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Do you have obal’s posts set to hidden or something?
Why? Has Obal provided a comparative analysis of optimized DPS + Survival builds at melee and range? I haven’t seen it. I’ve not even seen a build concept like this proposed until now … so Obal probably hasn’t done this. If you know of anyone else that has, please provide the links because I’m interested before I completely dismiss this thinking of what’s being presented here.
I’m pondering the survival value of simply avoiding melee combat … something that no other Guardian builds we are used to take advantage of. Remember, the smite build is selfish but it still dodges and blocks as well as most of the other builds we tend towards and at range … IMO those things increase their survival value alot if any of the other players on your team are melee.
For me the biggest question is why Nemesis feels that, when playing with a team, he requires so much survival by going to range and sacrificing any shred of team support that isn’t already part of the base toolset. …. All this given the fact that even average players can survive with melee, getting similar if not more damage and supporting the team better.
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I’d go even farther by saying that even if Nemesis is simply trying to make the highest DPS guardian build possible regardless of their ‘typical’ role, he seems to overlook the fact that one of the biggest DPS sources for the guardian is through the collective sharing of boons and target de-buffs, not to mention the DPS gained by keeping your teammates alive. Support=DPS much more for guardians than necros, where it’s almost mutually exclusive.
Perhaps. What is clear from his video’s is his motivation. He was very clear to state that this gives the best combination of highest DPS with survivability. I tend to agree with that statement because camping ranged tends to help avoid hits, aggro, etc… (One of the reasons that I’m against suggestions to give Guardians more ranged weapons, but that’s a different topic)
What would be an interesting rebuttal to this video is if anyone would attempt to provide a bestter survival + DPS build …. with a melee range weapon. I’m not sure how anyone would be able to compare them though.
Maybe being a bunker Guardian isn’t a good fit with your playstyle. PVP in this game is great because the gear and respecs are free. You can try anything you want and see what fits you.
Again it wouldn’t have to be that extreme at all. Idk why everyone always argues that it does.
I’m still waiting to hear why regulation is even necessary at any level. What is the goal of implementing regulatory measures?
Because the lack of regolation and the use of TP as the only trading system is forcing players in a PVP minigame they DON T WANT to play.
And since this is not market wars 2 that is totally wrong.
Any for of farming have Always been regulated but the TP….
I know that the difference is farming produce gold, and TP doesn t , YET TP produce INFLATION directly on luxury items.
No one is forcing you to play the TP like a game because if you treat it like an NPC vendor, it’s not. If it’s a ‘game’, it’s because the player chooses to play it that way.
TP also doesn’t ‘inflate’ luxury items, just like it doesn’t inflate any other item through the nature of regular, vanilla supply/demand theory. There are examples of luxury goods going down in price even though There is probably a steady but small inflation occurring. Your statements don’t add up to reality.
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Fair enough. I actually agree with most of what both of you are saying (‘blight on the GW2 community’ seems a bit harsh, hehe).
IN all fairness to everyone, including Nemesis, I think ‘blight’ is a reasonable adjective here.
Despite all the bickering, this is the first build in a guide I have seen that completely disregards the role that Guardians play in the meta; having some level of team support, mostly with boons/defense. I just don’t get the underlying concept of the build, which essentially ignores the fact that anywhere a considered build is needed, it’s usually done in a team.
Again it wouldn’t have to be that extreme at all. Idk why everyone always argues that it does.
I’m still waiting to hear why regulation is even necessary at any level. What is the goal of implementing regulatory measures?
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As they may be good for the economy, there is much more to games then economies. That’s where the two clash. Making a synergy between a healthy environment and economy is crucial. When ones prosperity feeds off the other there is an issue.
I find statements like this unbelievable. Anyone can be very successful in this game without even doing ‘economy’ stuff. The health of the game is really not as tied to the economy as many people would like to believe.
Furthermore, no one says players have to use the TP to buy/sell their stuff either. If you think the risk is worth the reward, don’t use it.
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I spent some significant time going through the video. I get his approach; the best survival AND DPS will be with a Scepter. Other than that, I question alot of what’s being done here:
1. 10 trait points are unoptimized in Zeal. I would not do this, even if I were to consider using torch/burning.
2. I get that he’s stacking burning (our burning values are actually very high) with the auto attack and Smite. I get that he’s maximizing survival (or claiming to) by avoiding melee. He’s also making significant AOE. It’s what he says the build does so I don’t feel he’s trying to be misleading.
3. You can quote me on this:
“This is a selfish build”
Team support is LOW. VoC, VoR and Torch 5. I think this build actually has the lowest support you can get from any combination of traits/skills/weapons.
4. I think there is TOO much focus on survival with this build or more specifically, the wrong kinds. He’s already playing at range, he crits tons for dodge …. and he’s playing ranged. He’s procing Aegis at 50% HP .. unlikely to happen while dodging a lot …. at range. The choice of Valour 5 is too conditional for my tastes with this ranged strategy.
5. Knowing the issue with Scepter auto attack potential to miss, I would be concerned about his strategy in the first place.
If I was to consider a ranged DPS/survival strategy, 20/30/5/5/10 and Purging Flames over Condition Damage Signet. I fixed the major shortcoming of this build (conditions), made it less selfish and maintained the ranged/DPS concept.
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So … you’re going to attribute drop in people due to a lack of trading regulation? Is this for real?
a broken economy is the main cause of many mmorpg failure….should be obvious.
If your claim is that how the economy works has such a significant influence on the success of the game, then my answer is that Anet shouldn’t touch the TP/markets, etc… because the game is successful. I mean, anyone can just make statements. Do you have any evidence to suggest that the impending failure of the game is due to whatever is wrong with the economy or is that just some empty threat in hopes to get Anet to change something?
I’m all for fixing what is ‘broken’ but … is there actually anything broken here? Can you explain what that is?
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Not sure why a damage build would put 5 in Valour over Virtue. I’ve watched his necro vids. His approach to designing builds was a little radical.
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FACT: Unless you are a Dev and have first hand knowledge with the game code you know absolutely ZERO about the RNG and/or probabilities of getting anything.
Anyone that has a background in statistics can determine the probabilities for events to occur from a set of data. We can definitely say we know more than absolutely zero about the probabilities of getting anything. You don’t need to be a Dev to figure this out.
So … you’re going to attribute drop in people due to a lack of trading regulation? Is this for real?
You know what is funny …
People using their crystal ball to predict bad things happening to leather in the market soon, but they aren’t using it to tell them they should buy it if they need it before that happens. TLDR: If you want to speculate leather, it’s pretty hard to loose out on it’s current price.
The OP has it wrong. The game doesn’t rely heavily on the TP, only the impatient players who wants everything quickly and conveniently.
Like all those impatient people who were too impatient to farm those 15,000 candy corns for the Halloween pail?
No, he means all the impatient people that farm the more common mats to make things like ascended gear, etc… Your n=1 example is flawed.
You say that like it’s a bad thing.
Yea they do… because it’s not required gear to have for any part of the game. I know many of people that aren’t upgrading because they don’t need it for anything.
…and I know more than a few casual players who have simply quit playing the game because they cannot possibly keep up to the grind needed to build this gear. Believe it or not this gear is necessary to stay competitive in WvW.
As one who is routinely facemelted after no less than 30+ builds for WvW alone, I can tell you that ascended weapons/trinkets does indeed make a difference.
Fixed … because Ascended Armor stats do not make a difference.
I don’t think you recognize how this exclusive atmosphere is created unintentionally, even if you know it’s not ideal. I know a great number of people who simply avoid this subsection, because of the atmosphere. Devs are players too. They aren’t blind to what’s happening. I don’t blame them for not coming here.
The only reason this subforum seems toxic is because its become like a chatroom for a bunch of players that know each other. Its like a circle of people who have the same opinions and ideas. We get asked stupid questions and flamed and you wonder why things have gotten like this?
This exclusivity is part of the problem and it stems from the “play this way” ideals.
My posts aren’t trolling just because you don’t like my position on why this community doesn’t get the attention it demands. I want what you want. I just recognize the role that the community has in fostering a good relationship with the devs. This community doesn’t have a chance in hell.
The answer is: community as a whole needs to start acting ‘nicer’.
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The point is that the community plays a role in how the devs interact with it. This one simply doesn’t ‘play well’ with others. I would love for more dungeon discussion with the devs, but unfortunately, the community won’t allow this to happen.
Sorry, did I ruin another ‘discussion’?
This community is ‘ignored’ for obvious reasons. The game doesn’t cater to it’s most capable members. Second, a certain vocal population doesn’t respect anything outside it’s own vision of how to play.
I’d like to posit that no other section of the game is as screwed up as the dungeons.
That’s a community issue. People need to recognize what kind of audience this game caters to. You think devs are going to be more or less willing to work with a hostile community?
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You do realise the forum has only gotten like this because of the lack of developer interaction.
Other areas do not have dev interaction and aren’t like this at all. Players create their own environments through their own communication and language. Blaming the devs for the toxic air in this subforum is irresponsible.
Conceptually, Axe seems a little brutal for a Guardian.
Hopefully those new players, like yourself become ‘enlightened’ at some point and find what works for them for the content they want to do. Even if they are fed bad info by guildies, they might find that whatever build that leads them to satisfies their desires to play the game on their terms. That is more important than anything else.
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Honestly, a guide similar to this held me back for ~6 months.
I’m not going to argue about how you felt it held back but you learned much more about how you want to play by doing it the way you did instead of someone telling you how to play. That is a valuable experience, even if you think it was a bad one. Gaining your own insight on how YOU want to play is worth all the gold you had and then some.
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If your PUGing and you get someone with a build like this, that’s not the fault of the guy who makes a video on YouTube about it. I agree misinformation is bad but this is the internet. That’s why playing and testing gear ingame is the most valuable way to learn how to play.
stats gain is not CRap if you are FULLY ascended , even a 5% in damage increase AND more armor!! is decent for END game gear not to mention they also need to keep the game balance so making it TO GOOD would just break the rest of the game.
That true but we aren’t talking about FULL ascended, it’s about Silk, which is only necessary for ARMOR. Since the thread is about the ARMOR, then the context of my statement is correct … The stats gain on the ARMOR IS GARBAGE!
You may think the stat gain is garbage for Ascended armor, but it won’t stay that way. Only Ascended gear has infusion slots — I’m betting Anet will use infusion slots as the next vertical grind .. we’ll slowly see the stat ceiling increase on infusions, forcing people to go Ascended.
It doesn’t mean that everyone needs to go out and craft their Ascended armor RIGHT NOW when it’s the MOST expensive time to do it, which is my point. Furthermore, a stat ceiling increase on infusions will not force anyone to craft Ascended armor. Content that requires more AR than you can get from Ascended trinkets and Weapons will.
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Popular guides aren’t the problem; even if they are, it’s not a problem anyone can fix. This thread is just a bit of jovial. It’s certainly going to have no impact on directing people in a good direction. People that have potential to be good will figure it out pretty quickly what is effective and learn that the best approach isn’t someone telling them what is good. It’s learning for themselves what works.
IMO, if someone is looking at Youtube for advice, that’s already a bad start. There is nothing like practical application to give a player feedback.
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I’ve tried to build a burning guardian a few times since release and my biggest complaint is that they couple condition damage with precision……
I understand part of this sentiment. My biggest wish is to see the Duration and Damage stats swapped on Zeal/Radiance.
I also can’t advise any stats in Cond. Damage on gear though I have been toying with Celestial in WvW with the 2 second Passive VoJ duration … happy times.
My only problem with this is that someone will take it seriously and throw away a lot of gold.
Why do people like to MAKE things their problem? This is not your problem. If someone looks at that video and thinks “OMG, best Guard build EVAR!”, then they deserve to lose their gold for not doing more research, asking, etc …
Anyone that doesn’t have 100’s of G (in overall stuff) to show for playing in the last year doesn’t actually play enough to justify having a Legendary/Ascended, etc…
Furthermore, Anet never promise anything … in fact, NO MMO developer will promise anything. At least I’ve never seen it. Exactly for this fact … people QQ even when they don’t deliver on untimed plans. Imaging the mayhem if they PROMISED and didn’t deliver.
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You’re forgetting that cloth can only be obtained through bags and salvaging. Wood and ore are much more reliable to obtain.
You’re forgetting that you get bags from killing stuff (everyone does that) and wood/ore from farming, which involves killing stuff as well (not everyone does that)
Would had prefered if they didnt have introduced them with such unfair reasons.
The reasons are plenty fair, you just don’t understand them. Significant increases in stats every tier segregates the player base. This whole game revolves around a focus on getting people to play together, not little gangs.
The Ascended armor is perfect. Anet doesn’t want to game to be only for hardcore players and alienate casuals.
The Ascended armor its not perfect cause you see this as a casual player to get whatever you want in the easyway, so everything they put in game that requires effort to get you runaway thats why you want to defend your slacker opinion.
If you are serious, you’re going to have to actually explain yourself without making nonsense assumptions and insulting people that don’t agree with you:
If I understand you right, you say casual people don’t have a problem with the stats on Ascended gear … because they are slackers and run away from ‘something’? People that don’t want big increases in stats are actually advocating skill over gear; they aren’t running from anything … I would say if anyone is trying to hide or run, it’s someone trying to push for better stats on higher gear to make up for their own lack of playing skills.
If the design/cost/looks/purpose of this teir of armor don’t tell you what the intention of this armor is, then you have failed to understand what this game is about. You can argue what other MMO’s do, it’s not relevant.
Toroxous is 100% correct … this game wouldn’t EXIST with it’s present business model if it didn’t focus on what average players have time and motivation to do. Making ever increasing tier armor sets with significant stat increases is not inline with the approach of this game. You want gear to be a differentiator between players when it should be skill.
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What makes you think isn’t intentional?
That is lucky … i have 4 characters there, so I get 28 chances to get one a week. I get about 2-3 per week on average.
What makes you think it should?
You should be THANKING Anet that it’s worthless if you don’t need it because of the effort and cost involved to make it.
stats gain is not CRap if you are FULLY ascended , even a 5% in damage increase AND more armor!! is decent for END game gear not to mention they also need to keep the game balance so making it TO GOOD would just break the rest of the game.
That true but we aren’t talking about FULL ascended, it’s about Silk, which is only necessary for ARMOR. Since the thread is about the ARMOR, then the context of my statement is correct … The stats gain on the ARMOR IS GARBAGE!
as for FRACTALS they said that they will add more levels ( past 50) so chances are you WILL probably need the armor unless you plan on getting a kitten tones of 12 AR infusions at what 200gold a pop? (witch would cost you more then armor with out getting the armor and stats bonus)
If you NEED the armor, then it’s only because you CHOOSE to do fractals beyond a certain level. That’s your choice and therefore you aren’t forced to craft. Only a very limited amount of PVE content in this game requires you to have SOME Ascended armor, even less of that content requires FULL ascended setup.
The number of people ‘being forced’ to craft right now is guaranteed to be a heck of alot more than the number of people who actually NEED Ascended armor for PVE content. Therefore, … people shouldn’t really be complaining about the supply; they are crafting something that has 1) A very small impact on their build and 2) something they are likely to not actually need RIGHT NOW.
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Your not forced to craft anything unless you feel you NEED Ascended armor.
I can’t imagine any real player is actually selling this stuff because
1. You can’t farm it. and
2. There is a better profit in selling bolts of Damask. because
3. Most players still don’t have their first set of Ascended armor. and lastly…
4. There isn’t much salvagable material left on the TP either.
I’m a real player and I sell every scrap of silk I can find:
1. You can farm it (I know what you mean …. )
2. Their might be better PROFIT but the ROI is lower (I don’t need to get armorsmithing to sell silk)
3. … and most players don’t need Ascended armor .. the stats gain is crap, I have enough AR to do fractals without it.
4. Maybe, but that’s the point of how people make money with farming.
UGH … someone got bored or a new mic I think.
“You can’t tell me these stats AREN’T amazing!”
Sorry man, you’re at the mercy of people buying gems with and for gold on that one. Furthermore, once you buy the gems, Anet probably really doesn’t care if you spend them or trade them for gold.
Skelks in Southsun. Gives fangs too.
The core reason AH is inferior in pve is because you’re sacrificing too much team support and dps in favor of heals for yourself. Dps and damage mitigation are the 2 most important aspects of fast, smooth dungeon runs, the meta supplies this far better than the AH build.
Here is the problem. The thread isn’t actually about how superior something else is over AH … it’s just that certain people turn these threads INTO that discussion because they have an agenda to push.
OP wants to know if that combo is viable … AH+EM is a good combo if you want to run AH. In fact, What other combo with AH would be better than this? THAT’S what the discussion should be here.
Oh yeah, playing ‘properly’ and ‘correctly’ … You would almost think that if this was a real thing, it would come from Anet, not players.
Fun is part of the argument because what you value isn’t the same thing as what other people do.
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Is this for PvP or PvE? You’re using the PvP editor so I assume it’s that. I can’t really critique for sPvP, I don’t usually run burning there.
A burning build doesn’t work in spvp either, its easily cleansed.
It does if you apply it every 2 seconds.
That’s the right attitude because frankly, Anet doesn’t want your gold, they want your money. If the system is done ‘wrong’ for people that want to use gold, I hope it stays that way. I would rather not pay a monthly subscription fee just because people want cheap stuff off the gemstore. I don’t feel like subsidizing players’ sense of entitlement.
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You’re assuming alot about the ‘original armor design’. How do people not figure it’s being respected if you don’t know what the original armor design is or how Anet figures it out in the first place.