Guild Wars 2

Most of my friends including myself are getting refunds. They rushed the game and now they are set back MONTHS because of bugs that should have been fixed in betta / stress test. I don’t want to wait 2-3 months until my classes are balanced.

I have done beta for a few mmo’s. The amount of issues that made it through to launch is ridiculous.

Sephelutis.3480:

worth the money not expectation

Thats one of the reasons why I got my refund.

I’ve gotten more enjoyment for my time from borderlands 2. Ill stick with that for now.

GW2 has nothing long term at 80 and are far to slow with support and updates.

I think most people appreciate the hard work going into the fixes in this patch…the criticism comes from the lack of other substantial fixes.

A good development team for any mmo is going to have a laundry list of bugs to fix but will also multitask some of the other issues such as class balancing and general content improvement (buffs not bugs).

Other MMO’s may not have had a ton more resources tied into those areas but even 2-3 improvements beyond just bug fixing would be nice. One patch a week is pretty poor as well.

Most of this stuff looks like beta notes.

It doesnt make sense that you nerfed classes in beta so quickly but can’t find the time to make minor adjustments to so many of the classes that need it.

This is it for rangers. I’m pretty disappointed. 7 more days to see if they make any substantial changes.

Entangle: This skill is now properly affected by the Wilderness Survival trait Wilderness Knowledge.

Lick Wounds: This skill now functions only with ranger pets.

DusK.3849:

Sorry, can you please skip to the part where you were going to say something relevant? Maybe bring something to the table that proves your point?

My point? This thread has no point. I’m surprised they haven’t closed it yet.

Why don’t YOU tell us YOUR point.

DusK.3849:

robot.9134:

Lance Coolee.9480:

DusK.3849:

10:54 PM on a Sunday.

LA overflow and W3 queues don’t even come close to exemplifying population health.

Dusk knows more than you. This game is very alive and has 0 issues.

Don’t get all hissy just because I keep bringing evidence to the table to support my claim whereas you have literally nothing other than speculation.

i am getting a bit hissy….far more hissy than id like to admit.

It gets frustrating when someone of your caliber brings all of these undeniable facts to the table. I cant compete. Hence…the hissyness.

Everybody needs to stop getting hissy.

swagjuice.9270:

Anonymous.6935:

You could say that about any game. My point is I know alot of people (me included) who have stopped playing the game completely simply because there’s nothing to do.

There should be enough content in a game to have you happily logging in every so often to play for a while up until they decide to release some addition content.

You plus alot of people that you know means the game is dying? Very nice.

There are AT LEAST 6 others that i know about personally.

Lance Coolee.9480:

DusK.3849:

10:54 PM on a Sunday.

LA overflow and W3 queues don’t even come close to exemplifying population health.

Dusk knows more than you. This game is very alive and has 0 issues.

AndrewWaltfeld.4621:

robot.9134:

True but most of guild wars 2 customers are out of school. I don’t think this applies to the whole customer base.

I highly doubt most are. I would think most are in college which is far harsher environment for failure. I would peg the average age around 16-24 or so. But at this point, both our arguments are making assumptions with no basis for facts to back it up.

YOUR arguments are making assumptions.

AndrewWaltfeld.4621:

robot.9134:

AndrewWaltfeld.4621:

robot.9134:

AndrewWaltfeld.4621:

Anonymous.6935:

Maru.6157:

I think the game is dying…..where 2 weeks ago on Sunday night we had 42 ppl in game playing tonight we had 11. I had a good month but until they add a dungeon finder or something like that my time will be limited.

It is slowly dying due to the lack of content once you’ve hit 80. WvW queue times are not a good reason to assume the game is thriving, as such a small amount of people are allowed into each WvW map anyway. Ah well, enjoy the game whilst you can!

actually what’s currently happening is perfectly natural. it’s called life and eventually it does come knocking on your door to drag you away.

Besides there is always a population dip after a MMO launch because people find they don’t like the game or they have to return to their normal routine of work and thus have less time to play.

Actually…whats happening right now is denial…

You can choose what you want to believe. It isn’t denial but rational thought especially in this time of year. They launched literally the week before, on or after school starts in the U.S.A. What did you expect? The primarily market to ignore school for longer than a month?

The time of year has nothing to do with the guilds and players shelving the game because of various issues. Its becoming a far larger issue than just normal population drop.

Also…where do you work where you have a month to take off for games before your job “goes back to normal”.

sighes In the case of schooling. People tend to put your schoolwork for example in order to play more video games. About a month into the semester – your O kitten alarm goes off and you attempt to compensate for your month of slacking. Which means… reduced playing time. As guild wars 2 has gone from < School work.

Example.

True but most of guild wars 2 customers are out of school. I don’t think this applies to the whole customer base.

AndrewWaltfeld.4621:

robot.9134:

AndrewWaltfeld.4621:

Anonymous.6935:

Maru.6157:

I think the game is dying…..where 2 weeks ago on Sunday night we had 42 ppl in game playing tonight we had 11. I had a good month but until they add a dungeon finder or something like that my time will be limited.

It is slowly dying due to the lack of content once you’ve hit 80. WvW queue times are not a good reason to assume the game is thriving, as such a small amount of people are allowed into each WvW map anyway. Ah well, enjoy the game whilst you can!

actually what’s currently happening is perfectly natural. it’s called life and eventually it does come knocking on your door to drag you away.

Besides there is always a population dip after a MMO launch because people find they don’t like the game or they have to return to their normal routine of work and thus have less time to play.

Actually…whats happening right now is denial…

You can choose what you want to believe. It isn’t denial but rational thought especially in this time of year. They launched literally the week before, on or after school starts in the U.S.A. What did you expect? The primarily market to ignore school for longer than a month?

The time of year has nothing to do with the guilds and players shelving the game because of various issues. Its becoming a far larger issue than just normal population drop.

Also…where do you work where you have a month to take off for games before your job “goes back to normal”.

AndrewWaltfeld.4621:

Anonymous.6935:

Maru.6157:

I think the game is dying…..where 2 weeks ago on Sunday night we had 42 ppl in game playing tonight we had 11. I had a good month but until they add a dungeon finder or something like that my time will be limited.

It is slowly dying due to the lack of content once you’ve hit 80. WvW queue times are not a good reason to assume the game is thriving, as such a small amount of people are allowed into each WvW map anyway. Ah well, enjoy the game whilst you can!

actually what’s currently happening is perfectly natural. it’s called life and eventually it does come knocking on your door to drag you away.

Besides there is always a population dip after a MMO launch because people find they don’t like the game or they have to return to their normal routine of work and thus have less time to play.

Actually…whats happening right now is denial…

They will probably fix a few dyes that were broken. Maybe an escort quest.

No but seriously…I hope its more than nerfs and a few small bugs. Especially since it is a weekittenhing.

ravinhood.3981:

It’s not good enough to loose 40-50% of your user base and then say “well, they will come back when new content comes”. If that happens to your game then as a MMORPG developer you have failed.

Based on an MONTHLY SUBSCRIPTION FEE MMO you would be correct, but, based on an MMO that doesn’t require a monthly fee you are incorrect as Anet/NCsoft doesn’t rely on repeated monthly fees to survive or be a success. Look at GW1 for 6 years + no monthly fees and until recently no mini purchases from the cash shop. So it did real well and is a success for the first 4 years easily without any monthly fees or worrying about the playing population size.

Hes…not …talking about cash flow…

The customer service should be at least the same regardless of the way they earn their money.

This is about the customers being happy. If someone leaves the game because thy had a bad experience with content, bugs, bots, DR, w/e the excuse maybe….thats bad.

The chances of me returning to a game after leaving it due to bad experiences like that are slim to none.

Remember its not JUST the issues but how efficient they are at fixing it and how good the communication is regarding those issues to the community.

CC Eva.6742:

Hi everyone.

We would ask you to stay on the original topic and do not start personal accusations towards each other, please, as this does not help the community in any meaningful way. Thanks.

What would help the community is some feedback to the customer base about what the devs are working on, future patches, etc….detail! Not just “we fixed various de’s” How many? 2? 3? 10?

1 patch a week is not enough and seeing how other mmo’s were able to patch more updates AND communicate better means that it is possible. The better patch notes is NOT too much to ask by itself…

“We are aware of __________ problem and are adding it to the to do list.”

That response on the dev tracker is getting old.

War had a great campaign against botters…. they didnt just track them down and ban them….they made it a blood sport and publicly broadcasted the number of casualties.

It was great for customer confidence.

“The payment model really has nothing to do with it. The whole $15 a month actually pays for stuff” argument is a myth, debunked four or so years ago and still remains so to this day."

Source?

I’d be interested to see how this was debunked.

DusK.3849:

robot

Criticism causes some people to get defensive.

As if any post with positivity isn’t met with the same reaction.

There are no such threads.

lawl

Criticism causes some people to get defensive. If players have bad things to say about the game people shouldn’t be getting bent out of shape. You going to tell them they are wrong? Tell them to leave the game? Chastise them? Move on…

So… there are people being labeled fanboys and people being told “this game isnt for you, LEAVE!!”

Stop being so sensitive. This is like a forum of ex girlfriends.

Soulwatcher.2604:

Lets be honest there this is not Anet’s first MMO. If they couldn’t for see the bot problem then they shouldn’t be a developer! Obviously they didn’t do enough beta testing with this game.

And when the crap hit the fan they pulled the same stupid move that the biggest IP in all video game history pulled. They introduced DR to the game and not only that but the DR they introduced is 100x more punishing then the DR in FFXIV.

The guy cleaning toilets would have told Anet that FFXIV was the worst flop in MMO history and that every lead developer was fired. If they would have asked.

Do I want this game to succeed? Heck yes! Do i think its fair people are bashing the game on ALL game forums. Heck yes! Anet is getting everything they deserve!

Had they handled the problem the proper way. You know hire a human bot banning team. The forums would be full of praise on how well Anet is handling the bots and gold sellers, Instead they used a sludge hammer to crack a egg!

This^^

Having issues the first 1-3 months is a given. GW2 should have had a much bigger support/dev team vs under manned team. Now they are behind the curve and posting ads to hire more way too late in the game.

Im not upset at the fact that this game has issues. I’m upset that anet didnt plan for them better. How can you release an mmo knowing that the first 6 months are going to be hell? Had they spent a little more on the front in and hired more developers and maybe even live bot crew….things would have been much better.

I know a few guys who would jump at the chance to sit a comp all day for $12/hr and investigate/ban botters.

The customers LOVE seeing that stuff happen live too. There is nothing like a gm showing up quickitteno a ticket and seeing bots disco. Especially when they have a sense of humor about it and mess with them.

I honestly think they were trying to maximize profit and squeeze by. Then they got overwhelmed with more problems then they thought they could handle…hence the “now hiring” nonsense.

SgtSarcasm.1653:

Pretty much this. Anyone raging about the bugs in GW2 obviously haven’t been playing MMORPGs for long, as it’s a very common problem in MMORPGs.

^^^ This!

Anyone with any criticism about anything doesn’t know anything about anything.

MrLee.6892:

“Most” players have not hit 80 yet…..

Um…based on what? This game has the easiest road to lvl cap Ive seen in awhile…if you are seeing more low levels it is because people are rerolling out of boredom.

tolunart.2095:

Gehenna.3625:

You seem to have a maximum reward per minute need. Don’t forget this is not your job. Your boss isn’t there to improve your efficiency in time spent. I suppose that in line with the term DPS I shall call you a RPS’er. You know Reward Per Second player..

Then: “Why did you climb Mt. Everest?”

“Because it’s there.”

Now: “Why did you climb Mt. Everest?”

“Because I get $50 a foot per climb.”

lol…Id do it free for the challenge….I’d do it for a living if it was $50 a foot. Over a million $? yes please.

“People who don’t want to do the lower level events because the “rewards are crap”, don’t get how this game works. I don’t have a problem with doing some events that only give me half the karma.”

Please explain how the game works because there are a lot of us that are playing it wrong apparently. Tell me what you do that I don’t so that I can enjoy the way you play it.

There is also nothing wrong with wanting to earn rewards for anything you put your time into. On or off the computer.

You may not like the reward system others like but dont chastise them because you can’t relate. When it comes down to it this game still has the carrot on the stick. Carrot on the stick (in w/e form) + fun = replay value.

1. Mob tagging – I like it but this is not unique to gw2.
2. Reviving -Works great for gw2. Needed for non holy trinity.
3. Rewards – Not unique to gw2 but im pretty sure wow has started this too…
4. Avoid – Needed for non holy trinity.
5. meh…
6. Holy Trinity – still exists somewhat. People actually like healing and tank roles still and they still do them in this game. Groups still ask for them. I’ve seen it quite a bit in chat actually.
7. Pvp gear vs skill – I wouldnt say one is better than the other. It completely depends on the players playstyle. Some players like that other aspect of character growth. Also I’ve played both types of pvp but I’ve never cried that someone with better gear “had no skill” even if it was true….it just made me want to down em all the more.
8. Scaling – broken. No reason to do it.
9. Opinion.
10. Wow and gw2 have very similar gear grinds. Its token and mat based pretty much. The major difference is the diff the gear stats have on game play. It has a larger impact.

Gehenna.3625:

….The downscaling makes that you can do events in all areas without feeling that you are one shotting stuff and the dungeons are tougher than any flashpoints in SWTOR.
Aion was a total grind game and GW2 isn’t….

….No, I am not convinced at all that SWTOR an Aion had anything on GW2.

First of all I said aion was better than both…Swtor was boring after a few months. In my experience and with the people/guilds I play with… They got more out of pvp and pve vs GW2. With exception of wvw but that isnt enough to hold a community on its own “imo”.

Downscaling is a whole different issue that people are complaining about. The point of downscaling was so that you could play with your friends with similar rewards as higher level content. They were proud of that. Thats not how its working and people rarely do it. The reward is garbage. So yes…you can go to low zones and fight mobs….other than helping out a bud…why would you want to? When brought up to discussion…most people i ask that say they would rather reroll so they can get more mats to sell.

Dungeons can be difficult up until the boss but once you hit a boss its mechanics are more boring and stale than any boss fight in wow. Then after your done you have a reward that is just not rewarding. I wont get into that though…. there are entire posts on that.

If you think this game isn’t grindy though maybe you should take another look at the token, badge, karma, mat, and gold grind that is happening. Same old carrot on the stick.

Once developers start paying attention to their competitors’ mistakes more and put more emphasis on post release… things will look better.

I don’t think they really understand that they need an abnormally large crew of developers and support in order to handle the first few months. By the time they see problems…they are already behind and players are getting bored.

The should be starting ahead of the curve as much as they can.

CaveSalamander.9150:

robot.9134:

Gehenna.3625:

Most of the people complaining unfortunately don’t come with actual arguments but just opinions that don’t hold much water to begin with. I don’t think the problem is criticism but the abhorrent lack of quality in the criticism.

Why would a customers opinion “not hold much water”? lol Anet better be listening to these opinions because its not just 1-2 players.

You can’t just come in here and say that someones criticism is bad because you have had a different experience and you have a different opinion.

I hope Anet listens to everyone’s opinions but I don’t want them breaking their game if some loud minority demands so (no cases in point but I heard it happened to another MMO).

Also, I believe he meant that people are just shouting out opinions like “something isn’t good enough improve it!” and that’s okay, but if you try and call that criticism you are awful wrong.

I agree. My complaints are not based so much off of the direction of the game…but functionality. Broken de’s, class imbalances, bots, DR, etc etc.

Go to the necro forums and ask if the bugs are opinion or if necro could be improved.

What really annoyed me personally was when the ranger longbow was nerfed way too much to the point of it being less damage than the short bow.

LB= direct dmg
SB = condition/dots

Without the condition damage the shortbow does MORE direct damage vs the longbow. Rangers are even playing Sb as direct dmg in pwr/crit builds!

This may not be big to some people but it shows how much thought that Anet put into before they shotgun nerfed it. They were quick to nerf and now it may be months to see if they fix LB’s. LB is mostly unused except for utility.

SamTheGuardian.2938:

Moonthrower.1406:

They should be given the time they need to fix bugs. Here’s an analogy that the devs for SW:TOR came up with to explain bug fixing:

You’ve got rows and rows and rows of marbles lined up perfectly. And then there’s shelves of these marbles, dozens deep. You try to start tweeking a crooked line, but you bump the row above and below. That causes them to roll slightly, until you’ve messed up 4-5 lines on 3 different shelves.

THAT is bug fixing. Give them some time. :P

I like the SWTOR developer’s analogy. I believe there is a link between bugs (and include flawed design that must be repaired such as what happened with dungeons in GW2) and an MMO failure. You have a situation where 1.) customers are upset. You may be very patient most aren’t. 2.) You’re proven tested systems from beta are broken and you’re have a small window to retool them because of the angry customer base. It’s a horrible place to be in.

How well did the studio prepare to deal with bugs? Is it a case like like Titanic where they viewed their product as an unsinkable ship and now they are reallocating resources and working like mad day and night to fix problems? -Or- Was this part of a contingency plan with a dedicated team in place at launch to deal with these issues and the teams responsible for new content still working away on schedule.

Indications from recent interviews (Chaplin’s being the most recent) make me wonder. I’m not going to say there’s enough to strongly say they weren’t prepared but it does sound like all hands are on deck to deal with these unexpected issues. That is a concern.

Well put…. add onto that the recent post on the main page “now hiring”

They weren’t ready or well setup to handle post release.

If an MMO wants to impress me on release it wont be with concept art or voice acting etc etc. Itll be when they have several dedicated teams for several areas of the game with the proper manning. The first couple days and weeks they should be able to make minor class balancing tweaks with minimal need to worry about bugs as tehy would mostly be fixed from beta/stress tests.

It’s almost as if Anet is focusing down single issues at a time minus a few small fixes here and there.

Again, my theory is they just rushed it to beat MOP and were nowhere near ready to support post release.

For me personally I already left. I’m mostly waiting to see how future patches go. DR was pretty far down the list of top reasons I stopped. tbh.

Not that its a small issue…its just i think there are much much bigger problems.

Gehenna.3625:

Most of the people complaining unfortunately don’t come with actual arguments but just opinions that don’t hold much water to begin with. I don’t think the problem is criticism but the abhorrent lack of quality in the criticism.

Why would a customers opinion “not hold much water”? lol Anet better be listening to these opinions because its not just 1-2 players.

You can’t just come in here and say that someones criticism is bad because you have had a different experience and you have a different opinion.

More often that not its the level 80 players complaining and the level 1-70 players who think the game is great. I thought this game was amazing until 60 or 70+ when the bugs and issues started to surface….especially when i saw orr. Orr is exactly what people were hoping GW2 wouldnt have. Its a huge zerg/farm/grind.

Also going back to your post about aion, swtor and the comparison of their release and gw2…. Aion killed BOTH of them for lvl cap content. The pvpve was interesting as well as the normal pvp and pve. Not only that but they were multi tasking character balance with the bugs and fixes.

GW2 has interesting pve but it is boring after several runs because it is just a grind for tokens. Thats why people do it! Aside from wvw and dungeons….pve is broken.

They knew (just like gw1) that the journey to level cap was going to be short. With it being so easy to cap….they should almost be that much more ready (vs other mmos) with their level cap content. It was the opposite.

Zerg Orr for hours at a time while trying to tap a boss to get credit for a karma farm is not fun. It isn’t my thing but for w/e reason it seems like the whole server is there doing it to grind.

No fix or change in sight.

My experience and opinion might not match yours…. but it is shared by a lot of people from my server at least. People who are not shy about talking about all of this in Orr map chat and in the guilds I have been in. 1 of which has already dissolved and gone back to other games. Not to mention other friends from different MMO’s on different servers who I dont play with…. They report the same issues and reactions. People no longer logging in etc etc.

You may report the opposite… but who cares? You might not. Anet sure needs to. How many players is anet okay with losing?

2-3 months seems to be good but you can also take a good look at how things are currently being handled and it makes a big statement on how things will go down in the future. At month 2…. its not all going to be magically fixed and be fun again. This is something that begins before release and bleeds over heavily into post release.

I was worried when pretty much all 80 pve content was broken and grindy….and that didnt take long to learn…. guess what? its still broken.

The majority of the player base doesn’t give them a set timeline. It is based entirely off of how much fun they are having. It is entertainment. The bleeding gets even worse when your friends and guildmates stop logging in and the community feels as if they aren’t being listened to.

For an MMo to be successful developers need to fix and improve the game forever. It never ends. In first 1-6 months, support should be quicker and more focused than ANY other timeframe in the MMO’s “life”. Anet is not prioritizing like they should and they are now paying for it.

More developers or support could have made this much smoother but for w/e reason they chose not to do it …or even worse…weren’t thinking.

If a movie is horrible people get up and leave the theater.

Those are fanboys who are getting defensive. I really really hope that Anet doesn’t have that mindset…otherwise they wouldn’t be able to stay in business. Then again GW1 they were bad with communication and quick resolution too.

What might be possible is that they think since they will always have a small community then that is enough to sustain it until next release? I dont know, even that is pretty shady. In that case they could take their time and there is no rush to get out fixes or new free content.

If people leave though servers will shrink and WvW will shrink causing more bleeding. They really just need to get it together.

dalendria.3762:

@Paulus Beg to differ.

Good post.

Paulus magintie.7432:

So you work in the gaming industry with a horrible grasp of English? Unless your from a non English speaking country then im going to go ahead and say your lying.

They can be fixing bugs but it doesn’t mean they are ignoring us when they don’t post, incase you haven’t noticed a new patch comes out once a week. The bugs are very difficult to fix since many of them are one 1 server while another server doesn’t have the issue.

MMO’s are hard to patch, from the sounds of it you don’t work in the industry or your would know that. Lying doesn’t make your argument any better, however I am not in the industry but I am training to be a QA tester so I know what goes on behind the scenes.

Also after one month from releasing the game why would they add new content?

You don’t need to be a tester or even a developer to be able to do product comparison.

Lets hypothetically say that ALL mmo fixes and maintenance are equal across all games. It shouldn’t be TOO far from the truth as most mmo’s should be somewhat similar depending on class balance and events etc. Compared to other mmo’s at release Anet is getting about a D+ to C-. in many peoples opinions.

Anet knew they were making an MMO. Anet had GW1 already. Anet was also notoriously slow with releases for it and bad with communication. Why was little done to improve post release?

If you or I can sympathize with them that “its a new release MMO and there WILL be big problems” Why couldn’t they have done more to blow post release support out of the water? It is a ton of work! I agree…. but im so sick and tired of MMO’s coming out and the same mistakes happening. A lot of mistakes are a given….but most of the huge complaints regarding class balancing and events should have been resolved week 1-2.

Other mmo’s…even the ones that failed for other reasons came out with patches (detailed and big) 2-3 times per week if that was needed and they didnt even have as big of an issue like Orr to deal with. Anet has a “now hiring” ad up because they obviously didnt plan very well.

There is no reason that any mmo shouldnt be hiring temp help for 3-6 months after release in order to handle the major issues or help with the smaller ones so the seasoned devs can tackle the more complicated….especially since 3-6 months is pretty much make or break for MMO’s if not earlier. There is no way they can’t know this.

So don’t give me that vague answer “There is a lot of work behind the scenes” garbage. We already know that.

lol stop acting like this is a normal turn around time for resolution… They are slow. Period. Same as GW1. This isnt an old issue.

1 Patch a week and they still dont provide any detail. I’m not being overly critical here…some things DO take quite awhile to fix but they aren’t even going through the easy stuff quickly.

They either dont have the staff or they have not set these issues as a big enough priority. They should have had a crew brainstorming, testing, and implementing fixes/buffs for necro 3 weeks ago… Don’t even tell me it takes longer than that. If they can swing nerf’s around like wildmen in beta they can get enough buffs out so that people will actually play the necro more. Especially during the first month.

Stop settling for excuses and bad development!

It will probably be empty from new players but will have plenty of vets who have rerolled because they are bored at 80.

DusK.3849:

Sorry, but if that “something to do” is eternally trying to get armor that gives you stronger superpowers, you’re gonna be waiting for quite a while. Like… forever a while.

Anonymous.6935:

It’s never good to just stick with one game anyway, switch it up a little bit! You’ll need to once you’ve hit level 80 on this game as there’s nothing to do really that can be considered anywhere near remotely “fun”.

That’s a pretty blatant lie ya got there, sir.

Its an opinion he has. I also think its boring and most of all broken. The lack of function is probably the worst part.

id rather have them release less content @ 90% vs more content @ 50%

Wait for an mmo that takes a few good ideas from GW2 and makes a good game with it and hopefully it will have a better release.

This game is dead unless they start making these changes soon. Based on the speed at which GW1 balancing came….don’t expect anything out of LB anytime soon.

This thread is negative and will be closed soon. We are only allowed to post attaboys to anet in here. Stick to telling them how good they are doing please.

Agemnon.4608:

Dopplegangr.9678:

tolunart.2095:

“I don’t play X any more” does not mean death. It means you choose to spend your money elsewhere. How many MMOs have actually shut down all their servers and closed up within six months of release? A year?

I’d say pretty much every MMO besides WoW is dead. I don’t know anyone that still plays AoC, Rift, Aion, Tera, SWTOR, etc. I’m guessing the same will be true for GW2 soon.

Keep dreaming, Blizzard spy. Some games just get old and die, some just atrociously manage and design their levels (in addition to SWTOR’s bug and homogenization problems) while not being graphically spectacular but still feeling like the latest Crysis on max settings and taking forever to load screens even with the latest SSD. However, GW2 is much better than that. The hype for GW2 comes from the grassroots whereas SWTOR paid for its own hype and ratings. Sure GW2 has problems (paying to rez and common world mobs with bleed, pull, slowdown, and knockback while others transfer conditions while having a too potent for a lifesteal lifesteal, WTH?) but those will be worked out. This isn’t an EA game.

SWTOR needed to get its priorities straight. No one will look back at it and say “well…at least all the voice acting was great”. Stop spending tons of money on actors! Hire more people or spend more time on developing the game itself. I mean there is a debate on how much they actually spent on voice acting but either way they invested quite a bit of resources into it when it just wasn’t worth it compared to what they could have improved.

killbill.7910:

that’s why you do not run a developer company yourself….
there are bugs that come into play when fixing other bugs
there are minor bugs for the majority (but maybe YOU are the minority and say that they are major)
there are balance tweaks that can only be seen when milions of players play/tweak your code
and in the end as everything….you cant’ please everyone…if you try it you will please none in the end and you will broke…

when people will understand that….if you are a so bright CEO why do not start your own studio/game/whatever ?

in the end the consumer (you,me,whoever) will weight the pros and cons of a product and will decide…the company can only create more pros and fix some cons cant’ and will NEVER eliminate all the cons in 1 month..cause is cost inefficient….

get over it…it is all around you…accept it or…..choose another hobby

Your missing my point. All that is expected…I even said that. Class balance, just as one example, should be just as important. They were so quick to nerf in beta and stress test but didn’t double check their work in some cases to make sure it made sense. It was as if some nerfing was shotgun’d out.

For example. I play a ranger. Longbow was strong and they nerfed it into the ground making it WEAKER than shortbow. It is annoying that they made the change without testing. The players did the testing and found out that the shortbow is still stronger head on even without the benefits of flanking where it is supposed to shine. SB is a condition weapon and people use pwr crit with it! lol LB has been shelved by many minus some of its use for utility it seems.

Why is it crazy for a paying customer to expect a separate team of class managers and developers to look into this and fix it within days? a week? Players do it for fun….NO PAY! I do know they have class managers in place but for w/e reason (communication would be great) These balancing issues are taking quite awhile.

if you think im the minority why dont you wander over to the necro or even the elem forums and read a bit.

Renegadeimp.8439:

Dopplegangr.9678:

tolunart.2095:

“I don’t play X any more” does not mean death. It means you choose to spend your money elsewhere. How many MMOs have actually shut down all their servers and closed up within six months of release? A year?

I’d say pretty much every MMO besides WoW is dead. I don’t know anyone that still plays AoC, Rift, Aion, Tera, SWTOR, etc. I’m guessing the same will be true for GW2 soon.

You need to know more people then. I know plenty that actively play all those you named.

Just because the games arent as popular as WoW doesnt mean that none of them are a success.

The point is…you cant just tell people to meet NEW people in game. If a game is going to be as big of a success as the devs are really looking to achieve then it needs to appeal to enough people so that the hardcore community stays as well as the average players who go to work and talk about it with the cooworkers etc they play with.

Eve for example is a great game but it has a very steep learning curve for most. Still has a great community but your not going to see it explode and get game of the year.

Most mmo’s die because they don’t seem to be prepared for all of the issues post release and fall behind…deeper and deeper until I am sure they have great intentions to address all of the issues….they just can’t do it in time before players lose attention and leave.

It isnt just the funding whether its B2p or subscription… but the management of those funds, the support teams behind the game, and the priorities of all those departments.

Id be willing to pay $15 a month or even $20!! (considering a 2 hour move is $12-14 or w/e it is at the movie theater) If I knew that the company that was behind an MMO had a proper sized team in place for post release to NOT ONLY take care of issues….but MULTI TASK in all areas that were important to the player base so they could be taken care of in a more reasonable time frame.

Tackling bugs, bots, exploits, and nerfing for the first 1-2 months of release just isnt enough and this isnt the only game to fall into that category. Players expect those issues but class balance and more positive and fun changes should accompany them. That should start day one and be independent of other major issues.

The best advertisement is word of mouth. If your friends are bashing the game or are actually positive but just not excited enough to log in and show face in guild chat….that speaks wonders and will start the avalanche. You all have seen it..if not in this mmo…others.

It is becoming predictable. I cant remember the last MMO that didnt advertise that they were hiring within the first month or 2 of release. Great planning. It is pretty costly to hire and train new people last minute when the clock is ticking.

Post release has become far more important these days and it really really annoys me that mmo developers aren’t seeing this and keep making the same mistakes over and over.

Im sure that this will be deleted soon but post your thoughts…

Anet had horrible communication in GW1 and its bleeding over into GW2.

Bots and security? Honestly I could deal with bots… what i can’t deal with is the boring content that is driving players and whole guilds back to other games. Bots are NOT the major cause of people leaving. Its the content.

WAR communicated great regarding security and bots as well. The problem wasn’t necessarily communication…it was getting their priorities straight and quickly fixing issues that where driving players away. Instead the important issues were placed on the back burner instead of being multi tasked with a quickness.

I am not impressed one bit with Anets discussions about bots and security. I would be impressed if they openly discussed most of the plans to fix the concerns in these forums AS WELL AS bot/security issues. At this rate im not sure how many people are going to wait around months for class balancing and fixes for all of the various 70-80 content issues.

We need more than “fixed some de’s” in patch notes. was it 2? 10? I dont think its asking for much considering the payoff when it gives your customers confidence that you are making progress.

Also grandmaster traits are very lackluster. The final 2 should be quite powerful imo. They should be worth going down the whole tier too pick them up. It sounds as if there are complaints with this for most classes.

borderlands 2 and waiting to see if anet listens to the community and is able to turn this around.

Im not exaggerating but it seems as if a majority of the people who are still happy in the forums have not yet made it to 80. The ones who have hit 80 are not satisfied in one way or another. There are always exceptions but that seems to be the trend.