Guild Wars 2

Force 1: The Dragon who wants to define the Sylvari
Force 2: Tyrian races (especially humans) who ended up defining the Sylvari
Her Agenda: Waking the dragon so the two can box and destroy each other
The Dragons Agenda: Waking up, eating magic
Her Reaction: “I do this for myself, not for you! Im gonna be the last one standing”

What I like: Being important to the other characters, seeing them invest in our friendship/partnership/trust and being able to do the same at times.

What I don’t like: Repeatedly being said how great I am and how my deeds were legendary as hell and stuff.

GW2 does le both, so nothing missing for me…

morrolan.9608:

OK a prominent gay male couple then since I have no idea who you’re referring to.

Logan & Ritlock

Trahearne & The Floor

Woooo!! Wildly Flailing

Mordremoth!! AND THE CUTSCENE!!! And there I thought Kasmeer was to die and then!! BAM Marjory flying across the screen and AWWW the dramatic scene!! And then the bad-kitten Dialogue between Kasmeer and Scarlet!! An then COW FINISHER RIGHT IN DA FACE, SCARLET!!! and then suddenly BOOOM everything blowing up and there underneath THE DRAGON!!

…guys.. girls… WE’RE GOING TO MAGUUMA

ok, phew.. im a grown up at last. Well done, everybody.

Asura with skimpy armor would be awkward. Who would want that?
And what differences would you want between the Male and Female versions?

Wow, looks interesting. I believe this to be the entrances to her Drill ship once we fight back. Don’t know about the spirals though..

They actually shoot you dead now if you get too close to their wall. There are barrages of arrows coming down killing molten alliance and players equally. Dam lv 90 Tengu..

Miasma is a thing in guild wars like “Hylek” or “Mists”. All magic has its source in a number of magical “Poles” like our real world electrical charges. If Abaddon can use one of these sources, Scarlet can too, even if not the same way..

EDIT: this might be a little misplaced in the lore section so move it if necessary, al least im mentioning cantha..

What im gonna do is looking for symmetries and coherences between the classes and from there draw a conclusion what the next class could look like.

We have: 3 Light Armor classes, 3 Medium Armor classes, 2 Heavy Armor classes
We’ll get: A Heavy Armor class

We have: 3 Harpoon Medium classes, 3 Trident Light classes, one of each can use the weapon exclusively, A Harpoon/Spear and a Trident Spear Heavy Class
We’ll get: A heavy class that only uses Spear for complexity reasons or a Trident/Harpoon class (Spear exclusive is much more likely for a heavy class)

We have: A light class that can alter its weapon skills with its class skill bar and a medium class that can alter its skills with its utilities.
We’ll get: One that can alter its weapon skills with… (whats left?) … with its weapon skills.

Weapon skills that alter weapon skills? What? Well, we already have this in our chain abilities. But here it could get more complex. Do you remember the Assassin from GW1? We had lead hand attacks, second hand attacks and dual attacks. Here an example how this could look like:

3 Sword abilities, I choose “hilt strike, which dazes the target for 1 second”

-> the 3 abilities swap for a second set of 3 abilities, the second hand attacks

I choose #2 Faint Attack – Deals X damage and makes vulnerable

-> swap for the final set of 3 abilities

Bam, final thrust – deals damage for each condition on target or whatever

Now concerning the stlyle of that new class, I tried to find another pattern. Players play classes for a certain feel they have. For each of the armor classes we have

1. one “well known fantasy class” (The warrior, the ranger, the Elementalists)

2. one class thats a bit special and off and have a certain philosophy to them (The Guardian, the Thief, the Necromancer)

3. one that that speaks to the “unique” players (The Mesmer, the Engineer… aaand our new class).

If we divide the classes in these groups, there’s one of the “complex”, no-weapon-swap classes in each group

So to put the pieces together – my prognosis for the next class:

A heavy class, that exclusively uses Melee weapons, that uses a combo system in a fancy way that sets him apart from the warrior and the guardian – maybe by using elements or ancestral power to enhance his attacks

We had a few interesting earth aligned NPCs in “Edge of the Mists” lately using Totems. Another direction this class could go would be aligned with the GW1 assassin who came up when we went to cantha. With the dominion of winds so close to the destroyed lions arch, maybe will get the new class when the dominion becomes accessible.

Did I miss something? What class would you like to see?

Claw is an island that blocks LA form the sea. Any regular invasion would have to pass there. Scarlet came from above so she doesn’t has to deal with it. Airships are still a relatively new invention.

After the patch, I and a friend got dropped off near the Lion in LA in the midst of this vast destruction of well-known places and started to fight our way towards the middle of the city. Such an epic, apocalyptic feel. Such a great patch. The cutscene was breathtaking. GJ (Use more of that synth that occurs in the last two seconds of the scene)

1. In “escape” you can search for survivors solo or in a small group
2. If your class is “boring” to solo, accept the zerg or reroll
3. I you want rewards, spread out, look for survivors and converge at events when they appear near you, then spread out again. The reward scales with the number of rescued citizens

Jenna… who is an elder Dragon… because of Abbadon… and of course Scarlett planned this all along…

Elder Dragons are not evil. But in one of the books, someone enters a Dragons mind and states, that its full of greed, hatred and anger. However these emotions get their connection to that elemental force, its still thinkable, that a dragon full of gentleness, love and appreciation would behave differently – for whatever reasons.

Even if they turn LA into a PvE zone, if they leave the essantial structures the same, they can still add instanced missions where the NPC movements and dialogue are the same.

A High five from Barney and A GS made out of all the posts of this thread.

Concerning the secret of Caithe

Im pretty sure she someone blames herself for the fall of Faolain to Nightmare. That there was some accident or Faolain tried to protect her. A lot about that happening is kept blurred by caithe herself.

how about

1: +1% poison duration while your pets health is over 90%
2: -2% weakness duration while you are knocked down
3: +3% daze duration while your health is below 25%
4: -4% blindness duration unless you are blinded.
5: +5% pet health for 2 seconds whenever you use a Manipulation
6: Summon two random elder dragons

Stats are bad.. pass

You need to have a drawback if you want to balance a totally awesome follower.

I got this rune that hasn’t quiet as many stat points on it but summons a neat golem that has knock back and can tank a whole zerg for a few seconds.

We already have the rock dog and the necro minion from other runes. Im not sure if theres more – but please, give us more with the next patches – maybe with other stat combinations. Ive been dreaming of my Husk-Rune for a while now and If the LS is taking us to Maguuma one day, please don’t leave out on this one.

And Im sure there are other minions people want to see – A Quagga Rune for example

Superior Rune of the Arbomancer

1: +10 vitality
2: +15 condition damage
3: +25 vitality
4: +35 condition damage
5: +45 vitality
6: Summon a Husk that knocks down.

Superior rune of the Coddler

1: +2% boon duration
2: +15 healing power
3: +3% boon duration
4: +35 healing power
5: +5% boon duration
6: summons a quaggan that casts a healing water splash spell

Maybe they’ll have Zhaitan return inside the LS to be defeated once and for all so they can proceed with the story. With the LS officially happening after the PS they’ll need to have an exact time when Zhaitan was beaten just for the records. And the arah version of Zhaitans fall didn’t make his death clear. We just saw him fall.

Maybe the dear priestess just can’t accept or won’t believe that the gods have left. Jeff won’t lie to us. The in-game characters can do whatever they want. There are a lot of NPCs contradicting each other and only one of them can be right.

Maybe she wants to absorb Mordremoths power with her UFO the way she absorbed the clockwork minions power at the weapon test encounter.

Andele.1306:

the dude who needs a CORSPE

Priceless..

Use celestial, its got it all :P

“Mesmers are masters of illusion and control, subverting the enemy’s Energy for their own use, and that of their allies. Combined with any other profession, their skills provide excellent support, turning enemies’ powers against them and changing the very fabric of reality to hinder foes and help allies. Mesmers have the ability to cast spells quickly, which can make all the difference in the heat of battle. Their powers of domination allow them to take control of enemy skills and Energy. Their unique illusionary talents can slow or even halt enemy movement and skill casting, or cause imaginary illnesses that drain Health and Energy from foes while healing and energizing allies. While Mesmers are not known for brute strength, their ability to confuse, distract, and drain the enemy’s resources more than compensates.”

Oh man, I can still remember reading those lines when I bought “Guild Wars Factions” and I started right away with the idea of a melee mesmer. 3 campains later I had a solid build using illusionof weapons, Illusion of weakness, flurry and distortion. I was SO happy to see the reality bending Mage return to GW2.

The fact that he could use a sword by design made it so much better. I can still remember the first two month when literally no one knew how to fight a mesmer and I could beat everyone exept thieves (lost every single fight). After 2 months I counted 4 non-thieves that could beat me 1v1 (played WvW roaming mainly and half of them were other mesmers). And then came the hard times when People started to notice the moving mesmer between the clones and the bunker builds came and people l2p’d and the trolling came to an end.

And yet I found other fun things, actually I got away to define my playstile to be the total beater-build and just focussed on the things that were fun. Especially with most of the Players seemed to just take the most effective build from the Internet I ended up using stuff that was rightout despised by other players. Heck, I use Celestial stats, Inquest-Golem-Runes, a torch, the “descent into madness” trait and “Take Root”. And guess what, its a ton of fun and right now I got 1.4k hours on my Mes alone with 1.8k total.

And this I think is the mesmers main Problem. Ist a class that plots in the Background, that deceives and values its ressources, that needs time and effort to learn and even with mastery cant compete with warriors PvE-damage-wise. Right now Mesmer are played by players mostly because they love the class or focus on WvWvW.

With the game focussing so much on reward, people try to min-max. its more of a calculation instead of a gut decision. There is not so much flavor to the classes as in GW1 where you had your Mentor and your Special Missions depending on class, that it was cool to be busy with your necro stuff. All you can really relate to right now, is your personal preferences from outside the game and the experience wether youre successful with the class in your first 30 minutes.

The mot effective way in many cases is the simple way. And you can do make people do the most unfun or boring things if it makes them win. On the other Hand its a good to have the game being beginner-friendly. So it Comes down to the Mesmer being an advanced class mostly for players that either have the passion to learn the class head on or after they played an easyer class first.

“And as Scarlets minions breached the gates of Lions Arch, Ritlock Brimstone saw no other way than to smash his legendary blade Sohothin and set free a wave of energy that doomed both, the attacking forces and the players within the city. Through this act, the remaining defenders where forever bound to their tasks that they were performing at the moment and thus being forced to farm and grind the same dungeon paths until the curse is lifted one day – their resolve relentless…”

Where can I has dat Orb?

Noticed the same problem, but sometimes it works, could be just at breakable bridges

Belzebu.3912:

Rym.1469:

Hmm. I think we may see something related to Tengu and Mr.E himself revealed.

What if Mr. E is a Tengu, and he is not only hiding his identity from us, he is also hiding from the other Tengus that want to keep away from the other races.

Wow, that makes absolutely sense since we’ll need a Tengu member for our NPC guild anyway.

What happens:

We can start a living world event that will bring our group to the mission where we run from portal to portal and close them joining the new edge of destiny. (Who will absolutely get a name by the end of this season) Then scarlet will use her mass destruction weapon to deal heavy damage to LA setting it aflame and starts digging down somewhere in the water creating a maelstrom.

And then we will travel downwards with her drilling device while her alliances fight us. In the end, she will face us herself to finally show us how we achieved nothing. And as we defeat her, the drill enters a huge underground cave that is overgrown with green poisonous plants and masses of husks. Thats where we encounter Mordremoth peacefully feeding on the lay lines. And then he flies off mysteriously leaving LA not further harmed but turning it into a lush jungle (explaining the Artwork in the developer streams). And then everybody wonder why it didn’t attack LA. And then we find out that scarlets body was never found…

And btw they can’t destroy old LA… Quaggans live there… who could…

What do we know about the mysterious entity Scarlet met?

- It is very powerful
- It wants to destroy stuff (Scalet mentions that she does what shes doing because of herself, not because of that thing, which implies that it has the same intentions)
- It is was a part of scarlet before she met it.

Sounds dragon-ish to me.

Interesting is, that we are not talking about a connection she has to a dragon out there. Its stated, that this thing is A PART of her she was protected of before.

Maybe we should start to imagine dragons not just as a single entity that flies around and kills stuff but more of as a manifestation or a facet of this grater but formless elemental will that can be divided and shared in artifacts such as the sanguinary blade of Jormag and distributed under a dragons minions.

The only other place where I see somebody BEING another being was when the dwarves all proclaimed to be the great dwarf after they got the “good corruption” from the Hammer to single-midedly hunt down the destroyers and become all greenish-stony looking immortals.

Maybe Omadds device just freed a small, contained part of Mordremoths corruption that now destroys scarlets personality. Its strong enough to make her insane, but not necessarily stong enough to finally corrupt her yet and take over her will.

Imo this season will anyways end with a dragon. Anet wants to prove how they can distribute expansion worthy stuff via the living world and the expansions will definitely rotate around the ED. And since its soon 1.5 years since the release of GW2, the dragon story has to continue.

Narcemus.1348:

MatthewMedina.5419:

I’m confident that our storytelling in this format will get better and better as a result!

I personally would say that this release and the last are proof that it already has gotten much better

It really did. Considering the uproar of the player base when they didn’t feel important enough, I had to laugh when reading Marjorys letter. “I can’t emphasize enough what of an important rule you played revealing Scarlets plans” well played, Anet

First I was all like “Woah, who’s Volstag? Some prophet?” then it became something along the lines of “Oh, its just himself…”

Actually it doesn’t make any sense at all, for Faolain to be corrupted, she still doesn’t act that way..

Thank you Konig for the long post.

I see while you two don’t believe in the theory. Because it makes too many assumptions and too many exemptions for the sylvari in regard of the other minions.

Yet there have to be exeptions because something must have happened in their past and the past of the tree. And this something would have effects on other aspect of their personalities and their belief system, their physique, their perception of themselves. It can’t be that plain simple. “Stop writing, Ice is cold water. Ice cannot be cold water.. Ice is solid. Water is not..”

Let us assume and don’t take it for an impossibility

Concerning the body morph of the nightmare courts, for some reason, established courtiers all seem to have the same brown look.. however I wouldn’t compare them to destoyers. Its probably more complicated there.

(Destinys edge spoiler alert!)At a certain point in “Destinys edge” Faolain frees Caithe of a poison she gave her to convince her to join the court. After she almost dies she takes the poison out again. This causes her Arm to become thorny and it starts to rot. Now THIS is what Mordremoths corruption probably looks like.

And lower minions can very much be freed. Its possible all the way down to a chicken. :P

You’re right about the Sons of Svanir, I looked it up, you’re either corrupted or you’re not. At least thats what we see with the dragons we know yet. So thank you for your effort.

Now, still, we both believe that dragon corruption doesn’t exclude a certain amount of intelligence for the minions that they keep even under total control of a dragon. So in the end, if you removed the influence of the dragon be it through any means, (like the chicken ritual in orr) that intelligence can be used freely. And they could live even without the guidance of a dragon.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

We have no reason to assume any of them have any sort of remaining free will.

Glint managed to make decisions after the corruption was taken from her and destroyers may too. I don’t say it IS that way. But don’t say, this is not possible. Something could have happened to to the Sylvaris corruption, there in Ventaris refuge. Something could have happened to the pale tree and the dream.. maybe even to the dragon himself and thus to the other sylvari of the other trees… we can consider it.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Miroe.2054:

Scarlet: “Oh Bloodstones, Ive sacrificed many lives on my journey to reach all six of you (Mad giggle) and put you back together and confront you. What do you have to say?!”

[…]
Growth

Uh… there is no Growth bloodstone. There’s only FIVE bloodstones.

No, theres none. But the bloodstone seal has six sides as well. There is one form of magic missing and if we take the keystone as “order”, theres only the Melandru-magic left out which would tie to the forgotten magic the druids have used. Just kitten ing and improvising some theories because such an in game event needed a huge reveal.. (wow, I didn’t know that would end up in the forums word filter 0.0)

Darkbattlemage.9612:

Perhaps

Its 100% perhaps that way. Its a good theory though. I rather wondered why one can say with certainty that they cannot have free will.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Yes it does. Those minions that chose to join Zhaitan willingly, did not need to be corrupted. But those that were, lost their free will, and became mindless servants.

You said that after I mentioned risen calling you names, which they do after they are corrupted.

They aren’t robots, they are living creatures. As such, they don’t turn off, but they don’t regain their free will either. Primordus was still asleep, so the destroyers continued to do what they already did: Kill dwarves, and eradicate life from the Depths. Their goal did not change with the death of the Great Destroyer, only their coordination did. But they didn’t get free will. They were created to serve Primordus, and never had free will to begin with. So there isn’t any free will to give back to them either.

Could be, probably is that way, still you don’t know, what went through their heads.

Dragon minions are not being influenced, they are being commanded. They have no option to do anything but follow those commands. A common soldier might disagree with the army he serves, and doubt if the cause he’s fighting is just. Dragon minions are not capable of considering this.

Do we know how the corruption works? where do you take this from? I don’t say my version is true, I say its open. And its a viable theory.

This is a mistake many people make. The Sons of Svanir are not dragon minions, and they are for the most part not corrupted. They are a bad example.

Then the wiki article is heavily misleading
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sons_of_Svanir
So the second paragraph isn’t about the sons of Svanir?

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Not always. Some Risen have chosen to serve Zhaitan willingly, and thus retain free will

Thats all I wanted to say, the possibility inside this universe, that corruption in a sense of elemental dragon energy doesn’t exclude free will. And that the possibility of the Pale tree and the sylvari being tied to the sixth dragon is still thinkable.

The Destroyers were being controlled by a champion of Primordus. With the Great Destroyer killed, and Primordus still asleep, there was no one left to give them orders. And so they no longer were a coordinated force. This does not mean they got free will.

If you mean that they keep some kind of slave-attitude I can see, what you mean, but they are still free at that moment to do what they decide themselves. If they didn’t decide themselves, they would just have turned off like robots.

No, it is also the ability to will something in the first place. You have to be allowed to think for yourself, and choose to do something, or not do something, to have free will.

Drug addicts decide for themselves that they want a certain thing and yet are heavily influenced by their addiction. Im certainly not wise enough to understand WW2 but I know that the human nature is easily manipulated by everything, by substances inside your body, by media, by people, experiences, all influences that somehow merge into your world view. We have absolutely no identity without something to guide, something that lets us refer to the different choices we have. Thats what makes us actively choose – not just by thinking but mainly by being all that we have gathered throughout our lives.

And if someone wants to control me, he just has to understand that and mess with my identity, with my memories, feelings and experiences. He can influence me there, at who I am instead of overpower my will. We can see that slow corruption of the soul with the sons of Svanir. (All corrupted to a certain point and still able to make decisions) It starts with temptations and leads up to almost remote control. I still decide. but if that Me ist still Me is another question.

I don’t say, this is, what happens, but its possible and it leaves the Sylvari-Mordremoth question open and it would also explain, with what kind of power the Sylvari soul is shaped.

1. Overflow Map released
2. rest of the Battlefields empty
3. no Overflows required anymore
4. ???
5. Profit

So when risen call you names, its because Zhaitan has given them a direct order?

When the destroyer queen was slain in EotN, the destroyers went back under the earth, they became uncoordinated. How on earth can they become uncoordinated when they are all mind controlled by the same dragon. (consider that he was able to create the queen) And if they need a champion to guide them, on what was their decision to run for cover based on? On their own self-preservation?

Will in my opinion is the things we want. Our instincts or emotions, and our decisions we make as a result of them. If something changes my emotions or instincts, the act of the decision making would still be there and thus my free will. My will may have been altered, my personality changed, but it is still free.

I don’t really see how you can say, they do definitely not make decisions? Or how the border between mind control and free will cannot be blurred depending on the connection.

How comes so many germans hated the jews in WW2, yet nobody yells “mind control”?

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

And no, it is not a small version of the Pale Tree Miroe, it’s just a giant plant.

It actually seems attached to the Spekk’s Laboratory JP.

Well, looks like you are right there. There are just minor similarities to the sapling version of the pale tree and the grown up version – especially the few leaves at the top. and the connection to Spekks laboratory is strange indeed. I rather wondered about the sheer amount of possible connections to scarlett. Most of the stuff im writing is actually rather unfounded and rather an attempt to connect lose ends.

So what you’re saying is, that there is a fundamental difference between being

- “turned into a fanatic dragon minion” and then follow your fanatism and kick a puppy

and

- being created from scrap out of the experiences of your fellow people.

Both includes meddling with wills and ends with someone perfectly fine with what they are doing. If you fall in love, how is that different from a dragon giving you a sudden desire to kick puppies. (Free will wise I mean. Of course I see a difference XD)

btw Svanir chose to embrace Jormags power.

Magic never vanishes – it always changes Form.
A jungle vanishes, a new race awakens – I think we’re even..

I edited my post late, sorry for that.

So, what tells you that the dragons minions don’t wanna do what they do? The nightmare court are 100% obedient to the nightmare and CANNOT return. here we see how much power the dream can have over a Sylvari. They laugh you in the face and say, “Yay, my friend, lets kill some villagers. Oh, you don’t wanna, well die so..”

Dragons mess with your will and then set it free. A sylvaris consciousness is created inside an independent system, there our alarm should already go off.

You’re right, It doesn’t feel right, to use it in an argument.. its doesn’t feel like the devs intended this to be in our official information pool at this moment. I wondered what the codes meant so I posted them without mentioning the JP. Put since it was recently mentioned in a post anyways I could as well just go all the way…

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

They can’t be dragon minions. Dragon Minions don’t have free will. Ugh. I get tired of repeating that.

From the outside there is no difference between wanting to destroy something and thus doing so and destroying something because you’re mind controlled. But considering the freedom of will its a huge difference. You are forced to do what you do because of your desires and goals, that IS freedom of will.

We don’t know, what its like to be a dragon minion. As far as we know, the Sylvaris personalities contain primarily the things from the dream. All that is important is, that their will and strive is defined outside of themselves inside a single entity.

Would you call a nightmare court free? I would. They all seem to have the same desire for destruction implanted but from that point on, they are free to follow that desire. Its highly probably that all dragon minions are guided by some hive mind while still being intelligent beings. Look at the risen. How can they taunt you and bring their one-liners if they are mindless forces?

This has been a huge argument in the forums and I just leave it saying that we don’t know the answer and that its a cool theory.

Or from another angle.. what tells you that dragon don’t wanna do, what they do?

There is a small pale tree down there with a thorn vine around it that has scarlet red leaves. Scarlets story has been in writing a long time. They can’t just change it because its been there a while now. The place includes: underground strucures, psychoactive substances, force fields and experiments with a small version of the pale tree thats getting powered by some device. Too many connections to scarlet in my opinion.

Stupid question.. but what magic did the druids use? Preservation magic? Like monks? I mean, there is no Melandru-aligned Blood Stone.. yet..