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Dungeon/Fractal Record Rule Meeting

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spoj.9672

The ruleset is sound. Only issue i have.

8. Bypassing closed doors by jumping over them when they are closed is banned.

This opens up the whole arah p3 and arah p2 door issue again. Cant we just remove this rule? The only case where this would be an issue is CoE door. But alpha is inactive until path trigger so players would be prevented from attacking him anyway. Which solves the main issue with that particular case.

And the belka specific rule should be removed. It doesnt effect full groups. But in solo’s and duos most players will simply not bother submitting their times because they use that trick on belka regardless of the rules. Besides its not really a big deal.

(edited by spoj.9672)

Dungeon/Fractal Record Rule Meeting

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spoj.9672

ya but M/D is the one which is used for all and i think england aswell. Sp its kinda the offical one.

No its not. I am english and i can tell you its DMY here. Just like it is pretty much everywhere.

Dungeon/Fractal Record Rule Meeting

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spoj.9672

Im not here in July for me the 08/02/2015 would be better for me, and for Sandy i guess not sure tho.

So were going back in time?

You know how to write a date in non german?

Last i checked only US and Canada use the M/D/Y format. You are in EU arent you?

Edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Date_format_by_country
Can anyone explain to me the logic behind using MDY anyway? Its a jumbled up order.

Sorry for offtopic. x)

(edited by spoj.9672)

Can necro axe please get attention

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spoj.9672

They get 7%, 7%, 20% (devastation and invocation) and 3% per self condi.

Can necro axe please get attention

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spoj.9672

What about runes though? Runes with power could throw those numbers off. Using fire procs would be unreliable as well. Im going to wait till the next beta before i question the damage.

But if your calculations are close then thats actually pretty reasonable. Its only very slightly higher than dagger (same attack speed). Obviously revenant has slightly more damage modifiers. But thats more of a necro issue than something wrong with revenant.

(edited by spoj.9672)

Dungeon/Fractal Record Rule Meeting

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spoj.9672

Im not here in July for me the 08/02/2015 would be better for me, and for Sandy i guess not sure tho.

So were going back in time?

Can necro axe please get attention

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spoj.9672

Erm we have no idea on the actual damage of Revenant sword. It looked rather weak if Roy was using Berserker amulet on the stream.

Unless we know his power on the stream we cannot calculate the coefficients of the skills. Which means damage comparisons are meaningless at this point. I was only able to work our reaper damage from the stream because they showed us the tooltip of a currently existing skill (BiP) so i could estimate the power from that.

Can necro axe please get attention

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spoj.9672

Before anything axe needs a role/vison right now it is an agglomeration of different effect with no cohesion. DPS weapon? to low damage coefficients. Support? selfish retaliation and #2 skill. Defensive? 2 skill and vuln on auto attack.

This is another good point. I think its trying to be a semi ranged dps power weapon. But it does that very poorly. Especially when we have life blast.

It doesnt even compliment life blast because the one benefit it has (vuln) requires you to maintain a weaker auto attack. So maybe the solution would be to put the life force on the auto attack and the vuln on ghastly claws. That way you can set up burst vuln for a spike when you enter DS or drop wells.

(edited by spoj.9672)

Can necro axe please get attention

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spoj.9672

I dont know how many times i have to point it out. But axe 2 is not fine. Its ridiculously long channel time makes its DPS very very low for supposedly a “burst” skill. The same goes for dagger 2 but that at least has the benefit of being a heal. Life force generation is not really enough to justify axe 2 when we can already get really good life force from dagger auto, focus 4 and warhorn 5.

Sorry but its starting to get annoying still seeing people say “axe 2 is fine because i hit someone for 15k”…. When in reality 15k over a 3 second channel is not fine at all.

Brazil even did a video on it. It gets the point across. But it actually displays axe as slightly better than it actually is because he ignores aftercasts.
https://youtu.be/paxEJr1hWac

Also i kind of agree that axe needs a range increase. 600 is barely out of melee. So if it remains at 600 it needs to be just a bit lower damage than dagger and around the same damage as lifeblast or very slightly lower. If it has 900 range then it just needs to clearly beat scepter for direct damage. So it only needs a minor damage buff if it gets a range increase. Either way axe 2 needs buffing to have a lower channel time or much higher damage.

(edited by spoj.9672)

General Dungeon Discussion Thread - Part 2

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spoj.9672

Im just thinking is it really that funny necro posting? Once is enough. After that it just becomes stupid and annoying.

Ascended gear advice.

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spoj.9672

The kind of difficulty they are going for is the kind which makes you use utility to survive. So CC, blinds, projectile defence. Which means theres no reason to expect anything other than berserker for most effective play. Its ascended. Its expensive. It doesnt make sense to go for “feel good options” over the actual most effective option.

And they certainly arent going to force us into defensive gear. That would be a complete turn around from what they have said about avoiding a hard trinity. Berserker should still be possible to survive in. It will just require greater effort, skill and use of utility.

(edited by spoj.9672)

Ascended gear advice.

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spoj.9672

If you go valk you are going to only have 50% crit from decimate defences and the rest from buffs which means you will be short on crit in organised groups. Being forced into DP just to get a bit of extra health you dont need isnt a wise idea imo. Besides we dont even know if camping DS will be worthwhile yet.

Currently assassins is better because we need the crit. Reaper just means we dont need the extra prec anymore because we can finally cap crit easily without being forced into certain builds. So when HoT comes out berserker will be the go to.

Base necro health is plenty. If we ever need defensive gear i would go for power, ferocity, toughness/healing (doesnt exist yet). But theres no way defensive gear will ever be required if anet wants to maintain their design philosophies. So we are safe to assume berserker will still be the number one choice.

(edited by spoj.9672)

Ascended gear advice.

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spoj.9672

Berserker for PvE.

General Dungeon Discussion Thread - Part 2

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spoj.9672

Well yeah but those finishers, buffs, utility and support options….. The better damage and the mobility… Its pretty clearly better than necro in so many ways. I dont really mind because id rather see the new class actually be designed to compete with the other classes than have it as another bottom feeder on the list.

Shiro spec alone basically gives everything necro has from 3 different trait lines lol. Damage, life steal, vuln and might. And that stunbreak is spammable up to 3 times consecutively. And its not like the necro uses a wide range of utilities as it is. So we may as well be locked into wells full time. And then theres the active defence. kitten its everything i could dream of having on the necro. :<

(edited by spoj.9672)

General Dungeon Discussion Thread - Part 2

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spoj.9672

I did always want to roleplay as a sword/sword warrior. Now i can roleplay on revenant.

And its better than necro so no guilty conscience.

The Necromancer Initiative

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spoj.9672

Was going to ignore this thread. But i decided meh what the hell ill just post my ideals for the main things that need to be done.

___________________________Heal Skills___________________________

  • Well of Blood
    Make it a water field or increase pulse healing. Or both.
  • Signet of Vampirism
    Reduce cast time of active. Change passive to proc on hit.
  • Consume Conditions
    Remove self condition. Maybe make it a spectral skill instead of corruption.
  • Summon Blood Fiend
    Increase taste of death healing massively.

___________________________Utility Skills___________________________

  • Spectral Wall
    Make it reflect projectiles.
  • Spectral Walk
    Increase the time available to cast spectral recall.
  • Spectral Grasp
    Make it a projectile finisher. Fix its unreliability issues with bumpy terrain (make it shadow step targets to you and knockdown instead of pull).
  • Spectral Armor
    Should grant stability on activation.
  • Plague Signet
    Make passive work in DS.
  • Signet of Spite
    Make passive work in DS. Add wider variety of conditions to the active. Torment, confusion and burning for example.
  • Signet of Undeath
    Make passive work in DS. Increase the radius and the number of targets for the active.
  • Signet of the Locust
    Make passive work in DS.
  • Well of Power
    Make it pulse stability for allies.
  • Well of Suffering
    Buff the damage or increase its uptime. So either reduce cool down, increase the number of pulses or increase the damage per pulse.
  • Well of Darkness
    Should block projectiles.
  • Well of Corruption
    Reduce cool down. Maybe increase the rate of boon corruption. So pulses twice as fast but pulses more often. Or add a bonus end pulse which deals bonus damage if no boons are on targets within the well.
  • Epidemic
    Remove self condition on default version of skill.
  • Corrupt Boon
    Remove self condition on default version of skill.
  • Blood is Power
    Remove self condition on default version of skill. Buff the might duration considerably.
  • Corrosive Poison Cloud
    Remove self condition on default version of skill. Should block projectiles.
  • Bone Fiend
    Reduce the cool down of Rigor Mortis to about 25 seconds.
  • Flesh Wurm
    Reduce the cast time of the summon considerably.
  • Shadow Fiend
    Buff shadow fiends damage. Make its auto attacks cleave and make haunt AoE.
  • Bone Minions
    Make the blast finishers more reliable to place on small fields. Reduce the cast time of the summon considerably.

__________________________Weapon Skills__________________________

  • Axe Skills
    Buff the damage of axe 1 and 2. Reduce cast time of axe 2. Make axe 3 a blast finisher.
  • Staff Skills
    Allow self detonation of marks through secondary skills. Buff auto attack damage and make it 100% projectile finisher.
  • Dagger Skills
    Reduce cast time of dagger 2. Make dagger 4 a projectile finisher.
  • Warhorn Skills
    Wail of Doom should be a blast finisher.

___________________________Elite Skills___________________________

  • Plague
    Remove self conditions. Buff the base damage of the pulses.
  • Lich Form
    Fix the auto attack so it saves auto cast. Buff the other 4 skills to make them worth using (reduce cast times and buff damage and effects).
  • Flesh Golem
    Fix charge so that the golem actually turns to face the target before charging.

_________________________Shroud Skills_________________________
Life blast should pierce as base. Should also be a projectile finisher. Buff life transfer damage slightly. And increase dark path projectile speed.

____________________________Spite____________________________
Make unholy fervor grant 10% damage to foes inflicted with vuln regardless of weapon.
___________________________Curses___________________________
Remove the ICD from chilling darkness. Base versions of corruptions should have no self conditions. But when traited they can self condi for increased effectiveness on active. So MoC should also buff the actives.
_________________________Death Magic_________________________
Add traits that give necromancer active defence through death magic. So block/invuln/reflect on DS entry. Or block/invuln/reflect while casting shroud skill 4.
_________________________Blood Magic_________________________
Unholy Martyr does the same thing as plague signet. Change it to transfer conditions to enemies inside DS and grant pulsing life force for each condition on the necro. Make quickening thirst also grant 5% bonus damage while wielding a dagger. Give us a vigor trait in this line. Vamp Rituals should grant protection on pulse.
_________________________Soul Reaping_________________________
Strength of Undeath should grant 10% bonus damage. At the very least it should be 7%.

(edited by spoj.9672)

[DnT] + Ambro - Arah P3 6:29 [World Record]

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spoj.9672

Also it’s ironic that you critizize people who don’t do records (but have been around since forever) yet the only thing I associate your name with is a solo of some boss in arah. I admittedly might be wrong about that.

I understand why those people get to approve records, I’m just saying some of them might not be the right people for it, and that’s my opinion.
I personally would love to see the actual community being involved more, to see what the majority of people thinks about new rules, and not just a small handful of people

Because believe it or not most people dont want to devote their free time to approve records or get involved. Its a thankless job and it can take a lot of free time when you have to watch 5 PoV’s for a single record. Many just want to play and be done with it.

Besides everyone on the approval team does have suitable credentials. Whether you are personally aware of them is another matter. Weth didnt select people who just volunteered. He made sure everyone at least understood or had some background in the scene.

[DnT] + Ambro - Arah P3 6:29 [World Record]

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spoj.9672

Yeah thats why they tried to fix waypoints before and then broke them again….

Why no Invulnerability?

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spoj.9672

The only way we could possible get a pseudo invuln out of DS without actually giving us an invuln on DS entry trait. Would be to give us a condi immunity on DS entry trait. Combine that with foot in the grave. That way whenever we enter DS to absorb damage we avoid the conditions and the stability counters any CC. Then hopefully we have enough life force to negate the damage. And we can generate it back and repeat.

Or we could just have a simple solution and give us active defence through traits just like every other class. Can even be tied directly into DS traits so we are forced to use our class mechanic to survive. Jesus kitten its so simple and yet its so frustrating that nothing has been done.

[DnT] + Ambro - Arah P3 6:29 [World Record]

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spoj.9672

Clearly you want everything new to be allowed though. So wouldnt it be easier just to modify unrestricted and compete on that? Otherwise restricted is completely pointless as a ruleset as it no longer serves its purpose.

[DnT] + Ambro - Arah P3 6:29 [World Record]

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spoj.9672

If you don’t want people crying about rules perhaps you should do unrestricted records.

Just because you find a new way to stretch rules doesn’t mean it should be automatically allowed.

^

Dungeons 6 months from now?

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spoj.9672

Number one tip for necro skipping. Bring stealth consumables and an executioner axe. Much easier to keep up and you have emergency stealth if you get left behind by the thief.

Arenanet please read this

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spoj.9672

That sheet needs to be updated. Raise condi cap isnt relevant anymore. Also fgs is on there.

Dungeons 6 months from now?

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spoj.9672

I dont think even Hrouda expected them to stay fresh for 3 years. Lets be honest. Its a miracle we still play them after this long.

General Dungeon Discussion Thread - Part 2

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spoj.9672

Its pretty simple. You dont need to be told how to play suboptimally and safe. Thats easy. However people misinterpret the advice given on optimal play as the only method. Then again if people are stupid enough to misinterpret it like that then they deserve to stew in their own ignorance.

And the content is so easy right now there really is no point on wasting effort encouraging safety.

Your best LFG reads and puglife stories

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But, He owns 2 businesses!

Honestly wouldnt surprise me if it was true.

General Dungeon Discussion Thread - Part 2

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spoj.9672

that 20g…..

Your best LFG reads and puglife stories

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spoj.9672

That type of person is far too common in this world.

Healthy Necro Discussion

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spoj.9672

I love how necros still try to sugar coat our problems.

General Dungeon Discussion Thread - Part 2

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spoj.9672

Tbh, this is exactly how I feel too except having played Archeage during the first few weeks I can say that playing trinity combat in dungeons honestly isn’t that much more enjoyable than waiting to play it was. Can’t even believe people cry about zerkmeta1111ing on here when it could be so much worse.

So much Yes.

Good thing you could solo most archeage dungeons on dps with heal pots. x)

NA vs EU?

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spoj.9672

xD

I was under the impression there was quite a few though.

And im sure there are plenty of jobless students on NA as well. Remember the rush to fractal 50?

(edited by spoj.9672)

Renevant Dungeon/Fotm

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spoj.9672

The only time dhuumfire was ever good was when it was passive. But now that burn stacks intensity even that version would be sub par. The reason necro is so bad at condi damage is because they have almost nonexistant burn, no confusion, limited poison, limited torment and decent bleeds. Its pretty much all bleed damage. So its the same as it was before the condi changes.

NA vs EU?

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spoj.9672

http://gw2dungeons.net/Records
Monopoly or not, [DnT] is registered for a single record only (Arah P2) …
I’d love to see the Americas giving some proper competition

my impression was EU was full of college/university students who had masses of time to kill versus NA who has more older people with full time jobs.

Dunno about that. Might be true for some of the EU guilds. But we are divided so.

Renevant Dungeon/Fotm

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spoj.9672

Yeah ahah. People have been saying that for a long time. Its never been true.

….but but epidemic!

Renevant Dungeon/Fotm

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spoj.9672

Full Sinister Engineer: 15k dps
Full Sinister Warrior: 11k DPS
Full Sinister Mallyx Revenant: 6k DPS

Full Sinister Necromancer?

Probably about 7k unless you can transfer some burns (not gonna happen in PvE).

NA vs EU?

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spoj.9672

The NA guilds seem to be pretty huge. Whereas in the eu community we are split into smaller guilds.

DnT monopoly on NA?

[vC] Uncategorized Fractal 3:32 [Restricted]

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spoj.9672

Yeah exactly its skipping triggers. Which is the kind of stuff that probably would have been frowned upon when restricted first got created.

[vC] Uncategorized Fractal 3:32 [Restricted]

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spoj.9672

Dunno why you are making a joke out of it. It is true. Wondering when people are going to just admit they like unrestricted. ;>

Renevant Dungeon/Fotm

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spoj.9672

Now is our chance to give feed back when Anet might actually listen and improve,

Seriously?
… like, seriously?

I know its hard to believe. But they did actually listen to feedback and make changes with the necro between the first spec preview and second spec preview. In particular blood magic. It does happen sometimes! Maybe not in the best way possible but it does happen!

Zerker necro Stats

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If u also look several ppl above is boosting there stats with SoS bare that in mind.

Just minus 180 power and you have the normal amount. :>

Renevant Dungeon/Fotm

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spoj.9672

Agree. If we “just wait” we will have another case of the necro. Class remaining terrible for 3 years with no major changes that are sorely needed. Once rev is released they will be less inclined to make huge changes to the class as a whole. Which is probably why necro has never been fully addressed.

Revenant sucks! Who is happy? =D

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spoj.9672

It usually takes more than 1 spec line and 1 weapon set to build for dps on a class. So revenant doesnt look like its going to be good unless they do some major changes between now and HoT. That mostly means number tweaks on the weapons. But there should also be a little more choice in the other spec lines. Theres literally nothing in the 4 current spec lines that i would want to take. So its going to be a 1 spec class going by current direction.

@Ravezaar

Keep in mind that might stacking and vuln stacking traits only boost dps in suboptimal groups. They are essentially worthless the rest of the time. Which is why classes that have a huge amount of damage modifier traits are so strong (ele and thief). Necro didnt even have these vuln and might traits previously. Now at least we can be a little stronger solo. But we are still rather weak in groups.

#FixUnholyFervor

(edited by spoj.9672)

Renevant Dungeon/Fotm

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spoj.9672

What makes a class do good damage? Its a combination of 3 specialisations and choice of decent weapons. But even the alternative weapons do competative dps to a certain degree.

Sorry but i dont really see how 1 specialisation and 1 choice of weapon set can save the class. Necromancer already suffers from a major lack of damage modifier traits. Revenant looks like its going to suffer from that issue along side terrible base weapon damage.

Zerker necro Stats

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spoj.9672

Heres a pic. WvW bonus gave me some extra health (you can see actual value in hero panel). Food is experimental remnants which doesnt give any stats. It just gives 8% damage while moving (best budget food for necro). Gear is berserker, scholar runes and night + force sigils. Basically your standard PvE gear.

Bare in mind assassins armour is actually better for dagger necros in PvE currently. But that wont be true anymore once Reaper comes out.

Attachments:

(edited by spoj.9672)

How to Reflect Bloomhunger

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Yeah cant say im not surprised about the whole enemy displacement effect being horrifically abused. It doesnt even use a defiant stack. l0l

Can hardly see anything in that video though. :P

Constructive balance thread.

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spoj.9672

what in the hell ?

I cannot believe necros are actually COMPLAINING right now .

-Power based lichform STILL doublehits people when you’re on top of them, making 1 pew do 5K damage times 2 . And that’s only one pew for 10k damage. OH LOOK he pewed again and you’re downed. weeee !
-Defensive based necros still have an equivalent of 5 hp bars to kill thru before they get downed
-Wells necro can still melt people’s faces off, FASTER THAN BEFORE ( with all the vamp aura + leeches PROCing on every wells pulses)
- You have actual easy buttons that are still as strong, if not magnified with everything else from the spec patch.

….. and you complain ?

pffff these lies.

Because PvP is the only thing that matters right?

General Dungeon Discussion Thread - Part 2

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At least the revenant doesnt need to be handheld due to lack of active defence. :>

Constructive balance thread.

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spoj.9672

The thing is DS could be the answer to active defence. But they actually need to give us traits that effect it. Such as 1 second invuln on DS entry or 3 second reflect on entry. Or block/reflect while channeling life transfer. Or gain vigor on attacks while in DS.

Unfortunately anets refusal to actually give us a proper defensive line, and leave death magic as sponge/minions only, has left us in a sorry state.

(edited by spoj.9672)

gw2dungeons.net: Week 28 discussion

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spoj.9672

Tbh it’s nice to have the records set on http://gw2dungeons.net/ that doesn’t mean tho that the people of the website should have the power of making the rules. The rules were CLEARLY made on the last meeting back when DnT hosted the record stuff NOONE had problems with approving and rule management, so why is this voting stuff made now? Because approvers don’t know if it should be approved or not. The logical answer would be that approvers don’t know what the ruleset is about. If it is really that unclear (which in my opinon is not the case) then go on some issues. But things like rtl in molten facility which are obviusly out of bounds, what was always unrestricted, or Immobalizing which was always restricted are things were voting is totally unnecassary.

Because when it was on DnT there were less records being posted and there was none of the grey area crap that has been appearing in the latest records. Also previously restricted was about playing as close to intended as possible.

Currently guilds try and break that as much as possible while still remaining in the competative ruleset. Which is why there is so much grey area/exploity stuff in restricted now. Its also why some stuff is voted to be banned and others to be allowed (despite them being very similar). Generally speaking the new stuff gets voted as allowed unless it requires effort (line casting rofl) and the old stuff remains banned. Which suggests that the players setting records currently have changed their mind on what the ruleset is supposed to be doing.

Completely agree with Rising Dusk. You might not see the votes as beneficial because you dont like keeping up with every little clarification/change. I personally dont like them because i think restrictive custom rules are stupid. And an open simple ruleset would be much easier to deal with but you guys dont want that. Or at least refuse to admit you actually want something closer to unrestricted. These votes have made approving within the bounds of the ruleset far easier for us.

We had multiple instances where we didnt know whether something was breaking a rule or not. Clarification was necessary to establish that the community wanted the less obvious choice to be true (funny that). So maybe you should stop acting as though its pointless. Because its not. Its easy to say that when you dont have to do anything except check the rules when you post records.

(edited by spoj.9672)

gw2dungeons.net: Week 28 discussion

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spoj.9672

I think this would have been fine except some records were approved that had rule violations in it so its more of a matter of the approvers going by the listed rules.

As for the discussion going on now, the stricter the rules get, the less creativity teams are allowed to employ which is going to lead to people not bothering.

I do agree with this. To be honest I couldn’t understand why there was even a need to vote on the Molten Facility Ride The Lightning thing as it was being used to get to an yet unacessible area and therefore is classified as “Out of bounds” or/and even “blockade bypassing”.
Two of the most fundamental rules of the “original” restricted ruleset.
The rules need to be what they are and people should just play accordingly rather than attempt to customize them everytime they find a new thing to show and that would require the rules being bent. I can understand the voters’ perspective as it’s a heavily timegated instance and anything to make it quicker probably feels like a good thing but it still doesn’t justify allowing it when it’s clearly disallowed by fundamental rules that have, for as long as I can remember, been a part of the restricted ruleset.

This is exactly what ive been saying all along. People dont know what they want. They bend the rules when they come up with something new that they think is cool. But if its something old its “no, ban it”. Its a complete joke and i honestly cant take people seriously anymore.

The whole reason some of these old questionable tactics were banned in the first place was because restricted was supposed to be to play the dungeons as close to the way they were intended as possible. That idea for restricted stopped being the case a long time ago and now its just play whats fun (because noone gives a kitten what anet intended anymore). So theres not really any point in having restricted anymore. It should just be how it was before with the big issues covered.

A universal ruleset that bans the big 3 issues would give plenty of freedom and creativity but would also be quite restrictive towards major exploits. So; no gem store items, no consumables and no breaking out of the map or moving through geometry. If anything seriously major surfaces, like skipping half the dungeon without getting out of the map, then we can revisit.

If people are still insistant on the constant customised ruleset (no idea why they would be). Can we at least have unrestricted follow this ruleset? Or get a 3rd ruleset for it. Id actually just like to see an open poll for those 3 rulesets. Or a survey of what people dislike/like about each ruleset and why they will/wont compete with it.

I think people would be surprised at how popular a middle ground ruleset would be. I personally know a lot of people (and im not talking about rT members) who are silent on the issue but agree restricted goes a bit too far. And unrestricted is too open so it has very little competition and people worry about their rep by posting heavily exploited runs.

(edited by spoj.9672)