Guild Wars 2

sigh… what is it with people and their shoot-the-messenger mentality?

I play every class at level 80.

and no matter what class it is, it’s all about either getting every ounce of burst damage, or every ounce of survivability, there is no in between, and the result is the exact opposite of what Anet intended.

… you either give up because there is no way you can kill them.
…or you give up because there is no way for you to survive.
…but either way, you end up giving up, because it’s hopeless.

I spent all afternoon in Spvp with my warrior, and I kept ending up against this poor guard that had no chance of winning against me, and his non-stop whining about it… it didn’t help… but he was right….

I just auto-attacked him to death, over and over again.

Then I logged to my ele to test some stuff in WvW, and a zerker hammer warrior, landing 4k (non-crit) attacks absolutely destroys my ele so hard, I give up. My ele has 3k armor and stone heart.. wtf…

…and it’s not like there is a paper-rock-scissors going on here. A lot of builds are completely worthless, because they can neither kill a bunker nor survive a zerker.

….and skill doesn’t even factor into it. I can remember a handful of times where I attacked an AFK player, and ended up running for my life.

The one that first comes to mind is my flamethrower engi running into an afk power/regen warrior… his retaliation did more damage than my flamethrower did, and his regen was more than my damage….

I’m just bored of knowing 2 seconds into a fight that’s it’s a win or a loss, and there’s no in between.

It seems to me, that either you fight people that you have absolutely no chance of killing, or people that kill you in 3 seconds.

…and I’m really starting to wonder, what’s the point of playing?

first, the weapons are hideous.
second, you get three of them
third, where’s the armor skins?

I’d spvp my butt off for armor skins, but for weapons? no thanks.

People are waking up to the fact that necros are a bad condition class.

…a good gimic way to play them, is full zerk, as people tend to worry about the conditions, and ignore the direct damage.

…but after the first time a person dies to a zerker, they look at their logs, figure out what happened, and then go wreck that necro over and over, so it’s not really viable.

…it’s not like he has stealth, just go kill him.

In my opinion, it’s condi thief vs condi necro

Most people would think the necro would have a chance, but no, it’s completely hopeless for them.

Thief stacks conditions, necro uses dagger #4, transfers them to the thief, thief goes stealth, removes all conditions, heals to full, and for a reward, sneak attacks, reapplying all of his conditions.

Sneak attack is like quickness, 5 rapid fire attacks, and it’s spamable

Necro uses staff #4, transfers the conditions to the thief, thief goes stealth, removes all conditions, heals to full, and for a reward, sneak attacks, reapplying all of his conditions.

Necro heals using consume conditions, thief goes stealth, removes all conditions, heals to full, and for a reward, sneak attacks, reapplying all of his conditions.

Necro drops a well that converts conditions to boons, thief goes stealth, removes all conditions, heals to full, and for a reward, sneak attacks, reapplying all of his conditions.

Necro uses deathshroud, (which is completely worthless to condition necros, and just shows how desperate the necro is, but as necros have no escape mechanisms, it’s all they can do) thief goes stealth, removes all conditions, heals to full, and for a reward, sneak attacks, reapplying all of his conditions.

Thief downs necro, stomps him in stealth, and then hops around in mocking celebration while knowing full well that there is absolutely nothing a necro can do against a well played condi thief

So I hopped on my thief for karma train nite, and got destroyed by an ele, and I thought wow, hey!, we got something here!

..so I whispered him, and we was standard spec’d D/D zerker ele.

Turns out I was just rusty, I only play my thief on karma train nights, but soon enough I was back in form, killing people 5 and 6 at a time.

Ele’s have long cooldowns, on complicated combos….

…as a thief, you can just cloak and dagger people to death. When you’re landing 5k crits, it’s not hard, half the people you fight won’t even be able to attack you without a target.

…perfect your timing, and nothing can stop you.

Just a few thoughts on possible talents….

-Frost-burn: chilled enemies take additional burning damage.

-Cold Justice: virtue of justice’s burning also inflicts chill (1 second)

-Jagged Ice: chilling effects cause bleeding

-Bloody Justice: virtue of justice’s burning also inflicts bleeding

I just type “kitten stealth hacking BS thief” in chat, and report the people that defend the thief as being “skilled.”

It doesn’t really solve anything, but why should I be the only one whose day is ruined?

The best defense in this game is pure offense, crits heal, crits steal health, crits proc vigor and damage effects…

besides all the talents and skills, we only have three sigils that don’t require a crit ;(

healing scales so poorly, what’s the point of it?

….

…..but mostly, this is how I see it:

Bunker dodges, dodges, and hits back for 700 damage
Zerker dodges, dodges, and hits back for 3000 damage

Bunker gets hit 5 times and dies
Zerker gets hit 3 times and dies

If a zerker can kill something before getting hit three times they win, and they almost always can.

A bunker would have hit their enemy four times to equal one attack from a zerker, therefore they have to survive four times as long, but they can only take two extra hits.

If it takes you four times as long to kill something, but you can only live twice as long, you’ve given up too much.

Where’s the loot? No achievement skins?

The new gear stats are worthless, even the event storyline achievements greatly favor people wearing zerkers.. do they even play their own game?

…and I’m so tired of jumping puzzles

I can’t play in Dry Top, I keep falling to my death while trying to walk around on the cliffs.

I have lag… not in the story/instance part, but in dry top it’s unplayable.

I like the Minion Master and Death Nova for making minions go boom…

…but yeah, 90% of necro talents are borderline worthless, and the rest you can’t live without.

Clownmug.8357:

Is this confirmation that everything is balanced around sPvP?

Have you been to WvW? they sure aren’t balancing the game in there…

Do not mess with warriors.

Warriors work fine, it’s the other classes that need buffs.

Hey, I am just pointing out how everyone feels.

Even a cleric warrior is landing 7k 100 blades. Everyone agrees rangers are garbage, but they’re doing 8-12k rapid fires. Unload thieves, dagger thieves, … even hammer guardians are seeing 2-4k crits while giving everyone in symbol range protection.

….again condi necros will maybe get two or three ticks of bleed damage before their bleeds are replaced by someone else’s auto attack. The result is less damage than a full cleric guard does, while chilled, and with zero % crit chance.

….necromancers stack bleeds very slowly., and your condition inflicting attacks do almost no damage of their own. Compared to a thief spamming sneak attack… it’s sad.

…and while we’re at it, a condi thief with a shortbow can spam poison fields while stealthed, and is vastly superior at spamming aoe bleeds

Their heal (hide in shadows) heals for 5200, gives stealth and cures bleed, poison, and burning, and when traited, stealth cures a condition every 3 seconds, so don’t tell me thieves don’t have condition removal, if they want to, they can clear conditions faster than necros can stack them.

It’s just not the best backstab build, so when you catch a thief, that didn’t spend 2 points to get Shadow’s Embrace, you’re not skilled, you’re not leet, you don’t pwn thieves. You just fought someone that didn’t think spec’ing to kill necros was worth 2 points.

Look, I’m not happy, and I’d love to say get riled-up and campaign for changes, but that’s never going to happen, Anet does not care, so find a new build.

…or in the least, get an axe, and go hybrid.

Or go try to get that zerker build Nemesis is promoting.

My necro in full zerker does about half that much damage.

I’m in exotic, he’s in ascended, but still… I cannot see how he’s getting those numbers.

First off, condition necro would be my main character, but I had to admit to myself a long time ago that it simply was not viable.

Second, I am tired of seeing other people playing condi necromancer, when the reality is, your presence only makes things worse.

A condition necro, at a pve event, brings less benefit, than a person that refuses to respawn. All you are doing is causing the boss to scale up, and for what? A few ticks of bleeds, doing maybe 300 damage?

It’s likely true, that necros at boss events end up doing 1/50th the damage other players do, however, they also proc regen with their staffs.

A support geared banner warrior’s regen heals for 300 or so per tick, a condition necro heals for 140…. so every time a condi necro uses mark of blood, they’re damaging the tanks!

…every 4 seconds, when you cast mark of blood, you are over-writing a real healers regen.

I know it’s not the players fault, but this is the situation condi necros are in, no real boss damage, very real player damage.

…and in pvp, a condi thief is superior in every way.

…condi warriors are vastly more useful as well.

…condi engineers kill players twice as fast.

And they can all do something a necro can’t do; they can run away, and live to fight another day.

Command your pet to aggressively guard an area. Your pet gains stealth and protection for the duration of the skill.

Stealth: 10 s
Protection: 10 s
Duration: 180 s
Range: 1,200

I propose that while the pet is stealthed, it should break stealth and slap 4 seconds of revealed, on anyone that comes within a radius of 240 of the pet.

So I like my ele, but I’m not a fan of carpal-tunnel.

I’m also not so big on the whole burst rotation playstyle, so for peeps like me, I’d like to see traits like:

For 2 points in fire, you gain a 30% chance on hit (not crit) to burn your target for 1 second, and you can no longer attune to fire.

For 2 points in earth you get a 50% chance on hit to bleed for 5 seconds, and no more earth attunement.

For 2 in air, you get blinds, or a higher crit chance, swiftness… whatever

For 2 in water, you get heals, or chill

Or in another direction, new signets at lower one element’s attunement and cooldowns by half, and doubles all the other element’s attunements and cooldowns.

This way a player, that wants to, could really focus in on one element, and players that enjoy the current playstyle won’t even be affected.

+1 to the OP

We need new stuff, it’s getting so boring.

Thieves, only seem OP, because they hit you for anywhere from 5000 to 9000 damage in a single hit, while invisible, and while keeping your character blinded.

I mean… if you could fight back…. they would die so easily. It would break the class. You just need to learn how to play.

And just the other day, the zerg I was in, couldn’t catch a thief in gari, and after 10 minutes of chasing him around, we just gave up, because the thirty of us clearly didn’t have the skill to catch him….

…and sure enough, after we left gari, it flipped, clearly showing that people who play thieves are just really highly skilled. So much so, that solo capping garrison is nothing to them.

Could you solo flip garrison? No, because unlike the people that play thieves, you are an unskilled noob.

When I go into WvW, I pour every ounce of effort into building a character that can survive a CnD, backstab, 12k, one-two punch.

Basically if my character cannot kill, or run away from a backstab thief, I refuse to play it. So in my eyes, better than half of the classes in this game, are garbage.

…if you can’t, at least, run back to the zerg, then what’s the point?

So who are all these people complaining about conditions? ..and what’s a “meta”?

-Warriors use melandrus and lemon grass food. so they don’t care.

-Guards…. most people trip over themselves chasing down those freekills, so dying to condi’s is no big deal for them.

-if a mesmer wanted to, they could press a button and cure 2 conditions, 6 times. As well as fields and phantasms, so I don’t think they care. (besides those portal kittenes are too busy being useless thief food)

-eles, pop water, don’t care.

-huntards have a water heal

-engis have a water heal (stop crying engis, you’re fine)

-thieves lose a condition every three seconds in stealth

…so that’s everyone, but necros, and besides their heal and offhand dagger, they have the hardest time dealing with conditions, since they have to fight the longest (attrition), so they get condi-bombed the most.

In fact, if I could afford them, I’d have melandru runes on my necro, since it’s the one class that I play that has trouble dealing with condis.

FA is supremely bored this week.

I dunno how whispers work, but I get group invites all the time.

It’s usually a thief asking to duel, or someone I ran over with my thief telling me I have no skill. (I don’t)

All in all I support it.

…and there has been a time or two when I was just so blown away, by some people’s builds, that I just had to ask what they were using.

+1 to most of what the OP said….

I like the flame thrower, but it does 10% more damage to burning targets, but it’s burn is on the last hit of Flame Jet, and it only lasts for one tick.

…and the fire field that we get with the flamethrower is one of the straight line ones, that even a stationary target tends to walk off of.

So is it any wonder that the players consider the flame thrower a CC weapon, and not a damage one? And it only has one knock back, so it’s not much of a CC weapon either.

…I think of it like it’s a guards staff, but without the support, lower damage, smaller range, less targets hit, and a higher suicide success rate (retaliation)

;-(

….but just to emphasize how bad engineers are. My server, FA, has a weekly WvW theme event done by one of the larger guilds. We’ve had mesmer night, ele night, asura night, stuff like that…. It’s very popular, and usually insanely fun.

This last Sunday was engineer night.

…and no one showed up.

Olba.5376:

Ezeriel.9574

Proof of what? That I state facts all the time?

384 from signet, 142 from Adrenal health, 85 from mango pie, 200 regen from a healing banner…. 811

….and that’s with zerker gear.

1. To get 384/s from Healing Signet, you’ll need (384 – 362)/0.05 = 440 Healing Power. Full zerker with banner regen gets you 300. So you’re 140 short.
2. To get 142 hp/s from Adrenal Health , you’ll need (140-120)/0.05 = 400 Healing Power. Full zerker with banner regen gets you 300. So you’re 100 short here as well.
3. To get 200 hp/s from Regeneration from Inspiring Battle Standard you’ll need (200-130)/0.125 = 560 Healing Power. Full zerker with banner regen gets you 300. So you’re 260 short.

I think you’re mistaken on what “fact” means.

With zerker gear, your setup would give you:

1. 362 + 300*0.05 = 377 hp/s from Healing Signet.
2. 120 + 300*0.05 = 135 hp/s from Adrenal Health
3. 130 + 300*0.125 = 167.5 hp/s from Regeneration
4. 85 hp/s from Mango Pie
5. A total of 764.5 hp/s

In order to get adrenal healing, you need to spend 3 points in defense, and that’s 150 +healing, but most people will go 4 points for 200 +healing…

..but don’t take my word for it, log into the game, spec for adrenal healing, and banners, drop a banner of tactics… and stick your head back up where it was.

I actually logged onto my warrior and he may have 1 or 2 celestial gems on his trinkets, but I’m pretty sure you’re just a troll so I don’t care to look.

a t s e.9614:

I wouldnt take the OP seriously , in his recent posts he said warriors regenrate 800-1000hp per second which is far from the truth.

He either went in wvw naked or got killed by old schhool D/D 6/6x thief with 0 defense.

proof right here ( i dont know how to edit from the other post so I just copy paste)

…but the reality is, a warrior 2-shotting clones as fast as you can make them, while regening 800-1000 health-per-second, doesn’t care if you’re using rampagers or zerker gear, he just knows you’re a free kill.

Proof of what? That I state facts all the time?

384 from signet, 142 from Adrenal health, 85 from mango pie, 200 regen from a healing banner…. 811

….and that’s with zerker gear.

Sourde Noire.5286:

It does matter what class you are playing, actually, since light armor classes (ele, mes, necro) take more physical damage than heavy armor classes with the same toughness.

Where did you come up with that?

Damage done = (Weapon strength) * Power * (skill-specific coefficient) / (target’s Armor)

A warrior with 3000 armor will take as much damage as a necromancer with 3000 armor

Anet deleted my last post due to snarky remarks, but they said I could repost it, minus said snarky remarks….

So, before this thread gets derailed….

I was not playing my engineer. It does not matter what class I was playing. I was at range, and not under pressure. It was a zerg v zerg moment. I was not at full health, so I will allow for the possibility of 3 stacks of vulnerability.

I had 2600+ armor. It’s not a lot, but it’s far, far from glassy, and every piece of equipment my character was wearing had +toughness.

I have no idea what buffs the thief had. I died so fast, their toon may have not even rendered, and of course I was stomped while they were stealthed.

So I thought, well maybe they’re right, maybe there’s something I’m just not seeing, and I went out and bought zerker gear.

So now my crits hit harder, but there’s less of them, and I do have harder normal hits, but my bleeds do even less damage, so all-in-all switching to bezerker gear DID NOTHING!

…except cost me 40 gold.

Talk about trolling, that’s the best troll on the forums: “just buy zerker gear, and everything will be better”

…but the reality is, a warrior 2-shotting clones as fast as you can make them, while regening 800-1000 health-per-second, doesn’t care if you’re using rampagers or zerker gear, he just knows you’re a free kill.

Yes because another 200 ferocity would make me a warrior slaying machine.. they would all have to bow down before me!!!

What a fool I’ve been! Thinking that a little condition damage would balance the loss of 200 ferocity! 10 stacks of bleeds and 10 stacks of confusion mean nothing to me now…

It all makes sense!!!

Well… I was using rampagers for two reasons.

1: Berserkers costs a fortune, and I’m broke.
2: Illusions do a pretty good job of stacking bleeds, so having a little condition damage isn’t a bad thing.

So I spent a day playing my warrior, put on a bunch of clerics gear, and tested things out.

The warrior is not the problem. Phantasm mesmer builds just have dismal damage.

The GS phantasm hits for around 5k on a good day. The #1 attack is lucky to hit 1k. Whether I’d be better off with more ferocity and less bleeds, doesn’t seem to matter much when a glass cannon build is doing less damage than a guardian bunker.

…I’m starting to see why shattercat is the most popular build.

My mesmer is 4-4-0-5-0 spec’d with the last point floating around because I can never seem to find a good spot for it ;/

All precision/power/condi damage gear with runes of speed, sigil of air, 7% crit sigil…

My mesmer cannot kill a warrior to save it’s life. 8k eviserates, clones go down faster than I put them up… It’s horrid.

…but what’s even worse are the warriors that I cannot damage. Two GS phantasms, and a Pistol Phantasm, 5 stacks of confusion, and the warrior ignores me, killed the yak I’m guarding, laughs, does a little dance and runs off…

and I can’t even begin to catch him…

Anyone have any tips? or should I just play my warrior?

Attrition is great! If you like to play that way, try a thief.

It is rather absurd that necros are one of the worst condition classes.

…fighting a P/D thief will make you want scratch your eyes out.

Any ranger that has ever popped his elite skill, that roots people, can tell you that some specs are just completely shut down once immobilized.

..not to mention that half the classes in the game have no way to kill the roots.

…and stability won’t help you either.

“Guarding” pets should ignore stealth, and attack players that enter their area.

It would be nice to have longbow range, pierce, and speed traits, instead of just two out of three.

…but mostly it would be nice to stow a pet and get a buff, or give us new pets that don’t attack, but instead give the player a buff.

Like a little forest fairy that cures conditions, or gives you a damage boost to make up for the loss of the pet… or half the damage the pet would do…

…but mostly rangers are just boring.

HOD has a PD thief that camps FA’s spawn point for hours on end.

He can easily kill people two and three at a time, without any risk to himself.

…five people can force him to back off for a minute or two, but anything less than ten can’t catch him, and we’ve completely given up on getting a yak to our base.

I’m sure someone would argue that it’s “fair” since FA has thieves that do the same thing, but personally, I find the whole thing toxic to the game.

Instead of the GM trait for scepter causing weakness with a stupidly long cooldown, making it worthless, it should apply cripple or chilled.

…or maybe a chance for condition damage to cause cripple or chill.

Ganking is Gang Killing. It was popular in WoW, as one person would be bait, and if you attacked them five rogues (thieves) would attack you from stealth for an instant kill.

…but they didn’t need five, one would do, as rogues could stunlock a person from full health to dead, by themselves. It was however much harder to do alone, so they usually traveled in pairs.

..and it sucked all the fun out of the game. Players traveled in zergs, and people whined endlessly about zergs. Sound familiar?

So Anet promised it’s player base that, that wouldn’t happen in GW2, but it did. You can’t go anywhere without a zerg in WvW, ganking is everywhere.

Gank spec’s that are popular… CnD thief, P/D condi thief, shattercat mesmer (now with condition damage), condi engineer…. and hammer warriors can stunlock you, from full health to dead, but it’s hard to do, so they travel in pairs.

If you’re not one of those classes, and you see one of those classes, you might just as well lay down and die.

This video applies to GW2 more and more everyday….

Rengaru.4730:

Ezeriel.9574:

The sad thing is, waaaaaay back when they first talked about the thief class, they said it wouldn’t be a stupidly OP class that kills you from stealth, without you being able to react… nope.. no gank classes in GW2! Thieves in our game will only use stealth as a defense mechanism; one with long cooldowns so that it can’t be spammed.

Did they really say that?

Oh the discussions with Anet were never ending back then, as people were rightly disgusted by ganking in wow.

“ganking” is gang killing. You’d see some poor guy running all alone, go in to confront him and BLAM! 5 thieves would attack you. One stunlocking you while the others backstabbed, and there was nothing you could do, but die… it was total BS

…and the guild name “and 5 rogues” became a popular meme.

…and Anet assured us that stuff would not happen in GW2, but it does, all the time. Any thief with good timing can spam cloak and dagger on wild life all day long.

Anet told us there would be no benefit to attacking from stealth, no backstab, no sneak attack…

Finding Anet’s reddit posts is nearly impossible, but there are plenty of discussion threads from back then:

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/17144-stealth-mechanics/

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/15769-how-does-stealth-work-specifically/

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/12777-is-a-thief-without-stealth-a-viable-choice/

Far, far too many gank specs

It’s almost as though the devs only play Spvp, and complaints about WvW class balance is completely ignored.

The sad thing is, waaaaaay back when they first talked about the thief class, they said it wouldn’t be a stupidly OP class that kills you from stealth, without you being able to react… nope.. no gank classes in GW2! Thieves in our game will only use stealth as a defense mechanism; one with long cooldowns so that it can’t be spammed.

…and instead we ended up with the most OP stealth class ever designed.

I haven’t played Rift in years, but when I did, I thought their stealth class was very well balanced. It was similar to WoW’s, but much less ganky.

All in all, when it comes to WvW, guards are in a real bad spot.

…of my eight level 80s, I feel the guard is the worst.

I use a mix of Soldiers and Knights with Runes of Speed, I keep my armor around 3K, crit around 45-50% and vitality depends greatly on build 15k-20k health.

I’ve found that the choices for builds are AH+EM (altruistic healing + empowering might), Meditations, or straight DPS

-If you go AH+EM:

Staff is for tagging stuff in zergs. You’re almost impossible to kill, and it’s fun BUT… if you step away from your zerg you are a free kill for every other class in the game.

If you swap to scepter/shield you can have some decent range for walls, and at least put up a bit of a fight against roamers.

Hammer works for small skirmish stuff. You won’t kill anyone on your own, but you’re helpful to small groups, and decent against direct damage thieves. A #2 hammer blast won’t kill a thief, but it will make them think twice.

If you use a greatsword, you rush in blow all your cooldowns and hope to kill someone with the burst, if you don’t kill them with your burst, you’re dead.

-Meditations are a mystery to me:

Meditation builds are usually DPS burst builds; so why do they bother getting the healing trait? I’ll never know, but keep Stand Your Ground on your toolbar, ‘cause you’ll need the stability.

Burst or die. There’s very little sustainability to these builds, and condition classes tend to eat them alive.

-Straight DPS

This is actually one of the more fun ways to play, as you can actually kill someone, usually thieves. I’ve started to grow fond of the 30-0-0-0-30 build with a greatsword.

…but you give up everything that makes a guardian, a guardian. And you can get AOE fire damage by using a torch.

All in all, every guardian build has major flaws that offset any advantage they may have, mostly caused by the talent lines.

Why traits that have synergy are so spread out I’ll never know, or worse, all in the same line so that you can’t get them, because you’d be forced to give up other must have skills. …three symbol traits in the vitality line? Thanks for nothing, Anet….

PS, healing scales horribly. Just swap to your signet, and look at your healing skills, and you can see how little +180 healing boosts them.

Engineer elixir gun #1 auto attack is weak, and doesn’t pierce, but elixir gun #3 (Fumigate) basically does nothing

Highly Skilled Player hits you with confusion…

You:

A) Do nothing, and die from Highly Skilled Player auto attacks.

B) Defend yourself, and die from confusion damage.

C) Cure the condition, only to have it instantly reapplied.

D) Log off and play another game, because it’s the sensible thing you can do.

Roll a thief, they make a far, far better condition class than the necro does.

They siphon better, hit and run, stack conditions with ease, and are basically immune to conditions, as they just stealth and come back, again and again…

….they are the true attrition class.

The fact that condition thieves have made it into the game, in their current state, is all the proof that a person needs, that someone at Anet should be fired.

That one spec breaks this game, so hard, that playing now is pointless.

…I’d be embarrassed to recommend GW2 to a friend

So, I run onto the ledge of the wall, cast dragon tooth and dodge away, and nothing happens?

Someone at anet needs to be fired…

My problem, with the new GM traits, is that I can’t find one worth using.

…and I’ve leveled every profession to 80.