Guild Wars 2

Phantasm and Pu need to be reworked. 4-5k-ish attack is too easy to land. Except gs Izerker, other phantasm skills are poorly telegraphed. Cd on phantasm skills are too forgiving for such big damage. Sure it’s not hard to find the real Mesmer, but when there is one or two phantasm landing 4k dmg every couple a sec each takes 3 hits to clear, and the real Mesmer keeps moving into you blind spot with 0 telegraphed skills which can be spammed if traited, fighting Mesmer becomes a questions of whether you have spammy aoe or someone else as his main target. I find fighting Mesmer very silly. I don’t think anet did a great job on this class

Vuh.1328:

What? You are saying that conditions are applied before they are applied now?. Power classes don’t rely on 1 ability either, lots of their damage comes in multiple abilities. You just need to know WHAT condition abiility you need to prevent, which is hard but that is more because animations are so bad right now(goes for some power builds aswell).

ok, I am done arguing with you. You are right, ok? Condi, boons, blocking, invul affect condi gameplay as much as power gameplay. There you have it. imma go back play some LOL or WOW now in the meantime, good luck to you preventing condition applications and save the game

Vuh.1328:

are you just stupid or trolling? Ofc they kittening have a cooldowns, jesus you are ignorant. Now it’s quite clear that you are a troll

So autoattack that appied 1kish dmg haz a cooldown? Bleeding shot, explosive shot, cross fire etc have a cooldown? You ever heard of perma blind, perma poison, perma weakness?
[/quote]

Just the part about what you said about guardians just reinforces the theory of you either being completely unexperianced with anything above 90% team queue pvp or that you are just someone who watches streams and know absolutely nothing about the gameplay itself and just plain ignorant OR trying to live up too your name.

Wow, where did you get so much pride from? I am rank 35 not actively pvp-ing just like many others since it’s no fun, boring, non-brainer and dominated by people like you. I don’t watch any pvp gameplay since power meta either since well, what’s there to watch. Focusfire is counter for passive,void action is just BS as burst dmg is counter for healing signet. Even you know warrior is more bunkerish than guard right now and why is that? Coz, the passive healing and abundent cleanse. See how much the meta is determined by passiveness? which is why this meta sucks.

Vuh.1328:

I am tired arguing with you. You work for anet?
For the last time and for the record, these abovementioned condi, boon and dmg mitigators affect condi application as much as direct power application. But condi application is only a small portion, contributor of condi dmg, the bigger portion is the passive effect applied before. On the other hand, dmg application is all that is for direct damage, if you mitigate that, there is no more damage from your opponent and you have no pressure for how long you are mitigating it. You can do lots of amazing things when you are pressure-free. L2p counter condi application is just funny as l2p counter healing signet with poison and chilled.
Anet made the game boring to watch, to play after we moved away from power meta, on the belief that condi should be on par with power. ppl like you are to be blamed too. Condi should never be on par with power. Passive should never be on par with active. And most importantly, field goal should never score as much as touch down. Period.

nyqwist.2360:

The counterplay is in the application, not the condition itself.
Conditionclasses rely on their cooldowns, not their autoattack.
Hence when a cooldown is blinded they have to wait for it to return, as for power, you need to attack once, and then go ham again without any waiting whatsoever.

Condi application has a cooldown? WOW they finally fixed it, how nice.

nyqwist.2360:

One condition/boon that only counter condi but leave power dmg alone.

1. I don’t need to, the actual mutual conditions/boons are enough to counter it, not to speak of “Runes of the Lyssa”. The power-specific counter-conditions, is simply neccessary, otherwise power would be too strong. Though I personally think weakness and chill is a tad too strong, the conditions are there, and they should be.
[/quote]
Rune of lyssa is not cleanse? When using it, its not one button? Does your position and movement matters? Does any condition, boon on you matters?

one condition/boon that punishes passive game play.

nyqwist.2360:

2. Once again, I don’t need to. This gameplay counters itself, so to say. If you’re just going to stand still and play passively, you will be more useless than someone that’s active. It’s what differs good players from bad. There’s no condition/needed to punish this. If you and your team (even though I doubt you have one) cant manage a necromancer standing on a ledge and spamming, you should seek advice, not complain.

Why is mid bunker guardian viable then? No movement needed, not even attack needed. Just heal heal heal. Watching them play gives me epiphany

For the record, the one button gameplay I was referring to is counters to condi. It’s cheap and boring to watch.
Dude, why do you always assume I don’t get direct dmg is instant? I got it, ok? plain and simple. You keep repeating these mechanism affect the same on condi attack and power attack, yes I got it. But does it mean they affect condi dmg and power dmg the same? no.
Why is it so hard for you to understand ? One is passive other is active how can they be affected the same?
Lets use healing signet for example. Does poison, chilled affect all healing the same? YES. Are all healing skills affected by poison, chilled the same degree, NO. Healing signet is less affected by poison and chilled, if you can’t grasp that, well, let’s end the conversation here.

The problem is not whether condi is balanced with power. Condi should never be allowed to par power dmg. Since the mechanism and counter is CHEAP. Bursted down by power, you can l2p by doing protection, weakness, chill, cripple, confusion, retaliation, blocking, invul, stealth,positioning, movement….. at the right time. Bursted by condi, what to L2p? Bring a cleanse and press that button? lol, so fun to play and so great to watch.

Condi should never be allowed to on par with power, since the counter mechanism is cheap, unless more counter is introduced. Just like field goal should never be on par with touch down.

nyqwist.2360:

noobftw.9654:

Snip
Counter that.

There’s no need to “counter” something that’s not true. You’re kittening stupid, that’s the only thing i’ve come to realize reading your rant of one chromosome too little.

1. Blinds counter necromancers, which is the heaviest condition class in the game.
2. There should be counterplay to all mechanics.

Let me explain something to you here, boy. It’s not the condition damage itself that’s supposed to be countered, it’s the application of it. When it’s there, it will either do damage or be cleansed. So yeah, blinds do counter conditions.

You don’t need a kittening game mechanic to counter passive play and a void of movement, you’ll just be focused as you stand like a kitten.

tl;dr You’re wrong.

Nice language of choice. Blind affect less condi gameplay = blind counters necro? Is that all you’ve got? Does blind counter longbow F1, traps, caltrop? Hence, blind affect LESS condi gameplay. Prove it wrong again word by word pls will you?

Yet you failed to give me 1. one condition/boon that only counter condi but leave power dmg alone, 2. one condition/boon that punishes passive game play.

Does focus fire not punish active gameplay? So you are saying as you move you take less dmg? What a load of BS.

Vuh.1328:

Why are you so obsessed with warrior longbow F1, choking gas etc? They are mostly used in power builds anyway, and caltrop thieves have no place in the game anyway.

And yes you are wrong, blind hurts the normal condition builds just as much as power. Get some experience with higher level spvp play before you start to speak nonsense or atleast post on your main account.

But anyway instead of trying to make you understand how condi builds/classes actually work since that is a lost cause and you seem to have zero actual experience with them, how would you balance it so it would still remain viable?

Blind doesn’t affect condi build as much as power build, stop spreading your lies. vs power build, blind, weakness, confusion, retaliation, blocking, invul, stealth often means losing all or most pressure from opponent, but not so much when against condi builds. Being pressureless is golden, it gives us chance to target the real mesmer, stomp or ress downed. I hope I don’t have to breakdown how important ress and stomp is in this game.
You are so obsessed repeating game mechanism is the same for condi attack and direct attack, how many “yes” do you want to get from the community. It won’t change the fact that “most of condi, boon, and game mechanism affect less or none to condi gameplay”. For once, can you name us one condition or boon that only counters condi dmg and not power dmg?.
We all hate one button win gameplay, it’s cheap and not fun to watch however one button is how condi is mostly countered by, it’s just you have it or not.Letting power dominate we can see how weakness, chill, cripple, invul, blocking, retal, confusion, protection, positioning, movement.. are applied at the right time to counter that 7k backstab. Wouldn’t that be more fun to watch than “well this guy didn’t bring condi cleanse at all, he is kittened” or “OMG he pressed that F1 cleanse, he is WIN”.
This game has gone too far on condi, how many times you are downed by condi as VS power? How many times your banner is kittened up by poison. There are countless game mechanism that punishes and counters movement and activity, and can you name me one game mechanism that punishes passive gameplay, standing still, doing nothing but just healing.
Bottom line:
1. Most game mechanism affect less or none on condi gameplay.
2. Condi countering is cheap and no-fun.

Counter that.

If field goal scores 6 and touch down scores 3, is that fair to both teams, yes. But is this rule kittened up and gonna ruin the game, also YES.

True, these game mechanism affects the same to attacks that applies condition vs direct damage, it will always work the same. but that doesn’t mean it’s gonna affect condi and zerker gameplay the same.
Is blind and retal works the same to condi attack and direct? yes. but that doesn’t mean it’s balanced. They don’t have the same effect on condi gameplay as they do on direct dmg. Blind doesn’t work on warrior longbow F1, thief caltrops, ranger traps, etc, either do retaliation. Is the rule clear and fair yes. But does it have the same effect on both? No!

Edited by Moderator

Vuh.1328:

noobftw.9654:

Fire grab under blind, puny dmg, longbow F1, choking gas, caltrop….. still does full dmg.
Backstab 7k dmg can be fully dodged, Bleeding shot 200ish direct dmg, 1k bleed dmg can be fully dodged too, but wait, next half sec imma bleedshot you again with 1.2kish dmg now dodge that and the next one and the one after that and etc
VS direct dmg when finishing the fight, confusion or retal completely mitigate any more dmg so either you have no more pressure or your opponent is gonna kll himself. But for build relies on condi dmg the pressure is not mitigated by confusion nor boon. Invul, blocking works the same way at end game.
My point is whether condi is op or not or whatever that’s not my point, and I am not arguing condi proc on autoattck should be nerfed, my entire point has been “Condi dmg are less or not affected by most of the boon, condi and dmg mitigators in this game”. Is that simply not a fact? Stop trolling lol.

I’m not trolling, i’m just correcting your mouth diarrhea of false information.

Choking gas, poison field from grenades, longbow f1 all do pretty minimal damage, but still useful for power classes which might be the real issue.
So if you dodge a bleeind attack which adds bleed worth of 1.2k damage and then next bleeding attack hits you worth 1.2k damage, how is that different from an auto attack crit for 1-3k+ from a power class?
And yes confusion is just as strong vs power specs as vs condition specs, in fact confusion is the bane of engineers.
Retal also hurts any class that relies on multiple hits(grenades for example) equally much, condition or power doesn’t matter.

I’ll stop replying to you when you actually stop spreading lies or just talk about mechanics you have no idea how they work

What lies are you referring to? That F1 longbow do minimal dmg? that caltrops do minimal dmg?
lol, again, what I said is protection doesn’t affect condi build, so is weakness and many other condi, boon and game mechanism affect less or none to condi game play is that false?
Stop trolling and spreading your lies. Confusion retaliation affect the same to attack that applies condi and direct dmg but it doesn’t mean confusion retaliation have the same effect on condi game play and direct dmg game play. So is blind, invul, blocking. Please stop replying until you get this fact right.

Fire grab under blind, puny dmg, longbow F1, choking gas, caltrop….. still does full dmg.
Backstab 7k dmg can be fully dodged, Bleeding shot 200ish direct dmg, 1k bleed dmg can be fully dodged too, but wait, next half sec imma bleedshot you again with 1.2kish dmg now dodge that and the next one and the one after that and etc
VS direct dmg when finishing the fight, confusion or retal completely mitigate any more dmg so either you have no more pressure or your opponent is gonna kll himself. But for build relies on condi dmg the pressure is not mitigated by confusion nor boon. Invul, blocking works the same way at end game.
My point is whether condi is op or not or whatever that’s not my point, and I am not arguing condi proc on autoattck should be nerfed, my entire point has been “Condi dmg are less or not affected by most of the boon, condi and dmg mitigators in this game”. Is that simply not a fact? Stop trolling lol.

Vuh.1328:

noobftw.9654:

Fire field , choking gas, caltrop, traps…are how condi does dmg, ofc how these condi and boons work is the same for both condi and direct dmg, but again you are missing the whole point, " condi is not or less affected by them because the way condi works" , retaliation works both on condi and direct attck by returning % of direct dmg, but not condi dmg, condi build is almost not affected buy it. Confusing works when you actively attacking or dodging, both affect zerker more since its their only main source of dmg and zerker has no option to tank the dmg. The point is all these condi , boons affect direct dmg much much more than condi build, some don’t affect condi at all, which is what op is asking about. If your argument is the way these boons and condi works is the same u are trolling the wrong thread.
And you sure your engi don’t inst-die is not because of AR?

Retaliation does not reflect a % of power damage, you not knowing this makes you either clueless or complete beginner to the game. Retaliation damage is based of the Power of the target.
Confusion affects condition builds just as much as they use abilities just as much as a power class, confusion is the bane for all engineers for example..
Only condition and boon that really don’t matter vs conditions is protection and weakness.
The more you speak the more obvious it is that you are completely clueless and seem to have no idea how the game mechanics work

Power dmg is not based on power? Retal is based on power, no?
You are still missing the point, retal, confusion matter less to condi vs direct dmg since they punish active game play which is the only source of dmg for zerker. For blind there are many types of dmg dealers not affected by it they all happen to be in the sleeve of condi, and it does affect condi ticking, so is aegis, blocking, invul. The point is tho the way these mechanism works is the same for both they happen to affect direct dmg more than condi dmg. Only thing that can mitigate condi dmg ticking is cleanse, or if you have huge hp pool which is normally not available for zerker. Ticking contribute huge part of dmg from condi so condi is less or not affected by most of dmg mitigators is it not true? Drop you dry pride and noob calling and try to go back to the topic will ya?

Vuh.1328:

noobftw.9654:

Ludus Rex.1562:

noobftw.9654:

Nope, just like weakness blind aegis vigor confusion torment retaliation it doesn’t affect condi play at all. Immo does not affect condi neither since necro nor engi need to face the target and warrior has insanely large aoe. Heck not even blocking or dodge mitigate condi dmg. The only way to counter condi is cleanse and vitality to a lessor degree.
Condi vs condi is pretty much like text mud game in which you play the right card – cleanse – at the right time meanwhile keep spamming your condi, which actually can be fun

Ha. Good stuff. Abilities that apply conditions are subject to blind, aegis, vigor(dodge), confusion, retaliation, just like power based attacks, because they all register as a damage dealing attack which then applies the condition.

If you dodge the attack, block the attack, blind the attack, then you don’t get the condition. These moves are impacted to a much, much lesser degree by protection and weakness, since most of the damage is from the condition, but the trade off is that the damage isn’t front loaded, and can be cleansed which negates some of it.

IMO Condition vs. physical power is in a pretty decent state of balance right now. The problem is that condition/attrition play is better for small scale engagements, like 1v1 or 2v2 fights on a node, which happens a lot in our current games modes, and power damage is much, much better for bigger team fights where there’s AoE cleansing going on and downing a player quickly matters, making up-front damage much more desirable than damage over time.

Conditions have a slight edge in our current game modes, but are not better, in general, than physical damage.

The other problem is that all classes have the same access to physical damage mitigation via toughness. We can all take toughness amulets and traits, etc. Not all classes have the same access to condition prevention. I think this is the main problem.

IMO, there should be a condition duration reduction stat built into PvP amulet sets, exactly like toughness, and people should be able to gear up for -% condition duration if they choose. That’s called counter-play, and it’s important for having a constantly shifting meta, which is healthy. If somebody doesn’t like getting wtfpwned by an glass cannon thief, it’s their responsibility to pack some VIT and have some toughness.

We ALL laugh together when a player in full zerker gear cries about getting 2-shot. If -% condition duration gear existed, we could all do the same thing to people who whined about getting ground out by condition/attrition builds. Some classes just don’t have enough access to cleansing. Let us gear up to protect ourselves from builds we don’t like, or that we have a problem with.

Hmmm, last time I checked blind don’t affect marks, warrior f1 long bow gigantic fire field , thief can do choking gas while in stealth, no reveal, no effect from blind, so is caltrop, ranger traps, signet of spike, etc etc. last time I checked, block, invul, dodge aegis doesn’t stop condi ticking, retaliation don’t retaliate on condi dmg, and confusion don’t confuse condi ticks. Nice abet has fixed all these bugs.

block, invul, dodge, ageis don’t stop conditon ticking= true
they do stop the application, so you still have to remove blind/aegis before you can apply conditions or wait out dodges. Same as with power damage except conditions are delayed damage.
retaliation and confusion cause damage when the condition class person is using abilites just the same as power.
You don’t seem to understand and i doubt you will understand considering your name.

Blind works against marks, just no the transfer mark(#4) btw, also works vs signet of spite(not spike). Blind is the main reason i can fight a necro as an engineer(i don’t run automated response) without instantly dying
Warrior fire field, chokeing gas is not really affected by blind no cause they are pulsing aoe fields.

Fire field , choking gas, caltrop, traps…are how condi does dmg, ofc how these condi and boons work is the same for both condi and direct dmg, but again you are missing the whole point, " condi is not or less affected by them because the way condi works" , retaliation works both on condi and direct attck by returning % of direct dmg, but not condi dmg, condi build is almost not affected buy it. Confusing works when you actively attacking or dodging, both affect zerker more since its their only main source of dmg and zerker has no option to tank the dmg. The point is all these condi , boons affect direct dmg much much more than condi build, some don’t affect condi at all, which is what op is asking about. If your argument is the way these boons and condi works is the same u are trolling the wrong thread.
And you sure your engi don’t inst-die is not because of AR?

Ludus Rex.1562:

noobftw.9654:

Nope, just like weakness blind aegis vigor confusion torment retaliation it doesn’t affect condi play at all. Immo does not affect condi neither since necro nor engi need to face the target and warrior has insanely large aoe. Heck not even blocking or dodge mitigate condi dmg. The only way to counter condi is cleanse and vitality to a lessor degree.
Condi vs condi is pretty much like text mud game in which you play the right card – cleanse – at the right time meanwhile keep spamming your condi, which actually can be fun

Ha. Good stuff. Abilities that apply conditions are subject to blind, aegis, vigor(dodge), confusion, retaliation, just like power based attacks, because they all register as a damage dealing attack which then applies the condition.

If you dodge the attack, block the attack, blind the attack, then you don’t get the condition. These moves are impacted to a much, much lesser degree by protection and weakness, since most of the damage is from the condition, but the trade off is that the damage isn’t front loaded, and can be cleansed which negates some of it.

IMO Condition vs. physical power is in a pretty decent state of balance right now. The problem is that condition/attrition play is better for small scale engagements, like 1v1 or 2v2 fights on a node, which happens a lot in our current games modes, and power damage is much, much better for bigger team fights where there’s AoE cleansing going on and downing a player quickly matters, making up-front damage much more desirable than damage over time.

Conditions have a slight edge in our current game modes, but are not better, in general, than physical damage.

The other problem is that all classes have the same access to physical damage mitigation via toughness. We can all take toughness amulets and traits, etc. Not all classes have the same access to condition prevention. I think this is the main problem.

IMO, there should be a condition duration reduction stat built into PvP amulet sets, exactly like toughness, and people should be able to gear up for -% condition duration if they choose. That’s called counter-play, and it’s important for having a constantly shifting meta, which is healthy. If somebody doesn’t like getting wtfpwned by an glass cannon thief, it’s their responsibility to pack some VIT and have some toughness.

We ALL laugh together when a player in full zerker gear cries about getting 2-shot. If -% condition duration gear existed, we could all do the same thing to people who whined about getting ground out by condition/attrition builds. Some classes just don’t have enough access to cleansing. Let us gear up to protect ourselves from builds we don’t like, or that we have a problem with.

Hmmm, last time I checked blind don’t affect marks, warrior f1 long bow gigantic fire field , thief can do choking gas while in stealth, no reveal, no effect from blind, so is caltrop, ranger traps, signet of spike, etc etc. last time I checked, block, invul, dodge aegis doesn’t stop condi ticking, retaliation don’t retaliate on condi dmg, and confusion don’t confuse condi ticks. Nice abet has fixed all these bugs.

Nope, just like weakness blind aegis vigor confusion torment retaliation it doesn’t affect condi play at all. Immo does not affect condi neither since necro nor engi need to face the target and warrior has insanely large aoe. Heck not even blocking or dodge mitigate condi dmg. The only way to counter condi is cleanse and vitality to a lessor degree.
Condi vs condi is pretty much like text mud game in which you play the right card – cleanse – at the right time meanwhile keep spamming your condi, which actually can be fun

Vuh.1328:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjvLLI-SHa8

Nah, too much active play and too little condi

December.3946:

What I’m trying to pose is: would healing signet be as broken if warriors didn’t run Lyssa runes? In other words, does the complete condition wipe every 48-60sec (basically stops all condi dmg) contribute the way healing signet is now. Definitely hard to sustain any poison on the warrior.

thing is warrior has many other condi cleanse besides lyssa, with shouts and/or cleansing ire hardly any condi stays.

I agree HS with zerker warrior is balanced and fun to fight, no need to nerf there. Its the settler, cleric, pvt warrior abusing HS makes fighting warrior pointless, It’s not problem with a single build aka hambow, there are more brain dead builds such as offhand sword+offhand shield+reflection on block basically hard counter all projectile faceroll literally faceroll with 80% reflection uptime healing while blocking.
Fighting a zerker 100b KO warrior is 100000 times fun than fighting any zerker/condi warriors.

Gusies, it’s l2p issue.
adapt adapt is the keyword
the fact warriors are not to be 1v1 with on point
if you are far point assaulter
they are condi build
longbow F1 is too big too long and hot
the moment its put out you lose
even if you win the fight you lose points
then switch to hammer F1, 5 4 3
enough to KO
even they condi build
yep it’s big stun and hits hard
you need to bring at least 2 stun breaker coz F1 charge fast
need to down him fast coz he outlast you
then you need 3 condi cleanse
coz he switch to longbow
F1, 5 3, too long, too hot and too big
sometime you hardcore down the warrior
he lays on the point hits you like champ
so hard, really hurts
if no blind, he still downs you vengeance and gg
so you need to adept
when it’s 1v1 on far point with warrior
call your friends
2 or sometimes 3
or fight the warrior off point as possible
remember warrior+point=gg

kinda like wvw except lacking guards

So is the skyhammer but less affecting.
All audio settings are at default.

Also the skyhammer is silent for me too. Not that of a big deal since you can see the AOE. My audio settings are at default.

Same issue today.
This map is basically bugged and unplayable for me.

Can we please please have dev at least acknowledge this will be looked into??

I am pretty sure the audio channel is fine since I got the announce when cap.
Its just the treb is totally silent mode.
Its been like that for a while now.
Can we have the DEV at least look into this?

nah, in my recent games I haven’t seen the treb shots getting announced ever. Not even sure if it’s a recent patch.
Maybe it’s bug or exploit to get it hidden?

I have noticed all treb shoots in kyhlo are not annoced just like the troll cannon in Capricorn.
Is this intended?
Why?
Please, battle of kyhlo is one of few maps that’s still actually playable. Don’t ruin it pls.

DanyK.3842:

Punishes players for using game mechanics. Seems reasonable to me. In fact in the next patch I’d like to see: debuff [Stoned] deals 420 damage on jump.

aww please don’t. Jump is already heavily punished (IMMO mid air and rubber binding). Dont we have enough mechanism to punish active game play?
point contest
retaliation
confusion
torment
kitten

This game mode is already very bunker heavy and why does DEV wants to promote more bunkering? Srsly I don’t quite get the point dev is trying to make with torment and confusion. Was anyone actually able to avoid the proc by doing nothing? Maybe endure pain, shield warrior or tool kit engi can turtle it. For zerker toons these two condition pretty much equals to stacks of bleeding that hurts more and ticks more frequently, and it costs more cleanse since its own separate stack.
IMO these two are pure troll conditions that punishes play styles that depend on movement, dodge and position, as if we don’t have enough passive mechanism in the game already. If dev keeps adding conditions like these, we will end up playing a board game.

Blocking skills that can contest
———————————-
Shield stance, 3 sec invul, 30 sec cd
Gear shield, 3 sec invul, 20 sec cd
Blurred Frenzy, 2.5 sec invul, 12 sec cd

Nonblocking skills that can’t contest
———————————-
Mist form , 2sec invul, 75 sec cd
Renewed forcus, 2 sec invul, 90 sec cd
Elixir S, 3 sec invul, 60 sec cd.

why?

lift mid-air skill ban. If we can use skill midair, classes with z-axis teleport will have a chance to save emselves if pushed off.
1. Ele has 1 knockback, has 1 z-axis teleport has short stabilty
2. Mesmer has 1 knockback, has 1 z-axis teleport has short stability and distortion
3. thief has no knockback but 1 pull,, has many z-axis teleport close to zero stability.
4. engi ,warrior and ranger has good amount of launch, knockback but no z teleport
5 guard has good amount of launch knockback but also has z teleport.
Overall looks pretty balanced to me, plus the mid-air skill lock is really buggy.
so what do you guys think?

ahuba.6430:

you have the worst logic i have ever seen in this subforum.
all of your arguments are stuff like “warrior is not overpowered because if it was we would see only warriors. do we see only warriors? no? then warriors are not overpowered!” or “warrior is not overpowered because sometimes i still die on my warrior to condi damage or direct damage!” (i swear you have said something almost exactly like this awhile ago). These are just… dumb statements.

To be fair, he does have some good points, such as
1. Guise need to learn to bring friends to fight warrior.
2. Warrior has no clone, stealth, attunment, death shroud….
3. Warrior is not god alike
4. For blocking, warrior needs to bring a shield
5. For endure pain, Warr needs to equip it
6. Berzerk stance is only effective if you click it
7. Hs is not op when it’s not equipped.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

warriors are not overpowered because if warriors are overpowered, everyone would only play warriors in sPvP and nothing else.

happy new year!

When not everyone plays warrior, Warr not op no fix needed.
When everyone plays Warr, there is no more needs to fix.

Win

This game is only balanced when no one plays other 7 classes.

NevirSayDie.6235:

Apologies, I was trying to be humorous. It’s true that grenades don’t have an auto so some pve players do warn of carpal tunnel. If you’re using grenade auto much in PvP I’m afraid you’re doing it wrong, though.

well, im not pve player tho I don’t like to run bunker builds in pvp so engi is not on my fav list, but it’s ok, apology accepted.
ppl keeps saying aiming grenades in open field is hard, i play engi a lot in gvg, it’s actually not as hard as you think. Just combo it with stun or group bomb, and keep pressure on enemy downs how hard is that.
However it’s too much key spamming tho, which is the reason I prefer to bomb with zerker necro instead in gvg. Necro’s well bombing does slightly more damage than grenade but only needs 2 keys, unless I feel absolute pleasure facerolling my keyboard why should I make myself suffer for no fun? as engi, I tag a lot of ppl and does awesome damage all around, but it’s still more boring to play than necro bomb, which needs good timing. For engi, if I miss the timing, no big deal, just keep throwing it. It gets boring really fast.
anyways, that’s open field gvg, in pvp nade and bomb are very easy to hit targets.

The thing I really don’t like about bomb/grenade kit is they all have bad animation, you can’t tell if it’s shrapnel grenade, grenade barrage which does great damage or a flash grenade or auto grenade which is meh. You can tell a freeze or poison grenade but it really hurts my eye especially when the screen is filled with every possible color. And bomb kit is worse, it has close to zero animation. Same for turret, the only practical way to ID a turret is when it attacks or heals.
Fighting tool kit or rifle is fun, but as far as turret , bomb or nader goes, it’s extremely boring. You are pretty much forced to spam your dodges, skills as the engi does.

Monoman.2068:

In wvw bomb/nade engies take an extreme amount of skill imo because their opponents have the freedom to move and the engineer will need to aim and time his attacks well. In pvp on the other hand, it’s fairly face roll and you will realize this if you ever catch one of these engineers between points, they’re almost free kills.

in contest mode, it’s fairly easy to hit your target with nade or bomb, you just lay em in the circle.

In wvw tho, it’s actually not hard either. I play engi in wvw quite a lot.

NevirSayDie.6235:

noobftw.9654:

• I have engi I don’t play it too much tho since it hurts my finger when playing it.

Just answered your own question

spamming=high skill floor?

NevirSayDie.6235:

Also, bomb/nade engineers will never pop elixir S and toolkit block. That’s four utilities. Just saying.

I was of course referring to different builds.

I keep hearing people saying engi has the highest skillz in game? It frustrates me, since all I see in game is engi spamming bomb/nade and pop toolkit blocking, elixir S, healing turret on the point over and over again with very little animation. TBH, fighting engi is so boring, there is very little counter play. The engi doesn’t counter play me they are defensive spamming focused, and I can’t counter play him much since he has close to none animation. The game play is extremely boring.

So what’s your opinion? Does engi really have high skill floor or it just requires a good keyboard. Please keep your feedback constructive and educational.

• I have engi I don’t play it too much tho since it hurts my finger when playing it.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

zapv.8051:

warriors don’t have blocks, or invulns or a skill that makes them immune to conditions for a period of time. Other classes you reference would love to have endure pain, or zerker stance, or a shield. Other classes would also love to have a zerker build that has insane survivability, cc, and damage, but they don’t because those classes are more balanced.

Chuck Zitto.2367:

No they only have endure pain zerker stance fear stomp balanced stance banner regen and great mobility with a gs or sword and bull rush to disengage from a fight to heal up while they running away

only if they choose to equip those utility skills. again, working as intended.
endure pain? 4 seconds. cripple, immobillze, stun, launch, knockdown works
60 seconds recharge

stability? only if they choose lyssa runes, or balanced stance or dolyak signet or rampage. all have long recharge times.

shield? only if they equip a shield as offhand. working as intended since shield is a

banner regen? only if they trait for banners and equip banners utility, again, working as intended.

mobility? only for long sword, greatsword. working as intended since those are melee weapons and gap closers

do you guys even play warrior at all?

until you can play your warrior to be a god like status, other wise you all just want warriors to be free kills again.

^ this
Warrior has nothing if no equip these skill/traits. A barehanded warrior can absolutely do nothing. Even if they have endure pain/blocking/zerker stance they need to click it to be useful. If I choose not to click em it equals I don’t have em.
For the same reason, If warrior don’t equip HS they will not have the hps, hence hs is not op at all.

Let’s face it gusie, warrior will never be nerfed. Anet is not that stupid.
80% WVW community runs warrior in organized groups, it’s the heart and soul of guild vs guild. Most of Anet’s post-sales revenue comes from WVW, when they made the necro dumbfire change warrior groups just melted by the aoe spamming many wvw guilds quit the game, revenue was impacted big time.
They have learned that in a hard way, that’s why they give warrior 1 button immunity to condition. Healing, shouts, banner ress, immunity are the core wvw mechanism that keep them payroll, they are never gonna be changed.
However the staff ele in the wvw comp can’t sustain as well as warrior in the condition aoe meta, losing the dedicated reset nurses is definitely not gonna be joy. So in their recent patch they gave ele diamond skin and move big staff from adept to minor arcane tier. As long as warriors are happy, the viability of dd ele, sd ele, staff ele in contest mode is simply ignored.
A warrior might start roaming in wvw in the down time and you certainly don’t want to make him frustrated by the lack of mobility. The longest immunity time + best mobility is a given.
Anet is simply doing the right thing to put their limited resource in the right place to maximize their profit. In the first place they will prevent branching pvp from wvw traits becuz 1 it’s too expensive to maintain 2 spvp community is too small and revenue is tiny. They made a mistake with the ‘dumbfire’ trait kitten ing off every1 including necro mainer but they are too good to rollback. They are simply doing the right thing to keep warriors happy.

It’s getting worse after the patch, you can get the mid-air skill ban when you still walking, no skills can be used.
Can dev please look into this? It’s getting to the point that its actually annoying now.

after dec 10th patch, pd thief will be very op

not only midair, if you get immo when you surface swim you are also kittened. This has been reported by many ppl before but anet dev don’t even bother to admit it instead they focus on adding new healing skills.
More healing is the last thing this game wants. We have had too many healing skills now more passive healing and uninterruptible healings? Wtf

what’s the point of having this? you lose all your skills and if you get immo in this state, you are kittened. Only thing can save you is passive condi cleanse or immune, all active cleanse skills are kittened.
The same goes to mid-air skills. You can’t use big portion of your skills when you are mid-air. Condi gets 2-3 sec of free ticking on you. And if you get immo mid-air, again you are kittened.
Passive skills WIN!!!
Can we fix these first before adding more potentially buggy skills?

tichorum.2415:

You can only assume that if you build as tanky as you possibly can, you won’t do any damage and you won’t take much either. Hmm. Makes total sense. Not sure what the complaint is for.

this build actually does lots of condition dmg with ss/lb, in big aoe.

Not actually complaining, just felt funny it can take thief pp unload like mosquito bite without doing anything, so fun to watch.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

i dislike dying / kissing the floor often in sPvP so i would try to make them tougher. (i think)
i will come back after i have played my mesmer in sPvP.
stay tuned!

haha let us know how your adventure goes.

Piece of advice though, please stay away from making advises such as making a soldier stats mesmer tougher coz anet tends to take advice like such seriously.

redslion.9675:

(it’s doable with many bunkers, but those warrs also deal a lot of pressure).

Other bunker builds actually have to do something to outheal it while HS warrior can just take the shot like nothing.
Also the build has 1200 condition damage so not exactly a bunker.
I ran p/p burst build sometimes when I am bored just for the fun. I know that dummy thief does only moderate burst damage. It still hits really really kitten most of profs.

redslion.9675:

No, I actually didn’t mean to show a counter argument with that.

I have just always been curious about how the dummies work. Are they doing something doable in-game, or did Anet just beef up their damage to make up for the fact they don’t use healing skills?

I know you are not. I also wondered about how the thief dummy can do black powder, daze daze then unload unload.
Only explanation is the dummy runs x x x 30 15 build and switched to off-hand dual pistol to pull off that 20+ initiative combo.

redslion.9675:

Try it on guardian dummy.

That guy hits over 1300 with every non-crit auto attack. On a guy with 2700 armor. And has high armor himself. I don’t know how he can do this.

yep, that guard dummy hits harder. I win all other prof dummy with 100% hp afk fighting except guard and ele. I still win of course, but they hurt..

On another note, warrior indeed is not op, cos I just tested this build against the pvp dummy warrior, literally what I had to do to beat him is to press attack once. There is no need to dodge, no need to use utility skills, the warrior’s attack just doesn’t do anything and I win with 100% hp while afk. So skillz does matter after all.
Time to buff up warrior attack I see.