Thanks Shoogli! Paralyzation adds a full second to the daze. The other runes are superior sigils of ice and they do stack. I didn’t have those on the pistols for every fight in the video but they are the ones I’m sticking with. Having the Sigil of Paralyzation on the sword is a must. You need that extra second on the daze. The other sigils you can change out for whatever you want really, just as long as you keep the Paralyzation.
I’m avoiding using Para on my S/D combo because it will probably get fixed someday. I figure if I don’t ever use it I won’t have to get sad when it’s awesomeness is gone. So purposefulness gimping myself for now…
I like it the way it is as well there is just one change I would like. Swap the effects around so the 1st hit rips a boon and the 2nd hit is unblockable. Currently the unblockable aspect of it kind of sucks.
The first hit it unblockable to be able to remove boons through Aegis. Honestly, I prefer it that way since there are better ways of doing damage.
Ah I see, I don’t know why I always assumed one removed and the other was unblock-able. So the first hit does both and the 2nd is just pure damage..
Best way to gear quick is to split it with all available resources. Make a build work with all P/V/T armor (ruby orbs or whatever orb for your stats in all if you want cheap build). You get 4/6 P/V/T armor from karma merchants in Orr and 2/6 from badges. Save money made in WvW or whatever else for exotic weapons first then ammy ^ accessories/rings.
Search TP for “spineguard” pick up rare P/V/T backslot for cheap, put in orb (exquisite jewel if you have ~50s).
Start out with all greens and replace them with each pieces as you get them. Save karma jugs and spend gold to get 75 gems to buy a 50% karma boost, then drink a bunch at once so you can get karma armor faster.
Apparently you guys aren’t aware of gaming “Whales” who are spending many thousands of dollars in their F2P game of choice with cash shops. It’s where a huge amount of Anets non box sales income will come from. These being for sale are a perfect sales item for them especially since the Whales need them on their alts too.
Part of the beauty of having things easily accessible via tons of cash OR putting a ridiculous amount of work/playtime into it is you will never know who the Whales are. There is always the chance they grinded in game. This is why you won’t see really big ticket items that are gem shop only (even if there were in GW2, you could still buy gems with in game gold). There is still a very negative stigma associated with using cash so it gives them something to hide behind.
Max run speed is 50% bonus. Thieves can achieve this with a trait that boosts run speed to 50% when stealthed.
There is still a hard cap of +33% out of combat speed. A thief using blinding powder to gain stealth out of combat with this trait still only moves 33% faster since it’s a hard cap. In combat though it does work +50% because it’s no where near the hard cap of +33% of out of combat speed.
So I’m at the point now where I’m trying to pimp my ride with some skins. One problem I have is many chestpieces(Medium Human) will cover my offhand dagger skin with the cloak/left leg while in combat stance. I can’t tell this until i buy the armor and try it out. So far I’ve found the base crafted armor skin does not do this. Anyone know others that don’t have this issue? Seem to be related to the longer trench or cloak look.
Burst thieves punish people with poor reflexes, utilities and builds much more than any other profession. No doubt they are noob slayers even if they are noobs themselves.. That’s all these screenshots prove.
If this is how you approach issues, then the world can’t make sense to you. You define the problem to have a cause and conclude it to be so. Interesting. Oh well … not gonna lecture you on logic, latency, networks or anatomy … but you DO need to read up on those if you want to be a part of this century.
@pedrst: Nicely put.
So are you trying to say that Thief burst needs to be balanced around people playing from AOL dial-up with one arm? We sort of assume all things being equal in that arena.
The only thing I’ll concede is that thief burst is extremely effective (OP?) vs players who are distracted with abilities on cool-down. Which is what everyone is pointing out about hotjoin.
So then, do you balance burst (for anyone) to be avoidable in that set of circumstances? If you do, then what good will it ever be? Especially vs a competent, attentive opponent with cool-downs up.
This is sadly exactly why they won’t ever make badges useful. They have been mostly useless for this long so everyone has a ton of them. Anything good they add is just like automatically giving most WvWers the items(s).
Is this our problem? They didn’t give us something useful, so we can just throw away the only reward we’ve got in months of WvW playing? Don’t we deserve it? “Nope, you better throw away 4k badges and free some space in your bank!”
Seems legit.
Nope, it’s a problem with the game design at the start. Why was only one set of stats available via badges that overlapped with much easier to get Karma gear? Who knows… even the weapon skins look pretty terrible.
I’m not saying I agree with it, just saying when they update with a new shiny they probably want us chasing that carrot for a bit to keep up busy. Allowing it to be purchased with badges won’t do that. I could be wrong or maybe they will just add way cooler skins to badge gear to make it at least cosmetically useful.
I like it the way it is as well there is just one change I would like. Swap the effects around so the 1st hit rips a boon and the 2nd hit is unblockable. Currently the unblockable aspect of it kind of sucks.
Reviving IS a valid tactic against people who gank and/or frontload damage. Basically, you want a counter to your ability nerfed. Invoking the meaningless word “skill” is meaningless. They could say reviving people before you stomp them or preventing stomps is a “skill”?
Also your premise that no other game does this is just wrong. DAOC and Warhammer, two big open-world RvR exampkitten th had long distance resurrections with cast times of a couple seconds. This game requires melee range and everybody can resurrect…but on balance it’s about a wash.
I’d say in the arena of PvP-based MMOs ….the games where ressurrecting is easy to moderately difficult outnumber those where it’s difficult or nearly impossible….
In DAOC there was also a resurrection sickness debuff and casted resurrection could be interrupted by a fart in their general direction.
Make them obtainable through badges.
I have like 2k because you can’t spend them on anything.
You get pvt gear easily and way faster outside and for siege you just do the jp once and you’re set.
They’re kitten worthless and i really have no nerves to grind daily after daily just to hope lady RNG will love me some day.
Go to hell with this RNG kitten.
This is sadly exactly why they won’t ever make badges useful. They have been mostly useless for this long so everyone has a ton of them. Anything good they add is just like automatically giving most WvWers the items(s).
Reviving is fine. Not being able to revive from dead when you are in combat would fix nothing.
Stealth stomps on the other hand, should be removed.
Remove stability stomps, mist form stomps, invulnerability stomps and elixir S stomps and maybe we can talk.
No reason for those to be nerfed. If your team knows you are getting stomped and don’t react accordingly then that is their problem. Being stomped when you don’t even know you are being stomped, is a problem however.
Furthermore, all the skills you mention are on fairly long cooldowns, whereas stealth is easily accessible.
They are all more powerful than stealth stomp. A majority of “stealth stomps” is a thief coming up to you while you are down, hitting you with C&D then channeling stomp. Maybe they don’t have the init and use a SR near you or hit blinding powder or their stealth heal. In any case, if it thief goes stealth near a downed person don’t you sort of assume they are stomping? Everyone but war, egnie and ranger can interrupt them with their #2 and anyone can come to the rescue with a KB or just DPS.
Only two profs can avoid stability and immune stomps, Thief and Ele and no one can help you with KB or DPS (for immune). Those stomps are way more powerful at the cost of being less accessible. It’s pretty balanced. You just need to pay more attention to what’s going on around you.
No. 1v1 you might expect it. In a 10v10+ you won’t.
Furthermore, Stealth Stomping does not waste an entire cool down simply for a stomp. An ele who uses Mist Form to stomp for example, knows that he is using Mist Form solely to get that stomp off. Take for example a Thief stealth housing to res a downed ally instead. 2 people join in the effort. You now have a free revive and 4 players stealthed for 10 seconds that may run around the battlefield and stomp a variety of people. A player downed on the edge of the battlefield may have no clue that Stealth House even went down, and neither will the players around him. They are completely unaware that their ally is about to get stomped, and react to the situation accordingly.
The longer I’m down with any Thieves around the more leery I get. You just have to pay attention. I don’t really have sympathy for someone in a 10v10 that doesn’t notice or hear a house go down and then sits there not using #2. People going to save downed people with thieves around usually blow their knockback before trying to rez, as they should. I’ve been knocked back after 8-9 seconds of stealth trying to stomp someone because a guardian came to rez and just did a KB as a precaution. Warriors will frenzy/100blades over a downed player and quickly down a Thief who is trying to stealth stomp. It’s not hard. Stomping is by far the most dangerous activity a thief can do even with stealth.
Burst thieves punish people with poor reflexes, utilities and builds much more than any other profession. No doubt they are noob slayers even if they are noobs themselves.. That’s all these screenshots prove.
Reviving is fine. Not being able to revive from dead when you are in combat would fix nothing.
Stealth stomps on the other hand, should be removed.
Remove stability stomps, mist form stomps, invulnerability stomps and elixir S stomps and maybe we can talk.
No reason for those to be nerfed. If your team knows you are getting stomped and don’t react accordingly then that is their problem. Being stomped when you don’t even know you are being stomped, is a problem however.
Furthermore, all the skills you mention are on fairly long cooldowns, whereas stealth is easily accessible.
They are all more powerful than stealth stomp. A majority of “stealth stomps” is a thief coming up to you while you are down, hitting you with C&D then channeling stomp. Maybe they don’t have the init and use a SR near you or hit blinding powder or their stealth heal. In any case, if it thief goes stealth near a downed person don’t you sort of assume they are stomping? Everyone but war, egnie and ranger can interrupt them with their #2 and anyone can come to the rescue with a KB or just DPS.
Only two profs can avoid stability and immune stomps, Thief and Ele and no one can help you with KB or DPS (for immune). Those stomps are way more powerful at the cost of being less accessible. It’s pretty balanced. You just need to pay more attention to what’s going on around you.
@Stiv – I suppose you could replace S/D with D/D in this build and it would do just fine. I’ll have to make a D/D vid soon.
Yea but S/D is so fun :P I love the auto for pressuring downed state + rezers. #2 is amazing and after getting used to #3 is really good as well. I’m playing S/D D/D currently which is great but I def miss having range. Especially when a necro pops a 10min blind field.
What’s needed is Anet to make a statement one way or the other to shut the crybabies up. This same thing happened with “night-capping” in WvW. It was cried and cried about until Anet finally made a statement and basically said: it’s intended, deal with it, it’s not going to change. Now people post off hours recruitment threads for their servers instead of daily QQ threads.
Until Anet stands behind their system and points out they believe it’s a L2P issue and nothing more (or not) the QQtrain will never slow down.
I honestly don’t care what route they go. Stand behind their design or total overhaul, just either stand behind your system or don’t and communicate with the player-base. The incessant crying is annoying as hell and makes it hard not to jump in and argue with idiots when surfing these forums.
Another huge problem for me personally is that I have now built an armor/weapon set for every possible spec. I found the one I enjoy the most (S/D – D/x) and the only thing left to do is “pimp it out” looks wise. I’m currently working toward one of the cheaper forge recipes (I’m amazed GW2 has gotten me to start PvEing). If I go through all that to end up having something about the build made crap or changed to be un-enjoyable it would ruin the game for me. I can’t imagine how people deal with getting something as time consuming as a legendary then having that weapon set ruined by a patch.
Stealth is part of combat. This would make us have to stay in it for the duration giving our enemies that entire time to do whatever they want. It would also promote max burst builds.
If they are going to make any major changes to stealth it is going to be an entire class overhaul. Maybe they decides they want to go traditional toggle stealth and re-design.
I doubt it though, they are stubborn with controversial things like downed state. This stealth mechanic is unique and their own design. I doubt they throw it away. Especially since it’s not an issue for experienced, skilled players which are the ones they want to attract for e-sports and such.
Seems like the big thing to complain about is the SR^Backstab^Mug^HS with haste maybe thrown in. What if they (similar to how sigil of int works) made it so the first backstab that is thrown from stealth is full on but a miss would make the subsequent ones do 25% less damage when they hit.
It is sort of lame that if you do happen to time a good evade right when someone tries to BS you they get no punishment other than a loss of ~1 second of stealth time. This punishes spammers but lets people who BS precisely keep the current burst.
Thieves have stealth available in all builds because it’s a utility? Same reason Ele’s have mist form available in all builds… RTL is like C&D. Everyone complains about it but not every Ele can use it. It’s just that the Thief has a shortbow or has two choices for offhand, pistol or dagger. Dagger gets C&D. Even if a Thief uses a shortbow there is still a 50/50 chace they have access to C&D on swap. Ele have way more choices, not that they they are all good.
Trying to compare Ele and Thief staying power if you take away stealth is a joke. If you really think Ele survivability = Thief when there is no stealth then…
Especially a GC thief which is what you seem to be complaining about. They have zero survivability. Haste stomps only work against bads. You can tell when someone is hasted and use #2 to interrupt.
Disagree on the basis most don’t know which tier they are in. I know ofc but many don’t.
Rather, separate WvW forums into general WvW, and WvW matchup discussion. Then each week the new matchup threads are posted (as are) in WvW matchup discussion, and don’t get buried, and the dribble of dolyaks OP (seen it said) goes into general.
I’d think most forum goes who post here know their tier. Just plain server forums would be nice to keep it simple.
That thief should stop using a mini while fighting. He was giving away his location.
Lucky for him the people he was fighting weren’t very good.
I’m guessing since his build seems to go for max damage while remaining in stealth (CD reduction, trops, trops dodge along with lots of endo regen) the entire point of the mini may be so that his enemies stay on top of him and run over all his trops.
Just separate WvW subforms for each Tier that we can post in. I really miss the server forum community from other MMOs and I think Tiers would be the best way to do it. That way discussion doesn’t have to be buried into random threads that go for many pages.
The goal of the idea is to balance out the ability of thieves to enter a fight at no risk. Right now because there are no mounts for chasing, escapes are very powerful. Stealth is the most powerful escape because it essentially provides a get out of jail free card at any time for escaping an encounter.
The objective is to create a mechanism that adds risk to an encounter. The idea adds a mechanism for forcing a thief to stay in a fight instead of being able to vanish without a trace and reset the fight at will and with high frequency.
While non-crit and chilled ideas are great ideas, they still don’t fix the problem of no fight commitment that thieves are entitled to
While thieves should not be easily trapped in every fight, there should be a stealth counter mechanisms that increase the degree of difficulty in fleeing an encounter.
The problem with the idea is that burning is plentiful, easy to apply, and easy to maintain.
It might be better to add an illumination buff to only certain burning abilities that applies a 2-3 second debuff on thieves and mesmers that prevents them from stealthing.
Why should a class with 10k base hp and medium armor be forced to commit to fights, especially seeing as how their sustained damage can’t hope to match that of Warriors or other high durability professions?
And why burning – a condition that is easily inflicted by literally every non-Thief profession? Hell, anyone can equip Forge(?) runes and get a free, long-duration burn against the Thief as soon as they drop to 50% health, along with a free 10 second Protection to make the Thief’s forced commitment even more useless.
Your idea has no merit. Thieves are SUPPOSED to have commitment issues. Give them enough base health to survive a sustained encounter and then talk to me about forcing commitment.
elementalists have the same base health and LOWER armour than a thief not to mention any non bunker ele is more squishy than a thief and deals far far lower damage. Yet people and in particular thieves that i come across complain about eles having an escape mechanism.
I can’t remember the last ele I ran across that wasn’t D/D. They have a ton of movement and staying power built right into their weapon set. It allows them to slot block/immune utilities which a thief has no access to. All together you have the most mobile class in the game dealing decent AoE damage with plenty of immune/blocks etc. Not even sure how you can compare their squishyness.
The goal of the idea is to balance out the ability of thieves to enter a fight at no risk. Right now because there are no mounts for chasing, escapes are very powerful. Stealth is the most powerful escape because it essentially provides a get out of jail free card at any time for escaping an encounter.
It’s not a get out of jail free unless combined with other utilities like Shadowstep and that’s only if one of the people giving chase aren’t extremely mobile like GS/S/Sh warrior or D/D Ele or another Thief.
In any event, this is the intended design of a Thief. They are pesky and annoy you. Most people will admit they would beat thieves all the time if they couldn’t run away. This sort of illustrates why they can do it. It just makes them angry because they feel like they deserved the kill. Sort of how I feel every time someone I downed is instantly revived or I’m interrupted three times and they rally off a PvE mob. Know what I do? /sunglasses – deal with it.
Cogbyrn, I don’t have time right now to get into details. Next week I can forum it up again. I’m just going to say that your points are valid. I take blind on stealth because it’s required due to how good it is, not because I want to. If changes could be made to make it more fun for both parties it would be welcome. I play the “shadowstep thief” like the one you fought. Sword#2 and shadowstep slotted. It’s really fun and comes at the cost of not being able to C&D as much.
At least Cogbyrn’s argument is it’s just not fun (which is subjective).
True. When we get into what’s fun or not, it’s almost impossible to have any sort of objective discussion. Luckily, forums exist for defending subjective opinions/beliefs for the sake of… I don’t know. I’m bored and need a break from testing this dev work.
Anyway, here’s a question I’d like to see answered:
What do you (not just you, Stiv, the general “you”, but you seem to apply as well) find fun/enjoyable about fighting against something like a P/D Thief?
When answering, please highlight the class/spec that you’re using for your perspective. When someone says “Yeah, P/D Thieves are fun, they’re hard to catch, yadda yadda”, then it comes out that they play D/D Ele, there’s a general feeling of “Well, you’re the other class that’s impossible to kill, so of course it’s no big deal for you”. If a similar statement came from someone who played a build similar to mine (Hammer/GS Warrior), it could potentially lead to interesting rapport.
And yes, I understand that a condition/attrition-based class that is designed to stay at range and has good escape mechanisms is a pretty strong counter to a melee-centric Warrior. Remember that I don’t really care about the balance aspect. I’m arguing that combating a stealth-heavy survival Thief results in an experience that lacks interesting counter-play options for the non-Thief, creating a stale guessing game that provides minimal success feedback and results in the wrong kind of frustration.
Well my current main profession and gameplay type currently is S/D – D/D Thief in WvW. So I’m not sure if that eliminates me from the discussion. I play a balanced build designed to survive but use on swap crit sigil on a dagger to give on demand 5Kish bursts when needed.
My current build is actually a pretty hard counter to P/D thives. I’d go so far as to say they have zero chance agaist my setup.
Anyway I find it enjoyable to evade Cloak and Dagger. Knowing when they want to do it, seeing them come for it then stuffing it is fun for me. Do I like it when I get hit with it? Nope. Other than actually killing them that is probably the most joy out of that fight.
Thinking about fights that way, I’m not sure if off the top of my head I could come up with more than one thing for every build. What’s fun about fighting bunker guardians? Dazing them at low health I guess.. warriors, backstabbing them when they are in Frenzy. Burst Thieves? Surviving their burst then killing them in their refuge.
Regardless of whatever else is done/not done etc, there is NO justification for a 10 point trait (Mug) hitting for as hard as it does. At the VERY least, Mug should be gutted, period. Argue against any other changes/nerfs all you want, but that much damage passively tied into a ranged move that can be used from stealth for 10 points is ludicrous.
This is honestly a decent argument. You could move mug up to 30 points in DA instead of 10 and move Fury on steal up in trickery. That would make thieves have to choose between 2 of Mug, 20% dmg to 50% health or up front fury instead of having easy access to all three.
Stiv has established himself as a thief-defending zealot, that much is clear. p/d is absolutely disgusting in wvw, and an annoyance in spvp due to a virtual godmode. denying this is silly.
I have an account full of professions. I have a guild of friends who play all sorts of professions. Why is it that none of us have the same problems that you do nor feel the need to make Thief nerf threads many times daily?
At least Cogbyrn’s argument is it’s just not fun (which is subjective). You get mad when you get bursted down while already distracted fighting someone else then come here to rage.
this happens to me all the time on my ranger bunker. ranger bunker is a high skill cap bunker that’s very rewarding to play when mastered. i could be handling 1 or 2 guys on point, barely surviving, hovering between 6-12k health lets say. and some thief roamer, who i cant see coming, will come in and instagib me for 13k burst on 2k toughness, instantly.
the problem is – WHERE IS THE SKILL? how am i to react to the most reliable single target burst in the game when i cant see it coming?
I don’t care if you try to change your argument once you get pinned down, this shows me what you want to be able to do. Even the so called “godmode” attrition p/d thief has no way to survive that.
youre absolutely correct. so if im missing 20% of my health, im dead. i wouldnt mind getting bursted down from 60%. thats a lot more reasonable. again, not asking for tips, or discussing the bunker ranger. please stop hijacking the thread. if u can think of an alternative buff/nerf for the thief, please discuss it instead of diverting attention to my abilities and credibility.
this is a well known, serious issue and id like for discussion to continue.
I’m not hijacking. I obviously don’t agree with your title. I don’t even play this build in sPvP nor WvW but I fight it all the time with no problems. I’m explaining to you there are counters available in game right now. If this really is your biggest problem then why wouldn’t you alter your build to deal with it better with something like Svanir?
The main difference between us is I accept dying to burst (of any kind) when I’m distracted already fighting someone else as a legit kill. That is what burst, especially a stealthy burst profession is suppose to do.
i could be handling 1 or 2 guys on point, barely surviving, hovering between 6-12k health lets say. and some thief roamer, who i cant see coming, will come in and instagib me for 13k burst on 2k toughness, instantly.
the problem is – WHERE IS THE SKILL? how am i to react to the most reliable single target burst in the game when i cant see it coming? it’s like getting smitten by lightning from the sky. basically, i just have to “deal” and take it. there’s no other explanation.
This bit here shows your mentality. You think that you should be able to be in a fight, 2 on 1 even, be “hovering” around 6-10K health and be able to survive a burst profession piling on you while distracted.
The fact is, if you have the awareness to see a Thief coming and the cool-downs you can prepare yourself for the burst, even if you are already fighting but if you don’t even notice them then there is no way you can nor should you survive.
he doesnt need 13-16k burst to kill me, thats the point. maybe 6-10k. BS thieves generally just overkill the target.
That’s silly…you’re talking about a 1 v 3. I am by no way condoning thief burst, but your reason for it (being that you are being dropped in a 1 v 3 by a thief you can’t see) is just as silly as their damage.
i am not talking about a 1v3. at all. not even close. im talking about receiving ridiculous amounts of burst damage without having any control over it. it cannot be seen coming, it cannot be dodged.
You asked “how am I to react”. I said in that situation you shouldn’t be able to. Now you are saying it’s fine to get insta killed in this situation, just not by so much?
that is absolutely ridiculous. forget the example. lets say i was 1v1’ing someone, and i was at 13k health. im as good as dead.
- no risk
- huge burst
- cant be dodged
- can be repeated quickly
- reliable
i would really like to invite experienced thief players like Xeph to come out and just support greater build diversity for the thief, and a trait coefficient nerf for the BS build. arguing against this is wasting time, and not caring about your game.
I’m starting to think you just need to slot some Svanir runes and make your build work with them. It does exactly what you want, counters overkill and anything else that doesn’t take you from 21% – 0. Usually a Thief will put you in the 20% window with mug or C&D. If you are at full health they could get lucky and kill you with back-stab but in that case, you weren’t fighting already and should be able to react.
If you want deathmatch go to WvW and play that style. P/D thieves are really good in WvW except for the fact they have no way to stop people from simply running to guards or to any other form of safety.
I do play WvW, and P/D Thieves are impossible to fight to the point where it simply isn’t fun. You can try to make a legitimate argument that being forced to run to guards or into a keep because the little Thief can’t really be attacked is fun, but you’re probably going to have a difficult time.
I was sticking to sPvP, since this is the sPvP forum. Even here, if they decide to add Deathmatch-style arenas in the future for the fun people are chomping at the bit about, builds like this are going to dump all over that fun.
Sometimes bad design has nothing to do with balance.
I think people here understand that whatever the goals are of a specific match will change what builds are effective for that match. CTF, deathmatch, TDM, LMS, conquest and whatever else would all have different builds that were desirable and more effective than others.
Arguing to nerf a build because it’s more powerful in a specific game type, even if that game type did exist is kinda pointless. Each game type would then require a set of nerfs that would homogenize each class down to a stale bore of a game.
i could be handling 1 or 2 guys on point, barely surviving, hovering between 6-12k health lets say. and some thief roamer, who i cant see coming, will come in and instagib me for 13k burst on 2k toughness, instantly.
the problem is – WHERE IS THE SKILL? how am i to react to the most reliable single target burst in the game when i cant see it coming? it’s like getting smitten by lightning from the sky. basically, i just have to “deal” and take it. there’s no other explanation.
This bit here shows your mentality. You think that you should be able to be in a fight, 2 on 1 even, be “hovering” around 6-10K health and be able to survive a burst profession piling on you while distracted.
The fact is, if you have the awareness to see a Thief coming and the cool-downs you can prepare yourself for the burst, even if you are already fighting but if you don’t even notice them then there is no way you can nor should you survive.
he doesnt need 13-16k burst to kill me, thats the point. maybe 6-10k. BS thieves generally just overkill the target. in fact, id love to see an overkill damage counter.
You asked “how am I to react”. I said in that situation you shouldn’t be able to. Now you are saying it’s fine to get insta killed in this situation, just not by so much?
Anet doesn’t want the nerf crys that come from 1 v 1 dueling. Just look at WvW where random 1 on 1 happens. First thing people do is come to the forums and QQ it up.
I’d like to have dueling though, I don’t care about the whiners, Anet shouldn’t either.
If you want deathmatch go to WvW and play that style. P/D thieves are really good in WvW except for the fact they have no way to stop people from simply running to guards or to any other form of safety.
i could be handling 1 or 2 guys on point, barely surviving, hovering between 6-12k health lets say. and some thief roamer, who i cant see coming, will come in and instagib me for 13k burst on 2k toughness, instantly.
the problem is – WHERE IS THE SKILL? how am i to react to the most reliable single target burst in the game when i cant see it coming? it’s like getting smitten by lightning from the sky. basically, i just have to “deal” and take it. there’s no other explanation.
This bit here shows your mentality. You think that you should be able to be in a fight, 2 on 1 even, be “hovering” around 6-10K health and be able to survive a burst profession piling on you while distracted.
The fact is, if you have the awareness to see a Thief coming and the cool-downs you can prepare yourself for the burst, even if you are already fighting but if you don’t even notice them then there is no way you can nor should you survive.
i’m sorry nerva, but stealth counters pets. i’m pretty sure you play bunker ranger, so you will have a hard time putting that spec down on your own. but he will never kill you & never take your point, so outside of honor duelling i don’t see the issue.
i play other profs and specs as well. i havent lost to an attrition thief. BUT my point is: godmode. nobody should have near infinite stealth. it’s a broken mechanic.
On your other classes you can dodge/block/immune C&D. On your ranger you are screwed because of your pet. Hard counter, at least you say you don’t die.
I hope it may be different than straight damage nerf. Who knows, they may even allow it to hit more than 5 targets. What I think they mean by “effective” is how it racks up kill credit and gets bags. This is what they mean by “gaming the system in WvW”.
If they are adding a Prestige system they will want to be careful to make sure just zerging and spamming AoE isn’t the best way to gain it. They may just make it worse at getting kill credit and things like that, not necessarily worse in it’s damage effect.
For the Prestige system to be meaningful it has to award quality kills more than AoE spamming.
Or just give more credit to those that do more kind of like what DAOC tried to do. If you splashed someone with minor damage you got minimal points for them, but if you wrecked them through heavy damage, you got a ton.
Yea exactly, that would be perfect but no idea how they plan on doling out prestige. Also the way DAOC split points evenly with the group. That would encourage actual grouping for support types.
Honestly I am hoping Anet has a x-mythic dev (or players) and they more or less rip off the RP/RA system but not going to get my hopes up.
Basing the prestige system purely or mainly on damage done will be terrible. ‘quality kills’ – by this do you mean thiefs will get no credit for their ‘steal/mug, one skill, cnd you’re downed and thief used a macro to do it in under 1 second’ type kills? Killing people with aoe without dying yourself takes a lot more ‘skill’ than instakills while not being able to even SEE what killed you then stomping whilst in stealth…
Base it on damage dealt and you will make all support classes disappear and everyone will run glass cannon to maximise their chances of gaining ‘prestige’. Add that to an aoe nerf and you’ll see piles of thiefs and d/d eles running around and not much else.
They need to have thought out very carefully the Prestige system so that it includes defensive actions, support classes, etc and not just ‘burst single target class wins’.
Basing it on damage done is fine as long as it’s split evenly with your group. I’m not sure if it works this way now, but does Guardian group Aegis for instance prioritize your group over other people nearby? That would also be needed.
Another option is to give a portion of the credit to anyone who has applied boons to the people doing damage or done knock downs or applied debuffs to people getting killed.
It took me a while to sift through your post history of constant theif QQ to figure out what class you were playing. Looks like you swapped from a ranger to a warrior. You got railed while using Frenzy. You got countered. Deal with it.
Isn’t that the same as pretty much having no armor?
If thieves can only do that much with an unarmored opponent, looks like thieves need a damage buff.
It’s close. A 50% dmg buff is a lot. I lovelovelove junking a dumb 100b war (like the OP) who pops frenzy and backstabbing them like they are an up-level.
It took me a while to sift through your post history of constant Thief QQ to figure out what class you were playing. Looks like you swapped from a ranger to a warrior. You got railed while using Frenzy. You got countered. Deal with it.
hidden thieves reviving someone can also be hit by single target attacks.
nop you cant. single target skills actually need a target. the majority of melee skills is cone aoe, not single target.
try to hit an invisible target e.g. with any rifle shot (warrior). its impossible.
It’s not you have to angle up your camera or be very close. Thieves can hit other invisible thieves with their pistol#1 shot which is the same mechanic.
I use a carrion short-bow on swap if I’m P/D. The point blank cluster bomb split stacks 3 bleeds and of course the poison is good. Short-bow in combat mobility is better than heartseeker when you account for cripple/root etc.
I would think for PvE since it’s all ranged you could get away with full Rampager’s gear. That way poison and cluster bomb pbaoe as well as Vital/Sneak attack all do some dmg.
