Guild Wars 2

Only me eh? Just my luck lol.

Fortus.6175:

It has come to my attention give my friends’ own experiences and mine that all people who rolled ele as the first and main tend to roll guardian next followed by mesmer, those two change order for some.

I just wanted to see if that trend also applies here, anyone?

Holy shyt that is scary. I did that exactly as you said. No one told me too either I just did it that way. You scares me.

BTW: Ele, Guard, Mes, Warrior, Necro, Thief.

Daecollo.9578:

You shouldn’t be forced to use all 4 attunements to be good, they need to make it so using 1 or 2 attunements is viable.

That would make ppl that use all four over powered.

Basically what the title says. After the most recent patch not too long ago, and serveral other patches. I experience a lag like no other. My texts/messages in game take almost half a minute to display. In wvw all players are inanimate. In the open world I see other players just sitting there then after a while they “zoom” really fast to their actual locations, and the process repeats its self over and over. And my skills take a while to cast if at all. Any solution to this.

Side notes: This does not begin right after the patches. Takes about 10-15 mins. to really start effecting me. I tried restarting game multiple times. Even a full computer reboot, and still the problem persists. I am doing a virus scan to make sure the problem is not on my end or my fault at least. I havent tried spvp yet but im sure the problem would effect me there as well.

Questions: Anyone else experience this? How did you fix it? Devs? Do I need to re-install the patch? Is my account at risk?

mbh.8301:

Anet knows what our opinions are (things like RNG IS BAD) and they keep in touch with the top players. I can only imagine that they talk to them so that they have something to do the opposite of.

Lol

Archer Henchman.2534:

mbh.8301:

Archer Henchman.2534:

And this, folks, is how you derail a thread with pve bullkitten and turn this forum into an unreadable cesspool,

Who cares?
OP is a madbad and all the good posts in the world don’t make a bit of difference.
Most of what people think are intellectual epiphanies are actually posts which have been happening since 2011.

I’m sad about it, not mad.

Good posts do make a difference, but our community doesnt have the equivalent of izzy taking notes from ensign or any other dev listening to an articulate and knowledgeable set of players. I was hoping Powerr’s recruitment into anet’s team would help things, but the pvp patch record since he’s joined the team hasn’t really filled my sails with wind. (not hating, though, I’m still really glad there’s a solid player who’s on the inside).

The problem is that if players comment at a roughly equivalent rates, and player engagement/skill/knowledge/lucidity follows the 1% rule and post quality follows Sturgeon’s rule(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1%25_rule_ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sturgeon%27s_Law), then from the outset the suggestions the devs are getting are from an unrepresentative sample of loud people who, on the whole, are missing 9 times for every hit they score.

Those are horrendous odds.

I’ve seen games of all genres flourish or fail based upon who devs listened to, how they listened to them, and how communities organized around games. This game is no different.

So Archer I ask you this.. Would setting up a state of the (all professions) thread in spvp, wvw, and pve forums be a better solution? To keep things separated and onto the point. Maybe doing it this way would keep things more organized, and would appeal to these certain sections of players. Posts like Jumpers “Thief- IMO” would be expected and maybe we could give them an idea as to what we want as a community instead of complaining about mods.

So its not only me then. I have noticed some awkwardness in my attempts to teleport in wvw and failing. I had assumed I was just making a small mistake as to where the margin was. Guess it’s time for a new secondary. I’m think of going S/D to utilize shadow step and FS/LS. What do you guys have in mind?

Well this forum has evolved. Nice number play I had to read it twice just to understand. In my experiences and from what i have seen D/D thieves do use the auto attack and they do get hit often. Based on your stats i’d say the ghosts would be better. It’s ironic, I have been looking into what foods I would like to use and this pretty much sums it up. Thanks and keep up the work!!

Mrbig.8019:

@rastaman dude

listen, there’ve been splits in traits for PvE and PvP.

In recent SOTGs devs stated they’re goign to split more and more and more, and they’re doing so even for WvW.

I AM THE OP and when i said “rehaul stealth tree because it’s usekitten th in PvP and PvE” i was referring to an OBVIOUS fact: stealth is bad for end-game PvE and COMPLETELY USELESS in PvP, it’s used only to grief opponents in WvW and it’s BAD DESIGN.

Aside this LITTLE DIGRESSION, all my concerns are about PvP since i don’t give a kitten about PvE.

PvE players can raise their ( legitimate) concerns in the PvE subforum, WvW players can raise their ( legitimate) concerns in the WvW forum.

This is the sPvP forum.

And this thread is about the thief in PvP

STOP YOUR NONSENSE, PLEASE.

I know you status as the orginal op. And I know you feel some type of way because the developers moved your post. What you are trying to do is tell them how to run their forums which is unacceptable. If they moved the forums it was for a good reason. Your little friend here doesn’t seem to understand that. As if A-net has no experience with handling forums. And again i say if the forum was where it was supposed to be IT WOULD HAVE STAYED. I assume you havn’t read the entire argument me and archer which is quite impressive i might say. During this argument I prove multiple times that you are both wrong in which why the post should be moved and right in which traits and skills very well can be separated between pve and pvp. And yet history shows that these changes occured in pve and pvp for the most part. Am I wrong? Even to the point that I have clear reference points from the developers posts themselves. Where is your proof… no where. You claim radical gestures from your own imagination. Even to the point where I have proved my points with your own posts. The point is you can’t deny the facts, so stop arguing with me your both wrong trying to justify your own insecurities with A-net. People like you should not be allowed to use the forums. Furthermore, like I said before, I do think thief needs a bit of work as well. All in all only time will tell.

SPLENDID!! I just recently started getting into use S/D as my secondary and this build (Wish fall) Fits me the best. I use the same traits and utilities the only thing different was the armor types. Which really intrigued me I never thought of mixing soldiers and berserkers instead of the valkyrie set up. Bravo!

Archer Henchman.2534:

The post was in the spvp forum, and was clearly designed to address the state of thieves’ viability in spvp. Do you think that Grouch’s dev sitdown’s name changes what the thread was designed to do?

This here is a direct quote from the original post.
“Rehaul stealth tree, stealth has no use both in PvP and PvE: you should reward players to actively use stealth, not to sit passively in it while gaining health and initiative.”
While his main focus may very well be spvp related he still mentions pve. And it does not change the fact that a-net wants to please both pve and pvp players. I already proved that most of their changes to professions occur in both pve and pvp, so let it go you lost this one.

Archer Henchman.2534:

Muddling sources of input by moving the thread does not help; if wvwvw thieves want to make a thread in the wvwvw section and devs believe that their issues are more pertinent wrt a specific skill or mechanic than what’s listed here, that’s their call.

If you feel what a-net did here was unjustified take that up with them. I didn’t tell them to move it. I’m pretty sure the people getting paid to do this know what they are doing. If the post was in the right place it would have stayed there.[/quote]

Archer Henchman.2534:

A bunch of off-the-wall suggestions made by players with little design knowledge is exactly the problem at hand. If you think those types of suggestions are an issue, then you’d want to see the source of the suggestion in order to determine the aim of the suggestion so that you can evaluate it better.

I encourage players to think “outside of the box” as to what needs to be done. Proof of encouragement. (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Stop-nerfing-us/first#post2192670)
The developers think so as well. why would we have a suggestion forum? In current SOTG videos the devs themselves say they read the forums, and they like to read what we have to say.

Archer Henchman.2534:

Anet nerfed quickness in order to lower the speed at which zerk groups cleared CoF1; no one in the pvp community was complaining about quickness, while lots of people were kittening about the formation of exclusive speedrun groups. The removal of quickness from the arsenals of warriors and rangers has decimated the warrior population and turned them into a huge liability, while it also severely reduced the effectiveness of rangers overall. I don’t recall seeing a single warrior in the previous tournament, whereas warriors STILL zerk farm CoF1.

Lol your own quote!! This further proves my point as to how changes are taken place in both pvp AND pve. Also shows how hard it is to please everyone. Which is why they need everyone’s input.

Archer Henchman.2534:

Competitive balance is more brittle than balance against PvE mobs, accordingly it should be a primary concern. Dealing with PvE mechanics and class desirability can be solved by adding boss mechanics which substantially favor certain classes, whereas the only x-factor in pvp is map design, which iterates far less frequently than changes to dungeons and their mechanics do.

Your own quote again!! So in other words it is even harder than we thought to change a profession to benefit pve AND pvp players, because the objectives differ.

Nice story though I can tell this took some time to write up. I’m flattered you are turning to call me names instead of sticking to the point (nice maturity here). Anywho do you even know what you are defending? Are you saying a-net was wrong to move the post? Is getting input from all players before a big trait change bad? Why not have all this information in one place? Should professions be very different between spvp and pve to the point of unrecognition? Please read before you type, it saves the embarrassment. Anything else I can help you with?

Archer Henchman.2534:

You realize your list of ‘proposed changes’ are things that single posters have mentioned, and largely changes that don’t solve any of the issues the the class?

Regardeless if you feel the changes made no effect, The game developers that posted these updates are slowly but surley make changes that effect everyone. I do respect opinions but you can’t speak for everyone. For some of our players these updates where crucial to thier gameplay.

Archer Henchman.2534:

Next, skills have already started to be split between PvE and PvP, so if the change is substantial, there’s no need to maintain it across gametypes (besides for an argument about maintaining shared functionality across gametypes, which is silly, because the different damage modifiers possible in, say, wvwvw, create completely different expectations of players within classes.)

I posted proof that ALOT of the updates occured in both pvp and pve. AND I also posted proof that changes CAN be made just in pvp or just in pve. So I don’t know where you are getting at saying changes are not and can’t be changed over pve and pvp when clearly the majority of all changes occur in both sections of the game. Also I did acknowledge changes with damage modifiers such as the confusion nerf. Another one would be the retaliation nerf in spvp.

Archer Henchman.2534:

Originally I looked at the skill changes you talked about, but then I realized that all of the proposals on the table are to strengthen those skills, which shouldn’t break any pve/pvp workflow issues.

I do appreciate you looking at what I posted. However I think you getting this idea because I posted alot about how these changes could possibly ruin the profession overall. Seeing that the changes in the past occurred in both pve and pvp for the most part. The slightest mistake by A-net could be devastating. Mistakes like biased opinions from only sPvP players could insure the failure of the professions.

Archer Henchman.2534:

Given the above, I have no idea how straight improvements to the class which have been requested threaten to ruin pve, nor do I see what spvp gains from commentary from the wvwvw and pve crowd.

I do apologize before hand as I can not find the post where this was stated. For example it was once stated that a fix to thief not being able to cap points while in stealth was to make him slightly visible to the point where the enemy can see you the way your team does when you go stealth. If this change was also applied to wvw, I’t would completely change how a thief works in wvw.

What you are defending here is the idea that A-net moved this thread out of the spvp section to get more feedback from spvpers. See how rediculous this sounds now? Now doesn’t my proposale make more sense. And why wouldn’t A-net try to appeal to all players?

Furthermore SOTG (State of the game), contains discussions (while occasionaly focused on pvp or some other aspect) about the game over all and its professions. Listing problems such as thief effectiveness in dungeons. Changes to how professions work in pve, and great ides from the community as to what spvp play needs.
These posts like this one named "State of the(Thief, Mesmer, ect….), should include details on spvp, pve, and wvw. Now how does one achieve this by limiting posts to only spvpers? The forum title should read “Thief pvp” or “sPvP ideas (Thief)”. So again please stop arguing with me.

Mrbig.8019:

Rastaman.9015:

Mrbig.8019:

Rastaman.9015:

@Archer Henchman.2534 Please get your facts straight before you come and expose your ignorance. Thank you.

skills are split between pve and pvp version.

your point is invalid.

in pve stuff can remain the same if you’re happy, in pvp stuff needs to change.

period

Traits my friend traits. Not skills. And recent changes especially to rangers traits the change was made in both pve and spvp.

Eles, regarding evasive arcana and such, would like to disagree, and inform you are wrong.

Cheers.

These are all changes made in both pve and spvp…
Elementalist
Ring of Earth skill: No longer destroys unblockable projectiles.
Lightning Whip skill: Now strikes targets in a similar angle to other melee ranged skills.
Elemental Surge trait: Now functions correctly with the Arcane Shield skill while the player is attuned to air.
Conjure skill: Summoned weapons now correctly appear in the player’s hands if certain on-swap sigils are equipped.
Arcane Energy trait: Now works properly with the Arcane Power, Arcane Shield, and Signet of Restoration skills.
Rock Anchor skill: No longer able to affect targets at infinite range. Now respects line of sight.
Air Bubble skill: No longer able to affect targets at infinite range. Now respects line of sight.

Engineer
Glue Bomb skill: The radius of the effects is now consistent—240 units for all effects when untraited, 360 units for all effects when traited.
Adrenaline Pump trait: Now works with turrets and racial skills.
Short Fuse trait: Now works underwater even when the Grenadier trait is equipped.
Inertial Converter trait: Now works underwater for the Grenade Barrage skill.
Rocket Kick skill: Now hits targets at maximum range.
Fire Bomb skill: No longer deletes the bomb if the player jumps at the wrong time.
Smoke Bomb skill: No longer deletes the bomb if the player jumps at the wrong

Guardian
Symbol of Judgment skill:
Now acts as a combo field even if the Writ of Exaltation trait is not equipped.
No longer heals for less without the Writ of Exaltation trait. It now uses the higher value in all cases, and the healing fact on the tool tip is now always accurate.

Dont feel like finding more but you get the point by now i hope. And i’m not some snarky kid so here are some instances where you are right.

Guardian
Perfect Inscriptions trait: Now functions in PvE.

Ranger
Pets now draw aggro from guards in WvW.

Elementalist
Signet of Restoration:
This skill now has its cooldown reduced by the Signet Mastery in PvP.
Spiteful Talisman:
This trait now works with Reaper’s Touch in PvE.

This is from update notes May 28th and June 11th.
As you can see the pvp, wvw, pve specific changes are GREATLY outnumbered. And with the vast amounts of trait changes to come, we can only expect that alot if not all changes will be in all pvp, wvw, and pve. So please stop arguing with me. NEXT.

Mrbig.8019:

Rastaman.9015:

@Archer Henchman.2534 Please get your facts straight before you come and expose your ignorance. Thank you.

skills are split between pve and pvp version.

your point is invalid.

in pve stuff can remain the same if you’re happy, in pvp stuff needs to change.

period

Traits my friend traits. Not skills. And recent changes especially to rangers traits the change was made in both pve and spvp.

Vortex.3712:

as a fellow i thief i feel like the reason why people say thief are op is not because of back stab or stealth but heart seeker strike being able to be spammed…as a thief i feel like we do not need to spam HS for our dps so i think raising the initiative cost will stop a majority of the whining. what do you guys think i don’t want the skill to be changed like its function because i need that for my d/p build but i also think i don’t need to spam that skill. Thoughts?..

Nah I don’t want to be punished for other thieves bad tactics or other players inability to counter it. We made countless threads on how to counter spammers. If they didn’t read it not our problem. But thanks for at least thinking of ways to calm the calamity down. Keep thinking you might find the perfect solution.

@Archer Henchman.2534 Please get your facts straight before you come and expose your ignorance. Thank you.

Archer Henchman.2534:

Rastaman.9015:

Archer Henchman.2534:

Rastaman.9015:

lol you really have some nerve. Regardless of where you yourself see the problem in these skills. They still persist everywhere in which both pvpers and pvers can relate. Which is why the old thread was moved so all thieves pvp and pve could post and give A-net a good well rounded opinion on what should be done. Not just listen to spvpers and change the profession based on them, and leave pve thieves out of the loop. What the moderater did was good, and your acting childish about the situation.

A good well rounded opinion on issues in sPvP coming from people who play WvW and PvE?

What?

These issues don’t just affect spvp. If they were to make big changes to the traits and what the skills do, it would be to everyone regardless of spvp or pve and wvw. Therefore they need opinions from everyone in order to please everyone.

What big changes to traits and skills exactly are being proposed here, and when has anet floated potential changes for us to discuss in the past.

Oh wait, none and never.

Thieves are talking about their issues in sPvP. If the issues are compartmentalized, why would you try to have a conversation between people who are discussing fundamentally different issues?

Just incase you didnt see it here you go…
1. Death blossom should be reworked, and aNet need to get their mind clear with daggers ( condi ? direct damage ? control/support ? )
((Changing death blossom could possibly sabotage condition spec thieves in pve aiming for aoe bleeds on the mobs.))

2. OH dagger should become a support weapon like OH pistol, there’re tons of ways to do so ( make dancing dagger and C&D able to spread poison/weakness or similar, reduce ini cost while not making C&D able to gain benefits from Infusion of Shadow).
Like this it could be used by condition sets like P/D.
(( C&D not benefiting from Infusion of shadows mainly effects wvw thieves, reducing their “synergy” or “flow” in small fights.))

3. Pistol whip needs to be reworked.
(( S/P is highly recommened by mainy pro thieves for leveling up via pve. Changing it could possibly destroy this build in pve.))

4. Sword traits, please
((Adding sword traits means removal of other traits which could possibly hurt mainy build including pve pvp and wvw.))

5. Overall better traits: we need more sinergies, the thief is the class with absolutely worst sinergies in the whole game, and with arguably one of the worst set of traits.
( a good example of a good sinergy is Lotus Poison trait).
A thief has overall no ways to be played if not stacking damage or ini regen.
Rehaul stealth tree, stealth has no use both in PvP and PvE: you should reward players to actively use stealth, not to sit passively in it while gaining health and initiative.
We need support options, and overall we need MORE DAMAGE and LESS DAMAGE TRAITS STACKING.
(( Changeing the way stealth works whether it be good or bad is mentioned by the auther of this thread to be worthless in PvP and PvE. Implying it should be changed in PvP AND PvE.))

6. You need to revaluate the trade off between certain u-skills.
traps are horribad ( mostly due to having no traits related, not being AoEs and not being persistent), Shadow refuge is borderline OP and n.1 reason why the thief is brought into competitive play, Roll for Ini is horrible, smoke screen, venoms, blinding powder and such are all terrible choices if you compare them to other stuff like signets ( aside signet of shadows) and shadow refuge.
(( Lots of utility skills are listed here changeing this much would deffinatley effect players from anywhere whether it be PvP, PvE, or WvW.))

Im not disagreeing with any of his opinions as I too think thief needs a bit more work. Furthermore, besides from things like the confusion damage nerf in spvp. Trait changes (listed many times by the auther) would not only take place in spvp but also would take the same effect in both PvE, and WvW. Therefore to please everyone a-net would like to hear from all sides.

And to top it all off. A direct quote from Jon peters on a sotg stream.

Mod jon_peters: every single trait line is seeing at least 1 change

The thread can be found here.
“https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Incoming-ele-trait-changes/first”

Archer Henchman.2534:

Rastaman.9015:

lol you really have some nerve. Regardless of where you yourself see the problem in these skills. They still persist everywhere in which both pvpers and pvers can relate. Which is why the old thread was moved so all thieves pvp and pve could post and give A-net a good well rounded opinion on what should be done. Not just listen to spvpers and change the profession based on them, and leave pve thieves out of the loop. What the moderater did was good, and your acting childish about the situation.

A good well rounded opinion on issues in sPvP coming from people who play WvW and PvE?

What?

These issues don’t just affect spvp. If they were to make big changes to the traits and what the skills do, it would be to everyone regardless of spvp or pve and wvw. Therefore they need opinions from everyone in order to please everyone.

Yiyojin.3241:

What’s the deal?
FIx the kitten system. This is impossible to play more like this.
Getting a team full of nubs to play against premade. + Classes setup is just crazy. Get a full team of bunkers. Or full team of Dps. or 2-3 same classes team. simply bad class setup like 60-70% of the time you solo que.

Get some friends that pvp alot and your problem is solved

lol you really have some nerve. Regardless of where you yourself see the problem in these skills. They still persist everywhere in which both pvpers and pvers can relate. Which is why the old thread was moved so all thieves pvp and pve could post and give A-net a good well rounded opinion on what should be done. Not just listen to spvpers and change the profession based on them, and leave pve thieves out of the loop. What the moderater did was good, and your acting childish about the situation.

Definitely interesting but I think this would make thief truly op. Although it would promote more “tactical” play.

Frenk.5917:

laquito.5269:

Thats not how stealth is supposed to work. If your opponent is any good, u’ll never be able to land a backstab this way. I’d be willing to trade some stealth for more mobility (+damage), but as long as that doesn’t happen, I think stealth itself is balanced, theres just one particular weaponset that is being abused for extensive stealth access.

TL;DR
Try to play something different to d/p and you might realize that the class offers something different to easy mode.

I played all thieves spec. D/D condi, P/D condi, D/D bers, S/D pre and after buff, D/P and S/P. The only one I haven’t played is P/P.

I still don’t understand how we can convince ourselves that “if someone is good he can avoid being backstabbed”. No. He can’t. You know why? Because I’m not stupid enough to backstab when he expects me to backastab him. Also, 2 evades can’t save anyone from getting backstabbed.

Im right with you I actually stealth and make you use up all your endurance before i go for the backstab. My 50% movement speed while stealthed and other traits makes my backstabs almost unavoidable. the only profession I come in to even the slightest problem with landing a backstab is mesmers with all their clones, but even with them you just have to wait a little while longer and then go in for the kill.

I loved the music and gameplay. I just recently started using s/d as secondary in spvp and soon wvw. I really love the boon stealing especially on guards/eles. I remeber fighting a necro in tPvP and he popped lich form or what ever it’s called that gives alot of stability… needless to say the only thing that could shut a thief down (crowd control) was non effective

I do have a question however. I’m haveing trouble finding the right sigil for my sword. I figure id just go air since im on a d/d crit build. I tried to ampplify the immobalize and cripple at once but the sigils really dont add anything. What do you suggest?

Umm guys, you do know the elementalist is the strongest profession in the game right?
But more on the subject I do see where your coming from about not being able to be a healer, or tank if you wanted. You are kind of forced to be an all around player if you want to or not which isn’t entirely true, but compared to other games based on their healers (the steady and constant healing) I don’t think gw2 has a healer profession. Tanks imo would be the ranger, and all around dps would be warrior, but healer is just non existent.

EDIT the closest ive come to becoming a healer was S/F and traiting up for lots of vigor ,endurance regen on crits, and utlization of evasive arcana. Water signet and even the water elite form. But this can only hold my team up for about one minute average.

TBH S/D might help you out more than S/P because PW keeps you in place too long. Also S/D is really good against boon bunkers. P/P is just crap anywhere you go imo, but ive seen some people put down with P/P just dont get caught up with P/P cuz then you have no way out.

Engels.8537:

Rastaman.9015:

1) It’s a challenge believe it or not.

jokes aside please,

Lol if you don’t believe so, you may have never put yourself in challenging situations, OR you are just that good. But for the majority thief has a huge learning curve.

Mijo.3274:

this is my set up when i do tpvp with my ele:
Trinkets: cleric
Runes: ogre
main hand dagger: force
off hand dagger: superior sigil of battle (this one alone let you play with perma 9 stacks of might)

Lol I use the exact same thing.

Tachenon.5270:

Rimu.7105:

Just like in guild wars 1, where rangers were practically only nerfed, you cant take away our awesomeness!!!!!!

Nerf my bow
Nerf my pet
Nerf stuff I ain’t thought of yet
We don’t care
We won’t fuss
You can’t take the awe from us!

Lol made my day!!

This question seems to be asked alot lately. I’ll make a guide on how not only me but most d/d sb thieves build to literally survive anything. While putting out huge damage of course.

Seth.4927:

If you want to try out some extra survival on the cheap there is a Orb that gives you the same amount of Power/Crit % Damage than Ruby orbs but instead of Precision it gives Vitality, I’m not ingame to see the name. With the 5% Precision transferred to Vitality it gives my full zerker thief around 13k hp.

There is no Orb that gives Power/Crit % Damage/Toughness unfortunately.

It’s called the Beryl Orb. Its blue and favors the Valkyrie stats.

Its probably the berserker stats you were running. I my self can’t be instagibbed by anything (has been tested). Go with valk armour and berserker trinkets and weapons.

Also go 0/30/30/10/0 Build

This with some good reactions and knowledge of the game should make you invincible. The only issue with this build is wearing down bunker builds. S/D is very effective against boon relyant bunker builds. But it is a sacrafice of mobility. GL

Kreed.2768:

I don’t really think you can compare the two. One’s a utility skill with a 60 sec cd and the other a weapon skill with no cd. Also, the notes state that Spectral Recall needs to be used within 8 seconds, while Shadow Return has a 15 second window. Let’s be honest; you can’t get as far in 8 seconds as you can in 15 seconds.

I think he means the utility shadow return. I say the utility should have infinite range and the weapon skill from sword main hand should be limited.

Erdem.8956:

Thank you for giving me an insight on the matter.

• So which item prefixes are mostly used by thieves?
• What’s the best way to get/balance enough survivability without cripple damage so much?
• Which one is prefered most toughness or vitality? I know glass cannons aren’t suited for WvW (except maybe solo/small party roaming).

-For armor go Valkyrie. Trinkets and weapons go Berserker.

-Make use of stealth by going 30 in shadow arts(stealth is your friend. And utilize our crit damage since the hidden killer trait can guarantee a crit.

-Toughness is typically better than vitality but in order to get toughness you would have to sacrifice ALOT of damage so go vitality.

Dagger storm for me is only used for tagging the zerg, stability, fighting a ranger(special occasion). Other than that it is completely useless to me in wvw. Do the daggers even bounce? I like the evade because the locked animation makes you completely vulnerable to melee players (aka everybody). To us thieves, dagger storm is considered a troll. Fix it please.

swinsk.6410:

Also, as a mesmer, stand directly in your clones and it will literally make it impossible to land a backstab.

This is the best thing you can do against a backstab thief. Keep a clone behind you at all times. Even the mesmer trait that makes a clone when you dodge is very effective. I end up having to wait a few more seconds for the mesmer to dodge and blink out before I go for the backstab. This will give you time for your cool downs.

EDIT: In addition to clones, mesmers have alot of blocks( Scepter 2, Off hand sword 4 ect.) Use these skills when he goes into stealth. Also the chaos storm from staff is very effective against a thief as it not only gives you aegis but also dazes and cripples the thief.(Also when using the chaos storm run in circles around the inner perimeter so you still get buffs and it forces him to chase you while crippled.) Furthermore, if you have room in your traits, make your clones cripple when killed.

Ralathar.7236:

Rastaman.9015:

Sorry to disappoint you, but thief was made specifically to not get caught. A thief is supposed to take out key targets to win the fight and to do that he can’t get caught. And to balance this if he does get caught his low defenses will show.

So if you are built to not get caught then you getting caught was your own misplaying. therefore you are saying thieves are not intended to get caught and ergo not intended to die?

Because honestly if you don’t get caught your low defenses will never show.

Exactly. Now that is where the hard part of being a thief comes into play. You have to know what not to get caught by from every profession. You have to know every skill in the game and how to counter it. Players that achieve this are the “skilled” players in game.

Zunhar explained exactly what you wanted.

MrForz.1953:

Yeah it’s cool, but you’re just cluttering this section aswell with.. well, ‘QQ’ too.

Because he didn’t know that right? Sorry but that type of thing gets under my skin.

Caom.9251:

I know this itself can be considered as QQ so I’m being a hypocrite but something needs to be done about this.

Further more the devs know that most of the people complaining have never played thief. And they also know that the complainers that finally play one realize how wrong they truly were. A thread posted last night shows this exact experience. So really and truly those thread spammers are just wasting lots of time.

Daecollo said it best. It grabs the boon and all the stacks it resides.

Sorry to disappoint you, but thief was made specifically to not get caught. A thief is supposed to take out key targets to win the fight and to do that he can’t get caught. And to balance this if he does get caught his low defenses will show.

Doomdesire.9365:

I’m sure you could probably land a 35K one given that you use full zerker ascended, a might stacking build via signets, bloodlust, force, and impact sigils(after using basilik) on a low level, naked warrior with frenzy.

LMAO just keep adding on.

Also animalmom said it best, if dagger storm is on cool down. poison field and cluster bomb will work wonders for your zerg. Thanks animalmom.

Erdem.8956:

My question is specifically for WvW zergs and maybe for high level FotM to some extent.

I’m thinking of creating a thief since few of my friends seems to enjoy playing with thieves a lot (even though there is all kinda hate in forums for thief profession).

I know thieves are great solo roamers… But is it true that they just melt in big zerg vs zerg fights because of random AoEs? My friends seem to die. A lot. Generally speaking on zerg fights they seem to really struggle. If they are not standing back and nuking things with their bow they seem to be dead.

Either I’m missing the mechanics or thieves has such terrible base health, low armor, and no damage mitigations. Is not getting hit only way to survive?

Does anyone have any hints on surviving? Any hints to enhance survivability without cripple damage so much? What kind of equipments mostly used by pro-thieves?

A thieves job in zerg fights is to take out key players. So Elementalists, mesmers, other thieves, even players that are maning the arrow carts and such. Also fighting the perimiters is a thief specialty. For no reason (besides Dagger Storm) should a thief be in the middle of a zerg fight, that is why we have guardians and warriors. Think of a thief like your military snipers. Get in and right back out nothing else to it. Also the thief can use dagger storm to cripple enemies to benefit his own zerg in taking down the enemy. I only do wvw and spvp so I can speak on fotm behalf. But yea Thief=Sniper.
~Invis Dreamz

Vanthian.9267:

Thief is by far the class that needs the least amount of skill to achieve.

I stopped here. You sir are incredibly wrong. Almost everyone on the forums that complains first, and then gives it a try QUICKLY eat their words. And realize just how difficult the thief profession is. If it was really as op as you say why isn’t it ranked tier 1 among the professions. I’m not mad or anything just give it a good weeks play and come back with results. I bet your prospective will change. Ill even give you a pretty good dagger/dagger build (assuming that’s the one you don’t like so much).

ahuba.6430:

MightyMe.1356:

Not if they’re specifically pvp oriented threads.

if you’re asking for changes to skill then its not specifically pvp oriented at all.

Your wrong. They keep skill changes separate between spvp and pve/wvw. Most times that is

ok so I don’t like sword/dagger but I can’t deny it’s effectiveness. So teach me the way masters of the Sword/Dagga!! I have given it some play but not enough. I need to know what to trait and combo rotation ( I do realize that the thief profession is more situational than anything else so “rotations” are not necessary, but give me a general roll out).
My thoughts where go heavy evasions with 30 in acrobatics and either trickery or Critical strikes. I really have no clue at this point. I need help…

Thanks guys I will definitely take all this into consideration when playing. My studies of the engineer continue.

Well P/D is more conditions and D/D is more direct damage. And the thief cant really do both so which one do you want? Is this in regards to Wild Bills build? I ask because he is P/D main and D/D secondary.

I swear to god I thought about this a couple weeks ago. A staff thief that hits multiple times in quick successions. I say the out of stealth attack should be a short knockdown. and the 3 ability be a 10 hit combo for a base 500 damage each hit. The auto attack should be really fast but lower damage this would make signet of malice viable. 2 ability should be a leap attack. And 4 should be an ankle attack that cripples. 5 should be a stealth maneuver that doesn’t require you to hit anything( lots of initiative here).

Hey guys I come here to learn how to kill you! >:-) But on a serious note, I respect all engineer players because I do know you guys have to micromanage just like the elementalist does. I have played all professions besides the engineer and currently am saving up to buy another character slot for it.

What I want to know is how do most people build? What is the burst rotations? When is an engineer vulnerable? HOW THE kitten DO I COUNTER GRENADES? What is the glass cannon build like? Thanks in advance. And to trade off ill make a thread on how to counter a thief with the engineer once i learn how engineers play.