillful overall.

online.1278:

BurrTheKing.8571:

I can accept no Fast Hands baseline, heck I could even support it being removed, if the devs are willing to make significant changes to weapon skills. I’m kinda afraid that these changes will involve making them easier to use and will just make Warrior even simpler to play. I pray that the sustain changes are skill based, the one positive of the current state of Warrior is that even doing moderately well gets you respect.

again, Dev said warrior skills generally and overally have reduced cd time on most of skills or equivalent way to let us play with one weapon set longggggger which means they want to rather reduces the need of fast-hand trait.

I don’t think it is good idea tho. Lol

If each weapon gets increased functionality on lower CDs then rapid weapon swapping won’t be as needed. I would even take losing Fast Hands entirely if it was replaced with a trait that removes blind on Burst Skill use. I like the idea of frequent swapping, but if they can make our weapons more varied I won’t be too put out.

I can accept no Fast Hands baseline, heck I could even support it being removed, if the devs are willing to make significant changes to weapon skills. I’m kinda afraid that these changes will involve making them easier to use and will just make Warrior even simpler to play. I pray that the sustain changes are skill based, the one positive of the current state of Warrior is that even doing moderately well gets you respect.

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

I like the idea’s, but they haven’t been pushed far enough in my opinion.
After playing high level fractals and raids, but having less in game in Pvp the same dynamic keeps featuring as ‘optimal.’

1) groups quickness
2) fast break bar
3)Group boon share
4)perma max vulnerability
5)combo fields.

This leads to the optimal group being;
1)mesmer-alacrity
2)revenant-boon share/breakbar/blindness
3)Great sword reaper-vulnerability/blindness
4)ele-combo fields/boon share
5)Guardian -quickess/breakbar/vulnerability/blindness/block

swap out reaper for scrapper if you want to skip a lot of trash mobs, but keep break bar and boon share/combo fields

add druid for raids.

With this group you’ll stay on perma on 25 might/fury/25 vulnerability/protection and light speed break bar. There is still no need to take a warrior for any reason.

They’re great idea’s, but they only affect warrior in the Pvp scene, but still leaves them redundant in PvE.

Isn’t Berserker being used for the LB primal burst with Viper Stats? Also, isn’t Phalanx Strength still seeing plenty of use? I’ve only been solo PvEing as of late.

Rage Skills

This one was hard. How to make them feel different from Physical Skills? One possible idea I like is making it possible to use Rage skills at different tiers like Burst Skills, but instead of it affecting damage, it changes things such as distance and duration. This idea has issues, like how that means you’re only ever use one Rage skill at a time and then you have to start gaining Adrenaline again, but maybe you could change a trait to make them give some adrenaline back.

Sundering Leap: The Distance you leap depends on what tier you’re on. It can vary from less than the current amount to further than the current.

Shattering Blow: It would be really cool if they could figure out how to make this skill useable while moving (something like the Tempest Earth Overload but the Warrior is stomping up rocks and punching them) and the higher amount of Adrenaline you spend the longer it lasts.

Outrage: I’ll be honest, I like this skill as it is, but for the sake of consistency it needs to have something added. Maybe cleanse one condi for each tier?

Head Butt: Maybe just duration of the stun, while slightly upping the default range.

Blood Reckoning: If the idea of this skill has to stay the same, at least make it affect ALL damage, and not just crits. The amount of Adrenaline used can just affect duration.

I’m open for more ideas regarding these utilities as well.

I feel like it’s important that Adrenaline be a part of every utility for it to be an actual Warrior mechanic. It’s similar to Energy on Rev in a way only you start at 0 and move up and the skills aren’t channeled.

Signets

This one is also hard because in GW1 Signets didn’t cost Adrenaline. I’ll be honest in saying I’m not really sure what works here.

Maybe keep the passives and actives the same, but allow the use of Adrenaline to reduce the CD? That still feels a bit meh though.

I’m open to ideas regarding this.

Banners

This is a weird one. It would be nice to see these be used outside of PvE. I would keep them CD based, but change the mechanics. I really, really think these should be something you wear on your back. After activating a Banner, the skill could be replaced with the Banner’s current 2 skill. The passive buffs can stay the same.

Inspiring Battle Standards could bring back the CD reduction, but maybe make it be slightly less than before since the utility of wearing banners could be really strong if combined with stances.

Shouts

With the nerf to Vigorous Shouts, the utilities became much less useful. I think this nerf should be reverted so that Warrior can once again have the ability to focus on support. In terms of Adrenaline cost, it should vary depending on the Shout. Like last time, I’m listing the Shouts in order from lowest cost to highest.

• “On My Mark!”

• “For Great Justice!”

• “Shake it Off!”: I would also consider making it an AoE Stun Break as well.

• “To the Limit!”: Having this skill fill your Burst Energy seems redundant since Vigorous Shouts already does that. Maybe have it give more endurance than it currently does instead?

• “Fear Me!”

With Adrenaline management being a thing, hopefully Shouts will feel much less spammy and force the player to use them more wisely.

Physical Skills

In order to make these useful I think they will need to be fairly low Adrenaline cost. Even in my changes, Stances will still be important for sustain, so to make them even remotely appealing they need to be more “spammable.” The game is now swimming in anti-CC, so having Physical Skills being able to wear it down might make them more useful.

Not much to change here, the functionality is going to stay the same, they’ll just have an Adrenaline cost (and probably a short CD) now.

I would say the cost of skills should be as follows, in order from least Adren to most:

• Kick/Bolas

• Bull’s Charge: Maybe lower the KD time and make the utility more frequently useable, but more as a gap closer.

• Mending: Should be a Physical skill.

• Stomp

Peak Performance would be more useful imo if it increased range rather than damage based on Burst Energy level.

Stances

Not only does it make no sense to be able to be in multiple stances simultaneously, it’s also boring mechanically.

To start, you will only be able to have one Stance active at a time. Instead of a cooldown, they will cost Adrenaline. Now, there might need to be a short CD to avoid “spamming” stances, but nothing as long as the current CDs. The effects will also be modified while keeping the base premise. The amount of adrenaline they cost and duration will of course have to be messed with to find a good balance.

Endure Pain: Instead of reducing all melee damage to 0, it will dramatically lower incoming damage. This is because it would be seeing much more use. The exact numbers of which i won’t go into because w/o testing it’s impossible to say what’s fair.

Berserker’s Stance: Similar to EP, rather that reducing all duration to 0, it will reduce the duration by a significant amount. Again, this is because the idea is to have you constantly swapping stances depending on the situation.

Balanced Stance: I think the idea of a toggleable Break Bar is a cool idea. You could give it the same or slightly less “Stacks” of Stability as before, but the second you change stances you lose the bar.

Frenzy: Rather than giving Swiftness, it just increases your attack speed and maybe increases your damage a small amount. Maybe keep the stun break aspect, though it may not be needed.

Defiant Stance: Should be instant. Hopefully would make it much more useable. Down bellow I talk about changing Defy Pain, it should not affect this Heal to avoid anti-synergy.

These changes would make it possible (in theory) for good Warriors to change stances based on the situation. It would be nice to see the player actually change their stance rather than just glowing.

I would also like to see Last Stand (name change to Stance Mastery or something) changed slightly. Perhaps making Stances cost less Adrenaline and giving the same Vigor boon on activation, and maybe the duration increase but that might be too much. You would lose the Stability, but not only does Berserker offer pulsing Stability, but if Endure Pain and Frenzy keep their Stun Break properties it’s not like you’ll be getting overwhelmed by CC.

Also, I’ve always disliked Defy Pain. Sure, it’s easy to account for but it’s still just a trait that you have no control over. Maybe make it give you additional toughness while in a Stance? You would have to balance Endure Pain around this but this would make it more player controlled. The idea of stacking Endure Pain, Defy Pain, and Rousing Resilience sounds cool. You’d give up Last Stand for that but there would be good synergy with Berserker.

Let me start by saying that I know a redisign such as this is unlikely to ever happen, I just enjoy writing pieces like this.

When ANet was designing Warrior, they apparently wanted it to be a simple class that beginners can pick up and do well with relative ease. It has a simple class mechanic and uncomplicated utility skills.

While this sounds good in theory, in practice this has seriously screwed players who want to main Warrior and play PvP/WvW. Once you know how Warriors fight, beating them becomes simple. While there are techniques like weapon stowing to bait out countermeasures, they can all be applied to any class to improve play. There’s plenty of players that like the idea of a Warrior, but don’t want be hitting the skill ceiling early and having no room to grow. I think it is possible to grow Warrior complexity while still keeping it beginner friendly.

Now, this is a rough concept, so forgive it being light on details in some places. The general concept is to add additional complexity to Warrior’s utility skills and making them more rewarding for experienced players. These ideas will draw heavily from GW1 Warrior design.

The base concept will be to have Adrenaline power your utility skills. The current Adrenaline bar can be renamed Burst Energy or something similar and will remain separate from Adrenaline.

As someone who frequently plays with Mace on Warrior, there is now an insane amount of CC hate in the game. Most meta builds laugh at CC. Hell, Rev can totally counter me because of the Stability on dodge. Skull Crack is hard enough to land without that.

War is guilty of this too, but the class as a whole is weak now wo complaining about Defy Pain is a bit odd. I would LOVE for more active traits, but ANet is convinced that War has to be the noob class, kitten anyone that wants to main it.

I agree that if you allow yourself to eat that big CC the game should not correct your screwup for you.

Syde.5961:

@BurrTheKing: The only time I fine myself lacking sustain is during team fights. 1 versus 1 scenarios usually fall in my favor, but I get targeted hard during team fights so a 1k heal isn’t gonna help any.

The heal got upped but the real strength of the trait, it’s the 1,000 toughness that makes a surprisingly big difference.

Ross Biddle.2367:

BurrTheKing.8571:

I’ve decided to fully commit myself to doing one thing well, killing bunkers.

The Bunker Buster

You HAVE to come into the fight a bit late and avoid being targeted. The rotation is:

(Start in GS)
1. Head Butt, using Berserker Stance and Signet of Might to give you the best chance to hit.

2. Swap to Rifle, Go Berserk.

3. Gun Flame

4. Rifle Butt

5. Volley

6. Gun Flame

Not much lives through that. You’ll be unblockable, immune to conditions, and have pulsing Stability. I’ll be honest, I haven’t been playing that much but I WILL say that Bunker Chronos, Dragon Hunters, Revs, and anyone else dependent on blocks can be killed really quickly if you’re being supported properly. I use Defiant Stance just because once things get going you’ll probably be targeted and you’re so glassy that Heal Sig isn’t that great.

I too am dedicated to bunker busting.

I started where you’re at, but I’ve moved on to str, arms, berserker. As of tonight I’m further tweaking out the amulet and rune. I have a higher focus on ranged assault with gunflame, leaving GS for clutch aoe moments or picking off anyone wandering to the outskirts of a fight.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vJAQJAURnMdAlki9dA2dAEliliAzYA8ACAHjhLwP7d4mcnuA-TpBBABEcEAO+QAIfZAAuAAYt/g+PAAA

Has 100% more unblockable uptime, 100% crit chance on rifle (98% on GS or whatever), and Furious provides proficient adrenaline regen to keep those gunflames pumping out upon CD. Overcoming no Fast Hands is simply a matter of discipline, ironically XD

No Piercing is merely a matter of positioning.

I value the piercing too much to lose it. After downing someone you can line up on anybody reviving them and not only interrupt them the possibility kill them too and keep the other guy down. Downed cleave is one of our few strengths and I want to maximize it.

@Syde Have you tried Rousing Resilience and Eternal Champion? With that setup you’ll find yourself with a bit more sustain. I keep going back and forth on Heightened Focus and Burst Mastery, both are good. Good job on using Sigil of Speed though.

I actually think that Head Butt is fine, it’s just a bit clunky. It can be an amazing opener and can give you a free Primal Burst.

As for heals it’s a given that they’re pretty bad atm. That being said I think it comes down to just tweaking numbers. Mending being a physical skill so you can trait for lower CD and maybe slightly higher base heal makes it decent on paper. Blood Reckoning has a cool concept but could use a much longer duration or a greater percentage of damage given as healing. A heal that buffs your crit chance is cool, but it should also be for ALL damage and not just power. To The Limit doesn’t need the adrenaline gain imo since it already gives some when traited. Maybe get rid of that and up the AoE endurance gain. The idea of you mitigating more damage via dodges is cool. Defiant Stance deserves to be instant like all stances. It still has counter play due to you having to absorb damage for it to actually heal. Same duration as the Rev heal when traited seems fair as well.

I like Rousing Resilience where it is, it’s a defensive trait after all. It has tons of synergy with Berserker. With better heals it would let us have better sustain and if Savage Instinct had better condi removal you would have a sturdy build.

What we REALLY need is offensive team support. Make Savage instinct removal condis and break stun for allies when you go Berserk. Dead or Alove heals you and nearby allies when Berserk mode ends. Eternal Champion pulses Stability to nearby allies, but at a slower rate of course. This would actually give Warriors a place in a team. They could focus on damage but not be totally selfish.

I’ve decided to fully commit myself to doing one thing well, killing bunkers.

The Bunker Buster

You HAVE to come into the fight a bit late and avoid being targeted. The rotation is:

(Start in GS)
1. Head Butt, using Berserker Stance and Signet of Might to give you the best chance to hit.

2. Swap to Rifle, Go Berserk.

3. Gun Flame

4. Rifle Butt

5. Volley

6. Gun Flame

Not much lives through that. You’ll be unblockable, immune to conditions, and have pulsing Stability. I’ll be honest, I haven’t been playing that much but I WILL say that Bunker Chronos, Dragon Hunters, Revs, and anyone else dependent on blocks can be killed really quickly if you’re being supported properly. I use Defiant Stance just because once things get going you’ll probably be targeted and you’re so glassy that Heal Sig isn’t that great.

I’ve enjoyed facing and playing as any build that has decent defensive options but required timing them in order for them to be effective. This included:

• Most any War build after the Hambow shaves. Even in its meta form it wasn’t anywhere near as crazy as any of the metas that came before or after. People give double Endure Pain a lot of hate but seem to forget that using the toolbar EP too late made it almost useless and the Defy Pain trait is crazy predictable.

• Pre-spec patch Mediguard. Used to have great risk vs. reward. Sure, it seemed to have a lot of defenses but once you learned them they were easy to work around. It was also much less powerful outside of duels while still being viable.

• Lockdown Mes (not during the bugged mantras). Reminds me of the old GW1 Mes. Doing damage requires interrupts and man does it feel good to land them. Losing to one means admitting that chances you you goy outplayed unless you had a class with long cast times.

• Static Discharge Engi. Man I LOVED this build. You used a ton of different Engi skills and landing a big combo felt great. Overcharged Shot feels less cheap due to your much lower sustain, but using your defenses right still lead to decent sustain.

Sadly, Engi is now a class that requires all those passive traits to have any sort of decent sustain. I tried to make Scrapper build without Adaptive Armor and found myself having a difficult time.

It seems like ANet have moved away from the design philosophy of the above builds in favor of easy to play and flashy builds and I would put most of today’s meta skills in the “bad” category.

It would cool to see Savage Instinct remove more conditions. It has decent synergy with Rousing Resilience, having it remove like 5 condis would at least make losing Cleansing Ire a bit less painful. You’re also giving up Smash Brawler, which is a really strong trait.

Maybe making it pulse cleanse a few condis every few seconds or maybe blind immunity while Berserk?

Well, I’ve recently graduated from college with a communications degree so this would be a good learning experience. OK, I’ll look into it. Thanks for all the positive feedback!

Edit: I applied. That being said idk if they’re looking for players that are as focused as me atm.

I’d consider it…but I’m not well known. That being said, if they get to directly communicate with the devs it might be worth it. The actual job description is a little vague.

The only real use for Warriors I can think of is some sort of glass cannon that uses double Signet of Might and acting as a +1 to a Tempest or another build with support and using that combo to try and take out bunker Mes fast. With a decent amount of sustain based on blocks it might counter it a bit. It’s not an amazing role, but right now War isn’t an amazing class.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vJAQNAU8ejMdQdHWFCOeAnIGmCq7ICgWX76avHwEICKAA-TpQSABtWGAg9HAA

There are some OK hybrid builds out there but they’re almost purely dueling builds

I get the argument that you are negativity affecting your teams’ chances of winning, at the same time it’s not the players fault for wanting to play their preferred class. Imo it’s on the devs to ensure every class has at least 1 viable build.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Choppy.4183:

Agreed on the stability. I messed around with your build a bit, Burr, and I think you’d get more mileage with King of Fires and a Settler’s Amulet.

No joke. If you also trait Armored Attack and add a Smoldering Sigil, you only lose about 250-300 power but gain 500 toughness, a bunch of condi damage, and better heals. Overall damage is higher, as is your sustainability, and you have more opportunities to proc your heals on stun break because you won’t have so much stability.

I thought the new Wanderer amulet might be good, but wasn’t in love with the result. It was ok, but I didn’t think the extra damage was worth the loss of sustain.

King of fires has average synergy with Kinf Settlers because you lose that burning spread on crit, which is a shame. Though Settlers has better synegy with the healing aspect, Rabid will net you the necessary precision.

I guess its a question of more damage, or more support.

The issue I see a Settler’s build running into is that if you face anyone with decent removal (or Diamond Skin) you’ll just be flat out countered. With Cele you at least have enough power damage to make it work vs condi-resistant builds. I always hate going full condi with Sword and then Final Thrust is almost useless.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Superior rune of the tempest will grant you aoe heal on break stun

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/index.php?title=Superior_Rune_of_the_Tempest&redirect=no

I saw that, might mess around with it.

Something like this?

SlayerSixx.5763:

Honestly, make dead or alive and savage instinct baseline. There are so many warrior traits that need to be made baseline it isn’t funny. Make eternal champion pulsing stability for yourself baseline as well and then turn your suggestions themselves into the stand alone traits. Would make a lot more sense than what you guys currently have.

I sincerely disagree. That would only bring back the old “Warrior OP” or “Warrior is ANets pet class” talk. It also would be pretty unfair. Some condizerker builds would be absurd with all that baseline.

There are a few major things that Warrior players have to get good that that benefit you no matter what class you play but are more important for War.

Skill Canceling: Skills like Backbreaker, Pin Down, and Kill Shot have long activation times. To bait out dodges, bind Sheath Weapon to anything you can easily reach. Start using a long activation skill, and sheath just before the attack launches. It’ll go on a short CD (even shorter with perfect timing) and you can use it again. It cause really throw your enemy off and can also bait stun breaks/stability.

Wait for the Dodge and Count Dodges: War skills are slow, avoid throwing out the slowest and hardest hitting skills unless you’re sure they’ll connect. Use these skills right after a dodge or when you know they have no more endurance. Skill Canceling helps here as well.

Know your Enemy: More so than other classes, Warrior has to know about their enemy to be effective. If you blow that major attack you’re gonna be up a creek without a paddle. Knowing what tools your enemy has lets you know when they’re out of stun breaks and when you’re free to start pushing back.

These three things help all classes, but you have to master them on Warrior to do anything resembling good.

One quick thing about Stances. They have a reputation of being easy-mode skills, and while they aren’t hard to use per-say they aren’t as easy as non-Warrior players paint them to be. Knowing when to use Berserker Stance is the difference between having no condis and using them once the enemy already has some on you. This ties into “Know your Enemy.” Endure Pain is also not that useful if you only use it after that Backstab or True Shot hits you. You don’t have to use it as a stun break only, if you know a big hit is coming, use it.

For some context, I’ve played Warrior since launch and I STILL fail to follow some of these rules. A lot of it depends about if I’m really focusing on winning or just playing/smack talking. When I follow the rules, I can win most 1v1s unless the build I’m facing hardcounters me (Diamond Skin Ele while on Hybrind/Condi builds).

Now, Warrior/Berserker still lacks a really useful role currently. That’s basically undeniable. Every time someone says otherwise and I ask them to give a example I either get majorly outdated answers or answers like “They can roam” (Thief does this better, even if they’re hurting atm too) or “They got so much Stability” (True, but this is only so useful when other classes have ways to stomp that don’t need Stability or they have enough for doing that). The class needs help, but you can still do OK.

Support in GW2 can be simplified into two main types, Utility and Offensive. Warriors used to be very good at Utility support via the use of Shouts and a traited Warhorn. Now that that has been gutted the best reason to bring a Warrior to PvP or WvW has basically disappeared.

Warrior DOES still have Offensive support (and some utility) in the form of Phalanx Strength and Banners, but you rarely see them used outside of PvE.

I believe the basic framework for turning the bottom line of Berserker, which could be called the “Unstoppable” or “Champion” line, into traits that do not just benefit the Berserker, but their team as well has already been laid out.

Savage Instinct: First off, cleansing just 1 condi seems a bit weak, 3 seems to me to be a fair number considering if you take it Berserk will be on a 15 second CD. Second, make entering Berserk mode break stun and cleanse condis off of your nearby allies as well. Third, make Rousing Resilience heal and give the bonus toughness to allies that you break stun for. This would be a really interesting combo that would make Berserker valuable vs CC heavy groups.

Dead or Alive: Fairly simple change, make the healing apply to any ally that hits 0 while you are Berserk. It wouldn’t be ground shaking, but it could potentially turn a team fight to your favor.

Eternal Champion: This is a big one and you can probably already guess what it’s gonna be. You spread that might to up to 5 nearby allies. Now, the current rate of how its applied is OK for just the Berserker, but the tics may need to be further apart for the allies. Maybe have the Stability on allies last 5 seconds but only tic every 5 seconds as well. I would say let there be gaps between tics and that might be fair, but at the end of the day it’s only 1 stack. Oh, and if you break a stun for an ally, they should get that 3 might as well.

Changes like these would keep the theme of the Berserker, but actually give it some use in teams. You don’t see a whole lot of offensive support and this would be a great first step in making the spec and Warrior as a whole useful again.

*cough*andbaselinefasthands*cough*

@Thuggernaut.1250

Hey there, I probably could have made it more clear that I didn’t mean to say that these are super amazing combos, just that they do exist and that saying that Berserker doesn’t fit with base Warrior (I’ve seen it said multiple times by different people) isn’t really true.

Most of the time, where these synergies fall short is as a result of the failings of the bade Warrior. Baseline Fast Hand? Suddenly a hybrid build using the first combo becomes pretty scary, the only huge weakness being the lack of Warrior’s Sprint (I feel that Strength + Defense + Berserker is optimal), and that’s fine. Every build should have some sort of weakness.

Cygnus.6903:

About the Warrior’s Sprint baseline, that I don’t agree on and never will. No class has baseline 25% movement speed, and other classes arguably need that just as much as we do if they go double melee. If you don’t go double melee, then there is no solid argument at all.

Combine that with the fact that warrior has amazing access to swiftness and can easily get it permanently at a very reasonable cost (for instance, Rune of the Pack and sigil of Rage), baseline Warrior Sprint seems unneeded.

I agree. It makes warrior players sound greedy. If we stick to baseline Fast Hands and adrenaline decay it’s apparent that we’re just asking for something we generally need to function (like how Mesmers got Illusionary Persona) and a QOL fix that wasn’t even complained about as far as I know when they changed it.

Anything more is excessive. After we get those changes I would gladly start campaigning for changes other classes need baseline to work. I play them all anyways.

Clearly this here is the only way to go.

I’ve got a much easier five words.

Baseline Fast Hand now please.

Warrior and Berserker lack many things, but saying they lack synergy simply isn’t true.

Distracting Blows + Body Blow + Skull Grinder

I should probably still include Bloody Roar even though the synergy isn’t as good as before, it can still interrupt though. If you land all of your CC on Mace and interrupt the synergy possibilities are pretty crazy. Oh, you could even use rifle in a build using this cause that has 2 interrupts as well.

The problem is always that you have to give up either Discipline or Defense to take advantage of this synergy.

Rousing Resilience + Outrage/Head Butt/Savage Instinct

How well these complement each other seems to be flying under the radar. Yes, you might be a bit weaker to condis but the healing is still good. You can potentially use Head Butt to break a stun then break that 1 second stun for another heal. It’s sustain that isn’t totally dependent on double Endure Pain, but you can bring that still as well. If you want even more sustain you could bring Dead or Alive as well.

Burst Mastery + Smash Brawler

Very simple, short burst CD and getting adrenaline back from those bursts letting you spam them even more.

So, while this doesn’t mean our class is in a good spot, saying it has no synergy is insulting because it’s clear that these synergies were intended and if not for other issues some builds would be even more powerful than they are now.

I’m not as YOLO as some of you, but I have been messing with Rifle.

This is what I have been working on. It’s not perfect yet but it does offer a healthy balance of damage and sustain so long as you’re facing some CC, which is almost ever build, you can also CC yourself so you’re gonna get use out of the synergy no matter what. Might take Smash Brawler instead but both are useful

I’ll leave the glassy ranged damage to Rangers, I wanna be in the fray lining up collateral shots.

gannondorf.7628:

Don’t say that OP! Devs don’t are going to change anything more if they see topics like this!
Berserker are better now and can remplace strengh or arms. In pve it’s a nice spec. But in pvp it really lack of something. I think berserk mode is too expensive or is don’t long enough. The dommage are strong but warrior is don’t enough mobile now (with daredevil, shiro revenant, range guardian…) and need to wait 30 of adrenaline, resulting in no using burst skills for a moment, and a lost of dps, for activating a burst mode which last only 15 seconds. This can"t make the warrior at same level than other classes.

I think you vastly overestimate how much the devs value my opinion.

eXruina.4956:

You are better off dumping Berserker entirely from that build, it doesn’t even bring that much damage into the equation to scrap the Strength tree for it..

As hard as we try to make this work it is just sub-par, skill can only get us so far, and ultimately we are only as good as the tools we are given. Where all the other classes got significantly stronger or a whole new playstyle altogether Warrior got kitten.

Their heart was in the right place, the theme was great, but the execution was all over the place.. It seemed that while other classes got no restriction to their design Warrior got heavily restricted, tunnel visioned into the mess it is now.

There are some advantages:

Cleave/AoE – Decapitate and Arc Divider both spread more damage around than a the normal burst. Also, you miss Evis, you’re facing a much longer CD. Decapitate isn’t that much lower in terms of damage and I’ve been finding it much easier to land.

Synergy – Outrage, Head Butt, and Savage Instinct all synergize better with Rousing Resilience than any other base War build could. Eternal Champion also helps make up for the lack of Forceful GS. Losing Strength hurts, but these changes made it hurt less. I may go Smash Brawler over Savage Instinct though in the long run.

Now, let me say that by “OK” I do not mean that I am satisfied. It’s not total doom and gloom though, in any game mode. The recent changes weren’t what we wanted, but they weren’t all bad changes either.

I was doing surprisingly well with this setup right here.

I actually finally felt the “unstoppable” theme of that bottom line. You stun me? I break it and heal and get tougher. Even if the enemy doesn’t have CC (most builds do though, and there’s even a lot in PvE now) you can still trigger it yourself using Head Butt. You can take “Dead of Alive” for even more sustain. You’re potentially weak to condis, but with proper use of what you have it shouldn’t be too bad. I’m finding that even vs condis my sustain with Rousing is higher than it is with CI. Don’t forget Healing Signet’s active, that can really save you.

While berserk you actually have pretty good cleave/AoE, might make us a bit more useful.

I’ve also been doing decent with this interrupt build.

If you hit all those interrupts, they die, don’t, you die. You’re also slow, I prefer the axe build because of the mobility.

The class/spec still has a ton of issues, but it feels at least useable now. Always Angry helps you keep your DPS up with not in Berserk mode.

Bloody Roar had good synergy with builds using Body Blow and Distracting Strikes. That synergy is now much less. That being said the Daze on Blaze breaker IS nice so I guess it’s just a tradeoff. Will probably help a lot with hybrid builds.

Core Warrior still has issues, but it’s something.

Also, the extra damage will now hopefully mean that you can drop Strength in some builds and not be totally screwed.

Mace on Berserker is where you wanna be. With Mace/Shield you have 3 interrupts and 2 blocks. Skull Grinder might me boarder line OP of base War gets fixed. If you time all your interrupts things can get crazy fast. With Bloody Roar that’s another interrupt and a long lasting bleed. The real issue is that you can’t afford Disciple. You’re slow even with a sword and you are totally dependent on landing that CC for damage.

It’s surprisingly skill based.

Arewn.2368:

Pestering and begging the devs to respond isn’t going to get you anywhere. Projects, be they game development or otherwise, have schedules and daily tasks that need to be tended to. They aren’t ignoring us, they’re busy. Arena Net, like many devs, have proven that they do listen and take feedback into consideration, it’s just a matter of when they have time.
And as precious as everyone thinks their advice is, it’s not. The warrior sub-forum can harp on about “baseline so-and-so” to the ends of time, that doesn’t change the validity of the suggestion. As great as fast-hands baseline would be, I’m still unconvinced on why exactly it “needs” to be baseline.
Most instances of things being made baseline were to fix the functionality of the mechanic. Traits that were required just to make a utility-type usable for example. Fast Hands can be strong/useful in many circumstances, but that doesn’t mean it fits the above. If anything, I’d say the so called “need” for Fast Hands is a symptom of warrior problems, not a cause.
To go with your analogy, the tower is being built on fairly sturdy ground as-is, the problem is the bricks are made out of feces.
We have so many weak traits, traits in lines that have poor synergy, and utility skills that are either under-tuned or outright useless. Not to mention weapons like off-hand axe that are in a laughable position.

I read all the class sub-forums and I have been seeing a decent amount of dev response. While often times it’s just “We’re aware of this” or “We’re looking into it,” that’s way more than what we’ve been getting here.

I don’t have a ton of time to play these days, so I need to decide if it’s time to just totally drop Warrior and go and fully kit out my Engi or Necro.

I feel that it’s safe to say we are generally underwhelmed by Torch.

Blaze Breaker

This skill is just really unimpressive. Same animation for the arm as Tremor but with a skill that is way less impactful. Reusing animations is fine on a different class, but Tremor is a Warrior skill.

As for the actual skill, it’s also not that great. What would be much more useful is a skill like Scrappers Shock Shield which gives a bit of sustain but with a offensive aspect. Maybe something like a 1 second block to the front but it shoots out longer ranged flames than the Lightning from Shock Shield?

Flames of War

This isn’t a bad skill, but it’s missing something. It would be a great bit of sustain for it to destroy projectiles for the duration.

Maybe that’s too much, but atm I would still use a shield on a condi build for the sustain. These suggestions would make torch have a little sustain while still being focused on burn.

I really don’t wanna get caught up in forum drama, but recently I’ve seen far too many posts asking for a totally unreasonable number of changes. If you’re a dev involved with this class I just want you to know that the class is not in as bad of a place as many are making it out to be. My list comes about from my own experiences as well as from many hours talking with other Warrior and in some cases non-Warrior players who I find can have insight that those of us who play it all the time lack. These changes are intended to be simple (in concept from someone with no background in game design) as possible and to open more build options.

Baseline Fast Hands

Let me start by saying that I in no way oppose other classes getting traits like this baseline if they need it to function. I know Thief has a few as does Ranger and Ele. I play all of those classes (only really play enough Ele to understand some builds), but I’m not well versed enough to say what’s needed and what’s just nice to have though.

Warrior though, it’s easy, Warrior weapons are pretty obviously balanced around this traits existence. In the old trait system you only needed to invest a few points for it so it was less of an issue. War in general benefited from being able to dip just a few points into some trees. In this new system, Warrior’s in PvP/WvW simply need that trait to be effective. It also dramatically hurts Berserker as well.

Adrenaline Decay

This hurts PvE the most. It can feel like you hardly use your class mechanic in many cases and that can kill the enjoyment. I feel like starting a SLOW and steady drain as soon as you leave combat would be a fair compromise from the old system which was apparently seen as lasting too long. Again, the current system hurts Berserker a lot.

A Few Trait Swaps

Some traits are in awkward places that keep builds that would be at least viable from reaching their full potential. A big one is Crack Shot. I feel like the devs might not want 3 weapon traits in one line, but right now if you’re running Healing Signet and no Physical Skills you’re pretty starved for options so it would fit wonderfully there. Otherwise swapping places with Destruction of the Empowered is acceptable. Someday down the line maybe Axe Mastery will be buffed and traits can be shuffled again, but as things currently stand players don’t wanna lose Warrior’s Sprint.

Another big one is swapping Inspiring Banners and Merciless Hammer. I could see Hambow making a bit of a comeback then because you would have both Cleansing Ire and Merciless Hammer which is needed for the Combustive Shot + Earthshaker combo that is a staple of that build. Without Merciless Hammer your DPS feels much lower and CDs line up awkwardly with weapon swaps. Again, we can talk Inspiring Banner Changes another day, just trying to make a few more builds work now.

Anything else right now is just greedy.

For base Warrior, I think that’s all that is really needed right now. A mini change would be to revert the nerf to Vigorous Shouts.

Now, I’ve been writing a lot about Berserker changes but many of mine are way more difficult to implement (comparatively, most are just about usability and sustain) and can be discussed once we hopefully get base Warrior in a good spot. You can’t build a tall tower on shaky ground.

Also, I know all the devs are busy, but can we PLEASE get at least some sort of communication as to whether these complaints/suggestions are at least being looked at? I would at least be able to make a clean break with the class if I got told “No, we like how we’ve designed Warrior” rather than me posting here way more often than I should in the hope that I can help affect some kind of change. There’s a lot of us Warriors and from both the forums, reddit, and in game many seem very disappointed right now. This class has been a bumpy ride since launch. From “OP” Bull’s Charge + Frenzy + 100b, to being seen as terrible for almost a year, to being slightly over the top with Hambow/Axebow/Shoutbow, and now we’re almost right back where we were shortly after launch in terms of PvP, not wanted or needed.

Honestly, I disagree with a lot of this.

• Those first few damage buffs aren’t needed. Shout heal values just need to be reverted.

• Skull Crack as a leap would actually make it worse in some ways. As it is now say a D/P Thief uses Heartseeker through Black Powder towards you. You can actually use Skullcrack and hit them very easily. A leap would make it much harder. Also, it’s a devastating attack and should be hard to hit.

• Berserker needing full adrenaline is fine. Head Butt is a free full bar and Berserker Stance fills you up AND not to mention many other traits.

• Healing Signet is at a fine level, especially with the buffs to Rousing Resilience and Shield.

• Leg Spec just needs to have a per-target ICD (like Blinding Ashes) and to allow Blade trail to proc it on both hits.

• All primal bursts don’t need CC. Skills like the LB one just need a different design. I would say reuse that “expanding flame circle” idea that GS once had and up the damage a bit and have it so that you are burned more the closer to the skillshot you are. I’d like Hammer to be a pull for some nice combos.

• Banners just need CD reduction on the trait to start. In a perfect wold we would get the ability to wear a single banner on our back when traited and swaps places with Merciless hammer, which is fine as is (it was a major factor in the old Hambows strength and shoulda been nerfed before base hammer damage). Poison effecting Battle Standard is fine as is the cast time, it’s a powerful elite and needs counterplay.

• Only Fast Hands needs to be baseline , anything else is just being greedy and we need to keep Discipline a worthwhile trait line.

OK, from here on I’m just focusing on the big ones, there’s just too many unneeded buff suggestions to comment on them all them all.

• Shake it Off and Fear Me are both fine. They’re both already good it was just the healing decrease that was the problem.

• Berserker Stance SHOULD NOT remove conditions already on you. That’s the major counterplay that was intentionally placed there. There should not be such a hard counter to conditions.

• Cleansing Ire doesn’t need to be replaced by Berserker. You can already take CI and Burst Mastery with a LB for near-immunity as it is. I don’t like the LB Primal Burst but it is good for that.

• Much rather see Rifle 1 get a damage boost when the target has vulnerability. It gives skill 4 much more use and makes skill 1 actually hit for a bit more.

• Rifle Range is fine, Ranger is supposed to be the long range specialist while Warrior is medium and Engi is (mostly) close. Do you REALLY wanna make Warrior Pew Pew Ranger 2.0?

To be frank, while I do agree with some of these suggestions the vast majority are just totally uncalled for. You seem to think Mace is terrible when imo it’s one of the best weapons we have. I would like the ability to trigger Counterblow on my own though because that can be a tad finicky. Instant though!? That hit can do 4-6k on light targets!

I’ve been running Mace/GS base Warrior post patch and have managed to reliably beat Herald Revenants and Dragonhunters. The Shield buff is a HUGE deal, almost feels too good. Even Engis/Scrappers with Jugg don’t stand a chance because all you gotta do is chain Pommel Bash and a stun.

Back to the point at hand, outside of Fast Hands being baseline, slower adrenaline decay, and a few quality of life changes most everything else is OK to good on base Warrior. Every class had bad traits but making weak traits OP is not the solution. We have to appear reasonable. This list just looks ridiculous and if I was a dev I wouldn’t give it the time of day.

hackks.3687:

better yet, traps should require the user to trigger them. not just a player stepping on them. lets just make them useless without active play.

This idea actually seems pretty interesting.

• Give traps a 1/2 second “cast” time.

• Placing traps replaces that skill with another skill that is the activation.

That would actually allow you to time when you want to use them and would also create a interesting game of “am I on the traps or not?” Lure them into the traps and spring them when you’re actually ready to burst. I’d be cool with that being possible with all traps. It makes them much more skill based and it also means you can’t just counter them with one dodge.

Sometimes when I have a crap day I swap to Scrapper to play how I thought Berserker was supposed to.

If you wanna keep some movment speed I’d suggest Traveler instead. You get more benefit overall imo. Also yah, I see no reason to go double Rifle and at the very least you can use it to create distance.

So, I’ve been messing around a bit, and while I wouldn’t call these builds amazing or viable, they’re somewhat useable.

Mace Condi

Good against builds with low stability and cleanse, but if they do have those things you’re gonna have a hard time. No Discipline line as well.

Berserker GreatAxe

Probably not better than the version with Strength over Berserker. You do gain Head Butt and Outrage which cane be used for easy 100b combos if you can get Headbutt to work right.

You can drop Defense for Strength, but I feel like the sustain Shield offers is really good. Can also drop Axe/Shield for Hammer.

GUUUUNNN FLLLLAAAAMMEEE!

Good damage but fairly weak to high condi uptime. Been trying a lot of different runes. Rage was fairly good, Traveler helps with your lack of movement speed out of combat. You can go even more yolo, but I like at least a little sustain cause I don’t focus on ranging.

It’s still a mediocre elite spec but you can get a bit of fun out of it from time to time.

Gambino.2109:

Stun myself? At the cost of the other dude stun breaking.. making the attack useless. No thanks

I’d rather not stun myself =D

We got a 10 second CD stun breaker and a trait that breaks stun if you go Berserk after landing it ANY a trait that makes it give you Stability if you use it as a stun break AND that same trait pulses Stability while going Berserk. It’s hardly a issue in my experience, just pathfinding.

The concept if fine, but I personally run this instead.

It has better sustain, you can eaten alive by condis if you don’t have Berserker Stance. Sadly, Healing Signet is just better than “To the Limit!” It’s too slow this build is also not even traited for shouts. You can go offhand Sword instead of Torch for the extra block.

I’ve tried it with Sinister, Rampager’s, and Celestial as well, all have their pros and cons.

The biggest overall weakness is any build with a lot of stability, which isn’t that uncommon now. Against a Warrior with Last Stand AND Balanced Stance AND Berserker Stance you’re gonna have a hard time. The confusion and bleed application can get CRAZY high though.

Still, you don’t have Fast hands, Warrior’s Sprint, or Burst Mastery. It’s kinda similar to the old Mace/Sword or Axe/Sword builds. I’m not really a huge fan of double 1h sets though. It’s a “balanced” build, but its has so many weaknesses it’s hard to call it good. You’ll either crush your opponent or will be crushed if they have a lot of removal/stability.

I would say a big part of the problem is that there are a realativly few skills that can deny block skills. Magent is one and Sigent of Might can let you CC through it (but what Warrior is going to give up sustain for it?) but there’s still not a whole lot of counters to block.

As for invulnerability, I agree that the Warrior way of doing things is much healthier than other classes. On my Engi fights simply tend to just be easier with Elixir S. I can go E gun and do well, but it’s hard to beat a long lasting immunity when it comes to escaping danger. I never understood the hate of Endure/Defy Pain. You can still apply CC and condi and Defy Pain is SUPER predictable. I don’t like having to have both for any kind of real sustain but it’s one of the easiest skills to counter.

Seeing more selective immunity would certainly make things more skillful. Maybe have different types of break bars for direct damage and Condis? That could be cool.