Guild Wars 2

Okay guys, so I’m leveling up a thief and I’m probably going to be taking it out for roaming and PvP eventually. I know the thief class has been fleshed out and streamlined like all the other classes (maybe not ranger) so I’d probably be wasting a bunch of time trying to create one on my own that will likely be inferior to the ones out there already.

So, I want to know (linked if possible) what are the cheesiest builds out there right now. I want to know what are the builds that make people who play against a thief want to give up. So cheesy that it will validate crackers (thus the title) and probably create “thief OP” threads.

I’m gonna just put this out there for the OP and I hope he sees this.

1. The developers have already released the notes for the patch so it will be inevitable.

2. PvE drives the balance patches. Look at living story.

3. This is the wrong forum to post this on because developers barely respond to the complaints here. If anything you’ll have this page locked because a moderator (not developer) will see something he/she doesn’t like.

4. People aren’t bothering to read your original post as it is with a lot of these forum topics. I’ve tried making coherent arguments in the forums in the past but you need to think of the forum posters as having the reading attention of a mouse. Just look at people talking about zerging, when in the original post you already talked about how the zerging meta isn’t affected by the changes and are instead talking about the roaming meta.

5. While some people will mention thieves or warriors as the main reason why ferocity needs to be implemented, it is really only the thief that can do complete one shots. Guardian burst will hurt with these changes along with some roaming ele and power mesmer builds.

6. People don’t want to get better at the game. Period. If you offer to help someone learn how to fight burst classes they will most likely decline, then continue to complain how overpowered or underpowered classes are.

I only make this long post because it is obvious you want developers to think about the changes before they implement them but I’m going to warn you that you will be sorely disappointed by the responses you will get around here.

I’ll duel you, but I play during weird hours if that’s okay with you. We can duel on EotM because I’m on the wrong server right now but I’d love to try to fight this type of build. And if you don’t mind trying it against different classes.

If this is trollbait then you got a bite and well kitten me…

Edit: PM me on any of my characters if you want to

This has been seen so many times it’s begun to mold the meta of the posts around here in all the forums. The power of Mighty Meek can’t be denied.

But love it none the less.

Lotus.9746:

Hills you say?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Ru31FN2qNY

kitten that hill wiped a zerg. I DEMAND A NERF OF HILLS. They’re just too powerful with their ability instantly gib and grief players. Dunno if its a L2P issue or not though some say the almighty hill isn’t OP at all.

The most powerful thing in WvW?
You might be thinking of warriors, necromancers, or any strong profession. Wrong.
You might be thinking of blobs or zergs. Wrong.
You might be thinking of well organized guild groups. Wrong.
You might be thinking of T3 fully upgraded keeps defended by said blobs and organized guild groups. Wrong.

No. The most powerful thing in WvW, are hills.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRFS9C0PFUM

A-Net you need to nerf those hills you can clearly see in the video a single hill defeating me and a guild member despite our best efforts.

Due to a serious lack of condition pressure this group set up would melt to an organized and well versed group of mesmers and thieves. I’d say 3 thieves and 2 mesmers because your support ranger and or ele would be dropped in a second as soon as the thieves open on them with massive backstabs. The stealth uptime would make you run circles trying to pin a person down while slowly being bursted and forced to take AoE damage as you rez the downed person during a stealth stomp.

Your disapproval of warriors and necros surprise me due to their roles in group fights.

Warriors – Peeling thieves and other burst classes off of your glassier support members. They also provide excellent AoE pressure for cleaving and stuns for bursting select targets. Properly played warriors can force your team to choose a different target due to damage mitigation.

Necro – AoE condition pressure. Force opposing team to consistently be cleansing and give an alternate form of damage to pressure. Signet of Spite into an epidemic is never to be underestimated and will immediately force cooldowns to be used to cleanse it. The spirit ranger might be able to apply burning but necros are the king of conditions.

With the current set up I would still say the ranger would be incredibly easy to down as 2800 (not 28,000 as you stated earlier because that’s literally impossible) isn’t a very high armor rating and is minimally higher then a full zerker warrior armor. 2 mesmers and a thief could down my 3,000 armor guardian even after using my shelter in about 2 seconds with proper timing. Then the thief would be the next target due to the lack of extremely slippery escapes. After those 2 are down your party turns into a wet noodle. A very hard to kill wet noodle but a wet noodle none the less.

I thought ArenaNet had reworked the matchmaking system for solo queue. I was having a winning streak and wanted to try go for leader boards and was at 70% and rising. Then this. Really Anet, what is going on? Is it really THAT hard to fix the 4v5 problem. Its infuriating to lose rank and wreck a winning streak because of imbalanced teams.

Even though I know a red post won’t come because they don’t seem to give 2 cares in the world. This is more of a venting session.

Sreoom.3690:

I’ve recommended this before…there should be two WvW instances.

WvW Seasons should be viewed as the “Professional League” and should not be server specific. Instead several “Armies” are established and people can enlist in the army they choose. There should be an enlistment fee (25g maybe?) to demonstrate a personal commitment to the League. The enlistment fee would go into a pot that would be divided among the top three armies. In this professional league there should be a “Season” and a “Post Season” Your army’s performance in the Season will determine your Post Season position on the brackets. The last week of the Post Season would be the Superbowl of WvW…only the top 3 teams/Armies play that week and will fight for Championship.

The other WvW instant would be for the casual players (they way it is today…Server specific).

I like this idea but i feel like it risks the chance that guilds will all enlist in the strongest group especially if they have to pay for it. And they can assist the payments for other guilds they see as strong enough. Essentially “buying” a guild.

And can we not make this post about Blackgate I feel it should be a discussion about how to improve seasons. For those who were there the T2 → T1 push was indeed hard seeing as SoS and JQ were strong but you also need to remember all the bad and buggy tactics guilds and zergs were using. May I remind you of the infinity ball and culling.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Have all PPT scored only via tower and keep meta events which spawn due to X (either random or player initiated), and last for Y (1hr).

That way no matter the disparity in numbers in servers, everyone who is available knows where to show up for the PPT, and the fights.

-_- That has the same problems that the current system has with server stacking.

…In fact that’s exactly how it works now. Disparity in numbers will still be a problem because the larger zerg will still win due to coverage.

@TeamBattleAxe.3901- Thanks for the link to the video I like his idea as well we just have slightly different but it’s good to know other people have similar ideas.

@Gilgamesh.7364- No, it isn’t a QQ post about foreign coverage. For someone who #believegate I find your faith false. Do you think we can’t win against 2 servers. I sure believe that we can and will win even if the odds are against us, we’ve proved ourselves many times in the past. In fact I’m a very active Blackgate member myself and participated in some of the overtime that we put in to take leagues. Both guilds I’m in are very WvW active. Hit me up or watch out for my name in mapchat some day if you don’t believe me.

@Dayra.7405- Don’t group up all members of Blackgate together please as I too am a member of it. I understand that there are coverage problems that thus I am presenting what I believe is a way to smooth those problems out.

@Chris.3290- This is exactly what I would be hoping for. Some other servers to get some spotlight as their matches would suddenly be “interesting”. Seeing as 2 servers would be sharing 6 BLs and 2 EBs I don’t feel as though queues would still be a problem. From what I’ve heard and read, Eredon Terrace has problems fill any of the BLs even on reset days as well as almost all the bronze league servers.

@IMAGE.1509- That is why I am posting an idea that I feel would be helpful to the WvW community as a whole by balancing out servers.

@Fortus.6175- I do believe they have the technology for it because all the mechanics are ingame already except for the limited free transfers. And I personally feel as though server stacking is a bigger issue then some of the caps right now.

@Lord Kuru.3685- That is a very valid point but I feel as though the biggest big brother (Blackgate, which is my current server) wouldn’t bully and would rather work with their fellow server because winning would be the name of the game. With other servers finally getting a chance to shine I hope other servers will come out to fight to win.

So, I’ve seen a lot of comments regarding how Season 1 was a blow out for many servers and how many people didn’t like the coverage problems. Regarding the rewards for the 1st place finishers for each group you can’t make everyone happy.

If you lower it then it makes all the players who tried extremely hard, even putting in overtime play, useless. But if the rewards are good enough then it destabilizes the server populations as everyone will be flocking to the 1st place servers.

This is an idea for a Season 2. Since most will agree that server strength is equal to their coverage why don’t we link servers? What if for Season 2 servers were linked via free transfers to the mirroring server? I.e. Blackgate+Eredon Terrace, Jade Quarry+Devona’s Rest, Tarnished Coast+Kaineng, etc etc.

The servers would be matched randomly (but not against a linked server) and the winner would be assigned points much like our current leagues. The 2 linked servers would share a pool for points i.e. Blackgate 2nd (3 points) Eredon Terrace 2nd (3 points) = 6 points for their team.

Queues would disappear as players would just free transfer over to their friendly server and join on their battles; once done can either stay or transfer back for no fee. It would help distribute players across the servers more evenly in a fun way and promote friendliness and cooperation across servers (hopefully). And once the season is over then the two top ranked servers will get paired down again and constantly shuffle the “top” server to prevent server stacking.

I.e. Maguuma+Ferguson’s Crossing gets top spot and Blackgate and Eredon Terrace get bottom spot. Then the next pairs will be Blackgate+Ferguson’s Crossing and Maguuma+Eredon Terrace or vice versa thus not allowing anyone to know which server group will be the best next season and not allow anyone to transfer over to the “top” server.

Let me know what you think.

edited for grammar

The problem about this possible solution is that the more elitist servers will only allow their best guilds to fight during certain time zones. This will severely discourage PuGs and new players from playing WvW.

For example, if a server knows it is weak during SEA, then it will try to only allow best guilds in during that time because those guilds will be able to get more PPT then a militia at that time.

How will servers keep PuGs from playing?
For starters commanders won’t turn their tags on to allow PuGs to easily follow their group (already done by some elitist guilds). They might use server TS or other voice coms and only communicate with their guild. They could allow PuGs to die and grief them so they will stop playing WvW during those times. Many other ways that I probably don’t even know about.

No, friendlies can’t attack each other. It is essentially a giant stadium shaped room that keeps all gear from WvW.

Be careful though because depending on your server, it could be dangerous and full of ganking zergs.

How would I react to these patch notes?
Well after I’ve changed my pants, due to the raging kitten I’d have, I would say probably thank A-net for making WvW fun again.

posting to keep OP on main page so A-net will read this

Zanryu.3417:

Hello everyone, there have been many complaints about the Warrior class. How Healing Signet + Adrenal Health provide too much healing, how Cleansing Ire is too good at removing conditions, how Banner Regen Warriors are virtually unkillable, and I’m here to put a stop to this nonsense.

Warriors can die. Here’s the proof. Show me those Warriors that are carrying teams by themselves and winning 4v1s on video. Or really anything that shows how OP they are, rather than theorycrafting and telling stories about what happened. Sure, stories can give us some idea of what’s going on, but we don’t know the exact situations.

In other words… watch this video.

Dude not to insult you or anything but you’re wasting your time here in the forums. Most people on this forum are trolls and/or QQ bots who would rather have all but their classes nerfed rather then get better.

For example, I offered on Spvp forums and Warrior forums offering free lessons for dueling a warrior and showing key moves to interrupt and dodge. No one took the offer. Not a single PM, mail, or invite.

I’ve helped a couple of my guildmates on how to fight warriors. Things such as Rush animation, skullcrack dodging, using the stunbreak after the switch to GS, etc etc. Next thing I know they were able to prevent escapes by interrupting my Rush, dodge stuns and keep proper distance.

I realize this is a group oriented game but many warriors are one trick ponies. If you can dodge the initial stun you’ll be okay as long as you know what the movement buttons are and how to dodge.

But instead this is what happens http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_Qsq9J3g8g.
Sorry its a WoW video, haven’t found a GW2 counterpart.

I personally don’t feel as the warrior is OP if you know their tricks and that’s all I want to help people with.

Silferas.3841:

Skull Crack on an Asura, the obvious winner of the most telegraphed ability ever! It’s not like you are stunned for 50% of it’s duration and can’t really see it coming at all! But wait, there’s more! Skull Crack is actually a melee range thing, so let’s give warriors shield bash and earthshaker to close that gap between you two and waste both your dodges! But wait! You have actually managed to save a stunbreak up to this point and got out of that nasty stun? Well, even if you have managed to land some damage on that warrior it’s gone now!. Adrenal health with signet of healing and some regeneration if you accidentally CRIPPLE or TRY to STOP the warrior running at you is such a balanced mechanic. I’ve always been a fan of guardian level sustain. Especially on a glass cannon character with 0 healing power. But warrior isn’t really a glass cannon with about 18k HP and more armor than a valkyrie elementalist in spite of going zerker amulet, now is it? But it’s all ok, because warriors need to go melee range (unless they have a longbow…), unlike guardians, or d/d elementalists, or s/d elementalists, or any other of the dozens of builds that don’t get half of what warrior gets yet have to do the same thing. But warriors do have the ultimate counter. Blind. Well, it would be if they were not immune to it for a whole of 8 seconds it takes them to roflstomp you. Or they could just use the longbow with AoE that covers the whole point. But don’t mind all these small things, I am sure engineers that have no viable stun break will manage somehow. It’s not like in spite of being natural tanks with very high sustain, immunity to conditions and reduced control effect durations warriors would actually still do high damage right? WRONG!

They do

EDIT: btw, don’t get me wrong, I am not implying warriors are unbeatable (not at all). There is a number of ways to go about it. It’s just that they get the cream of the top and in the heat of battle, if you get caught by a warrior when out of energy, or with your stun break on cooldown, you are done and there is little you can do about it.

While I do agree with a lot of what you said, if you get caught by any class with no energy or CDs (assuming the other guy is competent) then you’re screwed either way.

The Asura thing is completely right and isn’t just the warrior. Try interrupting a thief skill when hes an Asura. But there’s no excuse for the other classes, I play a human and I’ve stunned tons of people with a shield bash only for them to break it directly into a skull crack.

Some small things too such as when you get skull cracked and don’t see a switch to the GS then they used it defensively and you don’t need to use the stun break because the mace does below average damage. Or something like poison upkeep or spacing/positioning such as running straight through the person to get behind the warrior (it throws so many people off) instead of strafing or walking backwards.

I’ve been seeing a lot of posts on the forums about how they can’t deal with warriors. I’ve never felt that warriors were overwhelming especially with the hammer, due to highly telegraphed attacks.

So I’m willing to help anyone who wants to learn about how to fight a warrior for free. Just message me and I’ll use different builds and show you what telegraphed attacks to look for and when to pop those useful stunbreakers.

I’m not the best warrior by far but if you know what attacks to dodge then it will become a skill fight rather then it being simply “OP”.

Message me in-game or send me a mail, character names in sig.

I’ve been seeing a lot of posts on the forums about how they can’t deal with warriors. I’ve never felt that warriors were overwhelming especially with the hammer, due to highly telegraphed attacks.

So I’m willing to help anyone who wants to learn about how to fight a warrior for free. Just message me and I’ll use different builds and show you what telegraphed attacks to look for and when to pop those useful stunbreakers.

I’m not the best warrior by far but if you know what attacks to dodge then it will become a skill fight rather then it being simply “OP”.

edit: message me in-game or send me some mail (character names in sig)

Axtozob.4597:

You got 4 gap closer (in fact 3 because Hammer F1 is a waste for that), so you can cover more than 2000 units in few seconds and you are not able to reach a necro ?

Just GS 5 + 3 allows you to rush someone at 1200+ range. Then you can Zerk stance and combo the kitten out of him.

Problem was that I got crippled mid rush, they were pretty good at that, so the rush and other gap closers were shorted. Forgot to mention in the post that they were really on dodging both bullsrush and earthshaker. Only landed 1 earthshaker during the duels.

And the zerk stance was always answered with a spectral walk with a port at the end.

Idk why the necro always felt just a little to far away.
Just surprised me because normally I’m able to stomp necros in tpvp and if I can get close before they notice me.

Well before I get flamed out with “you shouldn’t have any problems with necros” I’d like to say that I don’t feel its all that easy.

current build: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIAQJASRjkOxwpQyOMxBE0DNsK4iTBlQ9YOqj4A-jkBB0yAEIQJPFRjtMqIas6FYKXER1CBMaLA-w

So the set up was a duel in WvW against a necromancer (happened twice both were condition build staff/scepter dagger) and both times I realized the duel started at max 1200 range. I would usually start the fight by trying to get close while dodging through the circles but the necros would just kite me away using their cripples on the scepter. When I’d use zerker stance they would use spectral walk and continue to kite then port back to the original location then when my 8 seconds were up they would simply condition burst the life out of me and I’d die.

I play a necro and I understand what they are doing but I would like to know what I could do better as a warrior.

I would also say that if you are in a roaming group, that much toughness won’t do anything against necromancers and engineers because conditions ignore toughness.

I don’t know why people are equating higher toughness to higher health because with conditions abound toughness is just a cute number on your screen. Heck, you might even die to a thief if he happens to be trolling around with a confusion build. I personally run zerker gear for the sole reason of trying to kill necros and engineers before my precious 8 seconds of heaven are up.

I’m curious and hope I can get a response but why do you say finally viable in Tpvp. I’ve never been at the top levels of play for Tpvp but I’m curious about the MaceShield/GS builds that are running around. (note: not trying to derail thread)

And how do you feel about the chance of it getting nerfed because of the angry forum posts that are flying around about it,

You inspired me to go out and buy a charzooka and run around with a rifle build.

That video is pure gold man, thanks for sharing it.

Well with the amount of crying going on over the warrior I fear for the value of this thread.

Don’t worry just get a cup and store all the tears that are gonna appear and drink them later if you’re full. It’s quite good for the skin as well as refreshing.

Pibriamal.8719:

Skeletor.9360:

Yes I think they should be buffed more. Lets see we only get what?

1.) High default HP’s.
2.) High default toughness.
3.) Unable to be CC’ed.
4.) Unstoppable block that wastes opponents skills.
5.) Charges that connect no matter if the target is stealthed or not.
6.) Best mobility in the game. (Tied with thief and ele)
7.) Super high damage.
9.) Hey while we are damageing them lets add a charge a stun and a bunch of automatic hits.

Yes definately in need of a buff. Not OP at all.

Please tell me how to unlock more than 2 weapon sets. I would love to be like this warrior you described, slotting Greatsword/Sword+Warhorn/Hammer/Mace+Shield.

Guys don’t worry. I mean don’t you know warriors are so OP they can spec 30/30/40/30/30 which allows us to use 5 different weapons sets and never runs out of adrenaline. Sheesh the nerve. /sarcasm over
But seriously though I feel like some people on this forum actually believe that when they mention our abilities.
This post is so well put +1000 internets for the writer. I remember there was a tier list somewhere on the Spvp forum when D/D ele was god tier and everyone put warriors and necros at the bottom and now that the status quo has changed you’d think that A-Net had developers personally shown up to people’s houses to punch them in the face.

Been getting more 4v5s and they are never fun. I heard A-net tried to fix this ridiculous problem but obviously it isn’t working. There should be much harsher punishments for people who aren’t present for majority of the game. It ruins people’s win-loss ratios and makes the game unplayable. So why hasn’t this been fixed? In a recent post there was talk about how there is much love for this game but this has been a persistent problem since the beginning so can we get a patch for this.

Pictures of a game where my team has 4 people against people of higher rank as well.

That vengeance is wayyyyyyyy to overpowered seeing as if your team keeps them off of you for a bit they will have a 2nd chance to rez you but seeing as warriors aren’t making a huge impression in pro games that might be what we need.

Daecollo.9578:

Please check all that apply.
You are:
[] Engineer
[x] Necromancer
[] Thief
[] Elementalist
[] Ranger
[] Mesmer
[] Guardian
[x] WARRIOR

You Think Warrior is too:
[] Hard
[] Overpowered
[] Broken
[x] AWESOME

You are Currently Threatening to:
[] Quit
[] Uninstall
[] Reroll
[] Tell the Internet That You are Upset
[] Bash my head to the wall because I can’t beat them.
[x] CONTINUE PLAYING THE WARRIOR

Describe how the Warrior hurt you:
(fill below.)
My warrior made me feel like I was having fun playing it because of the proactive style of play. This made me confused and ALMOST feel bad for people that I kill in PvP.

I believe most people who question the point of kick is speaking from the standpoint of PvP where you want to stick to your target and avoid being kited, or speaking from PvE dungeon point of view where kick is useless on bosses due to defiant and most times you don’t want to be kicking mobs around

The largest problem with this threat is the fact that you are disregarding PvE, when Anet as said before that they want to keep PvE and PvP balanced at the same time. In PvE warriors are great with heavy damage dealing and that extra HP creates a buffer for mistakes. So instead of making criticisms I’d recommend trying to figure out what you’d be willing to give up for better mobility, time on target, and protection.