Guild Wars 2

Actually you only have 5 energy regen in combat, so really there’s a lot of negative aspects for keeping them up because they ultimately limit what else you can do. For example if you’re only at 1 Energy regen because you’re running Facet of Nature and Facet of Strength, using base weapon abilities can become strained fairly fast. That makes even basic things like Coalesence of Ruin now have kitten cool down due to waiting for Energy. Is the amount of Might you’re adding (9 stacks) worth halving your damage potential for?

Someone at some point will have to calculate a DPS per Energy number. This will let you compare it to the Aura and see how much damage add you’re giving per second with the Aura cost compared to the Aura benefit. Eyeballing the math however I’m pretty sure it doesn’t work out very well for the Auras.

Actually people are mad because they are meant to be different and it isn’t different. That’s the entire core of the issue. It isn’t different. There is no new role. There is no new style of game play. I don’t care if it’s straight up worse damage or whatever IF there was different role to play. But we can already do D/D boon based Bruiser. Hell it’s featured predominantly in every major SPvP tournament.

Specializations are about creating a new role for a class. Dragon Hunter is a predominately ranged Guardian something it lacked. Reaper creates a melee role for a Necro that it didn’t really have before. Herald creates a boon aura support build that isn’t available in the base Revenant class. Chronomancer gives them access to AOE well abilities they never had before. Tempest…well it gets more of the exact same things it always had with no new roles opening up. You can say it’s just because Elementalists are too good…or maybe…just maybe…it’s because Tempest was designed inadequately.

Recursivision.2367:

First off, Well of Power is nothing alike. It does one stack of stability, one time, for you alone. Second, if your front-line is just plowing straight ahead full speed 24/7 you clearly don’t need any stability.

Only one stack you say? That’s exactly how much you get on the run with Inspiring Reinforcement.

They can plow ahead 24/7 because of Stability. Post nerf most front line teams consist of 2-3 Guardians with a mix of 2-3 Warriors and Necros. The Necros get the initial Stability (so they can deliver the bomb) while Warriors bring their own Stability in addition the large amount brought by Guardian (Stand your Ground, Indomitable Courage + Virtue of Courage). This is why Guardians currently have a strangle hold on the front line in WvW currently, because they’re the only source of group Stability that is functionally useful. Devs can throw around the word “Front Line” all they want, but unless you bringing AOE Stab for your group then you’re just as equal to a Necro in the party leeching off the Guardian’s stability. With 2 Empowers you’re already at 24 stacks of Might. With a Warrior you already have For Great Justice for Fury. Best we got is offering extra boon duration at the moment.

Recursivision.2367:

Mallyx also doesn’t require corruption at all. The only reason you’d take it is to absolutely maximize resistance (selfishly), but Pain absorption is going to be your most used skill anyway, giving you about 7 seconds of resistance either way. The only other trait in the line that would be useful to you would be the damage modifier.

I’m skeptical about the Glint legend being particularly useful. The only boon not already in abundance in a typical front-line comp would be protection with a small amount of downtime, and none of the actives look particularly useful—You’d pretty much be taking it for the heal skill. However, if you could do without, I think you’d be bringing more to the party with Mallyx/Jalis and putting your points into Invocation/Retribution/Herald.

Actually Unyielding Anguish disrupting people is the most used skill. With the large amount of Condition removal already available Pain Absorbption wouldn’t be useful to allies except generating Resistance which is only 1s of Resistance for 35 energy. Even then it only gives it to your team if they have condis on them or no one has condis on them and instead gives it to whomever you clear condis from. Without Demonic Corruption you also only get around 2s of Resistance (self) with Pain Absorption but you get up to 4s with it.

When you use other useful skills like Unyielding Anguish resistance plays a big part in preventing you from taking the negative effects such as Cripple. Playing Malyx with and without is night and day with the Resistance boost. The other traits, specifically boon strip, is great as well because if you lead with an AOE you’ll often strip Stability off their front line as you hit with Spontaneous Destruction as well as MP now at 10% per second in combat that’s a lot of crit.

I am also very skeptical about Glint and really only see the useful aura being the one that increases Boon duration (to increase your allies more useful boons) as well as Protection as you mention. Chaos active looks really useful, less for the CC (most people will have stab except the back line) but more for the 5s of Super Speed you can give to your front line party so you can be super mobile. Heal of course also looks good, and I’m curious if you can use it while stunned (it has no cast time).

If they fix Jalis, specifically Inspiring Reinforcements with my suggestion to give 3 stacks of Stability with less pulses then I’d agree with you but otherwise Jalis is pretty much garbage to a group that’s constantly on the go. Even the Hammers won’t work in a tower like situation where they cancel soon as you go up stairs or through a gate cancelling the 20% damage reduction. The only good thing about Jalis now is the heal.

Recursivision:
Inspiring Reinforcement has no place on the front line because you are forever moving in WvW. Basically the new IR is a field that so long as you stay in that field you get Stability which cause you’re always moving you’ll never be able to sit in that field. There’s another skill that currently works like this, Well of Power, and you can try it out in WvW on the front and you’ll see that it doesn’t work at all either.

Jalis basically doesn’t have a place in WvW anymore after the nerf. The only group support we can bring is through Herald and Malyx now and Malyx requires Corruption leaving you with a Corruption/Retribution/Herald build which removes the very powerful stun removal on legend swap. I still wouldn’t count out Shiro though. Super Speed on demand is pretty crazy as a legend swap to get back in position then back to Glint.

Kidel:
600 Radius for boons is fine, but the actives are all short range radius abilities. Most are 360 radius around you. Elemental Blast is a 360 AOE at 600 range. The point being is if you are back line you’re not going to be able to hit the enemy with Gaze of Darkness, Burst of Strength, etc.

Kidel.2057:

I was planning to use Jalis in WvW, but with last changes I don’t really know. Guess I’ll try it at least.

Are you going to use Glint and Herald traits?

Glint/Herald is rough because all the active utilities, beyond the auras, are all short range (360-600) abilities. However as we established, without being in a Guardian team for a source of good Stability, we’re basically not viable for the front line because we don’t have a good source (for WvW) of stability anymore.

If you can make it into a front line Guardian party you’d have to use a Staff for one because it’s the best front line weapon we got currently. Mace/Shield would be the offhand, but other than the multi-blast finisher on Mace that’s about best you’re going to get for useful one hand options to go with that shield. If they fix Crystal Hibernation to be mobile, like they did when they realized how bad it was on Engie to not be mobile, then Shield might make a more prominent role.

The real issue is how you would use the class. During the pre-stack Empower you’d be running Facet of Nature (to increase Empower boon duration). Doing this will prevent you from using 50 energy skills like Rite of the Great Dwarf before hand as Jalis and Road is garbage now so probably just start in Shiro/Malyx. Soon as you move out you’d likely pop Shiro Heal if Shiro or Pain Absorption/Unyielding Anguish if malyx, switch to Glint (you’ll be low Energy in Shiro/Malyx from Facet up out of combat so Glint will return you to 50 energy) activate Facet of Light and Chaos giving you -8 Energy temporarily as you engage. If you leap in, you’ll use Staff 5 to leap in and activate Chaotic Release. This will alleviate Energy concerns, knock opponents back, and also give your team Super Speed for 5 seconds. Facet of Light should try to be saved if possible but used if you get caught hard in a bomb. If you rally then you’d use Staff 4 for blast finisher on Water fields for Area Heal plus the heal plus the condi removal.

Shiro has a lot of good survivability to with on demand Super Speed for positioning. Malyx could be another great option. It already has good viability on the front line with Unyielding Anguish and it’s large sources of Resistance especially with +65% duration. Jalis was the natural choice until the recent Road nerf which is just a shame.

Glint as backline support…pretty iffy. I mean it’s better than nothing, but all the actives are useless for back line due to range and pairing up a pretty weak heal like that with Shiro gives you two very weak heals. You’ll still spend most of your time in Shiro for stability against back line rushers or sitting there running Facet of Nature/Strength. Swift Gale (minor Glint) would be hilarious with Riposting Shadows adding Super Speed to the mix. Shared Empowerment is great of course. Soothing Bastion would be nice, but honestly rooting myself at 25% is counter productive to me living so I’d probably go with Enhanced Bulwark in the end. If they fix Hibernation to be mobile, that’d be the no brainer talent and would really shake things up because you’d want to use a shield a lot with Shield 4.

Biggest issue with Facets in general is the upkeeps continue out of combat. You get out of Combat a lot in this game and it makes energy regen wonky. You can go from 80 energy in combat with only 1 energy generating down to 50 with -4 energy drain in the blink of an eye soon as you exit combat. I’ve actually had plenty of fights where I actually fall out of combat so it will be interesting to see how it actually goes.

Shiro is actually amazing in a zerg build because it’s the most survivable stance we have now.

Riposting Shadows is probably the most OP broken thing ever. It removes slowing Conditions. It breaks Stun. It Evades for the duration. AND it restores 50 Energy allowing you to dodge roll right after. For 30 energy. The only down side is it’s backwards so if you’re on the front line that can be bad because you usually want to keep going forward not back. However on the back line it’s tantamount to invincibility in most cases because no one and nothing can catch you mobility wise other than a physical wall.

Flipping on Impossible Odds is like watching one of those movies where you got a super speed person walking around. Super Speed is basically the same as 33% movement speed out of combat only, in combat so you have total battle field mobility with it. It’s pretty amazing and you can flip it on and off as needed.

After two Revenant weekends with the Revenant I’m pretty sure they haven’t even looked at balancing Revenant for WvW at all. I can sit there with Pain Absorption in Malyx and just feed off Cow Trebs and Fire Mortars. At one point I had something like 30 stacks of Burning with 10 seconds of Resistance up. Unyielding Anguish…well I’ll just let you watch the video what you can do with Unyielding Anguish. Meanwhile they make changes like Inspiring Reinforcements which is just awful for WvW now. Do you see a single point in that video where I really stop moving to stand in Inspiring Reinforcement? People have this idea in their heads that a lot of CC can be avoided but you can see in the first 10 seconds there most cases CC that gets you are dropped instantly and right in front of your face lol.

As an Elementalist refugee it’s pretty understandable why they’re upset. Tempest is a dud. It offers nothing new, nothing exciting, and is just more of the same existing character we already have. The gimmick is supposed to be it’s a front line character but there’s so many things wrong with that idea (base Ele stats make gearing impossible, lack of stability, lack of mobility, etc) that it amazes me they went forward with it. Anet is showing a real lack of understanding of what “front line” actually means in their game and it’s really evident with any new source of Stability they design so far.

Most people counter with that, “Well Elementalist is already amazing, did you expect more amazing?” and the answer is: Yes. No one wants their specialization to be a dud or get a dud because, “You’re already good enough.” Imagine for a minute if Herald we got a Long Bow that was basically the same as Hammer skills (power based) and for our Legend we got a rehash of Jalis and the Traits were Power instead of Ferocity. Would it be usable? Sure. But we’d already have all that covered in our existing character as a Revenant and we’d be all wondering why our Specialization is more of the same. None of us here would be, “Oh well at least base Revenant is good, it’s okay our Specialization sucks too.”

That said, we definitely love Roy for giving us a unique specialization that’s an entirely different way to play the base character.

I can only speak from a T1 perspective where blobs can run pretty fat at around 20-40 people and the tactics can be exceptionally brutal on players (large coordinated damage bombs and the like).

For front line play you pretty much want around 3000 armor buffed (such as with Strength In Numbers) so on that front you are massively under valued. Your other stats are fine for front line. Over all your stats lean more towards Havoc play and back line Blob play.

I would consider removing Jalis from your build. After the recent changes Jalis is worthless in WvW outside of the heal. Inspiring Reinforcements is worthless because a 1s duration stability every 1s means you have to stay it in the entire time which isn’t feasible in WvW. A 2s Taunt for 50 energy is incredibly wasteful and while the -20% damage on Hammers might seem useful they cancel anytime you get close to a wall and most restacks occur near an object that will cancel them. Running through gateways causes it to cancel, running up stairs causes it to cancel, etc so it’s really non-functional for objective fights. Rite is good and a decent buff but without a source of Stability it’s also risky (albeit less risky with the cast time reduction) because you can use it to break out of a Static Field only to run into an instant cast wall right in front of you or you get caught by a front line CC and it’ll get interrupted right after. This pretty much only leaves the heal with any real merit so the only reason to keep Jalis is the large heal with condi removal.

Sword/Axe for front line duty is also pretty sub par. Staff offers you a 600m travel skill (same as Warriors/Guardians) that’s now also an evade. That’s on top of an AOE heal, condi removal and now blast finisher for blasting water with the melee stack. We also get a 2-3s block which is also going to go a long way as well. For havoc Sword/Axe is far superior though.

In Retribution I’d take Redeeming Protection for the additional Protection time. Without Stability (and even then it triggers the Protection when Stability fires if I’m not mistaken) you are going to get CC’d a lot in WvW. After the Stability changes everyone tries to spam as much CC as possible to strip Stability stacks and catch the poor classes that have limited sources of stability (IE: Necros, Revenants, etc) so they’re separated out and easy downs to rally off of. I’d also use Steadfast Rejuvenation as it procs quite a bit and is a great source of damage reduction.

Most of your game play is going to be in Shiro using Riposting Shadows and Impossible Odds. Personally I use a similar back line build only as Malyx/Shiro with Corruption/Invocation/Retribution instead for WvW.

Really don’t understand why, even in the face of overwhelming and constant negative feedback, Anet doesn’t do something useful.

The numbers aren’t the issue.

Tempest doesn’t create a new role for the Elementalist. It’s a sub-par version of existing roles we already have.

These don’t appear to be affected in the recent BWE1 update.

These don’t appear to be affected in the recent BWE1 update.

A few points:

The entire issue is that staying in the road is not feasible in WvW as WvW is highly mobile in nature. Simply staying in place and in the road is not an option so often times you only get a single application. With the new 1 second duration, this is functionally worthless as it’ll be over before you would be CC’d. The Guardian skill was primarily brought up to show an example of a stability skill that is good for WvW but not overpowered. Essentially less up time, but more stacks because in WvW you encounter lots of CC fields for spammed CC.

This skill is capped at 5 targets like all AOEs. This means per pulse, it can only affect 5 targets. In it’s current form it can provide a single stack of Stability up to 25 different people if 5 different people stayed in the field. In my proposal, at maximum 10 different people would be affected because there are only 2 pulses.

To clarify my suggestion would apply 3 stacks of stability that last 3 seconds on a single pulse and would only pulse once every 3 seconds instead of every 1 second. With 3 seconds between pulses, and a 3s duration, this means you get one stack of 3 stability for 3 seconds at the start, and you get one stack of 3 stability 3 seconds later that lasts another 3 seconds. In total this +1 Stability compared to the current change that is live only with less time required to be in the Field. The suggested increased duration is half of what it was pre-nerf.

What you’re suggesting already exists in the game, and it doesn’t work at all in WvW. Currently Necromancers get a skill called “Well of Power” which when placed pulses stability and breaks stun (and also converts conditions). However when you use it to break stun, you are often CC’d right after and the stability isn’t long enough to keep you going through multiple CCs. I can make a video showing this as I had a similar idea for this when playing my Necro and I dubbed it the “Ghetto Road” because 1 second of stability is functionally useless in WvW but once in 10 times it’d work the way I needed it to.

morrolan.9608:

Well if you actually listen to Malevolent from ONS he actually wants BG out of T1 not TC and their stated intention is to open up tier 1 to become more of a rotation as I said. Again like I said whether you believe them or not is up to you but it is what they have said.

Except Mal said all this assuming that soon as ONS, TWL and other guilds left T1 that BlackGate would drop like a rock without them. However BlackGate has done nothing but pull together in the wake of letting all these cancerous guilds out of T1 and off BlackGate.

Eventually a T1 server will likely drop down to T2, it’s just a matter of time as always, but it’s going to be like the old days with BG, SOR, JQ where one of the servers goes down to T2…utterly dominates T2 for a week…then goes right back up into kitten

is basically the worst bracket to get caught in again. Best of all, the new locked servers basically means there’s no way out but down so all those guilds are trapped there.

Game Priorities
I recognize that WvW is usually not on the top of the list when it comes to game design or character balancing. This is usually because it can vary greatly depending on the scenario. You have up levels, non up levels, consumables, buffs, size differences and countless other factors that can create an unbalanced combat scenario. Heck just going from tier to tier is different for example in lower tiers things like Stability aren’t as much as a factor.

Stability and CC
In Tier 1, many cases you have large groups of 20-40 people who are all throwing out large amounts of control. While certain CC effects like Static Field can only affect you every so often, other hard CC’s such as Line of Warding, Unsteady Ground and similar skills can affect you an unlimited number of times for their duration. Often times a simple stun break might get you out of that Static Field instantly applied on top of you, but it won’t protect you from the follow up CC that you’re going to run into with walls and other CC (such as Guardians/Warriors using Leap).

It’s crucial then to understand that good sources of Stability post Stability change typically involves a few stacks from a source with a medium cool down and medium duration. A great example of this is “Stand your Ground” which provides 5 stacks, for 5 seconds, with a 30 second cool down. This is often enough Stability to push through the large amounts of CC and keep functional. Understand that total uptime is irrelevant, but rather multiple stacks to make it through multiple CC is critical to function on the front line.

Inspiring Reinforcement

Inspiring Reinforcement got reduced a bit because the potential uptime of stability was just too high when comparing to other stability skills; it could be kept up permanently. Besides that, I tweaked some of the other skills to make them feel better.

Inspiring Reinforcement: Decreased the stability per pulse from 6 seconds to 1 second. Increased the recharge from 5 seconds to 10 seconds and its energy cost from 25 to 30.

With that in mind, we now look at the changes to Inspiring Reinforcement. While we stay in the field, we have Stability as it pulses every second and we get 1 second of Stability. This is completely non-functional for WvW.

One of the biggest issues is IR will only give you one stack on the run. As you can see in this video if you run with 25% run speed or 0% runspeed you only get a single stack on the move even with a 6s duration. As part of this issue is it doesn’t give Stability right away leaving you vulnerable to CC (I have another video of that if you want me to upload it).

Proposed Change
I would propose the following changes to keep it balanced for other game modes but make it more functional for WvW

1. It gives the first pulse immediately on the ground and under the Revenant’s Feet upon casting. This means the Revenant who casts it will be affected by it immediately.

2. After the initial pulse on casting, it pulses a second time after 3 seconds.

3. Each pulse it grants 3 stacks of Stability that has a 3 second duration.

This has a number of effects. It’s the same total duration of Stability, 6 stacks over 6 seconds. With the Glint Grandmaster Trait it’s only 8 stacks instead of 12 total. Even with +50% boon duration on Facet of Nature that’s still only going to give you less than 100% up time on Stability. It also creates rewarding game play where if you stay in it the full duration you get a second burst of Stability. The only net difference is this version is actually useful for WvW where as the current version has no place.

Jalis is terrible now.

Glint would be way better.

Recursivision.2367:

Kodiak.3281:

Inspiring Reinforcement: Decreased the stability per pulse from 6 seconds to 1 second. Increased the recharge from 5 seconds to 10 seconds and its energy cost from 25 to 30.

This pretty much kills Jalis for WvW. Stability is already incredibly limited on the Revenant as is with no other skills adding multiple stacks of Stability for any notable duration. Inspiring Reinforcement was the #1 thing keeping it a viable contender with Shiro.

Most cases when on the run (which you are constantly moving in WvW) Inspiring Reinforcement was the only thing that was going to get you through with Stability. On the run, you are only affected by a single stack of Stability. Standing in the field generated is not an option in the highly mobile world of WvW where mobility = Life.

At this stage there’s no point going Jalis over Shiro which will provide you with a far superior Stun Break (evasion, condi removal, stun break, and endurance return) for far less energy and access to Super Speed on demand for repositioning. Our Offensive stance just became the most defensive.

This also sends us to the back line in WvW permanently in large groups because we also lack the Stability to keep up with and hang on the Front Line now as well.

1 second of Stability functionally speaking doesn’t work in WvW.

I agree that it seems a bit overkill. A reduction to 3 seconds wouldn’t have phased me, but I’m not certain it’ll be worth casting WvW, especially if it isn’t changed to start pulsing faster. On the other hand, 6 seconds + the possible boon duration is a bit much.

It was never really meant to be—or that functional as—a pre-buff. You drop it to prevent allies from being cc’d within its area, which 1 second stab accomplishes. However, a couple more seconds would provide a nice little margin for error.

I am excited for the changes to staff though.

Oh I’m super excited for all the changes, just that one was way over kill and deeply affects WvW my primary game mode. Personally I’d be okay with 3s because at maximum boon duration that’s around 6s again of stab max.

Personally what I’d rather see is it give multiple stacks of Stability in slower pulses. For example first pulse (when dropped) it gives 3 stacks for 3 seconds, then halfway through it pulses again for another 3 stacks for 3 seconds. First pulse is guaranteed to hit the Revenant as well. This would be actually pretty useful but not in such an OP amount.

Problem is I think Devs look at total up time rather than what is functionally useful when it comes to Stability. For example the pinnacle of Stability right now is pretty much “Stand your Ground” on a Guardian. They probably see it as not so good, 5 stacks for 5 seconds to 5 people with a “huge” 30s cool down. Except the fact it’s instant cast/instant effect, 360 AOE and multiple stacks basically make it amazing for WvW and most front line groups are in fact bottle necked by requiring 2-3 Guardians for that one skill alone. Then they look at something like Inspiring Reinforcement, see that it’s a skill with potential for 100% up time on Stability and all the red flags go off even when it wasn’t nearly as powerful as they think because functionally you’ll rarely sit at 100% up time because you can’t afford to stand in a field like that. Hell put the thing on a 30s cool down as well, I don’t care, just give me the multiple stacks of Stability I need to stay functional in WvW!

Inspiring Reinforcement: Decreased the stability per pulse from 6 seconds to 1 second. Increased the recharge from 5 seconds to 10 seconds and its energy cost from 25 to 30.

This pretty much kills Jalis for WvW. Stability is already incredibly limited on the Revenant as is with no other skills adding multiple stacks of Stability for any notable duration. Inspiring Reinforcement was the #1 thing keeping it a viable contender with Shiro.

Most cases when on the run (which you are constantly moving in WvW) Inspiring Reinforcement was the only thing that was going to get you through with Stability. On the run, you are only affected by a single stack of Stability. Standing in the field generated is not an option in the highly mobile world of WvW where mobility = Life.

At this stage there’s no point going Jalis over Shiro which will provide you with a far superior Stun Break (evasion, condi removal, stun break, and endurance return) for far less energy and access to Super Speed on demand for repositioning. Our Offensive stance just became the most defensive.

This also sends us to the back line in WvW permanently in large groups because we also lack the Stability to keep up with and hang on the Front Line now as well.

1 second of Stability functionally speaking doesn’t work in WvW.

After the disappointing Tempest reveal and details it’s pretty exciting to have a class with a cool Specialization and base class.

Roy’s done a fantastic job so far.

Yea I was really excited for that shield GM trait for the extra boon duration but honestly rooting yourself at 25% is just suicide in any kind of competitive environment. As Roy mentioned with the Super Speed adept this kind of class is designed to keep up with a group, and when you gotta be on the move like that stopping for 4 seconds while the party moves on just isn’t gonna work out.

Likely continue to use the Staff for the heal, condi cleanse, mobility and block as the off weapon.

I pretty much loved everything in the video except for Shield 5.

Being rooted is worthless and actually will leave you more vulnerable instead of defensive.

Please God no.

Shield is pretty great and functionally fits better as a support character supporting the line giving yourself defenses.

Leo G.4501:

There is a difference between blind optimism, optimism and pessimism. The thing is, I’m hoping changes are made to the spec, but specifically not ones that shoehorn it into current Ele specs.I see most complaints about how its mechanics work are complaints about how you cannot utilize it in your ordinary rotations and not about how it can support new rotations. And the counter, of course, to that line of thought will always be “numbers would have to be OP” to which I can only roll my eyes and let you carry on with your speculation.

This is a fundamental misunderstanding on your part then as the general impression I’ve seen repeatedly is that the Tempest doesn’t offer anything different than what we can already do. Very few people are complaining you can’t utilize the Tempest in the current rotations, but rather that the current rotations are simply superior or at worst on par with what the Tempest can achieve.

At the end of the day all that matters is answering the Developer’s question: Does it create a new role. The answer continues to be: No. All it does is provide an alternative route to the same end result we already have. What it should be is providing a new set of tools as well as using a mix of our existing tools to produce a new end result.

You can roll your eyes and act aloof all you want but at the end of the day the burden of proof is on the people claiming Tempest provides that new role. I’ve yet to read a single compelling case where someone shows the new role it provides that we can’t currently do. Instead we get these posts about how it’s “a new way to play” which completely misses the mark of what the Developers asked of us on in the BWE1 message.

Start at 100 energy. Regen stays the same. No energy when you swap Legends (stays the same amount as you had in the previous legend so if you swap at 15 energy you stay at 15 energy). Add trait when you swap Legends instantly gain 35 energy.

This removes clunky in combat then suddenly out of combat (whoops back down to 50 energy) and keeps it consistent throughout game play.

Could go either way on Weapon energy. Personally feel cool downs are sufficient to prevent spam and the weapon skills just seem to cost energy because of “reasons.” Really silly to have a 20s cool down and a 20 energy cost on a skill.

Leo G.4501:

And current Tempest has the potential to be a new playstyle. Shouting at me that it’s not doesn’t somehow make your opinion have greater impact.

The point being is, if you can currently camp fire all day, Tempest just gives you other options to use while you do so. That’s the point. Attempting to shout down people by stating your opinions as facts to criticize another opinion is beyond faulty.

Potential to be a new play style is not a new play style.

More over, what potential new play style? People have latched onto the Overload mechanic as a sign it promotes camping a single attunement for long periods of time. However there are a number of flaws with this line of reasoning:

1. Nothing about the Tempest addresses the fact our skills are balanced around having access to 4 attunement sets (IE: longer cool downs, reduced effects compared to other classes).

2. Nothing about the Tempest addresses that certain reaction skills are in certain lines, and in fact reinforces it. For example you’ll never camp Water for DPS. You’ll never camp Air for support.

3. Nothing about the Tempest addresses our innate lack of survivability (low armor and HP) and forces us to continue to seek the normal lines/ways we use to mitigate it (boons, healing, etc).

There are many facts about the scenario that show why Tempest is not a new way to play the class, despite the people shouting so at the top of their lungs with blind optimism that if they somehow tweak the numbers everything would be okay. The only way this would be true is if they made the numbers so ridiculously OP you had to use it which they are incredibly unlikely to do. The issues with the Tempest go deep beyond the numbers and in practical game play it simply delivers the same net result of what we already do only in a worse way.

More importantly, whether not this creates a new way to play the class is irrelevant. What the devs specifically said was does this create a new role for the class, and the answer continues to be based on all factual evidence: No.

KreatE.7612:

I think you missed the point of my post. I am not arguing the tempest is ‘good’, I’m saying its different, which is good. New playstyles open up variety to the game and options to the players to take something they like and feels good to them and be able to play that.

By your arguments on limited spots in parties we should just remove rangers from the game entirely because they aren’t top tier and therefore should not exist. And maybe disable necromancers too while we’re at it.

This would not be beneficial to the vast majority of players, only beneficial to min/maxers who don’t want to play with those people.

Many people (including myself) prefer the idea of how large attacks that have a detrimental consequence to them. I KNOW tempest is currently weak, but I like it for the PLAYSTYLE. This is healthy to the game. It introduces a new way to play and again, with tweaking may well be very strong. I’ll point out again that tempest is a work in progress and may well be completely OP on HoT release.

Except, it doesn’t, because everything the Tempest can do the base class can do better with the one exception of Aura Sharing (because of the shouts). Doing the exact same thing in a slightly different way is not a new result. It’s the same result, done slightly differently. They quite literally say

Do the elite specializations feel like they are creating an entirely new role for your main profession?

And in this case, simply put: No.

You can feel free to visit the Ranger forum to see their current list of complaints on the very topic you raise that they feel they have no place in the current game. They aren’t wanted in high end speed run dungeons. They aren’t wanted in SPvP high end teams. They aren’t wanted in high end WvW groups.

It’s great to hear you having a good time with the Tempest game play. I’m genuinely happy someone is enjoying it. However just because you are enjoying it, doesn’t mean it’s good or creating a new role for the Elementalist. It’s more of the same existing role we already have for all the reasons already covered countless times over.

Luthic.7290:

This is a terrible argument. Its like saying you should bother playing theif in pvp casue mesmer is a class already with burst and stealth potential.

Actually this is why Mesmers aren’t brought in SPvP on high end teams over having Thieves. You have 5 slots on a SPvP team and only the best classes that make up a good team comp are going to fill those slots. You can bring unconventional classes, but if they don’t fit in the mix then they have no role in that part of the game.

The same is true for PvE. You again have 5 slots and need to complete the content. Now currently most PvE is simple enough you can bring any 5 classes with any spec and complete the content. However when you start looking at the extreme ends of the spectrum, such as Speed Running, Tempest has no place in that realm currently.

Even when you get into WvW front lines, you got 5 slots in a party. Parties are used to guarantee buffs to your party over random nearby people (if a party member is in range, they take priority over anyone else for 5 target capped abilities). This means comparisons are very real because when you have 2-3 slots mandatory going to be Guardians because of what they bring to the table you got 2-3 slots that N number of classes are competing for.

Every game mode has limited slots and every class and potential person is competing for those slots. So no, it’s really irrelevant or terrible way of looking at things but simply the way things are in this game.

Luthic.7290:

ANET has alerady said that people should STOP FOCUSING ON THE NUMBERS. they are readily fixed. i mean would people be complaining if the fire overload suddenly did 5x the dmg with 5x the burn applications… no they wouldnt. \

yes ele is already good at creating might stacks. and sharing some buffs via arcane line. But tempest now offers an aura sharing via shouts which is lost previously. It offers a COMPLELTLy new playstyle of incentivizing not swapping attunments (which i enjoy). yes the overloards should be more impactful then they currently are but it also opens up new build archtypes.

a basic example is conjour wepons. say for pve when u use ur icebow or FGS, you can now swap to an attunemnt, use ur skills then ur conjoured wepon, and when ur done u can now use ur overload.

and in pvp this is supposed to be a zonning mechanic. previously they mainly just had rings/walls of fire which are not true denial. But now they can use overloads (with a bit of tuning) to make it so you really dont want to enter an area the same way you dont want to walk onto a node with necro wells on it.

I enjoyed the tempest and loved the new tricks you can do with it.

Numbers are the most important aspect to everything. They show where things need a boost or why things aren’t effective. For example nothing in the Tempest addresses our natural lack of HP and Armor. When you try to put together a front line build of gear for the Tempest it comes up woefully short on damage or defense. That’s a numbers thing that leads to how the class feels during game play because in order to hit the numbers you need in one area you are giving up numbers in another area, something other front line classes currently don’t have to do.

If the sum of your argument is that “Tempests can share Auras” then simply put the net benefit of Auras is woefully lacking compared to the alternative. Kicking out Frost Aura or Magnetic Aura to 5 people is irrelevant compared to what I could be doing on a normal Elementalist spec today.

The Overload idea is simply bad design. It’s bad design because staying in one attunement is not feasible outside of simplistic PvE encounters where you can camp Fire the entire time. In any kind of high pressure scenario we’re forced out of our attunements. Much of our weapon and class design is based on the fact that we have access to multiple attunements (aka: weapons) and thus aren’t as powerful as other classes nor on similar low cool downs as other classes (very few classes have cool downs upwards of 30 seconds on their 4 and 5 abilities for example). Had they designed the horn with us sitting in one attunement in mind and given us access to more defense in Fire/Air and more Offense in Water/Earth this would make sense but they didn’t. We got the same standard abilities in each line with long cool downs that when we get pressured we’ll be forced to swap. This swapping undermines the Overload mechanic as the rewards of staying aren’t worth the risks of staying (we lose access to the other tools we have to survive).

Also, we already had a zoning mechanic and it’s called the many DPS and AOE fields of Staff. I mean I get you guys want this to be something good, I want it to be good too, but it’s just not.

The play style they specifically mention is front line support.

The problem continues to be, in every regard, the Tempest is an inferior option to other classes or the same base class in this role. Every class is supposed to offer something unique or something advantageous to a group. Guardians bring stability, boons, and natural tankiness. Warriors bring Banner to rally downed people at range. Necromancers bring Well Bomb. Staff Elementalist brings support fields, CC and damage.

What does Tempest bring? What does Tempest add? Boons? Two Guardians already bring 24 stacks of Might and pretty much the only source of AOE Stability (Stand your Ground) for a group. Healing refresh? Staff Elementalists already drop Geyser under the refresh pile that is then blasted with Blast Finishers as the only real source of large scale AOE healing.

Where is the reward for all the abundantly clear risk?

Let me put this another way. All the reward you are talking about getting from all that risk I already get playing other, current Elementalist builds in the game. Many cases it already even requires a higher level of skill play to deliver (knowing combos, when use each combo, micro managing boons, boon generation, etc). So I already have the reward. I’m useful support. I’m useful damage. So all that’s really being offered here is a worse way to play the class for at best the same reward I already have.

This is the equivalent of tying one hand behind your back and saying, “See, this is a new way to play, super challenge mode, it’s so much more rewarding!”

Knighthonor.4061:

Still confused what Facet of Nature does as a mechanic.

Best I can understand it’s a permanent Facet always there as the F2 skill so long as you have the Glint Specialization equipped. This means even if you have the Glint specialization equipped but are using Malyx and Jalis you will still have access to Facet of Nature.

The active (upkeep) ability increases boon duration (+50%) for all affected targets in the Aura (presumably 5 targets, presumably 600 range). Hopefully the cost will be one of the lower ones.

After beginning the upkeep, the ability now turns into a new active ability, One with Nature. One with Nature, when used, will give all the Facet’s boons at once (for example Facet of Elements gives Swiftness as it’s Aura, Chaos gives Protection, etc this means One with Nature will do Swiftness, Protection, etc). It is unclear if it applies all boons regardless or only those equipped (IE: With glint on) but pretty sure it’s the former otherwise it wouldn’t be much use.

The main profession mechanic of the Herald is auras, using upkeep as a cost for said auras. This is (presumably) to give the feel/role of a Guardian or Elementalist who does their support via boons. Therefore the signature Facet (or “Aura”) is one that increases boon duration. This is actually quite powerful because regardless of who or what you are boon duration is incredibly powerful and the Herald provides +50% boon duration to anyone affected by their auras. Think about every class and the boons they provide and increase it by 50%. 50% more might duration, protection duration, fury duration, stability duration, etc.

Personally pretty excited to see the details on Friday.

Well this expansion is a dud for us.

Maybe they’ll fix it. Not too confident however as the base idea of the Tempest just conflicts very hard with the base Elementalist.

Hopefully the next expansion doesn’t come out in another 3 years :/

Kaiden Valor.7163:

The Facet of Nature is presumably an F2 skill and will be available on all legends (while specced for glint). This fits with how chronomancer and tempest both got off-hand weapons and an addition to their mechanics as opposed to a makeover of it.

Yea right now the Specializations seem split with Dragon Hunter and Reaper getting new ways to play the class and Chronomancer and Herald now providing an expanded way to play the same basic class. Tempest unfortunately doesn’t really fit in anything as it’s simply inferior in every aspect to the base Elementalist class; either a testament to how great the base Elementalist is or the failure to deliver a new way or expansive way to play the class.

I also have noticed the pattern it’s the specializations that get a new main hand weapon (in this case 2 handers) that are given new ways to play the class and it’s the classes that only receive off hands are basically just expansions of the existing way to play a class.

Also without more sources of Stability I don’t really see Revenant on the front line. Will be very interesting to see what each Facet actually does.

As I was talking about with the tempest Front Line in WvW is defined primarily by stability sharing (which is currently bottle necked by Guardians), blocks/invulnerability/evades, and mobility with leaps (both targeted and untargeted). Right now you pretty much need 2-3 Guardians to provide enough Stability (Stand your Ground rotations) to keep a front line active which leaves 2-3 slots maximum for front line people and you gotta bring something big to get those coveted slots.

While we do have some of these tools, such as Road, they are largely ineffective because they require you to stand still in them when you are constantly on the move in WvW (dropping road on the go only gives you 1 stack). If Crystal Hibernation requires a channel to activate (unclear, we’ll see on Friday) there’s no way you’ll get it off on the front line.

There’s still a lot of details left unseen with traits, utilities and otherwise but at this time I still see Revenants pretty much supporting the back line because they simply lack the tools to hang on the front line like Guardians and Warriors.

http://massivelyop.com/2015/08/12/exclusive-guild-wars-2-revenant-elite-spec-is-the-herald/

Shield Defenses with Defiance Bar!

All Upkeep utility skills as Facets. Auras that provide AOE benefits as part of upkeep. Can be used again to activate a secondary skill but go on cool down. One of 6 Facets (Facet of Nature) can be used in any stance, not just Glint legend. Auras more buff/support, actives from facets more control and offensive based. Actives currently cost no energy.

Spear Underwater. Mix of Condi and Physical.

Well Roy said they were working on making Jalis more tanky in another thread.

Honestly have no idea what to speculate regarding Glint and Shield. Roy did mention that “soon” there’d be another source of Swiftness when “it’s ready” which kinda implied it’s Glint but you can never really tell.

I mean long as it’s not Tempest level bad we should be good to go.

Didn’t someone work out where you actually travel the same distance if you didn’t stop for the two long cast animations? Hopefully there’ll be some kinda swiftness/mobility dealio with Glint specialization (considering Zephyrites are all based off her).

Remember that not every trait line has a single focus to it. Another aspect to the Corruption line is boon strip which is a huge reason I love the line. Between Opportune Extraction and Spontaneous Destruction both traits are very good even for a power build and I shut down a lot of boon based classes with it plus Banish Enchantment.

Kinda hope when Roy reworks the skill it isn’t yet another condition trait considering there’s already 2 other condition traits there.

Dstroya.6705:

I’m just going to put this here…
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/revenant/Let-s-talk-about-Maniacal-Persistence/first#post5313714

Way I see it is the same reason why people still try to stack Fury on top of 40-50% base crit and the reason why Necros swap into Shroud after dropping their Well Bomb: More crit is always better.

Again, for what I’m doing, it’s the best out of the three.

Nice video and build! As a power focused Revenant I might have to give that ol’ Condi build a try looks pretty decent 1v1. I mostly stuck to Sword/Axe and Staff when I did a small bit of roaming but those new mace animations are pretty great.

I do somewhat disagree with you on Maniacal Persistence. As a Power based Malyx player, it’s pretty darned crucial. You can see in my own video it’s pretty rare that I don’t crit and a large part of that is due to MP. Really there’s no other Malyx trait I’d rather have in my scenario and it works out pretty great.

Jaxom.7310:

Kodiak.3281:

This is also only backwards and the dodge rolls don’t stop hard CC’s such as Lines of Warding, Unsteady Earth, Static fields and other ground targeted CCs. Also if you switch to Shiro you only have 50 energy meaning 1 Riposting Shadows then you’re stuck if you get CC’d again shortly after.

Lets not compare running through some PvE zone to intense area combat like WvW.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Unwavering_Avoidance

its so hard to prove

That also happens at the end of the dodge roll, not the start. So at the end of the animation. So again, if you are disrupted while dodge rolling, it doesn’t give you stability until after.

If it happened at the start you’d immune through it. As it stands, you won’t, and still get stopped.

This is also only backwards and the dodge rolls don’t stop hard CC’s such as Lines of Warding, Unsteady Earth, Static fields and other ground targeted CCs. Also if you switch to Shiro you only have 50 energy meaning 1 Riposting Shadows then you’re stuck if you get CC’d again shortly after.

Lets not compare running through some PvE zone to intense area combat like WvW.

All of the below is from a WvW perspective:

1. I find I’m pretty much forced to take Invocation for that minor trait that breaks stun on legend swap. Not taking this makes the Revenant very clunky to play because there’s always a follow up CC. If I switch to Shiro, then use Riposting Shadows I often times just get CC’d again. The double stun break pretty much feels mandatory which is kinda bad from a character design perspective.

Ventari – Useless to me because it lacks any kind of stability or stun break and any kind of back line pressure you’re pretty much forced out of Ventari in order to survive.

Malyx – Actually a lot of defense here and I am very impressed. Even on a non-condition spec Malyx has a lot to offer defensively. Pain Absorption is a massive source of resistance and I regularly get up to 8s of it per PA. That’s a lot of resistance and it’s saved my bacon more than a few times especially against soft CC (cripple, chill, etc) which is also very common in WvW. Unyielding Anguish is amazing offensively but also defensively. Leaping back and creating a displacement field in your back line means any front line rushers will get teleported out and disrupted as they try to run in.

Shiro – Utterly amazing. Honestly when I did Shiro full time on Friday I had no issues. I could always reposition myself with on demand Super Speed and Riposting Shadows so I never had issues. Riposting Shadows is honestly almost too good with all it does.

Jalis – It’s hard to throw away Jalis entirely as pretty much our only source of stability. That said it’s all too slow and just isn’t effective. IR only gives 1 tick of Stability as you drop it if you are moving forward and you are constantly moving in WvW. Rite is just amazingly slow cast time for a great effect but too high an energy cost for something that’s so easily interrupted. Honestly I found Shiro’s mobility more defensive ultimately because it could actually give you the kinds of reactionary tools you need.

I respect the idea behind slow defenses. You’re tanky. You’re slow. Rawr. Except this is a game where seconds literally matter as the rest of it’s designed so fast. Necro well bombs for thousands of damage don’t give you time to sit there and cast a 2 second 50% damage reduction move. You either get out or you’re dead. Even in PvE you often times have a second to react to many encounters and slow reactions just don’t work.

Pretty much entirely agree with OP.

The slow tablet is largely ineffective. There are, a few cases, where the tablet projectile block is amazing in a particular setup but that’s about it. The healing it puts out is minimal and ineffective in any group setting beyond 5 even if they fixed the trait. To be honest the abilities should work where the amounts are reduced, but they occur at the player and at the tablet.

The biggest issue continues to be a lack of answer to back line pressure. In T1 WvW we often times get many front line teams who Veil then immediate teleport into our backline with Meditation Guardians. We’re talking anywhere from 4 to 10 of these suckers and quite frankly if you don’t have some kind of quick reactionary defense you’re dead.

You can see what I’m talking about in this video @ 4:45 and @ 6:20 and a few times later in the video. These kinds of rapid assaults basically obliterate Ventari which has zero reactionary tools and are pretty common as a back line player. Malyx has a displacement field (seen in video). Shiro has a dodge roll out of danger (seen in video). Jalis and Ventari on the other hand are just so slow they can’t possibly keep up. Trying to cast Rite of the Great Dwarf with that kind of pressure just isn’t going to happen. Moving your tablet back to get help takes too much time and just isn’t going to work.

Jski if your argument is that Elementalist shouldn’t be on the front line diving in with the ball because fundamentally it’s a mage how is it supposed to be in range to share boons with nearby front line allies who are there?

Also I have to really question how much front line experience you are speaking from. In WvW front line for example you do not have a choice between 100 or 300. It isn’t some controlled PvE environment where you can conveniently stand off with each other with you a few steps behind the rest of the melee ball. In fact if you aren’t on top of the front line in a group you’ll more than likely take the brunt of everyone’s damage rather than split amongst other nearby allies due to the 5 target cap.

Again…the whole thing doesn’t make sense. Either they need to give us the tools to survive and have a place on the front line or lets stop pretending that they gave us anything new.

Setup
Armor: Berserker (Hoelbrak and Traveler)
Weapon: Hammer (Strength, Bloodlust), Staff (Energy, Cleansing)
Soldier Neck, Cavalier Ring, Knight Ring, Knight Earring, Berserker Earring, Beserker Back
Lemongrass Soup, Sharpening Stone

I mostly do large scale (20-40 vs 20-40) WvW.

Friday Reset
Friday I went with a Shiro/Jalis mix with Devastation, Invocation and Retribution. I loved Shiro right off the bat and the survivability with Shiro’s mobility was intense. I got caught in a zerg a few times and the easy access to dodge rolling out and using Super Speed to reposition with Jalis always serving as a back up set of escape utilities as swapping to Jalis and immediately hitting Rite of the Great Dwarf got me out of some bad situations. Conditions didn’t get me that much in a larger group as condi cleanse is abundant and with -60% condi duration they don’t last very long.

Over all I found this setup incredible for dealing damage (at some points I saw 8k with 2k crit follow ups with Ruin+Shiro Heal) in a force and taking care of myself. Unfortunately it really didn’t bring much to the group other than that damage. With the Hammer Bugs (reported) going on it wasn’t the greatest damage either. Over all it felt very much like a Ranger, great for doing damage and surviving but honestly not really bringing much to the team.

Saturday Night
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-p7ysfz5fQ

Saturday I decided to swap back to Malyx and kept Shiro for defense. Originally I tried a Devastation, Corruption and Retribution build but it was very clunky and didn’t work well. A single stun break (Riposting Shadows) just wasn’t cutting it and I swapped to Corruption, Retribution and Invocation and the stun break on legend swap with Riposting Shadows as well worked much better.

Malyx is pretty amazing for group play. Pain Absorption works wonders for clearing conditions from people and stacking resistance on yourself. Unyielding Anguish…well watch the video above. It’s usefulness in a group WvW setting is unmatched and basically serves as massive area denial either on the front line or for guarding the back line. Corruption as a line is great even without conditions. Demonic Resistance is staple. Spontaneous Destruction is amazing for ripping stability off targets when you first engage. Maniacal Presence basically boosts that already large 40% crit rating (70% with Fury up) all the way up permanently until I crit to the point it’s more surprising not to see a crit on it.

Shiro is great in terms of mobility but I am not 100% convinced with it. Riposting Shadows is basically only backwards and that means your only real stun break option is a retreat. That doesn’t work when you need to charge forward, let alone charge forward into CC. The on demand Super Speed is fantastic for repositioning in combat and unlike the first test I never got left behind and killed because I was stuck in combat with no mobility.

Sunday Night
Sunday I went back to the original build from the first Revenant Test back to Malyx/Jalis with the same Corruption, Retribution, Invocation build. Road let me go forward so that was pretty great and the Stability isn’t bad but most cases I only get 1 stack of stability on the go. This means I have to basically sit in it which just isn’t viable for WvW. The stun break on Rite of the Great Dwarf is also a huge disappointment with the massive cast time. One scenario I literally got stunned, swapped to Jalis, got Feared, began casting Rite of the Great Dwarf and then got knocked down due to a wall. The 2-3s cast time on Rite of the Great Dwarf is ridiculous for the incredibly short duration and the fact it can immediately be CC’d while casting your stun Break at 50 energy no less.

Slow and tanky just doesn’t functionally work in a game where you often times have less than a second to react whether it’s PvE, PvP or WvW. Having to use 75 energy (25 for road, then 50 for Great Dwarf) just is a bit ridiculous.

How it works is:

Switch Air.
Wait 5 seconds.
Use Lightning Overload.
Switch Fire/Water/Earth
Get Crit
Swith Air
Wait 5 seconds.

Overload or repeat as desired from there. Fresh Air doesn’t reset Overload time on Lightning Overload, only if you swap out of Air.

Kidel.2057:

Please submit bugs here if possible, so they’re all in one place
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/revenant/BWE1-Revenant-Bug-List/first

Like the post already in the thread?

Please concern yourself with your own posts and leave moderation duty to the mods.

This works with any displacement skill in the game, not just Unyielding Anguish.

Also you can’t spam it “non stop” as it does have a fairly hefty 35 energy cost.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/revenant/BUG-Charged-Mists-and-Buff-Delays

Charged Mists and Boon Delays from Traits.

Few problems with this Grandmaster Trait.

YouTube video for reference:
https://youtu.be/25oYUI25Q3E

1. First thing we can see is that it doesn’t trigger off weapon skills. At first I thought it might be Combat so you can see in the video I trigger Embrace the Darkness to put me into combat and using Staff skills and Hammer skills has no change to the outcome on whether or not it procs despite weapon skills using energy. It only seems to work off using Stance skills that bring your Energy below 50%.

2. There appears to be an undocumented 7s ICD on the trait. If you use Unyielding Anguish back to back (4s delay between) you won’t trigger additional stacks of Might. This seems to be true of any stance so long as it brings your energy below 50%. A 7s ICD is really weak for a GM trait that adds only 2 stacks of Might especially considering the alternative is +10% crit on Fury (soon to possibly be +20% crit?).

3. I’ll also take this time to point out the delay on buffs after actions taken. You can clearly see in the video where I use Unyielding Anguish there’s about a 1s delay before Resistance from “Demonic Resistance” as well as “Charged Mists” might stacks actually trigger. ODDLY ENOUGH…the cripple doesn’t have the same delay function. This in many ways make skills like Unyielding Anguish a bit less smooth because for that 1 second you are effected by cripple and then not.

You even see this with Pain Absorption which gives you the initial Resistance boon same time as Blind, then Demonic Resistance triggers a second later refreshing the duration. This also applies to most boons from traits for example Nefarious Momentum as well.

Simply put: No.

They can fix the Tempest to properly be on the front line. However until these kinds of changes are made it’s simply ineffective and has no place on the front line over other characters. Right now it’s little better (and in many cases worse) than a D/D Elementalist who fell out of front line groups a while back (I honestly haven’t seen one in T1 WvW since the stability changes).

I do ultimately agree that there are other roles they could have had Tempest fulfill many of which are listed by Blackbeard. Frankly our low base HP and low base armor make us a prime candidate for a mobility based burst character in the vein of a thief. That said I don’t think they are going to reverse their decision or scrap their work at this time and it’s best to work on fixing their original intent: Tempest, a front line character.

Problem simply is it has no place in the current game.

There’s better DPS specs for PvE. There’s better tankier specs for PvE. There’s better “Bruiser” style front line specs for PvP. There’s better support specs for WvW.

It simply brings nothing new to the table that groups would want.