Guild Wars 2

hihey.1075:

Hard to Catch: you cleanse one condition every time you Shadow Step.
ICD: 5s

This would affect the following weaponsets:
S/x (#2)
D/P (#3)
P/D (#3)
Shortbow (#5)

And the following utilities:
Infiltrator Signet
Steal
Shadow Step
Shadow Trap

I like it. Would give more survivability outside of stealth, but 5 seconds seems too fast of an ICD.

I agree with the poster that said Acrobatics defense should be buffed. What would be great for the thief class is to have actual survivability outside of stealth. We need more diversity in builds. Every thief build uses SA in WvW. I’d love to see some D/D evade thieves out there, and not actually dying to condis every 3 seconds, or getting 1 shotted by a warrior. We need defense outside of stealth, which will give players the option of using either Acro for Defense, or Stealth for defense. Maybe even a hybrid of both.

Downed state has been in the game for 2 years now. Either learn to live with it and stop crying on the forums. It makes sense for every class to have different abilities.

The reason for this is because some classes are easier to kill than others, so they just want to delay their death for 3 seconds. Do you honestly think 3 seconds makes a difference when they’re already practically dead?

It’s actually pretty easy to counter a P/D condi thief…. You just have to know what they’re planning on doing.

For example:
If they’re running at you with that “mmmm im gonna get ya” face then they’re probably gonna go in for Shadow Strike which applies torment. Or they could go for a Cloak and Dagger. So just make sure to watch out for that.

Also, if they stealth they’re pretty much guaranteed to use sneak attack, so expect that to come.

And basically just be very aggressive and lock them down with lots of pressure. They won’t know what to do if you keep heavy pressure on them, just make sure you keep their shadow strikes to a minimum.

looks fine imo. You could use fire/air for extra burst which will help with jumping people with scholar. Or you could switch to pack and use fire/air, that way you keep precision and get the fury might swiftness buff.

If you’re new to thief tho you might want to use pack. It’s harder to get the buff from scholar if you’re new to thief. Pack works really well if you’re beginning.

That thief wasn’t even that good. Literally ALL he did was spam pistol whip.

Great video though, I enjoyed it a lot

Dakota.4591:

Easy fix to Assassin’s Equilibrium.

Completely scrap Last Refuge. Make Assassin’s Equilibrium the Shadow Arts 1-point minor. Make a completely new Acro GM trait that’s worth using.

I like that idea, but it might be a bit too strong for an adept minor trait. Maybe give it a small ICD

Build: Power D/D
Rune: Pack runes
Why: The fury might swiftness is nice, the swiftness duration synergizes with my food (gain swiftness on killing a foe) so I gain longer swiftness after killing a foe which is good in outnumbered fights and for roaming. They’re relatively cheap and good for a thief for basically any power build imo.

Make it give protection for 3 seconds when attacking from stealth with an X (my suggestion is around 7) second ICD.

I think you have to actually hit them, it doesn’t work on block/blind/evade. I could be wrong tho.

But really I don’t think this update is too much to worry about, if you were hitting FS before then you shouldn’t have a problem hitting it afterwards. And of course there are many other ways to hit it reliably.

This is actually a really good idea. Add me to the list of supporters for this feature

This is my last post, Im trying not to get involved but I just had to respond to this.
Black Powder is still fine, its just slightly less effective. It’s just not as rewarding to sit in a blind field and do nothing any more. YOu have to use other skills and carry your own weight more.

Although Im not against P/P getting a slight defense buff for compensation.

Kay. Im done here now.

Dude, leaderboards are broken as kitten anyways, it doesn’t mean kitten.

But whatever, I’m gonna go so I don’t have to deal with these pvpers pretending to be elitist kittens.

Actually I was top 1000 I just never pvp any more. I was around 500 for a while but I still don’t see what that has to do with anything.
You can be a great player and not be on the leaderboards. That’s just ignorant thinking.

Amonatory, don’t get me wrong I understand what you’re trying to say but I don’t think it was THAT much of a nerf. Sure it got nerfed but who cares, just deal with it like we always do. Anet isn’t going to change it just because you made this thread.
Just deal with it and play the game. Its fine to make a suggestion once in a while but anet does what anet wants. Just adapt and play is what I’m trying to say.

Thrackit.2158:

alchemyst.2165:

It will still be easy to land Flanking strike. Again, like I said, you can bait their dodges and then flanking strike —-> larcenous strike, use basilisk venom combo, or just straight up use it without doing any of those things and have it hit. If you can land CnD normally you can land Flanking strike easily. It has 1/2 second cast time, which is the same cast time as CnD and you land it all the time, I’ve seen it in your videos. If you can land CnD that much I’m sure you can land Flanking strike.

When playing crit strikes and acro u really don’t want to be around cleave/aoe attacks long as you well get melted so CnD isn’t the best option in 80 percent of cases when using these builds. CnD is almost a pure Shadow arts weapon skill. ( Emphasis on the almost) and bait dodges when you are one of most glassiest classes in the game? So you want to just auto attack and waste initiative til they dodge before you can land your burst? okay… makes sense since the theifs job is to do quick in and out burst damage.

No you obviously have no idea how to bait dodges, do you want me to make a video of how many times I’ve baited a dodge?

Here’s a quick tutorial on how to bait a dodge:

Step 1: Use CnD
Step 2: Cancel it
Step 3: Watch them dodge.

Also what you just said makes no sense. You’re saying I’ll get melted if I use autoattack pressure. If that happens I can just CnD and relieve the pressure. But you said CnD isn’t a good option, which is a lie, because it opens up a lot of options for you. You can daze or even flanking strike out of CnD which both open up even more options.

SImple as that.

Ways you can still use flanking strike after the patch:
1.Just kittening use it and watch it hit them
2.Use it out of stealth instead of just dazing
3.Use #2 skill on sword to immobilize them first
4.Basilisk venom
5.Daze them first, it prevents them from using blocks/blinds etc
6.Weakness, discouraging them dodging
7.Bait their dodges

Hey look, at least 7 ways you can still land a flanking strike!

Thrackit.2158:

alchemyst.2165:

Nah, I don’t think so. I play S/D at times and this will not destroy S/D. If the problem is that you wont be able to hit larcenous strike, just bait some dodges with fake CnD’s and use flanking strike then. It also encourages the player to be smart and rewards better, smarter play, which is good for a thief. Plus more autoattack pressure and encourages more daze pressure.

I do not think S/D is broken.

If you’re that upset then just switch weaponsets. If it’s THAT awful of an experience for you because you can’t land a flanking strike then switch to d/d or d/p or something. Who knows, maybe you could make the new p/p meta. It’s getting buffed.

coming from someone that uses s/d sometimes huh okay. Amonatory has mained S/D since the release of this game and im sure he knows what he is talking about. You do not realize how easy it is to dodge/blind/block one of the most telegraphed skills in the game. ( flanking strike) and you can make the argument that u can bassy them first or even sleight of hand them first but why should a weapon skill rely on a 20-45 second cooldown to be able to land. You cant even say that only 3 spammers use it because you are still gonna be able to 3 spam no matter what with this update or not so that argument is also invalid. larc strike is the only good dealing damage for a crit strike/acro theif. Also, another point, whats the point of having larc strike unblockable if you flank strike into a block and cant get larc strike. Please learn the weapon set and main it for more than a month before you call out one of the best theifs in the game. Also, I wasn’t aware that auto attack spam results in daze, correct me if im wrong.

I do agree that having larc strike unblockable is pointless. However larc strike is not the only good crit damage source from an acro/crit strike thief. You have auoattack pressure which does a lot of damage, cleaves, and applies weakness and cripple. You have CnD, which can do a lot of damage and gives you stealth which leads me into what you just said. I didn’t say that auto attack spam results in daze, I said this encourages us to add more auto attack and daze pressure. You still have all of these things. Stop overreacting and wait for the patch.

It will still be easy to land Flanking strike. Again, like I said, you can bait their dodges and then flanking strike —→ larcenous strike, use basilisk venom combo, or just straight up use it without doing any of those things and have it hit. If you can land CnD normally you can land Flanking strike easily. It has 1/2 second cast time, which is the same cast time as CnD and you land it all the time, I’ve seen it in your videos. If you can land CnD that much I’m sure you can land Flanking strike.

Stop overreacting because of whatever bullkitten reason. Aka: Ugh my precious S/D now requires me to think and be smarter. Now I cant spam my boonsteal

Or:

Omg my precious d/p is destroyed because the pulse is now every duration now I cant sit in my blind field and win((((((

Honestly they aren’t even that big of a nerf. D/P is practically untouched, in fact it’s kind of gotten buffed. You can cleave now

S/D is slightly nerfed, but the overall effectiveness and pressure of the build will still remain strong.

Edit: Alright I’ve given up…I’m not gonna get involved any more.

Amonatory.2453:

alchemyst.2165:

Nah, I don’t think so. I play S/D at times and this will not destroy S/D. If the problem is that you wont be able to hit larcenous strike, just bait some dodges with fake CnD’s and use flanking strike then. It also encourages the player to be smart and rewards better, smarter play, which is good for a thief. Plus more autoattack pressure and encourages more daze pressure.

I do not think S/D is broken.

If you’re that upset then just switch weaponsets. If it’s THAT awful of an experience for you because you can’t land a flanking strike then switch to d/d or d/p or something. Who knows, maybe you could make the new p/p meta. It’s getting buffed.

Sigh, you obviously have no clue what you are talking about.

Please, don’t say that just because you have no counterargument to what I’m saying. This really only affects people that spam 3 on Sword. I’ve played S/D, D/D, and D/p mainly. I really DO NOT think this will be much of a nerf.
Besides, if you’re a true thief, you’ll just deal with it and be awesome anyways, right?
Why don’t we all just wait until patch hits until we start calling out if things are broken?

T raw.4658:

alchemyst.2165:

Are you kidding? These changes were freakin’ awesome. I understand where they’re going with flanking strike, it gives more reward for actually hitting your target and more counterplay. Black Powder nerf was fine… Though it might hurt s/p. Dagger Cleave was awesome, Invigorating precision was awesome, P/P got buffed. I think they were going in the right direction. If you’re crying because you think your precious S/D is going to be completely broken or you won’t be able to D/P spam stealth any more then theres something wrong with you.

Sorry, I got a little ranty

You really don’t have a clue what you are talking about.

Let the changes sink in regards to fighting the OTHER classes in this game.

Actually I do know what I’m talking about. All of you people are crying about you constantly getting nerfs. Here we didn’t really get that many nerfs, only nerfs that were needed or were compensated for with other buffs.
The other classes will still be fine to fight against, I’m sure they’re getting nerfs as well.
ooooohhhh such a big deal cus I cant spam flanking strike any moreee ughhh anet pls buffffffff

ooohhhh such a big deal cus I cant sit in blind field and moreee ughhh anet pls bufffffff

Seriously? You guys sound idiotic. Why don’t you actually use tactical play instead of doing these things that I see every day. Belive it or not it’s better for you to use autoattack pressure with sword than to spam flanking strike. It’s better to use a mixture of autoattack, 3, 4 and 5 on dagger pistol than to spam 5 —> 2 all day.

Nah, I don’t think so. I play S/D at times and this will not destroy S/D. If the problem is that you wont be able to hit larcenous strike, just bait some dodges with fake CnD’s and use flanking strike then. It also encourages the player to be smart and rewards better, smarter play, which is good for a thief. Plus more autoattack pressure and encourages more daze pressure.

I do not think S/D is broken.

If you’re that upset then just switch weaponsets. If it’s THAT awful of an experience for you because you can’t land a flanking strike then switch to d/d or d/p or something. Who knows, maybe you could make the new p/p meta. It’s getting buffed.

Are you kidding? These changes were freakin’ awesome. I understand where they’re going with flanking strike, it gives more reward for actually hitting your target and more counterplay. Black Powder nerf was fine… Though it might hurt s/p. Dagger Cleave was awesome, Invigorating precision was awesome, P/P got buffed. I think they were going in the right direction. If you’re crying because you think your precious S/D is going to be completely broken or you won’t be able to D/P spam stealth any more then theres something wrong with you.

Sorry, I got a little ranty

Thank you for the thief buffs, especially invigorating precision and ricochet buffs. I’m fine with black powder nerf and flanking strike nerf, they were needed imo. S/D is still fine, D/P will still be fine. Some thieves are just overreacting. I like the changes to thief.

Thanks a lot!

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQRAoY6YlsMp0pdPxyJ8PNBNBtdFGeI4uGrYGaFAA-TFEEABLqSgBnAgmUC5hmAAOCAJ8AAaRFiP0CQwBBoLlgMpMhF1AkSpRO7P0hOBXUVhUACsFA-
That’s my build.

And yeah the CnD at 4:22 was intentional, I just guessed that he would shadowstep back and it worked

Sir Vincent III.1286:

alchemyst.2165:

Actually I like the idea of simply removing the blind shot on Black Powder.

Yup, just delete P/P from the face of the planet Tyria.

Nobody used P/P anyways…Or we could make it so that the shot stealths you if it hits instead of blinding.

2nd thief Outnumbered video I enjoyed making this one a lot. Yeah, in case you’re wondering, I change my character a LOT. But I think I’m staying with the male grenth hood look. My current look post-video is Grenth Hood with Sneakthief coat, so that’s awesome.

Songs used:
Lorde-Everybody Wants To Rule The World (Dead Suspect Remix)
The Two Friends ft. Priyanka Atreya – Feel Me (Clark Kent Remix)

Programs used: Sony Vegas 12 Pro

Updated Build: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQRAoY6YlsMp0pdPxyJ8PNBNBtdFGeI4uGrYGaFAA-TFEEABLqSgBnAgmUC5hmAAOCAJ8AAaRFiP0CQwBBoLlgMpMhF1AkSpRO7P0hOBXUVhUACsFA-

What do you guys want to see more of from me?

Actually I like the idea of simply removing the blind shot on Black Powder.

Cross server fights are always so sexy :P

Predict when they will use Shadow Strike (They hit you and shadowstep away and shoot you for 2 torment stacks) and dodge it. Just be very aggressive and try not to get hit by that or CnD. If you can prevent those abilities it’s pretty easy to kill them.

xbutcherx.3861:

alchemyst.2165:

Lol I love how all the warriors are trying to draw the attention off their class by talking about thieves. I just love it.

Just love how you trying to get warrior nerf but the sad part that we already been nerfed more than once, so I want to see the perma blind and perma evade nerfed to the ground and while at it please add 2 more seconds to reveal.

Thieves have been getting constant nerfs, we haven’t had a good buff in ages. Warriors are still top of the food chain. This thread is eviscerate, stop trying to change the topic to thieves. If you really want to, make a nerf thieves thread. But this is NOT the place to be talking about thief nerfs. We’re talking about eviscerate here. Stop trying to stray away from warriors and talk about thieves. I’m assuming you came here to defend the warrior class, not to hate on another class.

Please, stay on topic everyone.

Lol I love how all the warriors are trying to draw the attention off their class by talking about thieves. I just love it.

I have to agree, increasing the cooldown of burst skills will provide more opportunity for counterplay.

Equivocat.8246:

warriorjrd.8695:

Equivocat.8246:

How can you one-shot a thief as a necro, and what thief will stay in the open long enough for that damage to go through? I feared him off a point and he disappeared, next thing I know, I was melted. I also said Melandru runes, which give some toughness, however minor. And yeah, I don’t normally play zerker, but was trying something out in hotjoin, and I just happened into the situation. Kinda funny how the thief’s allowed to go zerker and get away with it, and everyone else has to suck it up and NOT play that.

And on topic, having a war as well, it’s a weird game where everyone’s waiting out, or baiting out the Eviscerate. They know you have it, and you know they know that the pain’s coming. The distance on the heatseeking isn’t big, but it is way too reliable since missing it doesn’t drain adrenaline. That, plus the relatively low cooldown, sigil of intelligence, and added condi pressure from Celestial runes/longbow/Impale, and it gets pretty overwhelming. Only have so many dodges, so do you dodge, the Pin Down, Impale, or Evisc?

“how can you one shot a theif with a necro?” If you’re playing zerker you should try using life blast sometime, maybe lich form. You are clearly unaware of how high a zerker necro can hit, so i’ll let you try those and figure it out.

Right, that’s exactly what I was testing out, by going zerker. The second part of my statement was that no thief will stay out in the open to take that kind of damage. Blowing a 3-minute cooldown on a thief that’s not even there? They’re obviously just going to wait it out, even they were there. Life Blast can hit hard, but there’s not a chance it hits for anywhere close to as much as I was hit for, in the same short span of time, and again, thief just decides to re-engage at a different time. Not to mention both are able to be dodged, since they’re out in the open, how’s about dodging that 11.5k Backstab (not counting sigil/other procs and steal)?

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying nerf thief. I’m just saying that denying they have ridiculous burst potential is myopic. Yes, a lot of professions have that burst/high damage potential, but thief is burst potential is tied to when they choose to engage, in relative safety.

I made a necro a while ago and went d/d dps build. I was One-two shotting thieves in just a few seconds. I was doing it to everyone actually, but thieves were actually the EASIEST to kill.

Anyways, sorry I just had to reply. Let’s get back on topic to eviscerate.

Yeah I never got why they changed it to 4 seconds for PvP…just bring it down to 3 seconds.

Equivocat.8246:

Atoss.1056:

Clearly someone doesn’t want his “precious” to be nerfed.

I have yet to be hit by 9-10k backstab, so 15-20k numbers are out of thief reach imo.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9d4Og8KbEM
This is footage from a full glass thief. He has to use ALL his utilities to get might/boost to dmg to even get close to warrior numbers, leaving him with almost nothing if his combo fails. All this is from before thie Ferocity patch, and the highest numbers 16k are on some squishy or uplvl guys (not to mention they’re total nubcakes, but it’s just to show the numbers). Now, how many hits will it take to kill 12k hp 1800 armor thief?

Warrior however… “F1 , oww he dodged, switches to GS – run away 1500 range, 7sec later F1 magic button is ready again, Boom! 12k, 7-10sec, Boom! 15k”. Feel free to input random 2-3k auto atk hits in between.

edit:
Because some ppl posting below didn’t seem to have read my previous post, go read it. This is about WvW zerg situations where zerker thief pulling out 16k numbers will just evaporate from few hits.
If you read the part about 1v1, it’s not big problem to beat a warrior.
This is not crying post. This is pointing out at a certain problem with balance of warrior class, just like other people in this thread are trying to point out.

This is from a hotjoin, using Melandru runes and zerker amulet on necro. If it hits that hard not as full glass, and not in WvW, what could it do in WvW?

You said you were using zerker. Most likely the thief was using D/P revealed training 6/6/0/0/2 which means that you can practically 1 shot them. If you’re crying about 11k backstab when you’re zerker then that’s your fault for playing zerker…

And…why would backstab need nerfed? Also, why are you trying to change the topics to thieves. We are talking about warriors.

You probably won’t need power since you’re going to be D/D condi so just use Dire instead of Carrion Imo.

Honestly I think one of the problems is the Cooldown of burst skills. You can try dodging it all you want, but you literally can’t keep up with the burst skills. You have to waste all your defenses on dodging the burst skills and then you get beat down by all of their other skills as well.

My suggestion: Raise the cooldown of burst skills to around 14 seconds.

xbutcherx.3861:

Atoss.1056:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aD_sQ5SAJGw

Seems legit.

He just posted all the hits to uplevels LOL, this is getting funnier by the hour.

Actually lots of them were on level 80’s…

Atoss.1056:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aD_sQ5SAJGw

Seems legit.

Them 20k eviscerates tho…

A lot of people think that Warrior’s mobility is too high, myself included. But I also do understand the Warriors’ point of view that Rush is very hard to hit with and can be very buggy. Here’s my suggestion for compensation.

Basically, my Idea is to have Rush work like a Guardian’s 3 skill on greatsword. It’s a leap finisher that has 600 range, and it actually hits things! 600 range might seem like a huge nerf, but they could of course make it a more damage based skill. And you would finally be able to hit things.

Thoughts?

Quakeman.9378:

Olba.5376:

TheBandicoot.5294:

I was always talking axe /shield and GS.

Well here’s a secret for you: No one uses that weapon combination because it sucks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvkCRf5cXIs

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC5mrp3LF3bQhDrrSE6Ft3kA
Yup. Totally. No one uses Axe/shield GS. 100% sucks.

LOL you did EXACTLY what I was going to do!

If axe/shield GS is so sucky and bad, why do I see it constantly? If axe shield GS is so bad why does one of the best warriors around use it?

Warriors trying to defend their class are so funny.

I play a warrior in pvp and even I know that its an OP weaponset. I love using axe/shield GS. It’s by far my favorite set. Its very fun but sometimes boring because I can kill people with little effort and run across the map in 2 seconds on a low CD, something even thieves can’t do.

Also, Hi yolo!!!

The problem I have is, there were already counters to stealth but they were soft counters, not hard counters, and I liked that people had to think to counter stealth.

Now arenanet is basically saying “kay now you can prevent them from doing anything useful for 6 seconds and basically kill them just by pressing a button from long range”

Edit: They better have some good stuff planned for thief or I will be kittened. We’ve gotten constant nerfs and I think it’s time arenanet treats us better.

Kravick.4906:

Shinjo.6092:

Death Shroud shields your hp from being damaged, and rangers have Signet of Stone combined with Signet of the Beastmaster in addition to “Protect Me”. I never said that other classes have evades similar to what thieves have; only that they exists for other classes as well (although one can probably make a case that the amount of evades Blurred Frenzy and Whirlwind attack provide over time is comparable to some of the evades on thieves’ weapon sets, there’s too many other things to consider to make this comparison legitimate).

Death Shroud is not a viable form of mitigation. If necromancers had the same evades/blocks/invulns of other classes, then yes, I can see the whole “second HP bar” as a valid argument, but as it stands, it is a horrible, badly thought out substitution for an actual defense. Case in point. Guardians have 11k HP as base, yet because of their mechanics and boons, make far, far better bunkers than necromancers ever will be.

umm…

So you’re saying a kitten ton of extra HP and not having it transfer to damaging your health pool the whole time isn’t viable? (WHILE shooting arms at people for 3k a hit.)
You’re basically invulnerable for X seconds…

silentnight warrior.2714:

NinjaEd.3946:

Its a hella strong skill. Reason I question why all burst skills have a 10 second cooldown, as if they are balanced around that. cough combustive shot cough

So… What is the cooldown of backstab? or any thief skill?

At least 3 seconds, then we have to actually hit our CnD (which is a challenge in itself) then we have to actually hit your back (which is a challenge in itself) and if we don’t we waste 6 initiative yayy

I’ve always found D/D is great for both, but I think it’s best at outnumbered compared to other sets. Some parts about outnumbered with D/D feel easier, like CnD landing, because there are more targets to stealth off of.

NinjaEd.3946:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/PVX-Fix-redesign-or-remove/first#post4227204

Feed ze list!

There is little reason to run a d/d power build without going glassy. I still agree the reliability of CnD actually hitting your target and not being blinded/blocked/interrupted/evade hurts. Like a suggestion I made long ago, make Dagger training (Deadly Arts IX) reduce the initiative costs of off hand dagger skills by 1.

Little love here and there if they wana go glassy to not be so punishing towards mistakes (since they die without CnD landing usually). There is much more that can be done towards d/d though that has little to do with damage values imo.

I love that suggestion. Never thought of it before and it sounds like a great thing for thief. We need more creative minds like yours