Guild Wars 2

niea.7504:

I can understand from where different people are coming. That doesn’t mean that I agree, but I can understand. I think the core of this thread is pretty simple.

The OP’s topic title posed the following question:

“Collectors Edition supports getting anything? [sic]”

The in-game email from Anet, in part, reads:

“Because you purchased gems through our Gem Store or via a Guild Wars 2 Gem Card between the launch of Guild Wars 2 and June 9, 2013, please enjoy the attached gift from ArenaNet.”

From this, the answer to the OP’s question is no.

Read this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhetorical_question

lordkrall.7241:

The minis were given out to people that have kept supporting the game.
Simple as that.

Buying the CE back in the days gave them some extra money over the standard edition, but far from enough to keep the game alive for a year. The the ones keeping GW2 alive is the ones that buys gems, simple as that.

Ohh please start reading before posting. This is like the 5th time I need to debunk that same story. IT has nothing to do with keeping supporting. Other people keep supporting buy buying the expansion when it is released and people who did buy gems the day of the release and nothing after that did also get the thank you.

And the idea that the gem-buyers keep GW2 running is also total bull. They can easily get around on box sales and expansion sales. Just like companies who sell non MMO games also make money only on that. F2P games run on micro-transactions and can’t live without them but this is no f2p game it is a b2p game.

kokocabana.8153:

Box sales go towards recouping development/publisher costs. Gems sales go towards maintaining the game after launch.

@Devata
Do you think that whatever real goodies like rylock figure did not cost them money to make and ship to you? You make it sound like you paid more and got the same thing as players that only bought the regular edition. Players that used real money to buy gems and then bought the CE would be supporting the game after launch because they are buying gems. Plus they don’t receive any extra real goodies like a rylock figure.

“Box sales go towards recouping development/publisher costs. Gems sales go towards maintaining the game after launch.” Also covered this idea. At least react on what I am saying in stead off repeating something that I already answered on. Single player games also make money on only the box sales. Yeah they have ‘less’ maintaining cost but they do have more cost on developing a whole new game while an MMO can do with a good expansion. That kinda level things out.

“Do you think that whatever real goodies like rylock figure did not cost them money " Of course it did. Do you think designing the items you buy with the gem-store do not cost stuff. Do part of your money go’s into the development / goodies cost, part is profit. Do I think they made more profit on the CE then on the regular. Yes I do, or at least I hope because for many people buying a CE is also a show of there appreciation.

“. Players that used real money to buy gems and then bought the CE would be supporting the game after launch because they are buying gems. Plus they don’t receive any extra real goodies like a rylock figure.” And once again.. after launch.. Yeah factually you be correct but that could be 10 min after launch and then they did not buy anything anymore. And those people do not get the goodies but then again, they pay 25 euro for there deluxe addition but the CE buyers did pay about 105 Euro on top of the normal price. So don’t be afraid, the CE buyers did pay extra for those goodies and I do believe they made some extra money out of the extra 105 Euro the CE buyers paid extra.

Vayne.8563:

I don’t buy collectors editions for an extra thank you. I buy them because I want the stuff inside the box. It probably hasn’t occurred to you OP, but Anet probably doesn’t make much more off the sale of a collectors edition than they do off the sale of a downloadable normal sale.

The reason is because they keep all the profit if you buy directly from them,but they have to cut in various retailers if you buy the collectors edition. In other words, buying a bunch of gems supports the company far more.

Anyway, envy is a lousy emotion. Anet did something nice for people who bought gems. You yourself refuse to support a company in that way. I’m not sure you have grounds for complaint.

I did think of that but there was no other way to do it. They could have put 500 gems in the CE, that would not go to retailers. I do still think they made more on CE version then regal sale but no way to be sure, just like there is no ware to be sure they did not. I refuse them to support them in the gem-store way but not in addition ways (like CE version / expansions) what seems like a fair reason for a B2P game. Furthermore it has nothing to do with envy. that would mean I was mad at the people who did get it and you do not hear me complaining about them do you? And like I also mentioned many times. A lot of the ‘bad decisions’ that are being made and are not good for the game seem to be directly related to the gem-store. So they do thinks in the game that are not good for the game but that they hope will get people to buy more gems, or so it seems. That was something I was thinking of making a thread about before, but then this came up.

Anyway, I think my point is pretty clear about the focus on the gem-store and they way it is rude to ‘thank’ part of the people for extra support and not ‘thanking’ the other half for extra support. If nobody got a thank you it would also have been fine.

Araziel.7201:

Devata.6589:

So the mini is ‘stuff from the gems’? But yeah you can buy stuff from the CE with the gems.

And you can buy the mini’s with gems too. They are in the store now. Wasn’t like we got some special unique reward like early access and a Rytlock toy.

Do you really not get it? You payed for those gems and got those gems + something extra. I paid for the Rytlock toy + early access and got the Rytlock toy + early access. The reason why we both did buy more then ‘needed’ was because of the things we did buy (gems, Rytlock toy) and partly (at least for me) for some extra support. You got a “thank you” for that extra support CE support did not. That is rude. And ingame the CE buyers did not get anything unique. Personally I think the reason they did this is 1 just a mistake.. simply forgot about the CE buyers and 2th because of the gem-store focus lately and that is becoming more and more of a problem in the game imho. So that brings you to the underlaying problem of that. But I did say enough about that in other comments so leave it to that.

Siphaed.9235:

Did I get my money’s worth from the Collector’s Edition? Yes. Does A.Net owe me anything beyond that for “paying more”? No.

As for this GIFT (something they were not obligated to do at all), it was done for those who have continued to support the development of this game’s additional content by purchasing stuff from the digital store. That’s CONTINUED SUPPORT. The box was paid for by the box purchase, the additional content was paid for by gem store. And thus the minis were a gift to additional content purchasers, not box purchasers. Thank you, have a nice day.

Nice that you leave your reaction. To bad that you did not read my previous post. Because I already debunked the whole continued support nonsense. But I will repeat myself again. For you. Everybody who for example did buy the deluxe edition with gems the day after release and did not buy any gems after that did also get the gems. No continued support. And secondly who does day I do not continue my support? I do, if they release an expansion I will buy that and if possible that will again be the CE edition. So gem-buyers are NOT only people who CONTINUED SUPPORT. And I will continue support if they give me the change to do it the way I like. That is to buy the game. Not so strange that that is my preferred way with a Buy to Play game.

“Did I get my money’s worth from the Collector’s Edition? Yes. Does A.Net owe me anything beyond that for “paying more”? No."

And I also said that I did not feel like Anet owned me anything (well they should fix bugs and stuff) but Anet does also not owe gem-buyers anything. I did get what I paid for and the gem-buyers got what they payed for. And we both gave something extra to Anet in our way. The problem that I have is that now the gem-buers get something extra for that extra they did and the CE buys do not get something extra for that extra. And then there is the underlaying problem that the focus becomes to much on the gem-store and that is is bad for the whole game. Good example now is the achievement for moa racer. Win 3 races. 1/5 change to win so about 15 bets = 7,5 gold to buy the achievement. Somehow I have the feeling that is in there just to drain money and that might be to try and sell more gems. Try to sell expansion, don’t ‘edit’ the game to sell gems, edit the game to make it better.

So next time first read everything because then you might also add something to the topic. Thank you, and also have a nice day.

You must have been absent the day that Anet said (and they said it more than one) that micro-transactions were part of their business model. I probably was. But yeah if you have a gem-store and make some extra money with it then it is part of your business model.

But if you sell your game as a B2P game the focus should not be on the gem-store but on the game and the expansions. What is a real problem in this game is that people can not farm for items but they need to farm for gold. Thats the worst way of farming possible or like a guild-member said after they removed the skelk farming. “I want to play this game but they do not let me play the game”.

Now the farming for gold be be there because they tried to have no farming in it and failed on that making it a gold-farming game. But it might also be because of the gem-store. You can buy gold with gems so there is a reason to buy gems. If thats the case it would be really bad for the game and not work because it is scaring people away. I also saw a lot of raging about the temporary available stuff in the gem-store and thats just an aggressive marketing tactic. So it shows how the focus on a gem-store is bad for a game especially in a game that people did buy partly because it was B2P. So if they want more money just come an expansion. Yeah also make some money with the gem-store but don’t focus on that. Focus on the expansion and have the gem-store as an extra. But now with rewarding gem buyers for buying gem-buyers and leaving other supporters out is just rude.

“No company can offer enough content to be competitive on JUST box sales. Even if they made and sold expansions to Guild Wars 1….it was a different era. Sure that supported the 50 people they had working there.” The biggest difference that the price for hosting a server is not that expensive anymore. Most games (like signle-player) make there money with box sales and yeah in an MMO they have to keep supporting it but those single-player games need to start making a whole new game for the next release so they lose the same time. MMO’s need to support and make an expansion. It’s nonsense to think they need the gem-stores. Business would like you to believe they need it but it’s just good money, they do not ‘need’ it and it often destroys a game and thats bad money.

“Voice acting alone is ridiculous. Why do you think SWToR was the most expensive MMO ever made.” Yeah it is. To bad because I do not even like the PS and most voice acting when into that in GW2. I would not miss it but again.. all games that make there money with only the box have the same. Box sales can easily cut it, gem-store is a nice extra.

Araziel.7201:

Hey, Anet, I didn’t buy a collectors edition, but I did buy gems and received the free holographic pets. Does that mean I get the stuff from the collectors edition too now. I think that’s really messed up if I don’t.

So the mini is ‘stuff from the gems’? But yeah you can buy stuff from the CE with the gems.

“And keep in mind it is very possible our expansions will be free” I don’t hope so because then it would become a F2P game and yes then you need micro-transactions else you don’t.

Astraea.6075:

The sense of entitlement is strong with this one.

It was known well ahead of launch that the gem store was a prime feature of ANet’s business model for this game, so trying to make a distinction between B2P and F2P as the OP is doing is pointless. Gem sales provide ongoing financial support to the game beyond that given by making the initial purchase of the game.

For the record, I pre-purchased the digital deluxe edition because I was willing to support the company prior to the game’s launch. I bought a small amount of gems after launch to further show my support and because I could afford it at the time. In neither case did I expect further recognition or reward from my purchases, but I think it is a nice gesture that gem buyers have received a gift from ANet as thanks.

You are all talking about initial purchase I keep talking about expansions. And I did not ask for a reward but doing it for the gem guys and no the other ones (that might even paid much more) that I personally consider just rude. But maybe they just forgot. If they want more money, stop the gem-store focus and get the expansion.

iCryptik.1496:

Vayne.8563:

I don’t buy collectors editions for an extra thank you. I buy them because I want the stuff inside the box.

This.

Anet makes its money from micro transactions.

You do not buy gems for an extra, you buy gems for the stuff you want to buy for them.

And F2P game make money with micro transactions. B2P games should not focus on micro transactions. It should be a nice extra for them. B2P game should make money on selling the game and expansion.. you know thats why is if B2P.

“The reason is because they keep all the profit if you buy directly from them,but they have to cut in various retailers if you buy the collectors edition. In other words, buying a bunch of gems supports the company far more.”
Who do you think that pays those extra cost? They person who buys so for ArenaNet it should not make a big difference.

Grim.6415:

Maybe Anet can make you happy by offering a better 1 year anniversary reward based on the edition of the game you bought. Maybe a rarer mini or something. Why don’t you put that in the suggestion forums.

But I do not ask for any extra so I would not be asking for something like that at the 1 year anniversary. It’s just that now suddenly gem supporters get something for supporting with gems but CE supporters or indeed pre-order (even they did not really pay more) supporters did not. IT;s more the difference they made why I made the post not because I need an extra. Then I would have made a post a long time ago.

Jrunyon.3012:

Elidath.5679:

Jrunyon.3012:

- People buy gems and got something extra.
- You buy CE and get something extra, but you want even more extra?

People paid for gems and got gems (what they paid for) and free, unexpected extra.
Some other people paid for CE (which is game + some billed extra), got exactly what they paid for, and nothing else.
That’s his gripe, I think. Even more if (like I suspect) it was preorder. What means more “I want to support this game, I’m a loyal customer” than paying for something beforehand, without garanty of quality ?

Now, I myself don’t think much of this, but I understand some can be, let’s say, not optimaly happy.

I preordered as well, and I got what i paid for. The game 3 days early, my ring and 7 days bank access golem. OP got what they paid for as well. I fail to see an issue here.

The problem is that some ‘supporters’ get some present for supporting and other supporters don’t. Would not mind if all of the supporters got nothing, would even be better this being a B2P game but if you do, and I understand that they wanna do, then give it to all supporters in stead of only to the gem-store-supporters. I think they simply forgot that there where other ways that people supported then just buy buying gems.

AlietteFaye.7316:

I enjoy staring at my Rytlock statue every day. He’s still in my box, nice and pretty. I do think that a few more in-game items would have been great, but I knew what I was getting into when I got the CE anyway.

Yeah same for me. But again. I did know what I was getting and thats fine. I did not ask for something extra. The problem is the difference. The gem-buyers also got what they pay for.. and now more. It’s the gem-store focus that is the big problem behind this. Just come with a nice expansion so I can give money that way in stead of the gem-store marketing.

So far no luck. don;t know if the past patch also fixed the problem. I asked in the guild and so far there is only 1 other person who did not get it. My luck.

“Fixed a bug where achievements were not being properly rewarded for activities.”
I think that is the bug. even it is the other way around. So can not get the skins now anymore:S

Elidath.5679:

Jrunyon.3012:

- People buy gems and got something extra.
- You buy CE and get something extra, but you want even more extra?

People paid for gems and got gems (what they paid for) and free, unexpected extra.
Some other people paid for CE (which is game + some billed extra), got exactly what they paid for, and nothing else.
That’s his gripe, I think. Even more if (like I suspect) it was preorder. What means more “I want to support this game, I’m a loyal customer” than paying for something beforehand, without garanty of quality ?

Now, I myself don’t think much of this, but I understand some can be, let’s say, not optimaly happy.

Exactly. The CE was only available as pre-order and it was even sold out in our country hours after the release so I had to go to a shop that imported it from another game. The reason I do not like it is not only because of missing the mini’s but also just because it’s like a slap in the face for the CE buyers and because one of the reasons I went for GW2 was because it was B2P and not F2P. But this sort of actions are something for F2P games. I also did not like the ‘aggressive’ marketing techniques to try to get people buying stuff from it. You know like putting stuff in there for a limited time. There is a reason why people go for B2P not for F2P. And I understand that Anet wants to make more money but then come with an expansion. If you lose members you will also make less money so those techniques work in the short run but might haunt you in the ling run. Anyway, this is just one more of those things. And I simply think it is unfair.

Grim.6415:

The good news is the free mini’s are not unique. You can just convert a bit more gold to gems and get them without spending any additional money.

Think about it like this. If you went to an amusement park and paid the admission fee would you be mad that only those that spent additional money on ride tickets were rewarded months later by a stuffed animal in the mail?

No, but I might be mad if I also spend extra money but not with ride tickets but with a vip entree ticket.

kokocabana.8153:

My question now is why aren’t people that bought the CE and also spent real money on gems getting something even better?

Simple, for the same reason as they also do not make a difference between those people who did buy 500 gems or those who did buy 5000 gems. They just thank you for ‘the support’.

I hope answered everybody’s question. So you guys really think my question is so strange?

It looks like people are forgetting something. You can buy the deluxe edition for gems. Buying the collections edition is in a way buying that + the ‘real’ stuff. But if I would not buy the CE and I would buy the Deluxe version with gems I would have got the thing from ArenaNet. That is not a little strange? I basically both the same but in another way. Then to answer your questions.

Jrunyon.3012:

Devata.6589:

Gem buyers also got other stuff. You know like the gems and they stuff they did buy with the gems.

- People buy gems and got something extra.
- You buy CE and get something extra, but you want even more extra?

How about you give me that Rytlock statue you got and I’ll shoot you a few bucks to buy some minis.

What extra? I did buy the Collecters Edition and got the Collectors Edition. People did buy gems and got the gems… and now get this for supporting ArenaNet. You know like I did buy buying the CE. Or at least that was one of the reasons. So no I did not get anything extra and I would not ask for it if it was not that now people got it for buying gems… in this B2P game.

SpyderArachnid.5619:

You already got your extra reward when you bought a Collector’s Edition. That is the whole point of buying the Collector’s Edition. For the bonus rewards that Standard Edition players don’t get.

The Mini Pack was a gift to those who have CONTINUED to support Anet. Which you haven’t done. You bought your Collector’s Edition and were rewarded appropriately for that. You are not entitled to bonus rewards after you have already been rewarded.

The people being rewarded the Free Mini Pack are being rewarded cause they are STILL giving Anet money and continuing to do so, thus continuing to support the company.

You are all saying the same wrong thing. I did not get any extra reward when I bought the CE. I got the CE. Just like the gem buyers got the gems. We both got what we paid for and we both paid more then we needed. And now ArenaNet is thanking the people for paying more then they needed. Wekk a few of them. “The Mini Pack was a gift to those who have CONTINUED to support Anet.” nonsense. If you would buy the Deleuxe Edition with gems the day after release you would have got it. Even if you did not buy any gems after that. They give the gift for the extra support not for the continued support. Beside that, who says I would not continue supporting. I had hoped there would be an expansion after a year (seems like there is none) but when there will be I will buy another CE version of the expansion (if that will be available). You are not entitled to bonus rewards after you have already been rewarded. With that reasoning nobody should have got it if they only spend gems months ago. But also those people did. And once again I got rewarded with the CE, just like the gem buyers got rewarded with the gems and fact stays that many of the CE buyers spend more on that then the gem0buyers spend on the gems.

“The people being rewarded the Free Mini Pack are being rewarded cause they are STILL giving Anet money and continuing to do so, thus continuing to support the company.” You repaid yourself so read back. No it has nothing to do with still giving Anet money because it was for everybody who ever got gems and CE buyers might also buy CE expansion so you can’t say they do not still support Anet just because they did not buy gems.

Ok well then I hope everybody just gets them because I am not online this weekend. BTW I would not say ‘some people’ guest. A lot of people got it.

Finally and thanks. Now have a look at all the missing guild-options please. Another think we are waiting on since the beta release.

I would like to see a API option to get all the claimed camps, towers, keeps, castles by a given guild-name. Useful for on a guild-side.

[An Error Prevented Saving:
Bump Warning: You are bumping a topic whose last post was seven days ago. Please select the manual override below if you still wish to post this.]
No I am not bumping I am adding a new reaction and the last post was 22 days ago, not 7. The override option force me to agree that I bump. Well I am not!

kokocabana.8153:

I have difficulty understanding your problem.
-Did you not get something extra in the collector’s edition or did you throw them away?
-Did you know you can convert gold to gems?
-Are these mini’s providing legendary bonuses that allow them an unfair advantage over other player?

1 Like i said to the other person. Yes I got some other stuff, just like the gem-buyers got gems. BTW the ingame material you got for the CE was kinda bad.. the ‘real’ material was very cool. In ‘real’ material it was the best CE I ever saw but looking at ‘ingame material’ the worst. but back to the point. Main reason I did go for the CE was because I knew I was not gonna buy gems with money so thats my way of supporting. And I guess they did make more money on the CE version then on the normal version.

2 Yeah and I did that. That does not count for getting the mini’s. And I do understand that because in that way you do not support them. Like you do when buying a CE of buyin gems with real money.

3 No, what has that anything to do with what I am saying?

Dawdler.8521:

Collectors edition got other stuff… also its completely worthless minis. They could have given us a single crystaline dust and I’d have been more happy – at least that I could have sold.

Gem buyers also got other stuff. You know like the gems and they stuff they did buy with the gems.

And you might not want them but I would like them.

No thats not it. I did that but did not get it. Other people just got them from logging in or going to LA. It are the skins ArenaNet first said they would make available during the weekend. But I can not be on this weekend so loved to see that people did get them today already. of course I did not get them:S

About 95% of the guild-members got a chest with 3 skins for the hat.

A few including me did not. When do you get it? Somebody said he got it later when leaving and then returning to LA but that did not work for me.

A lot of guild-members got a mini pack that had 3 Holographic mini’s in them. The reason they got it because they both 500 gems somewhere between the release of the game and this was ArenaNet’s way to ’thank’them for the support.

Now I do not buy anything from in-game stores. Thats why I buy a B2P game and not a F2P game because of this sort of things. And F2P games that are doing there best to get people buying stuff from there. Hate that, so I go for a B2P game. (To bad GW2 is now also doing that more and more.. but that was expected as there is still no expansion announced. B2P games should run on the game and expansion).

Anyway, in stead of buying stuff in the gemstores I do want to support ArenaNet and so I buy the collectors edition. You know, the one that cost 105 Euro more then the normal game (how many gems can you buy for that?). But not you are smacking all those players in the face. What paying more for the game but not buying gems… You get nothing.

So my questions.. did you just forget about those people and will they still get it? Would be nice.

DevonCarver.5370:

We’ve found a bug in the siege cap and are working on addressing the problem as soon as we can.

Well the siege cap itself should be viewed as a bug and so be solved by removing it.

Remove the max on siege weapons but give them collision detection.

People pay for siege, they build it to defend a keep, tower, camp and then ArenaNet just removes the siege because it is not being used for some time?

That is yet another things that punishes tactics. I can understand that you don’t want people to put 100 arrow-cards on a keep but for that reason just use collision detection so siege weapons can’t stand inside each other.

Implementing collision detection for everything in WvW (including players) would even be great but thats not what this topic is about.

Let people use tactics please and stop removing siege. What WvW (or GW2 in general) really needs is some more common sense in the game mechanic. Whever you make a decision you should ask yourself.. does this make any sense? That makes a game more logical, more realistic in a way and more fun.

Ask that question for anything in the game and you finds the weak spots.

Let me give you an example with this siege. Does it make sense that siege suddenly simply disappears? Nope.. so thats a bad idea.

Does it make sense you can place siege inside each other? Nope. so another bad idea.

Stormcrow.7513:

Died again today as my mesmer trying to target a vet. Targeted a mini. Lost money in repairs. Contemplating uninstalling game.

Yeah somehow most the bugs in GW2 cost the players money. When I report a bug ingame I also always ask for the ingame money I lost because of the bug.

Not that I ever got any but just to show how often thats the case. I seen bugs in other MMO’s but they rarely cost the player ingame money, in GW2 9/10 bugs do.

ArenaNet does not seem to be looking in the suggestions page anymore. To bad because it is most-likely the best and most important topic. Look at the last 10 pages in the suggestion page and there are like 2 ‘fresh’ reactions.

They can better close suggestions if they don’t read it anyway.

We might want to move this thread and the thread about missing guild-options (and maybe other important threats) to bugs. Because a bad game mechanic is a bug is it not? It’s one of the topics some dev’s still do react once in a while. But sadly it seems like they are stopping to really have contact with the community. To bad, it was something they were doing good during the beta.

Special option in the ranks to activate a guild-mission @ location.

To many times somebody who should not activate it does activate it.

The longer you wait fixing this, the longer the list gets so it’s about time this get fixed. It was something I expected to be fixed in the first 2 months.

Then again, seeing how the right clicking problem https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/An-option-to-disable-right-click-targeting/page/11#post2044861 has also still not been fix I do start to wonder what is going on in the hq.

If you guys don’t fix these kinds of basic things you will not only lose people like is already happening but they will also stop coming back. I mean now they come back after 2 months, still see the same basic problems and so leave again. 2 months later they are back, still the same problems so they leave a gain. How long does anybody expect players to come back?

Faux Play.6104:

Disabling right click targeting is just treating a symptom. The issue is the game allows you to both rotate AND change target with the same click (if the motion is done quickly). The same issue exists with the left mouse. If you use it to do a quick look left or right while you are running you will have the same problem. Globally fixing the mechanic so you can’t do two functions with the same click would cure the disease.

True, but it’s a fast solution that can be fixed in just a few minutes.. well lets give them an hour. And it would help the people who have this problem. Except for the left-handed who probably have this problem with the right key-button.

So it could have been an easy fix that was implemented within a week after that this thread had been created. By now you might have expected a better more complete fix, thats true. But for now we did not get any solution / fix at all and I do wonder if devs still look at this thread or are like “somebody already reacted to this post”. I noticed that “Suggestions” is a place where devs are already least active what is a really shame because it has some of the best threads.

Hickeroar.9734:

Devata.6589:

Hickeroar.9734:

EnemyCrusher.7324:

Hickeroar.9734:

BobbyT.7192:

Just take out the trap all together, We were doing just fine without them.

This.

Traps are a mechanic with a lot of potential, they need a lot of work to get there, but taking them out completely is a terrible solution.

No, it’s not a terrible solution. It’s the correct one.

Instead of using them logistically or purposefully, enemies are just dropping them randomly on the field in the middle of zerg fights. Or on mining nodes. Or any other number of troll locations.

All the thinks you name really strengthen Hickeroar point, not yours.
It should not be able to put them into a zerg so thats an implementation error. That would be gone with better implementation. Putting them on mining-nodes does not seem trolling to me but seems to be smart, the enemy has then be so smart to send a scout ahead to trigger them.

So more tactics

That’s not tactics. That’s having to work around a bad game mechanic. It’s not fun, and doesn’t add -anything- valuable to the game.

Wasting 15 badges and 525 karma + 10 supply to drop a trap on a mining node? That’s a troll move. Zergs, or small groups, do not stack up on mining nodes. Only someone trolling the enemy would do that.

And @ Niim.9260
and @ TacoJoe.6083
Well any option to attack our defend against the enemy has to potential to be used in a tactical way. If you want you character to have a bigger role I would suggest going to the EB JP (all do they now cut it lose from WvW ) and the PvP matches. I personal like the EB JP better for such tactics. But in the big WvW world siege weapons is a part of the tactics and it does not about one on one fights / tactics. It’s about battlefield tactics. Thats something else, and I personally prefer that because else I would go to PvP.

I don’t think the traps really make a big difference for zergs vs small groups. A zerg just needs like 5 scouts (walking next to each other) and a group needs one scout. In potential that has a bit more impact on the smaller group then on the zerg because if the scout loses his supply thats almost a big part of the total supply but it’s not as bad as you calculate.

For alone roaming players it might be a bigger problem but then again, they almost never have enough supply anyway and if he would trigger a trap the enemy wasted a trap on 1 person.

BTW
“Wasting 15 badges and 525 karma + 10 supply to drop a trap on a mining node? That’s a troll move.”
Like I said before implementation. I already said they they were to hard to get and should be implemented in a similar way as the other siege weapons. That in combination with not being able to deploy wile stealth (so not able to ‘abuse’ them) and only trigger on players who have supply or are invisible and I don’t see how placing them is trolling.

Hickeroar.9734:

EnemyCrusher.7324:

Hickeroar.9734:

BobbyT.7192:

Just take out the trap all together, We were doing just fine without them.

This.

Traps are a mechanic with a lot of potential, they need a lot of work to get there, but taking them out completely is a terrible solution.

No, it’s not a terrible solution. It’s the correct one.

Instead of using them logistically or purposefully, enemies are just dropping them randomly on the field in the middle of zerg fights. Or on mining nodes. Or any other number of troll locations.

All the thinks you name really strengthen Hickeroar point, not yours.
It should not be able to put them into a zerg so thats an implementation error. That would be gone with better implementation. Putting them on mining-nodes does not seem trolling to me but seems to be smart, the enemy has then be so smart to send a scout ahead to trigger them.

So more tactics

BobbyT.7192:

Just take out the trap all together, We were doing just fine without them.

We meaning the thiefs and / or big zergs? But many people like more tactics, less zergs and less invisibility. So they were not doing so fine.

meep.2601:

why did anet feel a REAL need to invest dev time on a new feature that literally no one has asked for?

Almost everybody asked for more tactics and less zerging and a lot os people have complained about the invisibility by thiefs.

The traps give the option for more tactics and to do something about the invisibility. It might help a little against zerging but not a lot I think.

So basically many people asked for it. The problem is the implementation is not so good and because of the the traps do not give what they should give. But if that got fixed and the traps would be cheaper they will be a good tool. So the traps are not the problem, there implementation is.

Reading everything again It seems to be that the anti-supply traps are OP while the anti-invisibility traps are useless.

Anti-invisibility traps are useless because every enemy players will activate them while the supply traps are OP because invisible thiefs will place them.

Second problem is that even if this is fix’t they would be to expensive.

The solution them seems easy. Make them activate only on invisible players (and maybe do the same for players with supply) and don’t be able to set them up while invisible.

But then they are still not very powerful because any scout is able to activate them because of that the cost should go down and it should be able to get them in a similar way as normal blue-prints. This would counter there weakness against scouts.

This however would still not help against alone roaming thiefs that are a frustration for many players because you can’t really fight an invisible player.

Geotherma.2395:

wolfram.8291:

This is without a doubt the best way to fix this problem. I don’t know how hard it is to do, but it would save me a lot of frustration. Lol at geotherma’s arguments here. Priority? How important was the fix on how an NPC holds a chicken? I won’t argue with the idea that some people have no problem with this, but by her own admission she never uses right click to target or attack or interact with anything. What if tab cycled through allies and resource nodes and brought up dialog boxes and made you start mining while you were getting hammered by a dozen enemies? Would that be a priority fix? Nah, let’s fix the way NPC’s hold chickens.

Arenanet is the ones who said low priority, I was just repeating their words. I personally think it is a lower priority because it is not as large as some think it is. This problem only affects some people, of 1-2 million people this thread has under 300 who feel strongly enough to post about it. I’m not saying their claims are unfounded or untrue, just that this is what we were told. I agree it should be fixed, even if it is to convenience just some players because it is not a major change to the game. Many people continue to make it sound like I’m against it, when clearly I’ve stated otherwise and condensed info that is easier for people and devs to read. There are plenty of things I would like fixed as well, I would like the chickens to stop pooping eggs at me for 40k damage, and for 3 champions to not use the same 21k dmg skill at once on me.. But I’m patient.

You also forget about the people who never post there problems here, those that see this thread an am like “oke thats known” and so don’t post and then the people who do notice they lost there target all the time but do not know why. Most think it has to do with auto-targeting. I though that at first. In the TeamSpeak I was talking about it and there also some people where like.. “oow thats why I lose the target the whole time, I though it had to do with auto-targeting.”

Just ask in your guild how many people have the problem of “suddenly targeting the wrong target” and you will see it’s about half of the player-base.

I really hope the devs will also read the comments after Hugh Norfolk’s last comment because some really valid points have been made.

And it is not that I dislike the idea of traps… I even came up with the idea in an older post of me https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/WvW-needs-more-resourcefulness-and-less-zergs/first#post1183875 .

There I ask for more resourcefulness so people can even make there own traps. Just giving the trap as an option is also fine. It’s just the way it is implemented that is a little broken imho. Would they have implemented it as the normal blueprints are it would be fine.

The way it is now implemented would be good for direct use. So lets say I am roaming alone or we are with a party and suddenly a enemy thief comes in. If I would then be able to throw down a trap that would be great and then it would make sense to make then more expensive. You also don’t need to use them as much. But they now basically work as normal siege weapons, have the problem that they get activated by any enemy-player making them basically useless (because groups will work with scouts now) but you are not able to get them just like other siege-weapons.

Hickeroar.9734:

Rising Dusk.2408:

Hickeroar.9734:

As it stands, their price keeps them from being abused.

I think in time we may find that their price keeps them from being used at all.

Uhm….Good! :-P

No one really wants the things. They’re pretty much a game-breaking concept.

No the invisibility was the game-breaking concept. This seems to be a way how ArenaNet tries to fix that problem without nerving the thiefs them-self and so a lot of people want the traps.

That by itself is good and the idea of a trap is good but the implementation is not so great. The anti-invisibility trap should only get activated by invisible enemies and the way to get both the traps should be similar to the current siege weapons, so money or badges and as drop from chest.. I think with about the same drop-change as cata’s.

The only thing the anti-invisibility trap now is only a little useful for attacking alone roaming thiefs (so not defending against them. you need to build the trap so for that they are useful but really to hunt for them I mean). But that is only half of the problem and for that they are to expensive.. and even worse, every time some enemy player (not invisible) walks over them people can place a new one. Making the traps more accessible by implementing them in the same way as the other siege weapons and making the anti-invisible traps only activate on an invisible enemy would make them useful and I can’t really see how people would be able to abuse them. It’s still a one time use only so after any activation people have to place them again.

So even if they would be as easy to get as arrow-cards you would still not be able to ‘abuse’ them because you will run out of them much faster then the arrow-cards.

DevonCarver.5370:

All I’m saying is, remember this conversation in a few weeks. And that’s all I can say right now.

Well if you now suddenly introduce ascended gear I may hope you make a way to return the exotic WvW gear. I just (last week) both exotic gear costing me 950 badges and 5,44 gold. Not talking about the runes.

Implementing the traps seems to be a good idea. However the fact that it targets 20 people means it is yet another thing that is no big problem for big zergs but a big problem for smaller groups.

However the thing I really dislike about them it they way you buy them. Why do you need to buy them with badges and karma?:S

Just implement them the same way as the other siege weapons. You can buy them for badges, for silver and they drop from chest (the WvW JP chest). That would make more sense and would make it better.

So why you did go for the karma + badges?

(I mainly like the invisibility trap. Not so sure about the supply-trap) I did not really see a problem with supply.

Also the fact that it gets activated whenever any enemy walks over them seems strange. Makes them much less useful (so then the prices are way to high). Just let 1 person or a small group run before the rest and the traps are not worth anything anymore.

And one more question. I read a lot of PvP people here who think they are superior to PvE players (I do both by the way) but please explain my why (other then for those badges, but most of the people in the EB JP where not there just for the badges) would do that JP while there are many other JP’s in de PvE world. If they are really PvE players they don’t go and to the JP in EB they do it in PvE and if they need badges they can just run with a zerg. You don’t need to be a PvPer to be able to run brainless with a zerg.

Valik Shin.9027:

Jp has no place in wvw

Why not. The best PvP is going on (or was going on before the change) in the WvW JP. The normal WvW is mostly zerging and the PvP is just not so much fun. I do still like the normal W kittenittenhere most of the time but for some nice fights and more tactics you went to the JP.

First of all. Half of the time I am in the JP I am there to fight. I Like the jumping puzzle because there is are smaller and more tactical fights going on. Secondly, it’s not ’the easy way to farm badges". The easy way to farm badges is to run with zergs and when defending using arrow-cards. That is the easy way of getting badges. I got most badges that way. I also never did the JP with all chars just to loot the badges (I did it once when I needed siege-weapons) but I guess it is a fair way for the PvE only players to get them. Still I would suggest them running brainless with a zerg and using arrow-cards. That works much better.

However it totally sucks that if I am there with another char I can not open the chest anymore.

Now I was talking about bad changes in this post 4 days ago and 2 days later you show that it can be even worse. Now it is an instance (Why?) with a waypoint at the entrance.

A lot of people used to fight inside the JP and now dead people can just spawn back a few meters back. Before they at least needed to run a little bid.
For me I did the JP while in WVW, it was a nice break of the zerg-fest but now I first need to get in line for EB, then I get in the JP. There I kill some and die some but I can not repair my armor.. I can’t even really leave the dungeon in a good way except for the portal at the end. and if I want to go back to EB (maybe to go on there or just to repair) I need to get in line again.. WTF?:S

Besides that I can’t use any of the wapoints what also makes no sence because I was also able to use the other border-lands waypoints from EB and the other way around.

Please think before you change something. Changes should make thinks better not worse.

To end on a positive note. In my post I also said that it was bad that the chest resets after 24 hours in stead of at the same time as the daily. It looks like ArenaNet agreed that that was a bad change and they now changed it back. So that is good!

I was doing the jumping puzzle today with my alt and I couldn’t open the chest. It turned out that in a recent patch the chest has been made account-bound. Like if this game isn’t alt unfriendly enough already.

Please stop making these kind of bad and silly changes and fix the stuff that needs to get fixed. You know like (make it possible to) disable right button click https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/An-option-to-disable-right-click-targeting/page/10 and add like 100 missing guild-options https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Guild-System-Improvements/page/4 and add end-content that keeps people playing like putting mini’s and mounts into the world so people can collect them, raid dungeons and put the consumable items (that made WvW a little more tactical) back in WvW and remove invisible walls (World of Invisible walls would be nice in 1999)

The new dungeon is really great. It’s fun, some nice rare drops people like to do the dungeon. It would be really great if it wasn’t for 1 thing. It’s temporary. That dungeon shows you know how end-content can look like even if it is just one of the sort of end-content you can make.

Anyway, in stead of making such changes you make the WvW chest account-bound. I did some research on the forums and the reason for this seems to be (not confirmed) that people got a friend with a mesmer there and they then ported up all chars so they farmed the chest for the badges of honer in just a few min.

Well I can understand that you don’t like that but then there is the good way to solve this and the easy bad way to solve this where you get rid of the problem and also punish all people who do it correctly. Now the better solution was to put a timer on the chest before you can open it with another character. The timer would then be about the time you need for doing the jumping puzzle (including changing char and going to the jp). Of course it would still be possible to port people up but people could not easily farm it in the time they where possible before.
So do it this way in stead of making it account-bound and making the game even more alt-unfriendly.

While talking about the chest anyway. Why is the reset 24 hours after it’s opened and not every night at the same time. (pretty sure, before (months ago) it resetted at the same time as the daily. In that case this is yet another example of a silly bad change)

In both cases you can still only do it once a day. Yeah if you time it you can open the chest twice in a few min without doing the puzzle twice but then again, but the here you can add the same solution as I gave for the previous problem… just add a short timer. Now it happens more then once that you get to the chest to discover that apparently you did it the day before an hour earlier.

It’s great that you guys keep updating this game but some decisions are simply bad and the priority also seems to be messed up.

Heey,

I want to do the Lost and Found part of the living story but it was bugged at our server so I guest another server and turns out to be bugged to. Been to all the locations for nothing.

Anybody here on a EU server that can confirm it is working on his server (at this moment, it still worked on our server 3 days ago) and tell me what server that is so I can guest that server.

Thnx.

Kitcat.1739:

Devata.6589:

“bad players are bad.” and again somebody who claims they are all bad players. Basically of the 20+ people there are in that first video only! everybody is a bad player. And all the players in the other video’s are also all bad. So basically thief’s have some special magic find ability to only run into bad players?

This particular brand of magic is called video editing. It is decidedly OP.

Yeah true except for the problem that people complain about this because they see it happen in the game itself unedited and that the first video posted seems to be one unedited video. I didn’t see a place where they took something out.

In the video’s that are supposed to prove that other classes can do the same (don’t see them really proving that. I mean the engineer can run in a true a zerg but dot not attack in the zerg and does not hang around the zerg and most of the other fights are mainly 1 vs 1 / 1 vs 2 not 1 vs 5 for the exception of the nec that has 1 fight with a group) I indeed do see they they cut out stuff mainly when they die.

phor.7952:

The videos posted so far prove VERY convincingly that these players don’t have any clue how stealth works (or dagger storm either). When the Thief stealths they stop attacking. When he drops Shadow Refuge, they just stand around with their thumbs up their butts. When he pops Dagger Storm they blow their ranged cooldowns…
Videos like that aren’t evidence that Thief is overpowered, they’re evidence that bad players are bad.

……………………………………….

While I do not believe the current mechanics make thief “overpowered”, I really do wish they would have went through with their original nerf of stealth and just hit us with a couple seconds of “revealed” even if you didn’t attack to break stealth.
Getting rid of the zerg surfing and “perm”-stealth could open the door for some buffs that would finally help us in PvE.

“bad players are bad.” and again somebody who claims they are all bad players. Basically of the 20+ people there are in that first video everybody is a bad player. And all the players in the other video’s are also all bad. So basically thief’s have some special magic find ability to only run into bad players? And about not understanding stealth, if that was true those players don’t have a problem with not understanding any other ability from any other profession so if stealth would be so hard to understand for not thief’s that would make it OP by that fact alone. Anyway, is has nothing to do with not understanding it. Lets take your arguments.

“When the Thief stealths they stop attacking.” They don’t all stop attacking immediately. In the first fight in the first video you see they keep attacking when he is invisible but indeed just for a few more sec. Because like I said before, more then those few sec are useless. The thief can go in any direction (360 degree) so after 5 sec he can be any-ware. Keeping attacking becomes useless because you don’t know where to attack.

About the raged attacks. Lets say ranger and there longbow. A ranger can only manually shoot one arrow that requires a target (still testing if an invisible thief actually can be hit) with the exception of Rapid_Fire http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rapid_Fire You see then blow their ranged cooldowns (so it’s not cooldowns but cooldown) but what happens is that they start shooting and that attacks keeps shooting (that is one attack that shoots multiple arrows) and at that moment the thief uses Dagger Storm. At moment they have to try and stop the kill else it will keep on shooting and hitting them self. And then they have a new cooldown.

I don’t really understand what is the problem. Sure I agree a lot of the content that is only available in the gem-store should be available in the game itself. So mini’s, town clothing, and so on should also be available in the normal world. But the reason for that is not because else “rich people” can get them more easy but because it would become a part of the end-content. (the part that I am missing).

The rest of the comment seems like the basis socialist “I hate the rich” talk. If people are rich they can buy more yeah, so what? Thats not related to the game itself but just a fact of life. If you don’t like that then there are county’s where nobody is rich, try to find out if there is some national MMO there and try to play that. One warning, big change you are now the rich guy.

Yet still there is one other thing I would think that is good for the game and might be helpful for people like you. ArenaNet seems to be focused on the gem-store. When GW2 was released I expected that the Gem-Store would be more to get some additional income but the main income would come from the game and expansions and so I expected to see an expansion about once a year (because most subscription MMO’s have an expansion about every 2 years). Because of that I expected that by the time they released GW2 they already had a team working on the first expansion but recently I hearth they don’t really have a team working on an expansion and that may be the reason they focus so much on the gem-store. And with the introduction of the endless mining pick you can’t even say it’s pure cosmetic anymore because now you have an item that gives you the advantage of not having to bother about buying a new pick every-time. So according to the philosophy on ArenaNet that should be available in the world not in the Gem-Store.

Most games that are F2P focus a lot on there store and thats why those games become bad pretty fast. Best AreanaNet can do is focus on expansion for income and having the gem-store just as an extra.

Warruz.8096:

i did not read through all the posts but im just gonna answer the OP question posed.

End game = content you do at max level.

I personally would go a step further and say its content thats only available at max level.

Collecting thinks (and that can be everything, from armor, to mounts, to achivements) is also end-content and is available from the beginning but mostly you can no collect it all until you reach the max level.

In addition to what I said before there is one other thing that is also a problem. ArenaNet said they where not going to make a farming game but in a way this is one of the most farming games I seen, or at least the most annoying way of farming.

It basically already came up in my example with the mini’s. The problem is that you can’t farm items in this game. You need to farm currency, being it tokens or money or laurels. That is one of the most boring ways of farming.

What most people prefer is farming for the item itself. If I want to get some specific item and I know it has an 1/10.000 drop-change from a mob and you place that mob a lot in one area then I can go there farming those mob for that item. But if I need 1000 gold then I need to go farm gold and thats just way more boring. The reason this has been done was just to prevent farming because “there are a lot of ways you can earn your item, you don;t have to farm for it” but of course it is still farming only in a less fun way. You don;t feel the joy when that thing finally drops but you feel the horror from farming for gold.

NinjaEd.3946:

DeWolfe.2174:

For the Lore argument, may I add, so someone came up with crudy Lore. You do not have to keep doubling down on it. If a large numbers of customers want something, you give it to them. Or suffer the consequences when someone else does.

If you like GW2 and want it to t last, making it fun and rewarding should be a top priority. If people want mounts, let’s have mounts. For mounts flying up to the VP’s, why not? It’s easy is not an argument. Because there’s nothing wrong with easy!!!!! Especially if it Feels good as you soar up to it on your flying mount.

This is a game. Feeling good and having a great immersive experience should come first. This game lacks in having that….. Especially for an RPG!

See, its things like that that are the reason mount posts are just a futile arguement and shouldn’t be added or discussed. The whole reason of “no to mounts” is because A. it isn’t necessary with asura gates and wp and B. because it makes content even less relevant. Not even sure if your post is to be taken serious…

Do people who want a mount really wana walk from Wayfarer Foothills to the shatterer or jungle wurm? Doubt it because assuming mounts were added, you would soon realize how often you miss things because you were too slow compared to those who just wp’ed. Wp I agree, take away. Especially because there is soo kitten many of them in almost every nook and cranny in every map. Doesn’t mean we should get some furry animal to ride around, should just remove many of the wp. IF you really want the scenic route, to acomplish this one can put on a method of perma movement speed bonus and run. You will be quick, and soak in all the visually stunning places on the way. Why would a mount be any different?

oh, because people want it to grant more movement speed than a player. Thats where I disagree whole heartedly, because now you’re making mounts a necessity not a cosmetic like town clothes. Wp in wvw arn’t that many, and if you add an exclusive bonus like a mount to them again I’ve already said this..

Sure, ground mounts can be added as an aesthetic but nothing more. Also no flying mounts because vistas and overall terrain would be flat out pointless if you can soar over/to them. How would wvw be fair if you could fly over the keep and rain kittens over them? On video it would be hilarious but the forums would explode with “the removal of flying mounts”.

(and the picture is the most kitten arguement ever. Throwing a refuge fleeing scene under the bus? If anything they are riding the doylaks because they are injured and can’t walk well as you can see in wayfarer foothills many of them are limping).

“Do people who want a mount really wana walk from Wayfarer Foothills to the shatterer or jungle wurm?” well if it was up to me they might lower the amount of waypoints when introducing mounts. But to not give the mount-haters yet something else to complain about I also don’t mind if they keep all the waypoints. Anyway, in (my) perfect world there would be less way-points and then yes people would use the mounts more.

The fact that people are in a hurry to get tho those events is because of the dailies and lets be honest, dailies don’t really do what they are supposed to (according to ArenaNet during release) so thats a whole other problem unrelated to mounts.

“to acomplish this one can put on a method of perma movement speed bonus and run. You will be quick, and soak in all the visually stunning places on the way. Why would a mount be any different?” That would indeed work. Why a mount.. well with the same argument I could say if you allow a perma movement speed bonus (something you apparently have not problem with) then why not a mount?

But I can tell you why a mount.. Because it is fun, because it is extra end-content because it is also a nice personalization.

“Also no flying mounts because vistas and overall terrain would be flat out pointless if you can soar over/to them.” this problem also has been fixed in many games. Sometimes you would need to buy a fly license but in GW2 the most logical way to fix this is to only allow fly-mounts on maps you have completed. However for some reason ArenaNet did go for instance based maps (I don’t know why, to be honest I think that was a very bad mistake) in stead of streaming based area’s. To implement flying mounts they would have to change this and that is a big task. So that will take some time. Most likely they will only make flying mounts availible in new area’s that have not yet been released. Same for WvW, if they would introduce mounts in a WvW map it will be a new one, not one of the existing ones.

declan.3968:

End game starts at whatever you choose it to be. If your end game starts at 80, then choose something to do and so be it. Don’t let the developer rigidly define an endgame for you. This is an MMO, not a spoon feeding contest.

Do what you want to do.

There shouldn’t be an incentive for you to enjoy the game.

If it’s getting tiring, then this game isn’t for you, so move on to another game.

I don’t think anybody here ask to let developers rigidly define an endgame for you.

They simply ask for more options to choose from.

I see a lot of thief’s say that people don’t like thief’s because they don’t understand the stealth. Well first of all, players don’t need to learn all about other professions to battle them so if that is required for thief’s does that not make them OP even by that fact.
Secondly I think it is not true that once you understand stealth the problem go’s away. People do try to cripple thiefs and use melee and AoE to attack them but the fact is that they are invisible. That means they have a 360 degree angle where they can go to and every step they make the area where they can be becomes bigger and thief’s probably the fastest profession in the game so that area where they can be increases like crazy.
It is not for nothing that in most games that have stealth you are out of stealth when you are in combat.

In addition, see in that video how he get damages while he is stealth and he keeps stealth. Thats also crazy. He should get out of stealth when he gets damage. I always place trebs and do AoE and usually do hit him but even while I am doing this he is able to get away and there is the 360 degree thing again. He can go all directions. No way I know where is is 2 sec later. You see that perfectly in the video.

OGDeadHead.8326:

Fritz.5026:

just for an example watch this guys video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCWywAXmVP4

this was just the first video i clicked on, i did not even have to try

please explain to me how another class, such as a ranger or necromancer, could pull off the same things.

edit – the guys commentary is so funny though. “Well I noticed things were not going my way so I stealthed” … for the 100th time in less than 10 minutes.

That exact video is not one of the best to show how OP the thief class is. Those players are totally clueless, letting a single thief take them all down one by one.

That crap can only happen in wvw…

A whole zerg of clueless people and all the other players not in the zerg are also clueless. He does not die once and he is fighting most of the time 1 vs more. But I guess they are just all clueless people.

Like I said before. go to https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Guild-System-Improvements/page/4

On page 4 I collected all suggestions from all the topics (including the ones in this topic) I read about it. It are 2 post summing them all up.

We could of course also post them all here but I prefer keeping it to one topic.