Guild Wars 2

AcidicVision.5498:

Chris said outright “We are not going to be releasing a new tier every three months” as a direct response to people screaming the sky was falling and posting “omgerz there will be a new tier every three months! ANet represents all that is evil and wrong! boo! boooooo!”

Anet also said for years there would not be gear progression and now there is gear progression.

Why would I believe him now?

I don’t really care what kills GW2. For all I care it becomes really successful or falls apart next week.

Why don’t I care? Because I am only interested in whether it’s killed for me. And since I am getting closer and closer to that point where I want to quit with every new bit of information Anet are giving us on this new direction.

My guess is, that unless this weekend miraculously turns things around for me, I won’t be playing this game anymore next week. But that’s just my personal decision. No one has to feel the same, I just decide whether I like something or not and act accordingly.

Another quote from this article from Isaiah Cartwright:

No, we limited the rewards for this new dungeon to rings and back items, our goals are to keep invalidating old content to a minimum because that just limits the fun an interesting things for people to do. This is why we also added some new unique rewards into our repeatable dungeons!

They want to keep invalidating old content to a minimum, ergo old content will be invalidated as per the treadmill pattern, just more slowly.

People can shout “wait till the content is actually out before you judge”, but then again, how much more clearly can it be that the treadmill is a reality and that it’s just a slower process.

So we went from 2 years of advertising: there is no treadmill in GW2
To 4 months after release: it’s not really a treadmill.
To 1 week later: it’s just a slow treadmill so you have enough time to adapt.

What can we expect on Monday I wonder?

They are two different games, so it’s unfortunate they chose to have them share the name.

GW1 held me captivated for over 6000 hours. GW2 is struggling to get to 600. Probably won’t make it but I wait till I see what happens this weekend.

That is the most important thing to me in the end. If GW1 got content updates and 3D maps I would definitely play it.

Just finished download. It was 702 MB roughly.

I have a couple of 80s but I made a ranger that’s level 20 now and so far it’s easier than any other class I played, including warrior and guardian.

“Does anybody need a hand with something?”

Look at it this way. Arah story is a complete and utter disappointment. This way you can end on a positive note.

I can’t stand Trahearne. If they ever continued the story and Trahearne would become a traitor, I’d kill him any chance I got. I’d rather beat him up than any dragon.

NcSoft is a company that doesn’t really understand the Western market. But Lineage and Aion are still doing well in Asia.

I played Aion, it was still too grindy for me to like. Not because of the actual grind but the fact that by the time you got something together you outleveled it….but I digress.

Arenanet was an American game company that used NcSoft as a publisher but in the mean time it has been incorporated into NcSoft.

But, GW1 is still running. Aion is still running (f2p in Europe) and other games of theirs are running.

As much as I hate the Korean grind and NcSoft’s lack of communication and terrible support, I wouldn’t categorise them as MMO killers. A lot of their games are still available to play.

The reason I cannot really connect to my characters has more to do with the poor storylines and horrible voice acting (more the scripts than the actors even).

So, a great world, great history and background etc…but horrible storytelling. I’d rather not hear my character’s voices.

As others mentioned any MMO has the risk of ending. Perhaps CoH was your first MMO. When your first MMO is shut down or disappoints you to the point of leaving. That always hits hardest. It gets easier after that.

That’s why there’s so much complaining going on. Customer expectations are moving a lot faster than game developers. Companies will have to learn to keep up with that. GW2 did some of that right, but not all of it.

We’ll see what this weekend brings, but the sword of Damocles is always there. Just a fact of life. Nothing lasts forever

Kript.3291:

We won’t know if the Ascended gear are going to be stronger until it actually comes out. As far as I’m concerned, it is a set of armor that’s actually worse than exotic because it is incapable of carrying rune set bonus. It is meant to be use as something of a gating gear for the new type of dungeon, which consisted 9 mini dungeon within the dungeon itself.

Do continue to speculate though. I’ve done my part and I’m now going back to the game. Hanging about forum is against my philosophy. Next time my brother wants me to do it I’ll just let him use my account.

We do know because they already showed an example on THIS website, which shows a comparison. Take a look, the link to the article is on the front page

The question has already been asked but got snowed under. Personally, I wouldn’t mind if it reopens world completion, on the other hand I can understand why people can be concerned. Perhaps the area is big enough for a separate title.

Actually, I think there’s a lot that’s snowed under by this ascended gear thing. I would be interested if in a few days we get another kittentorm because of the skill changes.

Loosifah.4739:

They did properly respond to this thread. Just not IN the thread. Read the announcement.

They responded yes. But not properly. It’s still unclear what they are doing and what it will mean for the future of the game.

Doubtful. I suspect I would end up quitting when it starts feeling like a treadmill. Do mind, I am not happy with what I’m hearing but I won’t decide till after the changes take place.

What I do know is that I got bored of the treadmill in other games like Aion and SWTOR. I stayed in SWTOR shorter because you recognise the symptoms more quickly and get fed up more quickly.

If more powerful gear comes out and it’s not the end of it I am sure that feeling will hit and once it does, it will be easy for me to quit and look elsewhere.

But we’ll see how it plays out.

Eain.7825:

The way I see Guild Wars 2 as it was sold to people is as something equal to communism. People were tired of the competition and the hawkishness and the race of living in a capitalist society, where the wealthy exploited the poor. Most people feel like in MMO’s they are the poor because they don’t have the capital (time) to invest in getting somewhere with their lives (characters).

Then Guild Wars 2 comes along and promises a poor (undergeared) man’s utopia where everything’s equal and a certain quality of life is assured and people can live in a levelled playing field where life is fair. Then when it’s made people discover that the lack of progress is grounding society to a halt and that a brain drain is commencing that’s taking people back into the capitalist world of competition and opportunity. I’m sure that in 1989 the Soviet Union still had a few ardent communists running around insisting that their system was perfect, but the country collapsed two years later for a reason.

Except this is bull. The Soviet Union didn’t put proper communism in place. That’s a first.

Also, GW1 was popular for quite a while and it died because they started building GW2 and stopped really supporting that game. Sure, it had its limitation but it did well and didn’t have a gear treadmill.

So, what did they do? They created rare skins that you could only get in certain places. New items got slots that previous items had as fixed stats, creating more flexibility. I remember special gloves that were very shiny but cost a lot to get. But hey, they looked awesome.

But nothing changed the stats. In fact old skins started getting value because they were more rare than before.

It worked and people played the game for many more hours than Anet expected. They said as much openly. I put in over 6000 hours without needing a gear treadmill.

PvP was interesting because it was about the player’s ingenuity in combining gear with skills and synergies that kept Anet busy because of the imbalances people created. But it was still fun to create.

But you can hardly call it communism when there were rich people with expensive gear that a lot of other people didn’t have or couldn’t afford and this was the case already in GW1. So your comparison fails.

Gear progression is for people who need to feel powerful, not because they are skilled but because the AI does it for them via gear stats. I have more stats therefore I win. And I know a lot of people love that.

But Anet said it was their philosophy not to play that game and offer an alternative. Now, they are changing it and so far any communication they have made, few as they are, have been ambiguous at best.

I would like to believe they are not going to throw this game to the gear treadmill gods, but they haven’t exactly done their best to explain their actions…and if they have done their best, then it’s just not good enough.

Anyone can figure out that if this new gear is a step between exotic and legendary as they say, that there is something wrong there. First because the legendary items have the same stats right now and they are being raised to accomodate the new tier. They can do this again and again.

So they say they are not going to do this every 3 months, but that implies there will be more tiers in the future, just not every 3 months. And this is what I mean with poor communication. It’s ambiguous…and the worst thing is that it might be intentional.

It’s not that I fear power creep. I simply do not like it. Leveling by itself is power creep. At some point that gets boring. That is my main problem. A lot of people quit playing MMOs because they got sick and tired of going through the same cycle over and over again.

I do however understand the need or wish to continue to expand on your characters. But power creep is done in a way that bores people, also because they’ve gone through it. I guarantee you. If they were to completely go for power creep, in a few months people will start complaining here that they are bored and endgame is just the same old gear treadmill. It will happen.

So what can you do? Well, I think game developers can be more creative. They are just too lazy or too focused on the wrong things to explore other ways.

You see, one of the big issues with a gear treadmill, aside from getting bored with it, is that it by definition devaluates your efforts so far.

It is conceivable that for example gear progression is done by adding new things that can be added to existing armour. A lot less people would be upset if they could gain upgrades to make their existing armour that they put all this time in up to date again. And allow it to be done in different ways, so people don’t feel forced to go to a specific dungeon only.

Another thing that can be done is add upgrade slots in general. New armour will have it, older gear can be slotted.

Now, there are always many things to consider but there are simply other ways to make sure people don’t feel like their current gear feel obsolete.

It means there can be gear progession without kicking players in the head at the same time.

I also find that the way all this has been communicated is very poor. They start with releasing some interviews, let people rage because of the many holes in the explanations and then after a few days only comment on the kittentorm that occurs and give explanations that are still ambiguous.

I do believe Anet listen to their customers but also from GW1 I remember that their communication is short sighted and lacking in general. That could be improved.

They must’ve known this would hit like a bomb. And they could’ve prepared better for it.

The fear there is, is simply that a lot of people left other games to play this one because there was no gear treadmill. It was a big issue for many people. Anet must understand that if they don’t communicate clearly, people will start thinking they have something to hide. It’s this unknown that creates the fear.

Yep, see this Anet?

That’s what I mean. Once you say A, you need to say B. If you think that people are exaggerating because they are upset you let go of your principles….it’s started already and this thread is part of it.

Bring in the gear check. That way we can make sure we can shun players and turn this game into “yet another one of those MMOs”.

I’ve played enough years of enough MMOs to conclude that I don’t like the gear treadmill. So I bought GW2 because ANet promoted it saying there was no gear treadmill.

I am not going to like it now when I hated it in other games. It’s not that a gear treadmill is bad per definition, it’s bad for me cause I don’t like it.

Where were you when people were flaming the game for lack of endgame and were crying for a carrot? Did you tell them to hush and deal with it? My guess would be no.

The tables are turned but now they are turned because Anet put aside once of their core philosophies….that worries me more than the actual new tier of gear.

Slither Shade.4782:

Yes. One thief in a combination of karma, dungeon token, and TP exotics. Every possible slot and weapon combination. Underwater too. At this point I consider him done and I dont think the new gear changes that. Perhaps if I played wvwvw I might.

And when new content comes out that requires infusions that you don’t have on your gear.

Saying that most people exaggerate is an exaggeration….pot calling the kettle black.

I kinda lost interest when the OP said there wasn’t anything wrong with gear progression. It’s not a factual issue but an opinion. Some people like it, some don’t.

A lot of people were happy about GW2 because they don’t like vertical gear progression. Now Anet does a turn around.

You argue that people should look at it because it isn’t inherently bad. Good or bad, don’t matter. People like things regardless of whether they are good or bad (tobacco, cigarettes, etc). The issue is, do you like this approach or not.

It’s a big dividing issue and many players stopped playing MMOs because of it…and started GW2 because of the lack thereof. This changes all of that.

I could tell you that I don’t like to eat fish. Is fish bad or evil? No. But I still don’t want to eat it. When I go to a steak restaurant and they serve me fish, I will not be happy. GW2 was a non gear treadmill game. Now it will have a gear treadmill. Time for me to find another game? Perhaps so.

@Vorch Spectral agony required infusion. But it didn’t require special armour. All armour you collected could be infused and still had max stats. There was no tier difference and it wasn’t limited to certain gear types. And that makes all the difference in the world.

I easily made enough money just from selling mats and such. I skipped crafting completely. With that money and a little bit of karma grind and a few dungeon runs and my exotic set was complete. Now working on my second level 80

But yeh, a bit concerned now because I am an altoholic and gear treadmills are the worst when you play multiple toons. You just get tired of doing it all over and over again for each toon. This new information about the game worries me as a consequence.

Changes are that when you can get a full set of exalted, it’s best to just use rares to grind for the exalted gear and skip exotic entirely.

karma.8763:

You had to work for gear in the beginning……what is the difference after 80? you think there just gonna beable to throw more skins at us? LOL, no that wont keep the players happy, i want my character to feel like he is getting stronger…..that is what an mmo is about right? or just grinding all day to play dress up is for you?

GW1 was like this and it kept lots of people happy. You want stats and more levels? THere are tons of games like that. Each one trying to tell you their game is better, but it’s all the same.

You are typical of treadmill players. Not everybody likes that. A lot of people came here because they didn’t like it. Whether you understand it or not makes no difference there. The problem is that getting stronger is bull, because they just make stronger mobs indefinitely. It makes no difference if you go from level 12 to 13 or from 120 to 121. It’s so mind-numbingly stupid that I can’t even begin to explain why a gear treadmill is not for everyone.

So a game comes out that for years said: we are not about the gear treadmill. 4 months after release….the treadmill begins. Aside from whether you like this or not, can you not see that there’s something wrong with a turn around like that?

You think dressing up is stupid. I think become more powerful for the sake of beating more mobs with higher stats is stupid. But that’s ok. There are plenty of games that cater to your needs. GW2 said they were different. They lied….and not just a little bit.

The problem is not just the stats but that you need to get this gear to do future content.

There will be LFM, need exalted gear message in chat. This will be needed because future content will require it and it will spill over into other areas because people want to do dungeons and such asap.

Also current exotic gear will no longer be wanted. And what will ANet do there? Tell people, sorry you can’t get exalted gear in dungeons…so why do the dungeons?

You see, why would I get an exotic set now? Why do dungeons if I know this gear will be obsolete in the near future. Rare gear (yellow) will become subpar because of it and will serve no purpose anymore. You might as well throw it out.

The problem is devaluation of current gear and the need to go to that dungeon for that gear or you cannot play endgame anymore. Either because of these infuse elements or because you are shunted from groups that require exalted gear for anything.

In GW1 there was infusion. Only one kind. There were 3 missions where you could infuse ANY armour set from any expansion…and they all had the same stats. You could alter stats simply by changing runes and such. It was a better system.

It’s kinda like peanut butter and jelly sandwiches. Let’s say traditional MMOs are peanut butter and GW1 was the jelly. Now they combine the two in a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. The problem is, some people don’t like peanut butter, some don’t like jelly and some don’t like the combination.

Anet said for years they would never combine the two. Now they are. Some will stay because of it, some will leave. But I figure that breaking a principle you advertised for years makes you untrustworthy. It means you cannot count on their principles. That is the biggest shame to me.

MrLee.6892:

Combat is different than WoW.
Questing is different than WoW.
Dynamic Events is different than WoW.
WvWvW is different than WoW.
Quickbars are different than WoW.
Being in multiple guilds is different than WoW.
Dungeons are slightly different than WoW.
Crafting is different than WoW.
There are no raids in Guild Wars 2

I don’t agree that all of it is different but of course there are differences. What you need to see is that people left other games for certain reasons…and it’s those reasons that you need to worry about.

Quickbars are different…but how many people left WoW because of the quickbars?

Dungeons are different…but look at the complaints about how simplistic they tend to be in GW2 (I said simplistic, not necessarily easy).

There are no raids in GW2…ahh well, that remains to be seen. This new dungeon seems to have a raid feel to it. Sure it’s a 5 man dungeon but it certainly reeks of raiding. Still, I don’t mind raiding as long as it doesn’t mean a gear treadmill.

And this the thing. The endless gear treadmill IS a reason why many people left WoW or other MMOs and ended up here and that’s why it’s a relevant issue.

Because if a vocal group can change the way this game works, against even Anet’s own self-proclaimed prinicples…well, that opens the door for more.

So what could be next: Dungeon finders, parsers? You see, once you go that way, where does it end? We can’t tell because even if Anet says to not worry because there will not be another tier of gear…well, they could change their mind again. And I don’t have the patience of a god, so I will leave as soon as I decide it’s gone too far.

Admittedly, this update gets me close to that edge. Not there yet, but as soon as I decide this game has gone the treadmill way, I know a number of games that are better at that. I don’t need another game with yet another treadmill.

I do not like the exalted gear they will be adding. In fact, the most recent update about it in the news section of this website only confirms what I was unhappy about.

It is gear with better stats and with infusion slots that you will need for future endgame content. It says this literally in that article.

This means that you need specific gear to do specific endgame content. This is a typical sign of a gear treadmill. It also makes current gear, including craftable gear obsolete because the stats are less and there are no infusion slots in it. Again, typical of a gear treadmill.

I am not screaming that the world is ending, but I am saying that I am not happy with this.

And let’s be honest. A fair amount of people were shouting for a carrot and Anet caved to that. They call it listening to their community (although obviously only a part of the community) and now that the tables are turned, we are supposed to stay silent about it?

I don’t like these changes and I think Anet are abandoning one of the core principles. That last part is actually the most worrying to me. You see, as much as I like the GW world there are others out there and why should I play GW2 instead of another game? The reasons for this just became lessened by this new approach. For me it cheapens the game. I as expecting new gear, new places to go, new puzzles etc. A new tier of gear was not what I expected.

I am not going to sit and wait. I will explain this here and Anet knows they will lose a number of players over this. It’s a gamble for them. Personally, I will decide after this patch comes out. This weekend will be telling for me, but as it’s a phased release (only rings right now I guess) it will become more and more clear what will happen.

I will look for the following in the near future:

LF2M for Arah – must have Exalted gear
WvW imbalances
Another tier of gear

They are smart enough to do it bit by bit, but as soon as this type of stuff really starts hitting, it will be my signal to leave this game.

It could be that other people will stay because of it, but I decided to play this game because it wasn’t like other MMOs. This will change that because endgame carrot hunting was one of the things I hated about traditional MMOs.

So not rage, but disappointment. And I am entitled to give my opinion, so don’t tell me to shut up or something. I will complain about this till my decision is final. If I do get to the point that I no longer play GW2, I will also no longer post here.

Agien.9834:

You people saying that groups are not going to let people in with out ascended armor sound silly to me.

Right now if you invite a person you have not played with into a group tell me how can you tell if they are in white gear or exotic?

Guess you haven’t played many games.

They can ask you to link your gear in team chat for example. Trust me, people will find ways.

I don’t mind so much that they wanted people to have a look in WvW but the central fort in EB will never be taken by some servers.

It would’ve been better of the POIs and Vistas wouldn’t require owning specific forts.

I have this especially in dungeons. It seems that when I cast certain spells with my mesmer especially I lose my target and tabbing makes no sense. Why would it choose further targets before closer ones? Very odd indeed.

“… but some of the rarer Ascended items will also feature a new Infusion slot that will make players even more powerful so that they can tackle new challenges that ArenaNet plans to throw at them as they continue to expand on the dungeon over the coming months and years.”

So what can we learn from this?

For future challenges we need infusion, but only certain gear will have this option. This means this gear will be required for some future content. Therefore people will feel forced to jump the carrot bandwagon.

So, people will complain and it will become easy to get it by the time or shortly after it becomes needed.

Of course, then the hardcore players will be upset and Anet will have to pull a similar stunt again…oh wait, it’s the gear treadmill we know from all other games.

Anet, I don’t know all the details yet, but I will be looking closely this release. You stated as a principle that gear progession was not for GW2. Now you take a step in that direction.

Once you go to A, the next step is B. I would like to point out that A is the first letter of Arenanet and B is the first letter of….well, you catch my drift.

I am not saying that thieves should be nerfed but there is an advantage for a class that can combine stealth with burst and life stealing and even stuns.

The burst thief can sneak up from stealth and with massive damage and life stealing food, it’s a matter of seconds. No matter your gear, when you are the target of a surprise attack by such a thief there is very little you can do before you die.

Still, I don’t ask for a nerf, because I also know that when I WvW it generally is a bad idea to walk around alone.

But I do at this time wonder if being able to stealth while in combat is entirely fair at all, especially if they have conditions on them. So not so sure about that one.

Electroflux.5320:

The OP is so blinded, really.

Like Robbyx said, this has to be your first MMO because this game is extremely lack-luster and hardly innovative. I’ve played so many MMORPGs that I’m too lazy to even list them here, let alone think about all of them I’ve played and this game is one of the worst.

I’d rather quest in WoW then run around and do stupid events all the way to max in this game, only to be slapped in the face with no content at 80 and more senseless grinding.

It’s not so much as the grind itself is what kills the fun-factor of the game, it’s how it’s presented. Questing in WoW is very generic, but you have bgs and dungeons with reasonable queue times to do while you’re questing so there’s a lot more interactive content then Guild Wars 2. There is literally nothing fun to do while leveling in Guild Wars 2, especially, like I said, when you know there is nothing there in the end for you that changes.

This game is really bad, really really bad.

The reality is that you feel this game is bad because it doesn’t cater to your expectations. That doesn’t mean the game is bad. It measn this game isn’t for you. That is entirely different.

Of course, like any game, a lot can be improved and I have some issues myself with GW2, but your reply here is….well, let’s say it’s poorly written.

It seems that you can’t imagine enjoying this game and therefore other people who do enjoy this game are either blind or lying in your view. This is a ridiculous way of thinking. If the OP thoroughly enjoys this game and all it has to offer then this is his experience.

If your experience is opposite that’s fine too. But please understand that it’s not a matter of one of you being right and the other being wrong.

You are both right, from your personal point of view.

I too played many MMOs before this one. I do enjoy GW2, simply because it offers different things from other MMOs I got thoroughly bored with.

Sure, Anet’s strong point isn’t story telling, which is one of my gripes about the game but I still enjoy the game. For me it is better still as a complete game than all of the other MMOs I played. Admittedly some of these games were better at certain things than GW2, but overall, I am playing GW2 with over 400 hours and still am not bored with it. I am not playing all those other games.

So the real question for you is: If you hate it so much, why are you still here wasting your time instead of being in a game or on a forum of a game you do enjoy?

The DE’s and hearts are repackaged quests. The advantage is that you don’t have a quest log with 30+ quests to keep track of. The down side is lack of story and not knowing when events trigger where half the time.

End game doesn’t offer a gear treadmill. That is a positive for me. If that’s what you want, I’ll say it again: this is not the game for you. Just get that and your life will be better for it

I know what you’re saying Jasher, but my impression as a whole is that skills are balanced around PvP.

Recently we saw they started splitting skill effects between PvP and PvE and I suspect that as the game goes along, more of this will happen.

Any class is viable in PvE but not all skills are useable. I think a big issue is and remains that creating a build for a toon isn’t nearly as interesting as it was in GW1. It was more flexible and you weren’t forced to use specific skill sets with weapons etc.

Now I don’t mean to reopen the debate about skill bars in general but it is part of the issue I think. Mesmer can’t really make a build without illusions in it and when you do have them you want to make them useful.

I just don’t get how game developers don’t seem to really get that we know there’s a difference between an enemy player with 20k health or so and a boss with 2 million hp.

A lot of skills just become silly in PvE and you might aswell just stick on auto attack and dodge all you can, cause that’s usually enough in boss fights without the hassle of worrying about ineffective skill bars. Sadly, it does make it more boring.

So normal mobs, veterans, yeh that works but champions and bosses and such = boring. Don’t get me wrong, the fight might still be very dynamic and such but from a skill bar point of view there isn’t much excitement this way.

Against normal mobs and (some) veterans it does work. Anything tougher, forget it.

Zen.2450:

No. Poison and burn used to stack in GW1 as well as bleeds. This needs to be brought back, as it completely negates the use of bringing more than one of both skills into any fight, as what’s the point of adding additional burn/poison when all it does is up the timer a bit more. And if someone else is doing more damage with their build than yours, well you’re just a useless accessory now.

Not true. You couldn’t stack bleed with bleed or poison with poison. And life degen was capped at -10 max anyways.
Conditions only stacked if they were different conditions.

The biggest difference is that in GW1 you could easily change your build, whereas in GW2 the trait system keeps you from swapping builds around like in GW1.

No, you’re not the only one, but it’s been discussed many times before and Anet already said they are working on this issue but it’s not easy to resolve.

So there’s nothing useful I can add to this beyond that.

I seem to remember that there was a mention of a new PvE mode coming soon.

In GW1 they resolved this issue the OP describes by having a hard mode setting for the game. This way you could clear the same explorable areas with much harder mobs in it. Also the same was done for missions.

I suspect that there will be a hard mode setting coming to GW2 as well. At least for the dungeons I would expect but I am sure they can come up with other things as well.

It doesn’t seem likely that they will simply dumb down the game. If they adjust difficulty down it will most likely be for the normal mode while introducing a hard mode option for people who want more challenge.

You’re not gay for playing a male toon as a male. That’s nonesense. I will just state that I like female characters because they look better to me. The comment that guys play females because “they don’t want to stare at a male butt all day” was originally more a joke not a real argument. It was made because a lot of people didn’t get why people play opposite gender toons compared to themselves.

In every game I do try to make male toons but they either look to feminine for a guy or ridiculously bulky and the faces generally look too smooth. I am 41 years old. I don’t identify with a clean shaven 18 year old face or fake aging effects and horrible beard options. Just doesn’t work for me.

So I go for the next best thing. Sexy females. At least it looks nice. Just my preference.

If games made better male toon models I probably would play male toons as well. Alas…games don’t offer that.

I am not sure what the point really is.

Is the complaint that there are too many people playing human females?

Or is the complaint that there are a lot of guys (like myself) who play female toons in general?

They are separate issues as I see it.

Why play female? Well, I don’t identify with male toons much because of the character models that usually look ridiculous to me. They are generally either too feminine as guys or too bulky.
Someone once asked in another game forum, why he couldn’t play a wizard that actually looks like an old man….I understand that question.

So, let’s play females instead cause they look hot or something. It is fantasy. But then human females apparently are the only ones in this game that are really allowed to look hot. Norn armours generally don’t.

So yeh, for me I blame the lack of interesting male toon models and the lack of better looking armour for most races. Oh and of course a lot of people who come from GW1 are used to playing humans as they were the only race available.

Think about it. Norn look like big humans but females aren’t allowed sexy looks (personal opinion). Asuran are funny and quirky but are mostly played because they are small targets in pvp I reckon. Sylvari…well, they are unique but perhaps a bit too unique and Trahearne as npc destroyed any hopes of ever playing a sylvari for me. And Charr, well not everybody likes furballs and they were the enemy in GW1 just as much as any other monster.

So I’d say all in all it’s not so surprising to me.

I don’t believe anything you say, till you at least tell us which server you are on.

Then at least we can have more people from your server comment on this and perhaps give these comments some credibility.

Something can always go wrong. So far it’s been great and now the servers go down for a bit cause something happened.

C’mon, all this stuff about trusting Anet.

Tell me this…how many times so far has this game had 8 hours down time for maintenance?

We get more play time than any other MMO I know and yet people complain like a bunch of entitled children as soon as something happens.

Oh and how about patches? When you are in a dungeon, you get 3 hours to complete it. You don’t get kicked mid instance.

So let’s be fair here. You have no idea what unprepared means when it comes to MMOs. That’s the real problem here. Seriously.

I like jump puzzles but not when they’re timed. I have fear of heights and I can’t do it like that.

On the other hand, it’s not big deal to me. Yes it’s disappointing in a sense but you can’t like everything. The good thing is that for the Emisarry title you need to complete 5 achievements and there are 7 to complete.

I would’ve prefered something else for sure. But maybe they’ll do something different the next event.

I played over 6000 hours of GW1 and I was disappointed at the beta events. I did feel I wasted my money in pre-purchasing the game.

And yet, I decided to play the game anyway upon release since I bought it and why not give it another shot.

1) GW2 is very different than GW1. This is true for sure, but it isn’t by definition a bad thing. What can be annoying is that GW2 is made by the same company and you might have the expectation that certain things that were really awesome in GW1 are just not so awesome in GW2. But then there are things GW2 has that GW1 never did have.

2) GW2 is a game with a persistent world and as such is a true MMO. GW1 wasn’t. It makes for a different type of game. I know it can be annoying but the truth is that it really is a different type of game. Therefore some of our expectations as GW1 players were simply unrealistic.

3) I don’t think GW2 is a grind game. Getting exotics through dungeoneering wasn’t that hard to and with the updated rewards it’s really doable for almost everyone.

4) The personal story line. Ok there I do agree that it’s particularly poorly written. The convo scripts are hideous and the voice acting doesn’t make it better. Perhaps I was spoiled by SWTOR (for all its mistakes, the story lines were very good and the voice acting as well), but in the end I just skip through them most of the time even if it’s a new story line arc I never did before. It hurts my brain to listen to that tripe. On the upside it’s just a small part of the game. So it’s ok for me, albeit a missed opportunity.

I remember Anet saying that they heard that people complained about all the wall of text story telling in GW1. I will take the stand and apologise for complaining about this, but I had no idea that they had something planned that was actually worse.

Oh well no game is perfect.

5) Crafting. Also here I must agree. Any other game I played I was a crafter. Even if it wasn’t worth it in the sense of making money with it, it was still fun. I don’t find the system here fun. It seems they took most of the bad elements from the Aion crafting system and added their own twist to it. It’s the first game with crafting where I actually haven’t gotten into crafting. Others probably disagree but for me it’s a crap system since it’s not very transparent and the whole discovery system is annoying to me as well.

I mean I’ll leave it at that because there is way too much you posted for one thread but mostly I don’t have the same issues as you do and I like GW2 for what it does offer, more than not liking it for what it doesn’t offer. As long as that’s the case I’ll be ok.

The hardcore setting in Diablo is a setting in a single player game. That’s a big difference right there.

Even though a lot of the content is soloable, it is also a game for groups and so it’s easier to make a mistake and end up dead.

Also the downed mechanic is part of the combat system. It’s expected that you go down from time to time and it’s up to the group to notice it and ress you….again as part of the combat system.

This mechanic does mean that also as a solo player you can’t realistically expect to never get downed and this, since you are alone and no one is there to ress you, means then that leveling to 80 without ever dying is not realistic either.

Any group play like dungeons and wvw also will mean that from time to time you will die.

All in all I won’t say that it’s impossible but just not realistic to play in this mode in GW2

PvE and PvP simply are not the same. So to think that the skills can be is just wishful thinking. I am just glad they came to this a lot sooner than in GW1.

Truth is that skills at some point will be either too powerful for pvp and/or too weak for pve or the other way around.

Also with the added rigidity in the skill bar in GW2 where you are not as free to choose your skills as it was in GW1, you run into this issue more simply because people can’t just swap a skill when a skill is messed up for either pvp or pve. You would need to use different weapons with entirely different skill sets. Which you may not like.

Whatever Anet thought they could do to balance the game for both pvp and pve was really just wishful thinking from my point of view. I am glad they are taking action sooner rather than later.

bojangles.6912:

Not sure why that would be split when this is a pvp based game. Their pve is basically just leveling and a couple of dungeons. Until they add actual raids, not sure why they would do that.

It would be split for the same reason why Anet spent most of their time and resources on leveling and pve in general.

Say what you will about pvp but the pve content is just so much larger that it makes no sense to call this a pvp based game. I certainly agree pvp is important in GW2 as it was in GW1 but content and resource wise, you cannot tell me that this game is mostly a pvp game. That would be bull.

The game simply has pve and pvp. Both are important and Anet happens to care more about pvp balance than other games. But pve is a huge part of the game and it’s just a pipe dream to think you can balance both at the same time.

You say that pve is just leveling and a couple of dungeons. That by itself is already wrong.

So what is pvp then? Oh yeh, leveling your pvp rank and a couple of siege maps.

Anet luckily realised quick enough that skill splits are needed since pvp and pve are entirely different.

The problem with a game that has pvp and pve is that the combat and opponents are too different.

Take an enemy player. Has perhaps 20-25k health. This is about as bad as it gets in pvp. In WvW you have some npc’s but the zerg element takes care of that easily.

In PvE mobs can have a lot more health, especially bosses but already veteran mobs have a lot more health.

This creates an entirely different mechanic. Some skills will then either be too powerful for pvp or underpowered for pve. It’s inevitable. PvP balance is not the same as pve balance.

With that the trait system is also a factor. Because you cannot change it at will like your skills, you can’t just switch from a build to another.

Then I also disagree that the GW2 system has a lot of depth. It has some depth for sure but a lot of limitations and therefore is fairly rigid in build creation, although dynamic in use. This could’ve helped in the overall balance but it doesn’t take away the fact that killing a mob is an entirely different thing from killing another player.

Splitting skills between pvp and pve effects makes it so that skill balancing doesn’t negatively affect the other game type. So a pvp balancing doesn’t affect pve and vice versa. We’ve seen that complaint many times.

All in all I think it’s unrealistic to think pvp and pve can use the exact same skill sets effectively. This can only be possible when fighting pve mobs is much closer to fighting other players in pvp. As this is not the case. Splitting skills or bringing out pvp or pve only skills are the only realistic options.

That’s my view.

A lot of xp can be had from dungeons. Agreed, not the easiest for casual players but you can learn and it becomes easier then. But you easily get half a level per dungeon.

Crafting gives a lot of xp, not my thing personally, but it does give a lot of xp. I never needed it.

WvW might be tricky to figure out but once you do and find some groups to tag along with, the events give lots of xp as well.

And then there is area completion. There are more areas of the same level range, so visit the other areas from other races. Also plenty of xp.

Daily. All the steps in the daily give a lot of xp bonuses.

All in all there is plenty of xp to go around, but you do have to figure a few things out here or there.

Sleaze.3748:

garraeth.3267:

It’s funny when people say GW2 is for carebears when GW2 is more about skill than a WoW (or clone).

Funny that you mention this because it is completely not true…

What is skill? I believe skill is knowing which skills to use at the right time when under pressure.

Funny thing about GW is that you have tons of skill but can only access 15 at a time. Plus there are traits which can play a major roll in battle, and can not be changed on the fly. Therefore, GW becomes more about planning than skill to be honest, while games like wow tend to be more about gear than skill. At least in other MMOs if you go up against someone with equal gear then it will be about skill. In GW even a skilled player could be caught in a bad situation with the wrong build and lose.

So honestly GW is more about planning and WoW type game are more about gear…. neither seem to ever purely be about skill. Just a side note… I never played WoW.

Edit: since I was asked what a carebear is…. they are people who expect everything to have everything without having to work for anything… they are the people who expect every child in a sports tournament to receive a trophy just for showing…

I do distinguish between skill and skills. Planning ahead is also a skill. But you cannot prepare for everything, especially in pvp.

What I have a problem with in a lot of these discussions is that people tend to see everything in black and white. Either you are hardcore or a carebear. The problem with using terms like that loosely is that you generalise people into a group even when they don’t belong to them.

I asked the question because now you give a clearer definition. But in essence “carebear” is a derogatory term, an insult. And when you use the term so loosely you basically make a general insult to anybody who isn’t of your opinion.

I got most of my armour from dungeons. I did the dungeons, so I didn’t get it for free. Is it easier than in other games? Depends on the game. Not everybody thinks dungeons here are actually easy. That’s still a matter of opinion.

Back on skill….yes, GW is about planning but when gear plays a major factor, there is nothing you can do against that, whereas skill and skill planning allow for growth and learning as a player. That is why I like GW2 better than a gear-centric game.

The only thing you can learn in gear centric games is that you need the better gear. Only when everybody has the best gear can you see where people’s skill levels are. That’s where it gets interesting to me. I don’t mind skipping to that phase.

AC is the first dungeon as you level up and it’s decidedly tough for new players. However, it does make it good preparation for dungeoneering. It really is about dodging, ressing etc.

See this as a learning experience, the rewards are the same but the repair costs will go down as you learn