Guild Wars 2

ManCaptain.3154:

Here’s the thing with thieves though. Shadow step stage 2 cleanses 3 conditions. Or they could have the trait that cleanses conditions while they are stealthed.

When they get low they will probably using their heal, which is most often Hide in Shadows, which cures burning.

Don’t get me wrong, it’s not a bad idea, but you can’t counter thieves with conditions because they don’t have to bring special skills just to cleanse conditions but they get condition removal on skills they bring anyway. Thieves have a really good skill set (unlike engy who has to bring specialized skills).

Like I said, the point of this build is to be disruptive on a point, not for dueling thieves. Also, to grief hundred blades warriors. A backstab thief can’t kill you and can’t move you off the point.

ManCaptain.3154:

On the topic of elixir infused bombs: I tried this trait and I was disappointed. It’s heals about as much as regeneration, which would be great if I didn’t have to be in melee range of the people I’m healing and if this trait wasn’t grandmaster trait in an otherwise unpopular trait line.

At times I run this build with 10 points in explosives for forceful explosives (I take 10 out of alchemy and lose backpack regenerator). It helps with the range of the bombs for both offensive and defensive purposes. Also, the inventions trait line is the bread and butter of any engineer bunker. If nothing else, you need the toughness and healing it gives to be able to survive insta-gib builds. I’ve never been under the impression that it is unpopular.

Aisa.2817:

I think the only idea I like is making summoned weapons like engineer kits. That would be pretty neat. The rest seems a bit overpowered to me.

I know, they’re really only situational and not as powerful as main weapons, but that’s to be expected really.

I like it too. I also think they should give elementalists some sort of adrenaline mechanic, allow us to steal skills from other classes, let us conjure illusions, and maybe give us a pet we can control. They should change the conjured weapons so that they give us access to fear, aegis, and stealth.

Aristio.2784:

Can you relink this build? I’m getting a bad link message.

Forum bug. Copy and paste the link into a new tab and it will work.

Kyon.9735:

I’m not a fan of Elixir infused bombs as well. Most of the time after dropping Fire, Concussion, Smoke, and Glue bomb I switch out of bomb kit and go to Rifle or Elixir Gun.

The purpose of this build is really to hold points. Since it is so defensively oriented, you’ll typically need assistance killing any opponents harassing you on the point. When help arrives, elixir infused bombs heals you and others in the area for upwards of 250 hps. This, coupled with the two super elixirs, will make you very popular with your teammates who fight with you on the point. I understand many don’t like it, but don’t underestimate it’s value, as it scales in power with the number of teammates on the point. Additionally, you really want to go 30 points deep in the inventions tree for the additional healing anyway, and it is the best choice of the available traits. Finally, spamming bomb 1 is the best option when toolkit 2, toolkit 3, pistol 2, pistol 3, and bombs 2, 3, and 4 are on cooldown.

insanemaniac.2456:

doesnt really matter, this wont counter thief very well since they do about 2-4 huge hits where most other burst skills are like 10+ smaller hits. you wont get much mileage out of the burn, condition spec or not.

The defensive nature of the build counters thieves extremely well. Their 2-4 “huge hits” amount to 7k damage max, so you have plenty of health left over before you even need to hit the panic button. You won’t be killing any thieves (except the ones that are stupid enough to stick around and keep fighting you), but you shouldn’t be dying to them either.

Also, many thieves like to use skills that hit quickly multiple times. The burn definitely gets their attention…

bromi.7809:

Hey mate. Have you tested if this ‘guardian’ burning scales with your condition damage?

I have not, nor have I tested to confirm that the runes truly do not have an internal cooldown and that it will apply a 10 second burn to hb warriors. Help with these tests would be appreciated.

hackks.3687:

btw Darth ‘Nader wins best build name IMO even though I don’t see what Darth has to do with it at all…

And I don’t see what Ralph Nader has to do with it all, but that’s what it’s named, I guess…

Panzen.4625:

Sounds like fun!

What about going 10 elixirs/30 tools? You could get 50% endurance regen to dodge more between your cooldowns or you could get additional retaliation after being crit (though the cooldown is a bit long). Though you’d have to weigh that up vs. the regen from backpack regenerator… hm…

About the sigils… are you sure that 20% longer burning is worth it? 120% of a 1 s burn is still just one tick, though I don’t know if the decimal is kept for calculation of totals (condition time on bleed builds can be tricky, too… though that one stacks intensity).

Either choice at the end of tools would be perfectly viable. I prefer the healing, but it is certainly up to you. The 20% longer burning isn’t necessarily worth it (although the decimal is kept), however there aren’t a lot of sigils that really benefit the build. Choose whichever you prefer.

I do need a bit of help confirming that there is no internal cooldown for the burn on block.

I’ve gotten some pretty significant burns (4-5 seconds) from blocking, but it doesn’t seem like hundred blades has to take the whole 10 seconds. Maybe there is a .25 second icd? Can someone with a warrior buddy try this against a hundred blades attack?

AKA: Shield-urally transmited disease.
AKA: The build that makes hundred blades warriors say: “Doctor, it burns when I cheese.”

Background: I was minding my own business pugging a few sPvP games and trying out my favorite point control builds when, to my chagrin, I found myself playing against a team with no less than three hundred blades warriors (that’s 3 “hundred blades warriors”, not 300 “blades warriors”, which would be a different issue entirely). I personally find the insta-gib builds cheesy and tasteless, but my sensibilities obviously weren’t shared by the opposition. Needless to say, I ended up eating more blades to the face (and back… in fact usually to the back) than I care to remember. While my build was bunker-y, I found that they out damaged my healing and I couldn’t damage them in the slightest. I clearly needed a new build. Now, it’s important to note that I am philosophically opposed to Anet mandating that slot 7 be reserved for a stunbreak (if you didn’t get Anet’s stunbreak memo go read posts by the pros in the thief and warrior forums), so my builds never have one. Not that it would have mattered if I did have one when facing more than one hb warrior. I realized that I had to go back to the drawing board to come up with something that could withstand the damage of cheese builds and be able to dish damage out as well. Thus, the STD Bunker was born…

Build: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fcAQJAqel0p6ZH5yuF17IxIFfW0heUYDrWRK0vlB;TkAg2UYZwSglFLHWSsGCMFA

Gear: Pistol/Shield, Shaman amulet, and SIX RUNES OF THE GUARDIAN.

Traits:
30 Toughness – Protective Shield because you don’t have a stun break so you are going to be eating a few steal/c&d/backstabs and hundred blades. Better have protection up… Reinfrorced Shield because more toughness and more blocky is more better. Elixir infused bombs for additional healing.

20 Alchemy – Protection injection because you’d better have protection up… Backpack Regenerator because it is the best health per second trait remaining.

20 Tools – Kit Refinement for the extra super elixir. Power wrench because, well, you know what they say about more blocky.

Play Style: Simple. Run on to a node being guarded by two or three enemies. Switch to elixir gun and drop a super elixir, switch to bomb kit and drop smoke, fire, and confusion, switch to tool kit then prybar someone’s face.

Right now you’re probably thinking, “Hey, that sounds awesome! Sign me up!” It is awesome. But it gets even more awesomer. If you’ve read this far, you’re probably wondering about the name… STD. Shield-ually Transmitted Disease. 6 runes of the guardian gives anyone who hits your shield 1 second of burning. No cooldown. So now that you’ve got the defenders spitting mad and ready to unleash their bestest attacks (which for most melee builds usually means spinning around like a spaz and throwing out a gajillion attacks in less than a second), all you have to do is press the gear shield skill and laugh maniacally.

That first time you block a hundred blades idiot outright and give him 10 seconds of burning (almost 6000 damage) from the block alone, you’ll be addicted to the STD build.

athuria.2751:

So there’s where the base damage buff went…

pre-Patch, FT has 916 base damage and, with Deadly Mixtures, 969 base damage. I just tested the switch and FT does now have a base damage of 969 and Deadly Mixtures is not resulting in any damage increase at all.

Just tested… Deadly mixture does increase damage against the target dummies, so it is working. It doesn’t affect the power or attack numbers on your character sheet, so it must be added in after the initial damage is calculated.

Moddo.7105:

blurps.2340:

ChackO.2346:

Seeing as this is a non-subscription game, PTR servers make sense. Let players do the testing for you Anet! Things like this wouldn’t be happening.

I doubt it.

For some reason you guys seem to believe the testers at ANet don’t notice the new bugs and bug fixes not actually fixing anything.

That’s not how it works though, even in games with a public test server.

Dev resources are the bottleneck and they have to prioritize, meaning tons of stuff will go live buggy even if the bugs have been found and reported. If there are indeed just two devs responsible for fixing all class related stuff no amount of testers will speed up or improve the process.

But if change is not working at all and is buggy how much resource would it take to fix patch notes removing one line. If people stop making excuses for poor practices then companies just might actually improve.

Bingo. All they had to do was take it out of the patch notes. Their internal QA/QC should have caught this.

Arenanet’s quality control on patches is atrocious.

Case in point: Patch notes state Bundles from player skills (engineer kits, elementalist conjured weapons, warrior banners) now have base damage that is consistent with the highest rarity weapons available at the level of the player.

Only base damage didn’t change. You guys are super busy. We respect that. But this isn’t the only time a patch fix has made it into the notes without actually making it into the game. I’d venture to guess that there are multiple cases where this has happened on this patch alone. This shouldn’t be happening as often as it is. I’ve seen it more times in the short lifespan of this game than the entire life of the mmo behemoth that shall not be named.

You don’t have time to QC properly, and it doesn’t matter why. The only thing that matters is that you have thousands upon thousands of players who obviously have WAY too much time on their hands. Do you see where I’m going with this? Set up a patch test server! We’ll do the QA to make up for the lack of QC! Easy!

In short, your refusal to accept free labor, while noble(?), has the undesireable side effect of making you look like understaffed amateurs every time a patch comes out.

They didn’t actually bump bundle damage like the patch notes say they did, so you’re still down roughly 250 attack when switching to a kit. The rifle turret still hits for 317 on the heavy target dummy. So yeah.

fishybill.6908:

Can someone tell me what this means:

“Weapons now continue to grant bonus stats while bundles are equipped.
Bundles from player skills (engineer kits, elementalist conjured weapons, warrior banners) now have base damage that is consistent with the highest rarity weapons available at the level of the player.”

Go to the Heart of the Mists, select rifle and grenade kit, with the character tab open switch from rifle to grenades and the power drops?

Am I reading the patch notes wrong or is it still borked?

It isn’t just grenades, it’s all kits. Apparently stats from weapons carry over correctly now, but the base damage from bundles wasn’t actually fixed.

Honestly, how hard is it to verify the fix actually worked before uploading the patch? What’s worse, this isn’t even the first time Anet has said something was fixed in the notes without actually bothering to check whether they’d gotten it right.

Ever heard of patch test servers, Anet? You’ve got fans that would love to help you QA your product. Use them.

If it isn’t elixir S then they must be blocking. No other engineer skills exist that can accomplish what you describe, and there are no known bugs that can replicate that behavior either.

I see it referenced a couple of times in the patch notes, but it doesn’t exist on the wiki and I’ve never seen it in game. Did we get a new turret? Was the patch note writer drunk?

Daredent.2961:

You have to deploy the turret — then hit F1 to destroy the turret for a instant heal + condition removal. Its a 2 step process.

You won’t get any condition removal unless you deploy the turret, hit cleansing burst, and wait for the next turret “pulse” (there is one every seven seconds). You can elect to hit F1 as the above poster stated for an additional area heal, just make sure you don’t do so until after a) you’ve pressed cleansing burst and b) the turret has pulsed.

Bottom line, cleansing burst activates on the next turret pulse. F1 has nothing to do with it.

leftharted.7102:

if you wanna get all technical, wouldnt Asura be the best alchemist engineers?? their, fine, we take that crown, argument settled??

Asura are certainly the best at self aggrandizing. You worship the great alchemy, yet you have to steal applied alchemy, i.e. elixirs, from an “inferior” race. This means that asura are undoubtedly the best alchemist engineers? I don’t think so. I think it means asura have the best reality warping technology.

leftharted.7102:

lets not forget this shtuff was all just made up…. and alot of people get their ‘lore’ facts from Wiki’s, which any ole nerd can edit however they please, so before we keep using LORE as a defense, we need to check the source!

I will if you do.

I know I’m trolling a bit, but I’m just jealous that I don’t have tiny animations like you guys do. And I hate asura condescension with a passion. Give credit where credit is due. So annoying!

spacemayu.4817:

Twenynge.8520:

Just because I want to be a Debbie downer, Asura are the last race that need new skins. From a lore perspective, Asura culture is all about magic. Even the Asuran golems that people THINK are technological are actually magic based. Engineers shun the use of magic. Therefore, the few Asura engineers that did exist would, in all likelihood, be using borrowed tech instead of homegrown equipment.

Hold on.

There is a mob in the game called “Inquest Engineer” that drops Asuran Turrets.

That’s more evidence than any to suggest that yes, perhaps Asuran Engineers should have a little more flavour.

Inquest engineer turrets shock. Charr turrets don’t. Do you want a new skin or a new class? On second thought, don’t answer that.

What a fun thread. Engineers aren’t any more lore appropriate to Asura than they are to Sylvari. Either everyone gets their own turret skins or we all share. You aren’t special.

Just because I want to be a Debbie downer, Asura are the last race that need new skins. From a lore perspective, Asura culture is all about magic. Even the Asuran golems that people THINK are technological are actually magic based. Engineers shun the use of magic. Therefore, the few Asura engineers that did exist would, in all likelihood, be using borrowed tech instead of homegrown equipment.

I recently equipped a full set of guardian PvP runes for my engineer and I’ve been playing around with the burn on block feature. It seems to me that the burning has an internal cooldown of 1 second or so. I’ve had a few thieves lay into me and it didn’t seem like they walked away with 5 seconds of burning like they should have. Anybody have any idea if there is an internal cooldown?

I tend to think that the meta is full of bunkers due to the fact that offense, specifically thieves, is TOO good. If you run anything other than a bunker, you run the risk of getting istagibbed by the thief combo. Tone down the burst (while maintaining overall dps) and your bound to start seeing things other than bunkers.

What do you think of that, OP?

I’ve been playing around with the knockback skills a bit and I’ve come up with a combo that, if executed correctly, is bound to piss off you opponent. It isn’t practical because it is so hard to pull off, but when you do, it’s awesome.

You’ll need a rifle, bomb kit, mine, and tool kit. The trait to improve bomb and mine radius is helpful as well. The combo is executed thusly:

get your tool kit out
drop mine field (tool belt skill)
drop big ol’ bomb
use skill 5 on the tool kit (magnet to pull)
detonate mine field
toss your mine to the location just behind where you think your opponent will land
bob knocks back
switch to rifle
detonate mine (knocks opponent directly back to you)
rifle skill three
rifle skill four (knocks back again)

It’ll end up pulling your opponent towards you, knocking them away, knocking them back towards you, and finally knocking them back away all in a matter of a few seconds.

I’ll be the first to admit that this combo is totally impractical in that it is very difficult to pull off on a moving target. in particular, the initial pull and aiming the mine cause problems. If you do pull it off, however, it is an instagib.

One way to make the combo easier is to delete the mine field portion. This allows you to use the magnet pull later which causes the bob knockback to occur immediately after the pull. When this happens, it is much easier to predict where you opponent will land.

What are some other (more practical) combinations that people use with the engineer beyond the standard rifle combo (net, skill 3, skill 5, skill 4)? Are there ways to improve the combo above?

I’ve been playing a bunker engineer build in sPvP for the past month or so and I never got all the complaints about thieves. Sure, I lost to a few good ones, but for the most part they weren’t a problem. I just decided to run a high damage build and, oh boy, I get what the issue is. I was running a bit of a glass cannon build (2300 armor) but I still had 24k health. It didn’t matter. Steal, C&D, backstab, and two heartseekers is all it took. Probably about 2.5 seconds and I was gibbed. Happened to me twice in two minutes by two different thieves.

The problem is that because they have stealth, you have no chance. The combo is over before you even realize what has happened. Thieves may need a buff against bunkers, but against other glass cannons they are way too powerful. I’d vote for giving them more defensive abilities whilst taking away some of the offense because, after those encounters, I’m never running anything but a bunker ever again.

There is one major flaw in your build. You state that you’re taking cleaning formula 409 because it works with super elixir, but you’re wrong. Super elixir clears a condition upon placement regardless of whether or not you take cleaning formula 409. Anet simply failed to note that in the tooltip. I got very exited when I watched the video because I was thinking that with formula 409 it would clear 2 conditions, but alas it was not to be. Only one.

On the plus side, you either get to select a new skill (backpack regenerator, perhaps?), or even better in my opinion, get to remove 20 to 30 points from alchemy and use them elsewhere. If I were you I would find a way to get 30 points in inventions for the elixir infused bombs.

misread post. Like, totally deleted…

Oni.6841:

The fact that you changed your strategy based on their (sic) visual representation of their character is win for their team.

All guardians should roll Asuran apparently

Who said anything about winning? I’m talking about dead asura.

Always kill the Asura first. It will discourage people from picking them if they feel they get targeted more often than other races.

Fourth.1567:

Considerable cooldowns is a lie! 20s on smoke bomb compared to 48s on well of darkness (4 procs vs 6). 15s on concussion bomb compared to 23 on cry of frustration. 8s on fire bomb compared to 15s on ring of fire (8s duration vs 5s though harder to get the full duration).

Skills are definitely stronger than their equivalents, just the kit doesn’t have much flexibility, though lack of flexibility can be partially covered for with pistol and grenades.

“Considerable” is a relative term, nevertheless point taken about the cooldowns. The point I was trying to make was that there is time to dash in and tear up the engineer if you insist on sticking to your melee weapon. With respect to the pistol, it’s not exactly powerful. Skills 1, 2, and 3 just can’t do enough damage to match up with other ranged abilities from other classes, skill 4 is close ranged, and skill 5 would only be used if you were already at close range.

With respect to grenades, I actually use them in my build as well, but not for the reasons you think. They can’t be used effectively in sPvP save for two situations: 1) You use the conditions for area denial by throwing them on the point itself (basically at your own feet) or by 2) raining down on other players engaged in a stomp. The point is, they can’t be used to extend the range of the engineer, because when used at range, they will miss. Every. Time.

I think my build is powerful. I don’t win every time against melee, but probably more often than not. I not going to argue whether it is overpowered or underpowered, but I will say this: I’ve not once seen a character react to the condition fields that I am dropping and engage me at range, and if that happens I suspect I’ll get chewed up. Just like I do 1v1 against greatsword mesmers, rangers, ranged necros, etc.

P.S. Well of darkness and cry of frustration are more versatile than bombs in that they can be used melee or ranged, but I think you conceded that in your second paragraph. And ring of fire is considerably more powerful than fire bomb, albeit with double the cooldown.

I play and engineer and I carry bomb kits for the very reason the op stated. You need to understand that you can’t just run in and spam skill 2 like you’re used to, or you will lose due to the conditions from the bombs. Pay attention. Are you standing in fire? Maybe you should get out if it.

I have considerable difficulty with ranged classes as an engineer. Equip your short bow and try again.

Also, the good bombs have considerable cooldowns. Wait for the engineer to blow the good ones (confuse, fire, and smoke), then jump in. You should be able to survive bomb kit skill 1 spam.

Lyuben.2613:

It was from someone snipping him talking in /map during the betas.

I’ll look for an image.

Edit: Found it.

http://i.imgur.com/w0mKZ.jpg

Ouch. Disappointing when you consider how strong mesmers seem to be. I wonder what will happen when people learn to play them.

I was hoping to play one of the most difficult classes. I typically quad kit, but it still bruises the ego to know that I’m playing only an “average” difficulty class.

Lyuben.2613:

According to Arenanet, it was: Necromancer>Elementalist>Mesmer>Engineer>Others

Lyuben, where did you get that list? I remember Jon Peters stating that he personally thought necros were the most difficult, but to my knowledge no ranking has ever been issued by Arenanet.

Source please.

Even after Mr. John Peters told us it was fun. It isn’t. Please, for the love of this game, listen to your fans.

It isn’t conducive to skilled play.
It isn’t fun.
Skills with baked in randomness will be less used.

I currently run pistol/shield with med kit, bomb kit, elixir gun, and grenades. Trait 30 into inventions for bombs that heal, 30 into explosives for bomb radius and extra grenades, and 10 into inventions for the super elixir on switch to elixir gun. Use engineer sigils in your armor and the shaman amulet and you’ll have over 700 condition damage, almost 1000 healing, over 3500 (!) defense, and a moderate amount of power. The only two downsides are that you’ll have base health and no crit. Nevertheless, it is a very tanky build and, coupled with the fact that bomb and grenade kits being so condition based, can put out decent damage. Support is great because of the elixir gun and 1000 healing.

The only downside is that I find I have trouble with ranged opponents (rangers and mesmers, mostly). Overall, though, one of the best pug point capturing and defensive builds I’ve found. Plus, you get to rip through thieves with your bombs…

We have the ability to use more abilities in a single spec than any other profession in the game.

Nope. An elementalist carrying 3 conjure skills will have 36 skills not counting the elite. An engineer has at best 27 skills excluding the elite, as 3 of the 5 from the healing kit are duplicates.

An elementalist can take a form as their elite, pumping their total number to 41.

Agreed. Stability is too scarce. Or too powerful. Either way…

Twenynge.8520:

aleiro.8521:

Stunbreaks are necessary because all the freaking classes in the game have CC not because some burst skill that can be used once every 48 seconds or so (cd for frenzy traited) maybe the warrior will get one kill.

I’d gladly eat any other skill due to CC besides a frenzied HB if it means I can bring another kit. Or my own KD. No Problem! The only skill I CAN’T eat is HB.

Edit: I’m not saying HB is great. It isn’t. It just isn’t good enough when your opponent has mobility and is too good when they don’t.

aleiro.8521:

Stunbreaks are necessary because all the freaking classes in the game have CC not because some burst skill that can be used once every 48 seconds or so (cd for frenzy traited) maybe the warrior will get one kill.

I’d gladly eat any other skill due to CC besides a frenzied HB if it means I can bring another kit. Or my own KD. No Problem! The only skill I CAN’T eat is HB.

Konrad Curze.5130:

Twenynge.8520:

I, as a matter of principle, don’t carry a stun break because I feel I shouldn’t have to.

you are every thief’s wet dream
be more bad, please

I don’t have a problem with thieves. I eat them for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. But to that end, yes, I am intentionally “bad”, because I don’t think that one skill from one class should dictate my build. One skill from one class and you. You’re obviously very good.

Payneful.7934:

Ever had a rifle warrior knock you down and burst you down before you get up?

What about a mesmer who stuns you then blurred frenzy+mind wracks you before you get out of the stun?

and believe me…. two hasted pistol whips do far more than 10k damage. If you don’t have a stun break, you will eat both of them.

Nope. That hasn’t happened to me. Or if it has, I’ve never seen my health go down as precipitously as when I get knocked down by a HB warrior. Assuming what you said is true, and I’m not sure it is, the fact that a stun break is a necessity severely limits ALL OF OUR BUILDS. What if a knock back were required? Or a push? Or a pull? Or a burn? If Arenanet wanted us to have 2 utility skills plus a stunbreak, they would have set skill 7 to “stunbreak”. They didn’t.

A stun break shouldn’t be required any more than a skill to grant might. Or swiftness. Or anything else, for that matter. That is my point.

Hundred blades. There is nothing else out there that scares me enough to warrant carrying a stun break. Pistol whip is annoying, sure, but it isn’t going to do 10,062 damage on a character with 3513 defense (just happened to me).

Is it dodgeable? Sure. So is everything else. Is it easily avoidable? For arguments sake, let’s say yes. But when you get nailed with a bull’s rush from behind, from a warrior you didn’t see, you’d better have a stun break.

And that’s the rub. A single skill by a single class dictates that everyone carry a stun break in one of their utility slots. That’s why it isn’t balanced. No other skill can punish a mistake so severely. I, as a matter of principle, don’t carry a stun break because I feel I shouldn’t have to. One skill shouldn’t dictate the metagame the way HB currently does.

Previously, the juggernaut trait gave the engineer stability while using the flamethrower, which was huge. Not only did it ensure stomps and revives would not be interrupted, it provided a viable alternative to slotting both a stun break and an immobilize break, which (according to the kids in the warrior and thief forums) is a requirement for “good” players. So now we really only have one utility skill available? I for one think it is ridiculous that HS and hundred blades should be allowed to dictate so much of an opponents skill selections, but Anet chose to go after stability rather than nerfing the obscene damage skills, so it looks like they think they are okay.

Sorry for rambling. With the current meta game, stability was the only alternative to slotting stun/immobilize removals. I hate having my builds so severely limited.