Guild Wars 2

Manuhell.2759:

Phineas Poe.3018:

I’d say you’re significantly oversimplifying things, but you’d probably just argue about that too, anyway. If you got a bone to pick about how the Static Discharge build is played then that’s an issue you gotta iron out yourself. Point is, the build exists.

Oh, so a single build that doesn’t use kits despite all i’ve said before and doing it only because it fully depends on toolbelt recharge times and not in the utilities themselves means all is fine and well, oh silly me.

Yes. Silly you.

Condi Duration is definitely the best method to beating Liadri. I kept getting her down to 5% or less in Berserker gear and running out of time. Ate a Koi Cake and donned my Rabid gear (Lich/Mad King/Lyssa) and facerolled her easily. Can be easily kept at range between Freeze Grenade and Box of Nails. Use Rocket Boots when you’re out of Endurance or Crippled.

Grenade Kit, Tool Kit, Rocket Boots.

Mathrin.3590:

80 views and nothing? Am I really to believe there does not exist a single build viable in dungeons or fractals?

With all due respect, this is a question that is asked every day. The threads are there. I understand that the search feature on this forum is broken, but you would find your answer looking back even just a couple pages through the Engineer folder history.

My build is in my signature.

Manuhell.2759:

Phineas Poe.3018:

I don’t understand how this refutes anything that I said.

Static Discharge is a viable build that requires zero kits to be effective.

A single build out of everything else. And whose whole mechanic is “get the toolbelt skills with the fastest recharge and spam all of them together”. Heh, the utilities themselves don’t even matter at all, you even slot a turret to never use it, basically – cause the toolbelt is all that matters.

I’d say you’re significantly oversimplifying things, but you’d probably just argue about that too, anyway. If you got a bone to pick about how the Static Discharge build is played then that’s an issue you gotta iron out yourself. Point is, the build exists.

Manuhell.2759:

A single (grandmaster traited) kit doesn’t give us the same long-range capabilities of the ranger.

I’m pretty sure it does, actually. Unless you’ve come across a different definition for “long range,” I’m pretty sure the Grenade Kit is equal to the Ranger Longbow in shot yardage, and isn’t tethered to shooting from 1000+ range for maximum damage, either.

Manuhell.2759:

Phineas Poe.3018:

And yet Static Discharge is one of the highest damage builds across all classes in the game and uses zero kits.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-December-14-2012/999247
Third post, Class balance philosophies

Engineer
The Engineer is a highly versatile class. While it doesn’t have the long range capabilities of the Ranger, or the melee capabilities of the Warrior or Guardian, they are comfortable at medium ranges in most fights. They have a lot of control, and use their boons to keep themselves (and allies) alive in a fight. They can use different kits based on the situation, but this extreme versatility comes at a cost in damage on their main hand weapons.

I would suppose devs know how they balance more than you.
So, yeah, we are hurting ourself if we aren’t using kits – it is clearly written there we are paying a price anyway.

I don’t understand how this refutes anything that I said.

Static Discharge is a viable build that requires zero kits to be effective.

Just because their write-up on how they envision the Engineer says otherwise doesn’t change that fact. And Engineers do have the long-range capabilities of the Ranger with the Grenade Kit, so I question taking this paragraph as gospel in the first place.

FreekPalmer.2839:

It’s the only fully gated set of gear. If all gear was this way it would be acceptable.

I think you’re looking at it wrong. Celestial is just a preview of how future content will be handled. They’ve said as much about how they’ll be releasing Ascended armor—that it will be craftable, but that tier 7 material acquisition will be gated.

This all being said, Charged Quartz are ridiculously easy to obtain. Even after the event is over, Quartz is only a little over a gold per stack. It’s actually cheaper to craft Celestial gear than it is buying Powerful Blood to craft Berserker gear.

Well, keep in mind you need Huntsman for the pistol recipe.

Ale.3280:

-they should consider that engineer it the less played class

People always say this, but I question how much of it is true.

Engineers are everywhere in PvP.

I also personally feel like Necromancers and Rangers are the least played classes in PvE, but that’s all a matter of perspective.

FreekPalmer.2839:

Now, add accessories, rings and amulet. 5 days per piece x 5 = 25 days add that to your 40 days we are at 65 days. 2 months of logging in everyday, most people will miss a couple of days and the odd slip up of that awkward thing called life. you are looking at 2 months if you get every day. or closer to 3 months if you have other commitments.

It would actually be faster just getting Ascended Celestial trinkets.

You could get both accessories in 4 weeks if you’re in a guild that has all missions unlocked. You could get both rings in 20 days or less, depending on how many 10+ Fractal tiers you have available across all characters. You could get your amulet in 30 days or less either through laurels or laurels + badges.

You could do all of this alongside compiling your armor and weapons, meaning you could have full Celestial gear in 40 days.

People complained that (1) gear is too easy to get in GW2 and (2) crafting is largely pointless in PvE aside from speed leveling. ArenaNet in one patch rectified both of these problems, and people complain about it anyway. Just goes to show you cannot satisfy everybody regardless of what you do.

I personally think the Engineer is fine. Turrets are weak. We lack reliable means of Stability. We have no melee weapons except the Tool Kit, which is not a weapon but a utility skill.

I agree with you on all of these points, but I could easily make a list just as long about why the Warrior relies on Guardians to be the oh-so-amazing DPS people cite on the forums while Engineers can stand back at 1500 range with top-tier condi removal and sustainability at the same time. Or about how Guardians have to sink points into several traits to get what Engineers have in Super Elixir spending zero.

The Engineer has access to every single combo finisher and the most combo fields of any class in the game. We have ranged DPS equal to Rangers (if not better). Our Bomb Kit does damage close to the Warrior Axe while stacking more Vulnerability, having access to a Fire field, a Smoke field, and an AoE Immobilization.

I refuse to believe that ArenaNet dislikes Engineers in any way, because the amount of work they put into our kits is unbelievable compared to the simplicity of other classes.

If concerned about sustainability, I would stay away from elixirs. Go with the Elixir Gun.

I would also stay away from the Healing Turret, as that is better for group support than self-sustainability. The Med Kit is far better at that with Drop Bandages along with Bandage Self, the latter of which scales by Healing Power far better than the Healing Turret does.

Mord.9237:

Sounds perfectly well thought out. That was my worry with another build posted on these forums that used soldier/knights gear! That the damage output wouldn’t be enough and that it would essentially become a slap fight where neither of us could down each other! So I like your reasoning behind celestial! My only concern is that I’m not a fan of pve so how will I go about getting celestial trinkets? Also curious about how amazing your healing power with all the healing abilities/light fields/water fields you can throw out! I picture it all in a 1v2 or even 1v3 situation and I think it’d be amazing! What’s your input? Also how often do you solo roam and what’s your experience in 1v1 or 1vX situations with this build? I’m very curious!!

Thanks in advance Phineas!

You can buy Celestial jewelry with laurels and badges. A little bit longer than doing Fractals, but it is possible. The armor and weapons will be the harder part. You need to craft them yourself because they are account bound when created. You must have 400 crafting of that particular discipline to make them, as well.

If this isn’t possible for you, I would look at just mixing and matching armor insignias, though you don’t get overall as many stats as Celestial doing it that way. Or just sticking with Soldier.

As for 1v1 in WvW, I handle most classes pretty handily. Rangers are the only ones that regularly give me trouble right now.

At first I was incredibly skeptical of Celestial. I thought that Soldier was still best for zergs, because stacking as much survivability as possible is best for those situations. And I think that is still partially true … but the second you go out roaming, Soldier really rears its ugly head.

Bunkering is kind of pointless when roaming in WvW, because the objective isn’t just to outlast NPCs/other players—you have to kill them to capture points or stay alive. And Flame Jet’s mediocre damage just becomes terribad in Soldier. I would end up just prolonging fights and creating a slow death for myself because I could never kill anybody. My best offense was simply to Air Blast people off ledges (which is still quite funny when it works) or pray they were dumb enough to just stand around in Acid Bomb’s pulse AoE.

As for my success with it, I wouldn’t come on here and advertise a build I thought only worked for myself; I think anyone could genuinely pick up this build and wield it effectively. I wouldn’t go charging in solo to a zerg of 20+ Blackgate, but it has served me well when small-group roaming with my guild in tier one match-ups, and whenever we hitch a ride with a zerg.

This is precisely what I run right now, but it’s a work in progress. I’m working toward full Celestial, with the relevant WvW infusions. Soldier is just a placeholder until I get the Pristine Fractal Relics for the rings (though the new patch has been a distraction), and the Charged Quartz for the Pistol and Shield.

This is a build better for roaming, but you could take it into zergs and survive OK. If you’re afraid of a little Retaliation, drop Juggernaut for Coated Bullets and stand back with the Pistol/Shield, using Fumigate for condi removal and Super Elixir with Magnetic Inversion for a little Area Retaliation of your own.

Manuhell.2759:

An engineer has got a single weapon slot and a reduced dps on the main weapon whether he uses kits or not, thus he’s actually hurting himself if he doesn’t use kits.

And yet Static Discharge is one of the highest damage builds across all classes in the game and uses zero kits.

It’s much better burning the Fractal Relics which you’re going to compile a lot of, anyway, than trying to farm gold for 250 Powerful Blood for the Book of Secrets. Ectos are really easy to get these days, too, through world events. Just salvage all the rares you get.

Only reason Book of Secrets is in the build is because Fractal Capacitors aren’t an option for some reason.

Haha, wow. I just changed that this morning. Good eye.

If you’re wealthy it’s still a suitable option, especially now that T6 drops like crazy in the QJ Living Story event (and likely everywhere from champions).

But for the average player, if you’re just looking to stack 45 AR, the simple infusions are fine.

The main reason why I adjusted it is because I’m dropping Gold Find out of my build. Now that champions no longer drop money, but instead drop bags that give money instead, it’s not worth using anymore. Gold Find only affects gold directly dropped, and not gold obtained through Bags of Coins or other opened containers.

If you’re looking for a good utility buff, Karmic Infusion might be worth it, but I just slotted +5 AR anyway.

ButterOfDeath.2873:

So here’s my question: Has the engineer been nerfed in PvE or something like that?

Did you try running Static Discharge with the Rifle?

It’s a very effective low level build. Kits don’t get stronger until later, when more traits are available.

It’s useful when stacking, yes.

I happen to just let Acid Bomb do its things these days, as I often use it Napalm, and then Rocket Boot back in for a second Blast finisher.

Nevets Crimsonwing.5271:

Anyone have an idea of which t3 boss to beat with 5 gambits? I thought maybe the sniper, but our wall doesn’t block his snipe.

It doesn’t but I’d still take him over others. Use Magnet to pull him to you early on and just burst him down as best you can. Toss Elixir U doesn’t work with it, but it can be avoided with Elixir S.

I got her to less than 5% and died.

I notice that the second phase AoE rotates around the room (after she’s vulnerable).

Since it’s ranged, Grenade Kit is best. I’ve been using Tool Kit to Magnet the adds to save time. Rocket Boots as third utility.

Yeah. I got through it after a couple more tries.

Now I’m stuck on the final fight. So maddening!

I’m stuck on Strugar. Very aggravating.

When I’m not concerned about collecting badges, I usually just focus on spamming Fumigate, Super Elixir, and the Healing Turret as much as possible for mass condition removal.

Manuhell.2759:

Phineas Poe.3018:

You’re supposed to be getting Protection from Guardians, anyway, which is why people bring them in the first place. If there’s only one Guard in the group, they should be using the Hammer with Writ of Persistence. This is like Dungeon Running 101.

Oh, didn’t know that they were mandatory in a party. I still thought we were supposed to play as we want, no trinity, no fixed roles, such things. Oh silly me.
So we are fine in that regard cause someone else can give us protection, seems logical.
I suppose that if they remove healing altogether from the guardians they’ll be fine as well, they can use my medkits for healing themselves after all.

Anyone who has a Fractal ever once in their life knows how integral Guardians are to a comfortable run. They aren’t required, of course. I’ve run more than my share of dungeons and fractals without my Guardian, and with no other Guardians in the group. But you cannot seriously deny that a Guardian’s abundant access to defensive boons/buffs like Wall of Reflection, Shield of the Avenger, Stand Your Ground, Hold The Line, Retreat, Tome of Courage, etc. etc. etc. don’t play into the meta or why Guardians are one of the most sought-after classes in every facet of the game.

Not my fault that ArenaNet went back on their word, but at least this game doesn’t have dedicated healers, which is enough for me.

Manuhell.2759:

Phineas Poe.3018:

And what am I optimistic about? I’m simply being realistic.

The Engineer doesn’t need heavy armor, and the only assertions that indicate that we “need” it only cite the wiki saying that at one point in time in the Engineer’s development it once had it.

I don’t see how this makes me the optimist so much as you the pessimist. I’m enjoying the game, enjoying the class, and enjoying my build. You can sit here and wallow in self-pity about how we don’t have everything every other class has if you want, but I’m not. And I don’t see how I’m somehow at fault for that.

Oh, i don’t exactly hide that i’m quite a pessimist, but i don’t see that as a problem; rather, i’m just better at pointing out the flaws in the class, cause i also take in account the worst cases instead on focusing only on when they can work well -something you do, and that isn’t realistic at all.
Because the best case rarely happens, if never (like with the supposed perma-protection with protection injection, whose uptime is based on being disabled every 5 seconds to be able to maintain it).
Also, whereas i argument about flaws and inconsistencies, you either skip them or reply just to parts of them to make them seem flawed – like with the grenades above, or all the parts regarding flamethrower and juggernaut. Or the whole comparison to the baseline defensive compartment of the medium classes.

It seems that more than really argument, you just want to force your point, avoiding any discussion or part of it that proves you wrong. You are free to do that, but i will rather bail-out. I won’t spend my time by writing walls of text that will be ignored for the most part.

I “skipped” those elements because last I checked this thread was about the Engineer being a medium armor class—and that it should be a heavy. Your “flaws and inconsistencies” are noted, but I don’t believe there’s any written rule that I have to read and respond to every single point you make, especially when they come with warning labels, where you even admit to writing “walls of text.”

I believe there is no rule, either, that I have to take anything you say under advisement, or that I should really care whether you think I am “wrong” or not. If you think I am: OK. Congratulations. You’re allowed to have your opinion.

My loyalties to the Flamethrower are pretty obvious, though I don’t think I’ve ever been nebulous about my reasons. I have taken considerable time out of my life begrudgingly dealing with every complaint about it, trying to re-think the community’s perspective on the kit, putting a lot of effort into authoring a Guru thread and creating a guide to be the most comprehensive regarding the kit. I’m not sure how much I have succeeded in this endeavor, but I can say I’ve rarely “avoided” discussion on that matter so much as put myself in the middle of it.

Most importantly: I’m not “forcing” anything on you. You responded to me in a post that was addressed to someone else. If you dislike the way in which I approach your posts, then you’re free to not quote and respond to messages that were originally written for someone else.

Manuhell.2759:

One that consistently hits at that range, seeing as we’ve got to specifically trait for it.
Guess i’ll simply repost that entire paragraph, cause you’re willfully ignoring the other parts:

Manuhell.2759:

[…]grenades are our only 1500 range weapon and it needs an heavy investment to even do so, and if even then you can’t reliably hit nicely at that range, then it isn’t that useful as far as a long-range weapon go.

I’m sorry, but this thread is not about the Grenade Kit or how much you hate it. If you want to continue talking about this, then we’ll take it to another thread.

Manuhell.2759:

Phineas Poe.3018:

Warriors don’t have reliable and active means of getting Protection either, and I stand in melee for 99% of PvE with full Berserker gear on mine. And he doesn’t have permanent Vigor like my Engineer does, so the armor and HP differential balances out.

But neither they need to stay close to the enemy all the time to sustain their dps – they’ve got burst damage. Unlike us.
And even then they’ve still got better armor and hp.
Also they’ve still got means to get that vigor (the warhorn is a fine example: even untraited and without boon duration it gives 50% uptime to both him and allies). Obviously you’ve got to give up something else – we’ve got to spend 20 points for that vigor for example – but the choice is there.

Actually, a Warrior DOES need to stay close to the enemy all the time to sustain their DPS. They don’t have a 4000+ DPS weapon that has 1500 range like we do.

People always moan about how much armor and health Warriors have, but they very rarely ever take the moment to recognize that the Warrior has some of the worst sustain of all classes in the game. They pretty much have nothing to keep themselves alive except for their healing skill, which are totally outclassed by pretty much every option Engineers have, who can additionally take their Elixir Gun and can self-revive themselves with Toss Elixir R, never mind the fact that we have access to Water fields and several Blast finishers in pretty much any build construction.

And let’s think more clearly about your situation. A Warrior has to bring his Warhorn to get 50% upkeep of Vigor. An Engineer just has to crit with anything or swap to a kit to get 100% upkeep of Vigor.

Explain to me how we’re the worse off here? If you don’t like using kits, or if you cannot handle speccing 20 points into two trees pretty much every Engi build under the sun utilizes, then I cannot help you. As someone that has both classes to 80 and plays them each frequently, I will say 10 times out of 10 that the Engineer has it easier getting Vigor. I don’t even have to think about it. I just have it all the time, similar to my Guardian.

Manuhell.2759:

Phineas Poe.3018:

My Flamethrower has 425 range, but I usually stand at 100 or so, so that I can immediately swap out to my Rifle, Blunderbuss, and swap back for maximum damage potential.

Feel free to do that, it could also work wonders. But i also explained why the juggernaut trait is inconsistent with this use, even if you didn’t reply at that specific paragraph.

I didn’t reply to it because I already told you: If you want to discuss the finer details of things like Juggernaut and the Flamethrower, I would be happy to—in the proper thread. This is not a thread about your issues with the Flamethrower any more than it is about your problems with the Grenade Kit.

Manuhell.2759:

Also, you are seriously belittling the drawbacks of our kits – grenades are our only 1500 range weapon.

Exactly how many 1500 range weapons do we need? Do you understand how rare that is? Rangers have to trait for it too. Eagle Eye is a 20-point trait in the Marksmanship tree, though it’s obviously not as powerful as Grenadier is, anyway.

Manuhell.2759:

And while the bombs delay is a small issue in PvE, staying at melee range versus bosses to sustain that damage – we have no burst damage with them after all – isn’t exactly beneficial for our health (especially since we lack reliable and active means of getting protection (and the reactive ones don’t really work in PvE; also, we shouldn’t spend all the traits just to make up for the drawbacks – again, it hampers with our supposed versatility).

Warriors don’t have reliable and active means of getting Protection either, and I stand in melee for 99% of PvE with full Berserker gear on mine. And he doesn’t have permanent Vigor like my Engineer does, so the armor and HP differential balances out.

My Flamethrower has 425 range, but I usually stand at 100 or so, so that I can immediately swap out to my Rifle, Blunderbuss, and swap back for maximum damage potential.

You’re supposed to be getting Protection from Guardians, anyway, which is why people bring them in the first place. If there’s only one Guard in the group, they should be using the Hammer with Writ of Persistence. This is like Dungeon Running 101.

Manuhell.2759:

Imho, you’re far too optimistic regarding the class and see us with rose-tinted glasses, to speak frankly.

And what am I optimistic about? I’m simply being realistic.

The Engineer doesn’t need heavy armor, and the only assertions that indicate that we “need” it only cite the wiki saying that at one point in time in the Engineer’s development it once had it.

I don’t see how this makes me the optimist so much as you the pessimist. I’m enjoying the game, enjoying the class, and enjoying my build. You can sit here and wallow in self-pity about how we don’t have everything every other class has if you want, but I’m not. And I don’t see how I’m somehow at fault for that.

Manuhell.2759:

Maybe he doesn’t love kits or swapping them every 5 seconds. We shouldn’t be forced into using kits altogether, after all (despite being penalized by default for something that isn’t even the class mechanic).

Then use Infused Precision.

Also: How are kits not our class mechanic? No other class has them, and they’re easily the most recognizable aspect of the Engineer compared to other classes.

Arkham Creed.7358:

Phineas Poe.3018:

They do work properly.

Clearly you’ve not seen that bug that causes back skins to glitch through whatever kit you have equipped. Been around since beta, and there still hasn’t even been a mention of it, let alone a fix. Engineer kit cosmetics do not work properly, and they never have.

Clearly I have.

Phineas Poe.3018:

They do work properly.

They just get overridden by Engineer kits.

Arkham Creed.7358:

Maybe it is only me here, but I feel like when you have a cosmetic driven game like Guild Wars 2 you should probably make sure the cosmetic items already in the game work properly before you add more stuff that you’ll just have to fix later.

They do work properly.

They just get overridden by Engineer kits. This is a minor cosmetic problem that affects a very small population of the game.

It will get fixed in time, but like I said—and Colin Johanson in his post you claimed he “lied” in—they have more important matters to work on. And part of that is maintaining an income level to support the game’s development, which is why they’re releasing gem store items.

Arkham Creed.7358:

It certainly is interesting to see how many posts we’ve actually gotten, though our total is still miles behind that of the ranger and the necromancer. So, in keeping with my thread invasion idea, I saw we start post bombing in the ranger forum. I get that we’re not actually being ignored in our entirety, but that doesn’t change the fact that some of the biggest issues the engineer community have are being ignored.

While I am pleased to see the kit issue –a personal concern of mine- getting a few posts addressing it, I still feel that we could get more open and honest feedback about it. I’ll come right out and say it, since tip-toeing around the issue has never yielded results; Colin Johanson lied in his post. I realize that is pretty inflammatory, but it is apparently what went down. The man is one of the biggest authorities on the development side of Guild Wars 2, so you can’t honestly expect me to believe that he just didn’t know that his claim of the team focusing more on tech and quality of life issues than cosmetic ones was a load of crap. Just look at all the cosmetic stuff added to the game since he made that claim and you can tell that is the case.

Not that I believe Colin Johanson needs anyone to defend him, but the suggestion that he “lied” because of the addition of new armor sets to the Gem Store is kind of ridiculous.

They rolled out with the largest balance patch to-date a little over a month ago, encouraging me to strip away 25 points from where I used to use them and now conveniently place them in Tools. And now this Tuesday they are completely revising the loot table of all Champion mobs, giving them better drops, including some unique skins. They’ve additionally just recently rolled out the new achievement reward system, which really changes how a lot of people treat and view achievements. They’re also completely revamping the dungeon system, reworking how rewards are doled out at the end of each path. And there’s the Account Wallet, which is probably the next patch’s biggest feature (aside from content), freeing up an entire tab of my bank that was once loaded up with Badges of Honor, dungeon tokens, and Fractal Relics—and no longer making me buy up Orrian Treasure Boxes to try and transfer karma between characters.

They’ve definitely been putting their nose to the grindstone improving the game the past three months or so—the game is markedly different. So excuse me if I roll my eyes at the assertion that CJ is deceptively pulling the wool over everyone’s eyes just because ANet additionally wants to create some more revenue by releasing new skins that actually look very good on Engineers.

ANet has been hard at work at a lot of stuff that has global ramifications to the way the game operates; local issues like the Engineer kits being hidden will be addressed in time, but I think we all know that ANet has bigger fish to fry. Would you rather we see the end of PvE culling, or hiding your kit backpack first? Really now.

Like The Gates Assassin posted above, I think you guys need to chill out and re-think your priorities here.

I think we’re the only class next to Warrior that has one interrupt and then must lay there and take the stomp. If our #3 skill was a little shorter, so that we had a second interrupt, I’d be happier with what we have.

Most classes, after all, have a second interrupt up their sleeve if they pull off the first one, even in time of using their #2 skill immediately.

Adamantium.3682:

Not sure it’s something I would want to do, but it is a type of build that would use every stat which is the only thing I would consider using Celestial stats.

100% agreed, but I think I’ve found a way to make it work with my FT/EG in WvW.

The key detail isn’t that Celestial levels out all your stats. It’s that it’s the only insignia in the game that offers both Condition Damage and Critical Damage. If you can utilize a build that uses both—Condi through Bleeding/Burning, and Critical through direct damage—you may find your DPS loss to be negligible with Celestial, never mind the slight increase in survivability with Healing Power, Toughness, and Vitality directly added into your build.

A full Celestial set shaves a few Critical Damage percentage points off—5%, in total. The bigger question is, can your build utilize other stats in a way to fully offset the loss in 573 Power?

When looking at my own Flamethrower, I noticed that the additional Condition Damage in my build—686 in total—would contribute about 170 damage to my burns, rounding them out to deal around 500 damage per second with no Might stacks.

At least for the Flamethrower, you’re about 30% less effective in DPS wearing Celestial gear versus Berserker in direct damage, but your burns (and by extension bleeds through Sharpshooter) are much more effective at the same time. I’d say on paper it pretty much balances out, and my experiences with Celestial gear thus far have supported that assumption.

In zergs I would still recommend full Soldier, but when roaming, try out Celestial and see if it fits your build.

Manuhell, you wrote a lot here. I’m not going to respond to everything, but I will address (what I think to be) the larger points of your argument.

Manuhell.2759:

And both of them have got drawbacks – bombs’ delay/small base radius and grenades’ accuracy on ranged attacks, for example (also, speccing for grenades is basically needed, they’re so bad otherwise). Also, the autoattack is the only power-based attack for both of them – the direct damage on the other skills is negligible, they basically only do conditions.

I disagree completely.

The Bomb Kit’s “small” radius is not a drawback. It’s a strength, given that it’s an AoE while pretty much every other weapon in the game is either single target, piercing, or cleave.

While what you said about direct damage may be true about the Bomb Kit, that definitely is not true about the Grenade Kit. Shrapnel Grenade and Freeze Grenade do significantly more direct damage than Grenade (#1) does on the Grenade Kit.

Manuhell.2759:

how comes every single time i make a critique about the terrible flamethrower autoattack i get told that we aren’t supposed to use it – even if the juggernaut trait is supposed to make us stay in that kit to both maintain and use the bonuses – but it is fine for grenades and bombs instead, who haven’t got similar bonuses?

When people say “you’re not supposed to use Flame Jet,” what they’re really saying is “you’re not supposed to rely on Flame Jet as your primary DPS.” Between maintaining Might stacks with Napalm, triggering Acid Bomb every 12 seconds, and dropping Healing Turret, Elixir R, Elixir U, or whatever for your group, you’re not really going to be standing there spamming Flame Jet very often versus triggering two Flame Blasts between every Blunderbuss with your Rifle.

Compared to a kit like the Bomb Kit, which, like you said, doesn’t do a whole lot of damage around its auto-attack, an FT (and EG) Engineer has many different skills to rotate instead. People tell you that Flame Jet isn’t that great because with the FT/EG build you’re dishing out 2500+ DPS before even taking Flame Jet into consideration thanks to Acid Bomb and Flame Blast. And that’s a conservative estimate.

I’ve been pretty clear on this point for several months now; if you’re still confused, you’re welcome to discuss it with me in the appropriate thread. There are several.

Manuhell.2759:

Our CC skills can’t do anything versus enemies with defiant, whileas evades and blinds would still work.

Rifle Engineers can blind their targets every ten seconds, and can blind them again when struck by a melee attack. Never mind the fact that we have access to a three Smoke Fields between Smoke Bomb, Smoke Screen (Flame Turret), and Toss Elixir U.

And then there’s Smoke Vent and Flash Grenade.

But why does this comparison matter, anyway? We are one of the best bunker classes in the game, so we clearly don’t need more evades. And we obviously don’t need heavy armor either.

OP dislikes kits, dislikes medium armor, feels abandoned—I think he’s better off just re-rolling a different class. And I think you need to take a few moments and re-examine our capabilities before replying to this post. Because we have no need for any built-in evades, we blind just as good as any other class, and the Bomb Kit and Grenade Kit both have very little if any drawbacks. They’re just a play style different from yours.

Anymras.5729:

I can’t deny that it would take a lot of development time, but I also don’t think that’s necessarily a bad thing. After all, part of the idea for how to implement it was “announce it months in advance” so people can get used to the idea and prepare for it, even people who don’t have a lot of time on their hands.

You’re talking about a developer that took nearly 9 months to fix Scope and to-date still hasn’t figured out a method to hiding Engineer kit backpacks.

Not that I think it’s due to a lack of caring, but the ArenaNet team is obviously stretched thin and is focused on other projects; they have bigger fish to fry. It’s not that them spending time adjusting the class is “necessarily a bad thing,” it’s that the changes you propose versus time investment don’t seem to carry significant payoff.

I just completely abhor your framing of the entire situation.

Anymras.5729:

1: Move the Engineer to Heavy Armor from Medium. Why:

• If this were to be done, it would allow the Dervish to be added as a Medium-armor class without disrupting the grid.
• There would be a class with high Condition capabilities in each tier of armor.
• Several traits would make more sense, such as the ones that give you bonuses for not dodging or moving.
• The Engineer would become the complete antithesis of the Elementalist – instead of squishy, high-damage wizard with more weapon skills than anyone else, a highly durable, but low-damage, tech-based (to the complete exclusion of magic excluding alchemy) class with more Utility skills available at any one time than anyone else.

1. There’s nothing that suggests there must be a heavy armor class that has high condition capability.

2. Enduring Damage, a trait that gives you a 10% increase in damage with full Endurance, is actually named and operates exactly the same as an Elementalist trait in the Earth tree.

3. Engineers are not “low damage.” The Bomb Kit has one of the hardest hitting auto-attacks in the game, and the Grenade Kit has some of the best sustained DPS through a mixture of both conditions and direct damage.

For PvE or WvW?

Elixir S is too defensive in my mind for PvE. If you want an on-demand stunbreaker, just run Elixir U, which has an additional projectile wall in its toolbelt form.

For WvW, Rocket Boots just offer too much mobility to pass up.

That’s actually why I put 15 in Inventions for AMR, haha.

I run the Healing Turret in WvW, so that may be why.

Okay, cool.

I recommend ignoring Explosives entirely, then, if you’re planning to use the Flamethrower. Sink all of your points into Alchemy and Firearms. Take Invigorating Speed in Alchemy and Infused Precision in Firearms to start. This will give you permanent Vigor and Swiftness, meaning you can dodge a lot more and are more mobile.

Once you have 10 points in both those trees, put 10 into Tools for Speedy Kits, giving your permanent Swiftness in the open world. You can then drop Infused Precision for Fireforged Trigger, improving the cooldowns on your FT skills, or Hair Trigger, improving the cooldowns on your weapon skills.

I also prefer the Rifle when soloing. Jump Shot + Blunderbuss is a ton of damage. Rotating them in between Flame Blasts from your Flamethrower is pretty potent stuff.

In PvE I run the FT/EG with 0/25/0/20/25. Full Zerker. More info in my signature.

In WvW I run the FT/EG with 0/25/15/20/10. Mostly Celestial and Soldier armor these days.

Lack of specialization.

I recommend going all Power or all Condition Damage and not both. I think it’s also important to ask what kits you’re using, because the Pistol/Shield on its own is not enough damage.

tencoderiot.6430:

@Phineas Poe One last question; can you explain your trinket setup for ascended and why you went with those choices? Would it be okay if with all 6 trinkets I went with + precision instead of the gold one? Or is the gold infusion worth losing the extra precision?

Yeah, I would definitely go for a utility amulet over an offensive/defensive amulet.

If not Gold Find, taking Magic Find or Karma Boost is well worth it over a gain of 5 Precision, which is less than a .25% increase in critical hit chance.

Like I said before, if you’re doing high end fractals you’ll want the additional Agony Resistance, but for most everything, a utility infusion is “best in slot.”

Weapon Skills: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5
Healing Skill: Q
Utility Skills: E, R, T
Elite Skill: X

I’m not into the whole Shift + 1 thing.

Any time.

/15char

The Engineer is actually the only class in the entire game that utilizes PvE’s three strongest combo fields: Fire, Water, and Light. The Engineer actually has access to six of the nine total Combo Fields—more than any other class in the game.

The Engineer also has regular access to 3 of the 4 Combo finishers in the game (Elixir X is a Whirl finisher but I digress), meaning we’re the most versatile combo class in the game. And they’re not just toolbelt skills. Magnetic Inversion is a Blast finisher. Static Shield is a Projectile finisher. Jump Shot is a Leap finisher. Etc. Etc. Etc.

Get a little more experience with the class before you jump to conclusions. Engineer is one of the best boon battery classes in the game, and a lot of that comes from its versatility with combo fields.

Yes, because they’re Agony Resistance plus Precision.

20 Precision moves your Critical Hit Chance only about 1% though, so I wouldn’t worry about it if you’re working on a legendary or something.

tencoderiot.6430:

I thought you only had to be personal level 10 to get Pristine Relics? Would Exquisite Ruby be best for the slots if I got an exotic version?

You only have to be Personal Level 10 to get Pristine Relics, but if you do Fractals 18 and Fractal 28 in the same day, that’s two daily chests—one for each tier. There’s not really much reason to go beyond that at that point, unless you really care that much about Fractal weapon skins, or if you’re just seeking a larger challenge.

tencoderiot.6430:

I am curious to know why you went with the choices for infusions on the ascended gear. Is the extra gold bonus worth not getting an offensive or defensive slot for your amulet?

Honestly, Simple Versatile Infusions are just fine. I just picked the Precise ones just as a goal you should work toward. That was kind of just a moment in my ITM build where I was just slotting things in as whatever. Obviously when you get into higher tier Fractals you will want to wear Infused Ascended stuff for extra Agony Resistance.

There are exotic Berserker rings. I just don’t recommend buying them because you’re just going to replace them in a month. Only invest gold in something you see having long-term use, especially since there are some big expenses for other things, like the new Aetherized weapons.

You can get 10 Fractal Relics for a ring in a few days once you’re at Personal Level 20-30, especially if you have multiple characters.

Unless you’re just strapped for karma, then I guess you can burn the gold.

You could just get Cavalier stuff (Power/Toughness/Critical Damage) from the Temple of Balthazar karma vendor. 42,000 a piece.

tencoderiot.6430:

@PhineasPoe.3018 Do you think there’s a build that can use Rabid that is similar to mine? I’d love to try your build but the logistics of transferring to Berserker from Rabid is probably going to be more gold than I can spare.

With all due respect, this is a move you should make sooner than later, because Rabid is not a very good insignia in PvE for reasons I’ve already mentioned.

Remember that you can run dungeons to get your Berserker gear. CoF, CoE, and Arah all offer Berserker insignia armor and weapons. You will have to spend zero money compiling this.

You can get your Ascended rings through Fractals, your Ascended accessories through Guild Missions, and your Ascended amulet from laurels.

ANet has structured most of the end-game content to where you can get what you need without spending much in the way of gold.

tencoderiot.6430:

Is Poe’s build valid in WvW?

Not really.

I mean, you could take it to WvW and probably kill people with it, but 25 Tools is not really an optimal distribution. Stuff like Protective Shield and Cloaking Device are also pretty much mandatory when using the FT in WvW, whether roaming or zerging.

1. Try running CoF to get your Berserker gear. If you can go with guildies that won’t discriminate you over your gear, that would be optimal.

2. What did you pick? Rabid? You’ll still have use for it in WvW, so it won’t be a total waste.