Guild Wars 2

FinalPatriot.8034:

I logged back into my D/D Ele again this morning just to mess around with it a bit as honestly, it was my favorite class in the game until the RTL changes. After 30 minutes of playing, I logged back into my Mesmer and was just sad on how much I miss my old character.

Granted my Mesmer isn’t as fast around the field but with stealth + centaur runes, there’s not a ton of difference on being able to escape. What’s sad is that with roughly the same quality gear, my Mesmer has a 42% crit rate, 91% crit damage bonus, 2340 armor, and over 19K health. While not the best, she’s able to dish out simply insane damage on a target before they even have a real chance to do anything.

I love my Ele (and probably always will) but really, why would I play the Ele anymore when my Mesmer has more versatility and can get better results for my WvW group?

Aesthetics?

Sorry, it’s all I can think of. It’s basically the only reason I play mine. I like the performance of my alts more, but I like the look, feel, and playstyle of the Elementalist better. It’s also the reason I run Staff 99% of the time. I rolled a Mesmer alt, and even upleveled from 20 it hit harder in WvW and had more escape options (b/c clones actually fool people in WvW apparently). I deleted it because I don’t like the aethetics.

The simple fact is that Elementalist needs trait work in a big way. There’s a reason almost everyone runs the same build.

Blaine Tog.8304:

Arheundel.6451:

So basically we should have a weapon suitable for a single situation only out of thousand?
We may as well make an entire profession and call it “Defender”, give it the ele staff and you’re good to go

I think you’re going to have to explain your reasoning here. It’s really unclear what you’re trying to say.

He’s saying that staff is too focused on a niche use. He wants it to be more versatile, I’d gather.

It’s simple math. ANet wants to make money, and the only thing they really have to sell is digital items. So, the riddle is how can they make the most money off of their digital items while minimizing the amount of items they have to create. The answer is quite simple. Find a way to get people to buy multiple copies of the same item.

If they just sold skins at a flat rate they’d have to sell them to a huge number of players to even approach the amount they make selling a few people 20-50 each. But with a random element that’s exactly what they can do. Since there’s only a chance to get a skin in a box people will now feel compelled to buy lots of keys/boxes. Some of these people will buy so many keys that they’ll completely negate the lost revenue of a majority of the players that would have bought a flat-rate skin but instead bought nothing.

That’s what the mining picks and scythes were about, btw. It was simple market research. If we sell X item with a lot of broad appeal for a flat rate will it outstrip the amount of revenue we make off of Y item with a narrow appeal and random outcome?

The answer, I’m guessing, is no.

Non-Subscription games are funded by whales that spend loads of cash in the cash shop, and the rest of us get a free ride because of them. Don’t be angry about it. Without those whales that buy 1,000 Black Lion Keys and then post Youtube videos of using all of them the rest of us wouldn’t be able to get off so cheap. Developing an MMO is expensive. Running an MMO is expensive. Unprofitable MMOs are shut down.

Is it really so bad that the people who pay for this game’s continued existence get rewarded with a shiny weapon skin the rest of us can’t get?

etrigan.4213:

As much as I like Orbs(as long as the buffs are properly done)…

I agree with some of the above statements:

Orbs should be low on the priority list…lets get working on the skill lag and some map rotation.

I disagree. WvW was designed with Orbs in mind. The structure of every BL map is based on continuous fights over Orbs, and they provide a counterpoint to the constant fight over Stonemist in EB. They were a vital component to WvW when implemented because they offered alternative paths to victory and additional room for strategic positioning.

Also, skill lag becomes less of an issue if people are busy fighting over multiple maps because all map now contain something of great strategic value. Matchups will become less predictable and stale when there is room for more unpredictable strategies to win the day.

In summary, Orbs were a core part of WvW because they were a good idea! I think finding a way to reintroduce them should be a top priority, because without them we’re all just playing half of the intended game mode.

Random rewards make more money than static rewards.

Sure, if every skin had a flat fee then more people would buy one of them. But almost nobody would buy 20 or 50 of them at a time. There’s more revenue generated in selling 1 person 20 boxes than selling 20 people 1 box, because you can always sell that 1 person 20 boxes AND sell maybe 9 of the remaining 19 anywhere from 1 to 19 boxes each. This is simple human nature. Inconsistent rewards create the most powerful forms of conditioning, and selling inconsistent rewards is a practice aimed at conditioning a customer base to enjoy spending money.

Here’s a bearded scientist talking about conditioning in primates

5 minute video on Youtube.

Brigg.6189:

- Only 1 person is needed on a capture point to capture it. Don’t sit on the point with your friends while the enemy gets everything else.

This should be a pop-up every time you join a match. Every time I do a hotjoin 3/5 of my team stop on the near point to cap it. QQ

Fuzzion.2504:

Dev said Orbs will return before the next star trek movie. So be patient.

Well, at least it was a good movie.

I guess this pretty much answers my question.

Fortus.6175:

Rerroll.9083:

It would be awesome if everyone could share any interesting trait lineup for staff weapon.

My efforts of avoiding the typical tanky build have failed hard

we are pretty much forced into it, not because we want to (like you said) but because water/arcana, as much as they have been nerfed, they are still the better traits.

Given that lava font wont be doing more than maybe a tick of 2k (maybe) to a 25k hp warrior and he will be doing 8k with #4 rifle (i think it is that one) we have to be able to survive around until fire is up agaisnt, because trying to do any damage outside fire is a joke. But then we are bunkers, unable to do more than just be CC bots. It is sad, there is no real middle ground here, specially since unlike PvE we cant mix and match stats, once we pcik either soldier or valkirie, we are pretty much stuck with that.

I used to go full Cleric’s and Water traits, and it greatly improved my survival.

I got tired of dealing pitiful damage and being a marginally useful heal-bot.

Now I go full Carrion and just deal with dying whenever someone decides to gap-close me. Next time I bother with sPvP I’ll probably try out Berserker, because what good is an AoE Pressure class that doesn’t do any damage? I’m anxious to compare the damage output and utility to my Condi Necro. I expect many Lava Tombs in my near future.

TooBz.3065:

Sunflowers.1729:

As someone who plays a Staff Elementalist in those WvW zerg balls, I think they might be referring to how Static Field (and similar things, like Veil) affect an infinite amount of people.

It’s pretty powerful, being able to stop an entire zerg with one ability.

But static field would be completely useless if it only affected 5 people. Imagine Gandalf standing before the hoard today. His resounding voice can be heard defiantly shouting “YOU SHALL BRIEFLY PAUSE”.

If they change the skill he would be screaming “A SMALL NUMBER OF YOU SHALL HESITATE”

You forgot to say “Please.”

At release the Orb mechanics were a pretty cool wrinkle to WvW, and I was saddened to see them go due to massive hacking/exploiting.

Has there been any word on when these can be reintroduced? It provided a different layer of strategy to WvW, and also served to add value to the Borderlands and get more people to do stuff there.

I build Arrowcarts and Ballistas near obvious chokepoints.

Badges are very easy to get, and a lot of people don’t dodge.

Also, don’t be afraid to build more siege than you can personally use. Your peers can use the extra siege you get, which will increase the amount of kills you both get. If you need to swap which siege you’re using you can kick the current user off, provided you’re the one that dropped the siege blueprints in the first place.

Rerroll.9083:

Id like to see an official answer on the 1 sigil restriction to 2hand weapon when they are clearly not superior (they are actually worse, if we talk about the ele class).

Also, the staff should be improved separately in pvp than wvw and pve, because as far as I know it’s stronger there.

It’s stronger in WvW because people don’t dodge.

I’ve racked up loads of kills firing a mortar’s Incendiary shells onto a bridge. People just stood there and burned to death (500 damage per tick….to death). I wouldn’t say that that makes Incendiary Mortar “viable.” I’d say that makes zerglings dumb.

Kaleban.9834:

“snip”
If this game is going to survive in the MMO arena, ANet needs to get its act together and fix the foundation before adding more fluff.

Never forget that fluff pays for everything else.

If this game was in the same sorry state of balance that it was in beta, and all they had added were a few PvE fixes to keep all the events running, they could still be making boatloads of money just releasing a different color cat mini every month or so.

Fluff and RNG slot-machines exist to make the bottom line look nice. PvP Balance exists because the people who make this game believe in it. But never think that anything as high-minded and abstract as “Balanced PvP Mechanics” will ever outweigh getting the next Infinite Gathering Tool out there for all the collecters to plunk down their $10 on.

Ralathar.7236:

You say that, but if allowed to free cast I can quite literally down entire zergs of people. Meteor Storm, Glyph of Storms, Fire Burst, Ice Bow (same story as meteor storm only far more concentrated, eruption, ice spike. If I cast this on a zerg, people go down. I’ve done it time and time and time again.

It isn’t a question, it isn’t a guess, it’s a certainty that a single ele can wreck an immobile zerg even if they heal. The damage output in an aoe is really high and when you end in water you not only continue to regen the hp of people around you but you throw 3k ice spikes on their head every few seconds.

That is a wonderful summation of what’s great and what’s awful about staff.

It works wonders if your opponents are dumb cattle that let you nuke them to death.

It doesn’t work so well when your opponents are organized and know not to stand in the red circles.

Miiro.3124:

PinCushion.7390:

Miiro.3124:

when i see a staff ele i think free badges

If I don’t have team members babysitting me then this is a fair assessment. If I get engaged in WvW my first goal is to run to the nearest clump of people or nearest keep.

I don’t generally make it unless I’m running a very tanky build.

Rangers like myself thank you for your effort

Don’t mention it. I know how your pets enjoy chasing things, and Rangers need badges too. For every time I’ve been mauled to death by a bear or jaguar in the open field I’ve probably turned some ranger into a smoldering crater while he was pew pewing off of a keep wall.

Miiro.3124:

when i see a staff ele i think free badges

If I don’t have team members babysitting me then this is a fair assessment. If I get engaged in WvW my first goal is to run to the nearest clump of people or nearest keep.

I don’t generally make it unless I’m running a very tanky build.

NeXeD.3042:

All I ever see in tpvp ele vids is d/d s/d. Usually 0/10/0/30/30 or 0/0/10/30/30

Same here, but I hate that build/playstyle. I rolled a Guardian for my support/bunker toon. I rolled an Ele to AoE fireball the living daylights out of things and Kite or Die. So far that particular playstyle has eluded me, but if there’s a video or stream of someone pulling it off I’d happily admit that I’m doing it wrong.

Emperor.1360:

I do mean sPvP (structured player-versus-player) teams, and it is true. If you speak with some of the top-ranking players, watch streams of top-tier play, and get into the top-tiers too—-you will see organized groups with staff elementalists (usually full damage) all over.

I’d love a link or 2 to some of the streams you’re talking about.

kostbabis.8791:

No staff is not viable in tpvp…

Its too slow,too unreliable,has little damage.And also…its support is lackluster!!!…

Only thing it has in spvp is range but when a thief can port to you from the other side of the map in a few seconds and take you down then that doesnt matter…

QFT.

People play Staff Ele in sPvP?

I mean, I do. But that’s like a once a month reminder that I don’t really like sPvP.

Truga.5897:

AoE cap does little to your main damage source, the meteor storm, which should be critting enemies for at 3k/hit with no might stacks. More if you trait fire+air. Stack some might and it becomes very dangerous. Drop it onto people and if they don’t move they will get downed. Blasting staff also seems to make it rain more fire.

I run a permanent 0/10/0/30/30 build (it just works with every weapon), and use soldier’s jewellery with berserker armour and 40% boon duration runes (2x superior water/monk, 2x major water). Also, omnomberry chocolate cream. This gives a total of 90% boon duration increase. The boon duration increase allows me to stack might and fury for long periods of time, giving a fairly large boost to damage output of everyone around me.

Casting healing rain over your team gives everyone 12345 seconds of regeneration as long as they keep shooting at something, while also removing tons of conditions. Since the AoE is gigantic, you can often get 30+ people into it or shooting through it.

Then there’s the really juicy stuff. Static field stuns everyone walking through it for 2 seconds. No 5 target limit. Drop it onto a bridge or into a valley/some other chokepoint when a zerg is passing and they’ll eat your meteor storm and any arrow carts you might have prepared. Instant death to everyone in there.

Frozen ground behind your meteor storm so that people who retreat out of it get frozen. Stack unsteady ground on top of it. A cripple or chill you can’t dodge out of because you just dodged the meteor storm usually means death in wvw. Also, projectiles over frozen ground stack chill. Cast it between two zergs and laugh as your zerg stacks literally hundreds of chills on the enemy with piercing/bouncing projectile attacks like trick shot.

Then there’s magnetic aura. Run into range of the enemy, wait a couple seconds for the enemy zerg to notice, pop it, laugh at them while they kill themselves, all while casting your meteor storm and frozen ground onto them, then lightning flash back out of range. Or, hop on the cannon and share it with the dude that’s using a cannon, laugh at the idiots trying to hit him/cannon as they kill themselves, while you press F while laughing manically.

Also, as you already said, meteor storm is useful for area denial. This is huge in itself, as this is generally what the arrow cart does, and that thing costs 30 supply and can’t move. We were nerfed by proxy a bit in this area since the buff to arrow carts, but when you’re in a freshly taken tower this is still great to have. Meteor storm + lava font + static field + ice spike + eruption the door and everyone either jumps out or gets downed, instead of build/use rams.

LordByron.8369:

Lemme guess another thief player?

Bingo!!!

I got my thief to level 4 before I got bored with her. Sorry to disappoint you, but I play elementalist pretty much full time.

I’m right there with you. I find Staff amazingly fun to play in all game modes, even sPvP. I’d never saddle a tPvP team with a Staff Ele, since they’re so fragile. I tend to favor either Cleric’s or Carrion gear, depending on what I’m doing. I hate Berzerker’s on Ele, since it makes us die to a stiff breeze. When I ran it in WvW I got tons of kills, but I died a lot more as well.

That said, while I find staff personally entertaining, I don’t find it all that good. Sure, you bring loads of AoE. That’s amazing in zergy WvW. But it isn’t all that great anywhere else. The trick would be buffing Staff in such a way that it doesn’t make it completely obnoxious in WvW, where it already excels. But, honestly, I doubt ANet will buff Staff at all.

innocent ouarior.1954:

I do, I don’t. I’v lately got a guy that left the group right after joining me arguing “I’v HAD to reroll a warriors because of P1 farming groups so now I only join warrior only groups”.

Remember community also make the game.

These kinds of people make me sad. If someone wants to roll a Warrior, then good for them. If they want to roll a Warrior and just farm CoF all day, then great. I’m happy they can do what makes them happy.

But to say they HAD to roll a Warrior, because they HAD to farm CoF…

I really don’t get it. Why would anyone think they have to do anything they didn’t want to do? And why would anyone try to convince strangers over the internet that they were the victim here, and so they’re justified in being a jerk to you?

Truga.5897:

while D/D stays just as good as ever, staff scales. The more people, the more power the staff has.

Doesn’t the AoE Cap make this impossible. I run a staff in WvW, mostly because I use staff everywhere. It’s nice, but it isn’t amazing. I often miss the damage and mobility of D/D. Most of reason staff is awesome in WvW is just the flashy animations. You drop a Meteor Shower in front of a zerg and most of them stop. Now, there’s no real reason they should stop. It’ll only hit a few of them, and it won’t kill any of them. But it’s big, flashy, and loud. So a lot of them try to dodge out of it on instinct.

Now 10 AoEs going off at the same time is another story, and staff Ele stacks very well with other AoE casters. But I’ve personally “stopped a zerg in their tracks” with my staff Ele just because everyone in the zerg was scared to take 2k damage from a Meteor.

The important thing to keep in mind about staff is that it’s designed around the use of Combo Fields and Combo Finishers.

You have a field in each attunement, and a Blast and Projectile finisher in Earth. You’ll be spending most of your time swapping in and out of Earth to set up your combos.

For traits, I recommend getting Elemental Attunement and Blasting Staff ASAP. The extra buffs and bigger fields will make leveling a lot easier. The rest of your points can be spent wherever you like. I take Quick Glyphs in Air and 20% longer bleeds in Earth. I gear for Power and Condition Damage (Carrion gear), but that’s really up to you. Some people like more crits and crit damage for better Meteor Showers.

The most helpful thing is to learn what all the finishers do, and get used to frequently swapping back to Earth to set up Blast finishers or to toss Projectile finishers into your fields.

Earth 1 is a Strong Finisher, so it’ll 100% proc off of whatever field you toss it through.

For example:

Earth Attunement → Eruption → Fire Attunement – Lava Font (Finishes with AoE Might)… Cast some stuff….Lava Font → Earth Attunement → Shockwave (finishes for extra burning) → Stoning (finishes for extra burning)

TheGuy.3568:

If you can spend 30 minutes posting and complaining about a build you can spend 30 minutes over 5 days each day learning a how a class ticks. There is no room for complaint if you aren’t willing to learn about other classes. If a player devotes themselves to be better than other despite other responsibilities they put the work in. If it paid off and they start beating folks left and right the average skilled players should accept the defeat. PvP is inherently just that player vs player it is competition. If one player refuses to put the time in to get better there is no possible way for them to justify their complaints as both players are paying customers.

It should also be noted among Spvp and pvp players this is conventional thinking and the norm amonf serouus plyaers and while I will never take it to the extreme some of them do analysis is key. Most players run a set pattern. Kind of like basic game theory is you know how they react to your action you cna always stay a step ahead.

Also to note I did crafting leveling for most classes and only played the last few levels my logic is simple leveling is a waist of time. If I want to know I class I spvp it. If i like it I level it and dive into the minute mechanics. This is the main reason I beat thieves on warrior and beat the last 3 mesmers I fought on my warrior. After I leveled mesmer it was like “Ohh that how it works.” Once you can see that you can see the gaps. 3 is to small a sample but I remember running often from mesmers and not so much anymore. If you watch a match in spvp inspect a players gear and build an see how they apply skills you could achieve the same level of knowledge without ever leveling the class.

Now to the other topic you brought up. The classes aren’t balanced not even close but its about as close as it is going to get so meh. As far as DD and complexity. I do not say this for shock value or anything but 4 months ago I started falling asleep while playing DD. It seems despite the 20 skills because the class runs a rotation most of them time it was making me bored. when I play warrior while having far fewer skills because I do not run a rotation is easy for me to play for long periods of time without getting bored.

I agree with everything you say here. But I think you underestimate the number of people that do not care about sPvP, don’t know anything about classes that they don’t main, don’t test builds extensively, don’t read what their skills actually do, and don’t really care all that much about the underlying combat mechanics.

Players that sPvP a lot are a self-selecting population that is biased to really care about game mechanics. These players are also a minority of the overall population. It’s too bad, as sPvP is a place where not caring about combat mechanics results in a very unpleasant experience. I find hot joins to be a great place to test builds, get a feel for how a build works in actual combat, get a pulse on what the most popular builds are for classes that I don’t actively play (need more character slots), and develop a thicker skin when it comes to getting absolutely destroyed by coordinated teams that know their stuff. Nerd rage turns very quickly into respect for a clever build, or admiration at skillful execution.

Full disclosure, I don’t sPvP a lot. I sPvP enough to keep a feel for how it works, and test builds for WvW. I do use spectator a good bit, though. It’s helpful for keeping my finger on the pulse of the meta (or what little there is of it). Something interesting that’s been happening more and more the last few months is people running builds in WvW that would be impossible in sPvP, so that makes things a bit more challenging. Still, paying attention to what consumable icons people run with helps (especially if they totally dominate me).

And I swapped back from D/D to Staff because D/D was just too repetitive. Everything casts so fast (besides Churning Earth), and all the utilities are instant cast. You kind of develop this set of rotations that you use for every situation, and it becomes like Ranger S/D + GS only with 5 times the keystrokes. Staff is much harder to play. Sure, zerg-farming with it is easy. But actually playing Staff in a 1v1 or 2v1 is incredibly challenging. I’m still piecing it together, and am still pretty terrible. There’s almost nobody good running Staff Ele in sPvP that I can find since D/D is just more effective at most things. It keeps things interesting though, so I keep at it.

Honorable mention of the Stoneline Staff thread on this forum that gave me some good ideas.

Kaleban.9834:

ThiBash.5634:

There’s plenty of versatility, but it’s hidden in the combo fields.

Versatility should not be hidden. Combo fields and finishers should add to the usefulness of a profession, not be the defining factor on its effectiveness. Nor should a class be balanced around making efficient use of every combo field all the time.

This was my gripe with the EA nerf(s). Not every build took it, and yet when used properly it was quite effective, ADDING to the Ele’s versatility. Then it was whine-nerfed into marginal usefulness, because people don’t like the Ele’s sole defense mechanism, healing.

Odd that even after the nerf it’s still one of the best traits in the entire profession. I’d hardly call that “whine-nerfed into marginal usefulness.”

Straegen.2938:

PinCushion.7390:

In DAoC, small groups won against large groups through intelligent use of lag, group composition, bursting tactics (when I played it was 3 PBAoE classes stacked on each other or 3 2-hander users focusing down one person at a time), buff bots, AoE CC, and stacking group-healers/endurance buffers to keep everything running quickly and smoothly.

In DAOC smaller groups won through effective use of control abilities. Stuns, dazes and the like had no limit so a big group could easily be at the mercy of a few well timed stuns. I think ANet should remove the target cap for stuns. I get why it is there for AoE, but stacking would become really dangerous with this change.

Until my old computer died, I had a screenshot saved of my group killing about 50 other people because we zoomed into them while they were huddled on top of each other (hooray for /follow). Our bard landed an amazing mez and we just AoEed them all to death in about 10 seconds. They couldn’t really react to us because of lag (we had stood on a hill watching them so all their models would load up in advance).

While that was a lot of fun for me, I can’t imagine it was a lot of fun for those 50 people. From my perspective we did all this planning, group makeup, and positioning. From their perspective they were trying to get into a keep, their computers froze for a second, and then they were dead. Honestly, I’m glad that gameplay is much harder to pull off in GW2.

Currently, small groups win against large groups through intelligent use of siege and terrain.

In DAoC, small groups won against large groups through intelligent use of lag, group composition, bursting tactics (when I played it was 3 PBAoE classes stacked on each other or 3 2-hander users focusing down one person at a time), buff bots, AoE CC, and stacking group-healers/endurance buffers to keep everything running quickly and smoothly.

GW2 removed most of that list, and pulled the teeth out of the rest of it. Bursting tactics don’t work as well because of the downed state and the AoE cap. AoE CC is far shorter in duration, and requires far more coordination. Healing is far more distributed and requires a lot more coordination and planning (so much that most people don’t bother).

What GW2 added was siege. They’ve tweaked it, and will continue to do so. Even so, what hasn’t changed is the idea that keeps, supply, and siege must be important in WvW. That was a huge failing in DAoC. Most of RvR consisted of roaming around Emain and fighting people to harvest points, with little consideration of what structures belonged to whom. Occasionally there’d be a keep siege just to shake things up, but it wasn’t a necessity. Less frequently there’d be a Relic Raid, but they took forever and didn’t really change much. Owning relics provided incredibly minor bonuses, so if you didn’t own them it didn’t really effect you all that much. The only siege engines that mattered were rams, for the most part.

ANet obviously determined that this was a huge failing on Mythic’s part, and endeavored to fix it. Most of the WvW rankings give you bonuses to siege, and none of them offer advantages to actually fighting people. Far more WXP is rewarded for taking or defending structures than for racking up kills. Unlike DAoC, properly placed siege often swings fights. Unlike DAoC, ownership of keeps is incredibly important and changes where people are fighting and who we’re fighting.

TL – DR Version:

In DAoC RvR was about getting kills as efficiently as possible. Keeps and siege were largely incidental, to the point where many players actively avoided keep warfare.

In GW2 WvW is about taking and defending strategic points using siege and supply.

BlackBeard.2873:

If you play a bunker, which most eles have ended up, celestials make a lot of sense. More than most other specs, bunker eles really do benefit from just about everything on the celestials. Damage is gotten by a few mini-bursts and a some decent damage stacks (bleeds and burns, using power and condi damage). The toughness and vitality is decent, and healing power is very helpful without going full cleric. The precision is helpful with the vigor trait, while the crit damage is just a nice bonus.

You don’t see much a tradeoff because we do use everything. When you choose to increase your PVT, for instance, you lose out on the condition damage, precision, and healing power such that it is about a wash. I still think celestials are better b/c they are more nerf-proof as I am sure major shifts in eles composition aren’t done. People still do play the class.

I’m accumulating a set of Celestial jewelry for this reason, as well as the convenience of being able to change my build without having to get all new gear every time. Armor/Weapons/Runes are expensive enough already. Sure, it’ll never be “optimal” in any situation. That’s not really the point. Quality of Life counts, and versatility is a benefit as well.

Zelyhn.8069:

Glyph of elemental power is pretty much useless anyway (5s internal cd, yay!).

At least the cooldown is per-target, which makes the utility somewhat interesting. Still, a 25% chance to proc and an unavoidable 25% down time untraited (assuming you refresh the skill as soon as it comes off CD) and a five second internal cooldown is a few too many restrictions for one utility skill. It basically ensures it’ll never work when you actually want it to.

I know it’s not technically on-topic, but this is a pet peeve of mine. If they wanted to restrict the use of this utility they should have just decreased the proc chance rather than add arbitrarily stacked hurdles.

Chaotic Storm.2815:

Fire- Ring of fire (Dagger 4) for Burning retreat (staff 4)= I like the synergy, it would go nice with burning speed and our overall mobility.

This is already available, and it’s called “Conjure Flame Axe.” Burning Speed, Burning Retreat, and Ring of Fire all on the same skill bar. I don’t know a single person that uses it, but I’ve toyed around having it on my staff build just to get a bit more clutch mobility for extra kiting.

Pros:
-Very versatile weapon sets and utility skills that can allow you to fill numerous roles at the same time.
-Tons of AoE.
-Great healing.
-Very good in-combat mobility.
-Lots of skill combos and combo fields to provide extra damage and boons

Cons:
-Lots of weapon skills and skill cooldowns to manage, most of which will not be visible to you while they’re cooling down. This means you’ll have to get a feel for when certain skills have reset so you can use them again, since you can’t see the timer.
-Attunement swapping adds another layer of complexity, as you can easily lock yourself out of an important skill right when you need it by swapping at the wrong moment. This can also cause you to lose certain combos if you swap attunements in the wrong order.
-You have the lowest armor and hitpoint values of any class, so if you mis-dodge or get stunned out of your heal you’ll probably die. If your stun-breakers are all on cooldown you’ll definitely die. This is why a lot of eles run with 3 stun breakers.
-You don’t do top DPS no matter what your build is*, but your burst can get very impressive.
-The class excels at back-loaded, rather than front-loaded damage. This makes it harder to “gank” people.

*Possible exception is the Thor build for dungeons, which does remarkable DPS. I haven’t played with extensively, so I can’t say for sure how good it is.

TheGuy.3568:

I don’t necessarily disagree with this. The problem is that there are OP mechanics in the game. The way I judge most fight is how my warrior responds to a build. Save heavy condtion damge in most fights in WvW on my warrior I should be able to do 2 things. First is win. I do not mean to sound kitteny or anything like. However, when I encounter most non heavy condition damage specs I should be winning or holding my own. The second is run. If its 1v1 fighting anything other than a thief I should be able to run. That being said if I get beat and I couldn’t do either I analyze the combat log and this is the important part. I look to see what I did wrong first. If you do not do this there is is no point in coming to the forums. After that I analyze the build I was fighting (usually I take a guess after looking at he damage and skills). If I feel its OP I ask how first do other people beat it. Then after playing it in spvp or just leveling the class I get a good Idea of whats OP

As of this moment in WvW DP and thief in general is OP but not by a huge margin. Ele isn’t OP atm. HGH might be OP but haven’t played it enough. to say its OP. Rangers might be a little OP in water. Everything else in my opinion has its pros and cons pretty sorted out even mesmer.

What you’re talking about is unusual behavior. Most people do not study combat logs, optimize and tweak builds to death, or analyze combat encounters in minute detail until they know both what they did wrong and what their opponent did right. Most people do not level up an alt for the sole purpose of learning how the class ticks so they can know how to beat them in PvP. What you’re talking about requires time and mental energy that most people have dedicated elsewhere.

Also, I think the classes are generally balanced. However, and this has been a topic of conversation since release, some of the classes are remarkably easier to play at a mediocre level. I think all classes have a relatively high skill-ceiling, but I think a chosen few classes have a low skill floor that makes them seem a bit OP when two players of average skill confront each other and one wipes the floor with the other. I bring this up because it’s far more interesting than whining about which class is OP and needs adjusting. Elementalist was considered an incredibly complex class until daphoenix (and others) started churning out D/D guides and videos. It turns out almost anyone can be taught, and the complex part was fitting it all together in the first place.

Truga.5897:

Blaine Tog.8304:

PistolWhip.2697:

But of course, our population of Ele’s seem to think they are the only one with issues.

Yeah, just about everyone thinks their profession is the least powerful and the most buggy.

When everyone’s whining about their class you know balance has been achieved. As soon as a class is “just right” by anyone’s standard, you know it’s OP, because they’re winning too often. :P

WvW makes this even worse.

Picture it. You’ve opimized your build for 7 months, collected the perfect gear setup, carefully chosen the optimal consumable buffs to run, took the time to farm mobs to get 20-25 Bloodlust stacks, and even bought a few consumable karma items to give you that extra edge. You run across 3-5 people. They are a random collection of total strangers. They aren’t grouped up, but just travelling together. They aren’t talking or chatting with each other. 2 of them aren’t 80 yet. 2 of them are in their PvE, super squishy gear/builds. 1 of them is in his zerg-farming, keep-siege build that’s amazing as long as he can get to an arrowcart. You destroy them all.

You think they’re pathetic. They think you’re OP, and they all go to the forums and whine about it. It doesn’t even matter what class you’re playing, because you’d probably win that fight on any class.

PistolWhip.2697:

Kaleban.9834:

Ralathar.7236:

Depends on your team composition.

Which is exactly how you don’t balance a profession. No one at ANet is balancing Thief Stealth around Engineer’s Smoke Bomb, or Warrior’s Adrenaline gain by standing in Fire fields.

Ele Staff for example should not require balance consideration around how many Guardians are using Might Blow at the time.

That’s an all around theme though. Anet has said over and over, most recently in the SoTG video last patch that they balance around team play. This to them justifies why warrior has no staying power and is terrible in most cases alone. This is why Ele staff has no viability in a 1v1 situation to the point its almost a free kill for most people. This is also why Mesmer is so strong in a 1v1 situation as they become more balanced and more realistic to beat in a team fight.

Anet doesn’t care for 1v1’s, though I’m willing to wager if they added a form of dueling they might. In fact, many of these new custom arenas are dueling servers, because people like the prospect of 1v1ing more than Anet anticipated it seems.

Ele’s aren’t the only profession which gets nerfs, some others for example, the Thief has had more nerfs than any other profession combined, and minimal buffs to conpensate. A big issue I feel is the culture in which Anet seems to buy into of nerfing everything as opposed to buffing. If other classes aren’t as strong as Ele at the time, buff them, don’t limit the Ele. Same applies to Guardians and Mesmers who can be considered the peak of balance. They are very well thought out, and work in all game modes, and the only reason they seem OP all the time is due to the other professions being UP in some KEY areas.

This is probably the most sober assessment of the state of the game that I’ve read. I don’t think the RTL nerf was that big a deal. What is a big deal is that the difference between the class being a good value in every game mode and the class being a waste of a group slot depended on 1 skill on 1 weaponset in 1 build. If a 40s cooldown on RTL is enough to change Ele from an amazing group member to a waste, then there’s some problems with the core class design that need to be tweaked.

And Staff Ele being a free kill is part of the overall problem here. Would D/D be any good at all if RTL was just removed entirely? Would Staff suddenly become good if RTL was added to it? That’s a problem. It means the class has problems and one OP skill is glossing over those problems.

So, let’s ask ourselves why RTL was so OP. It’s fairly obvious. We have great healing output, but poor armor and hitpoints. RTL allowed us to control where engagements took place, and stagger how many opponents we were fighting at once. It made it less likely we’d get dog-piled. It allowed us to cross maps faster than other professions. It allowed us to reset fights with impunity. That’s a lot of control on one ability.

Ok, so what problems is RTL glossing over? Again, it’s fairly obvious. People have been griping about this stuff since release. Low armor and low hitpoints is in the class design, and that’s fine. What isn’t fine is that our high-burst skills are all very telegraphed, and have long cooldowns. Our damage output hinges on “combos” that are easily broken or disrupted. Once we’re in melee we’re basically dead unless we build entirely around survival, which destroys our damage output. We have several Utilities that do basically nothing (i.e. Conjured Weapons). Our traits often work against each other. For example, “Get X the longer you’re in Y attunement” doesn’t synergize well with “Swap attunements X% faster.” In addition, we have many traits that are just bad options (i.e. Flame Barrier related traits).

Wenrolio.8063:

I wonder would the new signet of earth have helped your build significantly? The extra toughness is pretty nice. Can’t go wrong with the clerics support though.

Getting back to the OP; I hope you find something that is comfortable for you. That is what I think matters most. Find a balance of survivability and damage that suits your play style and fits in with your team/guild/whatever.

Edit: I realize you asked for full glass, but what gave me my best results for damage was also somewhat survivable. I have hit bigcrits on fire auto with the build and think that if you change the jewels to zerkers you’ll get close to the max damage a staff would put out while being somewhat reliably alive.

I’m thinking it’d be somewhat workable if I could line up Shockwave to hit several enemies, and time it like…

Shockwave → Eruption → Ice Spike → Flame Burst/Arcane Blast → Arcane Power

If I could get the timing right Ice Spike and Eruption would hit at the exact same time, I’d still be in both Fire and Water attune, and Arcane Power would effect them both. Then it’d just be a matter of mopping up with a Static Field, and Fiery Greatsword dropped on their face.

That’s a lot of uninterrupted chain-casting, though. Not sure how realistic it is. And it’d depend on getting enough Condi-Duration to land that Ice Spike + Eruption before the immob wore off.

I may tinker with it some more, since I need a new build to work on.

Dazzed.2057:

“To do:
- Solo PvE content,
- Group world events (Dragons etc.),
- Orr events,
- Map exploration.”

You may want to consider a build which favors conjured weapons – The Lightning Hammer and Fiery Greatsword in particular.

I currently run a D/D Survival Conjurer build with good DPS outage and PvE flexibility for different the scenarios you have listed:
- http://www.guildhead.com/skill-calc#mcszz9Mz0MvmCmMvmNoGa0xaoRomVqV

For maximum DPS, try the classic Glass Cannon Conjure build:
- http://www.guildhead.com/skill-calc#mcszz9Mz0MvaCmMvmboxx0a0oRbzobm

I use Berserker/Knight gear only.

Lightning Hammer + Piercing Shards + Weak Spot = Easy Mode PvE

Wenrolio.8063:

@ PinCushion: I can definitely say that in the heat of a fight I’m switching attunements as soon as they are up and wouldn’t be able to keep up with a full combo like that while predicting where the enemy will be. It also looks like you didn’t take credit for the at least 5% dmg you’d get for a burning foe with fire 25. I’m sure dropping that ice spike felt really good when it hit.

I did make my build to suit my style of play which typically revolves around keeping it simple. I tried to pick traits that would work with every attunement. Having 0 in arcana, I also find that I need to save my water swap for when I, or my group, really needs the geyser and healing rain.

Last thing, I put mist form in my second utility on that link, but I actually run with signet of air to get from place to place.

You raise some good points. First, I ditched the build because it never actually connected. I’d often hit people with various components of that burst. But it was incredibly rare to hit someone with all of them at once. When it all connected they’d die. But they’d have to be AFK, lagged to oblivion, or in the middle chatting for it all to land on one person. Second, I missed being tanky/supporty. Using a staff made me a little too vulnerable to burst, and I got tired of dying every time a Thief got close. So I swapped to full Cleric’s and just spam green numbers on everyone.

lunyboy.8672:

Deniara Devious.3948:

…Stealth stomp should not work. This should of course affect all professions e.g. mesmers and engineers also denied of doing stealth stomps…

Oh yes, we definitely NEED another nerf, so incredibly OP.

Lol.

-An Engineer.

I actually agree with this one, but with a minor tweak.

I don’t think stomping should work in ANY non-normal state. That includes Stealth, Death Shroud, Mist Form, Invulnerable, Distorted, or anything else (other than Stability).

I’ve abused most of these to get stomps, and I think they just encourage bad group play. My group should be CCing so someone else can get stomps.

But that’s not likely to happen, so I don’t really care if Stealth Stomps are still in. As long as I keep my Mist Form, Death Shroud, or Shrink Potion stomps then it’s all fair.

Terrahero.9358:

Kimbald.2697:

JubeiTM.5763:

Kimbald.2697:

What puzzles me most is how they have been ‘buffing’ turrets for 2 patches now, in some attempt to open up more builds… but failed to even recognise the main weaknesses of turrets.

My only tough is that current devs don’t have access to the source code, but only a limited control panel to change some variable numbers.

It could also be as simple as: they don’t recognise these issues as the real problems with turrets because they have limited personal experience with them.

Perhaps. Or perhaps its sheer laziness.

Lets set the scene. You are one of only two developers that have to deal with all professions, their balance, bug fixes, everything in all 3 gamemodes.

Now, after a couple of drinks, you’ve worked up the courage to finally open that file on Engineers. You prefer not to go there, its a mess! But, a job is a job. You figure you want to make Turrets more appealing, and you wanna get it done as fast as possible. Because you’re not a fan of Engineers and you’re busy! Its already noon and you just realized you havent buffed Thieves yet!

Okay, back to Turrets. Are you going to spend your time working out the complicated targeting algorythm of Turrets, aswell as figuring out a balanced system where Turrets are durable enough without being unkillable?
Or, would you rather slap a kitten buff on them? Something that sounds big, neglecting that 100% more of nothing is still nothing?

Yah, i thought so. Case closed, now you earned yourself another drink and then you can start with your monthly “balance” of Thieves… maybe we should let em fly… hic

“Laziness” is not a thing. It doesn’t really exist, or at least not to the degree that we throw the word around. If given two alternative methods to accomplish the same goal, almost everyone picks the one that’s fastest/easiest. The only reason anyone would pick the one that’s hardest is if it offered a measurably greater reward or if they actually enjoyed the harder activity more (and even then most people still don’t).

Software developers that assemble complex virtual worlds which bring in millions in annual revenue are not often what I would call “Lazy.”

Even so, they are often wrong about stuff. I think this is the case here. I think there’s a mismatch between how the dev team think turrets should work and how they actually work. I think this mismatch is there because how they think turrets should work is simply not a playstyle anyone values.

Can you build an engineer that creates a safe-haven full of constant blast-finished buffs/heals? Of course you can do that! It seems like the intended playstyle of turrets. Does anyone value that? Is it worth all the bother? Does it make sense to create a static safe haven that’s one Meteor Storm away from being a lot of cooldown timers and wasted effort?

No. It isn’t. That’s a best-case scenario of what I can imagine that turrets were designed to do, and in that best-case scenario it still isn’t all that valuable. That said, I do it anyway because I enjoy it. And even though it isn’t all that valuable, it does bring some value. But as long as my little turret nest is one Well of Suffering away from the trash bin it will continue to be a suboptimal playstyle.

Wenrolio.8063:

I posted this in the well balanced staff build topic. I am currently playing this build which I feel can be an alternate to yours. You can switch out the sigil fire trait for 10% more damage in fire to get juicier meteor showers. I don’t take blasting staff b/c I don’t find it to be that much more effective. You can also play with the jewels for more crit % dmg if you want (I looked at knights with beryl jewels). I think that I may get magi’s earrings/rings with sapphire jewels for more healing power/support.

Here’s a staff build that I theory crafted and have played with occasionally.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fEQQFAWhEmYbyx5gjEAkCoEZYwBTGhshogFA-jkyAYLAiAQ2TRN/BkDzYxrIasqaANEmGdR1eEGtahAUMBA-w
The premise is to always have burning up on your target. The traits/runes I picked allow:
10% dmg with full endurance
10% dmg with health above 90%
15% dmg to burning foes
20% dmg to foes with health under 33%.
That’s a 55% bonus to direct damage when your health is full and theirs is below 33%. The trick is to manage staying above 90% health.
Interested in anyone’s comments on this one.

Played around with a similar build, only I did 25/10/0/20/15. The premise was an attempt at stacking at least 1 stack of Vuln on people as well as Burning, then swapping to Water and dropping an Ice Spike. Because of 15 Arcane you can be in both Fire and Water at the same time at the moment that the Ice Spike hits.

+10% from Fire Attunement
+20% from Water Attunement if Vuln is present
+15% from Burning (used the same runes you’re using)
+20% if they’re under 2/3 health

It was loads of fun at keeping keep walls squeaky clean, and I got good at timing the Flame Burst, swap, Arcane Blast, Ice Spike. I liked the build, especially because it allowed me to keep 15 Water for a bit of extra healing. Your build looks like it’d be easier to actually land your damage, whereas what I was using was very decent damage but so easy to avoid. Think I ran Arcane Blast, Arcane Power, and Arcane Shield at the time. One problem spot was if you didn’t line up all your combos and attunements, or if Sigil of Intelligence didn’t proc, you definitely noticed the missing burst.

Blazedrag.4568:

Is it just me or when the idea of an Engineer is brought up as a class for a game, I usually think about gadgets and Turrets, not potions. Sure I can at least see kits, at least since they’re unique to the engineer, but I feel like (what should be) the most iconic things about the class in general are also currently the worst.

They could’ve easily made an entire other class dedicated to Alchemy and had that be separate from the engineer entierly.

Anyways, I agree that turrets really don’t need much to make them more usable, hell changing the AI to focus on what the player is targeting before anything else might make a huge difference in usability alone. On top of that I feel like since Turrets don’t move, they really would make for a better Tank build, so increasing the turrets toughness and health would probably be enough on it’s own. You could still have some turrets be more DPS based, like maybe the Rifle turret, but in general the turrets would probably be fine with just survivability buffs.

Well if I had to add one other thing, it would definitely be agreeing with the cool down changes people keep suggesting. I particularly like the idea of turrets keeping the same cool down, but starting them as soon as the turret is placed. That combined with a slight increase in survivability would make them much more annoying in combat. And then Picking up a turret would also still do the same thing, reducing the cool down, but now that the cool down starts sooner, it might make it be able to immediately be placed again. However that might not be fair, so maybe that would be changed to reducing the remaining cool down by the same percentage.

Alchemy works because it provides quality boons. If turrets provided lots of boons then they’d be the go-to build. They don’t. They do unreliable damage and die easily. I use them because I enjoy them, and have just learned to treat them like disposable blast finisher dispensers.

Turrets:

Press F Key for Blast Finisher
Press F Key for AoE Knockback
Press F Key for situational skill effect
Press # Key for delayed, occasionally useful “Overcharge” skill effect
Summon to do , unreliable damage and distract enemies sometimes

I have to say, there’s a lot of utiility wrapped up in one utility slot. It’s too bad that the actual Turret parts of turret skills don’t work very well.

I’ll be honest. I don’t get it.

Why do I need this trait when I already have it in the Explosives line. Rifle Turret and Healing Turret have a 20s cooldown, can be detonated for damage and traited to add a knockback. Doesn’t that kind of do what you’re asking for already, only not as OP. Shocking Aura on all your turrets all the time is a bit much.

I think the worst thing about turrets is the traits give a false impression of what they’re usually best at. They’re disposable pets, and yet the traits imply that they’re supposed to tank things and regenerate health, meaning last a long time.

I think turrets are fine, but generally if they’re taking melee damage I just detonate them and fall back on their toolbelt skills until they come off CD. That said, I think turret traits are useless filler besides Accelerant Packed Turrets and Deployable Turrets. The increased range trait should be good, but it’s too high in the trait tree and isn’t good enough to warrant how much other stuff you have to take to get to it. The turret toughness and regen traits are a complete waste.

Sin.4130:

I do agree that this can ruin game very soon. I don’t understand why any mmo must go through this stealth problem and at the end they always say yes we were wrong. Wy ANet can’t jump now to those conclusions of giants in market.

Many of us have some old school preference. We love any kind of rangers, warriors, guardians etc. even from cRPG games where they are always mighty and fearless. ANet is killing those golden memories silently and this is huge mistake.

That’s a bit melodramatic, I think.

My complaint about Thieves is only that they aren’t fun to fight against.

That’s it. I don’t think they’re that OP (only a little). I just don’t find the Stealth mechanic fun, and avoid fighting Thieves as much as possible because even if I win I don’t really feel like a “Winner.”

There’s nothing especially amazing about throwing AoE or auto attacks at the air and hoping you hit the other guy. There’s nothing fun about getting in a melee with someone that you know will just leave if it looks like they might lose.

Do they need to be nerfed into the ground? No. Not at all. Stealth in GW2 is a royal pain compared to other MMOs. In most of them you just click a button and you’re stealthed for as long as you want. Here you have to jump through all kinds of hoops, and drop combo fields, and constantly refresh it. Thief teleports are a bit over the top, but it’s their “Thing,” I guess. I don’t like it, and find it un-fun, but whatever. Most of the roaming builds are practically useless in sieges, which is where I spend most of my time.

Galrond.5972:

I mean why do we need a single target nuke as a utility skill?

Because our ranged single-target damage is usually very bad.

Swimsasa Stoon.8936:

PinCushion.7390:

Swimsasa Stoon.8936:

just wondering how much a cleric ele really heals for when he has 1600 healing power…

Soothing mist:
80+0.05xhealing power/second
160 hp per second while attuned to water for more than 3 seconds, affects all allies within a range of 1200. (divided by 4 since we have 4 atunements).

regeneration boon:
130+0.125xhealing power=330 hp/s

healing ripple:
2900/20s=145 hp/s

off-hand dagger cleansing wave + optional Evasiva arcana cleansing wave:
2900/40=72 hp/s (x2 if you have evasiva arcana)

Cone of cold (with dagger in main hand):
(740+(0.32xhealing power))/10cd= 125,2 hp/s

So a maxed cleric bunker elementalist heals itself for approximately:
40+330+145+72+125= 712 hp/sec.

We can however burst heal for up to 6000 hp without even touching our actual healing skills.

Add in our signet of restoration which heals for 362 hp per cast and 4750 when using it.
or
Glyph of elemental harmony which heals for 6094+regen for atleast 10 seconds. so a total of 9000+every 25 seconds (20% glyph recharge not included).
or
ether renewal which heals for close to 7000 on a 15 sec. cooldown (downside is the 4 seconds of casting time.)

I did not touch the scepters trident skill which also heals around 3000 or the staff water skills which also heal considerable. Add in all the damage mitigation skills the elementalist has and you’ll see why healing power is far more important than vitality or toughness.

I don’t think of it in those terms.

Just by standing next to people I increase their healing hefty amount, possibly even doubling their personal healing output.

I can do this to up to 4 people at a time (not counting myself).

So, if I can double the healing output of 4 other people just by standing around and mashing buttons but as a consequence I half my own damage output is it worth the bother. It depends on how valuable healing is. In dungeons where everyone knows all the encounters and can dodge all the big hits it’s a waste of time. In WvW, where arrowcarts are tagging everyone constantly and you can get outnumbered at a moment’s notice, it starts to be a lot more important.

Add to this, multiple people can fill the same role at the same time. If I’m dumping AoE heals on my party, and our Engineer is doing the same thing in different ways, then the only part that doesn’t stack is the Regeneration boon. All our Water finishers and AoE heals stack just fine. Every class has skills that can increase the group’s healing output, and they’re designed to stack with one another fairly well.

Exactly so now what if you halved the healing power doubled your own power and had 5 people with a build like that standing near one another? Wouldn’t the healing stacks make you near immortal? Or maybe the soothing mist doesn’t stack in intensity but duration? Haven’t tested it yet so I wouldn’t know. Regen definately only stacks in duration but the other heals are still decent. I swapped to S/D for now because the air-fire-earth burst is just a tad bit more deadly and gives more stacks of might compared to the D/D one. With boonduration the might lasts for a long time effectivly doubling y’r damage output and all those that stand near you.

Its not just defensive support and healing that we can give but we can also give 12 stacks of might to allies with firefield-combofinishers.

I lucked into an epic 5 vs 20 keep defense yesterday where healing was the deciding factor. They trebbed 2 walls down, eventually blew up both our arrowcarts, and got totally stonewalled at the ramp heading to the champion. Why? Because 3 out of the 5 were full support/healing builds (Staff Ele, Staff/Mace Guard, Alch/Turret Engi). Even with the treb’s dead-cow poison on us almost the whole time we held our own for about 20-30 minutes just farming kills. They eventually overwhelmed us when 2 treb shots hit us at once and they charged right after 3 of us were downed at the same time. Still, it’s probably the most fun I’ve had in WvW to date.

Then we retreated to a nearby supply camp and held that for another 20-30 minutes.

I’d think this was just something reserved for finely tuned guild groups except these were all people I’d never met before. We just happened to be running very heal-heavy builds.

ErlendR.6107:

Geiir.7603:

Just have three persons spam abilities

Spam is for newbies or kids, is not a demonstration of skills …

That’s the point. You don’t need super skills to beat Thieves. You just need 3 other people to spam stuff after they down one of your team members. Nothing to it.

Unless you’re solo, and not specifically built to fight Thieves 1v1. Then…oh, maybe that’s why this thread is here. How about that?

stinkypants.8419:

So… I’m in T4 and I can regularly -

run in a zerg
PvD
run in a havoc squad
solo guard flip
kill dolys
have large open field battles, 10v10 – 30v30
guard towers
run supply
run siege
1vX or Xv1

Sure sometimes I log in and I look for a field battle and all I find is a zerg, or I try some havoc stuff and just get roflstomped, but for the most part I think T4 is doing alright.

And yeah, some new maps would be nice, but I honestly can’t say I’m bored… there’s plenty of stuff going on, and if there isn’t I’ll just work on my dailies and log, no worries.

This stuff is why I don’t understand this thread. WvW is open-world, sandbox style gameplay. Sure, there’s a score so earning points is the general goal usually. That said, there are lots of ways to influence the score. Whether it’s directly scoring points, slowing down your opponent, or doing any number of things to make your team score points faster, the limit to how to play WvW is really up to the player. If you don’t want to, you don’t even have to care about the score at all and can just roam around and farm badges or just sit in the main keep and chat.

If you’re bored in a game format where you can do anything you want at any time you want then maybe the problem is that you’re choosing to do boring things. I’m not saying WvW doesn’t need stuff added to it, because it does. But I wouldn’t say that it’s boring because there aren’t enough things to do.

Now if I had spent 9 months zerging EB over and over I’d be very, very bored. That’s why I don’t do that anymore.

Swimsasa Stoon.8936:

just wondering how much a cleric ele really heals for when he has 1600 healing power…

Soothing mist:
80+0.05xhealing power/second
160 hp per second while attuned to water for more than 3 seconds, affects all allies within a range of 1200. (divided by 4 since we have 4 atunements).

regeneration boon:
130+0.125xhealing power=330 hp/s

healing ripple:
2900/20s=145 hp/s

off-hand dagger cleansing wave + optional Evasiva arcana cleansing wave:
2900/40=72 hp/s (x2 if you have evasiva arcana)

Cone of cold (with dagger in main hand):
(740+(0.32xhealing power))/10cd= 125,2 hp/s

So a maxed cleric bunker elementalist heals itself for approximately:
40+330+145+72+125= 712 hp/sec.

We can however burst heal for up to 6000 hp without even touching our actual healing skills.

Add in our signet of restoration which heals for 362 hp per cast and 4750 when using it.
or
Glyph of elemental harmony which heals for 6094+regen for atleast 10 seconds. so a total of 9000+every 25 seconds (20% glyph recharge not included).
or
ether renewal which heals for close to 7000 on a 15 sec. cooldown (downside is the 4 seconds of casting time.)

I did not touch the scepters trident skill which also heals around 3000 or the staff water skills which also heal considerable. Add in all the damage mitigation skills the elementalist has and you’ll see why healing power is far more important than vitality or toughness.

I don’t think of it in those terms.

Just by standing next to people I increase their healing hefty amount, possibly even doubling their personal healing output.

I can do this to up to 4 people at a time (not counting myself).

So, if I can double the healing output of 4 other people just by standing around and mashing buttons but as a consequence I half my own damage output is it worth the bother. It depends on how valuable healing is. In dungeons where everyone knows all the encounters and can dodge all the big hits it’s a waste of time. In WvW, where arrowcarts are tagging everyone constantly and you can get outnumbered at a moment’s notice, it starts to be a lot more important.

Add to this, multiple people can fill the same role at the same time. If I’m dumping AoE heals on my party, and our Engineer is doing the same thing in different ways, then the only part that doesn’t stack is the Regeneration boon. All our Water finishers and AoE heals stack just fine. Every class has skills that can increase the group’s healing output, and they’re designed to stack with one another fairly well.