I’m hoping for a Mawdrey II-like item that eats tiny snowflakes.
As someone who like to play alts (and I mean really play them through the game instead of levelling them as fast as I can with scrolls and tomes), I have to say there’s hardly any fun left in that part of the game. Not so much because of the NPE (although that does have some drawbacks for me), but very much because of the trait revamp. Characters are now boring until very far into their levelling career. I levelled a new alt right after the trait revamp. Didn’t like it. Levelled another one to experience the NPE. Liked it even less. So, no more alts for me.
It’s telling that so many people point to scrolls and tomes as the solution to the boring pre-80s. The pre-80s shouldn’t be boring.
There’s a lot more to the game than hearts OP. Starting at level 10 your personal story starts. That comes about once every ten levels, when you get a number of instances to do that tell the story of your character.
I used to like doing personal story instances, back when I could go through the lot of them at my own pace. Now that I can’t do them at a good number of levels below the level they were labelled at and having a modicum of challenge along the way, it’s become boring as hell. I used to enjoy the apprehension of having to face the instance ‘boss’ after already having to be very careful while dealing with the cannon-fodder. Gone, and replaced with going-through-the-motions auto-attacking boredom. Chunks of enjoyable gameplay have been disappearing with every major update for the bigger part of a year now, never to be enjoyed by new players. I shudder to think what they might come up with next.
What I dislike especially about events in the starter zone is I have to make a choice whether to about help others find events.
People are asking in map chat “where are events?”
1) An event pops up near me. I ping the waypoint and give fast directions. By the time I get there, the event is almost over and by the time the people that listened to me get there, it’s done. They wasted silver and time listening to me and got nothing.
2) One pops near me but I say nothing. It still makes me feel bad because I’m not helping others who are repeatedly asking about events.Either way I feel like I’m get in a lose/lose situation with these events. I want to be social and help others but I’m getting into situations where either I almost trolling people or I’m keeping events to myself.
The best way I found to deal with this daily is to chose not go to the zone in question at all that day. Even put off things you were planning to do there anyway (like map completion) to another day. Isn’t this system great? It offers so much choice.
They also added a meta-fun-component to the dailies that was never there before. Instead of the rather bland daily dodger, you now get to experience the daily elation of looking at your completed daily overview and realizing how many crap dailies you dodged that day while going for the 3 least time consuming ones. Fun!
(edited by Manasa Devi.7958)
For those who aren’t aware of it, it’s neither a golem nor a float. It’s Tixx’s airship, where the Toypocalypse and Tixx’s Workshop instances take place.
I got The Legend a year ago. Can’t even remember what dropped it.
It made my life complete.
Oh, wait, no.
I just sold it and added some spare change to the pile. Hurrah.
I find that the monthlies having been dropped disincentivizes me from doing certain things I would’ve done in the past.
When I see an event notification pop up, and it’s an event I don’t particularly like, I used to participate anyway, because I got a cookie when I finished 25/50/75/100 events. Even when I got to 100 for the month, I still participated, out of habit.
Now, I find myself thinking “why bother?” more often than not. The vast majority of events are hardly worth the time it takes to complete them, and after having done them quite often over the years, many have gotten stale. I just run along to wherever I was going.
The same goes for jumping puzzles. I just run past now, where I would usually do them if I hadn’t done particular ones that month. With jumping puzzles completely gone from the periodic achievement picture, I suspect they’ll see a lot less people complete them. Some are especially uninteresting now, as they don’t even have chests at the end. For example, I used to do Wall Breach Blitz at least once a month. I regularly visit the Diessa Plateau to get iron and tussle with the giant. When I got near the Blitz, I’d complete it if I hadn’t done it for the month or joined in if I saw some people struggling up there. Yesterday, I ran past with that old “why bother” feeling.
Also, all the WvW I’ve been doing lately has been to creep up on unsuspecting dolyaks and deserted ruins. Killing invaders has lost much of what little appeal it had left for me.
In short, I feel disincentivized from doing certain content now. Part of that is definitely the annoyance of not being rewarded for it anymore while I was before. On top of all the other things I used to enjoy that have been eroded over the last year, the game is losing more and more appeal to me.
(edited by Manasa Devi.7958)
Very few talk about enjoying the new dailies for themselves.
Of course they don’t. There’s nothing enjoyable about them, after all.
I did no such thing.
Oh please. Open-world-only players weren’t being overly spoiled. Everyone who spent some little time playing open world was getting their dailies done without much effort. Everyone, not just the open-world-only players.
Keep telling yourself that, you might forget about the 50% of the days you had to go out of your way to finish a 1-2 dailies to get the meta. Funny how that works with positive vs negative memories.
50% of the time? No. I would actually be more likely to complete more than 5 than less than 5. But thank you for assuming you know better what I’ve been doing than me myself. Now I know I can just skip anything you write on this forum because you’re a patronizing kitten.
It doesn’t matter how you dress it up, some options that were there before aren’t there anymore now. Hollowing out the game, one feature per major update.
No. It’s completely ridiculous to not even have a choice in what character you want to play if you want to complete your dailies. Whoever let that bit of idiocy slip into the game should be ashamed.
So those players who already have a level 80 and are using the dailies as a way to level up an alt, the way I used to play ( no longer – I refuse to level a character under the new trait system) are out of luck.
I’m wondering if Anet is trying to discourage the creation of alts. Most things they have changed in the game from the new trait system to this daily rework is detrimental to alts.
Soon, someone will be copy/pasting the stock answer to this issue, telling you to just do the dailies on your 80s and pass on the xp scrolls/writs to your alts. (Acting as if it’s a crazy notion to actually want to play your alts instead of feeding them levelup consumables.)
Be ready!
The dailies did motivate me to kill an occasional dolyak, stand in a ruin doing nothing and buy some liquid world xp several times over the past 2 weeks. For me, that’s indeed a lot more WvW.
How is layer arbitrary when it’s a far better visualization than shard? A layer would better represent that the mega server created another whole map. It’s easier to visualize the Mega Server stacking as it expands and contracts in size to accommodate players. Not that the mega server split a zone into fragments. Which is what a shard is, a fragment of something.
A visualisation? Why? There’s nothing to visualize.
Layer is better than shard? One arbitrary word that does nothing to describe the separate zone instances than another arbitrary word that does nothing to describe the separate instances? Why?
Some serious, some satirical, mixed together for your inconvenience.
- PvE – “Wait, what?”: Complete a daily PvE achievement.
- PvE – “Daily Squanderer”: Destroy a stack of 250 account bound items.
- PvE – “Daily Color Explosion”: Complete an event together with at least 25 players showing commander tags.
- PvE – “Daily Puzzle Jumper”: Complete a jumping puzzle anywhere in Tyria.
- PvE – “Daily Killstealer”: Kill 100 level 1-10 creatures without allowing any other player to tag them.
- PvE – “Daily Bash and Go”: Earn event credit for 5 events by killing no more than a single enemy per event."
- PvE – “Real Daily Vista Viewer”: View a vista without cancelling before the show is over.
- PvE – “Daily survivor”: Gain [some amount] of combat xp in any single zone without going down.
- PvE – “Daily Layabout”: Tell 3 different event starting NPCs that you won’t help them.
- PvE – “Daily Spambot”: Send in-game mail to 15 different players that don’t share a guild with you or appear on either your friends, followers or blocked lists.
- PvE – “Daily World Boss Auto-attacker”: Defeat a world boss using no other skills than skill 1.
The game should just get over itself and start offering an instant-to-80 option. Between the instant 20 birthday scrolls and the +1 tomes that are popping up in more and more places with every update, leveling has become a pointless concept.
Plus one.
There’s nothing I can do to get the notes right today, and I see a lot of people suffering from the same issue, their health bars dropping at approximately the same speed as mine, the difference probably caused by playing a different part.
Usually when this happens (and it has happened almost every day) I just quit the instance and join again. Today, that doesn’t seem to fix it.
Even the defenders of the system do not seem to truly believe it, as they apparently think that the default behaviour should be to do them in the least time possible, using all loopholes and shortcuts you can find. And laugh at posters that actually went at the dailies the normal way.
Of course that’s what they do, because the dailies are stupid and annoying, and get in the way of doing fun things.
If the new system is meant to encourage people to play content they usually don’t do, the PvE dailies fail miserably. If I hadn’t had much interest in PvE to begin with, these dailies would confirm that it’s not worth playing. All the remotely interesting achievements have been removed. Daily puzzle jumper? Gone. Daily story dungeon completer? Gone. Daily dungeon completer (explorable paths)? Gone. Daily personal story completer? Gone. Fractals is the only substantial PvE daily that’s still there. Two different ones even, possibly appearing on the same day.
Apart from Fractals, what’s left are the really easy and annoying ones, the ones you want to get over quickly because they require gameplay that’s not inherently entertaining, like standing on top of a building in a racial capital. Plus, a few that aren’t even actual PvE achievements, so kitten only know why they’re in that category. Things like using the mystic forge and crafting exotics.
None of that is likely to tempt non-PvE players to go play more PvE. And why would they? WvW and PvP players can pretty much finish their dailies while going their usual merry ways. The system obviously isn’t meant to get players to play outside their comfort zones, it’s specifically geared to only do that to PvE players. And not by making WvW/PvP more attractive. Perish the thought. It is accomplished by making the PvE dailies terribly unattractive. I’ve been killing dolyaks, buying liquid world xp and capturing ruins, because it’s the least painful way to complete the dailies. Absolute rubbish.
(edited by Manasa Devi.7958)
This isn’t a new incarnation of my views. They’ve always been like this. I’ve just stopped expressing them a few days ago and instead started attacking the stupid “don’t complain, you get your laurel for free now” rebuttals that were leveled at any and all critiques of the new dailies. I’ve asked “where are the puzzle jumper dailies?” before. No one noticed. I’ve asked for more interesting tasks. No one cares. People just obsess over the new reward structure and totally ignore discussion of the quality of the tasks. It’s infuriating.
I like your reasoning though. You’ve basically confirmed that you agree it’s okay to have to stray from your comfort zone to complete the dailies. Thank you for that!
I’ve never disagreed with that notion. I just disagree with the idea that they have to be stupid pet tricks. Remember? I’m the “stupid pet trick” guy.
Standing on top of a building in a city and harvesting a specific node type in a specific region, or standing in a square in a WvW ruin and killing a dolyak, none of that is outside of my comfort zone, all of that is just too bloody stupid for words.
And what of the ones they removed? Daily puzzle jumper. Somewhat interesting if you didn’t go the lazy mesmer portal way. Gone. Story dungeon completer and the one for explorables? Gone. Personal story completer? Gone. Weren’t those actually achievements that did fit the mold of encouraging people to try other things? What about the current mix of PvE dailies would inspire WvW/PvP players to play more PvE? They didn’t just remove the painless ones, they also removed the interesting ones and replaced them with stupid pet tricks, making PvE actually seem less interesting instead of more. If those achievements must be easy and stupid, at least let them be painless so I don’t have to feel like a dog when trying to gain some AP.
Give me something interesting to do instead of hollowing out the game with every significant update.
(edited by Manasa Devi.7958)
I was mostly just challenging your ridiculous claim that the previous system was spoiling open-world-only players when obviously any player who took part in the open world had the exact same benefit as they had.
Yeah, so I only skimmed the rest of the post after you so ignorantly divided the player base into 2 groups: “open world only PvE players” and “the rest of us”. I wasn’t expecting anything useful to follow that cracker of a fallacy. Mea culpa.
Save up 20 fine essences of luck. Grab a character with Artificer at 0. Refine luck up to exotic. Receive 3 ectoplasm. Not hard, great pay-off.
Is it possible that those who prefer and have done a lot of open world have pretty much exhausted their options to get AP over 2+ years of play? Slayer, Weapon Master, Puzzle Jumper, etc. are all finite. I know most of those completed while I played. The ones that haven’t, like Giant Slayer and Shield Master, are extreme long-term goals (if I choose to do them at all). Are these players at the point where progress towards the next AP chest means Festival or LS Repetition only, absent the dailies? If you’ve done the current Festival Dance, and the current LS dance, then maybe dailies are the only AP you’ll get on a given day, or given week. With the various gaps between LS releases and Festivals, maybe in a given month?
This is indeed the case for me. The only permanently available AP left for me are the extreme ones and the ones for content I don’t enjoy doing.
But really the dailies… I simply can’t empathize even in the slightest with your plight. I know for me (primarily dungeon runner), the dailies were never completed after I finished my runs. I’d get some of them sure, maybe even 3 or 4, but I’d always have to go out of my way to go gather stuff, or WP over to Brisbane to revive some NPCs, and so on.
Now, yes, I’m still doing a few mundane tasks to complete my dailies, but I’m being rewarded more than 100% more, and they’re taking me less time to do!
I don’t mean this to sound rude but, perhaps you open world only, PvE players have been overly spoiled. The rest of us always had that one or two random tasks hanging around that we had to go out of our way to complete if we wanted the daily.
Oh please. Open-world-only players weren’t being overly spoiled. Everyone who spent some little time playing open world was getting their dailies done without much effort. Everyone, not just the open-world-only players. The problem was apparently with you restricting yourself, “staying in your dungeon run comfort zone” previously. A zone you’re so quick to tell people now they need to get out of if they want their rewards.
You don’t like the dailies, so you’ll attempt to discredit anyone defending them.
On a more serious note: yes, I hate the new dailies, but what I’ve grown to hate even more is the attitude with which dissent is answered again and again:
“Oh stop whining, you get your laurels for just logging in now.”
I don’t attempt to discredit anyone in particular, I just try to destroy that insulting counterargument, tooth and nail if I have to.
Have a good what’s left of the night.
At no point did I say that the achievement points would affect the leaderboards.
Oh dear...
Giving away points that affect a leaderboard? That’s a completely different story.
*cough*
You don’t like the dailies, so you’ll attempt to discredit anyone defending them. Which is why this conversation, on my part ends here.
Yeah, we better stop this, because what’s the point in arguing with someone who can’t keep his story straight?
Seeing something different doesn’t equal hypocrisy. Just as you try to pass off a legitimate difference with a semantic one, when you run out of valid points, you try to play the hypocrisy card. It doesn’t strengthen your argument.
I’m not saying there’s no difference in fuction or nature between AP and laurels. I’m just saying there’s no rational way to defend why it is more proper to have one for free and the other not, based upon that difference. You’re right, hypocrisy isn’t the right word to describe this irrational opinion. The right word would probably not be tolerated on these forums.
There is a difference between a currency and a token of accomplishment though in some cases they can be the same. Currency has always been given away in this game.
You can get two free wintersday gifts a day just by talking to Tixx and interacting with a tree. These gifts contain currencies. Those currencies, including ugly wool items, are used at a merchant.
And unpacking a few of these free gifts gives you an achievement point. Achievement points have also always been “given away” in this game, and still are in some cases. Especially before the recent daily update. Seeing how both were incredibly easy to rake in, the change seems arbitrary.
Saying that currencies need to be treated the same as something like achievement points is an opinion. Calling it hypocrisy is a cop out.
But they were treated much the same before, especially with regard to dailies. They were given out hand-in-hand. Heck, achievement points came easier than laurels even. I’m saying, the change was arbitrary. If two thing start out being handled the same, and are accepted as being handled the same by everyone, how can anyone perceive any logic in one being handled differently now instead of it being the other way around or both being handled in that same different fashion?
Saying “but one is a currency and the other isn’t” makes no difference at all. Both have a subjective value and that subjectiveness will make people have differing opinions on which one should be handed out for free, and which one should be “worked” for. Some will even insist that neither should be given out for free.
Laurels are a currency with which you use to buy stuff. No one can view your laurels. There’s no leaderboard for laurels. Giving away a currency is something games do all the time.
Giving away points that affect a leaderboard? That’s a completely different story.
Not acknowledging that is disingenuous.
Leaderboards are an abomination that caused the whole obsessive daily problem in the first place. And, as you are fond of pointing out when it favors your arguments, there’s a daily AP cap. This completely invalidates your point that free daily AP would mess with the leaderboards. Eventually, daily AP would only provide a 15k baseline for all active players and the real “leaderboard heroes” will start to shine. It won’t even take very long for the top of the board to max out the new maximum of 15k, many of them already hit 10k and are probably further than most on the way to what was formerly the 5k monthly cap. Now, please don’t respond with how long it will take for all active players to cap out their daily AP. You never accepted that as a counterargument yourself.
And no, currencies are not given away all the time. There have been numerous times that I played for hours without having gotten any free currency at all. I would even say that not getting free currency has always been the norm, and free currency a very occasional perk.
You can proved 90% of the casuals were getting 5-8 ap daily in the old system? I’d be interested to see that.
It’s very easy to say people were getting achievement points by doing nothing, because that’s what was happening. Anet decided to actually make people do something to get achievement points, while giving them the other rewards for free.
We were doing “something” before. You couldn’t get AP simply by logging in, you couldn’t do “nothing”. You had to… surprise! – PLAY the game daily to get daily APs. That’s why they’re called “dailies”. If you were running around the world, killing stuff (naturally applying condies and dodging), gathering mats, for a considerable time, you were boosting ANet’s daily time metrics and getting your APs for playing the game. Would you really argue that people who were actively playing PvE (and not chatting in LA) for 30-60 minutes an evening were not getting AP?
The problem is that now, to get any daily AP, you have to
perform pet tricksdo specific things instead of doing something. Is it hard to see what people do not like?Yes before they were called dailies and they came with a daily reward which included as only a part of it achievement points. You now get most of those rewards (and more) just for logging in).
You can get extra rewards you could never get before, even if you don’t get the achievement points, by doing any two of the dailies.
But because it’s an achievement point you’re losing, I think (and have always thought) achievements really shouldn’t be something you get incidentally, certainly not daily achievements.
It’s a flaw in the game that has been occasionally commented upon. Now that you actually have to go out of your way for an achievement point, people are up in arms.
There’s nothing in the game you actually need achievement points for, and there are other ways to get them without dailies.
And I have always thought that a laurel wreath was something only awarded to the most excellent of achievers. Certainly, it was like that historically. You didn’t see just anyone run around with laurel wreaths on their crown.
In this game, you got them for completing multiple achievements, something that rang more true to the historical (and present) real-life use of laurel wreaths than the current hand-outs we get for just showing up.
In light of that, I would say that the currency “laurel” as it exists in this game, has lost touch with its etymological roots. Therefore, I propose we change the name of the currency to something more appropriate. Something like: “alms” or perhaps “charity”.
Or perhaps we can just stop the nonsense about it being more proper to actually work for achievement points, while getting laurels for free is okay. Those two acquisition methods paired like they are now is wholly arbitrary and not in any way proper or logical.
This isn’t really semantics. Nothing is locked behind achievement points, except skins. Laurels are useful currency to a lot of people. And yes you got the occasional laurel from an achievement point chest, but not quickly enough to make any use of it.
Laurels are simply more useful to more people than achievement points. That’s why Anet couldn’t just take them away. Achievement points, on the other hand, aren’t just an currency, they’re a form of score. Last time I looked there was no laurel leaderboard. So it’s not just a semantic difference, no matter how much you want to make it so.
I haven’t heard of a cap on laurels either.
You don’t spend achievement points, you’re rewarded for attaining them.
You don’t get titles for earning laurels, you do get titles for hitting certain levels of achievement points.
If you want to try to make this a semantic argument, go right ahead. But the in game reality paints laurels as a currency and achievement points as something other than just a currency.
I’m not trying to make it about semantics. I’m just, once again, trying to point out the hypocrisy of (quoting you): “I think (and have always thought) achievements really shouldn’t be something you get incidentally, certainly not daily achievements.” but seeing nothing wrong with giving out laurels for free, hell, even going one step further and using that “free-ness” to somehow explain why there’s nothing wrong with this system.
You can proved 90% of the casuals were getting 5-8 ap daily in the old system? I’d be interested to see that.
It’s very easy to say people were getting achievement points by doing nothing, because that’s what was happening. Anet decided to actually make people do something to get achievement points, while giving them the other rewards for free.
We were doing “something” before. You couldn’t get AP simply by logging in, you couldn’t do “nothing”. You had to… surprise! – PLAY the game daily to get daily APs. That’s why they’re called “dailies”. If you were running around the world, killing stuff (naturally applying condies and dodging), gathering mats, for a considerable time, you were boosting ANet’s daily time metrics and getting your APs for playing the game. Would you really argue that people who were actively playing PvE (and not chatting in LA) for 30-60 minutes an evening were not getting AP?
The problem is that now, to get any daily AP, you have to
perform pet tricksdo specific things instead of doing something. Is it hard to see what people do not like?Yes before they were called dailies and they came with a daily reward which included as only a part of it achievement points. You now get most of those rewards (and more) just for logging in).
You can get extra rewards you could never get before, even if you don’t get the achievement points, by doing any two of the dailies.
But because it’s an achievement point you’re losing, I think (and have always thought) achievements really shouldn’t be something you get incidentally, certainly not daily achievements.
It’s a flaw in the game that has been occasionally commented upon. Now that you actually have to go out of your way for an achievement point, people are up in arms.
There’s nothing in the game you actually need achievement points for, and there are other ways to get them without dailies.
And I have always thought that a laurel wreath was something only awarded to the most excellent of achievers. Certainly, it was like that historically. You didn’t see just anyone run around with laurel wreaths on their crown.
In this game, you got them for completing multiple achievements, something that rang more true to the historical (and present) real-life use of laurel wreaths than the current hand-outs we get for just showing up.
In light of that, I would say that the currency “laurel” as it exists in this game, has lost touch with its etymological roots. Therefore, I propose we change the name of the currency to something more appropriate. Something like: “alms” or perhaps “charity”.
Or perhaps we can just stop the nonsense about it being more proper to actually work for achievement points, while getting laurels for free is okay. Those two acquisition methods paired like they are now is wholly arbitrary and not in any way proper or logical.
(edited by Manasa Devi.7958)
Yeah, terribly annoying, each time reminding me that this game used to have different features, that I Iiked better.
The new dailies are likely structured in such a way to encourage people to visit different content.
Encouragement offered again and again and again and again (and again and again and again and again) will stop being regarded as encouragement. It will be perceived as harassment.
Active encouragement isn’t passive encouragement. There’s a deal for years to get solar panels where I live. A rebate. It’s advertised in lots of places. I don’t feel harassed by it.
And there are tons of new players, there are tons of returning players, there are tons of people who are only new getting bored with their style of play.
If you want to choose to feel harassed, there’s nothing anyone can do about it. But it’s your choice.
I’d recommend cultivating a bit of understanding about why decisions are made. They can’t always be made for any single individual.
Are you seriously claiming that a daily panel, almost as big as the screen, that you can’t not see if you want to get rid of the trembling little treasure chest in the bottom right of the screen, is not tremendously annoying active encouragement? It’s the equivalent of putting a big greasy hamburger in front a vegan while he’s having dinner, every day, going: “eat it and I’ll give you 10 bucks. Or you could come over to my place and clean the toilet. 10 bucks in it for you.”
The new dailies are likely structured in such a way to encourage people to visit different content.
Encouragement offered again and again and again and again (and again and again and again and again) will stop being regarded as encouragement. It will be perceived as harassment.
Trait acquisition needs to be more to my tastes and it should be possible to do dailies on low level alts again. In other words, I’ll probably never create a new character because I can’t see them backtrack on both issues.
The reward you’re not getting that you would have got before is achievement points on which there is a cap.
That is to say, if you keep doing only the days you want, you’ll end up with the same achievement points eventually.
Actually, for a great many people, likely a vast majority so big that the minority that’s left is insignificantly small, will never cap their daily AP. 15k is a huge amount, getting there before quitting the game for good is highly unlikely. So, getting AP faster means having had more of it before moving on, and as a result of that having unlocked more skins and and having had more time to actually run around in them.
Most of the problem here is a matter of perception.
Indeed, and if you perceive the cap of 15k to be some kind of balancing force that’s at all relevant, you’re staring at the sun.
Right now, if I had to pick my biggest issue with the new system, I wouldn’t say it’s a lack of choice, or being “forced” to do stuff.
The worst thing is the constant in-your-face “encouragement” to do things I have no inherent interest in doing. I can’t start a playing session without the huge pop-up, and it comes with the perpetual carrot of 10 AP for doing these ridiculous things. It makes me resent the game. If a person treated me like that in real life, day in day out, without missing a beat, I’d have punched him in the face by now.
Games shouldn’t foster resentment with their players.
Indeed. The rewards you get from dailies can be earned almost anywhere in the game. Doing dailies (in as little as 4 minutes) means getting AP a bit faster. The only real reasons to care about doing dailies (IMO):
1) a desire to get the checklist off of your screen.
2) a desire to pursue AP faster.
“getting AP a bit faster” is a bit of an understatement. Try “getting any AP at all apart from what becomes available with new content”. There aren’t a lot of alternative sources of AP when you’ve tapped out all the permanent AP pertaining to content you’re interested in playing.
Where has the daily puzzle jumper gone, by the way? Was it deemed too complex, because JPs aren’t marked on the map? Was it replaced “NPE-style” by daily [regional] vista for that reason? Or have we just not seen it yet under the new system?
Newsflash: if it’s gone, and with monthlies also gone, jumping puzzles will see a lot less action in the future. A great big lot. What a waste.
Because out of 12, 2 could only be done in WvW and 2 only in PvP. Are you paying attention? This is about the previous system.
They’re not a universal anything. What you’re talking about is a preference, not an axioma. Some people may not care if they never gain another laurel again and not care at all about the gold they can turn them into, but instead care to get their hellfire skin unlocks as quickly as they can.
And even if what you’re saying were true, how does that make it “logical” that one is a log in reward and the other a daily reward?
All I can gather from what you’re posting it that you find it “okay” to do something that would be beneficial to one group of people, but you find it “less okay” to do something that would be beneficial to another group of people. And you’ve come to these judgement calls based on an idea that you perceive to be some kind universal truth, which it really isn’t because in truth it’s nothing other than personal preference.
Really, you shouldn’t be using the word “logic” or any derivation of it, because nothing you say is based on logic and you don’t even realise it.
Whether or not everyone understands or cares about the difference does not change that the difference is there, and is a logical reason why switching the two would not be a good idea.
While the rate would be the same, assuming they were doing both every day, the choice is not. You can choose to skip a day of ap and just take a day longer to finish.
But you’re looking at it in a totally irrelevant way. The reality of it is that we can only make use of laurels at moments when we reach a milestone number that we need for a purchase we’re after. If you miss a daily laurel, you just hit your milestone a day later, exactly because of the open-endedness of the currency. There’s always another day tomorrow. You’re hung up over arbitrary totals you can’t make anymore, but those totals are irrelevant. Missing a day only means that your purchasing power curve is a day behind, just like someone’s AP gain curve is a day behind.
Except someone’s ap curve has a limit, one which by the way, at least prior to the change, a good number of ap hunters had already reached if I recall correctly. If ap matters to you, you know that you are not permanently behind this’d people because of the cap. When it comes to laurels, you are materially behind when you miss a day, forever.
This isn’t to say that your suggestion couldn’t work. We know it could, as laurels were already locked behind far more time consuming activities in the previous system. I’m just saying, it wouldn’t make sense to lock the uncapped currency behind the activities and leave the capped achievements in the login reward.
And like I said to me personally it wouldn’t make a difference as I do the dailies anyway. And if your switching suggestion were to be implemented it would still be better than the system we had before.
You can go on and on and on and keep saying the same thing over and over and over, but you’re only confirming again and again (and again) that the difference between AP gain and laurel gain only matters to people who care about maxing their laurel gain. You’re proving my point without realizing it, it seems.
Also, if it worked with the previous system, as you admit, and my hypothetical reversal just brings us back to a slight variation of the previous system, how the kitten can it be “illogical” as you claim it to be?
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What does that have to do with anything I said?
Whether or not everyone understands or cares about the difference does not change that the difference is there, and is a logical reason why switching the two would not be a good idea.
While the rate would be the same, assuming they were doing both every day, the choice is not. You can choose to skip a day of ap and just take a day longer to finish.
But you’re looking at it in a totally irrelevant way. The reality of it is that we can only make use of laurels at moments when we reach a milestone number that we need for a purchase we’re after. If you miss a daily laurel, you just hit your milestone a day later, exactly because of the open-endedness of the currency. There’s always another day tomorrow. You’re hung up over arbitrary totals you can’t make anymore, but those totals are irrelevant. Missing a day only means that your purchasing power curve is a day behind, just like someone’s AP gain curve is a day behind.
Of course there’s a difference, duh… I’m just not assuming like you seem to do that everyone cares about the “open ended currency” as much as you do. I for one don’t.
If things were reversed, and people cared, they’d still get both at the same rate as they do now. You can see that, right?
The only practical difference would be that the ‘laurel lovers’ would be the ones who had to do the legwork. If that would be a problem for laurels, why is it not a problem right now for someone who for reasons of his own has decided he needs to max his AP as quickly as he can? People set their own priorities, you don’t get to set them for everyone else.
Edit: And you’re really overselling the “open ended currency” thing. Anything you could do today if you got your laurel, you can do tomorrow if you missed today. That is not a big deal at all.
(edited by Manasa Devi.7958)
You wouldn’t lose the laurel, that’s nonsense, because you never had it. You didn’t earn it.
And also, you’ve just shown exactly the kind of hypocrisy that I tried to lay bare with my hypothetical alternate reward question. You value laurels more than AP, so you’re fine with the current system and think the reverse would be bad.
In the current situation you still need to log in for your free laurels, which you would also need to do in the hypothetical situation, obviously, because you can’t do the dailies that would award the laurels without logging in, right?
If you’re logging in for laurels in the current situation anyway, nothing would be stopping you from also logging in in the hypothetical scenario. And if you’re logging in anyway, what’s stopping you from doing the dailies? They only take 5-10 minutes, right? “If you want your laurels, earn them, you want everything for free?” That’s what the forum would be like.
You can’t catch up in laurels because laurels are uncapped. A Laurel you earn today will never make up for a laurel you missed yesterday. This is in complete contrast to daily ap which is capped.
And why is that bad?
Perhaps time gated was the wrong word there, but then again ap is not even a currency, so it’s odd that you would get focused on the time gated issue.
I didn’t focus on that. I also addressed the “not a currency” point. It was you who focused on the time-gating by mentioning it in the first place and getting all defensive about it with a scenario that proved nothing.
It’s odd that you fault me for the things you write. Really odd.
Like I said, probably the wrong term. Still, you are focusing on semantics rather than the actual explanation for why it would not make sense to switch the two.
That explanation you gave makes no sense.
We could get AP and laurels before the recent update, and we could still get both in the actual situation we’re in now as well as in my hypothetical situation. People who logged in and did their dailies all week would have the exact same rewards in my hypothetical situation as they actually got in the real situation. The only difference in the hypothetical scenario is that people can prioritize things differently.
I can only conclude that you’re not being rational about it.
(edited by Manasa Devi.7958)