Guild Wars 2

DevonCarver.5370:

… but you don’t want your opponents to have it.

And stomps giving points doesn´t accomplish that already?

DevonCarver.5370:

The stat boost, while controversial, is there to give the buff meaning in the context of the general WvW battle. Providing boosts like %WXP, etc. don’t have impact in fights against other sides, they are just a nice bonus for you.

That’s the freaking point!

Nobody wanted stats buffs getting in the way of battles – not on enemies, but neither on themselves.
People wants more battles, better ones, less siege and coverage war, not a buff which will make the already rare clashes on open field and similar strenght nearly impossible to see.
And when there’s a open field clash between 2 groups of similar numbers and strenght, the most skilled one should walk away alive, not the one that has double the coverage and holds 9 cap points across the BLs.

Get it for once and hear your playerbase.

Inbefore “GvG QQ stop it” – that’s the enjoyability of WvW as whole that will get stomped by Bloodlust.

DevonCarver.5370:

The stat boost, while controversial, is there to give the buff meaning in the context of the general WvW battle. Providing boosts like %WXP, etc. don’t have impact in fights against other sides, they are just a nice bonus for you. The stat boost and the points for finishing players mean that not only do you want to have the buff, but you don’t want your opponents to have it.

Then what about a waypoint? Hold three points and you get a waypoint in the middle of the map somewhere. So that it’s not too OP you could have the WP open every 3 mins or so.

DevonCarver.5370:

The stat boost, while controversial, is there to give the buff meaning in the context of the general WvW battle. Providing boosts like %WXP, etc. don’t have impact in fights against other sides, they are just a nice bonus for you. The stat boost and the points for finishing players mean that not only do you want to have the buff, but you don’t want your opponents to have it.

That’s all well and good, but these buffs will benefit those with more numbers, making the strong stronger. That’s the biggest issue with the stat buffs.

Do i want a stat buff? NO
Do i want to get rid of the water on the borderlands maps? YES
Do i like the look of the new map from what i’ve seen so far? YES
Would i think it cool if there was a buff containing either mf/karma/exp bonus or perhaps a bonus affecting actual gameplay, such as affecting building/supplies/upgrading/whatever? SURE

Adding just some numbers to your character is lazy design and NOT FUN.

cimon.5798:

orge you are not and never will be the voice of the wvw community

Never claimed so, but its good to see haters like you brimming with envy. Makes my day.

Titan.3472:

yes just to kill gvg and fightclub nonsenses

So thats your ONLY reasoning? just to be spiteful towards a group of people you don’t agree with? Other posts support this feeling.

Titan.3472:

These guys trying to promote GvG and having no consideration for other players

Hypocrisy if there is any left.

no to the buff, making servers that are strong even stronger. absolutely stupid

No

Why would you give a server with the most coverage/ map population a buff when they are already dominating.

Switch the bloodlust buff with the outmanned buff and it would be fine. Keep the points for stomping though.

• ascended stuff
• sentry buffs
• new bloodlust buff

I’m aware that WvW isn’t meant to be anywhere near fair or balanced – but this is becoming quite ridiculous. Coverage and numbers already decide wars – which I’m fine with – lets not make it worse.

Normally, gamers tend to look for sort of balance – too difficult and ppl QQ and leave, too easy and while they don’t cry they get bored and only lured by even bigger rewards (is this why we got to ascended in the 1st place?)

NO to stats, power creep.
Yes to stomp-points – should have been there since day one.

I really looking forward to every single pixel from this new patch, minus the tainted mark of bloodlust buff.

Vena.8436:

Yes, let’s completely imbalance the core of WvW (supply, yaks, upgrades, supply capacity (are you nuts?)) so that “combat isn’t affected unfairly” in a format where combat was never fair. (To think you’d want to the stronger server to actually WP, fortify, and repair faster, and readily carry more supply than you over +150 stats… is a bit mind boggling if one were to be thinking about it from the point of view of WvW mechanics.)

While we’re akitten let’s also cut down the trees in the south, cull those pesky spiders, and barbecue those hogs, all for the sake of “WvW” and “combat”.

PS: Canceling a servers buff, given your suggestion, wouldn’t undo their reaped benefits (ie. they will have their better supplied, upgraded, whatever-ed keeps and zerg) so there’s almost nothing lost to them aside from efficiency. Moreover, once they are fully fortified and upgraded, they won’t care about the buff anymore and will now simply crush you without having to divvy up resources to controls aid buff.

Whereas canceling a servers buff, when stats are involved, cancels the stats and they simply don’t have them anymore.

Well, I wasn’t saying the buff should be all those things instead of stats, just that they were more interesting alternatives. I didn’t specify any percentages or specifics, they were just suggestions I’d seen posted elsewhere that sounded better to me. Yes 150% faster yaks would be crazy but 33% would only really be equivalent to having one person giving each yak swiftness. And there would still be reason to hold the buffs after a particular BL is upgraded, as you’d still have the points for stomps part of the mechanic (which is a decent idea). Plus remember the effect is not limited to the current map, so holding 3/5 on home BL would still be worthwhile to help you upgrade other maps.

Also I disagree that siege/upgrading/capture points are the core of WvW. To me PvP, fighting other players, is the core of WvW and the rest are mechanical elements added to enhance it, because a simple kiling field with no objectives wouldn’t be as complex or fun in the long term. After all you might play WvW with the structures, siege and capture points removed for a little while before getting bored, but I can’t see anyone playing the upgrading, yak escorting and siege building metagame at all if there weren’t other players there trying to kill you.

Honestly I’d rather the buff were entirely reward orientated, which wouldn’t step on either side’s toes. +50% XP, MF, WXP. Maybe to make the buff more meaningful, you get twice or three times as many points for stomps. I don’t think that’s enough of a “gamechanger” for Anet though, which is why I made those other suggestions.

Mooodster.3470:

Devon has said that wvw is not supposed to be balanced so why do you think they want it to be balanced?

While there’s simply nothing the devs can do about balancing some aspects of WvW, that doesn’t mean it’s a good idea to purposely make the balance worse.

Mooodster.3470:

MarMaster.6241:

It it a question of making matches constantly more imbalanced.
Rewarding coverage with more even more power; this taking away of fun or competition is never a good idea.
Leagues in the real world try to promote balance (the teams of course are constantly trying to get around the concept).

Devon has said that wvw is not supposed to be balanced so why do you think they want it to be balanced?

Completely understandable, i’m always down for an epic 2:1 or 3:1 defense….but some of these matchups with like 10:1 fights all the time due to the population inbalance are just not fun. What happens when those matchups happen? the heavily outnumbered server loses its morale. People go to PvE, transfer servers (making the problem worse), or what i’ve seen recently quit the game all together. Bloodlust, the leagues, all that is making wvw worse.

Zikory.6871:

YES

I know were in the “sky is falling” phase of the patch notes but honestly this happens every change. Have of us cry a lot the other try to defend it, no one knows how its going to work out in real time yet. Wait and see, it may be awesome.

With the buff being implemented, guess which server will get it all the time? Of course the one with more coverage/blob, thus making a server that are already hard to defeat will be way stronger than ever.

Zikory.6871:

Tellerion.8102:

Zikory.6871:

YES

Instead of working on changing bloodlust. Something they already put man hours into, spend time working on a option for GvG. Since that is the main issue with the buff yeah?

GvG is not the main issue of the stat increase the buff will provide.

Do you guys really fail to see how this will make the strongest servers even stronger?

That isn’t the point of what I said. Its getting implemented, regardless of this post. This whole system is bring a whole new meta where small man groups can be extremely effective for your server, was that not the complaint last week? Need more for small groups?

I love the map change and the new mechanism as I can’t wait for more small group fights. However I feel the stat buff is really not needed to achieve the goal and is actually dividing the community, not to mention the snow balling effect. It is already hard enough to take back a map with 3 waypointed keeps, we don’t need them to have stat advantage as well:)

NO

I’m fine with stomps counting towards score but i’m not fine with stats buff. I’m on CD and recently we’ve been matched up with FA and TC. If the bloodlust was active during those matchups, those servers would have had the buff and we wouldn’t. So the already underdog CD fighting an ridiculous uphill battle gets even more of a disadvantage…how is that even fair or even any kind of good game design. Instead of these bloodlust changes they need to be working on their matchup system…because it is complete garbage.

NO

We already got Power of the Mists, which offers similar bonuses to the servers based on their score in their current match up.
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Power_of_the_Mists

I do not want more power to snow pile on the server which has superior numbers and coverage. I have suggested some defensive buffs to the structures and NPCs and to a smaller degree players on a heavily outnumbered side, but I have explained already well before that giving offensive bonuses even to the outnumbered side is a bad bad idea. Giving offensive map wide boosts to the side, which is already winning, is just plain madness and a great way to drive off the outnumbered side back to pve and other games.

Bloodlust would be bad for guild-vs-guild, who want as equal fighting ground as possible (e.g. stacks from weapon sigils must be nulled before match). EB jumping puzzle is difficult location for gvg and the long queus to EB might make gvgs a thing of the past. Arenanet should be careful not alienate their hard core player base.

Do you guys really fail to see how this will make the strongest servers even stronger?

The stat increase such a buff would give is a massive NO, it’s clear for everyone to see, apart from the devs, that it’s guaranteed to have a negative impact on WvW as a whole, for obvious reasons.

Although I understand that there needs to be something of value for people to fight over these buffs, giving them a stat boost isn’t the right way to go. The extra points for stomping people however is an idea I like.

No to stats and power creep. I remember words from ANET – there would be no grind, there would be no power creep.

Between ascended and soon ascended armour, the difference is getting bigger and bigger. Grind2win, rather than WvW being open to all (as they envisioned). Almost becoming like WAR, with RR gear destroying fresh 80s. It pretty much is already, the WXP, skill less, pvd karma farmers with their 400+ WXP ranks and like 10k kills have much more use in WvW – like draining supply with trebs, defending their precious points. While the guys with 200 wxp ranks and over 100k kills get penalised.

How bout some rewards for WvW kills.

Slomo.1029:

This isnt a simple “yes” or “no” question. Its more complicated by now.
If you mean the actuall buff: no, not really.
If you mean the mechanics around the buff and how you obtain it: yes.

basically what all the previous posters said:

Do i want a buff tied to objectives in the center of the borderlands: YES
Do i want this buff to give stats or other in-combat-advantages to players: hell no.

there were so many good suggestions for alternative bonuses:
-the point-on-stomp
-faster upgrades
-increased/faster supply-caravans
etc.

NO to stat bonus

Yes to kills on stomp with something added to make it more attractive

I feel a buff is required but not one that involves raw stats added to one particular server… its simply asking for strong servers to be even stronger.

Dahir.4158:

Haven’t recorded any footage of this match-up till last night but let me tell you a tale of three heroes.

There were three Elementalists watching the Second Law onslaught in frustration desolate our brave fighters of Desolation. They took it upon themselves to take action and lead the world while their commander had given up. And so they entered combat, riding into battle on lightning fearing no opponent that stood before them, basking in the eternal glory that long awaited them.

Honor their courageous hearts and soul till the end of time and further.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzknON2ZU_I

Good sir, you are a hero and a role model for your people.

Sylosis.7125:

QQ SCND (joke)…….. I think you acknowledged that i held back INVI from interfering when i was commanding a tag down guild raid last night. It was the battle you were having against 2 of deso’s guild groups COIN & GoD i think…near north east bay water edge……..shame you failed to return the favor in ruins….. however you were probably not aware that we had lost numbers and been fighting there for days….so i will let you keep hold of your man points for now. :-). Apologies for not challenging you to a GvG however our squad GvG commander is on holiday for 2 weeks…..minus man points to us :-)

If we notice a fight going on between 2 guilds we don’t interfere, we probably weren’t aware of the situation. Still, you have my apologies.

call PETA and report Anet for promoting animal cruelty

There are so many great things about PvE that keep a player attached to it, that there really is no reason to WvW. I don’t know about everyone elses server, but this has significantly dropped the player population in WvW for Ehmry Bay. On top of that, even though we fall 3rd every week, we still keep getting boosted in the rankings. Are you trying to kill my server?

My suggestions for starters:
- Add WXP for defending dolyaks. You give WXP for killing them, there should be a reward for defending them. I get the nerf for karma and exp, that’s fine, but bring back the WXP for it and reward people.
- Add WXP for upgrading camps, towers, keeps, accordingly to each upgrade (the more it costs to upgrade, the more WXP you get to complete the upgrade). It’s already hard enough to make money in WvW when you play it standalone, it’s more expensive to upgrade a structure just to lose it to some zergball from a higher tier. It’d be nice for some compensation, knowing I’m not just burning my money away.
- There should be some sort of better reward system for defending. WvW is based on how many points you can keep and take away from the enemy. You practically get nothing for defending anything.
- How about some ‘EXCLUSIVE’ incentives for playing WvW? Playing PvE, you get all sorts of perks, from running dungeons, to fractals, world bosses who spawn a daily chest, and you are able to get things ONLY from these sources. Armor and weapons are exclusive to farming PvE content, there is no exclusivity for WvW. There is an argument that you don’t want to force PvE’rs to play WvW, but you are forcing WvWer’s to play PvE.

I appreciate the updates, all the WvW traits, the new flame ram mastery, the new chest meta (who knows if it’ll even be worth it), the living story for WvW to tend to the Achievement Points issue, I think they’re great additions, but when you look at the whole picture, with playstyles aside, WvW is nowhere close to the appeal of PvE. You can make much more money PvE’ing from dungeon rewards giving exclusive armor tokens and gold, numerous daily world boss chests w/ a higher chance at a precursor, fractal rewards w/ a daily chest giving a chance at ascended rings, even the number of ascended mats are biased to PvE, as well are high tier gathering nodes.

I normally don’t post on these forums but there has been a huge downfall in the interest of WvW in my server in the past 2 months. I personally think your new league system may kill it if there really are no significant changes made.

Thanks for your time.

Tom Gore.4035:

The real question is, who asked for these upcoming changes in the first place and where? Are the devs listening to the players at all or just steamrolling their vision and hoping the players will eakitten

This is the core problem.
I imagine it like this: a bunch of Devs meeting in EB, smoking some Lemongrass, having visions about Siege Wars 2 together. Afterwards they write their ideas down, think about it and decide to hide them from the public folks because they fear the responses.
Then suddenly they reveals their stuff shortly before release with the idea of “haha, its too late now, we cant do anything :’( qq kkthxbye”.

While instead all we ask for is Devon kicking the dude, who is responsible for the broken party system, everyday in his nuts till he fixes it. And stop adding stats on Masterys/Orbs/Bloodlust.

Cogswick.5236:

GUYS PEOPLE ARE STILL PLAYING WVW THEREFOR EVERYTHING WORKS.

Right?

Haha +1 for that

On a serious issue it seems like devs are doing the exact opposite of what players want.

“We don’t want to have to grind to have fun”
-“Here’s some awesome new laurel currency you have to daily farm to get top level gear in a few months of farming!”

-“We want to be able to obtain the same things in WvW as in PvE”
-“Here’s an awesome back piece you can’t obtain through PVP”

“We don’t want new gear that will break the already delicate balance”
- “Here some awesome ascended stuff to farm!”

“We don’t want stat buffs!”
- “Here some new awesome mechanic that will reward the bigger zerg with some stat buffs!”

“We don’t really care for masteries”
-“Here’s some exciting new cow munition for trebs mastery!”

“Condi meta is so broken!”
-“Here’s some new awesome broken OP conD runes that will help you stack confusion on top of your ridiculous unmitigated uncapped condition damage!”

“We need some reward for defending keeps/towers!”
-“Here’s some more rewards for map flipping!”

I could go on. And that’s too much for me. I’m out. I’m really starting to feel like they’re making a kitten of me.

GUYS PEOPLE ARE STILL PLAYING WVW THEREFOR EVERYTHING WORKS.

Right?