Guild Wars 2

The frustration come from other people hiding the platforms (especially big norn and charr) to you so you are not sure when to jump, apart from that the puzzle is pretty awesome.

I like the dungeons the way they were made, but as anything with a set purpose; well it get his good and bad aspects of this purpose. I think many people don’t like them, well because they don’t really understand the purpose they were designed for, the whole competitive pve aspect is not something they really grasps, or even want to understand frankly, simply because they play a “game”, and want it to be as such. And since GW2 dungeon are clearly more or less about that competitive aspect of pve, they don’t like it much. Even fractals are set this way, even if they are really better that the usual mind set as the older dungeons (tank and spank rather than team work).

What i would like to see is a “chill out” dungeon (if that make any sense), a place set up as a labyrinth, but rich enough so that any kind of combination of team/squad could find some place and challenge for them. A place you could go deep inside and form groups on the fly or even go solo in the easier paths, and those groups could evolve with more or less difficulty to explore it depending how deep and what paths they go. In any case it should be quiet big so that people could get lost Much like an underground world as the concept was done in the old days of rogue like games/pen & paper. And it should always be a bit too difficult for your group setting to push you to group more.

I don’t think you got it guys, dungeons are high end pve content, yes they are challenging, and hard to do properly and efficiently, that’s the point, they were designed to be that way. Ye that can be frustrating for sure, but you can’t really have something "hard to do without that either you know, it’s just a game, so this is the self safe by itself, you can always stop playing and watch a movie.

I’m sorry but some people do like them, and if you manage to gather a good party you won’t die 10zillion time, in fact you won’t die anymore. And about exploit, ye sure people always come up with great reasons to excuse the crap they are doing, we are all doing it, it’s natural, it doesn’t mean it have any kind of value though. Usually when you do some kitten, and we all do some, and want to keep your ego a good image, well think about a great excuse, but you know keep it for yourself and move on, don’t be a smart kitten thinking other will swallow your kittenty excuse, just say “sorry” or shut the f*off, and move on… They should learn that in school to kids honestly, basic psychology 101.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stability

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stun_breaker#Skills_that_break_stun

Stability is the huge weakness on necro, and this is one of the reason why you will want to use your elite very well. I personally have full soul reaping, so when i need it i take foot on the grave trait (honestly i mostly use that trait skill and rarely swap anyway), so i don’t really care, but i can see a non soul reaping necro having a lot of problems. Now if you need long lasting stability use your elite ( a whooping 20s for plague and 30s stability on lich form isn’t something you should ignore totally like most people seam to do here). The only real problem is that you can’t res with stability on the necro, which is totally stupid, necro lord of life and dead can’t res properly??? wtf

As of stun breaker they are enough of them i don’t see the problem, spectral walk is a good one if you like having speed buff.

I agree with you very much OP, necro is a very strong class in all aspect of the game. I think the problem is that it got a very bad reputation during one point of the beta, and now this reputation stick to it. It was also very unfairly pushed further with that “lame” (was lame to me at least) necro have more than 100 bugs complain that was totally unfair in my opinion, because if those bug existed they were unimportant, and barely noticeable.

Now one thing is sure, and it was the case since the very beginning (dev said it countless time before release), this class is not a straight forward kind of class as is warrior for example. It need some subtlety and experimentation from the players, the players that aren’t in those kind of things probably miss all what the class is about, and is also probably one of the reason they are so many complains, because a lot of players are simply not in those kind of thing and completely miss this. But this is actually something very positive to the class, not everyone want to play bully kind of class, some do want some subtlety and look for this.

So in short if you don’t have a twisted mind don’t play a twisted class.

I have made this dungeon a lot to get my dungeon gear, and i like it very much, but imo the strongest problem is by far NOT the exploit. In fact i really haven’t see a lot of Pug exploit it, nothing compared to fotm for ex. But imo as some other pointed, all boss have too much hp, cut it to 2/3 or 3/4. The water parts probably need some tweak to make it more “fun”, i don’t know put more mobs and mobs group, but seriously reduce their hp, water combat isn’t really that fun, especially against bags of hp. The dungeon is overall very good, but the paths are a bit too long, especially if you have a “bad” group.

In short vertical progression is shallow and addictive, it is just the same content you put different names and numbers or value to it. You do the same level but because it’s level +1 and the mobs aren’t fat but skinny player have the sensation they do something, but in fact do nothing, that’s probably why player are bored so fast now when they play those kind of game, which is funny because vertical progression main reason to exist is probably for player retention. But you know too much of it kills it… Horizontal progression, doesn’t deal with addiction to make people stick to a game, it enrich the game with really new stuff, and create variety.

The only real problem is from the dev team side, horizontal progression is super easy to code and launch and probably have a high and short resource spent for gain ratio, well because as said it’s the same content reskinned with value changes. Horizontal progression would be like adding house system, or create a character richness goal, or create totally new pvp or pve system like a mob vs player conquer realism for example, that need a lot more work companies aren’t able and just don’t want to do, in fact i’m not even sure they can even do that. The only real mmo that have strong horizontal progression was Uo and it came from it’s incredible richness, but then again the game was designed and created that way from the beginning. Honestly it seam like Anet a re a bit lost now and don’t know what to do next. I sure hope they’ll be back on their ground quickly.

Honestly Gaile i don’t think the problem is in the event, the chest, the distribution or the loot. The problem is in the precursors themselves, we have drop that cost 100 time more than any other drop, so when people have a good chance to get one as an event reward, well it really isn’t very fair, but i guess you guys understand this. I personally didn’t want to participate in the event that night, i just wasn’t in the mood for a slide show and a lag fest even if i participate in all other events had great moments, if i knew precursor was raining i would have come.

You should make a general drop raise on them, but m’ not sure you’ll be able to break it ever, mmo economy are super inflationary, there is nothing you can do about it, but change the whole process of creating those weapons. Maybe guys break the precursors in crafting parts, or something.

I play both a warrior with zero mf and a necro with full mf gear, and the difference is obvious. As much in how much faster the necro make gold once he sell all the crap he drop, but also when i do dungeons or get in any tricky situation and see why the warrior have like 2k more stat points. Necro have wonderful survivability mechanism so it make up a bit, but still the difference is obvious. I personally think they should have made a special room for the mf stat in the character sheet.

I have tried the euro version of a fractal guild, and honestly i was totally choked Anet didn’t gave us the ability to have multiple guild chat window. Why give the ability to have multiple guilds if you don’t give them guild chat, i mean a guild is nothing else than a special chat channel. I was so disappointed.

I play only with pug, i don’t see the problem really. Some group are bad but it’s pretty rare in fact. You just have to spot if people are bad because they just never played those instance and don’t know the mechanism (then you can explain them), or because they are just bad, we all have bad days. There is not much you can do. People are pretty nice generally, people usually don’t like dictators and people throwing orders to other. If you explain, just do that, but really you usually don’t need to, bad groups are pretty rare.

I personally let it be. Only once i was so pissed i actually left.

The only valid way is to get as much stability/reflect skills as you can before engaging combat (you can’t change skill in combat). Then if you look closely they are grouped in small pack of 3 to 4, and you should be able with your group to go from a pack to an other and wait for your stability cd to go up in between each pack of mobs.

The rest of the pseudo techniques are just not very valid, like the theory saying they center your character and if you stay at the border of the platform blabla, this is all bs tricks, they center at your feet anyway. Use reflect and stability, especially if you have 2 or 3 melee guy in your goup, that should be enough to take them down fast before your stability wear out.

PS you can also use ranged pet to distract them and pull agro away from your group.

Loot isn’t the same, dev already said it scale with the fractal scale, each 10 new level the drop have better/other drop table.

In this game you are in charge of your own survivability, this is the main thing, your survivability doesn’t depend on someone else but it is your responsibility. This is something anyone planning to play in group should understand, and it is obvious the op missed that point. If you make a lot of group parties like dungeons you’ll see that bad groups fail because each member is enable to deal with his own survivability and blame other for his own failures. You can help other member but cannot do the job for them. If you spam your skill and don’t understand what each effect is doing, then good luck in your handovers, you’ll really need it. Op it’s pretty clear you don’t understand at all what group play is about in this game. Stop thinking about your beloved trinity, concentrate on your character job, which is stay alive and help your group go through whatever it is confronted to as fast and efficiently as you can, then you’ll really begin to play the game as you should, rather than as you would like to.

I have made this path countless time, and once, only once did i got such a terrible group they couldn’t aoe the pack of mobs, they were all scared to death because of the number and wanted to hit only one mob at a time for each member. Then those elites triggered, i didn’t even know about them and wasn’t sure if it was a bug or just because the group was so bad. Now i know ^^

Dahkeus.8243:

Eh, I don’t think it would be worth it. You’d either be wearing rare level MF gear (what most people use to farm with) or you’d blow tons of gold on getting exotic MF gear.

If you splurge on exotic MF gear, you’re probably losing a lot more gold than the extra drops will bring in and if you’re going in rares, then you’re really holding your group back.

Until MF starts making a real significant difference, I don’t think this can be justified.

You are very much wrong. Best way to equip is to craft your exo mf with your craft and mats. Then get better dungeon or other armor that are anyway far better than the crafted one. Mf gear give you a lot more revenue on the long run.

6k is pretty standard, it also depend how much utilities/boon/debuff you pumped on your shot to boost the damage. You can be sure the guy claiming those 15k, is doing it in very peculiar situations, he probably dropped a pack of mobs to have maximum damage buff, like 10+ might, have full vulnerability (25 stack) on the mob he is attacking because a bunch of people are stacking them and so on and so. But yes the game is set up so you need to work for it if you want to apply good damage and not “waste” your best skills, this is all the combat is about. If you use your utilities and skill well (good sequence), then you will significantly raise your dps, this is valid for any class, not only warrior.

Hi guys it’s a stupid question but i don’t really understand how it work. I joined 2 guilds recently and i just don’t understand how guild chat is working. You seam to be able to see/talk only to one guild, is my impression right? how does it work?

Ye i agree with this post, especially when it is totally counter productive, like people bugging the ettin boss and make the fight 10 time harder to finish without bugging it, i mean what use for this kind of stuff? as if bugging a game was something so cool to do…

Warrior and guardians are awesome class, but i will be honest they have a huge drawback in my book for pve, you need to go tanky spec if you really want to go wuper good with them and if you want to maintain a high dps, you’ll need to stay out of mf gear. As a necro for example i have a bunch of mechanism that let me do great dps, tank as well as the 2 other class if you play well (because it is mechanism based rather than stat based), and i can just not give a crap about toughness, and not much either about vit and precision. Naturally it all depend on builds too, so this is probably subject to discussion, but the base is there imo. I think ele and thief share the same kind of advantage when it come to pve, they can survive a lot, dps a ton and still have room for a “useless” stat …. caugh caugh “MF”. But if you want the easy road, war and guardian are probably better choices.

I like it too, and i don’t give a crap about the levels per say, what i like is that the difficulty raise. And i found the difficulty to be very well set in the fractal, well a lot better than what i’m used to see in most mmo, this mean having mobs with a higher hp bar. At least in the fractal difficulty scale come from many factors, and ask better team work, so this was well done by Anet.

And the constant spam is a good thing to me, it mean people like to play the fractal. It mean i can find group play a lot more often than in other dungeons too. They just need a lfg tool, tha’ts all.

Strifey.7215:

Waste of time, you already kill a bunch of stuff that you can’t run by. If you have more time to play, run another fractal and kill mobs you need to + get tokens and progression instead of derping around killing some bats.

Actually the biggest waste of time is when one of the team member die in the middle of a run and nobody even want to go back, if it is even possible, because in many situation if you didn’t killed them, you won’t be able to come back to res, not talking about mobs waiting for you at the check point to finish you if you respawn there and can’t even “wake up” at respawn point because of them… You can’t say those situations isn’t common, especially in fractal. The most horrible part is that even if those are trash mob, you still need your party to kill them quickly, so if one or 2 members want to run, the whole group have to run because of them. So all in all i’m sorry but runners aren’t very smart, create a lot of problem just to skip couple of minute tops for the entire dungeon length, which is pretty long for a full fractal, at least an hour. Personally i don’t like it at least.

They are run dungeon parts like the dolphin one, obviously designed to be that way, those are pretty good in fact, they learn people to stick together to be efficient, the rest is pretty bad. But its mostly bad because people want to run past them, and not because of design.

They said countless time that they are working on it and have a team on this.

KuroKanden.1026:

Unless you’re running MF , the likelihood of getting rare loots are rather slim in time vs. reward situation. even if you would have ran MF, this would merely appear as counterproductive as you’re providing less for your team. Most of the goodies you get are straight from the stage chests; this includes the fotm weapon skins from daily chests on lv 20+.

Nha i run both a full tank spec on my warrior and mf geared necro and if the difference is noticeable once you sold all the loot at the vendor; you will drop a lot of rare and some exo with pretty much zero mf as well.

The worst for me is listening people that don’t give a crap about fotm and just want their new best ring for their character and whine because their rings aren’t what they want, and people that really like the challenge of the game and can’t progress because they miss agony resist and need to farm dailies, and will gladly take any ring just to go on. So frustrating.

Ye i also hate this, how many time did i saw a guy from a group dead or at a checkpoint or somewhere on the path, and nobody can res him or the whole party have to reset for him, when they could have just killed the mob and took few minutes to do it. Just so silly… Not to mention they miss loot opportunity.

Ah ok Jakar, i wasn’t aware the item can have some agony resist as a stat plus a slot.

BUTTERBLUME.3217:

There actually is a method to obtain the ascended piece via tokens, 1850~ tokens and you are set.

It is absolutely not in proportion to anything, but the option is there…

I think only the back pieces are craftable, so no matter what, at this point you can only get +5 resist from the tokens, all in all you won’t go far with +5 resist.

Those agony resist will have better use than the inadequate stat at higher level believe me. Or just send it to me by mail :p

You forgot to mention the guy dying on top of a crystal, also you have to res him or try to target the crystal, good luck with that.

Great add me, character name “Flipflap Flop”, lv 15 or 16 i’m not sure anymore.

Riffle have a line aoe, this mean anything in your line of fire will get hit, where bow use circle type of oae. Your choice really. I personally use rifle because if i’m not mistaken bow is more of a condition type of weapon, rifle is more a power based weapon.

I play a lot with endure pain in dungeon and the description is just very misleading, you still get damage from all the condition and indirect type of damage like the agony in Fotm dungeon. It really seam to work only on the damage you take directly from mobs at the time your buff is up. So it is certainly not an immune skill, and is far from “take no damage from incoming attack” as the description suggest.

I have to point out that all mmo rng have problems with steak of bad or good luck, because they usually are not true rng system, but what they call in mathematics “pseudo random” system, and that is why some people after so many run never get anything, and other drop all the time. Pseudo random system have that exact problem of creating more string of bad or good luck than it should. This is not something new in mmo, in fact it happen at pretty much each new mmo, and is the source of the problem.

Nha it’s just the same for all the final boss/room, they are long to be done, but aren’t as hard as people think. You just need to coordinate your group so that it lure the boss under the fire, there are space without snow on the floor, then have him stick there until one of your guy activate the mechanism that throw lava on him, and lure him to the next spot, and the next until he dies. You guys just need to understand how it work, that is all.

Ye i’m here to point my discontent about the whole dropping affair around the fotm dungeons. I’m sitting at lv15/16 and need to redo easier levels because when i play with other players that dropped like 2or 3 pieces and take absolutely no damage from agony when i’m always at the border of death, have to keep my dodge bar filled and my heal up at all time to survive them, i think it’s simply stupid. I really love the dungeons, but this is beyond ridiculous, give us enough tokens so that at least we can afford the minimal agony resist at each new 10level. Not only that but now the people i play with are well beyond 20, when i have to wait for the RNG. And i don’t even talk about all the side effect like me having full pow/thou/vit gear, and other running in full MF and glass canon, not even talking about noobs that still don’t even know how to take down final bosses at those level because they never had to work for it since their immunity never get them any difficulty. In any case fix your drop rate because it sux, thank you.

The problem is not about magic find per say, but how it was implemented. As it stand now you have to give away some of your most important stats to get some magic find, since both magic find gear, runes and else don’t have all the stat you want or need. So imo they should or give magic find item or enhancements more stat choice, or make it a specific stat you add via some extra gem slot or something new to this taste. Imo they should just rework it. It’s obvious they wanted to add some MF in dungeon gear, but their system make it worst imo.

You should be able to begin and finish them whenever you feel like it, i play mmo since 1998 and im’ from the old school. I don’t see why you should put a quantity of time. We used to be able to go into a dungeon, party in our way deep inside and leavev when we feel like it, it was the good time i guess.

If there is something that this particular room is about it is clearly not about luck, since you have to avoid most of the traps and learn the paths you can make. Once you learned them it is usually easy for your group to finish it, at lv7+, even a pug will manage it before the 3rd attempt.

Some people say i can, others say i can’t…

So anyone know how to do it, or is it really impossible?

ye gotten them above 10 as well.

Once you know the routes, it won’t be that hard. The best is to stick to a path until you know all the traps and wall and how to make it in time. Then do an other path. Its very frustrating at the beginning but after a while it’s easy. Its the only part that is hard from the beginning and i still haven’t saw it scale at lv11. So this is the good and the bad.

Hey guys this a real problem, those dc, thank you to work on this.

Also please let us make group with americans from europe and let us join normal map with people from other servers. As it stand now you can only join people in overflow, and people that need to join other servers do it because they play off hours when there is not much people on their servers. I would love to be able to party with american since i mostly play when everyone in europe is sleeping. Thank you guys!

great thank you for clearing this up to me

Hi guys i reached lv4 with a nice group last night, and we had a crazy time.

So my question now is how those levels work when it come to making parties. If i group with people that make lv1, does it reset my own level, can i party with them, if i do what happen? Anyone can clear this up to me so i know what kind of group i can or cannot party with. I’m pretty sure i can party with anyone but i’ll rather have confirmation from more experimented people.

Just passing to tell you guys, we just made it to lev4 of the fractal, and it’s the best dungeon experience since 98 when i started playing mmos, and believe me i made a ton of dungeons, bosses since. Great job with this one, this is my new best after the dynamic event, this one just take the crown.

Josh i don’t think you should apologize really, yes the puzzle was hard but then again if it wasn’t that hard a lot of people wouldn’t have liked it either. There is a post from reddit that sent me here, where the op asked what was the best part of the halloween event, and a lot of people pointed the clock tower (the majority it seam).

Ok thank you Grenic for putting something positive in that general bitterness that have became mmo forums. I think i’ll try to find a guild who have dungeons as a goal.

Also to the others my aim wasn’t to make “speed run” at all, in fact i like this game because it is supposed to end those kind of “bad” habits, well they are bad habits to me at least. I want to do dungeon for the content as we used to in the old games i played decade ago, and not to farm the loot at the end boss encounter, but i guess a lot of people have hard time to understand this.

Ho ok thank you, i should have looked the wiki.